Terminator has better looks (imo), street cred, and a more solid engine, the fact that it's still being compared to 2020 V8 engines is a testament of how beast that engine was back in 2003
Revive you’re trippin. 05-09 is the worst. Nothing but plastic and fake leather. And with still the same features as the new edge, like as in buttons and accessories.
@@JoseDiaz-bk9mh nah I would still say the sn95/new edge interior is the worst. The s197 actually looks clean from pictures and stuff but yeah the plastics are horrible. The sn95 just looks ass and feels ass no matter how you look at it.
Jose Diaz I’ve owned a new edge, 2 s197s and an s550. The new edge by far had the worst interior out of my other cars. My 05 mustang interior felt basically the same as my 2012 boss 302 interior except the only real difference was the recaros in my boss unlike my red leather seats in my 3v. Than everyone knows the s550 takes the cake on interior looks. I love the new edge and actually sold my boss 302 and bought a terminator and now have a cheaper car payment which is nice but i don’t care much about interior looks. I’d rather have power over nice interior
BadBossRacing you’ve had some nice cars. But a terminator?!! Man one day imma get one too. Congrats on that and the Boss as well! I have a 02 gt, an 05 gt, and an 07 gt. My 02s interior is literally in perfect condition. The 05 and 07 have peeling door panels, you hit a bump in the road and the center console rattles, etc, etc. P.s. I’m the type of person that prefers a sleepers simpler look. The. 02 has that matched with a all black interior. It just works for me, I wanna coyote swap it one day, at least a gen 2.
The 05-up Mustangs just feels like big heavy boats to me. Sure, it'll go 120mph and feel like 70 mph, but I just think they're boring. Now a Terminator...That's a Mustang!
I have an 04 torch red terminator! 646rwhp and 613rwtq it just turned over 23k miles. It is my garage/weekend queen. I will NEVER sell my baby, ever. My 3 year old daughter loves it. She says “daddy, make it go weeeeeeeeeeeep!” Kenne Bell blowers have the sexiest whine!I have no doubt that these cars will be collector cars in the future; with the big bucks.
what about roush. saleen. california special edition. 7 up edition gt r ? i have an o4 gt with a 2000 cobra motor kinda built plus a 68mm turbo but i have to change the fuel system cuz its liening out
Well it’s been a couple of years since this video was made and the terminator is still holding value quite well. Thanks for the great information. Much appreciated.
The prices of the terminators 5 years after this video have continued to climb drastically. Good moded terms or low mile unmoded go well i to the 40k range.
Eli Gonzalez ha ha. It has truth to it. These cars are different in their ways and that makes a lot is sense. "It might just not be for you" would be a great way to describe it.
The cobra is.... well.... It's a COBRA. I'd rather say I drive a "Cobra" than any other coyote mustang. The name just sounds badass. Terminator Cobra haha
Angel Martinez I agree. After 10 years the coyote will be worth maybe $8k and a dime a dozen. The terminator will only increase in value assuming you don't completely trash it
To me value doesn't matter, it's the feeling you get while you own it, while I like the terminator which will always be a legend in the mustang, I get a lot more power in my 2016 GT with the Roush charger, trust me, 670hp makes you not give a damn
aidoist thank you for speaking from a person has or had “BOTH” cars...I mean I was in my teens when the cobra came out but at the same time I didn’t have the money for that but as an adult I love the 11-14. I think this guy is a lil leaning towards the cobras because he’s only got those to cars. No stock 67 gt500 in his stable but if you wanna talk about money that car pull more $ than anything thing
Dude really great video. You are good at talking and keeping the viewer interested. I would take the Terminator over the new 5.0 any day. I also love the way they look and not so much the newer ones. More boaty and now Italian - it's weird.
I know right? The newer 05 and up Stangs are big mid size cars and sure feel like it. The older New Edge Mustangs feel more nimble and less heavy. Though I was surprised how damn heavy my Mach 1 was at 3420 LBS with 3/4 tank.
I bought my '03 'vert brand new from the factory on September 30, 2002. The only mods are 3.73 gears, MGW shifter and custom pulleys, but stock crank and supercharger pulleys. I have a PA Performance alternator that replaced the stock one that toasted. I have an MM rear dif bushing kit and this year we are replacing the rest of the bushings and tie rods in the rear, along with the left side axle seal. They need to be in good shape to get a proper rear alignment and probably something that Termi owners might neglect.
Hey Danny, one thing you should mention. With a Coyote and cobra of the same HP, The Cobra will come out on top due to the instant torque of the roots/Twin screw blower
I started out with a 2002 GT then shortly there after a 2003 Saleen S281 non-supercharged, both cars were great however definately needed more power. Then came the 2004 DSG Mach 1, power and sound were much improved but still just needed something more. Next was the 2019 5.0 with the 10 speed, car was very fast, great to drive but very soft on the bottom, and didnt really care of the sound or high RPM charcter of the motor. 2 days ago I bought an 03 DSG Cobra.....almost completely stock minus the flowmaster 40's.....FINALLY....exactly what I have been missing, the car has everything.... great sound, special feel, more than enough power with huge potential, great looks, comfortable to cruise and just enjoy. This is what I have been seaching for Danny....now I understand the love for the Cobra and why.
Had an 03 cobra for a little over 4 years. Absolutely loved the car. Just a badass ride that reminded me of the older muscle cars...needed a car with a warranty though so traded and got a premium 2017 mustang gt. Very fast car as well but much more refined. Just doesnt seem like its as fast as it really is because its so smooth to drive. The cobra just feels faster even if the difference is negligible when they are both stock. I love the amenities the 17 5.0 has, and I enjoy it alot, but I'd be lying if I didn't say I do sometimes miss my cobra just for the sheer brute force the supercharger brought. Both cars hold a special place in my heart honestly. The T56 in the cobra is leaps and bounds over that clunky mt-82 in the 5.0 though. The cobras do hold their value. Paid 24 grand for mine 4 years ago and still got 18 on a trade in...could have sold it outright for even more. Ford really gave us two gems with the 03-04 terminators and the new 5.0s.
jrvbamafan1 Very nice! Thank you for the comment. I bet if you went back to a terminator after a 5.0 it would be equally difficult after enjoying how nice they are.
The current GT350 with the 5.2 will probably hold its value too. Since when did a domestic brand build essentially a Ferrari V8 engine? GM and Chrysler are too fixed in their ways to do that.
The MT-82 is scrap. I really don't like the one in my '12. Light action, but notchy and not so accurate. I've had the damn thing go into reverse when it should have gone into first and wouldn't come out of reverse. It made me look like a boob at the traffic light, even though I've been driving sticks since I learned how to drive in 1974. I've never missed a shift in my '03 or '99 Cobras. The '12 is my regular driver as it is way easier on gas, but that damned transmission is a piece of junk. My Cobras are my babies and they will be left to my niece and nephew when I finally can't drive them or worse.
All I can say is...I LOVE MY TERMINATOR!! Mine is an 03 Silver Metallic Coupe. Got it with 36,000 miles on it for 20K. Has a Whipple 2.3L & a 3.0 pulley and 3.73 gears with a t56 Magnum tranny. 650whp, 615wtq on 17 lbs boost.
tomkjr1 I miss my Cobra. My wife made me sell mine after she told me that i better stop modifying my Cobra and sell it or she would divorce me..so I sold it to stay married
Chance Koehler I sold my first V8 (2001 GT) under basically the same reason. I still see the car around and want it back even though I have a COBRA and the Mach 1 LOL
Danny Johnson and that's not the worst of it, i had over thirty thousand dollars spent under the hood, 2.9L Whipple, BBK Long Tube Headers, Borla Attacs, one of the loudest mufflers in the industry, custom Comp Cams stage 3 boost cams, JE Forged pistons to raise the compression to 10.0:1, Forged Brian Crower Rods. basically it was touched to the point that it could produce 1000HP, and a stage V T56 from RPM transmission, and a custom tune to run on both E85 and regular pump gas. And I sold it for less than what I have invested in the car itself
Thank you for the terminators videos. Keep posting those videos of how to fix things on them. I learn a lot from your videos. By the time 5.0 coyote get to be 10+ years old they won't cost not even half of what a terminator is nowadays. They are nice and fast and I like them too.
My brother has an 04 terminator silver with 110,000 miles, bought it for $14,500. Re-built rear end, pulled the vmp off of his 01 cobra, did a short throw, full exhaust, lowered, cooling upgrade and smokes my co-workers 2014 gt full exhaust, intake, tune built rear like it's nothing. Sad part is my brother is selling it now for $23,000 to buy a brand new Duramax. I wish I had the money...
I like the less-refined SN95 cars like this more than the 5.0. It just... feels like an old school muscle car. Possibly the last car that does... and I love that! Procharged Mach 1 with Termi short block owner reporting in! I was very close to buying a 2013 5.0 instead, but then I found the Mach 1 and just fell in love with it. I found it with 24k miles a couple of years ago, already with the blower. I upgraded to the termi block, upped the boost and did a few other mods. Keeping it until the wheels fall off.
Be careful if you do it, keep it around 400-420 whp! Some people say 450, but I spun a bearing on the stock bottom end at that level. Might just want to keep it bolt-ons if it's your daily. That's awesome that you've got a Cobra AND Mach though. Doin' it right, lol.
Nice video, I've been fortunate enough to have had 3 03 Cobras thus far and they are one of the best mustangs Ford has ever produced. Being its on the fox chassis it has that feel, feel of being just the right size. Never had the 5.0 but did have a 13 Shelby and boy was it a different feel. Keep up the good videos!
I wish they put a 4V in the 2001 Bullitt. I LOVE the color and style of the Bullitts. The Termi is the father of the Edge class though. These new 5.0s are nice and fast but they are dime a dozen.
The bullitt was intended to be a 4V but SVT wouldn’t share the engine. There were also other parts designed, but too many new crash tests and barriers led the car to be as similar to a GT as possible ua-cam.com/video/cQOfMnvsz14/v-deo.html
@@edjackson4389 At the time of the bullitt (2001) svt did not want to share the 4V and it would require more crash and standard testing, so the Bullitt remained a modified 2V and later in 2003 with the cobra being supercharged, the mach 1 got the 4V for 03-04
Coyotes are sinking in depreciation. The terminator is the better car to have. They will both be old cars but the terminator will maintain its value. Good choice
I own a 2003 Vert Termi, I would imagine both cars are a totally different driving experience, Great video and thanks for sharing all the differences. Much respect to any mustang owner and yall get a thumbs up from me on the street. :D
Great video. I would say another benefit is the New Edges are simpler, and hence easier to work on in many ways without having technologies like Ti-VCT and all the wild electronics and systems in the interior of the car.
Very good point. I don’t remember if I mentioned it or not, but it’s also a great advantage to already have all the write ups and videos on how to fix just about anything on the older cars.
Danny Johnson oh yeah for sure! With my 2v with the live rear axle, it’s also nice (and horrifying lol) how much Fox body info and even parts carry over suspension wise. I know there’s a lot of info and videos on s197s and even s550s, but you’re definitely right, the SN-95s have far more out there. I’ll stick with with SN-95s (even if mine is somehow destroyed one day) just for sake that I’ve touched and messed with every aspect/section of the car, besides building the trans, installing/rebuilding the diff, and assembling the shortblock. That knowledge and experience is invaluable to me, and I feel as if I’d almost be starting over going to another different and probably more complex platform.
These cars are, in my opinion, the last of the "muscle car" Mustang. Everything that came after it was a heavier, smoother riding and running experience. The Fox based Terminator will always have an "on the edge control" feeling and to many that's what makes a fun car. S197's and S550's will never garner this kind of street cred. MAYBE the new GT500 and even GT350s will be this collectible at some point.
Awesome vid man, your knowledge is profound. I'd love to see the mach1 thrown into this comparison. Dohc in both the termi and mach correct? Same engine just not supercharged? What if a supercharger is put on the mach, same numbers as a termi? As i watch more vids from you, the more i like your channel.
Both the terminator and mach 1 share the same forged kellogg crank and heads, but the terminators main difference is the iron block and forged manley rods and forged zolyner pistons. Here is a comparison I did against the two ua-cam.com/video/MMXVMsoj_RQ/v-deo.html
They really are nice cars. I tried to be fair and give it justice. Mustangs should have been making 400HP a lot sooner. They are very well respected now
I owned two sn-95 cars and a 2013 gt and I must say the build quality is much different. I love sn-95s but my goodness it is a pain to do things with it, like removing interior trim with the cheap plastic clips that break a lot and squeaks etc. The new plastics feel much stronger in the new cars and the clips seem to be more intelligently designed lol.
Great comparison , I have owned 03 cobra( should have never sold it) , two 03 Mach 1 ‘s presently own one all stock 03 Mach 1 5 speed which is a daily driver and a 2012 Boss 302 ( great car ) If a could have a 4th option I would get a 03 cobra back! Great videos and accurate in the details
Thanks for your comment. That’s a nice collection, and if you see my video on the cobra vs mach 1 you’ll see (and i’m sure already understand) why I like having both. Great cars. A Boss would be nice as well!
Well the rarer Mustangs tend to retain more value down the road anyway.. The Terminator wasn’t your run of the mill Mustang like the GT was, same goes for Roush, Saleen, Cobra R and all the specialty Mustangs. The Coyotes will likely have a depreciation similar to the old GTs, (some the of low mileage mint condition examples would likely do better) While the Shelby GT350 and GT350R models along with the Roush stage 3s and Saleens will at some point bottom out, they’ll definitely go up in price as they become rare and the demand goes up. I feel the same way about the Shelby models designed after Carroll Shelby’s death just because they’re rare models with a unique engine.
The terminators hold their value more than any other stang in the modern era as in what theyre worth vs what their original msrp was. The roush and saleen cars go for less money typically and the supercharged versions (the only ones even close to a terminator performance wise but still no match with a 2v motor and non forged botton end) but those typically costed more when new vs the terminator. The coupes msrp was 35k new...they still go for 20-30 if in good condition and low miles depending on year color mods etc. Thats pretty damn good...they basically havent depreciated in 10 years if anything theyve slightly gone up.
When you enter the world of boost and/or high compression ... octane matters. For big performance 93 octane pump gas ain't gonna float the boat. E85 0ffers variable 95-105 octane and is fairly available in some parts of the country, but for big performance you'll have to upgrade the fuel system because E85 is less energy-dense than gasoline. And of course you get the corrosion problems associated with ethanol. If you're just gonna race the car, there is race gas easily available up to 118 octane. But it is so expensive you'd have to be Jeff Bezos to run it on the street. At you local general aviation airport you can get a product called 100 low lead or 100L. Aviation gas. With tetraethyllead. An honest 100 motor octane (roughly equivalent to about 105 R+M divided by 2 octane standard for mogas.) Also it has a low Reid vapor pressure, so cold starts are often an adventure. Because of the lead you'll have to change spark plugs often - maybe every 5,000 miles or so, just like back in the 1960s. But it is super-consistent in quality. It has to be. Aviators lives depend on consistent fuel quality. 100LL sells for over $5 per gallon. There is another option. Compressed natural gas. Octane somewhere north of 120. Burns super-clean. Your spark plugs and oil stay clean for very long intervals. But it will require a re-engineered fuel system and injectors. Your fuel tank becomes very much like a SCUBA tank. A bona fide pressure vessel. But the gas itself is fairly cheap - about $2.00 per gallon gasoline equivalent. Wouldn't a boosthead love to get his hands on the 130 and 150 octane leaded avgas that P-51s and Spitfires ran on. The Rolls and Packard Merlins made staggering HP because they could stand up to 90 psi boost. Think about it: six atmospheres over sea level. The best gas the Germans had was only 95 octane and the Daimler-Benz 605 used in Messerschmidt 109s exploded at over 50 psi boost. But the P-51 and Spitfire ground crew had to change all 24 spark plugs after every mission because that much lead fouled plugs like crazy.
I thought about swapping this engine (aluminum block from Lincoln) as a swap in my ‘06 gt after I built up the engine a little. Why? Just want to. If I’m being honest, coyotes are nice. That’s for sure. But you just can’t beat the sound of the older modular engines.
Thanks! Yeah, ebay has some, a place called parts farm does a lot of them as well. If you have facebook there are a lot of pages with people selling them
Jesse Contreras Thanks for watching. I need to make a movie on the 2018 now since Ford upped the compression ratio to 12:1 and added direct port injection
Just bought an '04 cobra, as far as I know it's only had a tune headers and Borla exhaust. Dyno sheet that came with the car has it at 475 crank horsepower. Blast to drive and when I can afford it the mods will start.
The results from a dyno would actually show rear wheel hp over crank, so add in another 15%-20% from parasitic loss as the power makes it to the wheels (they say 20% because of the Independent rear suspension), so you're engine is actually making about 560-570 hp at the crank
I can’t help but feel the more modern coyote motor engineering approach that went into the coyote you can probably attain better overall performance along with power gains. I didn’t know ford got sued for the cobra power claims for that model year either.
Yeah, technology cannot be denied. It’s 100hp more than Ford’s former naturally aspirated mustang V8 (and even more like 200hp more when considering the 5.2L Voodoo V8. Great times for car people. On a side note, it was neat to see Ford sent out a leather jacket to all cobra owners who had the 99 (and also fixed the cars to make the power that was advertised). I had my chance to get a jacket from a friend but didn’t. Too bad I missed out.
i went with a 2017 5.0 track pack. and i love the thing. i didnt want a used mustang cuz you never know how the previous owners treated it. but i still love the cobras
Great Vid Danny. Been a fan and appreciate your vids like this in addition to your instructional vids. I learn alot from you. My '04 Oxford White Termi has 3836 on the odo, but I am looking to sell my '98 Cobra and either buy a 13-14 GT500 or a newer 5.0 which I will actually drive. I am interested on your opinion on the 13-14 GT500 and will be searching to see if you did a vid on them.
Charles Murphy Depending on the year, some of the new 5.0s (18-19 and maybe 17s) have had out of round cylinders and problems requiring new engines. Many have had new engines replaced under warranty and then dumped them. I would research it a little more. The 13/14 GT500s seem a little more solid. ua-cam.com/video/fTqqwc-RJis/v-deo.html
Great videos boss! Much love to you and yours!! I’ve owned and love about all Mustangs! Just have a question or 2!? Where does the 13 Boss stand as far as the Terminators and the Mach1’s?? I’m considering a 2013 Boss. Would it run with the Terminator? What about a supercharged Mach1? Could it compete?!
I would say a boss 302 is right with a terminator. The mach 1 is behind both.You may enjoy this video on the gt500s vs terminator as the rods in the 500 are similar in the boss 302. Something to look out for if planning to supercharge. The boss 302 is a great car. They are getting quite affordable as well ua-cam.com/video/mB7h9S_qa3I/v-deo.html
Great vid man! Definately all accurate info in a time of false and bias info flooding the internet. I've had both and my coyote is much more refined and stock for stock dynoed higher and was slightly quicker. Definately two of my all time favorite platforms and both respond crazy well with mods. Tue coyote is strange, it feels alot slower than it actually is, extremely easy car to control.
Excellent video, Danny! The points you talked about are what I have been considering in the purchase of a "newer" Mustang. Still have my '89 LX 5.0 5 speed, but looking for a daily driver. And by the way, you need a bigger tool box. ;)
K5WXP one of the tool boxes belongs to my twin brother. Our Dad was an aviation mechanic and gave us each one. My brother’s is at my house while he is moving. They are very nice boxes. Thanks for watching, and if you’re looking for a solid daily you’ll probably want to lean towards the coyote ;)
Danny Johnson that is very cool. I have a good friend that has his Dad's tool boxes and tools. Recently built an awesome shop, too. I am leaning towards a 2014 GT with the Coyote to keep the price down, even though the 2018's look awesome, I rarely buy new and wait for a nice low mile car that has already depreciated. I bought my '89 LX in 1993 for about 7k with 34k. miles. Enjoying your videos, thanks!
Great informative video! I was stuck between getting a Termi and a 5.0 myself. I ended up getting a 5.0 and I dont regret it. To me its all about the value you get for what you pay. I know my 15' Gt may not hold value as well, but its a car that I know ill get good performance and reliability in a straight line or around a track. I drive my mustang on weekends only so mileage stays low. If I could have both a termi and a coyote, I would definatley do it!
Loscar5oh yeah, they are both great cars and the new 5.0s are a great option for people who want something low maintenance and new. I'm glad they are making good cars. I wanted this video to represent both cars and not a one-sided opinion. The truth is they are both good options for the right person. Thanks for watching and congrats on your 5.0!
Danny I have a Cobra 04, very low miles, it is my summer convertible! I love it! I am a highway guy and as a Europian x rally racer can tell you, Cobra is a brutal dominant car on high speed! I don't care drag in the city or tire burning! I love the way she is brutal fast on highway speed! I like the tight feeling and shifter. New Mustangs as you said for more comfort. Cobra & Viper for guys who likes the pour power and old school handling on winding roads!
What about big turbos for The Terminator wouldn't that be better than a supercharger. Or does the supercharger have more potential. I would like to fully built stage 5 4.6 2v twin turbo. Throw it in a foxbody with full modern drivetrain and suspension with traction control and the semi auto transmission with badbutt gears. Like a 2018 Fox body
@@mikesimmons852 not to speak for him but i beleive be was referring to the powerband of the blower the way it has instant power and works well with a stick and works well on the street, not so much that turbos dont work well
Great informative video once again good sir. What are your thoughts on swapping the iron block out with a very low mileage Teksid from a 97 mark? Any issues that you think I should consider. Thanks in advance
Love my terminator with a 2.8KB at 17psi, long tubes, and 60lb injectors over 600 at the wheels and next I want to convert to E85 and a solid axle swap.
+Louis Brigandi that's awesome. That's about where I am on mine, and wanting to slowly upgrade to a return system. No e85 here, so maybe if it gets more popular.
Danny Johnson Yeah it has gotten more popular here on Long Island but not so much if I want to take a ride upstate or to PA, so maybe in about a year or so. BTW very informative videos definitely keep them up. I've always been decently good with push rod motors but the modular motors are pretty new to me to work on myself and I'm finding out how much more expensive everything is for these motors, but it's worth it.
Interesting video, good comparison. Was out of the Mustang world for a while. Decided I'd pick up Terminator until I saw the prices people were asking for them. Started looking at late models instead and bought a 15 with 28K miles for the same price as what a 45K Cobra was going for. Here's what I see as the advantages of each. 15 - newer car, better looking (IMO), handles, rides and stops better. Better quality car (let's face it, old Mustangs were a bit cheap), more features. IRS (cuts both ways, handling improved, wheel hop is terrible). Terminator - light, smaller, not depreciating, solid rear axle. I guess in the end you have to do what is right for you. For me, the 15 was the better deal
terminator has irs too factory although a lot of people swapped in solid rear instead. I always wanted a cobra and still do its just people want so much for them these days...I mean like you pointed out you can get newer 5.0s with fewer miles for less money. I want a car to drive and enjoy so future value isn't really that important to me I'm not trying to suffocate it into a garage so it can be worth a lot down the road. so that's why I'm thinking the newer 5.0 might make more sense to me
Right out of the gate I will say owning both cars. That the 5.0 coyote is better for the simple reason that’s it’s lighter . However the cobra engine is built ... so it can handle high horsepower. But I like the quick revs of the coyote and the smooth power delivery.
One of the biggest differences is the Terminator is fully forged cast iron block with rods that can handle up to 1000hp, new 5.0L rods are not as strong aluminum block and pistons are not forged. Also I highly doubt you are bolting on almost 100whp with new 5.0L, I would think 25-40 is more realistic.
Don Johnson that's is odd being the 5.0 with an almost identical bore and stroke size should make more than a 4.6L. The voodoo 5.2 v8 is also extremely low torque but high HP. It may be how they have the cams setup to get peak HP over torque. You'll see the 5.0 truck engine do the opposite with more torque than HP
It does not decrease the value substantially, but ones that have never been tuned and have the stock pulley with the factory plastic button will call for a higher premium
Great vids Danny, I've followed your channel for awhile, keep em coming, great info. I bought my 03 cobra new in December of 03 and only has 10k miles. What happened with the redfire cobra that you guys pulled the motor out of?
Joseph f thanks- more to come. Unfortunately, the owner of the redfire cobra has to sell the car off as a roller. Looks like that's the end of that build :(
Richard Harris wrong! You think you can simply run 30 psi on any engine? Rods will fail, blocks will crack, head gasket will fail, fuel will pre-ignite. Better fuel can help handle boost pressure, but ultimately too much boost is too much boost. You CAN run too much boost and destroy and engine
Coyote will make more using the same blower always because of compression and minuterized valvetrain, vvt, can rev much higher. New car 700 to 750 rearwheel with pass after pass with good fuel and tune. But Cobra can last longer at 750 if you have that kind of power.
Yes, pretty close.Stock for stock, mod for mod- but the new 5.0s are running $40,000+.. twice as much and will lose $20,000 in depreciation over the next few years
I live in California and I like the 03/04 Cobras...But!...There are no 50 State Street Legal Supercharger or Turbo kits as a Power Adder for it! Plus we have only have 91 octane fuel out here! So I currently have a 2003 Mustang GT/Cobra Project Car and it is fully paid for! As you may know, the 2000 CobraR came out with a with an N/A 5.4L engine for 1 year with 385HP from the Ford Factory! So what I am thinking is this either I could get a 03/04 Cobra with hi-mileage and swap out the S/C 4.6 4V 390HP Cobra engine and put in a 13/14 Shelby GT500 S/C 5.8L 662HP engine! Also, I am a Left Leg Amputee so I also plan to swap out the 6sp Trans with the New Ford 6R80 6sp Auto Trans!...or Since my 03 Mustang GT/Cobra Project car is Paid for!...I was thinking of going with a 15-17 Shelby GT350 N/A 5.2L 526HP engine swap out of a wrecked Shelby (I've seen a few online) or a 2015-2017 5.0L Coyote 435HP engine swap or a 13/14 Shelby GT500 S/C 5.8L 662HP engine swap! Whatever engine swap I plan to do it will also include a 03 IRS swap and a New Ford 6R80 6sp Auto Trans swap! So let me know what you think?...Thanks and God Bless! BTW!...I like the 03/04 Mach 1's as well! Maybe a Shelby GT350 N/A 5.2L 526HP engine or 15-17 5.0L Coyote 435HP engine swap with and an IRS swap? I've seen them with Hi-Mileage for around $10,000.00 +/-!...I am just saying! :-)
Screw it, I’ll buy a coyote and trans for 10 grand, the electrical swap kit thing for 2 grand, odds and ends for a couple grand, and have a ~400hp mustang. Similar in price to a terminator, but you can do it bit by bit and not need 20k all together at once.
Good day everyone, well ive always wanted a terminator, back in 2004 i bought a 2001 cobra, she was on fire until a 2003 cobra showed me what fast is. I put a vortech v2 on the 01 but was not satified, so on july 2017 i got my 1st 03 cobra, ive already put a steig stage 5 ported eaton, tb, injectors. But i still want more, she got 500rwhp, but i dont want to go broke doing it, so im looking vmp, but what is your thought on the steig stage 8 with the venom cooler and jlt cai, and 373 gears
That sounds like it would be a good set up, but those stock Eatons get pretty hot. I would recommend buying a used 2.3 L Whipple. You can find them for about $2500 used, which is about what you will spend with all the partying and such on the Eaton. My car makes about 600rwhp. Very easy way to get to your goal
I have been told that the Terminator engine is basically bulletproof. Is that overstating its reliability? I am looking to find one to daily drive. Is it a mistake to daily drive one?
It is one of the best built engines Ford has ever done. The alternator is a weak spot but the engine itself is certainly one of the strongest ever when properly maintained. I have videos for just about anything you’d need for it. Here is my alternador video ua-cam.com/video/0laLuFYHCU8/v-deo.html
You mention being careful with boost on the coyote, what is your opinion on this with the stronger rotating assembly of the 15-17 as compared to the 11-14?
Almokris The problem with the latest Coyote for boosted applications is they increased the compression ratio to 12:1. That’s great for power, but dangerous for pre-ignition. Being direct injection it should help with the danger of pre-ignition. However, the downfall is once the cars get old you’ll see more buildup on the intake valves now that fuel is not running past the valves and keeping them clean. It will be dangerous if any debris falls into the engine and pre-ignites the fuel like a burning ember falling into gasoline. I think a low psi supercharger kit would be a nice edition as long as it’s not pushed hard and you watch the octane rating and AFR
@@dannyjohnsonsgarage Thanks for the reply and info! I enjoy your videos and appreciate all the knowledge you share. I currently have a paxton set up on a 15 and have it wastegated at 10lbs. I have a 7lb spring but have been getting boost creep with it and am trying to sort it out so I can keep the psi low like you said. I always end up wanting a terminator after I watch your channel lol Thanks again for taking the time to respond!
But the coyote and especially the Roadrunner engine has the potential to rev close to 8000 RPM so over all the coyotes more efficient and generates less heat with equal amount of horsepower
The 4.6 and 5.0 Coyote aren't much different. Ford was still being conservative on the cam/porting/compression on the 4.6. The Mach 1 makes about 315 to 320 HP stock. But it peaks it's power at 5800 or so RPM. If you ad the more aggressive cams from the 96 4.6 Cobra and up the compression to 11:1 Then the power builds more and peaks higher at 6300 or so. That alone kicks their crank HP up to 350-360 range without a significant hit to their gas mileage. The Coyote's big advantage is big porting and valves, Ford admitting that modular motors are made for RPM :) and peaking their power where it should, using variable cam timing to preserve low RPM efficiency, and 21 more cubic inches. That being said. If only I could sneak a 2012 BOSS 302 under the hood of my Mach 1 and make a custom mount for the shaker.....
Hello, I purchased a 2004 SVT Cobra last year, it’s all stock and the supercharger doesn’t make a whine sound is it because it still has the stock air box and can you tell me if I put an aftermarket air intake on it will help the super charger have a more noticeable whining sound, thanks, I will wait for your reply
Dominic Sardina The supercharger will only whine under full throttle. The way to hear it more would be by spinning it faster with a smaller supercharger pulley or larger crank pulley (which requires a tune).
Disregard this if you address it later in the video, but I’m asking this question now before I forget to: Could you just install pistons with the tops shaped for lower compression in a coyote in preparation for boost?
That would lower compression, and it’s ok to keep high compression for more power if you run the proper fuel. At that point, you’re tearing the engine completely apart and need to do expensive machine work for the new parts. You’ll really be invested in it at that time and want to do new stronger rods and oil pump gears too
@@dannyjohnsonsgarage I just figured if one insisted on running around 15 or so pounds of boost on a coyote, stock bore flat top pistons (or some style for lower compression) would probably drop right in, allowing one to crank the boost up safely. This hypothetical for IF someone insisted on a lot of boost on a coyote.
Danny, are there svt cobra groups in Utah? I live in Salt Lake City and am also looking for a mechanic to work on these cars. Thanks, Danny johnson. Yes, thats my name!
Terminator has better looks (imo), street cred, and a more solid engine, the fact that it's still being compared to 2020 V8 engines is a testament of how beast that engine was back in 2003
Just my personal opinion. The "new edge" stangs are one of, maybe the best looking mustangs of all time.
On the other hand one of the worst looking interiors put in a vehicle, a ton of plastic, not a very good steering wheel, and a terrible shifter.
Revive you’re trippin. 05-09 is the worst. Nothing but plastic and fake leather. And with still the same features as the new edge, like as in buttons and accessories.
@@JoseDiaz-bk9mh nah I would still say the sn95/new edge interior is the worst. The s197 actually looks clean from pictures and stuff but yeah the plastics are horrible. The sn95 just looks ass and feels ass no matter how you look at it.
Jose Diaz I’ve owned a new edge, 2 s197s and an s550. The new edge by far had the worst interior out of my other cars. My 05 mustang interior felt basically the same as my 2012 boss 302 interior except the only real difference was the recaros in my boss unlike my red leather seats in my 3v. Than everyone knows the s550 takes the cake on interior looks. I love the new edge and actually sold my boss 302 and bought a terminator and now have a cheaper car payment which is nice but i don’t care much about interior looks. I’d rather have power over nice interior
BadBossRacing you’ve had some nice cars. But a terminator?!! Man one day imma get one too. Congrats on that and the Boss as well! I have a 02 gt, an 05 gt, and an 07 gt. My 02s interior is literally in perfect condition. The 05 and 07 have peeling door panels, you hit a bump in the road and the center console rattles, etc, etc.
P.s. I’m the type of person that prefers a sleepers simpler look. The. 02 has that matched with a all black interior. It just works for me, I wanna coyote swap it one day, at least a gen 2.
The 05-up Mustangs just feels like big heavy boats to me. Sure, it'll go 120mph and feel like 70 mph, but I just think they're boring. Now a Terminator...That's a Mustang!
I have an 04 torch red terminator! 646rwhp and 613rwtq it just turned over 23k miles. It is my garage/weekend queen. I will NEVER sell my baby, ever. My 3 year old daughter loves it. She says “daddy, make it go weeeeeeeeeeeep!” Kenne Bell blowers have the sexiest whine!I have no doubt that these cars will be collector cars in the future; with the big bucks.
very cool!
Jesse Costa these cars are still selling for high 20s here now.
Jesse Costa arent u cool
8=====D
My daughter is an instigator. Saying go faster daddy! Lol
I don't think there's any doubt that this guy knows what he's talking about. Great video
Justin Johnson I agree.
what about roush. saleen. california special edition. 7 up edition gt r ? i have an o4 gt with a 2000 cobra motor kinda built plus a 68mm turbo but i have to change the fuel system cuz its liening out
@@greenteamcaptain4087 2000 cobra motor...?🤦
Well it’s been a couple of years since this video was
made and the terminator is still holding value quite well.
Thanks for the great information. Much appreciated.
The raw experience from the cobra makes driving it so much better.
I agree. I have driven 5.0s on the street and the track and it honestly feels like my Mach 1 more than the cobra.
The prices of the terminators 5 years after this video have continued to climb drastically. Good moded terms or low mile unmoded go well i to the 40k range.
My advice is drive both before you make your choice, if you like the coyote more then you were never worthy of the cobra. Lol
Eli Gonzalez ha ha. It has truth to it. These cars are different in their ways and that makes a lot is sense. "It might just not be for you" would be a great way to describe it.
The cobra is.... well.... It's a COBRA. I'd rather say I drive a "Cobra" than any other coyote mustang. The name just sounds badass. Terminator Cobra haha
Angel Martinez I agree. After 10 years the coyote will be worth maybe $8k and a dime a dozen. The terminator will only increase in value assuming you don't completely trash it
To me value doesn't matter, it's the feeling you get while you own it, while I like the terminator which will always be a legend in the mustang, I get a lot more power in my 2016 GT with the Roush charger, trust me, 670hp makes you not give a damn
aidoist thank you for speaking from a person has or had “BOTH” cars...I mean I was in my teens when the cobra came out but at the same time I didn’t have the money for that but as an adult I love the 11-14. I think this guy is a lil leaning towards the cobras because he’s only got those to cars. No stock 67 gt500 in his stable but if you wanna talk about money that car pull more $ than anything thing
Your a wealth of knowledge Danny. The more i listen to you the more I understand my Cobra. Thankyou.
Stefano Spasaro Cheers 🙌🏼
Dude really great video. You are good at talking and keeping the viewer interested. I would take the Terminator over the new 5.0 any day. I also love the way they look and not so much the newer ones. More boaty and now Italian - it's weird.
Thank you. I agree. They have become more like the bigger challenger whereas the terminator was like the tight fighter jet cockpit
I know right? The newer 05 and up Stangs are big mid size cars and sure feel like it. The older New Edge Mustangs feel more nimble and less heavy. Though I was surprised how damn heavy my Mach 1 was at 3420 LBS with 3/4 tank.
I bought my '03 'vert brand new from the factory on September 30, 2002. The only mods are 3.73 gears, MGW shifter and custom pulleys, but stock crank and supercharger pulleys. I have a PA Performance alternator that replaced the stock one that toasted. I have an MM rear dif bushing kit and this year we are replacing the rest of the bushings and tie rods in the rear, along with the left side axle seal. They need to be in good shape to get a proper rear alignment and probably something that Termi owners might neglect.
Just rebuild the damn thing, it's a better engine than coyote.
Hey Danny, one thing you should mention. With a Coyote and cobra of the same HP, The Cobra will come out on top due to the instant torque of the roots/Twin screw blower
Very true
I started out with a 2002 GT then shortly there after a 2003 Saleen S281 non-supercharged, both cars were great however definately needed more power. Then came the 2004 DSG Mach 1, power and sound were much improved but still just needed something more. Next was the 2019 5.0 with the 10 speed, car was very fast, great to drive but very soft on the bottom, and didnt really care of the sound or high RPM charcter of the motor. 2 days ago I bought an 03 DSG Cobra.....almost completely stock minus the flowmaster 40's.....FINALLY....exactly what I have been missing, the car has everything.... great sound, special feel, more than enough power with huge potential, great looks, comfortable to cruise and just enjoy. This is what I have been seaching for Danny....now I understand the love for the Cobra and why.
Congrats. You may like this playlist Mustang Maintenance and repair
ua-cam.com/play/PLIjr-uSYDZi7hBrphoRniyYjb707PpPTu.html
Had an 03 cobra for a little over 4 years. Absolutely loved the car. Just a badass ride that reminded me of the older muscle cars...needed a car with a warranty though so traded and got a premium 2017 mustang gt. Very fast car as well but much more refined. Just doesnt seem like its as fast as it really is because its so smooth to drive. The cobra just feels faster even if the difference is negligible when they are both stock. I love the amenities the 17 5.0 has, and I enjoy it alot, but I'd be lying if I didn't say I do sometimes miss my cobra just for the sheer brute force the supercharger brought. Both cars hold a special place in my heart honestly. The T56 in the cobra is leaps and bounds over that clunky mt-82 in the 5.0 though. The cobras do hold their value. Paid 24 grand for mine 4 years ago and still got 18 on a trade in...could have sold it outright for even more. Ford really gave us two gems with the 03-04 terminators and the new 5.0s.
jrvbamafan1 Very nice! Thank you for the comment. I bet if you went back to a terminator after a 5.0 it would be equally difficult after enjoying how nice they are.
The current GT350 with the 5.2 will probably hold its value too. Since when did a domestic brand build essentially a Ferrari V8 engine? GM and Chrysler are too fixed in their ways to do that.
The MT-82 is scrap. I really don't like the one in my '12. Light action, but notchy and not so accurate. I've had the damn thing go into reverse when it should have gone into first and wouldn't come out of reverse. It made me look like a boob at the traffic light, even though I've been driving sticks since I learned how to drive in 1974. I've never missed a shift in my '03 or '99 Cobras. The '12 is my regular driver as it is way easier on gas, but that damned transmission is a piece of junk. My Cobras are my babies and they will be left to my niece and nephew when I finally can't drive them or worse.
Lifted_Above
All I can say is...I LOVE MY TERMINATOR!! Mine is an 03 Silver Metallic Coupe. Got it with 36,000 miles on it for 20K. Has a Whipple 2.3L & a 3.0 pulley and 3.73 gears with a t56 Magnum tranny. 650whp, 615wtq on 17 lbs boost.
tomkjr1 that's a great buy and a great car! Nice score
tomkjr1 I miss my Cobra. My wife made me sell mine after she told me that i better stop modifying my Cobra and sell it or she would divorce me..so I sold it to stay married
Chance Koehler I sold my first V8 (2001 GT) under basically the same reason. I still see the car around and want it back even though I have a COBRA and the Mach 1 LOL
Danny Johnson and that's not the worst of it, i had over thirty thousand dollars spent under the hood, 2.9L Whipple, BBK Long Tube Headers, Borla Attacs, one of the loudest mufflers in the industry, custom Comp Cams stage 3 boost cams, JE Forged pistons to raise the compression to 10.0:1, Forged Brian Crower Rods. basically it was touched to the point that it could produce 1000HP, and a stage V T56 from RPM transmission, and a custom tune to run on both E85 and regular pump gas. And I sold it for less than what I have invested in the car itself
Danny Johnson and it was Sonic Blue, and it was a coupe
Thank you for the terminators videos. Keep posting those videos of how to fix things on them. I learn a lot from your videos. By the time 5.0 coyote get to be 10+ years old they won't cost not even half of what a terminator is nowadays. They are nice and fast and I like them too.
Yanny Fragoso yeah, that's the problem with mass production and depreciation, but at least people can afford them. Thanks for watching
How much is 2004 gt worth now these new edge look horrible especially the interior
My brother has an 04 terminator silver with 110,000 miles, bought it for $14,500. Re-built rear end, pulled the vmp off of his 01 cobra, did a short throw, full exhaust, lowered, cooling upgrade and smokes my co-workers 2014 gt full exhaust, intake, tune built rear like it's nothing. Sad part is my brother is selling it now for $23,000 to buy a brand new Duramax. I wish I had the money...
human being There is great value in the terminator for sure. Too bad you can’t snatch it up from him
I like the less-refined SN95 cars like this more than the 5.0. It just... feels like an old school muscle car. Possibly the last car that does... and I love that! Procharged Mach 1 with Termi short block owner reporting in! I was very close to buying a 2013 5.0 instead, but then I found the Mach 1 and just fell in love with it. I found it with 24k miles a couple of years ago, already with the blower. I upgraded to the termi block, upped the boost and did a few other mods. Keeping it until the wheels fall off.
Very nice! I love my Mach 1 as well-though it’s just bolt on and gears right now. Mine needs boost :/
Be careful if you do it, keep it around 400-420 whp! Some people say 450, but I spun a bearing on the stock bottom end at that level. Might just want to keep it bolt-ons if it's your daily. That's awesome that you've got a Cobra AND Mach though. Doin' it right, lol.
Nice video, I've been fortunate enough to have had 3 03 Cobras thus far and they are one of the best mustangs Ford has ever produced. Being its on the fox chassis it has that feel, feel of being just the right size. Never had the 5.0 but did have a 13 Shelby and boy was it a different feel. Keep up the good videos!
Thank you. Maybe someday you’ll get another Terminator 😏
What a great life driving a mach 1 as a daily and owning a Terminator. I love the new edge mustangs a lot.
JaVvii3 thanks. Yeah, they are a great breed for their day, and affordable 😉
I wish they put a 4V in the 2001 Bullitt. I LOVE the color and style of the Bullitts. The Termi is the father of the Edge class though. These new 5.0s are nice and fast but they are dime a dozen.
The bullitt was intended to be a 4V but SVT wouldn’t share the engine. There were also other parts designed, but too many new crash tests and barriers led the car to be as similar to a GT as possible ua-cam.com/video/cQOfMnvsz14/v-deo.html
@@dannyjohnsonsgarage Didn't the 4V come in the Mach1 and the Bullit??
@@edjackson4389 At the time of the bullitt (2001) svt did not want to share the 4V and it would require more crash and standard testing, so the Bullitt remained a modified 2V and later in 2003 with the cobra being supercharged, the mach 1 got the 4V for 03-04
I've thought about selling my Terminator and getting a coyote. Decided to just throw the money into the cobra instead.
Coyotes are sinking in depreciation. The terminator is the better car to have. They will both be old cars but the terminator will maintain its value. Good choice
I own a 2003 Vert Termi, I would imagine both cars are a totally different driving experience, Great video and thanks for sharing all the differences. Much respect to any mustang owner and yall get a thumbs up from me on the street. :D
Didnt realize I wasnt subbed. Appreciate the content!
Ngl the Terminator is enough to scare me and its stock, I could not imagine 600HP
Great job on the comparison video Danny! All the best for you & your Terminator.
tomkjr1 thank you. Much appreciated. Thanks for watching
The only thing you forgot was the rear shot of the terminator lol
Great video man. I currently have a 96 Gt, 03 Mach 1 and this friday I'm getting an 03 Termi, super stoked!!
very cool. I’ve owned all three of those as well
Had a black 03 Cobra and I wish I would’ve held on to it. Although I love my Viper I still miss the Cobra.
one snake for another lol
And Shelby was the brains behind them
All!
Big flex.
You should compare the Internals because that’s the biggest difference
Great video. I would say another benefit is the New Edges are simpler, and hence easier to work on in many ways without having technologies like Ti-VCT and all the wild electronics and systems in the interior of the car.
Very good point. I don’t remember if I mentioned it or not, but it’s also a great advantage to already have all the write ups and videos on how to fix just about anything on the older cars.
Danny Johnson oh yeah for sure! With my 2v with the live rear axle, it’s also nice (and horrifying lol) how much Fox body info and even parts carry over suspension wise. I know there’s a lot of info and videos on s197s and even s550s, but you’re definitely right, the SN-95s have far more out there. I’ll stick with with SN-95s (even if mine is somehow destroyed one day) just for sake that I’ve touched and messed with every aspect/section of the car, besides building the trans, installing/rebuilding the diff, and assembling the shortblock. That knowledge and experience is invaluable to me, and I feel as if I’d almost be starting over going to another different and probably more complex platform.
3:20 you sounded like the Terminator. Good video man!
TheTerminator1919 LOL. Thanks for watching
These cars are, in my opinion, the last of the "muscle car" Mustang. Everything that came after it was a heavier, smoother riding and running experience. The Fox based Terminator will always have an "on the edge control" feeling and to many that's what makes a fun car. S197's and S550's will never garner this kind of street cred. MAYBE the new GT500 and even GT350s will be this collectible at some point.
Awesome vid man, your knowledge is profound. I'd love to see the mach1 thrown into this comparison. Dohc in both the termi and mach correct? Same engine just not supercharged? What if a supercharger is put on the mach, same numbers as a termi? As i watch more vids from you, the more i like your channel.
Both the terminator and mach 1 share the same forged kellogg crank and heads, but the terminators main difference is the iron block and forged manley rods and forged zolyner pistons. Here is a comparison I did against the two ua-cam.com/video/MMXVMsoj_RQ/v-deo.html
Very informative video! I have a 2012 mustang 5.0 and it’s so fun to drive.
They really are nice cars. I tried to be fair and give it justice. Mustangs should have been making 400HP a lot sooner. They are very well respected now
Great videos man just subscribed, keep up the great work!!
Thank you. Welcome to the channel 😉
The terminator keeps looking cooler and cooler but the coyotes keep looking blander
You are so right. I’m getting used to the new mustangs and now I love the terminators the more I see them.
I owned two sn-95 cars and a 2013 gt and I must say the build quality is much different. I love sn-95s but my goodness it is a pain to do things with it, like removing interior trim with the cheap plastic clips that break a lot and squeaks etc. The new plastics feel much stronger in the new cars and the clips seem to be more intelligently designed lol.
Yes, I agree the new build quality of Ford is among the top of the auto industry now
I'll be getting a terminator next hopefully. Loving my 19' GT at the moment, though.
Great comparison , I have owned 03 cobra( should have never sold it) , two 03 Mach 1 ‘s presently own one all stock 03 Mach 1 5 speed which is a daily driver and a 2012 Boss 302 ( great car ) If a could have a 4th option I would get a 03 cobra back! Great videos and accurate in the details
Thanks for your comment. That’s a nice collection, and if you see my video on the cobra vs mach 1 you’ll see (and i’m sure already understand) why I like having both. Great cars. A Boss would be nice as well!
Well the rarer Mustangs tend to retain more value down the road anyway.. The Terminator wasn’t your run of the mill Mustang like the GT was, same goes for Roush, Saleen, Cobra R and all the specialty Mustangs. The Coyotes will likely have a depreciation similar to the old GTs, (some the of low mileage mint condition examples would likely do better) While the Shelby GT350 and GT350R models along with the Roush stage 3s and Saleens will at some point bottom out, they’ll definitely go up in price as they become rare and the demand goes up. I feel the same way about the Shelby models designed after Carroll Shelby’s death just because they’re rare models with a unique engine.
The terminators hold their value more than any other stang in the modern era as in what theyre worth vs what their original msrp was. The roush and saleen cars go for less money typically and the supercharged versions (the only ones even close to a terminator performance wise but still no match with a 2v motor and non forged botton end) but those typically costed more when new vs the terminator. The coupes msrp was 35k new...they still go for 20-30 if in good condition and low miles depending on year color mods etc. Thats pretty damn good...they basically havent depreciated in 10 years if anything theyve slightly gone up.
When you enter the world of boost and/or high compression ... octane matters. For big performance 93 octane pump gas ain't gonna float the boat. E85 0ffers variable 95-105 octane and is fairly available in some parts of the country, but for big performance you'll have to upgrade the fuel system because E85 is less energy-dense than gasoline. And of course you get the corrosion problems associated with ethanol. If you're just gonna race the car, there is race gas easily available up to 118 octane. But it is so expensive you'd have to be Jeff Bezos to run it on the street. At you local general aviation airport you can get a product called 100 low lead or 100L. Aviation gas. With tetraethyllead. An honest 100 motor octane (roughly equivalent to about 105 R+M divided by 2 octane standard for mogas.) Also it has a low Reid vapor pressure, so cold starts are often an adventure. Because of the lead you'll have to change spark plugs often - maybe every 5,000 miles or so, just like back in the 1960s. But it is super-consistent in quality. It has to be. Aviators lives depend on consistent fuel quality. 100LL sells for over $5 per gallon.
There is another option. Compressed natural gas. Octane somewhere north of 120. Burns super-clean. Your spark plugs and oil stay clean for very long intervals. But it will require a re-engineered fuel system and injectors. Your fuel tank becomes very much like a SCUBA tank. A bona fide pressure vessel. But the gas itself is fairly cheap - about $2.00 per gallon gasoline equivalent.
Wouldn't a boosthead love to get his hands on the 130 and 150 octane leaded avgas that P-51s and Spitfires ran on. The Rolls and Packard Merlins made staggering HP because they could stand up to 90 psi boost. Think about it: six atmospheres over sea level. The best gas the Germans had was only 95 octane and the Daimler-Benz 605 used in Messerschmidt 109s exploded at over 50 psi boost. But the P-51 and Spitfire ground crew had to change all 24 spark plugs after every mission because that much lead fouled plugs like crazy.
I thought about swapping this engine (aluminum block from Lincoln) as a swap in my ‘06 gt after I built up the engine a little.
Why? Just want to.
If I’m being honest, coyotes are nice. That’s for sure. But you just can’t beat the sound of the older modular engines.
This was 4 years ago ! They are so much more now even with higher miles !
Great video just what I'm considering. Question do you think $30K is too much for a terminator with 38K miles and an upgraded kenne bell supercharger
Yeah, a little on the high side. I’d say closer to $26-$28k range
Very good info. Depreciation is why I've always stuck w/ buying
pre-owned coyote cars with low miles (
+The Millennial Trader Very good statistics there sir
I've done the same thing this is my 2nd 2012 coyote I've owned......paid $16k and it only had 10k on the clock (6spd)
Hey Danny, I love your UA-cam, very informative. I have learned a lot from you, any recommendations where I can buy a 2004 Terminator Engine?
Thanks! Yeah, ebay has some, a place called parts farm does a lot of them as well. If you have facebook there are a lot of pages with people selling them
Thanks. Great video. Answered lots of questions I had.
Jesse Contreras Thanks for watching. I need to make a movie on the 2018 now since Ford upped the compression ratio to 12:1 and added direct port injection
Just bought an '04 cobra, as far as I know it's only had a tune headers and Borla exhaust. Dyno sheet that came with the car has it at 475 crank horsepower. Blast to drive and when I can afford it the mods will start.
The results from a dyno would actually show rear wheel hp over crank, so add in another 15%-20% from parasitic loss as the power makes it to the wheels (they say 20% because of the Independent rear suspension), so you're engine is actually making about 560-570 hp at the crank
Danny Johnson thanks dude this is the first car I've ever seen that has been dynoed so it's all new to me. Cool video by the way.
I can’t help but feel the more modern coyote motor engineering approach that went into the coyote you can probably attain better overall performance along with power gains. I didn’t know ford got sued for the cobra power claims for that model year either.
Yeah, technology cannot be denied. It’s 100hp more than Ford’s former naturally aspirated mustang V8 (and even more like 200hp more when considering the 5.2L Voodoo V8. Great times for car people. On a side note, it was neat to see Ford sent out a leather jacket to all cobra owners who had the 99 (and also fixed the cars to make the power that was advertised). I had my chance to get a jacket from a friend but didn’t. Too bad I missed out.
The cobra engine can handle more hp.
01 Cobra with 5.0 swap is what I did. Couldn't rip the motor out of a terminator though, just wouldn't be right.
That’s gotta be a fun car.
i went with a 2017 5.0 track pack. and i love the thing. i didnt want a used mustang cuz you never know how the previous owners treated it. but i still love the cobras
That is very true. It is always nice to have a new car!
There is not track pack on 2017s
Just thumbed this up from 999 to 1k :)
🙏🏼
Great Vid Danny. Been a fan and appreciate your vids like this in addition to your instructional vids. I learn alot from you. My '04 Oxford White Termi has 3836 on the odo, but I am looking to sell my '98 Cobra and either buy a 13-14 GT500 or a newer 5.0 which I will actually drive. I am interested on your opinion on the 13-14 GT500 and will be searching to see if you did a vid on them.
Charles Murphy Depending on the year, some of the new 5.0s (18-19 and maybe 17s) have had out of round cylinders and problems requiring new engines. Many have had new engines replaced under warranty and then dumped them. I would research it a little more. The 13/14 GT500s seem a little more solid. ua-cam.com/video/fTqqwc-RJis/v-deo.html
Thank you for the video
Great videos boss! Much love to you and yours!! I’ve owned and love about all Mustangs! Just have a question or 2!? Where does the 13 Boss stand as far as the Terminators and the Mach1’s?? I’m considering a 2013 Boss. Would it run with the Terminator? What about a supercharged Mach1? Could it compete?!
I would say a boss 302 is right with a terminator. The mach 1 is behind both.You may enjoy this video on the gt500s vs terminator as the rods in the 500 are similar in the boss 302. Something to look out for if planning to supercharge. The boss 302 is a great car. They are getting quite affordable as well ua-cam.com/video/mB7h9S_qa3I/v-deo.html
Great vid man! Definately all accurate info in a time of false and bias info flooding the internet. I've had both and my coyote is much more refined and stock for stock dynoed higher and was slightly quicker. Definately two of my all time favorite platforms and both respond crazy well with mods. Tue coyote is strange, it feels alot slower than it actually is, extremely easy car to control.
I agree. I drove a 5.0 and it “felt” like my Mach 1
Have you been drinking!!!! Lol😉😉😉
Joe Reain Dinking race fuel 🤭
Lol...that a boy!!
Excellent video, Danny! The points you talked about are what I have been considering in the purchase of a "newer" Mustang. Still have my '89 LX 5.0 5 speed, but looking for a daily driver. And by the way, you need a bigger tool box. ;)
K5WXP one of the tool boxes belongs to my twin brother. Our Dad was an aviation mechanic and gave us each one. My brother’s is at my house while he is moving. They are very nice boxes. Thanks for watching, and if you’re looking for a solid daily you’ll probably want to lean towards the coyote ;)
Danny Johnson that is very cool. I have a good friend that has his Dad's tool boxes and tools. Recently built an awesome shop, too. I am leaning towards a 2014 GT with the Coyote to keep the price down, even though the 2018's look awesome, I rarely buy new and wait for a nice low mile car that has already depreciated. I bought my '89 LX in 1993 for about 7k with 34k. miles. Enjoying your videos, thanks!
Great informative video! I was stuck between getting a Termi and a 5.0 myself. I ended up getting a 5.0 and I dont regret it. To me its all about the value you get for what you pay. I know my 15' Gt may not hold value as well, but its a car that I know ill get good performance and reliability in a straight line or around a track. I drive my mustang on weekends only so mileage stays low. If I could have both a termi and a coyote, I would definatley do it!
Loscar5oh yeah, they are both great cars and the new 5.0s are a great option for people who want something low maintenance and new. I'm glad they are making good cars. I wanted this video to represent both cars and not a one-sided opinion. The truth is they are both good options for the right person. Thanks for watching and congrats on your 5.0!
Its all about what you want bud. As long as you chose a mustang you made the right choice!
terminator is RARE on the street
Very true! You don’t see too many
Hi, appreciated your videos when I had to work on my '02 GT, but now I have an S550. Any plans for making S550 how to vids?
+shiparino maybe someday. They are still pretty similar in a lot of ways I'm sure.
16-20k for a Cobra? This was definitely made 4 years ago lol Now more like 21-50k
Yep! Prices are on the rise! ua-cam.com/video/EIKCPkPJymk/v-deo.html
I love my terminator just picked it up , 30,000kms with a twin screw kenne bell 2.8 on 17lbs, with 60lb/hr injectors, shes a monster
Cody Lavery Very nice! Canada?
Danny Johnson yes sir, windsor ontario
Wish i could post photos here id like you to see it!
Cody Lavery Very cool! I hear of a lot from Canada 🙌🏼
Terminator > Coyote..
Danny I have a Cobra 04, very low miles, it is my summer convertible! I love it! I am a highway guy and as a Europian x rally racer can tell you, Cobra is a brutal dominant car on high speed! I don't care drag in the city or tire burning! I love the way she is brutal fast on highway speed! I like the tight feeling and shifter. New Mustangs as you said for more comfort. Cobra & Viper for guys who likes the pour power and old school handling on winding roads!
What about big turbos for The Terminator wouldn't that be better than a supercharger. Or does the supercharger have more potential. I would like to fully built stage 5 4.6 2v twin turbo. Throw it in a foxbody with full modern drivetrain and suspension with traction control and the semi auto transmission with badbutt gears. Like a 2018 Fox body
Yeah, turbo is much more efficient- just better off on an automatic car. In my case, I like the 6 speed streetable supercharged car
What do you mean by “streetable” in reference to the combo?
Do you mean bc it’s stick and supercharged? Vs stick and turbo?
@@mikesimmons852 not to speak for him but i beleive be was referring to the powerband of the blower the way it has instant power and works well with a stick and works well on the street, not so much that turbos dont work well
Great informative video once again good sir. What are your thoughts on swapping the iron block out with a very low mileage Teksid from a 97 mark? Any issues that you think I should consider. Thanks in advance
Love my terminator with a 2.8KB at 17psi, long tubes, and 60lb injectors over 600 at the wheels and next I want to convert to E85 and a solid axle swap.
+Louis Brigandi that's awesome. That's about where I am on mine, and wanting to slowly upgrade to a return system. No e85 here, so maybe if it gets more popular.
Danny Johnson Yeah it has gotten more popular here on Long Island but not so much if I want to take a ride upstate or to PA, so maybe in about a year or so. BTW very informative videos definitely keep them up. I've always been decently good with push rod motors but the modular motors are pretty new to me to work on myself and I'm finding out how much more expensive everything is for these motors, but it's worth it.
Interesting video, good comparison. Was out of the Mustang world for a while. Decided I'd pick up Terminator until I saw the prices people were asking for them. Started looking at late models instead and bought a 15 with 28K miles for the same price as what a 45K Cobra was going for. Here's what I see as the advantages of each. 15 - newer car, better looking (IMO), handles, rides and stops better. Better quality car (let's face it, old Mustangs were a bit cheap), more features. IRS (cuts both ways, handling improved, wheel hop is terrible). Terminator - light, smaller, not depreciating, solid rear axle. I guess in the end you have to do what is right for you. For me, the 15 was the better deal
Yeah, the good news is you have 2 good options. The new mustangs look good (except i’m not a fan from the side view). Nice cars
terminator has irs too factory although a lot of people swapped in solid rear instead. I always wanted a cobra and still do its just people want so much for them these days...I mean like you pointed out you can get newer 5.0s with fewer miles for less money. I want a car to drive and enjoy so future value isn't really that important to me I'm not trying to suffocate it into a garage so it can be worth a lot down the road. so that's why I'm thinking the newer 5.0 might make more sense to me
Right out of the gate I will say owning both cars. That the 5.0 coyote is better for the simple reason that’s it’s lighter . However the cobra engine is built ... so it can handle high horsepower. But I like the quick revs of the coyote and the smooth power delivery.
One of the biggest differences is the Terminator is fully forged cast iron block with rods that can handle up to 1000hp, new 5.0L rods are not as strong aluminum block and pistons are not forged. Also I highly doubt you are bolting on almost 100whp with new 5.0L, I would think 25-40 is more realistic.
I have a 2001 v6 mustang and i still don’t know if I should go for 4.6l terminator or 5.0😫 (budget wise) which would y’all choose?
At this point I would suggest a 5.0 for a daily car or a terminator if you’re going to have it as more if a collector item that you’ll keep forever
Another great video! I've always been curious as to why the coyote motors have such low torque #'s. Even more so when boosted.
Don Johnson that's is odd being the 5.0 with an almost identical bore and stroke size should make more than a 4.6L. The voodoo 5.2 v8 is also extremely low torque but high HP. It may be how they have the cams setup to get peak HP over torque. You'll see the 5.0 truck engine do the opposite with more torque than HP
Just putting a pulley on a terminator doesn’t decrease the value that intensely. They were still bringing $20K in 2017 and now closer to $30K in 2020.
It does not decrease the value substantially, but ones that have never been tuned and have the stock pulley with the factory plastic button will call for a higher premium
First comment.🤘🏼 thanks for the terminator videos. Keep it up
EAbraham.R you got it. More to come. Thanks for watching!
Great vids Danny, I've followed your channel for awhile, keep em coming, great info. I bought my 03 cobra new in December of 03 and only has 10k miles. What happened with the redfire cobra that you guys pulled the motor out of?
Joseph f thanks- more to come. Unfortunately, the owner of the redfire cobra has to sell the car off as a roller. Looks like that's the end of that build :(
Richard Harris wrong! You think you can simply run 30 psi on any engine? Rods will fail, blocks will crack, head gasket will fail, fuel will pre-ignite. Better fuel can help handle boost pressure, but ultimately too much boost is too much boost. You CAN run too much boost and destroy and engine
Coyote will make more using the same blower always because of compression and minuterized valvetrain, vvt, can rev much higher. New car 700 to 750 rearwheel with pass after pass with good fuel and tune. But Cobra can last longer at 750 if you have that kind of power.
So the new 5.0 are just as fast as the 04 cobras?
Yes, pretty close.Stock for stock, mod for mod- but the new 5.0s are running $40,000+.. twice as much and will lose $20,000 in depreciation over the next few years
@@dannyjohnsonsgarage very well said
My cobra is pullied and I dusted my boys full exhaust and bolt on Coyote
Richard Hammerbush by “dusted” you mean a car or two.
@@stunna_CODM 3-4 cars which is enough to kick dust up on the coyote lol
I live in California and I like the 03/04 Cobras...But!...There are no 50 State Street Legal Supercharger or Turbo kits as a Power Adder for it! Plus we have only have 91 octane fuel out here!
So I currently have a 2003 Mustang GT/Cobra Project Car and it is fully paid for! As you may know, the 2000 CobraR came out with a with an N/A 5.4L engine for 1 year with 385HP from the Ford Factory!
So what I am thinking is this either I could get a 03/04 Cobra with hi-mileage and swap out the S/C 4.6 4V 390HP Cobra engine and put in a 13/14 Shelby GT500 S/C 5.8L 662HP engine! Also, I am a Left Leg Amputee so I also plan to swap out the 6sp Trans with the New Ford 6R80 6sp Auto Trans!...or
Since my 03 Mustang GT/Cobra Project car is Paid for!...I was thinking of going with a 15-17 Shelby GT350 N/A 5.2L 526HP engine swap out of a wrecked Shelby (I've seen a few online) or a 2015-2017 5.0L Coyote 435HP engine swap or a 13/14 Shelby GT500 S/C 5.8L 662HP engine swap!
Whatever engine swap I plan to do it will also include a 03 IRS swap and a New Ford 6R80 6sp Auto Trans swap! So let me know what you think?...Thanks and God Bless!
BTW!...I like the 03/04 Mach 1's as well! Maybe a Shelby GT350 N/A 5.2L 526HP engine or 15-17 5.0L Coyote 435HP engine swap with and an IRS swap? I've seen them with Hi-Mileage for around $10,000.00 +/-!...I am just saying! :-)
I think the voodoo 5.2 would be an awesome swap that would get a lot of attention!
That's not true Whipple an Kenne Bell have Carb certified blowers for the Terminator as well as the coyote
Screw it, I’ll buy a coyote and trans for 10 grand, the electrical swap kit thing for 2 grand, odds and ends for a couple grand, and have a ~400hp mustang. Similar in price to a terminator, but you can do it bit by bit and not need 20k all together at once.
I enjoy your knowledge of mustangs
Thanks for watching. Hopefully my knowledge can be your knowledge. :)
Thanks for those videos bro👍🏼
Jose Posada thanks for watching
I have owned both and I say give me the cobra with a 5.0 SC in it!!!
I would love that in my Mach 1
Good day everyone, well ive always wanted a terminator, back in 2004 i bought a 2001 cobra, she was on fire until a 2003 cobra showed me what fast is. I put a vortech v2 on the 01 but was not satified, so on july 2017 i got my 1st 03 cobra, ive already put a steig stage 5 ported eaton, tb, injectors. But i still want more, she got 500rwhp, but i dont want to go broke doing it, so im looking vmp, but what is your thought on the steig stage 8 with the venom cooler and jlt cai, and 373 gears
That sounds like it would be a good set up, but those stock Eatons get pretty hot. I would recommend buying a used 2.3 L Whipple. You can find them for about $2500 used, which is about what you will spend with all the partying and such on the Eaton. My car makes about 600rwhp. Very easy way to get to your goal
Love your car like that you have all those car from that time I have a 96 cobra
+rcguy86 I had a 97 v6 mustang growing up and highly respect the 96-98 Cobras!
I have been told that the Terminator engine is basically bulletproof. Is that overstating its reliability? I am looking to find one to daily drive. Is it a mistake to daily drive one?
It is one of the best built engines Ford has ever done. The alternator is a weak spot but the engine itself is certainly one of the strongest ever when properly maintained. I have videos for just about anything you’d need for it. Here is my alternador video ua-cam.com/video/0laLuFYHCU8/v-deo.html
terminator was an instant classic. It's definitely a drivers car, if you can't drive, don't buy one.
Well said.
You mention being careful with boost on the coyote, what is your opinion on this with the stronger rotating assembly of the 15-17 as compared to the 11-14?
Almokris The problem with the latest Coyote for boosted applications is they increased the compression ratio to 12:1. That’s great for power, but dangerous for pre-ignition. Being direct injection it should help with the danger of pre-ignition. However, the downfall is once the cars get old you’ll see more buildup on the intake valves now that fuel is not running past the valves and keeping them clean. It will be dangerous if any debris falls into the engine and pre-ignites the fuel like a burning ember falling into gasoline.
I think a low psi supercharger kit would be a nice edition as long as it’s not pushed hard and you watch the octane rating and AFR
@@dannyjohnsonsgarage Thanks for the reply and info! I enjoy your videos and appreciate all the knowledge you share. I currently have a paxton set up on a 15 and have it wastegated at 10lbs. I have a 7lb spring but have been getting boost creep with it and am trying to sort it out so I can keep the psi low like you said. I always end up wanting a terminator after I watch your channel lol Thanks again for taking the time to respond!
Almokris Thanks. Sounds like a fun setup. Be safe with it
I feel the same way. I'd rather have something that is more rare. I also like the sitting position in the newedges more than the newer Mustangs.
azurebluemach I completely agree. I feel like a tiny kid sitting in the new cars lol
2004 TERMINATOR under 6000 miles , one owner,mint . They're asking $34, 000 seems like a fair price ...what do you think ?
ABB 4323 Sure. It depends on how bad someone wants it. I look at it like it’s getting a new car you can’t get anymore, so why not ask what it was new?
But the coyote and especially the Roadrunner engine has the potential to rev close to 8000 RPM so over all the coyotes more efficient and generates less heat with equal amount of horsepower
429mas definitely a great advantage for n/a vs FI
Only thing i would say is that the newer mustangs handle better. So you have to take that into account. I love new edges though
I would agree with 2015+ and the IRS, but not so much with the 11-14 cars
The 4.6 and 5.0 Coyote aren't much different. Ford was still being conservative on the cam/porting/compression on the 4.6. The Mach 1 makes about 315 to 320 HP stock. But it peaks it's power at 5800 or so RPM. If you ad the more aggressive cams from the 96 4.6 Cobra and up the compression to 11:1 Then the power builds more and peaks higher at 6300 or so. That alone kicks their crank HP up to 350-360 range without a significant hit to their gas mileage. The Coyote's big advantage is big porting and valves, Ford admitting that modular motors are made for RPM :) and peaking their power where it should, using variable cam timing to preserve low RPM efficiency, and 21 more cubic inches.
That being said. If only I could sneak a 2012 BOSS 302 under the hood of my Mach 1 and make a custom mount for the shaker.....
Great video
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it
Hello, I purchased a 2004 SVT Cobra last year, it’s all stock and the supercharger doesn’t make a whine sound is it because it still has the stock air box and can you tell me if I put an aftermarket air intake on it will help the super charger have a more noticeable whining sound, thanks, I will wait for your reply
Dominic Sardina The supercharger will only whine under full throttle. The way to hear it more would be by spinning it faster with a smaller supercharger pulley or larger crank pulley (which requires a tune).
Disregard this if you address it later in the video, but I’m asking this question now before I forget to:
Could you just install pistons with the tops shaped for lower compression in a coyote in preparation for boost?
That would lower compression, and it’s ok to keep high compression for more power if you run the proper fuel. At that point, you’re tearing the engine completely apart and need to do expensive machine work for the new parts. You’ll really be invested in it at that time and want to do new stronger rods and oil pump gears too
@@dannyjohnsonsgarage I just figured if one insisted on running around 15 or so pounds of boost on a coyote, stock bore flat top pistons (or some style for lower compression) would probably drop right in, allowing one to crank the boost up safely. This hypothetical for IF someone insisted on a lot of boost on a coyote.
Danny, are there svt cobra groups in Utah? I live in Salt Lake City and am also looking for a mechanic to work on these cars. Thanks, Danny johnson. Yes, thats my name!
Is there a video of this coyote swap by the sound and driving video?
The terminator is the most underrated car smh