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The diagnosis came from Ezzard's family, all his trainers and Ezzard himself. They didn't need a doctor's diagnosis inorder to help them see Ezzard's hand trembling when he tried to hold a spoon while eating soup. Ezzard said, *"after a guy hit me, I didn't seem to be able to get away,"* he recalled, *"I didn't have the same coordination."* William Dettloff's biography about Ezzard Charles having ALS symptoms in 1951 is NEVER EVER going to magically disappear just because you want it to or because there wasn't a medical diagnosis done in 1951. Wikipedia needs to be updated by Ezzard's family. Per family request Archie Moore's birthdate was recently updated from 1916 to 1913 making Archie 41 if not older when he fought Rocky.
William Dettloff’s biography *'Ezzard Charles: A Boxing Life'* documents that Charles first felt weakness and some numbness in his limbs as early as 1951. This was 3 years before the Marciano fights and it was also the same year he lost his title. Ezzard, his family, Ezzard's trainer's Ray Arcel, Jimmy Brown, Chickie Ferrera and Bill Gore all said they noticed signs of ALS in 1951. Bert Sugar said, *"His trainer, Ray Arcel said, that even now, at this stage in 51, and then on into the middle 50's, you could see the beginning, the traces of the disease, that would later claim his life, Lou Gehrig's disease in Charles."* --@ 35:01 ESPN Ringside - Rocky Marciano
*Quotes from Jersey Joe Walcott about Cassius Clay:* *“Cassius Clay is the best Heavyweight champion of them all. He could beat Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis, Ezzard Charles, Rocky Marciano and a fellow named Jersey Joe Walcott.”* *“Clay gets better each time you see him. This kid has speed in his hands and feet like a welterweight. He hits like a heavyweight. He puts his punches together better than any heavyweight champion I’ve ever seen."* Walcott was asked if he realized what he was saying. He nodded and repeated: *“Clay could beat Dempsey, Louis, Charles, Marciano and a fellow named Jersey Joe Walcott. Clay is too big and punches too fast and moves too quickly for all of us old timers.”* Asked to explain in more detail why he rates Clay a sure winner over Dempsey, Louis, Charles, Marciano and himself, Jersey Joe lit up a cigarette and said: *“Dempsey and Louis and the rest of us would be too small to beat this big, rangy kid. Clay would just have to stay away from us for a few rounds and then start throwing his combinations."* *“Cassius’ edge in height and reach, his fast hands and legs and the power he puts into his punches, whether from in close or at long range, would be too much for any of the champs I’ve mentioned."* *“All of us old-timers needed room to punch. But not Clay. He can hit you from any position and hurt you. He can do this even when he is off balance."* *“When one punch can take a big man like Liston off his feet, people should realize the agility, coordination and power Clay can put into each and every punch."* *"I didn’t fight Dempsey. But I did fight Louis, Charles and Marciano. I know none of these men, or me, could box with Clay. And I know none of us could punch as fast as Cassius. Some of us might hit as hard but Clay would out punch us in every exchange. Now, when Dempsey was fighting, he stood right over a man he had floored and hit him as he was getting up."* (( Source - RING, Sept. 1965 Walcott insist Ali would beat Dempsey, Louis, Rocky, etc. by Ed Brennan )) In summary Jersey Joe has been around boxing for a long time and should know what he is talking about....should i believe you,, a biased casual,, or Jersey Joe ?
Most people openly admit that the versions of Charles, Moore and Walcott that he fought were far from prime (The Louis & Savold fights really doesn't even deserve to be brought up). So it isn't the quality of Rocky's competition that his reputation is based on among the greats, it is that famous record 49-0. If Rocky's 49-0 record is the basis of his greatness then the fighters on that record should be the very best that were available. But by my reckoning that is the furthest thing from the truth. Infact when you look at the highest ranked fighters of the era, and then you look at his record, it's scandalous how many he didn't fight. Many of the ones he DID choose to fight are just as scandalous. Top fighters Marciano definitely should have fought that he didn't. *1)* Harold Johnson *2)* Oakland Billy Smith *3)* Yolande Pompey *4)* Curtis Hatchetman Sheppherd *5)* Clarence Henry *6)* Joey Maxim *7)* Marty Marshall *8)* Bob Satterfield *9)* Jimmy Bivins *10)* Lloyd Marshall *11)* Nino Valdes *12)* Willie Pastrano *13)* Cleveland Williams had 35 wins 2 losses when Rocky retired in April 1956. Rocky had plenty of opportunities to fight Cleveland in 1952 or 1953. Those are just the definites, we could add many other names (like Tommy Jackson, Dan Bucceroni or even Bob Baker) that while not as good, are definitely better than some of the guys he DID fight that make up that "legendary" record. Guys like these; Lee Epperson (Career Record 0-1) Jimmy Weeks (Career Record 0-1) Gilbert Cardone (Career Record 0-3) John Edwards (Career Record 1-2) Bill Hardeman (Career Record 1-7) Humphrey Jackson (Career Record 4-3) Johnnie Pretzie (Career Record 10-14) Bob Jefferson (Career Record 3-10) Gilley Ferron (Career Record 4-13) Tommy DiGiorgio (Career Record 9-15) Artie Donato (Career Record 7-13) Harry Haft (Career Record 12-7) James Connoly (Career Record 12-9) Harry Bilazarian (Career Record 15-12) Joe Dominic (Career Record 18-12) Don Mogard (Career Record 20-16) Jimmy Walls (Career Record 21-41) Eldridge Eatman (Career Record 22-21) according to BoxRec and the Providence Journal, *"Marciano hit Eatman with a right in the 3rd round and Eatman went down, THOUGH IT DIDN'T APPEAR HE WAS HIT."* Not only did Eldridge take a-dive vs Rocky but he had just lost 8 of his last 9 fights. Why would a 26-0 boxer fight an *F-LEVEL* diver who had just lost 8 fights? Eddie Ross (Career Record is laughable). Immediately, same day, after 170lb *F-LEVEL* diver Eddie Ross was supposedly KO'd by Marciano he drove from Rhode Island Providence to Quebec City Quebec -- 8 hr 15 min 465.9 mi via I-93 N inorder to fight 160lb Billy Sparks. ( *"Amazing recovery by Eddie Ross after being KO'd by Rocky Marciano the previous day."* - BoxRec and Providence Journal ). Marciano's 32nd fight was against *F-LEVEL* Keene Simmons who had a career 9 wins 22 losses. Marciano's 33rd fight was against *F-LEVEL* Harold Mitchell who had a career 7 wins 16 losses. *(Harold had just lost 10 fights in a row before diving against Rocky)* Marciano's 34th fight was against *F-LEVEL* Art Henri who had a career 18 wins 29 losses. Marciano's 35th fight was against *F-LEVEL* Willis Applegate who had a career 12 wins 16 losses. None of these guys beat anyone of note! Many of these guys he even fought pretty far into his career when there were obviously alternatives. In light of this should this 49-0 record be as revered as it is to some? *(In my opinion it's clear as day that Italian Mafia Boss Frankie Carbo and underboss Al Weill cherry picked and padded Rocky's entire resume. Maybe maybe not? But one's things for sure, it was undoubtedly the smallest and weakest Heavyweight division in boxing History)*
*C-LEVEL Journeyman Walcott lost to Middleweights Mays ,, Palmer ,, Ketchell ,, and to Light heavyweights Charles x2 ,, Fox x2 ,, Maxim ,, Brothers ,, Taylor.. In summary Walcott consistently lost to Middleweights and Light heavyweights!!! Overall he lost (20) times and was KO'd (6) times!!!*
*Per family request Wikipedia recently changed Archie Moore's birthdate from 1916 to 1913!!!* Archie Moore said, *"Rocky Marciano was about 15 years younger than I was"* --@ Archie Moore Talks 2007TBears Archie Moore also said, *"I was in my 40's vs. Floyd Patterson."* --@ Rare Archie Moore Interview The host asks Archie Moore, (@ 6:35) "why does your mother say your one age and you say another?" Archie replies, *"I don't deny anything"* .. *"I never deny what my mother quotes"* .. *"I know my age"* .. *"and I've befuddled a lot of people who are requiring about my age constantly"* .. *"and that keeps me in the news."* --@ Day and Night: Archie Moore, boxer *ARCHIE MOORE WAS EASILY 41 IF NOT OLDER vs MARCIANO AND THAT IS NO LONGER DEBATABLE!!!*
Muhammad Ali, *"Umm Marciano... Marciano, umm, phew, ooh he hit hard. He hit you so hard* (unrecognizable) *folks in Africa."* Cosell, *"But you think you could have beaten him too?"* Ali, *"Well it a been rough, look Howard, I don't take nothing from these fellas especially those deceased. Marciano and I were good friends, but I truly think on my best day and his best day I would have beaten him, probably not knocked him out, I been sore, I think he was better than Joe Frazier I'd put it that way. I truly think he was better than Joe Frazier. I think it be even, he may have won - it's just hard, it's just up to the imagination."* Cosell, *"You know you started out with so much braggadocio, now you're ending with humility."* Ali, *"Yea, you got the last man Marciano. Showing him last, you did the right thing. He wasn't as great as me, wasn't as beautiful everyone knows that. But I don't know if I would have beat him with his style and my style. He could've out-pointed me, could've knocked me down. Did a computer fight with him when he was an old man just pretending and my arms were so sore just for joking with him. In his heyday he may have won, he probably wouldn't... that's up for the imagination. In the end I still think I'm the greatest of all time!"* Later, in part 6 Ali flips a script saying that *"a prime Louis, Walcott, Charles, and Moore would've beat Marciano."* He then goes on to his usual *"I'm the greatest"* after part 6. Why was the most important part removed?? *Ali said, "a prime Louis, Walcott, Charles, and Moore would've beat Marciano."* *This valuable information has been suppressed for 48 years!!!* Imagine all the uploaders that have been entering incorrect information for decades!!! Truth is Rocky uploaders removed 3 hours 28 minutes because it didn't align with their agenda!!! *The Fact is Ali Hated Marciano!!!* Why not just use Rocky's resume to defend him instead of hiding vital information?? Well because Rocky's resume is Horseshirt, that's why!!! Y'all can order copies *@ Muhammad Ali Archival Television Audio Inc* just go to the *3rd page* to order 9889 is 90 MIN, 9889A is 30 MIN and 9890 is 90 MIN. That's 3 1/2 hours of Ali discussing Marciano Walcott Charles Moore and Louis.. *"a prime Louis, Walcott, Charles, and Moore would've beat Marciano." - Muhammad Ali, 02/15/76* (As more proof Dave Diles explains Ali discussing Marciano Walcott Charles Moore in depth @ 0:15 or very beginning of *1976 Daytona 500 - ABC Wide World of Sports coverage* from NascarAllOut)
Muhammad Ali said, *"Even in his prime, Rocky Marciano had no chance with me. First thing, he is too little. Less than five foot ten to my six foot three inches. I’d overwhelm him. I’d lay on him in the clinches like a big old grizzly bear, and I’d smother his insides out. He was too small to reach me from outside. I’d jab him twenty to one. Rocky had a face that cut easily. Can you imagine what my stinging jab would do to those weak eyes? By round three, Rocky would look like he ran into a lawn mower. How could he beat me? No way, is how."* This was before three Frazier fights, three fights with Ken Norton, and the George Foreman proved Ali's hypothesis. Ali too big, Ali too fast, Ali too strong a puncher, Ali too fast a jab, and the bad news, Ali too tough, takes heavy punishment well. I'm afraid Ali was right. Marciano, while a formidable opponent, wouldn't have lasted long. Regardless of the script, Rocky seemed unable to pull his punches, whereas Ali could come within a fraction of an inch to making it look extremely real. Our problem was that Ali was getting madder and madder as Rocky thumped one hard shot after another off his ribs. By the end of the second day, Ali stopped the filming to have a word with Rocky, *"Rocky, you're supposed to be pulling those body shots. You aren't, and they're hurting my ribs. Now, if we're going to have a real fight, then you will not be able to land those shots without me peppering your face with hard left jabs and right hooks, and if you do by chance land a body shot, you're going to take back a stinging right hand to the nose to break it again. Now, do we play movie or do we play boxing?"* Marciano knew he was wrong. Secretly, he wanted to find out if Ali could take his best shots. To his surprise, he found that Ali could. End of the problem. If you don't take anything away from this chapter, let me reiterate, commit this to memory: *"Ali would have beat Marciano if they had ever really fought."* - Ferdie Pacheco *Source - Tales from the 5th Street Gym: Ali, the Dundees, and Miami's Golden Age of Boxing by Ferdie Pacheco 2010. Chapter 10, When Ali took on Marciano - The Fake Fight* *(( IN SUMMARY ALI CHALLENGES ROCKY AND ROCKY DECLINED...AND THAT'S NOT JUST A THEORY OR A FABRICATED LIE...IT'S A FACT!!!! ))*
178 to 188 lb tiny cruiser Marciano's opponents (not in exact order): *We see their entire-CAREER record, not a partial record.* Seeing a boxers complete resume gives a more accurate evaluation how good, or how bad they are. Pro boxers can easily be evaluated using grades *A, B, C, D, F* which has been used for decades: Lee Epperson career record 0 wins 1 loss *F-LEVEL* Jimmy Weeks career record 0 wins 1 loss *F-LEVEL* Gilbert Cardone career record 0 wins 3 losses *F-LEVEL* John Edwards career record 1 win 2 losses *F-LEVEL* Bill Hardeman career record 1 win 7 losses *F-LEVEL* Humphrey Jackson career record 4 wins 3 losses *F-LEVEL* Harry Haft career record 12 wins 7 losses *F-LEVEL* James Connolly career record 12 wins 9 losses *F-LEVEL* Harry Bilazarian career record 15 wins 12 losses *F-LEVEL* Bob Jefferson career record 3 wins 10 losses *F-LEVEL* Harold Mitchell career record 7 wins 16 losses *F-LEVEL* Gilley Ferron career record 4 wins 13 losses *F-LEVEL* Artie Donato career record 7 wins 13 losses *F-LEVEL* Johnny Pretzie career record 10 wins 14 losses *F-LEVEL* Don Mogard career record 20 wins 16 losses *F-LEVEL* Pete Louthis career record 32 wins 14 losses *D-LEVEL* Tommy DiGiorgio career record 9 wins 15 losses *F-LEVEL* Kenne Simmons career record 9 wins 22 losses *F-LEVEL* Art Henri career record 18 wins 29 losses *F-LEVEL* Jimmy Walls career record 21 wins 41 losses *F-LEVEL* Ted Lowry career record 71 wins 68 losses *F-LEVEL* Ted Lowry (twice) 71 wins 68 losses *F-LEVEL* Gino Buonvino career record 24 wins 15 losses *F-LEVEL* Gino Buonvino (twice) 24 wins 15 losses *F-LEVEL* Joe Dominic career record 18 wins 12 losses *F-LEVEL* Eldridge Eatman career record 22 wins 21 losses *F-LEVEL* Willis Applegate career record 12 wins 16 losses *F-LEVEL* Lee Savold career record 104 wins 45 losses *D-LEVEL* Phil Muscato career record 56 wins 23 losses *D-LEVEL* Bill Wilson career record 56 wins 27 losses *D-LEVEL* Johnny Shkor career record 31 wins 19 losses *D-LEVEL* Fred Beshore career record 35 wins 17 losses *D-LEVEL* Jimmy Evans 18 wins 8 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 10 opponents with 10 fights or less.* Eddie Ross 19 wins 5 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 10 debuting amateurs and 7 other opponents with 10 fights or less.* Bob Quinn 20 wins 4 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 13 opponents with 10 fights or less.* Bernie Reynolds 53 wins 13 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 30 opponents with 15 fights or less.* Pat Richards 24 wins 9 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 20 opponents with 10 fights or less.* Carmine Vingo 16 wins 2 losses looks good until you see *ALL 16 wins came against F-LEVEL opponents.* Don Cockell 66 wins 14 losses looks okay until you see the majority of his career was at middleweight and light heavyweight. *By the time he faced Marciano he was suffering from severe glandular disorders that wreaked havoc with his physique. He was sallow-skinned, fat, and had a nasty boil on his neck.* Harry Matthews 90 wins 7 losses is a good B-LEVEL resume until you see *he was a career middleweight moonlighting at light heavyweight.* Matthews weighed 130 lbs vs. Joey Parks who also weighed 130. *Shouldn't one have to beat credible Heavyweight opponents to be respected as a legitimate Heavyweight?* Roland LaStarza *C-LEVEL.* LaStarza Refused fights with Charles, Moore, Walcott, Louis, Valdez, Satterfield, Bivins, Maxim, Henry, Baker, Johnson, Pompey, Marshall, Smith, Sheppard etc. In an article in RING magazine after his career LaStarza admitted as much! Rex Layne *C-LEVEL.* LaStarza vs. Layne reminds me of watching two midwest club fighters fighting a 4 rounder on an old ESPN card from Muncie, In. Two guys who were not well schooled, standing in front of each other acting like they were insulted if the other guy missed them with a punch. A lot of right hand leads, a lot of jabs with the rear foot leaving the canvas, little/no counter punching, just two guys willing to get hit but showing little boxing skill. Look how bad Rex Layne swings and misses. What an oaf. Joe Walcott *C-LEVEL.* Walcott's losses is what elevated his status and built up his credentials, not his wins!!! The fact that Walcott was granted (6) title attempts in a (5) year span speaks volumes about how weak the Heavyweight division was at this time!!! And (4) of these title opportunities came immediately after a Walcott loss!!! Archie Moore *A-LEVEL* MW/LH and *C-LEVEL* HW. Heck, Low Power 171/173 lb Charles beat him 3 times, 182 lb Patterson obliterated him, and 188 lb tiny cruiser Marciano smashed him. Every time Moore Stepped-Up in competition he got KO'D. Ezzard Charles *A-LEVEL* LH and *C-LEVEL* HW. William Dettloff’s biography *'Ezzard Charles: A Boxing Life'* documents that Charles first felt weakness in his limbs, and some numbness, as early as 1951. This was 3 years before the Marciano fights and it was also the same year he lost his title. Ezzard, his family, Ezzard's trainer's Ray Arcel, Jimmy Brown, Chickie Ferrera and Bill Gore all said they noticed signs of ALS in 1951. Bert Sugar said, *"His trainer, Ray Arcel said, that even now, at this stage in 51, and then on into the middle 50's, you could see the beginning, the traces of the disease, that would later claim his life, Lou Gehrig's disease in Charles."* --@ 35:01 ESPN Ringside - Rocky Marciano There it is. Y'all are intelligent enough to make your own judgement about Rocky's *F-LEVEL* resume. Who did he fight? Walcott was 38/39 if not older, Moore 41, Charles had ALS and Louis was washed. Even Hall of Famer Emanuel Steward a proven boxing genius who trained 41 world champion fighters throughout his career said, *"Marciano was too small. He really wasn't a Heavyweight. 5' 10", exceptionally short arms, very clumsy, cut easy, had troubled balance. 188 lbs was just too small."* @ Emanuel Steward: Ali all time greatest, Klitschko number eight *"Name one, just one 'Prime' all time great boxer Rocky beat? Failing to name even one proves my comment rings true. Show me any respected boxing publication or analyst that claims Walcott Charles Moore Louis was 'Prime' when they fought him?"*
@@freddiecorleone4411 *"Boxing and other combat sports divide competitors into weight classes in order to prevent injury, ensure fair competition and provide a more exciting fight. The heavier opponent will have an advantage as they have increased muscle mass, allowing them to hit harder and withstand strikes from their opponent more easily. It is for this reason that combat sports separate fighters based on weight class."* -- by MMA Combat Sports
@@freddiecorleone4411 If all the little short guys are so tough why aren't they Heavyweight Champions of the World. *"NEVER IN THE HISTORY OF BOXING HAS A 190 LB MAN BEAT A PRIME TOP-NOTCH SUPER HEAVYWEIGHT BOXING CHAMPION."* - Ring Magazine
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That was fast.
The diagnosis came from Ezzard's family, all his trainers and Ezzard himself. They didn't need a doctor's diagnosis inorder to help them see Ezzard's hand trembling when he tried to hold a spoon while eating soup. Ezzard said, *"after a guy hit me, I didn't seem to be able to get away,"* he recalled, *"I didn't have the same coordination."* William Dettloff's biography about Ezzard Charles having ALS symptoms in 1951 is NEVER EVER going to magically disappear just because you want it to or because there wasn't a medical diagnosis done in 1951. Wikipedia needs to be updated by Ezzard's family. Per family request Archie Moore's birthdate was recently updated from 1916 to 1913 making Archie 41 if not older when he fought Rocky.
William Dettloff’s biography *'Ezzard Charles: A Boxing Life'* documents that Charles first felt weakness and some numbness in his limbs as early as 1951. This was 3 years before the Marciano fights and it was also the same year he lost his title. Ezzard, his family, Ezzard's trainer's Ray Arcel, Jimmy Brown, Chickie Ferrera and Bill Gore all said they noticed signs of ALS in 1951. Bert Sugar said, *"His trainer, Ray Arcel said, that even now, at this stage in 51, and then on into the middle 50's, you could see the beginning, the traces of the disease, that would later claim his life, Lou Gehrig's disease in Charles."* --@ 35:01 ESPN Ringside - Rocky Marciano
*Quotes from Jersey Joe Walcott about Cassius Clay:*
*“Cassius Clay is the best Heavyweight champion of them all. He could beat Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis, Ezzard Charles, Rocky Marciano and a fellow named Jersey Joe Walcott.”*
*“Clay gets better each time you see him. This kid has speed in his hands and feet like a welterweight. He hits like a heavyweight. He puts his punches together better than any heavyweight champion I’ve ever seen."*
Walcott was asked if he realized what he was saying. He nodded and repeated:
*“Clay could beat Dempsey, Louis, Charles, Marciano and a fellow named Jersey Joe Walcott. Clay is too big and punches too fast and moves too quickly for all of us old timers.”*
Asked to explain in more detail why he rates Clay a sure winner over Dempsey, Louis, Charles, Marciano and himself, Jersey Joe lit up a cigarette and said:
*“Dempsey and Louis and the rest of us would be too small to beat this big, rangy kid. Clay would just have to stay away from us for a few rounds and then start throwing his combinations."*
*“Cassius’ edge in height and reach, his fast hands and legs and the power he puts into his punches, whether from in close or at long range, would be too much for any of the champs I’ve mentioned."*
*“All of us old-timers needed room to punch. But not Clay. He can hit you from any position and hurt you. He can do this even when he is off balance."*
*“When one punch can take a big man like Liston off his feet, people should realize the agility, coordination and power Clay can put into each and every punch."*
*"I didn’t fight Dempsey. But I did fight Louis, Charles and Marciano. I know none of these men, or me, could box with Clay. And I know none of us could punch as fast as Cassius. Some of us might hit as hard but Clay would out punch us in every exchange. Now, when Dempsey was fighting, he stood right over a man he had floored and hit him as he was getting up."*
(( Source - RING, Sept. 1965 Walcott insist Ali would beat Dempsey, Louis, Rocky, etc. by Ed Brennan ))
In summary Jersey Joe has been around boxing for a long time and should know what he is talking about....should i believe you,, a biased casual,, or Jersey Joe ?
Butterbean doc incoming?
👀
Most people openly admit that the versions of Charles, Moore and Walcott that he fought were far from prime (The Louis & Savold fights really doesn't even deserve to be brought up). So it isn't the quality of Rocky's competition that his reputation is based on among the greats, it is that famous record 49-0. If Rocky's 49-0 record is the basis of his greatness then the fighters on that record should be the very best that were available. But by my reckoning that is the furthest thing from the truth. Infact when you look at the highest ranked fighters of the era, and then you look at his record, it's scandalous how many he didn't fight. Many of the ones he DID choose to fight are just as scandalous.
Top fighters Marciano definitely should have fought that he didn't.
*1)* Harold Johnson
*2)* Oakland Billy Smith
*3)* Yolande Pompey
*4)* Curtis Hatchetman Sheppherd
*5)* Clarence Henry
*6)* Joey Maxim
*7)* Marty Marshall
*8)* Bob Satterfield
*9)* Jimmy Bivins
*10)* Lloyd Marshall
*11)* Nino Valdes
*12)* Willie Pastrano
*13)* Cleveland Williams had 35 wins 2 losses when Rocky retired in April 1956. Rocky had plenty of opportunities to fight Cleveland in 1952 or 1953.
Those are just the definites, we could add many other names (like Tommy Jackson, Dan Bucceroni or even Bob Baker) that while not as good, are definitely better than some of the guys he DID fight that make up that "legendary" record. Guys like these;
Lee Epperson (Career Record 0-1)
Jimmy Weeks (Career Record 0-1)
Gilbert Cardone (Career Record 0-3)
John Edwards (Career Record 1-2)
Bill Hardeman (Career Record 1-7)
Humphrey Jackson (Career Record 4-3)
Johnnie Pretzie (Career Record 10-14)
Bob Jefferson (Career Record 3-10)
Gilley Ferron (Career Record 4-13)
Tommy DiGiorgio (Career Record 9-15)
Artie Donato (Career Record 7-13)
Harry Haft (Career Record 12-7)
James Connoly (Career Record 12-9)
Harry Bilazarian (Career Record 15-12)
Joe Dominic (Career Record 18-12)
Don Mogard (Career Record 20-16)
Jimmy Walls (Career Record 21-41)
Eldridge Eatman (Career Record 22-21) according to BoxRec and the Providence Journal, *"Marciano hit Eatman with a right in the 3rd round and Eatman went down, THOUGH IT DIDN'T APPEAR HE WAS HIT."* Not only did Eldridge take a-dive vs Rocky but he had just lost 8 of his last 9 fights. Why would a 26-0 boxer fight an *F-LEVEL* diver who had just lost 8 fights?
Eddie Ross (Career Record is laughable). Immediately, same day, after 170lb *F-LEVEL* diver Eddie Ross was supposedly KO'd by Marciano he drove from Rhode Island Providence to Quebec City Quebec -- 8 hr 15 min 465.9 mi via I-93 N inorder to fight 160lb Billy Sparks. ( *"Amazing recovery by Eddie Ross after being KO'd by Rocky Marciano the previous day."* - BoxRec and Providence Journal ).
Marciano's 32nd fight was against *F-LEVEL* Keene Simmons who had a career 9 wins 22 losses.
Marciano's 33rd fight was against *F-LEVEL* Harold Mitchell who had a career 7 wins 16 losses. *(Harold had just lost 10 fights in a row before diving against Rocky)*
Marciano's 34th fight was against *F-LEVEL* Art Henri who had a career 18 wins 29 losses.
Marciano's 35th fight was against *F-LEVEL* Willis Applegate who had a career 12 wins 16 losses.
None of these guys beat anyone of note! Many of these guys he even fought pretty far into his career when there were obviously alternatives. In light of this should this 49-0 record be as revered as it is to some?
*(In my opinion it's clear as day that Italian Mafia Boss Frankie Carbo and underboss Al Weill cherry picked and padded Rocky's entire resume. Maybe maybe not? But one's things for sure, it was undoubtedly the smallest and weakest Heavyweight division in boxing History)*
*C-LEVEL Journeyman Walcott lost to Middleweights Mays ,, Palmer ,, Ketchell ,, and to Light heavyweights Charles x2 ,, Fox x2 ,, Maxim ,, Brothers ,, Taylor.. In summary Walcott consistently lost to Middleweights and Light heavyweights!!! Overall he lost (20) times and was KO'd (6) times!!!*
*Per family request Wikipedia recently changed Archie Moore's birthdate from 1916 to 1913!!!*
Archie Moore said, *"Rocky Marciano was about 15 years younger than I was"* --@ Archie Moore Talks 2007TBears
Archie Moore also said, *"I was in my 40's vs. Floyd Patterson."* --@ Rare Archie Moore Interview
The host asks Archie Moore, (@ 6:35) "why does your mother say your one age and you say another?" Archie replies, *"I don't deny anything"* .. *"I never deny what my mother quotes"* .. *"I know my age"* .. *"and I've befuddled a lot of people who are requiring about my age constantly"* .. *"and that keeps me in the news."* --@ Day and Night: Archie Moore, boxer
*ARCHIE MOORE WAS EASILY 41 IF NOT OLDER vs MARCIANO AND THAT IS NO LONGER DEBATABLE!!!*
Muhammad Ali, *"Umm Marciano... Marciano, umm, phew, ooh he hit hard. He hit you so hard* (unrecognizable) *folks in Africa."*
Cosell, *"But you think you could have beaten him too?"*
Ali, *"Well it a been rough, look Howard, I don't take nothing from these fellas especially those deceased. Marciano and I were good friends, but I truly think on my best day and his best day I would have beaten him, probably not knocked him out, I been sore, I think he was better than Joe Frazier I'd put it that way. I truly think he was better than Joe Frazier. I think it be even, he may have won - it's just hard, it's just up to the imagination."*
Cosell, *"You know you started out with so much braggadocio, now you're ending with humility."*
Ali, *"Yea, you got the last man Marciano. Showing him last, you did the right thing. He wasn't as great as me, wasn't as beautiful everyone knows that. But I don't know if I would have beat him with his style and my style. He could've out-pointed me, could've knocked me down. Did a computer fight with him when he was an old man just pretending and my arms were so sore just for joking with him. In his heyday he may have won, he probably wouldn't... that's up for the imagination. In the end I still think I'm the greatest of all time!"*
Later, in part 6 Ali flips a script saying that *"a prime Louis, Walcott, Charles, and Moore would've beat Marciano."* He then goes on to his usual *"I'm the greatest"* after part 6. Why was the most important part removed?? *Ali said, "a prime Louis, Walcott, Charles, and Moore would've beat Marciano."*
*This valuable information has been suppressed for 48 years!!!* Imagine all the uploaders that have been entering incorrect information for decades!!! Truth is Rocky uploaders removed 3 hours 28 minutes because it didn't align with their agenda!!! *The Fact is Ali Hated Marciano!!!* Why not just use Rocky's resume to defend him instead of hiding vital information?? Well because Rocky's resume is Horseshirt, that's why!!! Y'all can order copies *@ Muhammad Ali Archival Television Audio Inc* just go to the *3rd page* to order 9889 is 90 MIN, 9889A is 30 MIN and 9890 is 90 MIN. That's 3 1/2 hours of Ali discussing Marciano Walcott Charles Moore and Louis.. *"a prime Louis, Walcott, Charles, and Moore would've beat Marciano." - Muhammad Ali, 02/15/76*
(As more proof Dave Diles explains Ali discussing Marciano Walcott Charles Moore in depth @ 0:15 or very beginning of *1976 Daytona 500 - ABC Wide World of Sports coverage* from NascarAllOut)
Muhammad Ali said, *"Even in his prime, Rocky Marciano had no chance with me. First thing, he is too little. Less than five foot ten to my six foot three inches. I’d overwhelm him. I’d lay on him in the clinches like a big old grizzly bear, and I’d smother his insides out. He was too small to reach me from outside. I’d jab him twenty to one. Rocky had a face that cut easily. Can you imagine what my stinging jab would do to those weak eyes? By round three, Rocky would look like he ran into a lawn mower. How could he beat me? No way, is how."*
This was before three Frazier fights, three fights with Ken Norton, and the George Foreman proved Ali's hypothesis. Ali too big, Ali too fast, Ali too strong a puncher, Ali too fast a jab, and the bad news, Ali too tough, takes heavy punishment well. I'm afraid Ali was right. Marciano, while a formidable opponent, wouldn't have lasted long.
Regardless of the script, Rocky seemed unable to pull his punches, whereas Ali could come within a fraction of an inch to making it look extremely real. Our problem was that Ali was getting madder and madder as Rocky thumped one hard shot after another off his ribs.
By the end of the second day, Ali stopped the filming to have a word with Rocky, *"Rocky, you're supposed to be pulling those body shots. You aren't, and they're hurting my ribs. Now, if we're going to have a real fight, then you will not be able to land those shots without me peppering your face with hard left jabs and right hooks, and if you do by chance land a body shot, you're going to take back a stinging right hand to the nose to break it again. Now, do we play movie or do we play boxing?"*
Marciano knew he was wrong. Secretly, he wanted to find out if Ali could take his best shots. To his surprise, he found that Ali could. End of the problem.
If you don't take anything away from this chapter, let me reiterate, commit this to memory: *"Ali would have beat Marciano if they had ever really fought."* - Ferdie Pacheco
*Source - Tales from the 5th Street Gym: Ali, the Dundees, and Miami's Golden Age of Boxing by Ferdie Pacheco 2010. Chapter 10, When Ali took on Marciano - The Fake Fight*
*(( IN SUMMARY ALI CHALLENGES ROCKY AND ROCKY DECLINED...AND THAT'S NOT JUST A THEORY OR A FABRICATED LIE...IT'S A FACT!!!! ))*
178 to 188 lb tiny cruiser Marciano's opponents (not in exact order): *We see their entire-CAREER record, not a partial record.* Seeing a boxers complete resume gives a more accurate evaluation how good, or how bad they are. Pro boxers can easily be evaluated using grades *A, B, C, D, F* which has been used for decades:
Lee Epperson career record 0 wins 1 loss *F-LEVEL*
Jimmy Weeks career record 0 wins 1 loss *F-LEVEL*
Gilbert Cardone career record 0 wins 3 losses *F-LEVEL*
John Edwards career record 1 win 2 losses *F-LEVEL*
Bill Hardeman career record 1 win 7 losses *F-LEVEL*
Humphrey Jackson career record 4 wins 3 losses *F-LEVEL*
Harry Haft career record 12 wins 7 losses *F-LEVEL*
James Connolly career record 12 wins 9 losses *F-LEVEL*
Harry Bilazarian career record 15 wins 12 losses *F-LEVEL*
Bob Jefferson career record 3 wins 10 losses *F-LEVEL*
Harold Mitchell career record 7 wins 16 losses *F-LEVEL*
Gilley Ferron career record 4 wins 13 losses *F-LEVEL*
Artie Donato career record 7 wins 13 losses *F-LEVEL*
Johnny Pretzie career record 10 wins 14 losses *F-LEVEL*
Don Mogard career record 20 wins 16 losses *F-LEVEL*
Pete Louthis career record 32 wins 14 losses *D-LEVEL*
Tommy DiGiorgio career record 9 wins 15 losses *F-LEVEL*
Kenne Simmons career record 9 wins 22 losses *F-LEVEL*
Art Henri career record 18 wins 29 losses *F-LEVEL*
Jimmy Walls career record 21 wins 41 losses *F-LEVEL*
Ted Lowry career record 71 wins 68 losses *F-LEVEL*
Ted Lowry (twice) 71 wins 68 losses *F-LEVEL*
Gino Buonvino career record 24 wins 15 losses *F-LEVEL*
Gino Buonvino (twice) 24 wins 15 losses *F-LEVEL*
Joe Dominic career record 18 wins 12 losses *F-LEVEL*
Eldridge Eatman career record 22 wins 21 losses *F-LEVEL*
Willis Applegate career record 12 wins 16 losses *F-LEVEL*
Lee Savold career record 104 wins 45 losses *D-LEVEL*
Phil Muscato career record 56 wins 23 losses *D-LEVEL*
Bill Wilson career record 56 wins 27 losses *D-LEVEL*
Johnny Shkor career record 31 wins 19 losses *D-LEVEL*
Fred Beshore career record 35 wins 17 losses *D-LEVEL*
Jimmy Evans 18 wins 8 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 10 opponents with 10 fights or less.*
Eddie Ross 19 wins 5 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 10 debuting amateurs and 7 other opponents with 10 fights or less.*
Bob Quinn 20 wins 4 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 13 opponents with 10 fights or less.*
Bernie Reynolds 53 wins 13 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 30 opponents with 15 fights or less.*
Pat Richards 24 wins 9 losses looks okay until you see *he fought 20 opponents with 10 fights or less.*
Carmine Vingo 16 wins 2 losses looks good until you see *ALL 16 wins came against F-LEVEL opponents.*
Don Cockell 66 wins 14 losses looks okay until you see the majority of his career was at middleweight and light heavyweight. *By the time he faced Marciano he was suffering from severe glandular disorders that wreaked havoc with his physique. He was sallow-skinned, fat, and had a nasty boil on his neck.*
Harry Matthews 90 wins 7 losses is a good B-LEVEL resume until you see *he was a career middleweight moonlighting at light heavyweight.* Matthews weighed 130 lbs vs. Joey Parks who also weighed 130. *Shouldn't one have to beat credible Heavyweight opponents to be respected as a legitimate Heavyweight?*
Roland LaStarza *C-LEVEL.* LaStarza Refused fights with Charles, Moore, Walcott, Louis, Valdez, Satterfield, Bivins, Maxim, Henry, Baker, Johnson, Pompey, Marshall, Smith, Sheppard etc. In an article in RING magazine after his career LaStarza admitted as much!
Rex Layne *C-LEVEL.* LaStarza vs. Layne reminds me of watching two midwest club fighters fighting a 4 rounder on an old ESPN card from Muncie, In. Two guys who were not well schooled, standing in front of each other acting like they were insulted if the other guy missed them with a punch. A lot of right hand leads, a lot of jabs with the rear foot leaving the canvas, little/no counter punching, just two guys willing to get hit but showing little boxing skill. Look how bad Rex Layne swings and misses. What an oaf.
Joe Walcott *C-LEVEL.* Walcott's losses is what elevated his status and built up his credentials, not his wins!!! The fact that Walcott was granted (6) title attempts in a (5) year span speaks volumes about how weak the Heavyweight division was at this time!!! And (4) of these title opportunities came immediately after a Walcott loss!!!
Archie Moore *A-LEVEL* MW/LH and *C-LEVEL* HW. Heck, Low Power 171/173 lb Charles beat him 3 times, 182 lb Patterson obliterated him, and 188 lb tiny cruiser Marciano smashed him. Every time Moore Stepped-Up in competition he got KO'D.
Ezzard Charles *A-LEVEL* LH and *C-LEVEL* HW. William Dettloff’s biography *'Ezzard Charles: A Boxing Life'* documents that Charles first felt weakness in his limbs, and some numbness, as early as 1951. This was 3 years before the Marciano fights and it was also the same year he lost his title. Ezzard, his family, Ezzard's trainer's Ray Arcel, Jimmy Brown, Chickie Ferrera and Bill Gore all said they noticed signs of ALS in 1951. Bert Sugar said, *"His trainer, Ray Arcel said, that even now, at this stage in 51, and then on into the middle 50's, you could see the beginning, the traces of the disease, that would later claim his life, Lou Gehrig's disease in Charles."* --@ 35:01 ESPN Ringside - Rocky Marciano
There it is. Y'all are intelligent enough to make your own judgement about Rocky's *F-LEVEL* resume. Who did he fight? Walcott was 38/39 if not older, Moore 41, Charles had ALS and Louis was washed.
Even Hall of Famer Emanuel Steward a proven boxing genius who trained 41 world champion fighters throughout his career said, *"Marciano was too small. He really wasn't a Heavyweight. 5' 10", exceptionally short arms, very clumsy, cut easy, had troubled balance. 188 lbs was just too small."* @ Emanuel Steward: Ali all time greatest, Klitschko number eight
*"Name one, just one 'Prime' all time great boxer Rocky beat? Failing to name even one proves my comment rings true. Show me any respected boxing publication or analyst that claims Walcott Charles Moore Louis was 'Prime' when they fought him?"*
in the heavyweight division...you're as big as you punch!...& Rocky had a BIG punch !!!
@@freddiecorleone4411 *It's funny how you pretend boxing fans cannot grasp that Rocky was a 184 lb guy so he was not Heavyweight by modern standards.*
@@freddiecorleone4411 *"Boxing and other combat sports divide competitors into weight classes in order to prevent injury, ensure fair competition and provide a more exciting fight. The heavier opponent will have an advantage as they have increased muscle mass, allowing them to hit harder and withstand strikes from their opponent more easily. It is for this reason that combat sports separate fighters based on weight class."* -- by MMA Combat Sports
@@Rowdy-r2d2-John.3.16 I'm 72 years old...grew up in the bronx...the toughest guys i met were short & light..the TOUGHEST !!!
@@freddiecorleone4411 If all the little short guys are so tough why aren't they Heavyweight Champions of the World. *"NEVER IN THE HISTORY OF BOXING HAS A 190 LB MAN BEAT A PRIME TOP-NOTCH SUPER HEAVYWEIGHT BOXING CHAMPION."* - Ring Magazine