Thankyou Saint Andrews! One day all of this will be a story, a Grimm's fairy tale, told to children on the knees of their grandparents who have never known anything else but the Lordship of Christ over all. Happy children in a happy land.
The story will have to be sanitized because the subject matter is so unthinkable and obscene. But of course, Grimm’s was often disturbing, with mentions of cannibalization of children. Perhaps this is no different.
Ive really appreciated the ministry of Macarthur/GCC/The Masters College and have heard an unknown amount of sermons and speeches but I cant get enough of Doug Wilson now. Not only is he a true, genuine intellectual and extremely Biblically sound but hes gotten far better using the internet than Jmac has.
I'd honestly like to have a conversation with my professors at TMU (The Master's University) about Wilson's point of view on government and Christianity.
I encourage those expressing grave concerns over Pastor Wilson's approach go back and listen carefully to stones 3 and 5 and really consider the implications thereof.
So the Constitution is not a godless document because it says "in the year of our Lord" (beginning around 11:31)? That is unconvincing. _"Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter."_ Matthew 7:21 What in the the Constitute does the will of the Father?
very inspiring! However i dont live in a christian country, and it seems like the only groups willing to give Christians any rights and freedoms are the secularists, their arguments for freedom, tolerance and separation of church and state are based on a secular reasoning, so is it certain that only a christian form of government gives or gave the benefits, of a free society?
I'm beginning to explore Theonomy more, and being convinced of it in some areas - I was against it, or on the fence at some points for most of my theological 'career' as a pastor. I enjoyed this, however, I'm still left with questions. We all know the damage that straws are doing without getting into climate hysteria. I love the oceans and want to steward them well. My personal responsibility is not enough, surely? Help me understand here, someone. Thanks. Also, he stops short of answering the question most of us want to know: legislating against rapists, murderers etc. We're all there. How far to we legislate in the bedroom? He says we already legislate in the bedroom through building code, but its unclear of the direction he goes next. He's arguing for limited government (so, arguably no building code - even if it is there to protect you and others from a bad build?) and where does he stand on the LGBT+ area of marriage and sexual deviancy? Thanks again.
AFAIK he wants to reform churches first, then let it work out in the larger society. I.e. if enough people in your local community become convinced of the need for God's law, they will vote in such a way to reflect that. Let it build from there.
Quite rich of Doug to demand the Apostles Creed be recognized culture wide without any ‘hermeneutical funny business’ while moments earlier demonstrating just such an example of what that looks like while handling *actual Scripture*. He’s too smart to not know what he’s doing here.
So, Doug, does that mean there would be a religious test to be eligible to hold public office? Would a Hindu be ineligible to be President? How about a Catholic or a Mormon?
Probably would be a test. If most of the people were convinced that God's law is the only right standard I'd imagine they'd want someone who represents them. I imagine some time down the line they'd make it official in the govt docs that you need to be a trinitarian Christian.
AD begins at the estimated time of Jesus's birth, not his resurrection. In reality, given the calendar changes since then, it probably occurred around 3 or 4 BC.
An Ancap in the wild. Cool. How does a Theocratic Ancap differ from a Secular Ancap? Fundamentally, as philosophies, is there "tension" between Theocratic Ancap and Secular Ancap?
@@justingorman1068 Theocratic Ancap? Cool slang. Anyway in short I believe in a law that is not wholly determined by the market. Which law? Well obviously the biblical laws. But that's where the Anarcho part comes in, it's not a system of human rulers that enforce it but each individual person making the conscious decision to stick with it. At most when decisions are difficult to decide you go to the local elders, if they cannot decide then a judge/local overseer decides and that's the furthest it goes. When something is not accounted for in the biblical laws the market forces resolve it. It differs from the regular conception because it has a text of laws. The text of laws specifically condemn anyone who tries to change it and almost everyone on earth has a copy. Worldwide there are 900 million copies of that law in one out of every four homes across the globe. If anyone tries to change it we'll know and people will not take it lightly because it's the bible, you don't change the bible people will loose their minds. This solves a classical problem in Ancap, how do you prevent chaos and destruction and eventually communism or Monarchy. Well the bible gives the answer, because today the belief of God motivates billions of people to live a certain way, no one forces them to do so they do so of their own Accord. So someone whom they cannot see in heaven gets them to behave a certain way, if you try to convince these people to let another God run their lives they tell you no thank you I have my own religion. Well what if there was a means to have, just like there is a God in heaven, to have a King in heaven, what if you had a priesthood in heaven, what if you had a law from heaven. Well when someone comes to them and says let be your King, they will say, sorry I have my own religion, if you tell them then make me your Pope and church father they'll tell you sorry I have my own religion, if they tell you then at least make me your lawmaker, they tell them sorry I have my own religion. If we could put the state, the priests and the lawmakers in heaven the same way God is in heaven. Then I tell you people will fight to ensure no one is their king on earth, priest or lawmaker. Not only is it the most reliable way to Anarcho-capitalism but once you make it a part of their religion people will matyr themselves to make sure no one becomes their King, priest or lawmaker. If you try to amend the law (bible) they might just kill you (religion after all). This is why Theocratic Anarcho-capitalism is the best path to Anarcho-capitalism because you are using the human instinct for religion to implement it and to keep it in place.
@@allen_tor (Back when I was an anarcho-capitalist before I became a Christian, "ancap" was the term I heard and used). Interesting. How does the Gospel fit into what you said?
@@justingorman1068 We'll have our King in heaven, our high priest in heaven and the law is from heaven. Christ is that King, and he has a kingdom of priests in heaven and the Bible is the written law. Therefore once he returns and removes all governments for his. We'll have a government that doesn't charge taxes, or expand in conquest, or tell you what to think, or what to be, each man and woman under his/her own vineyard and orchard. Free to pursue your desires in keeping with the law (bible) and no one to make us afraid. Think about it Ancap says No human government only market forces Gospel days No human government only heavens government you have the law judge amongst yourselves. Fundamentally because Christ is taking his kings and priests to heaven that means no kings and priests here. No more monarchies no more Church State. And now no more democracies and constitutional republics because we have a law that does not need amending in which amendment is expressly condemned therefore no need for law makers.
These ideas presented are abscent in church history until the time of Constentine. And for good reason and that's not because the early church was misinformed on the matter. If they were misinformed so was Luke who wrote the book of Acts, who made no mention of cultural mandates or winning over governments but instead recorded people being preached to and being saved out of those kingdoms and becoming heirs with Christ in an incoruptable KIngdom. If you read Justin martys Apology to the emperor he explains that christians were not seeking to set up a competing kingdom on earth. For that was a false accusation mounted against christians by these who hated them and a reason for execution. But rather Justin quotes Jesus and says that the kingdom that christians seek is not of this world. You would do better with "scripture and plan reason" to quote Luther.
@StAnthony the apology was an appeal to justice, and asking for Christian's to be left alone, for accusations to be explored and not taken at face value . It was an accusation on the emperor and the Senate that they were ignorant and unjust in their actions. In the end justin warns in his first apology that if they continued they would not escape the judgment of God. It was an appeal not to change society but to receive equal treatment under the law just as the rest of society enjoyed.
Christ’s kingdom is not if this world. Bible is very clear on that. So there is a separation of civil government and the Church. The difference is that Christians should not focus on gaining political power to build the kingdom of God on earth. The kingdom of God is the stone not carved out by men. And it will come and crash all kingdoms of men. So the Church should focus on the great commission God’s way. But that’s not saying Christians should not influence the world. We should influence the world but not take over the rotten world system.
This is concerning The role of Government not the good will of people. It is not the government's job to fix the ocean, clouds, trees, or my lawn. We can care about the ocean and so much more without having a tyrannical gov. GOD Bless you in The HOLY CHRIST.
He doesn’t answer the question at all about the government being in people’s bedroom, and his answer of “whether/which” and this really is more of a non-answer is frightening because he completely skirts the question but I think this is lost on the audience
That is not an answer Grant. As a gay man I’m very curious- what would be the state’s response to my sexual activity in the privacy of my bedroom. Would stoning as Leviticus be called for for me and my partner or would I be imprisoned or would I be castrated? I’m actually a libertarian and I don’t see theocratic libertarianism as making any kind of sense. This would be an absolute nightmare of Handmaid’s Tale proportion for someone like me if theocratic libertarianism was in effect and if Levitical laws were enforced. So my question again to you is- what would be the state’s response to me if they came into my home while I have having intercourse?
First, I suggest you read Greg Bahnsen, Gary North, Gary DeMar, and Joseph Boot because I believe they all have written thoroughly about all these things. But to give my not so scholarly answer, yes it would be a crime punishable by death. It is punishable by death because the practice attacks the natural foundation of society which is the family, one man and one woman having kids and so forth. There is no castration in the bible as a punishment. You suggestion castration as an punishment proves his point that people think of Islamic type sharia law when they here this rather than biblical law. The only thing, facts in court are proven on the grounds of 2 or 3 witnesses. Accusations dont convict anyone according to the bible. Circunstantial evidence doesn't convict anyone in the bible. There's no mutilation as punishment. There aren't long prison sentences in the bible either. I highly suggest you read some from the authors I mentioned. I don't agree with everything they've written, and neither does Doug Wilson. But it's still helpful. I was scared of biblical law too until I really reread biblical law and realized it makes a lot more sense than our justice system and its nice actually.
@@EclecticEzra levitical law would not be put in place because that was exclusive to to ancient Israel under the Mosaic covenant. When Christ came, He made a new covenant, one of grace. So now we Christian's take the general equity of the law but not the puntitive action
Hey Alex, I understand your curiosity/deep concern about what a Christian theocracy would do regarding your sexual behavior. But, I'm not yet in complete agreement with Doug wilson so I can't answer your question from his view. However, i do want to ask you if are very familiar with the good news of Christianity. The heart and core of the Chtustian faith is that Jesus Christ the Son of God came to seek and save the lost. Jesus, as truly God and truly man, came into this world and lived a totally perfect life. Do you know what happened next, and why it's extremely relevant to you even as a "gay man" by your self-description?
That’s the point there will always be a government. The question is not whether we will have a government or ruler, the question is what kind of government and ruler we would have?
Thankyou Saint Andrews!
One day all of this will be a story, a Grimm's fairy tale, told to children on the knees of their grandparents who have never known anything else but the Lordship of Christ over all.
Happy children in a happy land.
The story will have to be sanitized because the subject matter is so unthinkable and obscene. But of course, Grimm’s was often disturbing, with mentions of cannibalization of children. Perhaps this is no different.
Ive really appreciated the ministry of Macarthur/GCC/The Masters College and have heard an unknown amount of sermons and speeches but I cant get enough of Doug Wilson now. Not only is he a true, genuine intellectual and extremely Biblically sound but hes gotten far better using the internet than Jmac has.
Glad to hear you are enjoying these videos!
I'd honestly like to have a conversation with my professors at TMU (The Master's University) about Wilson's point of view on government and Christianity.
Godspeed Doug Wilson and New Saint Andrews!!!!
I just watched this again. It is well done. Thank you for posting it.
Just a note. Mattress tags can not be removed by the seller, it can be removed by the buyer.
I encourage those expressing grave concerns over Pastor Wilson's approach go back and listen carefully to stones 3 and 5 and really consider the implications thereof.
He starts at 6:55
I don't agree with everything said, but I find a great deal of agreement with Doug Wilson, he makes alot of sense.
Yes
34:49 His name was Willis Carrier.
So the Constitution is not a godless document because it says "in the year of our Lord" (beginning around 11:31)? That is unconvincing.
_"Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter."_
Matthew 7:21
What in the the Constitute does the will of the Father?
publish this
Just FYI - He did. Check out "Empires of Dirt"
very inspiring!
However i dont live in a christian country, and it seems like the only groups willing to give Christians any rights and freedoms are the secularists,
their arguments for freedom, tolerance and separation of church and state are based on a secular reasoning,
so is it certain that only a christian form of government gives or gave the benefits, of a free society?
I'm beginning to explore Theonomy more, and being convinced of it in some areas - I was against it, or on the fence at some points for most of my theological 'career' as a pastor. I enjoyed this, however, I'm still left with questions. We all know the damage that straws are doing without getting into climate hysteria. I love the oceans and want to steward them well. My personal responsibility is not enough, surely? Help me understand here, someone. Thanks. Also, he stops short of answering the question most of us want to know: legislating against rapists, murderers etc. We're all there. How far to we legislate in the bedroom? He says we already legislate in the bedroom through building code, but its unclear of the direction he goes next. He's arguing for limited government (so, arguably no building code - even if it is there to protect you and others from a bad build?) and where does he stand on the LGBT+ area of marriage and sexual deviancy?
Thanks again.
AFAIK he wants to reform churches first, then let it work out in the larger society. I.e. if enough people in your local community become convinced of the need for God's law, they will vote in such a way to reflect that. Let it build from there.
Quite rich of Doug to demand the Apostles Creed be recognized culture wide without any ‘hermeneutical funny business’ while moments earlier demonstrating just such an example of what that looks like while handling *actual Scripture*.
He’s too smart to not know what he’s doing here.
So, Doug, does that mean there would be a religious test to be eligible to hold public office? Would a Hindu be ineligible to be President? How about a Catholic or a Mormon?
Probably would be a test. If most of the people were convinced that God's law is the only right standard I'd imagine they'd want someone who represents them. I imagine some time down the line they'd make it official in the govt docs that you need to be a trinitarian Christian.
Absolutely! Just like there is now. Not a matter of wether there will be a rest, but which test shall it be?😉
AD begins at the estimated time of Jesus's birth, not his resurrection. In reality, given the calendar changes since then, it probably occurred around 3 or 4 BC.
I think he knows that but didn't realise he said resurrection rather than birth. But everyone knows what he meant.
I am a Theocratic Anarcho-capitalist.
An Ancap in the wild. Cool.
How does a Theocratic Ancap differ from a Secular Ancap?
Fundamentally, as philosophies, is there "tension" between Theocratic Ancap and Secular Ancap?
@@justingorman1068 Theocratic Ancap? Cool slang. Anyway in short I believe in a law that is not wholly determined by the market. Which law? Well obviously the biblical laws. But that's where the Anarcho part comes in, it's not a system of human rulers that enforce it but each individual person making the conscious decision to stick with it. At most when decisions are difficult to decide you go to the local elders, if they cannot decide then a judge/local overseer decides and that's the furthest it goes. When something is not accounted for in the biblical laws the market forces resolve it. It differs from the regular conception because it has a text of laws. The text of laws specifically condemn anyone who tries to change it and almost everyone on earth has a copy. Worldwide there are 900 million copies of that law in one out of every four homes across the globe. If anyone tries to change it we'll know and people will not take it lightly because it's the bible, you don't change the bible people will loose their minds.
This solves a classical problem in Ancap, how do you prevent chaos and destruction and eventually communism or Monarchy. Well the bible gives the answer, because today the belief of God motivates billions of people to live a certain way, no one forces them to do so they do so of their own Accord. So someone whom they cannot see in heaven gets them to behave a certain way, if you try to convince these people to let another God run their lives they tell you no thank you I have my own religion. Well what if there was a means to have, just like there is a God in heaven, to have a King in heaven, what if you had a priesthood in heaven, what if you had a law from heaven. Well when someone comes to them and says let be your King, they will say, sorry I have my own religion, if you tell them then make me your Pope and church father they'll tell you sorry I have my own religion, if they tell you then at least make me your lawmaker, they tell them sorry I have my own religion. If we could put the state, the priests and the lawmakers in heaven the same way God is in heaven. Then I tell you people will fight to ensure no one is their king on earth, priest or lawmaker. Not only is it the most reliable way to Anarcho-capitalism but once you make it a part of their religion people will matyr themselves to make sure no one becomes their King, priest or lawmaker. If you try to amend the law (bible) they might just kill you (religion after all). This is why Theocratic Anarcho-capitalism is the best path to Anarcho-capitalism because you are using the human instinct for religion to implement it and to keep it in place.
@@allen_tor
(Back when I was an anarcho-capitalist before I became a Christian, "ancap" was the term I heard and used).
Interesting. How does the Gospel fit into what you said?
@@justingorman1068
We'll have our King in heaven, our high priest in heaven and the law is from heaven.
Christ is that King, and he has a kingdom of priests in heaven and the Bible is the written law.
Therefore once he returns and removes all governments for his. We'll have a government that doesn't charge taxes, or expand in conquest, or tell you what to think, or what to be, each man and woman under his/her own vineyard and orchard. Free to pursue your desires in keeping with the law (bible) and no one to make us afraid.
Think about it
Ancap says
No human government only market forces
Gospel days
No human government only heavens government you have the law judge amongst yourselves.
Fundamentally because Christ is taking his kings and priests to heaven that means no kings and priests here. No more monarchies no more Church State. And now no more democracies and constitutional republics because we have a law that does not need amending in which amendment is expressly condemned therefore no need for law makers.
@@allen_tor
I'm tracking. Until Jesus returns, how does one interface with those who oppose this?
These ideas presented are abscent in church history until the time of Constentine. And for good reason and that's not because the early church was misinformed on the matter. If they were misinformed so was Luke who wrote the book of Acts, who made no mention of cultural mandates or winning over governments but instead recorded people being preached to and being saved out of those kingdoms and becoming heirs with Christ in an incoruptable KIngdom. If you read Justin martys Apology to the emperor he explains that christians were not seeking to set up a competing kingdom on earth. For that was a false accusation mounted against christians by these who hated them and a reason for execution. But rather Justin quotes Jesus and says that the kingdom that christians seek is not of this world. You would do better with "scripture and plan reason" to quote Luther.
@StAnthony the apology was an appeal to justice, and asking for Christian's to be left alone, for accusations to be explored and not taken at face value . It was an accusation on the emperor and the Senate that they were ignorant and unjust in their actions. In the end justin warns in his first apology that if they continued they would not escape the judgment of God. It was an appeal not to change society but to receive equal treatment under the law just as the rest of society enjoyed.
Christ’s kingdom is not if this world. Bible is very clear on that. So there is a separation of civil government and the Church. The difference is that Christians should not focus on gaining political power to build the kingdom of God on earth. The kingdom of God is the stone not carved out by men. And it will come and crash all kingdoms of men. So the Church should focus on the great commission God’s way. But that’s not saying Christians should not influence the world. We should influence the world but not take over the rotten world system.
I don't think Saul was selected because he was tall. He just happened to be tall.
Tracey Lok
Interesting point
He also was considered the most handsome young man in their nation. Interesting. Sort of like the "Quarterback Face" theory.
I’d quibble on the plastic straw issue. The oceans are a complete mess due to plastic waste.
This is concerning The role of Government not the good will of people. It is not the government's job to fix the ocean, clouds, trees, or my lawn. We can care about the ocean and so much more without having a tyrannical gov. GOD Bless you in The HOLY CHRIST.
How are laws going to stop that? The government outlaws drugs (well, certain drugs) and yet they are inside their own prisons.
but plastic cups are still fine?
@@Zanroff probably not.
@@Chirhopher I’m not sure that’s true. It’s a public health issue.
He doesn’t answer the question at all about the government being in people’s bedroom, and his answer of “whether/which” and this really is more of a non-answer is frightening because he completely skirts the question but I think this is lost on the audience
Yeah he did, his point was that they're already in your bedroom.
That is not an answer Grant. As a gay man I’m very curious- what would be the state’s response to my sexual activity in the privacy of my bedroom. Would stoning as Leviticus be called for for me and my partner or would I be imprisoned or would I be castrated? I’m actually a libertarian and I don’t see theocratic libertarianism as making any kind of sense. This would be an absolute nightmare of Handmaid’s Tale proportion for someone like me if theocratic libertarianism was in effect and if Levitical laws were enforced. So my question again to you is- what would be the state’s response to me if they came into my home while I have having intercourse?
First, I suggest you read Greg Bahnsen, Gary North, Gary DeMar, and Joseph Boot because I believe they all have written thoroughly about all these things. But to give my not so scholarly answer, yes it would be a crime punishable by death. It is punishable by death because the practice attacks the natural foundation of society which is the family, one man and one woman having kids and so forth. There is no castration in the bible as a punishment. You suggestion castration as an punishment proves his point that people think of Islamic type sharia law when they here this rather than biblical law. The only thing, facts in court are proven on the grounds of 2 or 3 witnesses. Accusations dont convict anyone according to the bible. Circunstantial evidence doesn't convict anyone in the bible. There's no mutilation as punishment. There aren't long prison sentences in the bible either. I highly suggest you read some from the authors I mentioned. I don't agree with everything they've written, and neither does Doug Wilson. But it's still helpful. I was scared of biblical law too until I really reread biblical law and realized it makes a lot more sense than our justice system and its nice actually.
@@EclecticEzra levitical law would not be put in place because that was exclusive to to ancient Israel under the Mosaic covenant. When Christ came, He made a new covenant, one of grace. So now we Christian's take the general equity of the law but not the puntitive action
Hey Alex, I understand your curiosity/deep concern about what a Christian theocracy would do regarding your sexual behavior. But, I'm not yet in complete agreement with Doug wilson so I can't answer your question from his view. However, i do want to ask you if are very familiar with the good news of Christianity. The heart and core of the Chtustian faith is that Jesus Christ the Son of God came to seek and save the lost. Jesus, as truly God and truly man, came into this world and lived a totally perfect life. Do you know what happened next, and why it's extremely relevant to you even as a "gay man" by your self-description?
This isn't radical enough, Pastor Doug. There's still a federal government in your system.
That’s the point there will always be a government. The question is not whether we will have a government or ruler, the question is what kind of government and ruler we would have?
Sphere Sovereignty
Wolf in Sheep's Clothing. Avoid this nonsense.