Did Ben Hogan Use the Stack and Tilt Golf Swing? [THE ULTIMATE TEST]
Вставка
- Опубліковано 13 чер 2024
- Ben Hogan - was he a Stack and Tilter? Did Ben Hogan use the Stack and Tilt golf swing? Ben Hogan was an excellent golf ball striker (regarded by many as the best golf ball striker of all time). At the heart of his excellent ball striking was his unique approach to the golf swing. Years later, Ben Hogan's golf swing is still widely discussed in golf instruction forums - bringing up the age-old questions "Was Ben Hogan Stack and Tilt?" Uttering those words in a golf instruction forum can get you drawn an quartered, shamed, and put into exile. Let's get to the bottom of this - was Ben Hogan really Stack and Tilt? I put him to the test and come to a conclusion on this great golf swing debate.
#BenHogan #StackandTilt #TheGolfSwing
Ben Hogan Stack and Tilt Golf Swing Contents
1. Introduction 0:00
2. What is Stack and Tilt 0:20
3. The #1 Checkpoint in Stack and Tilt 0:58
4. Stable Axis - Weight Forward 3:05
5. Stable Axis - Shoulder Down 4:40
6. Point #1 - Weight Forward 6:37
7. Another Look at the Weight Forward 7:40
8. Point #2 - Hands In 10:04
9. Hands In - Notes on Knee Flex 12:40
10: Point #3 - Shoulder Down 13:54
11. Point #4 - Arms Straight 16:08
12. Point #5 - Tuck Hips 19:08
13: The Verdict - Is Hogan a Stack and Tilter? 22:06
FREE - Discover the Top 3 Things You Need to to Be a Great Ball Striker - go.saguto.golf/
Play the best golf of your life with my online golf school - saguto.golf
Join the Crispy KFC Club to access bonus SagutoGolf content and extra perks:
/ @sagutogolf
======================================================================
STUFF I USE/WEAR (Discounts on select items below for viewers)
1. V1 Golf App (for analyzing my swing and my students' swings) - v1sports.com/get/v1-golf-app/...
2. Upglove Golf Gloves - upglove.com/sagutogolf
3. Athalonz shoes - a comfy and powerful golf shoe you will love. I wear them all the time - (use code SAGUTOGOLF for $20 off)- www.athalonz.com/collections/...
MY "DIY" GOLF NET based on this video - • DIY GOLF NET - Homemad...
======================================================================
SUBSCRIBE LINK: ua-cam.com/users/subscription_c...
I am Tom Saguto, PGA Member and founder of SagutoGolf. Thank you for visiting my instructional page where you can find how to get on the fast track to improving your golfing abilities. Whether you are a seasoned golfing veteran looking for a quick swing tune-up after an on-course emergency, or a beginner just looking to get the most out of your golfing experience, I am here to help you achieve your golfing goals.
My mission as your swing doctor is simple, to help you maximize your enjoyment in game of golf. Because, let’s face it, golf is a hard game.
My philosophy is wholly based on the student having a fun, meaningful experience in a frustrating and complicated game where potential lifelong golfers either quit because it is too difficult or that they experience some form of swing-related pain or discomfort. I mitigate these problems by focusing entirely on the student’s needs and goals while teaching a golf swing method that ultimately takes stress off of the common pain areas of the swing.
Tom Saguto's personal website: www.sagutogolf.com - Спорт
Make the most out of the game you love by joining Tom's Online Golf School - saguto.golf/
AWESOME STUFF I USE/WEAR - visit: saguto.golf/p/store
F
Never thought I could actually be more hungry for more golf. You had me at BUTTERY.
Just wait until you add in the crispy KFC with a side of mashed potatoes, Corey!....😂
Enjoy!
Tom
Watched this today again since you first posted and I must say it’s one of the most informative analysts you’ve done. Would love to see more like this.
Just did the same and fully agree, very good analysis.
Precise, Detailed, and brilliant analysis .Thanks !
Friend of mine just eagled a par 4 thanks to this video. Thanks Tom Saguto. Exceptional stuff here. We appreciate it!
That's fantastic, Tom!! Congrats to your friend and thanks so much for sharing!!
Tom
Very good technical breakdown of the stack and tilt. You described the bodily feeling in the swing perfectly, which most instructors struggle to do. I heard Hogan changed his swing to stack and tilt after his accident because of his back/hip injuries. I have a bad back too so I implemented his technique into my game. It improved my comfort and power immensely--more torque in the hips.
Great job!
Subscribed!
I truly appreciate your kind words, Lucas, and I'm very glad to have you onboard as a subscriber!!
While Mr. Hogan pre-dates the swing name "Stack and Tilt" - and though he would not be considered "textbook" S&T because he had that brief shift in pressure to his rear leg before getting into his front side at the top of his backswing - the majority of his swing contains so many great elements that we can all benefit from and which also fit perfectly within the realm of S&T! Did Mr. Hogan tilt, turn, and extend while maintaining his swing center? Yes. Did his lead arm match his tilted shoulder plane at the top of the backswing, signifying no independent lifting of the arms? Yes. Did he take his hands in deep to access the tremendous power source known as "angular momentum"? Yes. Aside from the brief temporary shift of pressure into his trail side at the start of his swing, was his weight otherwise forward throughout as evidenced by his bending front leg and straightening trail leg? Yes. Did his motion facilitate an unrestricted 45 degrees of tilted hip turn to promote another 45 degrees of effortless tilted shoulder turn (for a full 90 degrees)? Yes. And that post-accident swing won Majors!! Could there then be any greater testimonial to the power, consistency, and body-friendly longevity of this swing method that enabled Mr. Hogan to compete - and win - at the game's highest level after sustaining such devastating injuries??
Thanks again, and keep up the great work!!
Tom
PS: By the way, have you considered enrolling in the SagutoGolf online school? For just $10 US/month or $99 US/year you'll have unlimited access to a comprehensive members-only system for the full swing, the short game, and much more. The school's intuitive course curriculum greatly simplifies the entire process through succinct, step-by-step videos, and I'm regularly adding new content. This will really put you on the fast track towards learning everything in a well-organized, self-guided fashion. There's even a members' forum where you can ask me specific swing-related questions, interact with others in the SagutoGolf community, and suggest new content ideas, plus you'll also have access to all exclusive "Crispier Than KFC Club" UA-cam channel members' content at no additional charge. Here's a link if you'd like additional info: saguto.golf/p/golf-swing-simplified-tom-saguto-pga.
I hope to see you there!!
Says ‘you can fit a grapefruit in there’ without cracking up; that’s impressive. That’s a man dedicated to teaching the craft. Bravo, Tom.
Always unscripted - 100% of the time. If that grapefruit comment isn't proof of that, then I don't know what is....😆
Cheers!
TS
Now, my game has gone from crispy to extra crispy with mashed potatoes and gravy, collard greens, and watermelon. Yum!
At 17:21 you can see how much wrist action there is in Hogan's swing. That is why there was a need for his grip. Pure athletic ability
A great explanation. The tilt and leg action were vividly displayed. It looks like it’s OK to have more active legs. I am really working on my tilt. This is a broader discussion. Thank you!
Thanks, @aviatorAW - I'm glad you enjoyed this episode!! Active legs are okay in terms of their supporting the swing's tilting, turning, extending, and weight forward motions (the bending of the front leg and straightening of the trail leg in the backswing, for example). What we don't want is any shifting or swaying action.
Cheers!
Tom
A great video! Tom's online golf school is excellent & worth every penny!
I'm glad you enjoyed this Hogan episode, Robert, and thanks for your kind words regarding the online school!!
I did my best to price the school at a "no-brainer" level given the quality and effectiveness of the delivered product, and I sincerely appreciate you recognizing that and taking the time to "shout it from the rooftop"!!
Keep up the great work and have fun out there!!
Tom
Love this video! Starting with Ben's five lessons and moving into Tom's training program was such an easy, congruent transition.
I appreciate your kind words, Justin!!
Mr. Hogan is recognized by many as being the greatest ball striker of all time, and yes - he certainly did make great contributions to the world of golf instruction and remains popular in that realm today. There's a lot of great information in that "Five Lessons" book, but there have also been many misinterpretations that have led numerous golfers - and their ball flight - astray. I do my best to take what Mr. Hogan conveys in the book as his "feels", apply it to the reality of what he actually did in his swing, and translate it into something we all - including myself - can learn well from. If we get Hogan right there is tremendous and timeless instructional value to be garnered!!
Thanks again, and keep up the great work!!
Tom
Excellent presentation Tom, well done. I’ve just signed up to your golf school and will be working on the S&T drills over the coming weeks whilst we’re in lockdown and no golf courses open here in the UK. I’m a big fan of S&T and have read the book and have the DVDs produced by Mike Bennet and Andy Plumber. Regards Bernhard, Worcester England.
I'm glad you enjoyed the episode, Bernhard, and I am thrilled to learn that you have enrolled in the online school!! As a S&T fan I am confident you will find that the school's courses, lessons, and drills provide an excellent means of learning the swing in a simplified manner. Hopefully you will also make good use of the Indoor Training Program during the current lockdown so you'll be ready to hit the ground running when things open up again in the UK!
Thanks for your kind words and support!!
Tom
@@SagutoGolf Saguto online golf school is worth every penny!
Shot 2 over today. From 8 over. Best score i have. This swing is a magic.
That is *AWESOME!!* Well done, and thanks for sharing your success!!
Keep it magical, keep it crispy!
Tom
Excellent video, excellent explanation.
Fantastic analysis of the stack and tilt. Love your presentations.
Thanks George - I appreciate that and I'm very glad to know that you are enjoying my instruction content!!
Tom
Thanks Tom, love the sessions you do on the Hogan, always enlightening. I attempted teach myself to play using Hogans book. Thanks again.
Thanks for your kind words, Jay!
Mr. Hogan is recognized by many as being the greatest ball striker of all time, and yes - he certainly did make great contributions to the world of golf instruction and remains popular in that realm today. Of particular noteworthiness in this regard is his "Five Lessons" that you are likely referring to. There's a lot of great information in that book, but there have also been many misinterpretations that have led numerous golfers - and their ball flight - astray. I do my best to take what Mr. Hogan conveys in the book as his "feels", apply it to the reality of what he actually did in his swing, and translate it into something we all - including myself - can learn well from. If we get Hogan right there is tremendous and timeless instructional value to be garnered!!
Cheers!
Tom
I have been trying to play golf the Hogan way for thirty years it works it's the best way for us amateurs to play we don't have the magic moves the pros have for me when my swing starts going bad it's because my right elbow starts to to fly and I start casting along with swaying off the ball .Hogan best golfer to ever live enetered only sixteen majors win nine.
I think this was your first best explanation of Hogan's swing of all your lessons on him!!!
Thanks Gerard - I'm glad this Hogan analysis resonated well with you!!
TS
Playing my best golf EVER cheers Tom :-)
I have been a student of the hogan fundamentals for 30 years. This is the best interpretation of Hogan's swing that I've seen. I have started practicing what Tom is teaching and I'm stoked to play and practice! Noticing the weight going left before the downswing is just genius. Looks like Hogan's shift to the right is more of a timing move than a fundamental weight shift. Great work!!! Carried my 5 iron 195yds yesterday! Boom! ThanksTom!
Thanks Greg, I'm glad you enjoyed this video - and that it's bearing good fruit for your golf game!
Correct, that top of backswing position is what sets up a powerful downswing.
Again Tom, impressed with your system...its snow on the grid here in the dfw TX area so cant get out to try. I first saw SNT with Jess Frank but I really like your explanations a tad better...saw your collaboration with Frank also. Been trying on a mat inside trying to do in slow motion and cant wait for weather to clear. I also tried a mini version for chipping and I have never felt so good over the ball, solid contact 95% of the time on the first day. Contact in chipping was always hit or miss with me and it seems the SNT works also with chopping. Been trying to find a chipping lesson from you. Cant wait when I can afford to sign up as a member! Love your stuff Tom....keep it up!
I appreciate your kind words, Gregory, and I'm thrilled to learn of your enthusiasm to get out there and try this!
Here's a collaborative episode with Eric Cogorno in which he offers a chipping tip: ua-cam.com/video/gY9iWY2U6yc/v-deo.html
Beyond that, the vast majority of my short game content is in the online school. I look forward to seeing you there whenever you are ready.
Have fun out there (once the winter stuff clears)!!
TS
Working for me, with my driver I shift weight a bit but all other clubs keep weight forward.
This is just fabulous . Many thanks Tom
Thanks Michael - I'm glad you enjoyed this analysis!!
Tom
Hi Tom from London I found your videos recently and have been improving since then, it takes some getting used to but gets you striking the ball much better also like your humour I'll be taking a grapefruit to the course if that's what it takes 😁thanks keep it up
I sincerely appreciate your kind words, Mike, and I am very glad the instruction on my channel has benefited your game!!
Thanks for sharing, keep up the great work, and be sure to eat that grapefruit when you're done using it!!
Tom
PS: By the way, here's a link to my FREE mini-course “The Top 3 Things You Need to Be a Great Ball Striker” in case you’re interested in learning about the swing system I teach in a more structured manner: go.saguto.golf/
An absolute wonderful summary of an easy way to hit a golf ball. Thanks for the work putting it together.
My pleasure - I'm glad to know that this helped!!
Tom
All stuff here Homer Kelley shared with the world decades ago, love the videos and content here Tom, you’re becoming one of my favorites on YT.
Yep - the roots of this swing can be clearly traced to Mr. Kelly's brilliant work.
Thanks for your kind words and support, Scott!!
Tom
Outstanding Tommy....I love that when you spill a gonzo bucket of crispiness. You hit everything, I don't even know what everything is; but you nailed the entire gambit. Those hands, man....that is finally sinking in like no tomorrow, I love when that happens. Just a side comment...Hogan's cap makes a nice visual, you have that sawed off crescent that stays parallel with his arm position....just sweet....Tommy, I got this stuff, 2 under on the front 9; never happened before. Had a couple hiccups on the backside, but I know exactly what went wrong. I need to have my weight more evenly distributed on greenside bunkers, or bad things keep me buried. Not a problem with fairway bunkers. Keeping it crispy, Tommy...Thanks again, you are a genie in a bottle or a bucket. Nice....!!....
That's some sweet sauce, Teddy Z - it sounds like you've got this swing thing nailed down quite well! Your game is now a buffet of Golden Extra Crispiness being served hot all day long!!
Congrats on your personal best front 9; looking forward to hearing about your lowest 18-hole score real soon!!
Thanks for the great update!!
Tom
Great video Tom, it put it all together for me, had my best round in a long time today, crispy irons and solid drives and I improved as the round progressed. Thanks mate, love your work.
Well done, Shane!! Thanks for sharing, keep up the great work, and stay crispy!!
Cheers,
Tom
Love this one.... Great video comparison!!!
Thanks - I'm glad you enjoyed it!!
Tom
Tom, your vidéo and good advice combined with explanations about Ben Hogan’s swing have simply changed my life.
Thank you body! 🏌️♂️⛳️👍
@Marc-Andre Sabourin - I am very glad to learn that my channel's instruction has benefited your game to such an extent!! You've obviously done an excellent job digesting the lesson content, incorporating it into your swing, and taking ownership of it.
Thanks for sharing your success, keep up the great work, and have fun out there!!
Tom
Love your teaching and instruction, Tom!!! Crispy, baby….
Is not the issue here the issue of body tilt or side bend as explained in Tom's own clip on how to tilt in the Golf swing? A simple concept that is rarely spoken about but is magic for a stable swing and maintaining spine angle and posture. Go from left side bend to right side bend through impact and what do you have? - the magic move!
You got it, David!!
Brilliant analysis which is the foundation of Tom’s golf system.
Thank you, Andrew - I appreciate that!!
Tom
Tom, loved that! Charlie Wie is a great model for S&T, but I found some older video of Grant Waite, which is exceptional. I could watch video of him and Hogan swing the club all day.
Thanks Bob - glad you enjoyed it!!
Grant Waite is an excellent swing model. Tiger even said that Waite has one of the best swings in golf!
Cheers,
Tom
Great video, thanks
Thanks C R - glad you enjoyed it!!
Tom
hi tom,,, there`s sooo much in this ! its like a favourite classic
movie, you can watch over and over and still glean valuable
crucial bits you missed before !! 😁👍👍
Hmmm...perhaps I should do a sequel to this box office hit then??..... 😎
Thanks - I'm very glad to know that this episode from the archives resonated with you and that you are still gleaning valuable morsels of helpful information from it!!
Tom
Nice idea Tom ..however isn’t there a danger of overdoing this and ending up with a reverse pivot ? ie weight goes forward on the backswing and then backwards on the downswing.
Great analysis.....but the one thing about Hogan’s swing.....there was something ethereal going on that no one can truly emulate. (I know you realize this).
There are also a lot of great, basic fundamentals in his swing that we all can learn from.
Fun breakdown, thanks again!
Great explanation and comparison of the stack and tilt. You’re the man!
Thanks John - Glad you enjoyed it!!
Tom
@@SagutoGolf
Hey Tom; After hitting the worst back nine of my life on Tuesday I went out and tried the stack and tilt yesterday. I hit my irons the best I’ve ever hit them and my fairway woods, loved it. My short game was spot on but my driver still needs work. I’m a believer and you will be my number one guy hence moving forward. By the way my back doesn’t hurt half as bad using the stack and tilt. Your the best buddy thanks.
Shifting off the ball and failure to keep that relationship to the ball hurts many golfers... Most of the guys I play with do both. That's why I beat their ass!!! lol.
You got that right, Larry!! I see it every day!!
Send 'em my way after you've taken enough of their money!!
Tom
Hey Saguto i been focusing on getting good Lag on my short backswing and i hit 2 drives 260 and 280 yds with Lag, my normal driving distance is 230 yds, but i just got into this Lag and learning, you got a link for A Lag video with driver.
If you're banging drives out there an additional 30 to 50 yards to a very respectable distance with your short backswing, what more are you possibly looking for??!! When executed properly the swing method I teach naturally builds up plenty of lag and also harnesses the tremendous power source known as "angular momentum". Here's a link to the playlist of my channels downswing-related videos - ua-cam.com/play/PLV62KxT7Mp7Jxi814RQddJx3wkHqxqhio.html - but really the best place to go for structured sequential lesson content is my online school, supplemented by an occasional online lesson or V1 swing video analysis to keep the learning process on track.
Aside from that, I'll just say great work building that lag and enjoy your newfound distance!!
Tom
It's as if the front leg is the post. It's insane how far you can punch the ball with weight forward and just using your upper body. Eventually after getting alignment down routinely and correct... you naturally start using the legs. I didn't realize this until this year. I stack and tilt 100% without realizing it. I feel like my lead arm is just a stabilizer. I can pull with my right hand as if I was throwing a disc underarm and as long as my lead arm is relatively straight and no wrist movement, the ball is hit KRISPY as hell every time. I took the biggest leap this year.
BTW I won my division at my local 9 hole thanks to you buddy. It all started with your videos. Keep going and keep teaching. You're getting more and more simplistic with the teachings, that's more people getting those lightbulb moments. I think you need a few more videos on alignment though. Anytime I'm struggling, I put a driver down between me and a tee and setup to that a few times just to get back to the feel. I'm gonna say it again... ALIGNMENT IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF GOLF. PERIOD. Prove me wrong if anyone thinks otherwise.
Another thing to add to this... I tried a squatting method for drives and holy shit haha. I banged one about 370 and hit the ball collector at the range. The guy came up after and asked "did someone from here hit the cart?" haha... he thought it was someone from fairway 6. HOWEVER. It is not consistent. It would be more for a long drive comp. or something of that nature. Cause it moves your head up and down, relying heavily on eye hand coordination.
*AWESOME!!!* Congrats on your success and victory!!
And yes - we should first default to checking our setup before considering any kind of swing intervention. We all fall into the trap of getting too comfortable, and we then begin to take our grip, stance, posture, alignment, ball position, etc. for granted, but without proper attention these things do tend to creep on us over time. 90% of the result is predetermined before we even take the club back, yet I've seen so many folks make a mess out of an already sound swing because they overlooked or did not consider the foundational elements of the setup.
Thanks for sharing, keep up the great work, and keep having a blast out there playing your best golf!!
TS
great stuff
Hi Tom again great Video I noticed something tucked under Charly Wee's right armpit what is that and why is he using this ?
Probably a small towel to reinforce the upper arm/chest connection, Ennio.
Another great video Tom. Question: What would you say is the purpose of the head over under Charlie’s right armpit? Is that a good practice tool?
Thanks!
Headcover
Helps stay connected.
Thanks Harry - I'm glad you enjoyed it!
As @Gregory Carricato said in this thread, it's a drill for maintaining the upper arm connection. You can do this also with a glove, a small towel, or even a tee. In fact a good drill from the Stack and Tilt book is to stick a tee under each armpit and hit balls while trying to keep both tees in place for the duration of the swing.
Here's a recent episode from my channel in which I stress the importance of these connections: ua-cam.com/video/GFwqlFjr60I/v-deo.html
Cheers!
Tom
Thank you Tom always the best.
Thanks Patrick - I'm glad you enjoyed this latest installment!!
Tom
Definitely an interesting video. My only observation: It's known Hogan lost the use of his legs as he got older after his accident in 1950. Much of the film I see of him (compared against Stack and Tilt) was shot after he wrote "5 Lessons" in 1955. The left-leaning side tilts in his backswing are from his left knee moving more OUT vs. in and behind the ball (which I see more of in earlier film prior to Five Lessons). So were these S&T moves an intentional change in technique on his part or more related to the injury catching up with him as he aged? Something we'll never know for sure. All the best.
I believe the fact that Mr. Hogan - perhaps the preeminent student and tinkerer of the golf swing - purposefully implemented these changes when he did and was still able to compete at the game's highest level offers testimony to the body-friendliness, playability, and longevity afforded by the motions that comprise the S&T swing!
Cheers!
Tom
On close examination you can clearly see 1) a little head movement to the right in this video. His head movement increases with the length of the club. With shorter clubs such as the 7 iron there would be no movement. 2) that Hogan is starting his downswing before finishing his backswing. This can be outlined by watching his right hip as it starts its lateral move as he just nears the top of the backswing. This is common with all great ball strikers. This is why you think you see all his weight on the left foot at the top of the backswing. What in fact you are seeing is Hogan in the beginning stages of his downswing and the transfer of weight has begun. 3) The left shoulder moves a bit to the right, which causes some weight transfer to the with longer clubs. The longer club the more pronounced it will be. Although with shorter clubs such as the PW there is more weight staying left. This is due to the narrow stance. So with a very wide stance such as the driver Hogan's left shoulder moves significantly left indicating plenty of weight transfer to the right. There really is no debate on what Ben Hogan was doing in his swing. Video analysis has been done to incredible detail. A good start to get an idea of what Hogan was doing is to watch Craig Hanson's golf channel and his analysis of Hogan's swing. He has a very evidence based approach. Another great channel is Wayne Defrancesco's. Tons of analysis out there on Hogan's swing, so there really is zero debate with those from the evidence based side of things.
I appreciate your thoughtful and detailed analysis.
Stack and Tilt is a model of the golf swing based on data from the best golf ball strikers. For this reason, someone can be doing Stack and Tilt without even knowing that they're doing it. This is because there are basic requirements that must be met to hit a golf ball consistently on the center of the clubface with the club bottoming out in the same place every time on the ground. There are also requirements necessary to add power to the golf swing without sacrificing accuracy. Stack and Tilt determined based on a study of the best golfers of all time that they all had 3 things in common (the 3 main golf fundamentals): 1. Hit the ground in the same spot every time (consistent crispy contact) 2. Have enough power to play the golf course well (POWER) 3. Be able to have a predictable curve (accuracy). A golfer MUST be able to do those 3 things to be good at golf. Stack and Tilt is a system and a model for accomplishing these fundamentals incredibly well. As far as tour players - past and present - using 100% of it, 99% of it, 97% of it, or 78% of the system, it doesn't really matter because they're ALL doing it to some extent. Those 3 fundamentals never change.
So, with regard to Mr. Hogan, did he tilt, turn, and extend while maintaining his swing center? Yes. Did his lead arm match his tilted shoulder plane at the top of the backswing, signifying no independent lifting of the arms? Yes. Did he take his hands in deep to access the tremendous power source known as "angular momentum"? Yes. Did his motion facilitate an unrestricted 45 degrees of tilted hip turn to promote another 45 degrees of effortless tilted shoulder turn (for a full 90 degrees)? Yes. Thus, we can call it what we want or don't call it what we don't want - but the bottom line is that this is what Mr. Hogan did, and it just happens that these same swing elements are shared with The Golfing Machine and Stack & Tilt, and we can all benefit from incorporating them into our respective swings!
Cheers!
Tom
@@SagutoGolf Those of us deep in the Hogan world have zero debate because everything is literally on film and that footage has been studied to the greatest length. You can't make claims without detail footage to back up your claim. When step into the Hogan world you need to be evidence based. Please breakdown some driver footage of Hogan piece by piece showing exactly where he is stack and tilt. I look forward to your detailed analysis. For those of you who want a detailed breakdown right away please check out Craig Hanson's and Wayne Defrancesco's channels. They have truly pioneered analysis of Hogan's swing. Please remember never listen to anyone that doesn't do a complete and detailed breakdown Hogan's swing when making claims
It really is phenomenal. Your teaching technique is very clever and very interesting. To infinity and beyond ,you will hit the fairway not the the pond. Keep up your good work Tom, thank you. When are you going to start doing online guitar lessons
Thanks Robert - I appreciate your kind words and I'm glad you enjoyed this latest episode!!
My guitar membership program is still active, and there’s plenty of great lesson content in there! Here’s the link if interested: saguto.golf/p/tom-s-rockin-guitar-membership
Cheers!
Tom
What an awesome anatomy of the golf swing, bravo
Thanks - I'm glad you enjoyed it!!
TS
@@SagutoGolf saved it. Will be practicing
Mr. Hogan just knew the principal that any motion should started with the skeleton move before the muscles attached could be elongated before it can contact and generat the power. Beside this muscles moves are short, so need the skeleton move to enlarge the distance of moving.
From his swing, we can see he roll the left leg to push the right pelvis and ribs further.
I also saw Rory McIlroy do the same actions.
This also explains why he stand with a closed right leg and the pubis is forced to the front of right leg when the hands reach the top.
Great video
Thanks Tom - I'm glad you enjoyed it!!
By the way, since you are commenting on a couple of my Hogan lessons here's a link to the playlist of all my content featuring him:
ua-cam.com/play/PLV62KxT7Mp7IyNDRp0hZK1F1OScdXx-u1.html
TS
Great stuff.
Thanks Tim - I'm glad you enjoyed it!!
Tom
Being a Hogan fan you could say that the stack and tilt swing comes from study of Hogans method. Great video Tom, I am a fan of yours bro.👍🏼
I appreciate your support, Richard, and I'm very glad to know that you are enjoying my instruction content!
Mr. Hogan was not "textbook" Stack & Tilt because he had a brief shift in pressure to his rear leg before getting into his front side at the top of his backswing, but beyond that the majority of his swing contains so many great elements that we can all benefit from and which also fit perfectly within the realm of S&T! Stack and Tilt is a golf swing system based on data from the best golf ball strikers, and of course Mr. Hogan is among those at the top of the list. For this reason, someone can be embracing key S&T elements without being aware of it. This is because there are basic requirements that must be met to hit a golf ball consistently on the center of the clubface. There are also components necessary to add power to the golf swing without sacrificing accuracy. Based on a study of the best golfers of all time, it was concluded that they all had 3 things in common (the 3 main golf fundamentals): 1. Hit the ground in the same spot every time (consistently crispy contact) 2. Have enough power to play the golf course well (distance) 3. Be able to have a predictable curve (accuracy). A player MUST be able to do these three non-negotiables in order to truly be good at golf, and Stack and Tilt provides a road map for accomplishing them incredibly well in a low-maintenance and body-friendly manner. Those 3 fundamentals never change!
Thanks!
Tom
Crazy how you take that K shape and place it on the floor for the stack n tilt grid for ball placement, its almost the exact same angles
Interesting. Coincidence?? Probably not for someone who quotes Tesla in decoding the univewrse!!
Tom, I switched a year ago to your method and found it easier to pull my right shoulder back to maintain spine angle and position. What do you think?
I have no problem with that at all, William. In fact, trail shoulder retraction is one of the options that I teach.
I do my best to convey different "feels" or thoughts throughout the swing wherever possible because we're all unique physiologically and psychologically, and something that resonates effectively with he or she or me may not necessarily work for thee. Furthermore, a feel or thought that performs well for you this week may run its course or get overdone and not play out so nicely next week, so it's good to have alternates to call upon if needed. The key takeaway here is that no matter the variety of suggested feels/thoughts offered for a particular element of the swing, they are all directed at getting different golfers to achieve the same desired result - body-friendly, crispy, compressed ball striking bliss. (It's like a multiple choice test with no wrong answer!)
So as I regularly tell my students and members, let your ball striking and shot shape be your guide.
Keep up the great work and have fun out there!!
TS
I noticed at 17:57 right elbow is not leading downswing, in fact it seems to be staying back on both players. I thought we should be leading downswing with right elbow, but it's barely to the right hip pocket.
I'm looking at 17:40, Richard, and Mr. Hogan's trail elbow is tucked in rather snugly against his side, with the inside bend of the elbow pointing away from him. Ingraining the feel of the trail elbow leading from that "Hogan's Magic Elbow" episode will put you in an excellent position to deliver the club to the ball, and that's definitely where Mr. Hogan is at this point in the current episode.
Cheers!
Tom
Hogan stacked fully only when the club was brought to the top of his swing. For most S&T advocators, weight shifted to the front side at the start of the swing.
Seeing Hogan do it made me a convert, went out yesterday and with a few small changes l was puring it one after another. When does the distance come back, couple weeks of hitting balls every day so I can go after it hard without worrying about it?
Hi Frederick,
I'm glad to know that you were able to implement these changes and achieve consistently crispy impact so quickly. Nice job!!
Yes - The distance will come with your repetition of- and increased comfort with- the proper motions. Once the "feels" are ingrained you'll be able to trust your swing and just let it go.
Now, if you'd really like to get on the fast track towards learning and owning this swing, please consider enrolling in the SagutoGolf online school. For just $10 US/month or $99 US/year you'll have unlimited access to a comprehensive members-only system for the full swing, the short game, and much more. The school's intuitive course curriculum greatly simplifies the entire process through succinct, step-by-step videos, and I'm regularly adding new content. Here's a link if you'd like additional info: saguto.golf/p/golf-swing-simplified-tom-saguto-pga.
Keep up the great work!!
Tom
Hello Tom what is it that keeps the arms straight right after the point of contact. My lead arm seems to naturally bend just slightly right after contact. Is this ok? Thanks 🙏
If you are pleased with your ball striking and shot shape, @R C, then of course it meets the definition of "ok". 😎 However, the fully optimized swing will have both arms fully straightened after impact, indicating that the club has accelerated through the zone and attained its maximum speed potential.
Check out these episodes:
- ua-cam.com/video/yfVgLRRgDnM/v-deo.html
- ua-cam.com/video/8zeERedVOiY/v-deo.html
Beyond that, it is important to understand that the videos, lessons, and drills on this free channel - while fully aligned with the swing method I teach - address a variety of topics, issues, feels, and/or common flaws/fixes from one episode to the next. They are certainly not intended to be taken as a sequential learning platform like the structured curriculum of my online school, which I strongly recommend to anyone who truly wishes to get on the proper path towards owning this swing. So many folks across the globe are now enjoying the best golf of their lives as a result. Here's a link if you would like to learn more about it: saguto.golf/p/golf-swing-simplified-tom-saguto-pga.
Keep it crispy and have fun out there!
TS
Question; the right elbow does NOT SEPARATE from the body in the backswing, right? Not that much, I mean.
Love it.. Does Hogan pass the test :) he's one of the top 5 ball strikers of all time. But fun how s&t lines up with top players
Although a stack & tilt fan I would never say that Hogan was doing stack & tilt. He is doing a weight shift. As everybody did at that time. Why would he else lift his left heel? He then transfers of course all his weight to the left side but he definitely does not stay all the time on his left side.
The thing with all these slow mos and still pictures is that everyone finds something that is in his swing model. Weight shift, no weight shift. I can literally watch five different guys on UA-cam explaining how Hogans swing matches exactly their swing model.
Stack and Tilt is good. As is Mike Austin or Monte Scheinblum or Gankas a.s.o. The thing is to find something which suits you and which model you find a perfect balance between distance and constancy. For me I hit my irons father with Mike Austin style so a weight shift but my Driver is better with Stack and Tilt. So I do Stack and Tilt. For somebody else it is probably different.
Btw, I was taught in the mid 80s with all this stupid coiling stuff and high arms. Idiotic! Took me years to get a good reliable swing. Stack and Tilt is therefore probably the easiest method to achieve very good results.
Mr. Hogan was not "textbook" Stack & Tilt because he had that brief shift in pressure to his rear leg before getting into his front side at the top of his backswing. (He did allow his lead knee to work inward somewhat in the backswing, but his tailbone was also moving targetward. The naturally occurring counterbalancing of these motions brought his lead heel up slightly and transferred pressure into the right (big toe) side of the ball of his lead foot.) Beyond that temporary shift the majority of Mr. Hogan's swing contains so many great elements that we can all benefit from and which also happen to fit perfectly within the realm of S&T!
To your other point - yes, different strokes for different folks, and as I regularly say - let your ball striking and shot shape be your guide.
Thanks for your comment!
TS
Maybe, maybe not, but there is some proof he did and even taught it in his book, “Five Lessons The Modern Fundamentals of Golf.” I didn’t see it until Mark Evershed (who teaches a form of stack and tilt in Canada) began to reassess Hogan’s book several years ago. It’s worth watching his videos on this matter. However, it was confirmed to me by using Tom Saguto’s method that the swing was a circle and the shoulders moved in a circle. Where had I seen that before? Believe it or not it was confirmed in Hogan’s book on page 72-73 of the paperback version. Look at the illustrations carefully. Above the image of Hogan are two ovals. The solid line oval is his shoulders and the broken line oval is his waist. Look at the ovals on page 73. At the top of the backswing Hogan’s shoulders square over the left hip joint! I never noticed that before. You can’t get that position and keep your right leg at 45 degrees on the backswing unless your weight is on the left side. The ovals show it clearly. Whether Hogan did what this illustration shows is up for debate but he is clearly showing in this illustration that the shoulders square over the left hip joint. Look closely at where the ovals intersect at the top of Hogan’s backswing on page 73.
@S. Beasley,
Thanks for citing and analyzing the documented/illustrated proof from Mr. Hogan's book!
Mr. Hogan timelessly delivers phenomenal instructional value, right?! But there are just so many misconceptions about Hogan’s swing out there - particularly within the realm of misunderstood or misapplied instruction - that have sadly relegated generations of golfers to the vast abyss of chronic frustration. I'm doing my best here to clear these up one by one and put an end to this madness by taking what Mr. Hogan conveys in the “Five Lessons” book as his "feels", applying it to the reality of what he actually did in his swing, and translating it into something we all - including myself - can learn well from. Because if we can get Hogan right there are tremendously effective swing keys to be garnered!!
Mr. Hogan was not "textbook" Stack & Tilt because he did allow the lead knee to work inward somewhat and thus temporarily had some shift in pressure to his trail side. While I am not advocating or teaching this shift, beyond that the majority of his centered, stacked swing contains so many great elements that we can all benefit from and which also fit perfectly within the realm of S&T!
Cheers!
Tom
@@SagutoGolf Thanks for your great analysis of Hogan’s swing. Using your technique has allowed me to drop an average of 5 strokes per round into the low 80s. I will definitely get into the 70s in 2021. Thanks again.
Ben is probably closer to the post as Charlie. The difference is most likely due the camera angles. Thank you for this video!
Glad you enjoyed it, Barry!!
TS
Gracias por su labor Bendiciones para todos los Patriotas!
It is my pleasure, Jose, and I appreciate your kind words.
I hope you had a Blessed and wonderful Christmas!
Tom
Hi Tom Barry from UK here. I get it as Ive said before. Stack and tilt. Be interesting if you could do a bit on senior golfers who are not as flexible as they once were, like me! We cant turn our shoulder down as much/
Hi Barry from UK,
If you can tilt your upper torso in both directions and are able to flex and extend your spine and your legs, then you should not have an issue executing this swing. The stock setup for the Stack & Tilt swing prescribes having both feet flared out 10-20 degrees, with both knees flared outward as well but to a slightly lesser degree. This facilitates a resistance-free, body-friendly 45-degree inclined hip turn that then enables the shoulders to turn 45 degrees without and strain or tension. It also helps us with keeping our weight forward throughout the swing rather than shifting.
S&T is a very body-friendly method. For me this is supported by my personal experience as a player, and furthered by the fact that the majority of my students are in their 60's, 70's, and 80's - i.e.: a smorgasbord of chronic ailments, physical limitations, back/shoulder/knee/hip pain, and joint replacements - and they are overwhelmingly elated to experience the dramatic pain-free game improvement and resulting enjoyment that this swing affords them.
Should you wish to give this swing a fair shot by learning it properly, please consider enrolling in the SagutoGolf online school. For just $10 US/month or $99 US/year you'll have unlimited access to a comprehensive members-only platform that really simplifies the process through succinct, step-by-step videos, and I'm regularly adding new content. There's even a robust Indoor Training Program for golfers who are snowed in or locked down (which, as I understand, is sadly the case in the UK at present). Here's a link if you'd like more info: saguto.golf/p/golf-swing-simplified-tom-saguto-pga.
Cheers,
Tom
hi Tom i think this brilliant analysis video illustrates the 'illusion' of the Hogan swing, in that it 'appears' (because Hogan was so dynamic), at normal speed there is a lot of movement or more correctly, weight shift to the right, but it is clearly NOT so, this + the other factors show He was clearly a stack and tilter. The 'Orthodox' golf teaching establishment basically does not want to admit to this as it would undercut such teaching and the $'s associated with it, Cheers
I appreciate your kind words regarding this Hogan episode!
Mr. Hogan timelessly delivers phenomenal instructional value, right?! But there are just so many misconceptions about his swing out there - particularly within the realm of misunderstood or misapplied instruction - that have sadly relegated generations of golfers to the vast abyss of chronic frustration. We're doing our best here to clear these up one by one and put an end to this madness, because if we can get Hogan right there are tremendously effective swing keys to be garnered!!
Mr. Hogan was not textbook Stack & Tilt because he had that shift in pressure to his rear leg before getting into his front side at the top of his backswing. I am not advocating or teaching any shift into the trail side, but beyond that the majority of his swing contains so many great elements that we can all benefit from and which also fit perfectly within the realm of S&T! For example, did Mr. Hogan tilt, turn, and extend while maintaining his swing center? Yes. Did his lead arm match his tilted shoulder plane at the top of the backswing, signifying no independent lifting of the arms? Yes. Did he take his hands in deep to access the tremendous power source known as "angular momentum"? Yes. Aside from the temporary shift of pressure into his trail side early in his swing, was his weight otherwise forward throughout as evidenced by his bending front leg and straightening trail leg? Yes. Did his motion facilitate an unrestricted 45 degrees of tilted hip turn to promote another 45 degrees of effortless tilted shoulder turn (for a full 90 degrees)? Yes. Enough said....
Thanks again!!
Tom
@@SagutoGolf hi Tom many thanks for reply perhaps it would be very interesting if you could do an occasional series on golfers past and present who 'use' aspects of stack and tilt factors (albeit unacknowledged). I beginning my s&t journey will be enrolling with you soon cheers and good luck
Hi Tom Can you explain at the end of the swing "the grapefruit or pomagranit in the Butt "
Tuck your butt under your hips through the zone, Ennio. That move enables your spine to fully extend, provides plenty of room for the arms, and provides a serious power boost.
Good stuff Tom, you reckon tucking but up in is a conscious effort.
Glad you enjoyed it, Barry!
The butt tuck happens naturally for some and is a temporary conscious action for others until the motion is ingrained.
With regard to ingraining the motion, my online school consists of very detailed instruction and drills that take you through the entire swing step-by-step from setup to finish. Thousands of folks across the globe are now enjoying the best golf of their lives as a result, and I'm happy to let their unsolicited testimonials tell the story: saguto.golf/p/sagutogolfreviews. And here's a link to my free mini course “The Top 3 Things You Need to Be a Great Ball Striker” if you’re interested in checking it out: go.saguto.golf/
Tom
Great piece of in-depth research Tom!
Thanks Paul - I'm glad you enjoyed it!!
Tom
So I was so concentrated on loading my right side, that even though I was getting good hip turn there was so much sway that my axis was gone
The need for a weight shift in the golf swing is one of the greatest fallacies ever taught, and sadly it has led many an amateur golfer into the vast abyss of chronic inconsistency and frustration. Can you have some transfer of pressure into the trail side in the takeaway? Yes - as long as you keep your center intact and don't shift off the ball. And you best be back into your lead side by time you get to the transition. In the swing system I teach we start with our weight forward (generally 55/45 for the short and mid irons, 60/40 for the longer clubs), gradually add more forward weight to the top (70/30), 80/20 halfway down, 90/10 impact, and 95/5 finish. There's no "weight shift"; instead, it's just a gradually increasing load onto the lead side. And the result is a centered, low-maintenance, body-friendly, consistent, and tremendously powerful swing.
If you'd really like to get on the fast track towards ridding yourself of that sway and properly learning this swing system in a comprehensive, structured, sequential platform, please consider my online school. That's where - among many other courses and lessons covering various aspects of the game - you will find very detailed instruction and drills that take you through the entire swing step-by-step, position-by-position from setup to finish. Additionally, you'll have access to all my short game content (putting, chipping, pitching, bunker play), advanced level content, diagnostic and corrective tools for resolving common swing, contact, and ball flight issues, and much more. Thousands of men and women from across the globe - including many seasoned, low-handicap, competitive players and spanning all age ranges from junior to super-senior - are now enjoying the best golf of their lives as a result, and I'm happy to let their unsolicited testimonials tell the story: saguto.golf/p/sagutogolfreviews. And here's a link to my free mini course “The Top 3 Things You Need to Be a Great Ball Striker” if you’re interested in checking it out: go.saguto.golf/
Thanks,
Tom
I make my best swings when I remind myself to stay centered, plus shoulder under the chin and forward arm on the chest--and swing around my head--usually one thought at a time--after a while it's pretty automatic. But I don't lean on left foot.
As I routinely tell folks, John, let your ball striking quality and shot shape be your guide.
Have fun out there!
TS
I’ve been watching your UA-cam videos this week. Great instruction. I’m going to sign up on your site this week. I agree…Hogan’s swing is not what he wrote about (accurately).
Sounds great, Eric!! Yes - there's a lot of great information in the "Five Lessons" book, but there have also been many misinterpretations that have led numerous golfers - and their ball flight - astray. I do my best to take what Mr. Hogan conveys in the book as his "feels", apply it to the reality of what he actually did in his swing, and translate it into something we all can learn well from.
By the way, here's some preliminary advice to help you get off to a good start on your journey to the Land of Ball Striking Bliss:
1) Regardless of a member's skill level, this swing necessitates a complete reboot for someone transitioning from a shift & lift swing (which is typically the case), and therefore it is imperative that one take sufficient time to ensure that the fundamental components are mastered. From the ground up there is nothing superfluous in the Stack & Tilt swing - in other words, everything with a purpose, and a purpose for everything. (For example, contrary to shift & lift where you may be taught to keep your trail foot perpendicular to the target line as a means of "creating resistance" in your trail side, in S&T we flare both feet out 10-20 degrees in order to facilitate a free flowing, inclined hip and shoulder turn.) I cannot emphasize this enough, as frustrations predominantly occur when students jump ahead in the curriculum without properly dedicating themselves to the foundational base upon which our consistently repeatable, powerful, low maintenance swing must be built. Chapter 1 of the Golf Swing Simplified program (GSS) and Part I of Get Out & Go Play (GOGP) both address this.
2a) GSS: One of the many great things about this swing is that you can achieve solid ball striking even at the most basic levels. This is why I oftentimes will suggest that students park themselves on Chapter 2 of the GSS course for an extended period of time after locking down Chapter 1's foundational elements. Chapter 2 reinforces the body motions and the weight-forward component, and it culminates with what I call "The Best Golf Swing Practice Drill of All Time". Work yourself sequentially and gradually through the chapter, and then commit yourself to that drill in Lesson 2.8. Learn it. Practice it. Master it. You can even use this partially abbreviated swing on the course and play quite well with it as it will provide plenty of distance. (It actually is the full swing minus just a couple of power accumulators.) Once you've got that down, you will be well prepared to move forward in the curriculum and well on your way towards taking ownership of YOUR swing!
2b) GOGP: This quick-start program is exactly as it sounds - it is designed to fast-track you out onto the course so you can have fun - and success - playing as you learn! Should you choose this path, everything in #1 above still applies, and as implied above in 2a you will still want to work through it sequentially and gradually, mastering each lesson before moving ahead to the next one. In this program, Drill #5 - The Flying Wedge is the one you'll want to park yourself on and nail down.
3) Also, as you progress always keep in mind the V1 Swing Video Analysis service, an effective and inexpensive service that I highly recommend to everyone in the school. I liken it to bringing your swing into the shop for a tune-up or minor repair. Scheduling one on a quarterly basis for preventive maintenance will do wonders for keeping things humming along nicely, and it's also a great tool for pinpointing and resolving any issues that arise. The process involves downloading the free V1 app and then submitting two videos to me through the app - one down-the-line (captured from your stance line, not the target line) and the other face-on. You'll find more information about the V1 Analysis halfway down this page on the Saguto.Golf site: saguto.golf/p/sagutogolf
4) Finally, please migrate over to the SagutoGolf Community Forum - which is included in your online school enrollment - and begin engaging with your fellow members. It only takes a minute or two to enroll - just go to your “My Courses” screen and you’ll see a link to get started. Once signed in you’ll be able to access and participate in the great dialogue that we are having on a variety of topics. You can start discussions, contribute to existing threads, post specific swing questions, make some new friends, and just share in the common bond of golfers from around the world seeking to improve their games and help others to do the same. I really think you’ll enjoy it!
I look forward to assisting you through the school’s structured lessons and drills towards building a consistent, low maintenance, powerful, body-friendly swing that will bring your enjoyment of this great game to a new level!
Tom
Nicely done Tom. Why does Charlie have a club cover tucked under his trail arm?
Thank you Bob! He is probably working on preventing his right arm from flying away at the top of the backswing ("flying elbow")
@@SagutoGolf understood TY
Hey Tom, you're a great teacher and I agree with most of this analysis, but what about Hogan's feet and his closed or diagonal stance?
While Mr. Hogan was not "textbook" Stack and Tilt, the majority of his swing contains so many great elements that we can all benefit from, and which also fit perfectly within the realm of Stack and Tilt. The system certainly allows for individual nuances in many respects, including grip and alignment. Stack and Tilt is a golf swing system based on data from the best golf ball strikers. For this reason, someone can be embracing its key elements without being aware of it. This is because there are basic requirements that must be met to hit a golf ball consistently on the center of the clubface. There are also components necessary to add power to the golf swing without sacrificing accuracy. The Stack and Tilt folks determined, based on a study of the best golfers of all time, that they all had 3 things in common (the 3 main golf fundamentals): 1. Hit the ground in the same spot every time (consistently crispy contact) 2. Have enough power to play the golf course well (distance) 3. Be able to have a predictable curve (accuracy). A player MUST be able to do these three non-negotiables in order to truly be good at golf, and Stack and Tilt provides a road map for accomplishing them incredibly well in a low-maintenance and body-friendly manner. As far as Mr. Hogan - or tour players in general - using 100% of it, 99% of it, 97% of it, or 78% of it, it doesn't really matter because they're ALL doing it to some extent. Those 3 fundamentals never change!
TS
Fantastic. I don't care if it's called S&T or anything else - the mechanics matter, and Tom is a student of them. Thank you!
Thank you, Clayton!!!
I do think he is a stacker but not a tilter......maybe I am wrong but I don't see him tilt back on the through swing like many stack and tilters etc.....I do agree with you analyses on everything else but would be interested to read what you think about the tilt element?....I undertstand we have to side till on the way back and through but in stack and tilt is there not a back tilt through impact? thanks
In order to move the shoulders on a plane that is oriented downward towards the ball while keeping the head in place, one must tilt, turn, and extend! The side tilt in the opposite direction does indeed occur in the downswing, and then we extend through impact and into the finish as Mr. Hogan did.
So, in comparing Mr. Hogan's swing to Stack and Tilt: Did Mr. Hogan tilt, turn, and extend while maintaining his swing center? Yes. Did his lead arm match his tilted shoulder plane at the top of the backswing, signifying no independent lifting of the arms? Yes. Did he take his hands in deep to access the tremendous power source known as "angular momentum"? Yes. Aside from the brief temporary shift of pressure into his trail side at the start of his swing, was his weight otherwise forward throughout as evidenced by his bending front leg and straightening trail leg? Yes. Did his motion facilitate an unrestricted 45 degrees of tilted hip turn to promote another 45 degrees of effortless tilted shoulder turn (for a full 90 degrees)? Yes. Now then - call it what you want or don't call it what you don't want - but the bottom line is that this is what Mr. Hogan did, and it just happens that these same swing elements happen to be shared with The Golfing Machine, M.O.R.A.D., and - yes - even this dark sorcery known as Stack and Tilt...... 😆😂
Cheers!
Tom
@@SagutoGolf Thanks but that is not what I was saying....I agree the tilt has to be there in backswing and down swing....but I am talking about the tilt backwards through the shot....whcih of course hogan did not do....I see stack and tilt players stacking and then tilting away from target....is this correct?....thanks love your stuff btw...
I remember when stack and tilt came out originally and this swing really suits me. Can you speak to the difference between the position of the back foot? Hogan stressed that it be parallel to the target where stack and tilt has the rear foot opened up like the lead.
Hi Mark,
In S&T we flare both feet outward approximately 20 degrees, with the knees similarly angled outward. This orientation provides for an unrestricted 45 degrees of tilted hip turn, at which point we only need to add another 45 degrees of shoulder turn for a full 90 degrees. The result is a centered, stress-free, flowing motion back and through, and a very body-friendly, consistent, powerful swing.
Have you considered the comprehensive, structured, sequential learning platform of my online school? That's where - among many other courses and lessons covering various aspects of the game - you will find very detailed instruction and drills that take you through the entire swing step-by-step from setup to finish. Additionally, you'll find all my short game content (putting, chipping, pitching, bunker play), advanced level courses on shot shaping and power/distance, diagnostic and corrective tools for resolving common swing, contact, and ball flight issues, and much more there. So many folks across the globe are now enjoying the best golf of their lives as a result. Here's a link if you would like to know more about the school - saguto.golf - and here's a link to my free mini-course “The Top 3 Things You Need to Be a Great Ball Striker” if you’re interested in checking it out: go.saguto.golf/
Cheers!
Tom
as beautiful a swing Hogan has, it is the small weighted movements he does with his lower body that so difficult to replicate consistently. I think the hip movement away from the "wall", although great for Hogan, might be detrimental to amateurs. Excellent video and explanation. I was mashing the ball at the range today, they're gonna need an ATV to find some of those balls, I think I hit one a million yards...
tucking in your butt and really SQUEEZING is huge. Like you're trying to crush a grapefruit is a good visual. Mike Breed covers this extensively and said he practiced it non-stop as a junior
Nicely said and done, @iBearcub! It certainly is mashed potatoes all day long when properly executed!
If extension is a power move what difference does it make after the ball is gone?
We strike the ball just prior to full extension of both arms, thereby ensuring that we are accelerating into impact. The same concept applies to baseball, tennis, and more.
Saguto thank you for all the helpful tips especially about staying connected with the right elbow. That has really helped my game. But make no mistake, the Saguto swing is nothing at all like the Ben Hogan swing. Any 20 handicapper can see that. Hogan’s lateral move towards the target happens at the top of his backswing. That is not stack and tilt. God bless.
Do you have a video that compares a stack and tilt golfer to one who is not? What do others do differently?
Hi Patrick,
Here are a couple of videos from the archives featuring my before and after swings:
- ua-cam.com/video/PM8lNNrMPEk/v-deo.html
- ua-cam.com/video/NMuizzl1nic/v-deo.html
Beyond that, watch any Tour event on TV and you'll see a large percentage of players executing motions consistent with the S&T system, a fact corroborated by just how many of them have a very centered swing with the lead knee flexing and the trail leg straightening during the backswing, their lead arms on or very close to their tilted shoulder planes, and their hands deep behind their trail shoulder at the top. You don't need to "drop it in the slot" if it's already there, and it's an extremely powerful move as well because we are invoking the tremendous force known as "angular momentum", where physics and geometry collide.
Tom
PS: Here's a link to my FREE mini-course “The Top 3 Things You Need to Be a Great Ball Striker” in case you’re interested in learning some key aspects of the swing system I teach in a more structured manner: go.saguto.golf/
@@SagutoGolf Thank you!
The day I earn a birdie.. you WILL be the 2nd to know sir!!!
Thank you for your time brother, I APPRECIATE you more than I could ever explain in words!!!
Well, Michael, I'm guessing your playing partners and the bartender at the 19th Hole will know in advance of me as well, but I'm quite fine with that..... 😎
I sincerely appreciate your kind words, and I'm very glad to know that my instruction content and teaching style are resonating with you!! Thanks so much for your message and keep up the great work!!
Tom
PS: By the way, since you are liking my channel's content, I think you will also enjoy my FREE mini course - “The Top 3 Things You Need to Be a Great Ball Striker” - where you can learn some key aspects of the swing system I teach in a more structured manner. Here's a link in case you’re interested in checking it out: go.saguto.golf/
@SagutoGolf I appreciate you more than I can explain!!! You are "teaching more with every video "lesson" & it is a wonderful thing you are doing for us lovers of golf who just swing to swing!!! & your sense of humor is TOP NOTCH teach!!!
P.S. & you will be the 2nd to know of my 1st birdie, you have earned that lol!!!
& I truly appreciate the you responded to my comment because I know you must have millions of comments on your MAGNIFICENT instructional videos Dr.SagutoGolf !!!
ahaa ! charlie is a bit taller than mr hogan so, possibly with
standard clubs, charlie has to bend more towards the ball
,,i love this lesson tom, its the best reference for anyone,,
Thanks William!! Our unique body features certainly do play a role in our setup and swing plane differences.
TS
Great
Thanks - I'm glad you enjoyed it!
By the way, due to their popularity I've combined my Hogan lesson videos into a playlist series on this channel. Here's the link if you are interested: ua-cam.com/play/PLV62KxT7Mp7IyNDRp0hZK1F1OScdXx-u1.html
Cheers!
Tom
Tom... How about a video contrasting Charlie Wei and Jack Nicklaus?
Nice analysis. I would add that maybe it is more correct to say that Mr. Hogan is S&T on steroids...both on the backswing and the downswing/follow through his is a far more dynamic and powerful motion than Charlie Wie. But then again, no one harnessed the physical potential of the swing better Mr. Hogan. One of a kind! Thanks for the video.
I'm glad you enjoyed the video. Yes - dynamic is indeed a very appropriate way to describe Mr. Hogan's swing!
Thanks for your comment!
Tom
Hit it crispy today, but was pulling shots left
Quality of contact and ball flight - both starting direction and curvature - pretty much tell you all you need to know about what's going on in your swing, Jeffrey.
It is important to understand that the videos, lessons, and drills on this free channel - while fully aligned with the swing method I teach - address a variety of topics, issues, feels, and/or common flaws/fixes from one episode to the next. They are certainly not intended to be taken as a sequential learning platform like the structured curriculum of my online school, which I strongly recommend to anyone who truly wishes to get on the proper path towards learning and owning this swing. For just $10 US/month or $99 US/year you'll have unlimited access to a comprehensive members-only system for the full swing, the short game, and much more. The school's intuitive course layout greatly simplifies the entire process through succinct, step-by-step videos, and I'm regularly adding new content. This will really put you on the fast track towards learning everything in a well-organized, self-guided fashion. Here's a link if you'd like additional info: saguto.golf/p/golf-swing-simplified-tom-saguto-pga.
Cheers!
Tom
7.53 at the top of the backswing hogans left heel is clearly off the ground which makes having weight left a little difficult. , He plants it again to initiate downswing and he stays left but he definitely looks like he shifts weight right then back to left.
Mr. Hogan did allow his lead knee to work inward somewhat in the backswing and he did have a brief shift in pressure to his rear leg - more so in his pre-accident swing - but his tailbone was also moving targetward. The naturally occurring counterbalancing of these motions brought his lead heel up slightly and transferred pressure into the right (big toe) side of the ball of his lead foot.
TS
@@SagutoGolf would you say that he is slightly re-centering also with that pressure shift or do you think he stays lead side throughout ? It's so hard to tell in 2D and without pressure mats !! Thanks Tom great video 🤟
We have to remember that the arms and club have weight to them, so as they swing back away from the target in the takeaway that bit of weight transfers with them. That's perfectly acceptable. The key is that we retain our swing center and not have any active rearward shift or sway off the ball with the body.
Speaking of pressure mats, here's an episode from the archives on "Hogan's Hips" in which I used them.
Cheers!
TS
I have gotten a ton from watching your videos, especially this one. Many thanks.
One thing that struck me as humorous. "Does Hogan pass the test?".... Hogan IS the test.
Thanks again!
LOL! I suppose to some large extent he is!
Thanks - I'm glad you're enjoying the content!
Excellent interpretation of Stack & Tilt and what Hogan really did: NOT what he said he did.
Thank you for recognizing and validating that, Tim!! Just like the rest of us (but obviously at a vastly different level), Mr. Hogan had his own case of the "Feels vs. Reals"!!
Tom
When Ben started his downswing he actually created more lag, especially with the driver, freeze hogan at the top of his backswing where his shaft is parralel and then start the tape, you'll see the shaft actually drop about an inch or so still horizontal, the only other player i've ever seen do this is Sergio Garcia, i suppose Daly could do it but his wrist are already maxed out at the top.
Yep - that cupped left wrist enabled Mr. Hogan to achieve an arm/clubshaft angle that was considerably greater than 90 degrees at the top and further into his transition. Sergio's dramatic dropping move at the transition allows him do create a similar amount of other-worldly lag. Tremendous athleticism in both cases!
You have a great eye, check out my rotten luck, i have virtually no flexibility in my wrist, hence i can't get distance, but like Hagen said, " 3 and 1 is 4" and Bobby Jones., " The secret to golf is turning 3 shots into 2 , ( getting up and down) @@SagutoGolf
Solid
which of these two elements of adress comes first tom,,our anatomy is already stacked but to adress the ball we tilt forward
then the rotation of the tilted shoulder /hip
relationship about that tilted axis is kept
as concentric as possible (stacked) at the
new tilted angle !! the order seems to be tilt and stack ? but i`m no expert,, 🙃😇
You get stacked at address, William, and then tilt your upper body towards the target while remaining stacked and keeping the head in place. Thus Stack...and...Tilt. Let's not try to overly complicate things now...... 😆
I wouldn’t necessarily agree with all the lines you drew here on Hogan. The difficulty being the position of the camera can change how actual angles are perceived visually.
You mention this power from this particular swing theory but what does this power get you in your estimation? In a traditional sense, power means distance and I believe Stack and Tilters have never led the driving distance on Tour so I’m curious what sense of the word power you use.
Additionally, I think it would be an interesting exercise to compare Hogan and Wi as Stack and Tilters to other modern Tour players with varied swings. My guess is that they arrive to very similar impact and “power” positions but get there using different methods so to say.
@6:25 they do not look identical, Charlie's shoulder is more down, his head stays more stationary while Hogan is clearly moving away from the ball more.
Their left thigh looks a lot different also. Charlie's thigh is pointing out and Ben's is straight. Which one is better?
The stock setup for the Stack & Tilt swing that I teach prescribes having both feet flared out 10-20 degrees, with both knees flared outward as well but to a slightly lesser degree. This facilitates a resistance-free, body-friendly 45-degree hip turn that then enables the shoulders to turn 45 degrees without and strain or tension. It also helps us with keeping our weight forward throughout the swing rather than shifting. And yes - as you cite in your comment, part of this entails allowing the lead knee to move downward in the direction that it is oriented, giving Charlie that "thigh out" look.
Mr. Hogan was not textbook Stack & Tilt because he did allow the lead knee to work inward somewhat and thus had some shift in pressure to his trail side. While I am not advocating or teaching this shift, beyond that the majority of his swing contains so many great elements that we can all benefit from and which also fit perfectly within the realm of S&T!
So what this all comes down to is that you need to decide what is best for you. If it is a swing that is based on a weight shift and building resistance by "swinging around a firm and flexed trail leg", then the instruction here is not going to correspond with that motion. If, on the other hand, you prefer to learn a centered, rotational swing that derives its power through physics and geometry as opposed to physiological torquing, then I believe you are in the correct place!
Best Regards,
Tom
@@SagutoGolf thank you for your videos. I've been hitting much more solidly and have learned a ton and having much more fun.
The stack n tilt guys analyzed the greats and took the most effective techniques and forms to apply to their system .
Add some measures of physics, geometry, and human physiology to that foundation, Jon, and I'd say it makes for a rather solid methodology. 💪💪
Thanks!
Tom
Hogan always said the downswing started with the hips going to the target, i have always had the impression that a lot of hogan swing had many similarities to the stack and tilt method, watching this confirmed it, not sure it was what Hogan thought he was doing , or maybe he knew exactlywhat he was doing and either never said.
I’m glad to know that this lesson video resonated well with you!
Mr. Hogan knew exactly what he was doing for sure LOL! Stack and Tilt is a swing system modeled after the best ball strikers in the game. He certainly fits that description!!
Tom
Does anyone else get to certain parts in Tom's videos - smash the pause button - then grab the nearest golf club in a sort of eureka moment?
Maybe even grab a grapefruit also!