Stoics In Video Games
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- Опубліковано 22 лют 2024
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I, Doktor Skipper. Am Talking about stoics like Kratos, Master Chief, Doomguy, Godzilla ( no ) and what makes a good stoic and why they should be able to be versatile
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co-editing by: @McMingus
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what's your favorite stoic?
yo
DoomSlayer is so stoic, that the demons in his world dont wanna do anything to him.
Sellout
@@theskeletonman2092 getting sponsors is being a sell out?
@@bandanna2388 sure I am Gustavo from Pollos hermanos breaking bad
This is such a cool video, i wonder what his thoughts on Godzilla
0_0
It's been 3 weeks and the fanbase in his comment section is still shitting on his video even after the controversy started to cool off now.
@@TriggerThe_ACE015FG He’s just playing around.
Western Godzilla is woke.
@@detective2221 No. This is a joke right?
He didnt mention kazuma kiryu 😔
Fr man. He's my favorite
Who's Kazuma kiryu?
@@goroakechi6515 MC of the Yakuza series
@@Kazillion-Jillionaire I've heard of that series before. I tried judgement and loved it.
Skipper has dogshit taste, man
The reason people hate new luke is not just because this development was off screen - he is plainly a different character
He is different because of the development that happened off screen. That’s the point
1:34 NO!! THAT IS NOT SOLID SNAKE!!
But still Snake
NO!! THAT IS NOT SNAKE!!
@@biggerboss550 he is snake, but not solid
Correct its Naked Snake.
Guys it's one of Big Boss's soldiers who was brainwashed into thinking he's Big Boss and operated on to make him look like Big Boss. He's called Venom Snake/Punished Snake.
I don't really understand what David Jaffee meant. Even in the o.g games Kratos was a dad who was going on a revenge quest for being tricked into his wife and DAUGHTER which is point they bring up in ragnarok
True, but that wasn't the focus. It added depth and relatability to the character. Otherwise he would be a much less compelling murderous monster and nothing beside that.
David also himself said, GoW2018 was great, Ragnarok not so much. And I agree. Exploring the father-son relationship and a more calm, retrospective and introspective Kratos was great and refreshing. It was a nice change of pace for the characer. It would've been better though if it was more concise and resolved in that game. Unfortunately second game wallows in his past way too much and the fact he STILL struggles with his relationship with his son and what he's done in the past is frankly boring IMO. Those issues were resolved already, so Ragnarok feels like it retreads the same ground not adding much to the story or characters. Which is a big reason why Ragnarok was such a disappointment. It just felt like the same game, again.
@@dud5606good thing your in the minority with that take on Ragnarok.
@iraford5788 you're *
@dud5606 Kratos had depth 💀 character development off screen isn't character development it's character assassination 💀
@@iraford5788 Ah yes the standard deflection 'your opinion belongs to a loud minority because I said so and as such isn't a real concern'.
This man didn't just get a sponsor from wanted: dead
Something that I find fascinating is the stigma around Gordon Freeman having changed recently. Originally he was just a silent protagonist nerd fantasy and just a blank slate for the player to immerse themselves in. However with the release of HL:Alyx, people have started to view him as his own person, and have basically started empathizing with him releasing he’s just this dude that has saved the world twice in the span of a week and hasn’t had the time to process any of it
Leon is consistently shown to be a ptsd ridden drunk and even in re4make ada flat out calls him a wannabe, hes still just the scared good hearted cop that he was during raccoon city just hiding behind his tough guy attitude
This, this is the reason why re4 remake story is way better than og re4 imo
@@kkinthewheelchair3049
I legit seen people get pissed at RE4 remake for daring to treat Leon like an actual human being and not a cartoon cutout.
@@Indigo_1001 they like action hero Leon which i can understand, but i just really like this beated down Leon, because if you really think about it , Leon has never actually saved anyone up until Ashley , he consistently fails to save everyone, with that kind of trauma and the harsh environment he is immediately shoved into of course he would have harden a bit , he believes that he changed, but he is still that well meaning rookie on his first day of duty trying to help everyone
If this doesn't have LEGO Star Wars in some capacity I am rioting
1:34
"NO! THAT IS NOT SOLID SNAKE!"
Another god, at least it ain’t a zilla
God of War was always deep, and Kratos as a character too. People seem to selectively forget all the lore and see Kratos as a bloodthirsty killer.
I mean apparently it wasn't since the original creator doesn't think so, oh well
@@redninja3056 he didnt say they werent deep, he said they should have stuck by the formula, and kratos not changing into an entirely different character. The games speak for themselves anyway.
@@XGames-94 you're right he just thinks the original isn't about fathers and sons like new games....oh wait
@@XGames-94 David Jaffee is a clown and anyone who thinks otherwise don't know enough about all of what he's done since OG GOW ended
Hi, I’m a OG GoW fan, and you are kinda wrong.
GoW 1 Kratos had a surprising amount of depth in history of an action game of that genera. But GoW 2 and GoW 3 was just fan service of “how many famous mythologies characters can Kratos kill”. There was no interestingly story development and Kratos slowly became two dimensional and kinda boring. Even Ascensions couldn’t save despite them trying to had more story.
There is more depth in Kratos story in a hour of GoW 2018 then GoW 2 and 3 combined
Not sure if anyone noticed that transition at 8:38 but that was a nice one Doc.
Halo 3 Master Chief is the ultimate Stoic. He is efficient and badass but has moments of humanity, I always love the scene during the mission, Cortana. When Chief sees a broken Cortana and goes down to her level to confront her, shows so much of his character
Kratos has been a dad ever since the beginning. Did David forget why Kratos's skin is grey?
Greatest buzzer beater of all time.
You want a deep stoic? Kiryu Kazuma.
Sam Porter Bridges from Death Stranding, phenomenal. Sure, the acting is really over the top, but in such a small and contained world with a hyper fixated premise, it adds a lot of weight to the few humans you interact with. I wouldn't want to go on the adventures Sam goes on, but his growth across the story as a loner to eventually the hope of so many people is absolutely worth the FedEx adventure of a lifetime. Still haven't played the director's cut, but it's on my wish list this year.
“Stoicism” has been bastardized beyond recognition. The modern definition is so far removed from the original definition that it makes the word essentially meaningless.
Like many words now
Aww yes Stoics “when actions speak everything”…
I wouldn't say Snake is a stoic
Venom snake probably
@@yourlocalhitman6696 only venom
Venom Snake def is he barely even spoke throughout the game
David’s entire childish rant just boils down to “I don’t like character development”
This is exactly what I was thinking. Who tf says "I don't want these characters to grow" and doesn't see the irony with that. There is no story if there is no character development.
I get it. I wouldn't want my character to be tampered with, but nobody would care if he didn't change. It'd just be the same thing over and over. Some characters can be stubborn or hypocritical, but then the story would have to include that in a unique or meaningful way, which you also can't do multiple times. Sure, you can play a game for the gameplay alone, but there's a reason Tears of the Kingdom got heavily criticized for it's bad story. It's crazy how fans can care more than the creator.
It's kind of a conundrum, isn't it? In the modern tradition, stories, good stories, have a very specific purpose or thesis, and we often measure a story's worth by how focused every element of it is for getting across that message. How much every bit and detail of an artwork contributes to one idea, because we value expressing one idea as strongly as possible. What this also means, is that stories must end. You cannot tell a story about hatred and rage and revenge and not have it end, because ultimately these are transient states that in time always fall away to reveal something else. That's what your GoW and your Doom were. Yes, there's lore of Kratos' family, but that was not the important part, and we all know that.
But then capitalism strolls along and throws a wrench in the works. Now stories are not supposed to just begin and end, now they must be eternal franchises that keep chugging along forever. If the public falls to that idea in the large, then the role of stories as a focused statement about one thing (however profound or deep that thing may be) is pretty much shattered, and, interestingly, we seem to revert back to an older ideal of stories, that of the mythos. A "cinematic universe" is after all just a mythology by another name, only with the modern standards.
Now I can support both those ideas. Sometimes, most times even, it is most useful and impactful to our lives to be able to communicate with stories, and the ideas they manifest, in a targeted way. To be able to get what we need in the best, most condensed and powerful form possible, undiluted by context, so that we ourselves are given the strongest possible tools for our own use. Other times, however, we may also want to look at the big picture, so to speak, and examine the interaction of ideas, rather than any one idea in itself. That's what a "world", a "universe", is (or rather *should* be) for. The interweaving tapestry of stories serves as a critical look about how what we end up believing, what path we end up deciding, may exist in a broader world. That can be very useful too, in a sobering fashion, counteracting the inevitable intoxicating mania of a hyperfocused narrative.
Of course, that's not the *actual* reason everything is an IP nowadays. And this approach also comes with significant flaws, the greatest of which being the death of originality. "All happy families are alike. Each unhappy family is unhappy in its own way". Ditto characters. It's a hard pill to swallow perhaps, but our problems, our struggles is what gives us our identity, what makes each one of us unique. Give every character enough development and they'll all turn into the same person: happy, well-adjusted, rational, successful, and superbly boring. It seems we cannot just *have* a decent story nowadays (in the AAA-space at least) by itself, undiluted, in its purest, strongest form, we have to integrate it into a mythos; One that may be entirely unsuited for it. What was alive and fiery is extinguished and forced ton submit to being no more than another insignificant piece of an uncaring world.
I suppose, the question we need to ask ourselves with all these franchises, is simply which ones should be the first type of story, and which ones the second. Deciding the best scope for a story is an extremely non-trivial task, but to me is the only thing that will resolve all these controversies. If we're all clear in ourselves about what we want out of an IP, then we can discuss maturely, persuade, be persuaded, agree, or agree to disagree; And not bastardise honest feelings and thoughts with ad hominems and strawmen
@@luigivercotti6410 Long read, but a based one.
It’s clear you’ve never created anything artistic yourself if think this reductively about it
Doom Guy is the best example of less is more
When characters have the ability to speak, depth is a good thing,
But the great thing about Doom guy is he doesn't need depth only rage, he just needs to be a icon of rage and violence, not everything needs to be expanded on, 2016 was so good because you'd have these factions with their own plans and goals and then Doomguy shows up and just shoots the problem
its like sticking an Anime Shonen character in the middle of a sports competition to just shred everyones years of hard work because he's just built different, and then the little pieces of lore added like how they took him out of hell add to the whole "oh so thats why he woke up in a coffin" rather than Eternal going he was a space gladiator and he gained power from the angels and his sword was given to him by Jesus and, blah blah blah just let me shot the Devil in Face thank you very much
Doom guy was a regular guy put in the worst circumstance imaginable and kept preservering, dedicating his life to being the great big middle-finger against evil.
1:34 NO! THAT IS NO SOLID SNAKE!
Dude it’s a joke
@@Gansterraccoon quoting mgs2
@@Gansterraccoon that is not a joke. He sounds completely serious
@@Mr_rizz_funny_role it’s called sarcasm
@@Gansterraccoon nope it not sarcasm
As flawed as Halo 4 was, the core story of MC watching Cortana fade away was the best the story in a Halo game has been since 2. Shame 5 and Infinite fell so far.
I find myself disliking the idea of inserting yourself I. The position of a character. Maybe it’s cause the games I play aren’t realistic story games but I can’t immerse myself in them because I can’t experience what’s happening. That’s why personally I prefer when media makes new characters that I can get attached to and it can be satisfying to watch them grow. But who asked me ya know
Holy cow I didn't think a single person like you existed anymore! You described that PERFECTLY! I don't enjoy inserting myself into games either. It's such an overdone downfall of so many games nowadays. A mistake made by many game devs who feel like they need to insert themselves into EVERY GAME NOWADAYS. If they don't they say they can't relate to things? It's totally the wrong approach. The direction of most games is misguided and or not utilizing the potential of what video games are capable of. You explained it so well. It's someone like you that I wish could be able to be apart of game design because you truly understand the medium and it's possibilities as a creative art form
I dont need to insert myself in a game but I find self inserts rather boring because they can't actually be me, they're a template but the characters options still have to lead to plot progression when a real self insert would let me just say fuck the journey Ima stay here in this safe town forever, now obvious in a video game I wouldnt care about safe but lets say someone actually wanted to role play, there just aren't game stories that can allow something like that because it would be a boring story for one but also technology just isnt at the point where it can account for every action a player may want to make
i think there's a misconception that a person can't get immersed into a story without being IN the story when it comes to video games.
This probably mostly comes from controlling the protagonist and having the power to do things out of character (like kill civilians as a hero) so developers make it so nothing feels out of character because the character is *you*. That or remove the option do such things entirely.
@@benmcreynolds8581I think you misunderstood his point so hard
@@benmcreynolds8581you completely misunderstood his entire comment my dude.
Kratos' development is the most natural progression of his story. The first games were about family and fatherhood, but the grief of losing said family. He got his revenge. There's no reason for him to still be angry. He was a happy father before, so now it makes sense for him to slowly regain that, to try and trust himself to be a father after what he did. It's brilliant storytelling and I think David Jaffee is just malding about giving up his creation, which is understandable
Still recovering from the burn wounds other UA-camrs recently gave 😢
Those burns look radioactive
havent been here in a while and damn ur videos have gotten more high quality
wow you pick good background music
I love how Kratos grew as character, and even in the old games we could see that he was more than "just a monster"
But i prefer the gameplay style of the original triology, it's just more satisfying and flashy for me, because i do love some crazy air combos
Lol alot of people say but after playing the original 3 I prefer the new ones the bosses feel alot better and thought out and some enemies aren't annoying as hell
I'm glad the new games don't play like the old ones.
@redninja3056 The bosses are better but I personally miss how glamorous and epic the bosses were.
@aytony4090 true the bosses were more epic, in scale but seeing Kratos actually throw hands like he actually knows how to fight instead of mindless monster gives me more joy
I personally really like Isaac Clarke due to how good his character is, for example in the first Dead Space he couldnt save Nicole, in the second game he puts Ellie Langford on a gunship to escape the infestation which I think is pretty stoic.
The Warrior of light as the protagonist of ffxiv is also a rather stoic protagonist. They have the advantage of staying within the same game, but the writers have obviously put a lot of efort into showing how the events of the game have effected the character, which can be seen with their interactions with others, their influence on the world, and in the simple changing and aging of the WOL stand-in in the trailers.
I love the new squimbly doodles they are ridiculously cute and charming
thank you for blessing us with more good food, chef doktor.
I loved Halo 4s Master Chief and was super excited to see where 343 was going to go for 5 when all the trailers made it look like he was going to be an outcast or on a lone wolf journey but then when they revived Cortana I was pissed because it made basically made the end of 4 pointless.
Bro is the yapinator
Why do you click on the fucking video then? 🎅🏿
*clicks on video essay where a guy talks*
"Why does this dude talk so much!?"
@@goosegooseproductions9587yap doesn’t mean talking, it means spouting nonsense
1:34 Is Big Boss
you should help Mingus, he's my favorite
I like when they evolve a story and character then just reboot or do the same thing over and over.
love your videos, love your editing, humor, and soundtracks. I watch the halo and starfield videos of yours probably 4 times a month because I love them so much. Probably my favorite new (to me) youtube channel. Hope to see more epic, long game critiques when you get the motivation or time because I can imagine they are a bitch to edit.
holly shit! Did you. Did you actually fall into the beginners trap of calling Venom snake, snake. Did you even play MGS5?
3:27 NO! THAT IS NOT SOLID SNAKE (excelent video as always dude 🐐)
Hey dude love your content
@@deviousmiscreant4662aint no way dumbasses are STILL bitching about that
@@soundbuug get off yo knees lil bro🤣
Say what you will about the new God Of War games but at the very least the new games respect him and din't shoot him in the head on a park bench by 3 C Tier Villains and a Shark.
Makes me sad seeing David dislike the direction Cory took with kratos. I thought he would be proud to see his creation progress into something positive that could help gamers grow as people instead of being the same old kill everything for revenge. I’m glad someone like Cory who was the second hand man and OG of the original god of war games paid close attention to the original games and cracked the code on what to do next for kratos and the series that would impact players and fans in a meaningful way. One day David will see his son kratos and accept for who he is now. Lol
There is a place for static characters and the notion that anyone is wrong for having a problem with, arguably arbitrarily, changing them into one with "development" is completely unfair.
Bro said Solid Snake then used an Image of Big Boss (not actually big boss)
Goated as always
I have to say, this is an interesting way to talk about PlayStation, Xbox, and some of their IPs.
Quick Reminder: David Jaffe called Metroid Dread a terrible game because HE DIDN'T SHOOT A VERY OBVIOUS HIDDEN BREAKABLE BLOCK.
The new god of war works beautifully because of the first games, ive beaten every god of war game, theyve been some of my favorite since i first started playing games, god of war is amazing and has made me cry countless times
Anything to say about the Godzilla drama?
He responded about it on Twitter now shut the fuck up
He's to scared
@@DodgedodgesProblems his response was terrible
@@shrektheshrek9339where is his response
What was his response? What did he do wrong?
I hate silent protagonists in games, when some crazy shit is happening and everyone else is talking and asking for your help or opinion and just nothing
honestly thats my favourite part, its so funny
Some of my favorite protags are silent(freeman, artyom) . Maybe is because it fullfills the fantasy of being a hero and having friends without having to interact socially xD.
It lets you pretend that you are him while keeping the mystery of what your character is actually thinking.
Well the point is that they are you they are a self insert so in a way they aren’t actually silent if u are talking during the game
Clearly not true since no one wants link to talk even to this day
My favorite stoics are Samus and Kratos
Song at the very end: YES! Killer Mike
Bro think he Jakey 💀
That take from the creator of kratos is such an L take fr
I just learned I'm a stoic
I am so sick of the God of War discourse. He's not "more" nuanced or "more" mature because there's a kid next to him or anything like that. He's the same as he ever was. It's the same themes, the same character, the same ideas and messages.
What happened to your editing? It gives me a headache with all the fast paced cuts at the beginning
What is the cartoon show used in a lot of the cut away edits?
Smiling friends I believe
good to know skip is also a fan of our glorious savior lord of light yeat
1:34 NO! THAT IS NOT SOLID SNAKE!
Wtf this is not the new godzilla content you promised mr skipper
Apparently the Godzilla fanbase is throwing a hissy fit over him making one “bad” video… so he probs won’t.
@@aidanscorner847calling out errors isn’t throwing a hissy fit, idk why it’s such an issue to disagree with content creators
@@aidanscorner847Sorry but that's the poorest defense I've heard. He spewed blatant misinformation and most of his points in his thesis was just flat out wrong or poorly researched.
@@Red_PlaysYTcorrect, but leaving comments about it on every video is kind of throwing a hissy fit
@@strombolex8452 couldn't be me lol yeah you're right. at least he acknowledged it on twitter. its not really a big deal to me at least
Anyone came here for Godzilla?
Anyone know the name of the song used at 1:23?
Sam Fisher in the first few Splinter Cell games is peak for me. Especially Chaos Theory 👌👌
Anyone saying the new god of war games ruined kratos is wrong and stupid, I still remember playing through the game with my dad and loving the father-son dialogue
I fucking love Kratos man, I wanna give him a hug
2:00 !2093 MENTIONED!
A better video then the godzillla video atleast
Get over the godzilla video neckbeard
@@soundbuug I know you’re not talking with that ugly ass cat pfp
@@soundbuugsomeone on skippers payroll 💀🫵
Super early, hello there Doktor.
Jeralt of Rivia
Damn, back so soon?
Adaptations, sequels, reboots, etc are not bad because they "changed". They are bad because the quality itself is bad.
I think my favorite stoic is probably doom guy just because the stoicism is seen as bat shit insanity. Everyone else reacts to the demon invasion with panick but doom guy isn’t just cool in collected, he is just silent and mad and everyone can just feel it and get out of his way.
Wait, wait, hold on...1:33...Solid Snake? SOLID SNAKE?!?!? NO! THAT IS NOT SOLID SNAKE!
5:10 old man yapping
What’s ur opinion about Red vs. Blie restoration
Blue
Dawg Chief could have had a similar arc to captain america’s in the mcu if 343 had stuck to their vision with halo 4. What a shame
i appreciate the PROBLEMATIC and saint pablo references
Love that you're more right than wrong (at least how i see😂) so nice video man
Luka cruised to 41 yesterday
Hello Dr skipper
Big up Yeat
I think the campaigns for Halo 4 and Halo Infinite are good. It’s great development for Chief as a character and plays into more of who he is in the lore. Halo 5 is the one campaign I wholesomely think is bad. However, there’s been weird revisionist history with Halo 4 and Infinite because when they came out people loved their campaigns. Now since Halo Infinite’s liver services hasn’t been great, it’s rained every other aspect. Which I hate because even when you reference reviews of both games at the time of release, they were well received. I guess people will just change history in real time.
12:54 what about Patrick Bateman from American Psycho?
The man, the myth, the legend, is back to bless me🎉
maybe it is hindsight but I think halo 4's campaign was a pretty alright outing for 343 considering they were brand new to the ip and a whole different studio. multiplayer not so much but I think if they continued with the ideas 4 presented 5 would have been a lot better as a game. Infinite as a soft reboot is super safe and thats not entirely a bad thing, but I hope the next game does a little more
another doktor skipper banger
Scarce lately
@@mrgodzillaraptors8632YAWPPPPP
@@Kitty255Again?
He's referring to the controversy with his godzilla video, it was an admittedly bad take and was rightfully called out for it but a lot of people seem to just now use that as leverage just to hate on all his content, it'll settle down eventually @gustavogaming6692
@@lancethedecayedguardian2719 ik what it is dawg
Dr Skipper a yeezy fan fr
The greatest gaming stoic of all time.. Fortnite Jonesy
Hello Dr
I kinda liked halo 4s story, just didn't like playing it
David Jaffe has been acting strange these days.
he's a extremely resentful old man. He just can't accept the most popular iteration of Kratos is not the one he made
Now he spends his days having stupid discussions with randoms on Twitter and UA-cam
i like the old thumbnail better
From 1-5. God of war is GOATED.
Honestly when I look at FF7R I see much of the same issues with fanbase expectation and creator vision
The team behind FF7R isnt a one man show like many want to believe, its a team and everyone on it from Director to Producer to Writer to Music Creator are all on the same page and keep moving forward with their vision no matter how much some people complain, and the reviews and reaction videos show that the majority are interested in the games direction regardless of what outcry from a vocal Minority might think
I personally dont care much for new Kratos but not because I think he shouldnt be deep, I'd argue he always was just not in the way they want to portray him now, Old Kratos was a tragic Greek Hero and Greek Heroes are usually assholes that learn lessons that change them forever, 2018 Kratos is the byproduct of his actions, he wouldnt be who he is now if the old him wasn't still a good person deep down, he's made mistakes constantly throughout the old trilogy but he kept to his goal and once it was over he only had himself left and had to live with that, he wasn't happy but he's now trying to make due with the cards he gave himself and I respect it
As an OG halo fan I absolutely love what they did in halo 4 after that it went downhill quick.