Spot on! My pump had a short run from the manifold to the pump, causing me to replace pump twice in 4 years. After seeing your vid, I increased the run to 11” from manifold to pump and now I barely hear the pump running.
Once had a pool store install a new pump I bought for them and the tech was going to install a elbow fitting pretty close to the intake. I mentioned this wasn't ideal and he should push back the fitting so it was around 12 inches away from the pump. He then turned to me and asked if I was a engineer at which point I said "no, I just read the install manual".
If the pump is against the wall and you have no room to move it back and have more pipe I understand. But you should always have a longer run of pipe if you can
@@teddygramz2008Even if that is the case, you can always use a long sweep curved pipe and create a new flow pattern that curves out of the way, even curving in multiple changing directions to plumb it back to the intake side of the pump and avoid the massive flow rate disruption caused by a 90 elbow right at the pumps intake. The guy he was referring to is obviously a low skill pool store employee with a self esteem / intelligence issue. You never have to settle and get stuck with no choice due to the position of the pool to the pump, or other equipment. You can always reroute around issues like this. It might look like less of a direct path to the equipment and it might appear to have some unecessary piping patterns but who cares so long as the flow rate is optimal. I can't stand easily threatened "professionals" like that. It's like a doctor who's butt hurt because you challenge their basic opinion of something that is objectively wrong and obvious even to layman.
Hello Steve I been watching a lots of your videos and they’re great. Today I was thinking what happens when child poops in the pool? Can you make video on this or explain what is the correct way to handle Thank you
I just watched two videos prior to this one and they both did not have a 5X pipe diameter straight run into the intake. In fact in one, you could clearly see large bubbles through the lid.
i WISH pump set ups give generous space and pipe but....9/10, so many pool set ups are so tight and you rarely have the luxury of getting so much room for pipe sadly...
Right. Come to think about it I had 1.5 to skimmer, down 45 across into pump. A guy added a second out port and adjusted to filter pump direction to line the pipes. I do have a 90 right into pump. so far the rubber coupling held 4 years. I know working with my RO setup I try to avoid 90s. So this video is a refresher on not using 90s or restrictions before and after pump. I had small 1-3 gph pumps that ran hard or hot drawi g high amps. Once removed obstruction before and after they purred cooler. Even on those pumps, just a few inches on an out port before you restrict made all the difference.
I have a 40mm fitting on the inlet side on my pump, so the reducer needs to be 12" from this. Am I able to put a pressure ball valve in-between the reducer and the pump?
Just a thought. Intex pump sucks so I will use my old filter pump, 1.5 hp and 1.5 pvc. Now, could I use the intex pump without adding holes to draw water? Maybe add a clip on skimmer to it and add a jet, shower, sprayer fountain as the out port? It probably would work like a vacuum mode be ajse the water would not be gravity assisted as the tubing would go over rail but maybe the siphon effect will assist. I am just not ready to cut into this new pool, Intex 12x24 vinyl .
The manual for that new black + decker you’ve been reviewing shows 5x pipe diameter straight run as good, but a long sweep as best. How do you feel about long sweeps?
Long sweeps are great. I always thought the straight run was the most optimal. Hard to imagine why any bend would be preferable to a straight run. In any case, I would say both are good.
In the past 35 years have you read the installation manual for any of these pumps you are installing. They ALL say exactly what I have said right here about having at least 5x the pipe diameter in a straight run in front of the pump. It is not enough to call into your job for 35 years. You should aim to improve your quality every year, and this one is black and white right in the installation manual from the pump manufacturer. Thanks for commenting.
It depends on your situation whether you are a pool owner or a pool professional. Either way you can read about my consulting services here: www.swimmingpoolsteve.com/pages/ask-steve.html
Hi Steve: What you are saying here is massively important for Pumps Without Leaf Baskets where the cavitation from the elbow or string of elbows fires right into the centre of the impellor, the longer the better. But of course you would only use these pumps below water level. If they have Leaf Baskets for use above water level I use Sweep Bends. The Lint Basket negates the need for extra lead in pipe. I have had no issues in 30 years. As there is no cavitation from Sweepers It's hard to tell if there is water in the pump basket. These days I only use Pentair Intelliflo 2 VSF pumps now and set them for 10 cubic metres per hour when installed on a new pool that I have plumbed from scratch using as many sweep bends as possible where required. I will pull about 500 watts with a Multicyclone, Sand Filter, heater and ozone sanitation installed. which is the optimum flow rate for Filtration, Heating and effective Skimming, basically equal to an old school 1 Hp pump. If I increase the flow rate to 11 cubic metres per hour it will pull about 1000Watts. The Intelliflo Pump allows you to find the most efficient flow rate and guarantees the specified flow rate for heaters. Have you used these pumps set as Flow? Everyone else I see uses them set as Speed and they get no real benefit out of using this Pump.
I just had a new Pentair 348190 Super Flo pump installed to replace a roughly 11 to 12-year-old DuraGlass, which replaced the same model that was in place when I bought the house. They were just being discontinued but had a reputation for durability. The motor was replaced once since its installation, until that started going bad a few months ago, overheating and shutting off for 20 minutes several times a day and finally stopped altogether. I wanted to just replace the motor because the pump was working fine, but the installer said that because it overheated so much, it probably melted and warped the plastic on the pump where it connects to the motor (I did smell burning plastic every time I was near when that happened) and would likely leak when connecting a new motor, in which case the motor would be wasted expense because that motor can't be used with new model pumps. So a new pump and motor was only about 40% more expensive, and he installed the Pentair, which would fit where the other one was. The Pentair actually seems to have more noise, including a slightly high-pitched whirring sound, and the outflow pressure is about 20% less for the same settings as the DuraGlass with a Century 1 hp motor, although it should be at least the same or more pressure. After the installer left, I looked at the manual, and I noticed he had installed a 90° elbow only about an inch from the inlet opening (maybe 2 inches to the perpendicular pipe). I asked him about that and pointed out the manual says it should have at least 10 inches of straight pipe, and should not haven't 90° elbow connected to the inlet. He sent me photos of the pipe he removed from the old pump, which had a similar elbow with the bend about 2 inches away from the inlet. He felt it wouldn't make any difference as to flow or noise if it had that straight length of pipe before the inlet, but he has no problem coming back trying to get as close to 10 inches as he can. There's a custom-built, although rather dilapidated now, wooden lattice cage that goes around the pump assembly to more or less obscure it from view and perhaps protect it, as it is on the same patio deck as the pool, in front of the corner of the back of the house (they don't put them in that way now). Anyway, there's about seven and half inches more that the pipe can be extended and still fit in the cage, which would make it close to 10 inches-- Update: I didn't account for the width of the frame of the cage, so it is really be only about 5 1/2 inches that the pipe could be is extended for a total of maybe 7 inches, unless I had the cage rebuild adding a few more inches of width, or didn't use the cage, leaving the bare pump/motor and filter visible on the patio. The inflow piping is horizontal from the inflow valve, and forms a broad U shape. So adding eight more inches at the Inlet would mean adding another 8 inches on the other side of the U--about 15 or 16 inches extra pipe, if that makes any negative difference, plus, the base of the horizontal U is unsupported and would be extended further--I don't know if that's an issue with the extra weight of water and pipe. Perhaps I can ask if he can just use long sweep elbows instead for the two elbows of the bottom of the U. Any opinion on this? And why it's producing less outflow pressure than the old DuraGlass--the installer says it is because it has greater flow, but that doesn't make sense. I can feel less pressure coming out of the outflow jet, and less suction at the skimmer. He said the DuraGlass was originally designed as a sprinkler pump, but seemed to work fine in my pool, which is 34 feet long, and 15 feet wide but narrows to about 13 feet wide toward the deep end, which is 7 feet deep, and about 4 1/2 feet deep onthe side of the shallow end away from the steps-- maybe 20,000 gallons, I'm estimating. The main reason I bought the house it Is because the pool had a 34 foot lane one can do laps without one's feet touching bottom in the shallow end. Unfortunately I only swam for a few weeks in the 14.5 years I have owned the house--I need to start again.
Spot on! My pump had a short run from the manifold to the pump, causing me to replace pump twice in 4 years. After seeing your vid, I increased the run to 11” from manifold to pump and now I barely hear the pump running.
That is great - hopefully this one lasts for you!
I like your info but you should show some exemplars to make it easy for beginners like me thank you
Once had a pool store install a new pump I bought for them and the tech was going to install a elbow fitting pretty close to the intake. I mentioned this wasn't ideal and he should push back the fitting so it was around 12 inches away from the pump. He then turned to me and asked if I was a engineer at which point I said "no, I just read the install manual".
If the pump is against the wall and you have no room to move it back and have more pipe I understand. But you should always have a longer run of pipe if you can
@@teddygramz2008Even if that is the case, you can always use a long sweep curved pipe and create a new flow pattern that curves out of the way, even curving in multiple changing directions to plumb it back to the intake side of the pump and avoid the massive flow rate disruption caused by a 90 elbow right at the pumps intake. The guy he was referring to is obviously a low skill pool store employee with a self esteem / intelligence issue. You never have to settle and get stuck with no choice due to the position of the pool to the pump, or other equipment. You can always reroute around issues like this. It might look like less of a direct path to the equipment and it might appear to have some unecessary piping patterns but who cares so long as the flow rate is optimal. I can't stand easily threatened "professionals" like that. It's like a doctor who's butt hurt because you challenge their basic opinion of something that is objectively wrong and obvious even to layman.
Hello Steve I been watching a lots of your videos and they’re great. Today I was thinking what happens when child poops in the pool?
Can you make video on this or explain what is the correct way to handle
Thank you
I just watched two videos prior to this one and they both did not have a 5X pipe diameter straight run into the intake. In fact in one, you could clearly see large bubbles through the lid.
i WISH pump set ups give generous space and pipe but....9/10, so many pool set ups are so tight and you rarely have the luxury of getting so much room for pipe sadly...
Right. Come to think about it I had 1.5 to skimmer, down 45 across into pump. A guy added a second out port and adjusted to filter pump direction to line the pipes. I do have a 90 right into pump. so far the rubber coupling held 4 years. I know working with my RO setup I try to avoid 90s. So this video is a refresher on not using 90s or restrictions before and after pump. I had small 1-3 gph pumps that ran hard or hot drawi g high amps. Once removed obstruction before and after they purred cooler. Even on those pumps, just a few inches on an out port before you restrict made all the difference.
I have a 40mm fitting on the inlet side on my pump, so the reducer needs to be 12" from this. Am I able to put a pressure ball valve in-between the reducer and the pump?
Just a thought. Intex pump sucks so I will use my old filter pump, 1.5 hp and 1.5 pvc. Now, could I use the intex pump without adding holes to draw water? Maybe add a clip on skimmer to it and add a jet, shower, sprayer fountain as the out port? It probably would work like a vacuum mode be ajse the water would not be gravity assisted as the tubing would go over rail but maybe the siphon effect will assist. I am just not ready to cut into this new pool, Intex 12x24 vinyl .
Is there a rule of thumb for the type of 90's you should run?
Thanks man I thought I read that before. Glad to be re assured!
Glad to help
And the outtake??
Really only applicable to pumps without a hair and lint pot. I always use sweepers on these anyway.
Thanks for the info man keep it coming.!
Visual would help!
The manual for that new black + decker you’ve been reviewing shows 5x pipe diameter straight run as good, but a long sweep as best. How do you feel about long sweeps?
Long sweeps are great. I always thought the straight run was the most optimal. Hard to imagine why any bend would be preferable to a straight run. In any case, I would say both are good.
What a load of toss more horizontal plumbing more chance of air locks.
Pool Pump Manufacturer 35+yrs repaired over 40,000 pumps.
In the past 35 years have you read the installation manual for any of these pumps you are installing. They ALL say exactly what I have said right here about having at least 5x the pipe diameter in a straight run in front of the pump. It is not enough to call into your job for 35 years. You should aim to improve your quality every year, and this one is black and white right in the installation manual from the pump manufacturer. Thanks for commenting.
Is it recommended to have a length of straight run prior to a bend on the return line to the pool as well or is it just for the inlet from the pool?
I should’ve been a little bit more clear. I meant as in a straight run out of the filter before I place any bends back to the pool.
How much would you charge for classes one to one ?
It depends on your situation whether you are a pool owner or a pool professional. Either way you can read about my consulting services here: www.swimmingpoolsteve.com/pages/ask-steve.html
@@Swimmingpoolsteve 🏆
Show some pics
Thanks.
Hi Steve:
What you are saying here is massively important for Pumps Without Leaf Baskets where the cavitation from the elbow or string of elbows fires right into the centre of the impellor, the longer the better. But of course you would only use these pumps below water level.
If they have Leaf Baskets for use above water level I use Sweep Bends. The Lint Basket negates the need for extra lead in pipe. I have had no issues in 30 years. As there is no cavitation from Sweepers It's hard to tell if there is water in the pump basket. These days I only use Pentair Intelliflo 2 VSF pumps now and set them for 10 cubic metres per hour when installed on a new pool that I have plumbed from scratch using as many sweep bends as possible where required. I will pull about 500 watts with a Multicyclone, Sand Filter, heater and ozone sanitation installed. which is the optimum flow rate for Filtration, Heating and effective Skimming, basically equal to an old school 1 Hp pump.
If I increase the flow rate to 11 cubic metres per hour it will pull about 1000Watts.
The Intelliflo Pump allows you to find the most efficient flow rate and guarantees the specified flow rate for heaters.
Have you used these pumps set as Flow?
Everyone else I see uses them set as Speed and they get no real benefit out of using this Pump.
I just had a new Pentair 348190 Super Flo pump installed to replace a roughly 11 to 12-year-old DuraGlass, which replaced the same model that was in place when I bought the house. They were just being discontinued but had a reputation for durability. The motor was replaced once since its installation, until that started going bad a few months ago, overheating and shutting off for 20 minutes several times a day and finally stopped altogether. I wanted to just replace the motor because the pump was working fine, but the installer said that because it overheated so much, it probably melted and warped the plastic on the pump where it connects to the motor (I did smell burning plastic every time I was near when that happened) and would likely leak when connecting a new motor, in which case the motor would be wasted expense because that motor can't be used with new model pumps. So a new pump and motor was only about 40% more expensive, and he installed the Pentair, which would fit where the other one was. The Pentair actually seems to have more noise, including a slightly high-pitched whirring sound, and the outflow pressure is about 20% less for the same settings as the DuraGlass with a Century 1 hp motor, although it should be at least the same or more pressure. After the installer left, I looked at the manual, and I noticed he had installed a 90° elbow only about an inch from the inlet opening (maybe 2 inches to the perpendicular pipe). I asked him about that and pointed out the manual says it should have at least 10 inches of straight pipe, and should not haven't 90° elbow connected to the inlet. He sent me photos of the pipe he removed from the old pump, which had a similar elbow with the bend about 2 inches away from the inlet. He felt it wouldn't make any difference as to flow or noise if it had that straight length of pipe before the inlet, but he has no problem coming back trying to get as close to 10 inches as he can. There's a custom-built, although rather dilapidated now, wooden lattice cage that goes around the pump assembly to more or less obscure it from view and perhaps protect it, as it is on the same patio deck as the pool, in front of the corner of the back of the house (they don't put them in that way now). Anyway, there's about seven and half inches more that the pipe can be extended and still fit in the cage, which would make it close to 10 inches-- Update: I didn't account for the width of the frame of the cage, so it is really be only about 5 1/2 inches that the pipe could be is extended for a total of maybe 7 inches, unless I had the cage rebuild adding a few more inches of width, or didn't use the cage, leaving the bare pump/motor and filter visible on the patio. The inflow piping is horizontal from the inflow valve, and forms a broad U shape. So adding eight more inches at the Inlet would mean adding another 8 inches on the other side of the U--about 15 or 16 inches extra pipe, if that makes any negative difference, plus, the base of the horizontal U is unsupported and would be extended further--I don't know if that's an issue with the extra weight of water and pipe. Perhaps I can ask if he can just use long sweep elbows instead for the two elbows of the bottom of the U. Any opinion on this? And why it's producing less outflow pressure than the old DuraGlass--the installer says it is because it has greater flow, but that doesn't make sense. I can feel less pressure coming out of the outflow jet, and less suction at the skimmer. He said the DuraGlass was originally designed as a sprinkler pump, but seemed to work fine in my pool, which is 34 feet long, and 15 feet wide but narrows to about 13 feet wide toward the deep end, which is 7 feet deep, and about 4 1/2 feet deep onthe side of the shallow end away from the steps-- maybe 20,000 gallons, I'm estimating. The main reason I bought the house it Is because the pool had a 34 foot lane one can do laps without one's feet touching bottom in the shallow end. Unfortunately I only swam for a few weeks in the 14.5 years I have owned the house--I need to start again.
Thanks for the info