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Yeah, cowboy bebop was absolutely awesome. Mostly it explores themes of sins of the past. And deals with the idea of "we are who we are" and the idea that if you leave unfinished business it'll come back to bite you in the ass. And how you can't escape your past or deny who you are. They did absolutely butcher fay valentine though. In the live action she's a badass main powerhouse. In the anime she's a fuck up who's drowning in debt. Her back story is less tragic than it is farcical. She joins jet and spike because fuck it, why not.
Your closing thought on "trying to make it in the first place" were my own sentiments from the moment I heard they were making a live action Cowboy Bebop. Much like Heathers (1988) and Fame (1980), Cowboy Bebop was perfectly awesome as is. Never needed any sort of remake nor reboot. All the woke shit did was exacerbate what was doomed to fail from jump.
"But unfortunately ther is only so much we human actors can do" is basically the line that makes me think WHY do people make live action adaptations of animated movies/shows. With animation you can do so much, show so much more than live action. Even if you go through the Herculean task of making a "good" adaptation there is still going to be magic that is lost with the switch. I'm looking at YOU Disney remakes.
One anime that i think has real potential in live action, if done properly, is Attack on Titan. That 3D maneuvaribility gear would look incredibly in live action if they did it right. If they could make the physics look realistic it would be a stomach-dropping, vertigo-inducing spectacle. Also practical effects titans (kinda like the old godzilla) have a lot of potential to be even creepier and more unsettling.
The excellent Rurouni Kenshin live-action movies, proved that you totally can make a good live-action Anime, IF you actually know what you're doing and have respect for the source material. 2 things that are completely missing from current day Hollyweird.
I think the biggest loss here is for John Cho. The man watched the entire original, fell in love with it, battled on set to ensure that Spike's iconic Jericho would be used, got the original composer involved, and tried his genuine best to represent Spike with the script he was given. And all off his efforts went down the drain because your average fanfic writer could create a better script then Netflix could.
Forreal. Why do they keep hiring these people? It's obvious they were fated to serve coffees. Instead they gotta do millions of dollars worth of damage.
Pretty much the reason why manga is dominating the comic book industry. Nobody wants to see Gay Superboy protest or Captain America say he benefits from white privilege, we want to be entertained.
@@cytorakdemon Exactly. And in the case of "sexing down" characters like Faye, who the heck wants to buy something they were expressly told they shouldn't be looking at? I mean, sure, not every female needs to be about sex appeal, but a protagonist should at least try to be pleasant in some way. Nobody wants the angsty victimhood finger waving that dominates things like Captain Marvel or basically all of modern Star Trek. Being lectured about how bad your culture is isn't entertaining, funny that.
@@cytorakdemon or have the x men murder innocent people just because a sea turtle choked on a plastic bag. Yes this is real and I ain't making this up.
@@Hypershell And they didn't even "sex down" Faye at all. Faye is shown naked with another woman after a lesbian encounter (yeah, nothing's showing, but Faye's blanket is about three millimeters from nipple flashing), and they put her in the red dress that Faye--in the anime--Gainaxes hard with.
"It's not made by you." Nailed it. According to the internet, Faye was only 5'6" anyway, so she just further proved she knew fuck all about the 'source material'. I can't stand these people that take on established franchises/characters to further their own career, that have absolutely no respect for the creation in the first place.
Yeah, its like she's never seen Faye before. She's sexy as hell, but, like, pretty realistically so. She's basically the poster child for "The woman doesn't need to have beach balls attached to her chest and bottom to be sexy". Not to say she doesn't have curves or anything, but she isn't exactly a High School DxD character. Its also not like she can benchpress a mountain, so its not one of those "You can't be that fit and have tits that big" situation. She has big boobs but like, modestly big. Not implant big or "I used to weigh 500 pounds and had them suck the fat out of me except the boobs" big. She's got good makeup, good skin (surprisingly so for being basically a chain smoker...but she is pretty young, so...), good style that all just take her to another level.
C-Drinker likes to point-and-laugh, but honestly, it kinda fills me with real bad emotions to think they are the greatest Clowns and just dont know. Chris Chibnal for example HAS already gone-down in History as one of the Worst Content-Creators in all of History (which is impressive seeing how much Content exists), but if you ask them, YOU KNOW he would brag. He would. He and Kennedy and Others genuinly think they are absolutely Amazing.
"they couldn`t find a woman that looks like her, its impossible" Then watch people spam almost 100% look-a-like cosplayers with the right clothing and style.
Was a little irritating to me. It's like they purposely cast people that don't look like the characters. Not even just Faye. At least the guys were cool about it though.
then you would be complaining that they hired a shitty cosplayer instead of a trained actress. This project was never going to succeed. There is no way a live-action was ever going to live up to expectations.
@@ElizabethD33 There are actresses who look like Faye. Hell, most of them do, she's pretty much the average chick in proportions and height. The outfit has to look correct, and the actress has to have enough brain power to not start ranting at the fanbase online. It's not hard to accomplish.
Not only did Daniella’s video backfire with the cancellation of the show, it unmasked her hypocrisy because of people bringing up pictures of her doing movies with a lot of revealing clothing.
Quick counterpoint: the issue isnt so much about nudity/revealing clothes. The issue is about Fayes anime body. Secondary to that issue yes is its weird to have a female character doing everything in two ounces of yellow vinyl.
@@MonkeyHero What is this "everything"? Faye doesn't have a hand-to-hand fight scene every episode. There's only 2 times she has a hand-to-hand fight and it only lasts a few seconds. Faye is the type of character who uses her charm to get out of tight spots and when that doesn't work she uses guns or her ship. So, why is everyone acting like she's Bruce Lee all of a sudden? I can sympathize with a constricting outfit, sure, but Faye is supposed to be feminine. Because god forbid women can be strong AND feminine in this era.
Not just revealing she did all sorts of stunts in it and literally lied that it would be physically impossible. Funny that she made it in the past but when it is about something beloved for fans they can't help themselves but go out of their way to shit on at least half of their fanbase.
I love the whole trope of "unrealistic body standards" in regards to Faye's difference in appearance, but there's literal dozens if not hundreds of amazing cosplays of Faye that look exactly like her. They chose not to choose an "overtly sexualized" Faye, not that it wasn't possible.
yeh exactly... and then she stupidly attacked the fan base... the pineda effect...lol and instead of wearing something similar to the outfit she wore i the anime she wore a suit... a friggin suit.... how more boring and annoying can you get ? i hope she never acts in anything ever again...... i think she was the major reason why the show didn't get a second season....
As far as body type goes I think a lot of people would have ignored a smaller chest if the actress was the same height. And that wouldn’t have been to hard to find an actress. But nope they just didn’t try.
Yeah... you could have picked any 'adult' movie star with the right hair color and they would have been good to go. The ability to act would be nice but even one without talent could do a better Faye just by actually caring about doing a good job.
The most funny thing about this is the fact that original Cowboy Bebop was written by a woman, Keiko Nobumoto. And she worked on 4 good anime series after it.
And she just passed away a couple of weeks ago of esophageal cancer :'(. Too bad this woke Netflix garbage was the last "tribute" to her legacy that she lived to see.
@@falldiifadliifadill Uhh. . . it's the highest rated anime of all time on a single website (MAL), which means absolutely nothing. Not to mention that the only reason it hasn't technically been dethroned on the website is that idiots spam 1-star ratings on any anime that would overtake it. Don't get me wrong, mighty great piece of work but people need to stop this dick-swinging about FMA being the unequivocally greatest anime of all time.
I’ll say this again and again. Faye’s original outfit was designed with the idea that she uses her sex appeal to distract and divert from her real self. It is a shell to protect how empty she is as a person. If she can keep everyone looking at her face and not into her as a person she can continue to ignore it too. It is what makes her stick with the bebop crew in the first place other than the money. They don’t see her for her sex appeal but they also leave her past alone. They are the closest thing to a family she could ever actually have. And it is all because, just like her, they don’t want to revisit the past either. They also don’t want people digging too deep. And as an entire crew, they tend to focus more on the now and the day to day so they can leave their histories behind.
Agreed. While I feel the practical reason for her attire is to distract men using her sexuality, I would agree that the metaphorical reason is her internal emptiness; she projects her physical looks to make up for the fact that she feels no value on the inside which is another aspect the Netflix adaption gets wrong; Faye is an utterly tragic character. But Millennial writers don't get these things. Theme, metaphor, subtext, and visual cues and imagery go over their head. They just don't understand. Because of their wacko ideology and agenda all they see if the physical appearance or text of a thing. Faye dresses scantily = she must exist just for men to fap to and objectify Instead of: Faye dresses scantily = she works in a cruel, harsh environment...wonder is she has a reason for dressing like this? Or, I wonder if there any cues in her backstory that explain why she would dress like this?
A bit of morbid irony, the notoriety of how bad this adaptation is has overshadowed the fact that Keiko Nobumoto, the screenwriter for Cowboy Bebop, passed away on the first of December. Rest in peace.
@@EverythingMustG0 Honestly, I have a feeling that if she did see the live action show, she'd rest assured knowing that since it was so radically different from her creation that her fans love for the original wouldnt be shaken. But who knows, that's just me being hopeful.
As an old Cowboy Bebop fan, I feel like you missed the key things that ruined it for Fandom. #1. There was no bebop. No jazz. No soul. It's amazing how much of the anime was developed and scenes specifically written for the music. They had the chance to bring in incredible music and film scenes around it but just didn't. Why is the ship called the Bebop? Because they had to in a way to work in that It's a jazzy space cowboy action dramedy western that leaves you feeling melancholy. It just worked as a glue for the episodes. #2. Jets story. It was nice seeing Jet as a dad, but that is the opposite of what made his character great. He was a lone wolf even when he had Spike. The Black Dog that wouldn't let go once he sank his teeth into something. He has a dark history as a cop who becomes a bounty hunter after losing his job, arm, and lover. He barely has any personal connections left and that's why he needs Spike. Jet also loved jazz and that's the "real reason" the ship is the Bebop lol. Great actor though. With a different script, he would have killed it. Hard yet likeable. #3. The Main Story of Spikes background should be the backstory/ending. In the anime you grew invested trying to figure out who he is/was and by the end, you felt shaken. You needed to rewatch it to pick up things. After you rewatched it, you watch it again later, sometimes just for the audio/soundtrack. The whole main show feels like it's missing and yet overdeveloped. That's how I feel after watching the original Cowboy Bebop countless times since it was released (thank you early 2000's NYC Chinatown bootleg discount video stores for the $30 DVD collection of this, Trigun, and Outlaw Star). Thanks for your time if you read this.
Josh - I couldn't agree more with your comment about the music. Yoko Kano, the composer of pretty much all of it, is totally brilliant. Besides writing the excellent jazz, she can fuse any two types of music and come up with something great. I bought the CD's as soon as they came out. There are wonderful melodies she includes almost as throw-aways that that could be made into top ten hits.
I agree with everything you said and would add a couple things. 1) The writers...they ruined all the characters... All of them. I was explaining to my wife to that both Vicious and Julia, in the original anime, were like Ghosts; they were ever present throughout the series but we hardly even actually saw them or even learned much about them except the impact they have on Spike. Additional to that, but when we do meet Vicious... He's an ominous, scary mother fucker. Vicious and Julia both, in the live action are given way too much screen time and they're both horrible. 3) Exposition. The original anime let the visuals tell the story much of the time, letting the viewer's mind go nuts trying to put it all together and figure it all out. The live action let's the viewer be completely lazy... They even have a backstory for the fucking rose.
Important note: Someone not only approved this, but also written the script, gather a cast to participate in it and nobody questioned it, or even spoke up about it. Someone in Netflix really has to speak up against this because that’s how proper staff and management works.
They don't like appealing to men. They do like appealing to nonces. It's actually not hypocrisy, just dislike of the nuclear family and the 'patriarch' within that framework. They sow chaos on that front to gain psychological power over other people's children.
I need to point this out, Netflix's Witcher for me also suffer the same "woke" treatment just like Cowboy Bebop, but the fans still hang around because of Cavill's darling attitude towards the whole series as well as the fans. He also paid homage to the ultra-popular video game through his gruff voice which is similar to video game Geralt and he stroll around the set like a walking Witcher novels wikipage. Humility, that's one fatal thing missing from Netflix's Cowboy Bebop. At least that's my take that nobody asked for.
A part of Witcher's appeal (books and game) is the geography and culture which is European and medieval fantasy based. That particular culture and look is unique. The show strips all that and substitutes its own aesthetic which is "otherworldly" and generic. It does not honor or maintain the original creators vision and is thus much worse for it.
To add to that, they did change a major character and several support roles to other races but it didn't hinder the story as they did a decent job being those characters. Most notably Triss who is supposed to be a white red head in every medium presented thus far, but they chose someone different. She was more/less forgetable character as she wasn't in the story but it didn't hinder the story because of it. Much like some european based towns(the setting of witcher story as a whole) having asian/black actors in it. Again it didn't do the in your face diversify to diversify that other movies/shows do so I didn't notice it until an article pointed it out. There's ways to have other actors play roles that they don't match the source material if the story is done well and compensates for any changes done. Even my first looks of Cowboy Bebop I knew it was going to fail. As it failed to capture the same look/feel as the anime did. Netflix has been hit/miss with its anime to live action adaptations. I will say the Bleach one has by far the best adaptation to it as it only did minimal changes with the story but had the look/feel of it.
They're missing the point with the Faye controversy. When they see Faye in the anime, they're only see her outfit and outward flirtatiousness. They fail to see that she's uses her femininity as a weapon to manipulate people. She's tough yes, but her attacks are a defense mechanism. There is a deeper layer of vulnerability, mistrust, a fear of being betrayed by the world. The problem is not that they don't get the outfit right, the problem is that theyre so fixated on Faye's sexuality that they fail to see who she is underneath. Fans tried to to tell them that and they responded by strawmanning us, which tells you they are not only lost but ignorant too. We got a callous and bitchy character instead of an intelligent, multifaceted one.
That,s the important topic - missing the core of what makes characters great. Imagine someone who read Preacher and thinks " Hey this irish vampire swears a lot and drinks booze, that,s why he is great character".
The writers involved seemed to have misunderstood that everything on the surface levels of Faye is a sham. She exudes confidence, sexuality, and all the other aspects of a classic femme fatale, but that's not who she really is. Its a veneer, used as her defense mechanism given her specific circumstances. She's a really complex and wonderfully written character, arguably the deepest in the entire franchise, but instead they threw it all out and made just made her gruff and sassy. Maybe season 2 would have gotten there, but I doubt it. The live-action lost the nuanced shift in tone that the anime had, as when her second appearance in the anime unravels most of the first surface layer persona to reveal the desperate, sassy, selfish, and guarded *second* fake persona.
@@ryllharu Chances are good that the writers didn't watch the anime before starting the project and were only skimming it. Might have just referenced some written summaries. I sorely doubt they noticed the depth and nuance in the first place because they probably didn't ever watch it for the experience as an audience would.
even if you just look at their "fighting style", Faye is less of a melee person, she is a good shoot. Jet is a power brawler and Spike is the kung-fu master, did they get that right in the show? Not really. On top of the fighting skills, Faye is the con-artist, Jet is the master mechanic and ex-cop, Spike is the sleight-of-hand pickpocket. Did the Netflix team gets that? Nope. All they care about, is bitching about how fans are disrespectful to THE MESSAGE
To the actress- we aren't necessarily complaining about your looks... or how you aren't physically like Faye. The bigger letdown is how the true character, demeanor, values, and the niche personality of who Faye is- That was missing. No matter how similar you may look like the character, if one cannot embody the true essence of the character, then it is something else that the anime does not portray. On a side note, I think John Cho did an amazing job portraying the true essence of Spike. But the defilement of the production of this series ruined his character, and the whole series. But that's just my humble opinion.
yeh the faye character was a disappointment..... i could live with her costumes and acting but NOT her outbursts (I never watched em but the reactions from fans was priceless... stupid is as stupid does I guess)
Though I get you, the actress still could have been reacting to people complaining about her looks. You know, people are mean. So even if your opinion as a fan could be from constructive cristicism point of view, rather calm, not heated, you are saying: "WE aren't necessarily complaining about your looks". You're not, and bunch of people also not, but she could have gotten tons of messages, that could have been aggresive, low and superficial. That "we" could be quite a broad concept, if you understand what I'm saying. Btw the actress is beautiful.
@@TheTolister het looks are subjective you think she is beautiful I think she is below average, and no nothing really justifys fueling the toxicity when she could’ve been a bigger person and not respond. Yes “she can” but she doesn’t have to.
@@qucciretknoops824 I'm not judging her you know. Also I'm not saying that how she responded was right. We should just look at ourselves and not be so critical even about someone who is critical, and of course realize how people can be mean and judging by the looks. And that the "we" can mean a lot of things: the constructive criticism, also just people trying to be hurtful.
@@jon636374 Same. Ive watched it for two decades now since I was a wee lad, back when bebop aired on TV. These days its honestly amazing how good some of these shows and writing are. Like drinker said, Japan doesnt give two shits about activists and they just do whatever they want which is why it can produce such amazing content
I’ve hated Daniella Pineda since Fallen Kingdom. The “I’m a perfect human woman with no flaws and I intimidate the men with my bitchy attitude” or as one of the other characters called her “a nasty woman”
I’ll never understand the need to “fix” Faye. What exactly is there not to like about her? She’s brave. She’s charismatic. She’s smart as hell and is dangerous. Her choice of clothing and her choice of makeup is on purpose. She uses the fact that she’s drop dead gorgeous as a way to bring her targets to their knees. It’s an incredibly smart tactic that serves her well in her line of work. She’s an incredible character. This one? I can somewhat understand that the costume may not be right for certain practicality in major fight scenes but that’s not a good enough reason. Her feminine wiles are what she uses as a bounty Hunter. You may not like it, but that’s what the writer wanted.
"the costume may not be right for certain practically in major fight scenes" That's the thing, she's rarely ever active in almost all of the action scenes in the show. She can't beat down people like spike or jet, it's why she went with she could actually use and used shock and persuasion to get the drop on people. Even in the finale she wasn't moving much despite everything that was going on which is why i'll always call bullshit when her outfits brought up.
In fairness, what looks good on *cartoon characters* doesn't always look good on *live actors* and vice versa. That said, Pineda's *attitude* and *man hating* was totally uncalled for! There were a million other ways that she could've gotten her point across. For instance, remember the original X-Men movie? LOGAN: You actually go outside in these things? SCOTT: Well, what would you prefer, *yellow spandex* ?
@@grantorino2325 And I get the whole thing behind the costume. But you can absolutely create something that's true to the character and help the actor move during fight scenes.
I like how the actress who played Faye said there aren’t any top heavy, tall, slim (and can act) Chinese women out there. I know I’ve seen them IRL. I’ll go away now.
Fayes treatment alone reveals how little they understood the characters prior to making this shit show. Faye is a classic example of a femme fatale, a trope in which a woman is badass, good looking and uses her skills and charms to get what she wants, mostly by manipulating men who are dumbfounded by their charm. She was even directly inspired by the most legendary femme fatale in anime, Fujiko Mine. So her having a revealing outfit and flirty personality is integral to her character. By giving her a generic concealing outfit, changing her build, turning her lesbian and having her act like a 14 year old who thinks putting the word fuck in front of every sentence is cool, you haven't "updated the character for modern audiences", you've created a completely different character all together! It's so ironic that their attempt to "modernize" a character who was an icon that could defend her self on her own, outsmarted almost all the men she encountered and who weaponised her charm to achieve her goals consisted of striping her off of everything that made her so cool and empowering in the first place. Cause having a character be an unattractive slob who acts like a toddler is apparently what's empowering nowadays...
i had watched (a few times when released) and actually enjoyed the adaptation as i was desperate for anything cowboy bebop... but yeah there was so much wrong with the faye character ... that reminded me how much it sucked...sigh.... i tried... i honestly tried and when i watched it shut down my brain...lol.... as powerbite says... 100% agree....
Faye’s sexuality was never overtly brought up in the anime why was it brought up in the live action? That’s something I can’t get over. Studios these days HAVE to have an LGBTQ+ token character in everything they put out and it’s getting obnoxious. I have nothing against LGBTQ+ people or community but studios changing a character or making the sexuality obvious for no other reason than to say “This is our LGBTQ+ character! Look at us!” irks me to no end. Does it move the story along? No? Then why do we need it? (I feel the same for gratuitous sex in hetero relations too so don’t hate message me.)
Faye's costume was intentional in the Anime. She used her feminine wilds to lure in unsuspecting bounties. So yes, it was very much designed for the Male gaze. But as a means of making her job easier.
It's a legit theory, which would make total sense except the show suggests she's more of an odd-job drifter, who now does bounty hunting so much because with the Bebop crew around it's easier. Yet she wore that attention-getting outfit when we first saw her and she was actually _on the lam._
@@CerpinTxt87 Whoa! Reign it in... or at least try. That comment I responded to was hardly that of a rabidly intense poster. It was actually one of the most neutral and mild ones I saw here. It showed no loudmouthed sociopolitics, excessive emotion or detectable slant behind the opinion, and used logic that didn't require a sympathetic reader to make any sense. To see it was refreshing, and that person should be encouraged to keep that approach. *A big part of the problem here* was that both old-school fans and those involved in making the new show got so intensely emotional and bitter that their fighting eventually became not a means unto an end, but it's own end. If everyone hadn't been so damn truculent and stubborn, just maybe it all could've been salvaged.
@@henrysokol3466 Her modus operandi was to look out for number one. Due to her experience when she first woke up. And if she had to take advantage of a few stupid guys to do it. So be it.
"She used her feminine wilds to lure in unsuspecting bounties. So yes, it was very much designed for the Male gaze. But as a means of making her job easier." But you see, that's an explaination that actually requires to at least spend 5 seconds to get informed about the character, instead of just looking at it and making assumptions.
"The art generally comes before the politics." This is one of the reasons I love anime. I want to use entertainment to briefly escape from our terrible reality, but it has become increasingly difficult to find movies and video games that don't try to force some heavy-handed political message. Anime is pretty much the only hobby I have left that I can simply enjoy without having to worry about "the message" being thrown in my face every five seconds.
I know what you're getting at, but Cowboy Bebop is pretty political, especially for the time. I guess it isn't "woke", but it's still progressive and pretty unwavering in its message. I do not understand what the art is supposed to be without the message it is trying to send. Isn't that the point?
@@pawa4869 There certainly are anime with political messages, but they don't tend to be nearly as obnoxious in how they portray those messages as most western media is. There's nothing wrong with having a message, but there are more types of messages than just those of western politics, and it's quite possible to have a message without getting political.
@@Shinigami41395 I do see what you mean, but I think the reason is that poorly thought out media in general won't have a well-done message. In Japan, that means it has basically no message (the majority of anime that gets ignored). Here, they usually butcher progressive politics as a cheap way to imitate having a message. I'm not disagreeing, to be clear, I just think it's important to note that we're comparing the best shows/films of Japan with the worst shows/films of the West.
@@pawa4869 In my experience, anime with poorly done messages tend to just be generic "power of friendship" shlock, with a few exceptions. As cringy as that can be, I still prefer it over heavy-handed political messages in bad western media. So even when comparing the worst of both, I still find bad anime more tolerable. Admittedly, this is just my personal taste.
Faye Valentine is 5'6ft(168 cm), her cup size is C, and the reason why she wore that outfit is because she used her appeal to her advantage. They could've easily found someone that looks exactly or close to Faye, but wokewood simply won't let women be sexy anymore.
I already put in an application for "body measurement expert" and am currently searching for the correct Faye specs.... ("stop screaming - I'm just doin' my job ma'am")
@@kosmosfan01 Yup that was brought up to her when she made that dumb video about how they couldn't find the right female to play that. In other words, they didn't want to.
What about Olympic Athletes? They are gorgeous, tall, wear something like a swimsuit and yet, they manage to do what most of mortals wouldn't be able to do throughout our whole lives.
It makes you wonder how the actress got the role in the first place if she couldn’t pull off the look of the character. Nepotism? Politics? Sexual favors? What possible reason did that woman get that job?
@@Ancientreapers Yeah, the whole situation just screams that they didn't want to put the effor there but yet Spike and Jet look pretty close from what I saw. I could be wrong though.
my dad, who has NEVER watched a day of anime in his life watched Ep1 of the Live-Action and the Anime side by side and his exact words "Why would they even bother doing this live action?" He then went on to watch the entire anime series on his own and raved about it.
good on him.... yeh the live action sucked the big one but i was so desperate to see any more cowboy bebop i watched the whole remake thing (i turned my brain off and enjoyed it... watched it a couple of times... yeh didn't hold a candle to the anime but ... at least it was something... a bit disappointed it was canned... but then again .. it gave me a serious laugh.. i think drinker got more views than the bebop live netwflix one got...lol)
@@worsethanhitlerpt.2539 i know... i expected them to copy the anime to the T but was glad they didn't .... as you said enjoyed both (well loved the anime... and enjoyed the live action..) and it was nicely unpredictable as not the exact same...
That costume designer's answer to fayes costume is the reason why it bombed. Fayes clothing is a reflection of her character. She is a beautiful sexy woman, and she uses those assets as a means to get her way. She is a con woman, she dresses provocative because she knows she will get a reaction out of men. All that answer demonstrated is how little they know about the show. And faye didnt fight. She used her wits and deceit and firearms. She was also a complex and tragic character like the rest of the cast, not just a bombshell to appease male audiences. Complete and utter disrespect, for both the original art and the fanbase.
Exactly. They got Margot Robbie to dress like Harley Quinn, but this production team didn’t want to go there. If you are overly PC and timid, then stay away from anime. The Japanese don’t give two shits about offending anyone with their stories, and why should they, or anyone else for that matter. If you haven’t got the balls to tell a story how it needs to be told, then you’ve chosen the wrong career. Go become an accountant or something.
According to the Cowboy Bebop wiki, Faye is 5 foot 6. Asian women are typically shorter on average than American women. Daniella is only an inch shorter.
@@Ryan_Thompson_Guitarist but she weighed 15kgs heavier than Faye 💡 I’m not here to care about her appropriate casting or not. I am here to say that’s not my problem. Jet was bigger - those guys exist. Spiku is a bit tougher, power at 6’ requires more mass than 75kg 😂
@@Ryan_Thompson_Guitarist Proving her insecurities are even more ridiculous than I first thought. So now she's just mad about having smaller boobs, got it.
The actress's criticism was way off. The lineup image in the show has Faye at 5' 6". She has C cups, and a violin figure. This is far from impossible to find in Hollywood. The real difference is how they had her act and appear. You can find far more impractical outfits on female pro wrestlers who do much more physically demanding work, so that is no excuse. Faye is a multifaceted character, who uses her femininity as a deadly weapon. The show just had her as a conservatively dressed shallow spaz with near zero sex appeal.
I was confused by the height statement in particular as I thought of that same "police lineup" picture. Maybe she was purposely exaggerating, although I don't know why. Agreed that the real issue is the change in how the character acts/behaves.
@@Rannos22 true - and by the way, fun fact, Spike Spiegel would technically be german dude ^^ ( Spiegel is a German family name, it means "mirror" in english )
@@fumomofumosarum5893 You do realise that this issnt his real name? oO And no one in Germany names his Son Spike. Any more dumb things you wanna call facts?
The actress goes on about how the character is "six foot" but that's categorically false. She's supposed to be 5'6", so the actress is only one inch too short. That's one of the things that really made her rant bad, she was either lying to try to make the criticisms sound unreasonable, or she was displaying her outright ignorance of the source material for the character she was playing.
The tallest woman that I could remember was Loki’s daughter Hela in Hulk VS directed by Sam Liu and Frank Paur. Thor is around 6’4” and he barely comes up to her hips. But yeah this actresses is not only uncultured, but she’s over exaggerating like do you have any idea how tall a 6 foot person is in real life? A lot of superheroes usually tend to be around 6 feet tall, or taller.
@@stevenc2149 Faye doesn't have double ds. She's just not fat like Daniella, so her bust looks bigger than it actually is. She canonically doesn't have double ds at all. Dani is probably thin by American standards, but Faye's build isn't that out there at all by Japanese standards. Even though is Faye is Chinese. All of those East Asian nations generally have a similar thin build though.
lol.. well said!!!! i had watched the original years ago...and was desperate for more.. this live thing was ok i guess as i was more forgiving as at least it was something... that last episode showing ed...wow... so very very glad they cancelled this..... that was painful.....
I watched the original anime on Netflix a month before the Netflix adaptation and man, the original anime is so good with catchy soundtracks, lovable characters, the atmosphere and the actions.
I identify as a cowboy, my pronouns are Be/Bop, and I give my skips a trigger warning before I apprehend them. You're gonna carry that weight...because you're plus size and you practice body positivity! 🤌🤌🤌 "See you, space cowboy" is too exclusive! How about "see you, space cowperson" instead?
I love how that one writer compared the cancellation to shutting down a restaurant just because you personally didn't like one meal. Bruh, this is the equivalent of going to a restaurant and as you're sitting down, the staff hands you a meal --even though you haven't even thought of ordering yet, the meal is awful when you do eat it, and on top of that, the staff moralizing at you and being passive-aggressive about your discomfort the whole time. The rejection is well-deserved.
It's like going to an imitation restaurant built inside a husk of another. "Sorry, is this still a McDonald's?" "Technically yes, but we don't have any of the original recipes or suppliers. We're gluten free though!"
Its like being an Uber eats driver and taking an order you were already hesitant towards and then pretty soon you're on the crime scene of the movie "the human centipede" and now you're being served the meal that you never even ordered....through an assholes assholes asshole.
To be perfectly honest the only way to kill a show, particularly one where you're reviving an older property that many people loved, is tell the fans you're going to "fix" it.
What did it for me was how they gutted the characters. Anime Spike is a quick talking, fast thinker, who is tormented by his past, tries to improve himself, and doesn't kill people unless he doesn't have a choice or they're really REALLY bad guys. He usually even spares people that try to kill him because he doesn't want their deaths on his conscience. Netflix Spike straight up executes people with a big smile on his face. He's a literal psychopath.
Going say you got a major point wrong. Litterally 1000s of Cosplayers have successfully excuted Faye's costume. Including fairly complex maunvers. Anyone with martial arts training will tell you tight leather is not a better action scene option. I was willing to give it a un hopeful chance until Danniela dropped her "we hate the fans" video then it became a hard nope
Also, even if a costume is unpractical or uncomfortable to wear... as a professional, you MAKE it WORK. The excuses they gave were as whiney and shallow as it gets.
its impractical to fight in such costume, who would walk in this and hunt bounties...what if its cold on the planet where you're going....it just makes no sense in the real world...anyways the new costume was fine, it had the colors and the shapes from the original.
I'm confused by the actress's non-apology for not being 6 feet tall. Peter Jackson didn't scour the world for 3 foot tall actors to play the hobbits in Lord of the Rings. If they had wanted to portray her character as being a particular height, they could have done it. That is literally a movie-maker's job.
Gets even better, Faye is actually 1 inch taller than the actress is. She's a set of shoe inserts away from being the right height. Also Faye is a C cup. And the outfit which is way too flimsy? She wore less in a previous movie.
@@ArkriteTheMad Probably important to remember that cup sizes in anime are about as consistent and accurate as your average twitter warriors political beliefs, but in general, yeah, outfit probably could have been better, and height was really fine.
one more thing. the original creator, sinichiro watanabe, gave them his criticism. and said something along the lines of "I pray and hope they listen. if you don't like it tell them." they completely brushed off a legend in anime for their own BS.
I fuckin knew it. I smelled BS when they said the creator signed off on this. More like he signed the check they gave him then they ignored his feedback.
How the fuck did they even get his property in the first place if he was so against it? Which he should be, because look at how they massacred his boy.
@@jase276 probably it wasn't clear at the beginning how much they massacred it. You have to be in the production to see the damage. And that happens after the ink is set. They did the same BS with George Lucas and so many others who put their trust into them.
@@jase276 because he sold it, you cannot stop someone from making something even if you disagree with the final product after you sell that portion of your ip.
I love how the first thing they always do is blame the fans... I happy to see that the Sonic movie producers actually listened to its fanbase, can't wait to see the second one!
To be fair, it's also a bit easier to make a fun comedy that's a bit ridiculous in that you can suspend your sense of reality and disbelief compared to a sci-fi space drama where the story really needs to be good to being the drama. Fun comedy is easy to get into because you can turn your brain off at times. Drama requires you to know what's going on/the story in order to really get into it.
Yeah, both of the Sonic movies are good as its best. Even though the second movie's plot in the middle has that long ass wedding scene, at least they know how to entertain people.
@@Ozzianman so... you're telling me that with out evidence you believe that they hired a full animator team, did a full length ad, animated a skeleton for a sonic that never was for... Psy ops. Okay dude. I have a hard time believing that is the case. If you had hard facts or some good examples of this I would be more inclined to believe you.
A few thoughts: 1) Casting was all over the place. John Cho was fine but clearly not given enough direction, Mustafa nailed the voice and clearly cared about his character, Daniela was so miscast and didn't have any idea what Faye was actually about, and Ed was just awful. 2) set design looked very cheap, in addition to fight scenes being choreographed awfully it just looked like a low budget fan film all the way to the costumes. 3) Mustafa's response on Insta shows how to respond to a cancellation and shows he's got a better character than that Daniela and that woke director. Overall, this show never needed to be made and it was made by people who had little to no respect for the original and the messages it tried to convey.
@@mahguvnah7403 You don't, some things don't translate well from anime to real life. As was seen in this attempt. It's like that cringe kid in high school who always acted like an anime character, it just comes off as trying too hard.
There is a way to get ed well done, but writers had to use their brains to do it and well that is hard..... They can use the anime persona in computer screens when she reached them in some episodes, all with the quirks and things of the anime.... The twist can be when they finally find Ed IRL she can be the shy geek girl kinda shut in and introvert.... its not that hard and can be a nice change from the anime adaptation without being cringe af
Six foot tall with big breasts and thin waists do exist ,in northern Europe. Just not in the Asian community so much. They could have got that body type but it would be a white girl and they coudnt have that.
Every actor needs to take the Henry Cavill approach: everyone has their opinion and he hopes they do the best they can to make everyone happy and if they're not happy that's okay too..
Also, how his response to justice league pre-snyder cut. He's just a classy guy who knows its about making fans and being respectful of their opinions even if they don't agree
Christ. If someone said that to me; especially a woman, I'd quietly power walk away. "You don't know what you're missing." Girl, I know. Oh, I know so well. That's why I don't want any of it. 🤣
Nobody was giving her crap over her body either, we were all mad about that lame excuse for not making her costume more accurate and the costume itself, especially since Daniela wore something similar in another movie.
The ending really nailed it. The reason manga and anime is loved is because their creators care about what they are making just as much (until they're forced to drag it on because the higher ups say so). They all started from passionate creators wanting to tell a story or just draw something they liked, whereas things like this and their Death Note adaptation are *only* made for things like profit and THE MESSAGE. Wearing Faye's outfit is absolutely nothing compared to the months and years mangaka and animators go through for their work.
2000's Hollywood anime adaptations: We know nothing about this series, sorry :\ 2020's Netflix anime adaptations: We hate this series, and we hate you. Give us money.
@@NoahGooder cause they made decent films that were were terrible adaptations while netflix makes an almost somewhat okay adptatin that is a terrible film in general
I think that's part of the fun, where in the past, the shows and movies that were made were pretty darn good, especially as there was actual competition. I'm sure we lost out on some bangers because the studios just didn't get it, but they were good even if the adaptions sucked in their faithfulness. I compare the OG resident evil films, especially the first movie as they went pretty wacky fast. But, they were fun. You could forgive that they basically established their own universe in which their only tie in to the RE lore was a few dozen names, but, heck, the first one and maybe a few after that there fairly enjoyable outside of that. Then, death note. They completely changed the main character into a stereotypical dope of a student away from somebody who academically successful (which, his character was a large part of why DN worked, maybe they just assumed that America wouldn't like a battle of wits type show?), they turned what I can only describe as airhead into the one who actually strived to do something with the book. it was bad faith adaption at best, IMHO, but, I could see that maybe if you weren't a fan of the OG, it was probably an enjoyable but mediocre experience. I've seen a few people try to attribute it to the fact that they squeezed half of a 26 episode series into a singular movie, but, I think that the japanese adoptions where pretty darn good considering their budget. and then the new resident evil adaption, which I can only really describe as, paraphrasingly, "but, we wanted to attract a new audience". I got into the first RE game when I was young, and haven't had the cash (or, when I do have the cash, the time) to throw into buying up the entire series and playing through it all, but, I don't know how many fans of a survival horror series would love a show which is pretty much a teen drama. I don't know if their marketing reached too far outside of us nerds, but, whatever marketing hit us, I kinda hope it was just a misfire and they never intended to care about us, because if they did they're clearly out of touch. The worse part is that, even without the tie ins to RE, it just wasn't a tolerable show, the survival flick side of stuff was actually okay and maybe could of been enjoyable if it wasn't sandwiched between the worse show I've seen in years.
Step 5: "Blaming the fan base" is one of the worst excuses. It's like designing a product and if it doesn't sell, blame it on the customers for not liking it or understanding it. I can still understand if they blame it on the marketing or the producer for not making a clear policy which viewers to target, but blaming the "customers" is laughable.
It is the lowest of all things you can do and literally makes you immune to any sort of progress or improvement you can do. If the studios don't do a thorough clean house they will go down by sticking to these talentless hacks. And they better implement a gag for actors in their contracts.
It's actually the best excuse! All you gotta do is convince the fanbase that they're simply not WOKE enough to understand your message. CASE CLOSED BAYBE! SEASON 2 LET'S GO!
Culture marxism.... They think THEY are the intellectual ones with the right critical consciusness, and they have a duty to lecture and lead us stupid peasants, because we supposedly don't understand their sophisticated revolutionary world view. They don't ever consider that they might be wrong, it's the stupid working class and middle class, who are brainwashed by capitalism to ENJOY their lives and enjoy their movies and entertainment. They want to ruin our entertainment, because actually enjoying your life puts out the "revolutionary" spirit. They don't want people to be happy, they want to make everyone miserable. Marxists HATE when people actually enjoy the propsperity of a free market capitalist system.
"The art comes before the politics." - This is doubly impactful when you take into account that The Drinker clearly thinks of a well-written story AS art.
I'm the kind of viewer who stopped watching the reboot tv show The Equalizer because of woke politics but I just didn't see them in this. I enjoyed it and am pissed that I don't get season 2.
yeah but anime in general is much more crassly commerical than even western tv, in general. Bebop is an exception. I'm not saying it's all bad, but it is a stretch to say that, in general, it is a medium about "the art." It's not, it's about making money just like western movies, maybe more so considering that theres an entire trope of "fan service". I think he's overstating the difference to make a somewhat irrelevant political point, because overtly political works can be pretty popular among general audiences, like Squid Game
@@madrabbit9007 Honestly, I haven't really heard of anything involving this outside of that which took place behind the scenes, primarily the Actress and her awful video to fans. At the same time, that kind of thing was also a massive mark on Shang-Chi's record pre-release, which itself contained very little wokeness (outside of how excessively kickass his sister was, but that was a very small facet ultimately)
“Don’t know what you’re missing out on” is the same kind of response the drunk cougar at the bar spouts when rejected. Lets you know you dodged a massive bullet in either context.
The entire point of the show was that you CAN'T be a strong, independent person who doesn't need other people, because you'll just end up a lonely and a broken mess of a person, so...yeah, fits *real* well with The Message, doesn't it?
So let me get this straight, producers and directors like making adaptations of established franchises because they already have an established audience, but when that established audience hates the adaptation, producers and directors blame those audience? Makes sense.
8:13 man the left have ruined swear words. I wasn't opposed to swearing before but in recent years every sentence they use seems to feature an unnecessary, unwarranted f-bomb.
It's a lie though what major corporation is out of business from going woke? Losing one IP and staying on message is just a small speedbump in the creeping commie takeover if everything.
@@nationlessnationalist Maybe not the corporation going bust, but they do tend to amputate the diseased member when they realize they are losing money. Then think twice before picking up the poisoned chalice again.
@@nationlessnationalist lol, are you a professional troll or do you just do this as a hobby? "Broke" is a direction, not just a destination. The phrase means the same thing that anyone who starts a business should already know, that you need to treat clients and customers well if you want their business.
If I remember correctly, one of the defining features of Cowboy Bebop was that the series was built around the soundtrack and everything about it screams noir, but it's the blend of that noir with space that makes it so iconic. The creators of the series did the same thing with Samurai Champloo where they blended a hip-hop / R&B soundtrack to a samurai series (RIP Nujabes) Both had compelling characters that you actually invest in. And that's where "modern" "entertainment" falls flat. It's riding on existing fan sentiment and expecting that to sell the product. Hollywood just doesn't seem to understand that just because a product has a rabid fanbase doesn't mean that rabid fanbase is going to eat any old shit just because it smacks of their beloved
I've got a coworker who watched and genuinely enjoyed the Netflix remake. He'd never seen the original, and was avoiding it so as not to "spoil" the remake. But I'm more happy for him than I am for myself now, because now he gets to watch the real Cowboy Bebop for the first time and see how it's really done.
Yeah I'm the same. First time I'd come across it so watched the remake from a blank canvas so to speak, without preconceptions. To be honest I enjoyed it and was hoping for a season 2.
I'm the same, except I chose to watch the anime first. (Finished Ep. 3 the other day.) Mostly because I think remakes and adaptations are unnecessary. If the story was good and told competently the first time around, it should hold up regardless of how much time has passed.
@@Americus2001 I think that is one of the best arguments against the live action remake. It failed to justify its own existence. The animation of the original is top notch, the story telling and artistry is great! The music incredible. What reason to even adapt it to live action? Just watch the original.
It's also been pointed out that her description of Faye Valentine's figure is horribly exaggerated. She's actually 5'6" with average size features. Daniella also did work on another film where she wore pretty much nothing, so it's not like she's never done this before. Her stand was just an incredible take on ignorance and hypocrisy. Why would fans want to watch something made by people who hate them from the start and don't even do their own research on the show?
And it still could have worked if live action Faye were to have been working under a delusion that she was hotter and better-endowed than she actually is for her femme fatale. My problem with it was that they tried to remake too many anime episodes instead of doing what they said they would - filling in the spaces between the anime episodes.
In the end, how hard is it to play Faye? They had Motormouth Megumi play her, in the ultimate type-against-cast ever (I don't count Eva, since Rei had like three lines).
Faye's costume wasn't the issue, it's was a symptom. Faye in this series just isn't Faye. Instead of being the clever, charming, elegant bounty hunter that she is, she was just basically a dude-bro with a gun. Costume and body type don't really matter much when it comes to writing and acting, which is where the issues lay.
When an Actor/Actress comes out of the gate with attitude. It doesn't even matter to me if I was excited about the show, I'm out! They are a clowns, being paid to entertain. Keep your opinions to yourselves and DANCE clowns, or get cancelled.
Truly. Faye is supposed to be a femme-fatale using her beauty and wits against her marks. Beyond that, we also see that for all her charm she's actually very emotionally broken. She's the exact type of character that *cannot* be made in the west today. She can't be beautiful and sexy as that would be sexist and she can't be shown to be weak in any way as women always have to be "empowered."
one thing to keep in mind is that each character was a style of music as the original writer saw that style. Spike was Jazz, Jet was Blues, Faye was Honky-Tonk, and Ed was Rhapsody. Jazz is simple but made complex through improvisation. Blues is slow and sad. Honky-Tonk was made due to abused instruments, was baudy, and tended towards themes of lost love, adultery, and loneliness (the Honky-Tonk bars also tended to be centers of prostitution). Rhapsody has its roots in classical music, and had a free flowing structure that made it seem freer than contemporary types of music. if the characters didn't embody these things then the show was going to fail, whether or not they embraced wokeness (that just makes it fail harder).
As I said in another comment thread, a western producer couldn't allow the Faye from the show (using her sexual elements to hide how broken and alone she was emotionally) as that would've been showing a woman being weak *and* being an "object."
The fact that she started the vid off with. I'd like to apologize to "the fans"... and then proceeds to mock the criticism with with poorly Veiled frustration disguised as sarcasm is what sent the show into a nose dive. It showed that she didn't give two sh!+s about the fans whose beloved property she had just adapted. She got but hurt and lashed out like a bitter, shallow woman scorned
Funny thing is, these people ARE privileged, they fucking pretend for a living, don't have to dive in filth and tend to their goddamn garden. They live in their high castles probably full of contempt for their audience. They don't feel the real fear of someone potentially double high kicking them for real if they talked like on the video in person. Not just actors, but many people say dumb shit online without consequence because we are much less likely to take a real slap on the nose for being a prick.
What really boggles the mind is that every cosplayer has come up with a better interpretation of Faye's costume than this show......... oops! Also: if Tom Cruise can play Jack Reacher, who's described as a hulking brute in the books and make his version fully believable, well, the sky's the limit if you are a competent actor/actress. It all comes down to how you make the changes work and sell it to the fans. Then there's the lead actor, who's way too old for the role and the scripts.............. eehm, they exist? In the end you're left with something that is Cowboy Bebop in name only, because almost everything that made the anime such a success has been turned upside down and flipped inside out.
WILL Stargate become Woke next?!? If Stargate becomes Woke, we have to Leave as one United Fanbase. But i think many know that, so i leave it at that. This ocmment here is meant to speak for the Other Side ofthe Medal though: Hope! I just sumbled upon a musicvideo and cant believe how much of the 'SPIRIT' of Stargate it has. It's impossible to put into Words, so please just see for yourself: 'Stargate SG1 - I'll go with you'!
Considering how many cosplayers happily dressed up as Faye Valentine both here and in Japan and in the rest of the world and were able to make her outfit accurately and true to character, I fail to see how that would have been considered offensive and exploitative. I can see how such an outfit would not work in cold climates or with a chilly wind, but seeing the crass attitudes from the cast and especially the script writer, I am glad to see that this failboat was dumped and they can mess up it up more.
I know, right? I produced a dance showcase where one of the numbers was Faye dancing to the Bebop theme song. The dancer managed to do a physically demanding dance number in a costume that was more recognizable as Faye than than big-budget movie version Faye's outfit. And this was a college age gal with low budget. Yet she nailed the costume better than a professional costume designer. Hmmm.
"Faye is impossible for a real woman!" Everytime Hollywood tries to justify that stuff they're adapting is impossible, just look up cosplay, and see how some normal person who doesn't have a million+ dollar budget is able to pull off these costumes accurately and with a lot higher quality. I remember when old superhero movies tried to justify that everyone had to be in a black jumpsuit. That comic costumes couldn't be adapted. That it would never work. Then the MCU came along.
If the MCU did one thing great, apart from a successful shared universe, it's really making old times comics costumes work. They made freaking Mysterio work. There is no excuse.
@@leirbag1595 honestly, one of my favorite parts of watching a Marvel Studios movie is seeing how they adapted designs for objects, tools and costumes to the big screen. The first time I saw the Mark 3 Iron Man suit on screen, my mind was immediately blown
@@Actinide5013 Yeah, they really did this well. And they managed to adapt the Marvel lore to ease its adaptation as well. For example, fusing the Infinity Stones with certain artefacts did well to both have McGuffins and let this be building up to other parts of the overall story.
Them : Faye looks were unrealistic so instead of making her a confident femme fatale, we made her a sacarstic insufferable gay goth tomboy Us : That makes no sense...
Well a couple things I think needs to be said about Faye's outfit. One: practicality and sexy do not need to be mutually exclusive. Two: Faye was never a martial artist mean that practicality could come secondary to sexiness as that was one of her primary tools and weapons. As you said in this video Drinker, she's a femme fatale type. She uses her body as a weapon as much as a gun. And her methods were always about being sneaky, seductive, and cunning. In the anime she was always pretty much helpless in hand to hand combat. SO have an outfit that practical for anything more than moving and running in is not necessary for her. While having an outfit that shows off and lets her use her sex appeal IS necessary for her character. But even with all this my first point still stands. You CAN be both practical and sexy, if you are willing to try. And clearly the people behind this weren't.
They only need to watch The Outpost for 5 minutes and watch Jessica Green be tall, graceful, strong and sexy whilst in some very tight fitting attire and completely owning it to know how much they got that wrong. Jess Green looks like she would have been a near perfect casting for this role too.
@@malphadour Never heard of her before, and yes, 5 minutes of watching random action scenes from the show it's all it takes, you're 100% right, she'd be perfect as Faye.
@@malphadour If the CW only does one thing well (which I would argue is true, but their millions of fans obviously disagree), it is making their characters look pretty and/or sexy. I can generally spot a CW production from a 30-second to 2-minute clip of any show (sound could be turned off), just by how they make-up and present their characters. It's as if they have their own art style, like anime, in how their characters appear on screen, regardless of the show. And it 100% works. Everyone looks hyper-pretty and/or hyper-sexy, no matter where they are or what they're doing. If the CW can figure it and absolutely master it out on limited TV budgets, anyone else ought to be able to manage some facsimile there-of. edit: I just watched a compilation of some of Jessica Green's fight scenes from The Outpost, and while I'm definitely not inspired to watch the show, I have to say Ms. Green looks like she's having a great time, and like her character is really enjoying being in fights. She's able to convey a lot of enthusiasm with her expressions, which I imagine adds a lot of fun to the show. Always a nice change from today's generally dour, serious combatants. And you're right, she *does* look sexy doing it, especially with her apparent enthusiasm.
I remember when people found out Hugh Jackman was going to play Wolverine, and many fans (myself included) pointed out that he is like a foot too tall, and didn’t seem to be a good fit for the character. After all, he is called Wolverine because they are small and dangerous. Instead of getting on social media and bashing fans for their options, he went out and did his job and attempted to prove all the haters wrong, and won over most of them. (I still think he’s too tall and at the very least the directors should have shot in ways to make him appear shorter). Now the actors and studios just fight and squabble with fans and turn them off from even wanting to give the movie a chance.
Your points at #3 are dead on - Pineda's egotistic, snarky diatribe made NetflixBop DOA. Watching this unfold, I recognized the massive shift in tone from audiences after she pulled that stunt. Before, I think most people were willing to give the show a shot and see how it played out, then they just wanted to watch the show go down in flames. Audiences have been antagonized, belittled, and talked down to by Hollywood for years and everyone is just tired of it.
Faye's outfit would've been difficult to adapt for sure, but there were compromises that could've been made. Instead of trying to be realistic, and (to a lesser extent) push agenda, they should've understood why Faye looked the way she did. Anime Faye lived a tough life and the setting of Bebop was very much a "dog eat dog" world. Faye understood that and also knew she was a beautiful looking woman, so she played that up. Yes, a lot of it was artistic design, but it had a purpose. She knew her appearance would distract others (particularly men), and she played on that. Men were often so taken with her beauty they dismissed how dangerous she was and by the time they realized it it was too late. Anime Faye played on her appearance, but she was still a very dangerous, competant, experienced, and crafty individual. They didn't have to make it a straight adaption, but they should've understood there was a purpose to her appearance and found a compromise to keep it as part of her character.
Faye was literally introduced to us *at a casino running a scam.* Her entire character is built around deceit and manipulation. Her sexuality is her biggest tool toward that end. It's the entire reason when you finally get a glimpse of her as a kid it hits _so_ hard. You see this bright, sweet, naive, optimistic girl contrasted with a jaded, cynical, deceptive, desperate woman. The moment you saw how they'd changed her costume alone you knew they'd missed the entire point of her character.
The Fifth Element's main character wears basically the same outfit as Faye's the whole film, including much more active fight scenes than Faye would've been involved with, and the outfit worked just fine. Faye's more about using her looks to get out of a situation, than being some martial artist bad ass anyway.
Funny enough Daniela Pineda is 5'5" and Faye is 5'6" so they're pretty accurate in height, it's Daniela's lack of understanding of the character that she was cast in to spout the "6 foot DD breasts" quote she tried to call a "clapback" and those photos of her in an outfit from another production looking an awful lot like Faye's booty shorts didn't help either.
Must be so hard for someone to just research about their character to get a good understanding lf who they're playing. But I guess that's just too much work.
Especialy when the very first image you get when googling cowboy bebop is the cast doing a police lineup. With their height in obvious display. Faye is under the 170cm line.
I think she confused Katarina from the first episode with Faye, Katarina is around 6 foot tall and very busty (she's supposed to look like Salma Hayak from "Desperado", and Salma's a large D-cup). Maybe Pineda should've actually watched the anime entirely before ranting about fans....
I am actually glad that this didn't get a second season. Could you imagine watching several episodes with that portrayal of Edward constantly mugging for the camera and screeching every line?
You know, I feel like Henry Cavill was the reason so many people liked The Witcher show, my mother loved the show for him alone. Plus, add on the fact: -Not an asshole to the fans -Actually respects the IP -Understands the frustration and gives reasonable responses to why everything wasn't a 1x1 recreation If Faye's actress took some notes, there wouldn't be so much backlash on her, and maybe lessen the frustrations with the redesign.
People don't love Henry Cavill for his acting abilities. He's a lousy actor. People 'love' Henry Cavill for his objectively great looks, classicly handsome features and roided up build.
Faye's actress was also super passive aggressive about not being admired for her work. She didn't match the character from the show, but if her rendition of Fay had been particularly good, it wouldn't have mattered.
Cavill is a true nerd 😆 Plays 40k, collects toys, and trust me there are videos of him nerding out at conventions. He's an awesome dude. Same with Vin Diesel. Another admitted super nerd.
@@pennywisedaclown51 I hated Cavill in the Superman movies, precisely because I thought he was all looks and nothing else. I **completely** turned around when I watched some interviews with him about The Witcher. I now think he's an amazing person, and I'm really glad someone gave him a chance at redemption after the _awful_ script of those DC movies almost torpedoed his career.
An apology wasn't needed. Literally nobody who matters is mad that Faye's anatomical impossibility wasn't perfectly rendered in the real world. However, Pineda allowing a handful of manbabies to get under her skin like that indicates lack of maturity and lack of self-respect.
Uh... the very line was delivered with sarcasm. She was an asshole in that video but your particular statement is irrelevant. We were obviously never *intended* to think she was apologizing.
@Andi Magna I have my problems with stuff in this guy's overall attitude. I decided not mention them to others here. The faults that don't require I subjectively read into things to find are obvious. Those who I could convince of them *know* he has them, so the comment would be useless. Any who haven't recognized them likely don't think they *are* flaws, and probably couldn't be brought about by reason. Enumerating the guy's issues just starts ugly fights which no one really wins.
Let’s not forget that while he is snarky and touts his own opinion, the show did tank in 3 episodes. So, apparently he is not alone in these opinions. Considering what passes for entertainment these days, you have really got to screw up to kill a show that quickly. I didn’t see it, and it seems I won’t get to either.
@Andi Magna first time I ever see his video and clicked cos I was wondering by the show was so odd , and now I regret giving this guy a view because he spent so much time lambasting the actress, calling her angry/seething when she made a valid point, its almost like he was trying to truly blame her for all of it. anyway, defs never watching this dude again cos "the message" bits makes it clear white kind right wing empty vessel crap this channel is. eew
People also forget that one of the biggest reasons why anime doesn't translate well to American film is that anime takes advantage of being animated. There are so many unique stylistic choices that would never work in live action.
Agreed. I will never understand Hollywood's obsession with turning everything into live action. Is it cheaper? That's the only reason I can come up with.
One of the biggest reason is because these talent-less hacks don't respect the original content. Alita was the closest Hollywood has ever gotten and that's because the directors gave a fuck about the material. That being said, I still personally think Alita fell short because it follows the OVA so it pales in comparison to the manga.
@@PKMN37 Creating original series take too much effort and creativity. Nothing wrong with live action adaptation, just don't half-ass it or discredit the source material with your incompetence
It’s funny that Gal Gadot copped similar criticism for not looking like Wonder Woman. Instead of blaming the fans she gave some context to the criticisms and just did her job. A job which ended up winning over the naysayers and showed she was the right choice. Why can’t other actors do the same?
Olivia Munn even took it a step further. When they were going to change the Psylocke costume in Age of Apocalypse, she asked that they make it more like the comics, because that was what she figured fans wanted. Too bad they couldn't make the movie better.
I disagree she was the right choice, not looking like she has any strength at all and her acting being terrible, but I agree that she was a lot more mature about it.
I don't think it was anywhere near as much, though. Gal actually doesn't look too far off from Wonder Woman except maybe being slightly smaller-chested, but yeah, only a few folks who expected a PERFECT casting complained about that; she was still athletic, beautiful, and can act well enough for action movies. Faye looks completely wrong in every way, like it wasn't a compromise over limited options, it was just outright not fucking trying.
Cowboy bebop, ghibli films and Akira maybe the only three stories that have been so perfectly and distinctly executed that all you can do is rerelease it or lose money
there were some really good bits in the live version... the message thing i didn't need... glad though that it wasn't exactly the same as that would have been a bit boring...
Here's a fun fact; Faye Valentine was actually Singaporean in the original show. I know it can be hard to tell when everyone is drawn in a consistent art style, but episode 18 "Speak Like a Child" confirms that Faye Valentine (not her real name, by the way) was born and raised in Singapore. I know some people complained about how they race swapped Spike and Jet for more diversity, but I guess an actual Asian woman wasn't diverse enough for them? Or maybe they just didn't actually watch the original source material. 18 episodes is a lot to slog through if you don't actually give a shit what you're doing.
Hollywood loves doing that. They will change the races of their white characters to appear more diverse but whitewash their actual POC characters. This is seen in DC with Talia and Damian
I think I read somewhere that Spike was based on Bruce Lee and a Japanese actor “Matsuda sth” (I’m not good with names sorry ) so I thought the casting for him was pretty accurate ngl (him being Asian). My memory could be failing me though ! But Spike and Faye I completely agree !
@@valmuncfezarion8607 Yusaku Matsuda, yeah. He was an actor popular in the 70's known for playing badass noir tough guys, and a lot of anime characters homage him. Spike's fluffy hair and blue suit are direct references to his signature style. I'll do you one better though, Watanabe once explained that the main design inspiration for the Bebop cast was actually Lupin the Third. Spike's physique and mannerisms are modeled after Lupin, they often do the same hands-in-pockets slumped walk and even wear the same weird high top boots. Faye is an homage to Fujiko, Vicious echoes Goemon, and Jet is a blend of both Jigen and Zenigata. Watanabe really likes Lupin, because Space Dandy also was based on Lupin as well.
@@Easy420skate That was only in the shojo spinoff manga, Shooting Star. Not considered canon, since Watanabe had no involvement in it. To be fair though, Spike being Asian would actually make sense, he's based on a Japanese actor and was a member of what is clearly implied to be a Chinese crime syndicate, it's just never made concrete in the show proper. I guess that's just part of him being mysterious.
What was wrong with Netflix version of Cowboy Bebop? 1. being subtle as a brick: anytime there was a silent moment in the anime, the live-action had to spell it out loud, treating the audiences as a bunch of 7 years old. 2. butchering the characters: the problem was not the appearnce, but the substance being completely off-track (I think Faye's look was totally fine, the fact the she was no longer an addicted gambler but default Hollywood badass woman was more of an issue; and don't get me started on what they did to Vicious). 3. the "message": the anime was actually very inclusive and progressive, and had real social commentary... but I guess that taking a stab at e.g. healthcare insurance costs or widespread corruption among the police was too dodgy for the SJW bunch, which played it safe with their woke crap.
@Andi Magna Even if that were true, correlation is not equal causation. One likely interpretation would be that some directors want to push a political message with their movies, which leads to worse movies but also to hiring of a more inclusive cast, leading to inclusive casts and worse movies being correlated even though the performance of actors of different ethnicities and backgrounds is the same.
Dude, I accidentally found out your channel. You are killing it! Keep up the work. We need voices like that in today's world where it's about "the message", or being politically correct and not quality oriented, or blaming the fans for incompetence of the creators or... well, you got it. Cheers.
That speech - what I heard was “how dare the fans expect actors to convey the look and feel of a character!” But isn’t that what actors are paid to do?
That's why they're called actors. An actor is supposed to play into the role or character the story revolves around. But nowadays they think they are awesome enough by themselves so if you don't like them you're a virgin/incel/racist/maga whatever
Rather, actors & screenwriters are nowadays paid & pressured by higher-up movie executives. These movie execs, who don't know a thing about good story-telling or movie production, are forcing the actors to be a Woke Messenger in every form of movie/anime/manga/book novel character they adapt to screen.
Contrast to Hugh Jackman who was first regarded with skepticism because he was physically dissimilar to the comic book wolverine but he simply played the roll well and won over the fans
@American Hero we're not talking Bugs Bunny, this seems to be a character that could be adapted for live action in a manner true to the spirit of the character it would never please everyone but I think it's a missed opportunity
@American Hero I don't like constant negativity either (and this channel does a goodly number of positive reviews as well) but the recent trend of taking an intellectual property and adapting it in a manner that is untrue to the original vision is upsetting to those who enjoy the original and who paid money to make it successful and it ticks those fans off when they are ignored and belittled, why is that wrong or unreasonable? Still I have things I like and things I don't, I don't get overly passionate about fictional characters but I do enjoy them and I enjoy discussing what makes a character, a story, or a franchise worth making an emotional investment in, I say if I like it or if I don't, I don't think that makes me dumb, bearded or inbred or whatever else you think people you disagree with are.
No one talks about how an anime director whose work is known for its distinct kinetic visual flair as animation does not translate well to live-action. Critical Drunkard’s focus on bad story writing is good, but let’s be honest, the Netflix adaptation just doesn’t even have the precision and refinement of the anime at all. As someone who enjoys the high marks of 90s anime, this was the first and biggest turn-off.
Well written. This was my biggest turnoff, the clumsy cuts, the awful pacing, the complete lack of dynamism. I was bored by the casino fight. I recommend 'My Name'. It's korean and on Netflix. It's proof you can get awesome fight scenes on a TV budget. There was no excuse.
This is why a live action Ghost in the Shell was never going to work and why the Vampire Hunter D series I was hearing about a while back would never work. And why this Akira is going to be awful no matter who does it. The only good anime adaptations are The Matrix movies.
Agreed, as son as I saw Netflix's version of the opening I lost interest, some shots that are ripped right from the OG opening like Spike and Jet sprinting somehow look worse and janky that the animated ones. Same with fight scenes, despite being live action and shooting that kind of scenes is easier and less complex that hand drawing them frame by frame, they look less fluid and more robotic than the anime.
The man who made this show, Shinchiro Watanabe, literally said to "pray the show is good" when asked about it. He knows it won't & it didn't. The cinematography was garbage.
It comes down to hubris. The writers of this thought they knew better than the creators of the original. Instead of understanding and respecting the genius of the source material they thought they could disregard it and "improve" it. They were delusional.
What adds insult to injury is they claim they consulted with the creator of the series and then basically ignored any notes or comments from them. I've heard very clearly that the original creator said they completely disavow this current iteration basically knew it was going to be bad.
I saw this video about 3 weeks ago, and started watching the original animation on your recommendation, CD. Good God, man, you've done it again!! Spectacularly great show, and I loved all but 2 episodes of it! (Sorry, I had to be honest with you.)
How to fuck up a franchise: 1- Do a Kathleen Kennedy (force activism: "the message"). 2- Do a JarJar Abrahams (mediocrity and laziness: parasite from previous work). 3- Do a Ruin Johnson (fuck up original characters to make the new ones seem better: diversity and inclusion). 4- Do a Brie Larson. Feed you ego and virtue signaling by antagonizing the fans and then double it down in anticipation to rejection and failure. 5- Blame fans and customers for failing.
Eh, Wait! Brie L'Arson wasn't credited with the act of dissing a fandom already put on alert by previous lame pandering productions? In the words of Queen Brie: "Is that a personal attack or something?"
@Andi Magna You're just looking for races to feed your racist RRRRREEEE. I bet you he's praised Idris Elba and other blacks in GOOD MOVIES they were in,not bad ones.
Not too long ago I wasn’t really into anime. The stereotypes and extremists made me wanna avoid it at all costs so I wouldn’t feel associated with them. However, after seeing several different series recommended by my brother and friends, it’s no mystery why anime has seen such a huge surge in recent years. They tell good, compelling stories that don’t feel aggressive or preachy, and don’t make it feel like the writers hate me bc I’m white, straight, or a guy. And what’s even more funny and ironic to me is that so many of these shows actually incorporate many things that these nutcase SJWs demand, that being strong female characters, diversity, etc., the difference being that it’s done in a smart, compelling way that makes you care about them as characters regardless of what race, sex, or whatever meaningless characteristic they have. It’s just nice to know that somewhere in this fucked up world there’s still people who just want to tell good compelling stories
@@osez111 True, but 'friendship' is something everyone can be a part of, not confined to groups depending on their race, sexuality or religious beliefs. and at the end of the day, feeling like you have friends you can count on is a better feeling than being told you're an overpriviliged piece of shit because you're not a minority.
@@osez111 They can be (looking at you, Fairy Tail) but at the end of the day... is that really the worst thing ever? Yeah it can be heavy-handed. But everyone needs friends, and good friends are absolutely worth fighting to keep. (And remember.... shonen is targeted at young boys. So... duh.)
Soon as I heard a live action Cowboy Bebop by a western production I thought "wow this is a mistake." So hearing it crashed and burned brought a smile to my face.
You should watch Rouge Origin fan films. Their Spike is sooo cool, even though his hairstyle is different, he is still 99 % closer to the original spirit than the old dude from failed Netflix series ua-cam.com/video/DQcykdQ6xks/v-deo.html
Similar happened with ghost in the shell, so much potential gone to waste. Alita was a step in the right direction. "The message" is so nuted. Well said drinker 👍🏼👍🏼
I watched the live action show, but only after binging the original all the way through, and I found my hate right in the first episode. My moment of clarity? Vicious. It's like taking a classic ubervillain, Sephiroth or Sauron or Voldemort, and just neutering them. You can't show the most terrifying killer in the original show by creating a new scene in which he yells pointlessly at his wife! Why? If the villain is no longer scary then no one will care if the hero takes him on, how is this so hard to understand?
Anime Vicious would never yell. Anime Vicious is all cold hate. He's like the Joker. You can never tell what he will do. You can never guess where his whims lie and what he's thinking. He could be there to kill you. He could be there to just say hi. You don't know. You never know. And what's worse is he might show up just to say hi, and, mid-conversation, decide to kill you... and there would be no sign outwardly that this has happened. You could go from a friendly conversation and both of you laughing to his sword out and your headless body slumping to the ground IN A MILLISECOND. And all that uncertainty is exactly what made him so terrifying in the anime. Him even being in the room was nerve-wracking and tense and dramatic because you just had NO CLUE if someone was about to die or not.
Netflix Vicious was a joke character, they had to show him choking out Julia just to shove it down the audience's throat how evil he was. Plus that nonsense about getting his goons to buy chocolates for her after. Seriously? I switched off after that episode as it was just a complete waste of my time and attention.
Was coming to say I did not really have any issues with the casting except for Vicious, when I saw him acting like a little bitch I lost interest in the show and stopped watching. I was completely unaware of the pre-release issues the Drinker spoke of in the video, but I can see why a lot of people were turned off right away. I didn't have my hopes up anyways, I always assume all live actions will end up being a new M Night Airbender, but enjoyed the three main actors portrayals of the characters. But as soon as I got a couple of episodes of Vicious, I saw where it was going and decided to save the few hours of my life rather than continue down the drain.
She was reduced from "perpetually lost, persecuted, but independent, manipulative and dangerous femme-fatale" to "generic female action lesbian, this time without the side of her head shaved".
Naomi Markman : "Fuck you're missing out" Sorry but we learned our lesson from Picard and STD and Dr. Who. They basically said the same thing "Ok, ok, it may SEEM like it sucks now but just wait, it gets better." Nah. I didn't waste my time (even though I have time to waste) on those and from the reviews I've seen it was the correct decision. And yes, I'd rather watch hours of reviews of a bad show rather than watching the bad show itself. Far more entertaining.
"Give it a chance, how do you know it's shit if it hasn't come out" *season 1 drops* "it's just the first season, plenty of shows have had a rough first seasons" *second season drops* "There has been production problems as to be expected, but they will pull through" *third season drops* "Ok the fans probably may have slightly been the tiniest bit correct in a few places, but this is a show of the now and it's what society needs during these troubling times"
The only highlight of this show was Mustafa as Jet Black. He actually nailed the characters sound, voice, mannerisms and appearance quite well. I think with a better script him and to a lesser extent, Cho could have actually made this work. Cho was also really really dedicated. It's just too bad the script was so terrible. They changed everything about the stories ending that made the show's story function properly. If they had just fired this one out, with a script that mostly matched the original and made it a one-off 12 episode homage and kept the core story the same, I dont think anyone would have been too upset, but instead they had to shoe-horn in so many changes to the core characters and story that they ended up just throwing out the baby with the bathwater and totally missed the mark. A lot of wasted potential here.
That's a thought, but some would disagree. I believe that the political nature of art takes precedence to its aesthetic, not the other way around. But that's not the argument we're having right now. Anyway, on Cowboy Bebop. If anything, the live action version is less political than the original show. There are a lot of themes that were lost in the translation, which leads us to... This.
@@painvillegaming4119 all art is by nature political. It is a reflection of the artist's material condition, their values, beliefs, what is important to them, and so on. There is no "good" or "bad" way of using politics in art. Such ideas come from interpretations of the reader/viewer, or from its aesthetic execution. But the political nature of art, in itself, is as natural as the artform itself.
as was pointed out elsewhere, they do these adaptations of beloved franchises thinking they will inherit a built-in fanbase, but what they actually inherit is a built-in critic base. it's like playing a game on hard difficulty while thinking it's on easy difficulty. doomed to fail from the start.
That's a great analogy. With a known property there are certain expectations that have to be met. Some of these expectations are undue or uncalled for. Other expectations are the foundation for what made the original popular in the first place.
I like that -- "built-in critic base". And it's absolutely true -- I saw Chris Reeve play Superman in the theater back in 1978, and thought "He isn't built like Superman". If anything, I've gotten pickier over time.
The most frustrating thing is despite this obvious result they still don't learn, and then continue to repeat the same process on another existing IP... That's the definition of insanity if I'm not mistaken 🤨
Given how regarded it is, it's setting yourself up for failure. If you're going to remake/adapt a masterwork (with a specific form), it probably makes sense to try and appeal to a different audience. As a comparison, if you were attempting to recreate the mona lisa, you'd have two options. 1) Use the same form and INEVITABLY fail to live up to the level of artistry/originality. 2) do something that was a radical enough departure to avoid the expectations that came with the original and appeal to a different base. Regarding Cowboy Bebop, there were enough people unfamiliar with the original that a tv show could work IF IT WERE INDEPENDENTLY GOOD and they were careful to only get existing fans with a managed understanding of the different product. ABSENT THIS, the message is "You loved the original? Here's a bad photocopy."
I don't know if it's feminine insecurity or what, but I can't help but notice how often actresses sabotage themselves by aggressively responding to critics where male actors would just let shit go knowing that their performance would ultimately be what brings their detractors around. Like when fans were going off on Heath Ledger being cast as the Joker prior to The Dark Knight's release, Heath never called out the "haters" and admonished them for not liking him. Likewise when Robert Pattinson was cast to play Batman, which I certainly thought was a miscast until I saw the first trailer. I don't recall him ever taking to social media to shame people for not immediately accepting him. Another commenter below also brought up Tom Cruise playing Jack Reacher. I'm sure there are many more examples, but it's hard to recall them because the outrage has long since been forgotten; which is the whole point. Whenever you're adapting something with an established fanbase, a portion of those fans are invariably going to be upset at things they feel aren't faithful to or respectful of the source material. The appropriate response to criticism is to keep your mouth shut and let the final product do the talking for you. If you feel your adaptation is good, then it will stand for itself and the haters will be silenced. All lashing out and trying to shame the fans into silence does is tell everyone that they're probably right to be concerned.
I recall Michael Keaton and Hugh Jackman were also go-to's when talking about actors who did not initially seem like the right fit for an adapted character, and instead of popping off, they bided their time, and let their performances win people over.
I'll say this: Women are less used to open rejection than men. Men (in most cases) deal with the rejection, harsh criticism, and open mockery with quiet stoicism and move on. They're expected to. Women aren't. (I'm working on majorities and averages here - Gal Gadot didn't attack WW fans who doubted her, she let her work speak for itself.) Imagine if any of the guys did what Faux!Faye did. They'd likely be fired. A woman? Completely different. Fortunately for us? These self sabotages have been happening so frequently that I'm hoping hollywood gets a clue.
Women generally have the emotional maturity of a six year old, on their best days. It's rare that you find one who acts much older than that. But in Hollywood, I think the real issue is that there's so many women trying to be movie stars and so they are all so replaceable. If any of them gets a shot, they know it's probably the only shot they'll get. Even the slightest threat to that shot and they'll have a breakdown as they imagine being waitresses in LA forever.
Women nowadays would disagree and feel they are being unreasonably attacked for being female and men don't deal with this sort of hate because the patriarchy. They always blame men and not once do women ever examine themselves. I cannot stand the victim mentality.
In The Bebop Beat podcast interview, the showrunner André Nemec talked about what would happen in season two: the reveal of the Cosmonaut; Ed finds out the true meaning of family; Jet's mechanical arm trips out; while Jet is tripping out, his arm is unusable and plays the saxophone with one hand; Spike's demons of the Blue Crow massacre will be put to bed; Faye finds who she is; Julia discovers "Heavy is The Head That Wears The Crown"; Vicious is reborn and Ein saves the day.
Funny thing is, in the anime character Faye's bio it states she's supposed to be 5'6" the actress that played her is 5'5". She was never supposed to be 6' so she's just lying or is just that ignorant about the character she is supposed to be portraying.
@@dethmaul Exactly, she is assuming. As to assume is one of the big no- nos of woke culture, I am once again baffled by the double standards of the people which represent it.
I paused it long enough to read the director's twitter bio, about being a raging lesbian / feminist / eco anarchist / leftist revolutionary / advocate for restorative justice, etc. etc. I appreciate her telling me everything I ever need to know about her and her "art." I'm looking forward to never watching anything she produces, ever.
Daniella really was the reason I couldn’t bring myself to try and watch it. I have an issue when actors attack fans prior to release, like Ghostbuster 2016 or the whole Brie Larson fiasco.
Or the Doctor Who Impersonator. It's officially a trend now. Maybe they take specific classes in acting school? "Method Acting", "The Stanislavski Method", "How to alienate a whole fanbase before release", ...
Yeah because the fans are kind to those actors and really speak with a reasonable mind. I hate it when Netflix (or any other platform and/or media) changes things so they can be more "woke", but I can't say I'm not with the actress in that case.
I'm impressed by the way that you said "Hollywood sensibilities" without breaking out laughing. I don't think I could. And listening to the actress playing the Valentine's character was like listening to nails on a chalkboard. God help whoever has her in their lives.
John Cho seems like a nice man and I didn't see any antagonism from him, and he was clearly very invested in the project, and he's very crestfallen that it's been cancelled. I can't help but feel bad for him. Feels like a nice guy in a crap situation. F in chat for John Cho.
He really isn't a bad Spike. He needs to get more in tune with how depressed Spike comes off as and most times just looking physically exhausted and uninterested so when he perks up before fights or hearing something he's happy or interested in the impact is more meaningful.
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@The Zoom duh
Yeah, cowboy bebop was absolutely awesome. Mostly it explores themes of sins of the past. And deals with the idea of "we are who we are" and the idea that if you leave unfinished business it'll come back to bite you in the ass. And how you can't escape your past or deny who you are. They did absolutely butcher fay valentine though. In the live action she's a badass main powerhouse. In the anime she's a fuck up who's drowning in debt. Her back story is less tragic than it is farcical. She joins jet and spike because fuck it, why not.
Your closing thought on "trying to make it in the first place" were my own sentiments from the moment I heard they were making a live action Cowboy Bebop. Much like Heathers (1988) and Fame (1980), Cowboy Bebop was perfectly awesome as is. Never needed any sort of remake nor reboot. All the woke shit did was exacerbate what was doomed to fail from jump.
I haven't even finished watching the show now I don't think I ever will
Drinker: "No amount of training makes you 6 inches higher"
Me: .... except Stallone managed and still manages to look that higher in screen.
"But unfortunately ther is only so much we human actors can do" is basically the line that makes me think WHY do people make live action adaptations of animated movies/shows. With animation you can do so much, show so much more than live action. Even if you go through the Herculean task of making a "good" adaptation there is still going to be magic that is lost with the switch. I'm looking at YOU Disney remakes.
One anime that i think has real potential in live action, if done properly, is Attack on Titan. That 3D maneuvaribility gear would look incredibly in live action if they did it right. If they could make the physics look realistic it would be a stomach-dropping, vertigo-inducing spectacle.
Also practical effects titans (kinda like the old godzilla) have a lot of potential to be even creepier and more unsettling.
The excellent Rurouni Kenshin live-action movies, proved that you totally can make a good live-action Anime, IF you actually know what you're doing and have respect for the source material.
2 things that are completely missing from current day Hollyweird.
Speed Racer did it the best, it embraced the anime part
I have not and likely never will see a live action adaptation that is better than the original animation. It’s a wonder why they keep trying.
@@UltraWeebMaster Because they're lazy and they think it will make money.
I think the biggest loss here is for John Cho.
The man watched the entire original, fell in love with it, battled on set to ensure that Spike's iconic Jericho would be used, got the original composer involved, and tried his genuine best to represent Spike with the script he was given.
And all off his efforts went down the drain because your average fanfic writer could create a better script then Netflix could.
Fair. It's a shame his dedication couldn't be rewarded properly.
Yeah. Huge shame. I really like that guy.
I hope he gets a better role.
Forreal. Why do they keep hiring these people? It's obvious they were fated to serve coffees. Instead they gotta do millions of dollars worth of damage.
He was horribly cast
"There's a very good reason people watch anime and read manga. It's not made by people like you."
Nailed it, Drinker.
feelings hurt ......hopefully
Pretty much the reason why manga is dominating the comic book industry.
Nobody wants to see Gay Superboy protest or Captain America say he benefits from white privilege, we want to be entertained.
@@cytorakdemon Exactly. And in the case of "sexing down" characters like Faye, who the heck wants to buy something they were expressly told they shouldn't be looking at? I mean, sure, not every female needs to be about sex appeal, but a protagonist should at least try to be pleasant in some way. Nobody wants the angsty victimhood finger waving that dominates things like Captain Marvel or basically all of modern Star Trek. Being lectured about how bad your culture is isn't entertaining, funny that.
@@cytorakdemon or have the x men murder innocent people just because a sea turtle choked on a plastic bag. Yes this is real and I ain't making this up.
@@Hypershell And they didn't even "sex down" Faye at all. Faye is shown naked with another woman after a lesbian encounter (yeah, nothing's showing, but Faye's blanket is about three millimeters from nipple flashing), and they put her in the red dress that Faye--in the anime--Gainaxes hard with.
"It's not made by you."
Nailed it. According to the internet, Faye was only 5'6" anyway, so she just further proved she knew fuck all about the 'source material'. I can't stand these people that take on established franchises/characters to further their own career, that have absolutely no respect for the creation in the first place.
Yeah, its like she's never seen Faye before. She's sexy as hell, but, like, pretty realistically so. She's basically the poster child for "The woman doesn't need to have beach balls attached to her chest and bottom to be sexy". Not to say she doesn't have curves or anything, but she isn't exactly a High School DxD character. Its also not like she can benchpress a mountain, so its not one of those "You can't be that fit and have tits that big" situation. She has big boobs but like, modestly big. Not implant big or "I used to weigh 500 pounds and had them suck the fat out of me except the boobs" big.
She's got good makeup, good skin (surprisingly so for being basically a chain smoker...but she is pretty young, so...), good style that all just take her to another level.
They only got one thing right. This train wreck gave me the incentive to go watch the original again.
Yeah, my son started watching it just because of this controversy.
Its amusing that the anime has been all over trending this whole month, I guess many people are doing the same.
C-Drinker likes to point-and-laugh,
but honestly, it kinda fills me with real bad emotions to think they are the greatest Clowns
and just dont know.
Chris Chibnal for example HAS already gone-down in History as one of the Worst Content-Creators
in all of History (which is impressive seeing how much Content exists),
but if you ask them, YOU KNOW he would brag. He would.
He and Kennedy and Others genuinly think they are absolutely Amazing.
Me too!! And I'm enjoying the original immensely
I hope not on Netflix or Funimation (they screwed Vic Mignogna)
Rather, you have the Blu-Ray collection
"they couldn`t find a woman that looks like her, its impossible"
Then watch people spam almost 100% look-a-like cosplayers with the right clothing and style.
Was a little irritating to me. It's like they purposely cast people that don't look like the characters. Not even just Faye. At least the guys were cool about it though.
then you would be complaining that they hired a shitty cosplayer instead of a trained actress. This project was never going to succeed. There is no way a live-action was ever going to live up to expectations.
@@ElizabethD33 There are actresses who look like Faye. Hell, most of them do, she's pretty much the average chick in proportions and height. The outfit has to look correct, and the actress has to have enough brain power to not start ranting at the fanbase online. It's not hard to accomplish.
I loved the show. it was exactly like the ip
Billions of people on the planet and they always act like you can't find anyone even close
Not only did Daniella’s video backfire with the cancellation of the show, it unmasked her hypocrisy because of people bringing up pictures of her doing movies with a lot of revealing clothing.
Yup. Modern woke feminist these days are clowns... Annoying hypocrites clowns.
Quick counterpoint: the issue isnt so much about nudity/revealing clothes. The issue is about Fayes anime body. Secondary to that issue yes is its weird to have a female character doing everything in two ounces of yellow vinyl.
@@MonkeyHero What is this "everything"? Faye doesn't have a hand-to-hand fight scene every episode. There's only 2 times she has a hand-to-hand fight and it only lasts a few seconds. Faye is the type of character who uses her charm to get out of tight spots and when that doesn't work she uses guns or her ship. So, why is everyone acting like she's Bruce Lee all of a sudden? I can sympathize with a constricting outfit, sure, but Faye is supposed to be feminine. Because god forbid women can be strong AND feminine in this era.
@@MonkeyHero you can't make her character like the anime? Maybe that's a sign you shouldn't touch the IP in the first place.
Not just revealing she did all sorts of stunts in it and literally lied that it would be physically impossible. Funny that she made it in the past but when it is about something beloved for fans they can't help themselves but go out of their way to shit on at least half of their fanbase.
I love the whole trope of "unrealistic body standards" in regards to Faye's difference in appearance, but there's literal dozens if not hundreds of amazing cosplays of Faye that look exactly like her. They chose not to choose an "overtly sexualized" Faye, not that it wasn't possible.
yeh exactly...
and then she stupidly attacked the fan base... the pineda effect...lol
and instead of wearing something similar to the outfit she wore i the anime she wore a suit... a friggin suit.... how more boring and annoying can you get ?
i hope she never acts in anything ever again...... i think she was the major reason why the show didn't get a second season....
As far as body type goes I think a lot of people would have ignored a smaller chest if the actress was the same height. And that wouldn’t have been to hard to find an actress. But nope they just didn’t try.
Also there is SO MUCH MORE to Faye’s character than her looks
Yeah... you could have picked any 'adult' movie star with the right hair color and they would have been good to go. The ability to act would be nice but even one without talent could do a better Faye just by actually caring about doing a good job.
@@crimsonite2044 Exactly! Faye is sexy, but she's just a character that uses it to her advantage. She's not defined by her looks.
The most funny thing about this is the fact that original Cowboy Bebop was written by a woman, Keiko Nobumoto. And she worked on 4 good anime series after it.
Many popular anime have been written by women, even some Gundam ones.
FMAB, the highest rating anime of all time, is literally written by a woman
And she just passed away a couple of weeks ago of esophageal cancer :'(. Too bad this woke Netflix garbage was the last "tribute" to her legacy that she lived to see.
@@chriswhinery925 so youre basiclly saying that the show was so bad she got cancer? :(
@@falldiifadliifadill Uhh. . . it's the highest rated anime of all time on a single website (MAL), which means absolutely nothing. Not to mention that the only reason it hasn't technically been dethroned on the website is that idiots spam 1-star ratings on any anime that would overtake it. Don't get me wrong, mighty great piece of work but people need to stop this dick-swinging about FMA being the unequivocally greatest anime of all time.
I’ll say this again and again.
Faye’s original outfit was designed with the idea that she uses her sex appeal to distract and divert from her real self. It is a shell to protect how empty she is as a person. If she can keep everyone looking at her face and not into her as a person she can continue to ignore it too. It is what makes her stick with the bebop crew in the first place other than the money. They don’t see her for her sex appeal but they also leave her past alone. They are the closest thing to a family she could ever actually have. And it is all because, just like her, they don’t want to revisit the past either. They also don’t want people digging too deep. And as an entire crew, they tend to focus more on the now and the day to day so they can leave their histories behind.
I want to make a bunch of smurf accounts just to like this 100 more times! Exactly!
Agreed. While I feel the practical reason for her attire is to distract men using her sexuality, I would agree that the metaphorical reason is her internal emptiness; she projects her physical looks to make up for the fact that she feels no value on the inside which is another aspect the Netflix adaption gets wrong; Faye is an utterly tragic character.
But Millennial writers don't get these things. Theme, metaphor, subtext, and visual cues and imagery go over their head. They just don't understand.
Because of their wacko ideology and agenda all they see if the physical appearance or text of a thing.
Faye dresses scantily = she must exist just for men to fap to and objectify
Instead of:
Faye dresses scantily = she works in a cruel, harsh environment...wonder is she has a reason for dressing like this? Or, I wonder if there any cues in her backstory that explain why she would dress like this?
Get this person a writing job at Netflix!
face?
@@RandomStuff-yx4rx ikr! Just summed up Faye's Data profile along with the rest of the crew👍👍👍
A bit of morbid irony, the notoriety of how bad this adaptation is has overshadowed the fact that Keiko Nobumoto, the screenwriter for Cowboy Bebop, passed away on the first of December. Rest in peace.
Thankfully comments like this pop up on most flix bebo vids and lets people know. Only reason I found out :(
She probably watched the show on November 30th. Seriously though, I hope she never saw what they did to her work.
@@EverythingMustG0 Honestly, I have a feeling that if she did see the live action show, she'd rest assured knowing that since it was so radically different from her creation that her fans love for the original wouldnt be shaken. But who knows, that's just me being hopeful.
@@VagrantJavi777 Supposedly the American Godzilla movie like 20 years ago was so bad that it caused a revival in Japan so that's a good possibility.
Damn. I hadn’t heard.
As an old Cowboy Bebop fan, I feel like you missed the key things that ruined it for Fandom.
#1. There was no bebop. No jazz. No soul. It's amazing how much of the anime was developed and scenes specifically written for the music. They had the chance to bring in incredible music and film scenes around it but just didn't. Why is the ship called the Bebop? Because they had to in a way to work in that It's a jazzy space cowboy action dramedy western that leaves you feeling melancholy. It just worked as a glue for the episodes.
#2. Jets story. It was nice seeing Jet as a dad, but that is the opposite of what made his character great. He was a lone wolf even when he had Spike. The Black Dog that wouldn't let go once he sank his teeth into something. He has a dark history as a cop who becomes a bounty hunter after losing his job, arm, and lover. He barely has any personal connections left and that's why he needs Spike. Jet also loved jazz and that's the "real reason" the ship is the Bebop lol. Great actor though. With a different script, he would have killed it. Hard yet likeable.
#3. The Main Story of Spikes background should be the backstory/ending. In the anime you grew invested trying to figure out who he is/was and by the end, you felt shaken. You needed to rewatch it to pick up things. After you rewatched it, you watch it again later, sometimes just for the audio/soundtrack. The whole main show feels like it's missing and yet overdeveloped.
That's how I feel after watching the original Cowboy Bebop countless times since it was released (thank you early 2000's NYC Chinatown bootleg discount video stores for the $30 DVD collection of this, Trigun, and Outlaw Star). Thanks for your time if you read this.
All of this! You get it!
As little as I’ve heard of the music, I do really like it, yoko kanno definitely did the best she was able considering what she was working against
They play uptempo jazz when the fights break out thats Beebop's signature.
Josh - I couldn't agree more with your comment about the music. Yoko Kano, the composer of pretty much all of it, is totally brilliant. Besides writing the excellent jazz, she can fuse any two types of music and come up with something great. I bought the CD's as soon as they came out. There are wonderful melodies she includes almost as throw-aways that that could be made into top ten hits.
I agree with everything you said and would add a couple things.
1) The writers...they ruined all the characters... All of them. I was explaining to my wife to that both Vicious and Julia, in the original anime, were like Ghosts; they were ever present throughout the series but we hardly even actually saw them or even learned much about them except the impact they have on Spike. Additional to that, but when we do meet Vicious... He's an ominous, scary mother fucker. Vicious and Julia both, in the live action are given way too much screen time and they're both horrible.
3) Exposition. The original anime let the visuals tell the story much of the time, letting the viewer's mind go nuts trying to put it all together and figure it all out. The live action let's the viewer be completely lazy... They even have a backstory for the fucking rose.
Netflix: "No, Faye's anime attire is morally wrong & not allowed!"
Also Netflix: *"Cuties"*
Also, Faye was not a lesbian, so we have to change that too.
Maybe they would've given her a more accurate attire if Faye was a loli.
Bunch of fuking hypocrites
Important note: Someone not only approved this, but also written the script, gather a cast to participate in it and nobody questioned it, or even spoke up about it.
Someone in Netflix really has to speak up against this because that’s how proper staff and management works.
They don't like appealing to men. They do like appealing to nonces. It's actually not hypocrisy, just dislike of the nuclear family and the 'patriarch' within that framework. They sow chaos on that front to gain psychological power over other people's children.
I need to point this out, Netflix's Witcher for me also suffer the same "woke" treatment just like Cowboy Bebop, but the fans still hang around because of Cavill's darling attitude towards the whole series as well as the fans. He also paid homage to the ultra-popular video game through his gruff voice which is similar to video game Geralt and he stroll around the set like a walking Witcher novels wikipage.
Humility, that's one fatal thing missing from Netflix's Cowboy Bebop. At least that's my take that nobody asked for.
Cavill is extremely likeable. Character goes a long way.
A part of Witcher's appeal (books and game) is the geography and culture which is European and medieval fantasy based. That particular culture and look is unique. The show strips all that and substitutes its own aesthetic which is "otherworldly" and generic. It does not honor or maintain the original creators vision and is thus much worse for it.
I agree, they pushed the woke B S in Witcher casting, but I stuck around because the series was good
To add to that, they did change a major character and several support roles to other races but it didn't hinder the story as they did a decent job being those characters. Most notably Triss who is supposed to be a white red head in every medium presented thus far, but they chose someone different. She was more/less forgetable character as she wasn't in the story but it didn't hinder the story because of it. Much like some european based towns(the setting of witcher story as a whole) having asian/black actors in it. Again it didn't do the in your face diversify to diversify that other movies/shows do so I didn't notice it until an article pointed it out.
There's ways to have other actors play roles that they don't match the source material if the story is done well and compensates for any changes done. Even my first looks of Cowboy Bebop I knew it was going to fail. As it failed to capture the same look/feel as the anime did. Netflix has been hit/miss with its anime to live action adaptations. I will say the Bleach one has by far the best adaptation to it as it only did minimal changes with the story but had the look/feel of it.
@@juzi68 agreed
They're missing the point with the Faye controversy. When they see Faye in the anime, they're only see her outfit and outward flirtatiousness. They fail to see that she's uses her femininity as a weapon to manipulate people. She's tough yes, but her attacks are a defense mechanism. There is a deeper layer of vulnerability, mistrust, a fear of being betrayed by the world. The problem is not that they don't get the outfit right, the problem is that theyre so fixated on Faye's sexuality that they fail to see who she is underneath. Fans tried to to tell them that and they responded by strawmanning us, which tells you they are not only lost but ignorant too. We got a callous and bitchy character instead of an intelligent, multifaceted one.
That,s the important topic - missing the core of what makes characters great. Imagine someone who read Preacher and thinks " Hey this irish vampire swears a lot and drinks booze, that,s why he is great character".
The left's understanding of anything is only surface deep.
The writers involved seemed to have misunderstood that everything on the surface levels of Faye is a sham. She exudes confidence, sexuality, and all the other aspects of a classic femme fatale, but that's not who she really is. Its a veneer, used as her defense mechanism given her specific circumstances. She's a really complex and wonderfully written character, arguably the deepest in the entire franchise, but instead they threw it all out and made just made her gruff and sassy.
Maybe season 2 would have gotten there, but I doubt it. The live-action lost the nuanced shift in tone that the anime had, as when her second appearance in the anime unravels most of the first surface layer persona to reveal the desperate, sassy, selfish, and guarded *second* fake persona.
@@ryllharu Chances are good that the writers didn't watch the anime before starting the project and were only skimming it. Might have just referenced some written summaries.
I sorely doubt they noticed the depth and nuance in the first place because they probably didn't ever watch it for the experience as an audience would.
even if you just look at their "fighting style", Faye is less of a melee person, she is a good shoot. Jet is a power brawler and Spike is the kung-fu master, did they get that right in the show? Not really. On top of the fighting skills, Faye is the con-artist, Jet is the master mechanic and ex-cop, Spike is the sleight-of-hand pickpocket. Did the Netflix team gets that? Nope. All they care about, is bitching about how fans are disrespectful to THE MESSAGE
To the actress- we aren't necessarily complaining about your looks... or how you aren't physically like Faye. The bigger letdown is how the true character, demeanor, values, and the niche personality of who Faye is- That was missing. No matter how similar you may look like the character, if one cannot embody the true essence of the character, then it is something else that the anime does not portray.
On a side note, I think John Cho did an amazing job portraying the true essence of Spike. But the defilement of the production of this series ruined his character, and the whole series. But that's just my humble opinion.
yeh the faye character was a disappointment.....
i could live with her costumes and acting but NOT her outbursts (I never watched em but the reactions from fans was priceless... stupid is as stupid does I guess)
I feel so bad for John Cho. The guy is legitimately the only guy who is trying in the entire cast.
Though I get you, the actress still could have been reacting to people complaining about her looks. You know, people are mean. So even if your opinion as a fan could be from constructive cristicism point of view, rather calm, not heated, you are saying: "WE aren't necessarily complaining about your looks". You're not, and bunch of people also not, but she could have gotten tons of messages, that could have been aggresive, low and superficial. That "we" could be quite a broad concept, if you understand what I'm saying. Btw the actress is beautiful.
@@TheTolister het looks are subjective you think she is beautiful I think she is below average, and no nothing really justifys fueling the toxicity when she could’ve been a bigger person and not respond.
Yes “she can” but she doesn’t have to.
@@qucciretknoops824 I'm not judging her you know. Also I'm not saying that how she responded was right. We should just look at ourselves and not be so critical even about someone who is critical, and of course realize how people can be mean and judging by the looks. And that the "we" can mean a lot of things: the constructive criticism, also just people trying to be hurtful.
" When it comes to anime, the art generally comes before the politics "
Well said, Drinker
What a novel concept for Hollywood today!
As it should be in all good fiction
Most of what I watch these days is anime
@@jon636374 Same. Ive watched it for two decades now since I was a wee lad, back when bebop aired on TV. These days its honestly amazing how good some of these shows and writing are. Like drinker said, Japan doesnt give two shits about activists and they just do whatever they want which is why it can produce such amazing content
Shepard ma’am i soiled me britches in engineering I’m sorry
I’ve hated Daniella Pineda since Fallen Kingdom. The “I’m a perfect human woman with no flaws and I intimidate the men with my bitchy attitude” or as one of the other characters called her “a nasty woman”
Jesus talk about on the fucking nose with that one
Well, i had never even heard of her till now.☺️
And then when I Googled about her, I found out that she is a "comedian"
@@margarethmichelina5146 Really? I've never heard of her, same goes for the rest of the cast. Only the actor of Spike looks familiar to me.
Cracks me up how these women think men are intimidated by her attitude. xD
Great ending line by the Drinker, “The art should come before the politics”. He speaks for us all.
The original Bebop was incredibly politically loaded. Netflix’s adaptation was just shittily made.
No. If we are to have our ideal society, we mut manufacture it
@@MGSVxBreakpoint society is unnatural. Manufactured is the only kind
Everything seems political when you spend all day yelling at clouds.
But politics is a part of the art
I’ll never understand the need to “fix” Faye.
What exactly is there not to like about her? She’s brave. She’s charismatic. She’s smart as hell and is dangerous. Her choice of clothing and her choice of makeup is on purpose. She uses the fact that she’s drop dead gorgeous as a way to bring her targets to their knees. It’s an incredibly smart tactic that serves her well in her line of work. She’s an incredible character.
This one? I can somewhat understand that the costume may not be right for certain practicality in major fight scenes but that’s not a good enough reason. Her feminine wiles are what she uses as a bounty Hunter. You may not like it, but that’s what the writer wanted.
Can't have a female character looking feminine and attractive.
"the costume may not be right for certain practically in major fight scenes"
That's the thing, she's rarely ever active in almost all of the action scenes in the show. She can't beat down people like spike or jet, it's why she went with she could actually use and used shock and persuasion to get the drop on people. Even in the finale she wasn't moving much despite everything that was going on which is why i'll always call bullshit when her outfits brought up.
In fairness, what looks good on *cartoon characters* doesn't always look good on *live actors* and vice versa.
That said, Pineda's *attitude* and *man hating* was totally uncalled for! There were a million other ways that she could've gotten her point across.
For instance, remember the original X-Men movie?
LOGAN: You actually go outside in these things?
SCOTT: Well, what would you prefer, *yellow spandex* ?
@@grantorino2325 And I get the whole thing behind the costume. But you can absolutely create something that's true to the character and help the actor move during fight scenes.
Well, she's a dick. So there's that.
I like how the actress who played Faye said there aren’t any top heavy, tall, slim (and can act) Chinese women out there. I know I’ve seen them IRL. I’ll go away now.
Actually if you're getting technical Faye is from Singapore as opposed to China.
@@thefanwithoutaface8105 sorry not that technical, but thanks for the clarification.
I know one Japanese one. Smol, but big knockers. She plays....in some industries.
and we love them tall skinny top heavy chinese gals.
@@thefanwithoutaface8105 chinesse could also refer to ethnicity.
Fayes treatment alone reveals how little they understood the characters prior to making this shit show. Faye is a classic example of a femme fatale, a trope in which a woman is badass, good looking and uses her skills and charms to get what she wants, mostly by manipulating men who are dumbfounded by their charm. She was even directly inspired by the most legendary femme fatale in anime, Fujiko Mine. So her having a revealing outfit and flirty personality is integral to her character. By giving her a generic concealing outfit, changing her build, turning her lesbian and having her act like a 14 year old who thinks putting the word fuck in front of every sentence is cool, you haven't "updated the character for modern audiences", you've created a completely different character all together!
It's so ironic that their attempt to "modernize" a character who was an icon that could defend her self on her own, outsmarted almost all the men she encountered and who weaponised her charm to achieve her goals consisted of striping her off of everything that made her so cool and empowering in the first place. Cause having a character be an unattractive slob who acts like a toddler is apparently what's empowering nowadays...
100%
i had watched (a few times when released) and actually enjoyed the adaptation as i was desperate for anything cowboy bebop...
but yeah there was so much wrong with the faye character ... that reminded me how much it sucked...sigh....
i tried... i honestly tried and when i watched it shut down my brain...lol....
as powerbite says... 100% agree....
word
Faye’s sexuality was never overtly brought up in the anime why was it brought up in the live action? That’s something I can’t get over.
Studios these days HAVE to have an LGBTQ+ token character in everything they put out and it’s getting obnoxious.
I have nothing against LGBTQ+ people or community but studios changing a character or making the sexuality obvious for no other reason than to say “This is our LGBTQ+ character! Look at us!” irks me to no end. Does it move the story along? No? Then why do we need it?
(I feel the same for gratuitous sex in hetero relations too so don’t hate message me.)
The actress who played Faye was complaining about the outfit.
Faye's costume was intentional in the Anime. She used her feminine wilds to lure in unsuspecting bounties. So yes, it was very much designed for the Male gaze. But as a means of making her job easier.
It's a legit theory, which would make total sense except the show suggests she's more of an odd-job drifter, who now does bounty hunting so much because with the Bebop crew around it's easier. Yet she wore that attention-getting outfit when we first saw her and she was actually _on the lam._
@@henrysokol3466 you're asking way too much of these rabid fanboys to think beyond whats rattling around in their nostalgia brains
@@CerpinTxt87 Whoa! Reign it in... or at least try. That comment I responded to was hardly that of a rabidly intense poster. It was actually one of the most neutral and mild ones I saw here. It showed no loudmouthed sociopolitics, excessive emotion or detectable slant behind the opinion, and used logic that didn't require a sympathetic reader to make any sense. To see it was refreshing, and that person should be encouraged to keep that approach.
*A big part of the problem here* was that both old-school fans and those involved in making the new show got so intensely emotional and bitter that their fighting eventually became not a means unto an end, but it's own end. If everyone hadn't been so damn truculent and stubborn, just maybe it all could've been salvaged.
@@henrysokol3466
Her modus operandi was to look out for number one. Due to her experience when she first woke up. And if she had to take advantage of a few stupid guys to do it. So be it.
"She used her feminine wilds to lure in unsuspecting bounties. So yes, it was very much designed for the Male gaze. But as a means of making her job easier."
But you see, that's an explaination that actually requires to at least spend 5 seconds to get informed about the character, instead of just looking at it and making assumptions.
"The art generally comes before the politics." This is one of the reasons I love anime.
I want to use entertainment to briefly escape from our terrible reality, but it has become increasingly difficult to find movies and video games that don't try to force some heavy-handed political message. Anime is pretty much the only hobby I have left that I can simply enjoy without having to worry about "the message" being thrown in my face every five seconds.
I know what you're getting at, but Cowboy Bebop is pretty political, especially for the time. I guess it isn't "woke", but it's still progressive and pretty unwavering in its message.
I do not understand what the art is supposed to be without the message it is trying to send. Isn't that the point?
@@pawa4869 There certainly are anime with political messages, but they don't tend to be nearly as obnoxious in how they portray those messages as most western media is.
There's nothing wrong with having a message, but there are more types of messages than just those of western politics, and it's quite possible to have a message without getting political.
@@Shinigami41395 I do see what you mean, but I think the reason is that poorly thought out media in general won't have a well-done message. In Japan, that means it has basically no message (the majority of anime that gets ignored). Here, they usually butcher progressive politics as a cheap way to imitate having a message.
I'm not disagreeing, to be clear, I just think it's important to note that we're comparing the best shows/films of Japan with the worst shows/films of the West.
@@pawa4869 In my experience, anime with poorly done messages tend to just be generic "power of friendship" shlock, with a few exceptions. As cringy as that can be, I still prefer it over heavy-handed political messages in bad western media.
So even when comparing the worst of both, I still find bad anime more tolerable. Admittedly, this is just my personal taste.
@@Shinigami41395 Fair enough yeah
Faye Valentine is 5'6ft(168 cm), her cup size is C, and the reason why she wore that outfit is because she used her appeal to her advantage. They could've easily found someone that looks exactly or close to Faye, but wokewood simply won't let women be sexy anymore.
That's why the Black Widow movie sucked, too.
speak for yourself, I find Daniella Pineda very attractive.
@@ThePereubu1710 noone said she wasnt.
I already put in an application for "body measurement expert" and am currently searching for the correct Faye specs.... ("stop screaming - I'm just doin' my job ma'am")
This video contains a shot from the anime where you can see Faye's height. So where is she getting the 6 foot from? 1.68 cm is nothing special.
Faye’s anime costume was impractical for fight scenes? Tons of females in WWE and American Wrestling would beg to differ, have you seen those outfits?
I think in Gundam's video, he showed a post of the actress wearing a skimpy outfit so she clearly didn't have a problem then.
@@kosmosfan01 Yup that was brought up to her when she made that dumb video about how they couldn't find the right female to play that. In other words, they didn't want to.
What about Olympic Athletes? They are gorgeous, tall, wear something like a swimsuit and yet, they manage to do what most of mortals wouldn't be able to do throughout our whole lives.
It makes you wonder how the actress got the role in the first place if she couldn’t pull off the look of the character. Nepotism? Politics? Sexual favors? What possible reason did that woman get that job?
@@Ancientreapers Yeah, the whole situation just screams that they didn't want to put the effor there but yet Spike and Jet look pretty close from what I saw. I could be wrong though.
my dad, who has NEVER watched a day of anime in his life watched Ep1 of the Live-Action and the Anime side by side and his exact words "Why would they even bother doing this live action?" He then went on to watch the entire anime series on his own and raved about it.
good on him....
yeh the live action sucked the big one but i was so desperate to see any more cowboy bebop i watched the whole remake thing (i turned my brain off and enjoyed it... watched it a couple of times... yeh didn't hold a candle to the anime but ... at least it was something... a bit disappointed it was canned... but then again .. it gave me a serious laugh.. i think drinker got more views than the bebop live netwflix one got...lol)
Get him to watch Robotech: The Macross saga next!!!
I love the Anime and I love the live action version. Its only loosely based on the anime since they know weve seen it 1000 times.
@@worsethanhitlerpt.2539 i know... i expected them to copy the anime to the T but was glad they didn't .... as you said enjoyed both (well loved the anime... and enjoyed the live action..) and it was nicely unpredictable as not the exact same...
Hats off to the man.
That costume designer's answer to fayes costume is the reason why it bombed. Fayes clothing is a reflection of her character. She is a beautiful sexy woman, and she uses those assets as a means to get her way. She is a con woman, she dresses provocative because she knows she will get a reaction out of men. All that answer demonstrated is how little they know about the show. And faye didnt fight. She used her wits and deceit and firearms. She was also a complex and tragic character like the rest of the cast, not just a bombshell to appease male audiences. Complete and utter disrespect, for both the original art and the fanbase.
Exactly. They got Margot Robbie to dress like Harley Quinn, but this production team didn’t want to go there. If you are overly PC and timid, then stay away from anime. The Japanese don’t give two shits about offending anyone with their stories, and why should they, or anyone else for that matter. If you haven’t got the balls to tell a story how it needs to be told, then you’ve chosen the wrong career. Go become an accountant or something.
The fragile egos of actors never cease to amaze me. The fact that she said there are no 6ft tall double D women in real life, hilarious.
Yeah, I don’t remember Faye being 6 feet tall, she wore heels. That actress never watched the anime
Yep they are out there. One in a million, but this isn’t the problem for an audience. It’s a problem for a live action remake.
According to the Cowboy Bebop wiki, Faye is 5 foot 6. Asian women are typically shorter on average than American women.
Daniella is only an inch shorter.
@@Ryan_Thompson_Guitarist but she weighed 15kgs heavier than Faye 💡 I’m not here to care about her appropriate casting or not. I am here to say that’s not my problem. Jet was bigger - those guys exist. Spiku is a bit tougher, power at 6’ requires more mass than 75kg 😂
@@Ryan_Thompson_Guitarist Proving her insecurities are even more ridiculous than I first thought. So now she's just mad about having smaller boobs, got it.
The actress's criticism was way off. The lineup image in the show has Faye at 5' 6". She has C cups, and a violin figure. This is far from impossible to find in Hollywood.
The real difference is how they had her act and appear. You can find far more impractical outfits on female pro wrestlers who do much more physically demanding work, so that is no excuse. Faye is a multifaceted character, who uses her femininity as a deadly weapon. The show just had her as a conservatively dressed shallow spaz with near zero sex appeal.
I was confused by the height statement in particular as I thought of that same "police lineup" picture. Maybe she was purposely exaggerating, although I don't know why. Agreed that the real issue is the change in how the character acts/behaves.
Didn't do her due diligence, which is the only "dd" I'm looking for.
@@vafan13 probably to detract from the fact that she's short, flat and has a square figure
She isn't even Asian like Faye
@@Rannos22 true - and by the way, fun fact, Spike Spiegel would technically be german dude ^^ ( Spiegel is a German family name, it means "mirror" in english )
@@fumomofumosarum5893 You do realise that this issnt his real name? oO
And no one in Germany names his Son Spike.
Any more dumb things you wanna call facts?
The actress goes on about how the character is "six foot" but that's categorically false. She's supposed to be 5'6", so the actress is only one inch too short.
That's one of the things that really made her rant bad, she was either lying to try to make the criticisms sound unreasonable, or she was displaying her outright ignorance of the source material for the character she was playing.
Though she certainly succeeded at digging her own grave.
Or rather that of the show.
The tallest woman that I could remember was Loki’s daughter Hela in Hulk VS directed by Sam Liu and Frank Paur. Thor is around 6’4” and he barely comes up to her hips. But yeah this actresses is not only uncultured, but she’s over exaggerating like do you have any idea how tall a 6 foot person is in real life?
A lot of superheroes usually tend to be around 6 feet tall, or taller.
Yeah, but she's right. Have YOU ever seen a woman with double Ds and a thin waist?
I haven't since 2h ago when my wife went to sleep 💁♂️
@@stevenc2149 Faye doesn't have double ds. She's just not fat like Daniella, so her bust looks bigger than it actually is. She canonically doesn't have double ds at all. Dani is probably thin by American standards, but Faye's build isn't that out there at all by Japanese standards. Even though is Faye is Chinese. All of those East Asian nations generally have a similar thin build though.
@@LegacyComics100 It was certainly highly unprofessional
One good thing came of this show.... it pushed a number of people to finally watch the original anime, myself included!
lol.. well said!!!!
i had watched the original years ago...and was desperate for more.. this live thing was ok i guess as i was more forgiving as at least it was something...
that last episode showing ed...wow... so very very glad they cancelled this..... that was painful.....
I watched the original anime on Netflix a month before the Netflix adaptation and man, the original anime is so good with catchy soundtracks, lovable characters, the atmosphere and the actions.
ive never herd of it but i am now intrigued
A team of writers with no imagination "fixing" established art.
Painting a burka over Mona Lisa. "Fixed it for you"
@@sergueileonardoafonin7950 Using a crayon based on the skills of these "writers"
See: Wheel of Time
I identify as a cowboy, my pronouns are Be/Bop, and I give my skips a trigger warning before I apprehend them.
You're gonna carry that weight...because you're plus size and you practice body positivity! 🤌🤌🤌
"See you, space cowboy" is too exclusive! How about "see you, space cowperson" instead?
Oooooh you better not let Naomi hear that. we are missing out on S2 script... apparently. LMAO
I love how that one writer compared the cancellation to shutting down a restaurant just because you personally didn't like one meal. Bruh, this is the equivalent of going to a restaurant and as you're sitting down, the staff hands you a meal --even though you haven't even thought of ordering yet, the meal is awful when you do eat it, and on top of that, the staff moralizing at you and being passive-aggressive about your discomfort the whole time. The rejection is well-deserved.
It's like going into a restaurant and the whole menu is shit
@@michaelmcgee2026
LITERAL, literal shit, all options are just shit types.
It's like going to an imitation restaurant built inside a husk of another.
"Sorry, is this still a McDonald's?"
"Technically yes, but we don't have any of the original recipes or suppliers. We're gluten free though!"
Its like being an Uber eats driver and taking an order you were already hesitant towards and then pretty soon you're on the crime scene of the movie
"the human centipede" and now you're being served the meal that you never even ordered....through an assholes assholes asshole.
"moralizing" .....UHHHHH. WOT?
To be perfectly honest the only way to kill a show, particularly one where you're reviving an older property that many people loved, is tell the fans you're going to "fix" it.
i guess they "fixed" it that same way vets fix peolpe's pets....lol
literally what the producers of new the Amazone LOTR show said.
I liked this show until I saw the one where Spike bangs Julia. Bad soap opera shit at best now I see why people hate it.
What did it for me was how they gutted the characters. Anime Spike is a quick talking, fast thinker, who is tormented by his past, tries to improve himself, and doesn't kill people unless he doesn't have a choice or they're really REALLY bad guys. He usually even spares people that try to kill him because he doesn't want their deaths on his conscience. Netflix Spike straight up executes people with a big smile on his face. He's a literal psychopath.
Thanks for watching and dropping a comment you won🎊🎊 Hit me up on telegram for your package 📦📦📦
Going say you got a major point wrong. Litterally 1000s of Cosplayers have successfully excuted Faye's costume. Including fairly complex maunvers. Anyone with martial arts training will tell you tight leather is not a better action scene option. I was willing to give it a un hopeful chance until Danniela dropped her "we hate the fans" video then it became a hard nope
there is a difference between wearing something for cosplay, and wearing something you're going to be doing stuntwork/moving in.
good to know
Also, even if a costume is unpractical or uncomfortable to wear... as a professional, you MAKE it WORK. The excuses they gave were as whiney and shallow as it gets.
its impractical to fight in such costume, who would walk in this and hunt bounties...what if its cold on the planet where you're going....it just makes no sense in the real world...anyways the new costume was fine, it had the colors and the shapes from the original.
Practicality and money-saving might've played a role in the costume change, but it was definitely about covering her up.
I'm confused by the actress's non-apology for not being 6 feet tall. Peter Jackson didn't scour the world for 3 foot tall actors to play the hobbits in Lord of the Rings. If they had wanted to portray her character as being a particular height, they could have done it. That is literally a movie-maker's job.
Gets even better, Faye is actually 1 inch taller than the actress is.
She's a set of shoe inserts away from being the right height.
Also Faye is a C cup.
And the outfit which is way too flimsy? She wore less in a previous movie.
@@ArkriteTheMad Probably important to remember that cup sizes in anime are about as consistent and accurate as your average twitter warriors political beliefs, but in general, yeah, outfit probably could have been better, and height was really fine.
Just anything to play the victim
isn’t Faye like 5’9 or something
@@lb2kxx She 5’6”… Pinaeda is 5’5” she is literally 1 inch shorter than Faye.
one more thing. the original creator, sinichiro watanabe, gave them his criticism. and said something along the lines of "I pray and hope they listen. if you don't like it tell them." they completely brushed off a legend in anime for their own BS.
I fuckin knew it. I smelled BS when they said the creator signed off on this. More like he signed the check they gave him then they ignored his feedback.
How the fuck did they even get his property in the first place if he was so against it? Which he should be, because look at how they massacred his boy.
@@jase276 probably it wasn't clear at the beginning how much they massacred it.
You have to be in the production to see the damage. And that happens after the ink is set.
They did the same BS with George Lucas and so many others who put their trust into them.
@@jase276 uh, money. Throw enough it at someone and they will swallow their pride and/or engage wishful thinking.
@@jase276 because he sold it, you cannot stop someone from making something even if you disagree with the final product after you sell that portion of your ip.
I love how the first thing they always do is blame the fans... I happy to see that the Sonic movie producers actually listened to its fanbase, can't wait to see the second one!
To be fair, it's also a bit easier to make a fun comedy that's a bit ridiculous in that you can suspend your sense of reality and disbelief compared to a sci-fi space drama where the story really needs to be good to being the drama. Fun comedy is easy to get into because you can turn your brain off at times. Drama requires you to know what's going on/the story in order to really get into it.
Yeah, both of the Sonic movies are good as its best. Even though the second movie's plot in the middle has that long ass wedding scene, at least they know how to entertain people.
@@Ozzianman so... you're telling me that with out evidence you believe that they hired a full animator team, did a full length ad, animated a skeleton for a sonic that never was for... Psy ops. Okay dude. I have a hard time believing that is the case. If you had hard facts or some good examples of this I would be more inclined to believe you.
A few thoughts:
1) Casting was all over the place. John Cho was fine but clearly not given enough direction, Mustafa nailed the voice and clearly cared about his character, Daniela was so miscast and didn't have any idea what Faye was actually about, and Ed was just awful.
2) set design looked very cheap, in addition to fight scenes being choreographed awfully it just looked like a low budget fan film all the way to the costumes.
3) Mustafa's response on Insta shows how to respond to a cancellation and shows he's got a better character than that Daniela and that woke director.
Overall, this show never needed to be made and it was made by people who had little to no respect for the original and the messages it tried to convey.
I have no idea how you would even cast and execute Ed in liveaction.
@@mahguvnah7403 You don't, some things don't translate well from anime to real life. As was seen in this attempt. It's like that cringe kid in high school who always acted like an anime character, it just comes off as trying too hard.
Mustafa seems like a cool dude and a part of me feels bad for him. Best of luck for his future endeavors.
There is a way to get ed well done, but writers had to use their brains to do it and well that is hard.....
They can use the anime persona in computer screens when she reached them in some episodes, all with the quirks and things of the anime....
The twist can be when they finally find Ed IRL she can be the shy geek girl kinda shut in and introvert.... its not that hard and can be a nice change from the anime adaptation without being cringe af
Six foot tall with big breasts and thin waists do exist ,in northern Europe. Just not in the Asian community so much. They could have got that body type but it would be a white girl and they coudnt have that.
Every actor needs to take the Henry Cavill approach: everyone has their opinion and he hopes they do the best they can to make everyone happy and if they're not happy that's okay too..
Being humble isn’t in their programming
JustTheTip I'd say approachable but that and humble are practically synonymous when it comes to actors.
witcher was how to do it right. can't stand the rest of the d+ and netflix bloated dialog woke trash.
Except that Henry Cavill looks like he was ripped right out of the comic books.
Also, how his response to justice league pre-snyder cut. He's just a classy guy who knows its about making fans and being respectful of their opinions even if they don't agree
8:12 - Man did she just get dumped? The good old, "You don't know what you are missing out on" is high grade copium.
Never expected to see you here :)
@@VainerCactus0 My channel has huge audience cross over with this one. This should have been expected.
Christ. If someone said that to me; especially a woman, I'd quietly power walk away.
"You don't know what you're missing." Girl, I know. Oh, I know so well. That's why I don't want any of it. 🤣
Nobody was giving her crap over her body either, we were all mad about that lame excuse for not making her costume more accurate and the costume itself, especially since Daniela wore something similar in another movie.
Of all the writers they could've hired...
The ending really nailed it. The reason manga and anime is loved is because their creators care about what they are making just as much (until they're forced to drag it on because the higher ups say so). They all started from passionate creators wanting to tell a story or just draw something they liked, whereas things like this and their Death Note adaptation are *only* made for things like profit and THE MESSAGE. Wearing Faye's outfit is absolutely nothing compared to the months and years mangaka and animators go through for their work.
2000's Hollywood anime adaptations: We know nothing about this series, sorry :\
2020's Netflix anime adaptations: We hate this series, and we hate you. Give us money.
its hilarious because rn the holywood adaptions are more watchable then the current live action stuff
@@NoahGooder cause they made decent films that were were terrible adaptations while netflix makes an almost somewhat okay adptatin that is a terrible film in general
I think that's part of the fun, where in the past, the shows and movies that were made were pretty darn good, especially as there was actual competition. I'm sure we lost out on some bangers because the studios just didn't get it, but they were good even if the adaptions sucked in their faithfulness.
I compare the OG resident evil films, especially the first movie as they went pretty wacky fast. But, they were fun. You could forgive that they basically established their own universe in which their only tie in to the RE lore was a few dozen names, but, heck, the first one and maybe a few after that there fairly enjoyable outside of that.
Then, death note. They completely changed the main character into a stereotypical dope of a student away from somebody who academically successful (which, his character was a large part of why DN worked, maybe they just assumed that America wouldn't like a battle of wits type show?), they turned what I can only describe as airhead into the one who actually strived to do something with the book. it was bad faith adaption at best, IMHO, but, I could see that maybe if you weren't a fan of the OG, it was probably an enjoyable but mediocre experience. I've seen a few people try to attribute it to the fact that they squeezed half of a 26 episode series into a singular movie, but, I think that the japanese adoptions where pretty darn good considering their budget.
and then the new resident evil adaption, which I can only really describe as, paraphrasingly, "but, we wanted to attract a new audience". I got into the first RE game when I was young, and haven't had the cash (or, when I do have the cash, the time) to throw into buying up the entire series and playing through it all, but, I don't know how many fans of a survival horror series would love a show which is pretty much a teen drama. I don't know if their marketing reached too far outside of us nerds, but, whatever marketing hit us, I kinda hope it was just a misfire and they never intended to care about us, because if they did they're clearly out of touch. The worse part is that, even without the tie ins to RE, it just wasn't a tolerable show, the survival flick side of stuff was actually okay and maybe could of been enjoyable if it wasn't sandwiched between the worse show I've seen in years.
Step 5: "Blaming the fan base" is one of the worst excuses.
It's like designing a product and if it doesn't sell, blame it on the customers for not liking it or understanding it.
I can still understand if they blame it on the marketing or the producer for not making a clear policy which viewers to target, but blaming the "customers" is laughable.
It is the lowest of all things you can do and literally makes you immune to any sort of progress or improvement you can do.
If the studios don't do a thorough clean house they will go down by sticking to these talentless hacks. And they better implement a gag for actors in their contracts.
If a dog bites your hand when you try to feed it, it's time to get a new dog...
Yeah, and it reminds me of those Dragon's Den clips where one of the investors just says "This just won't sell".
It's actually the best excuse! All you gotta do is convince the fanbase that they're simply not WOKE enough to understand your message. CASE CLOSED BAYBE! SEASON 2 LET'S GO!
Culture marxism.... They think THEY are the intellectual ones with the right critical consciusness, and they have a duty to lecture and lead us stupid peasants, because we supposedly don't understand their sophisticated revolutionary world view. They don't ever consider that they might be wrong, it's the stupid working class and middle class, who are brainwashed by capitalism to ENJOY their lives and enjoy their movies and entertainment. They want to ruin our entertainment, because actually enjoying your life puts out the "revolutionary" spirit. They don't want people to be happy, they want to make everyone miserable. Marxists HATE when people actually enjoy the propsperity of a free market capitalist system.
"The art comes before the politics." - This is doubly impactful when you take into account that The Drinker clearly thinks of a well-written story AS art.
I'm the kind of viewer who stopped watching the reboot tv show The Equalizer because of woke politics but I just didn't see them in this. I enjoyed it and am pissed that I don't get season 2.
yeah but anime in general is much more crassly commerical than even western tv, in general. Bebop is an exception. I'm not saying it's all bad, but it is a stretch to say that, in general, it is a medium about "the art." It's not, it's about making money just like western movies, maybe more so considering that theres an entire trope of "fan service". I think he's overstating the difference to make a somewhat irrelevant political point, because overtly political works can be pretty popular among general audiences, like Squid Game
@@madrabbit9007 Honestly, I haven't really heard of anything involving this outside of that which took place behind the scenes, primarily the Actress and her awful video to fans. At the same time, that kind of thing was also a massive mark on Shang-Chi's record pre-release, which itself contained very little wokeness (outside of how excessively kickass his sister was, but that was a very small facet ultimately)
@@madrabbit9007
Well, something the Drinker missed. There isn't a black dude in the anime, so race swapping is pretty damn woke.
A well written story IS art.
“Don’t know what you’re missing out on” is the same kind of response the drunk cougar at the bar spouts when rejected. Lets you know you dodged a massive bullet in either context.
You know its bad when one of your lead screen writers has blm✔️pronouns✔️progslop✔️
The entire point of the show was that you CAN'T be a strong, independent person who doesn't need other people, because you'll just end up a lonely and a broken mess of a person, so...yeah, fits *real* well with The Message, doesn't it?
And ultimately that you will end up relying on others in some form or another, even when you're trying to avoid it.
Really? Might have to check this anime out. Thanks chaps
@@ThePrimeMinisterOfTheBlock I recommend it to everyone, Mr. Prime Minister.
@@ThePrimeMinisterOfTheBlock The show is a gem, sir, please do watch it in your pent house.
So let me get this straight, producers and directors like making adaptations of established franchises because they already have an established audience, but when that established audience hates the adaptation, producers and directors blame those audience? Makes sense.
They think it's an easy paycheck for them and try to blame fans when they don't get their monnies
I mean Netflix has a lot of LGBT people working there it is telling that one of them picked this director
Thanks in part to the advent of social media
8:13 man the left have ruined swear words. I wasn't opposed to swearing before but in recent years every sentence they use seems to feature an unnecessary, unwarranted f-bomb.
Get woke, go broke, not just a phrase.
Attacking the fans is never a good idea, nor is wokeifying a property everyone likes.
It's a lie though what major corporation is out of business from going woke? Losing one IP and staying on message is just a small speedbump in the creeping commie takeover if everything.
@@nationlessnationalist Out of business? Some, but most, like Gillette or ESPN lost a lot of money. I can name quite a few.
Whoooosh right iver you head. No wonder we are losing our entire civilization.
@@nationlessnationalist Maybe not the corporation going bust, but they do tend to amputate the diseased member when they realize they are losing money. Then think twice before picking up the poisoned chalice again.
@@nationlessnationalist lol, are you a professional troll or do you just do this as a hobby? "Broke" is a direction, not just a destination. The phrase means the same thing that anyone who starts a business should already know, that you need to treat clients and customers well if you want their business.
If I remember correctly, one of the defining features of Cowboy Bebop was that the series was built around the soundtrack and everything about it screams noir, but it's the blend of that noir with space that makes it so iconic. The creators of the series did the same thing with Samurai Champloo where they blended a hip-hop / R&B soundtrack to a samurai series (RIP Nujabes) Both had compelling characters that you actually invest in.
And that's where "modern" "entertainment" falls flat. It's riding on existing fan sentiment and expecting that to sell the product. Hollywood just doesn't seem to understand that just because a product has a rabid fanbase doesn't mean that rabid fanbase is going to eat any old shit just because it smacks of their beloved
I've got a coworker who watched and genuinely enjoyed the Netflix remake. He'd never seen the original, and was avoiding it so as not to "spoil" the remake. But I'm more happy for him than I am for myself now, because now he gets to watch the real Cowboy Bebop for the first time and see how it's really done.
Yeah I'm the same. First time I'd come across it so watched the remake from a blank canvas so to speak, without preconceptions. To be honest I enjoyed it and was hoping for a season 2.
I'm the same, except I chose to watch the anime first. (Finished Ep. 3 the other day.) Mostly because I think remakes and adaptations are unnecessary. If the story was good and told competently the first time around, it should hold up regardless of how much time has passed.
@@Americus2001 I think that is one of the best arguments against the live action remake. It failed to justify its own existence. The animation of the original is top notch, the story telling and artistry is great! The music incredible. What reason to even adapt it to live action? Just watch the original.
I thought you were gonna make 'And that's how we're no longer friends' joke
And that is what is wrong with the world today. People suddenly like pure garbage.
It's also been pointed out that her description of Faye Valentine's figure is horribly exaggerated. She's actually 5'6" with average size features. Daniella also did work on another film where she wore pretty much nothing, so it's not like she's never done this before.
Her stand was just an incredible take on ignorance and hypocrisy. Why would fans want to watch something made by people who hate them from the start and don't even do their own research on the show?
Attacking the fans is NEVER a good idea. It takes a narcissistic viewpoint to believe that 'the attack message' is truly for the 'someone else'.
And it still could have worked if live action Faye were to have been working under a delusion that she was hotter and better-endowed than she actually is for her femme fatale. My problem with it was that they tried to remake too many anime episodes instead of doing what they said they would - filling in the spaces between the anime episodes.
In the end, how hard is it to play Faye? They had Motormouth Megumi play her, in the ultimate type-against-cast ever (I don't count Eva, since Rei had like three lines).
Faye's costume wasn't the issue, it's was a symptom. Faye in this series just isn't Faye. Instead of being the clever, charming, elegant bounty hunter that she is, she was just basically a dude-bro with a gun. Costume and body type don't really matter much when it comes to writing and acting, which is where the issues lay.
When an Actor/Actress comes out of the gate with attitude. It doesn't even matter to me if I was excited about the show, I'm out! They are a clowns, being paid to entertain. Keep your opinions to yourselves and DANCE clowns, or get cancelled.
Truly. Faye is supposed to be a femme-fatale using her beauty and wits against her marks. Beyond that, we also see that for all her charm she's actually very emotionally broken. She's the exact type of character that *cannot* be made in the west today. She can't be beautiful and sexy as that would be sexist and she can't be shown to be weak in any way as women always have to be "empowered."
A femme fatale in club wear. Put her in some form of party clothes and it's closer to the character than the leather jacket look.
@@windsoboreas6073 it’s almost as if women have never used their looks to their advantage ever and it’s sexist if a woman is ever depicted doing so.
THANK YOU.
others: "consider subscribing etc.."
drinker: "go away now"
he really is original... and doesn't care... but people (and me..) subscribe anyway as he is such a good story teller and great for a laugh....
one thing to keep in mind is that each character was a style of music as the original writer saw that style. Spike was Jazz, Jet was Blues, Faye was Honky-Tonk, and Ed was Rhapsody. Jazz is simple but made complex through improvisation. Blues is slow and sad. Honky-Tonk was made due to abused instruments, was baudy, and tended towards themes of lost love, adultery, and loneliness (the Honky-Tonk bars also tended to be centers of prostitution). Rhapsody has its roots in classical music, and had a free flowing structure that made it seem freer than contemporary types of music. if the characters didn't embody these things then the show was going to fail, whether or not they embraced wokeness (that just makes it fail harder).
As I said in another comment thread, a western producer couldn't allow the Faye from the show (using her sexual elements to hide how broken and alone she was emotionally) as that would've been showing a woman being weak *and* being an "object."
Well based. Well thought. Well said.
Cool to know, gonna be listening to some honky-tonk and rhapsody now.
Thats actually a really interesting concept. Very creative
@@windsoboreas6073 so just make her a bitchy mary sue(like twitter wants) to avoid twitter heat? That's messed up and very annoying
The fact that she started the vid off with. I'd like to apologize to "the fans"... and then proceeds to mock the criticism with with poorly Veiled frustration disguised as sarcasm is what sent the show into a nose dive. It showed that she didn't give two sh!+s about the fans whose beloved property she had just adapted. She got but hurt and lashed out like a bitter, shallow woman scorned
Also, Faye Valentine isn’t 6 feet tall, she’s around like 5’6”(168cm).
She learned nothing from Captain Marvel's (Brie Larson) mistakes.
Funny thing is, these people ARE privileged, they fucking pretend for a living, don't have to dive in filth and tend to their goddamn garden. They live in their high castles probably full of contempt for their audience. They don't feel the real fear of someone potentially double high kicking them for real if they talked like on the video in person.
Not just actors, but many people say dumb shit online without consequence because we are much less likely to take a real slap on the nose for being a prick.
What really boggles the mind is that every cosplayer has come up with a better interpretation of Faye's costume than this show......... oops!
Also: if Tom Cruise can play Jack Reacher, who's described as a hulking brute in the books and make his version fully believable, well, the sky's the limit if you are a competent actor/actress. It all comes down to how you make the changes work and sell it to the fans.
Then there's the lead actor, who's way too old for the role and the scripts.............. eehm, they exist? In the end you're left with something that is Cowboy Bebop in name only, because almost everything that made the anime such a success has been turned upside down and flipped inside out.
@@TargunYssboern They cancelled because the show bombed. Those few alt right jerks did that too?
You can't respectfully portray a seductive femme fatale by removing the seductiveness.
For real!! Nothing about that actress even eludes to seductive.
and it's not even her outfit so much as her personality. It's just all so far off that it's just not the same character at all.
WILL Stargate become Woke next?!?
If Stargate becomes Woke, we have to Leave as one United
Fanbase. But i think many know that, so i leave it at that.
This ocmment here is meant to speak for the Other Side ofthe Medal though:
Hope!
I just sumbled upon a musicvideo and cant believe how
much of the 'SPIRIT' of Stargate it has. It's impossible to put into Words,
so please just see for yourself: 'Stargate SG1 - I'll go with you'!
@cat WHAT, THE, F*CK??
(Says that in the way the Drinker says it in the echoey tone)
Seen the video of Gabbage Claims about Wokeness?
Considering how many cosplayers happily dressed up as Faye Valentine both here and in Japan and in the rest of the world and were able to make her outfit accurately and true to character, I fail to see how that would have been considered offensive and exploitative. I can see how such an outfit would not work in cold climates or with a chilly wind, but seeing the crass attitudes from the cast and especially the script writer, I am glad to see that this failboat was dumped and they can mess up it up more.
I know, right? I produced a dance showcase where one of the numbers was Faye dancing to the Bebop theme song. The dancer managed to do a physically demanding dance number in a costume that was more recognizable as Faye than than big-budget movie version Faye's outfit. And this was a college age gal with low budget. Yet she nailed the costume better than a professional costume designer. Hmmm.
"Faye is impossible for a real woman!"
Everytime Hollywood tries to justify that stuff they're adapting is impossible, just look up cosplay, and see how some normal person who doesn't have a million+ dollar budget is able to pull off these costumes accurately and with a lot higher quality.
I remember when old superhero movies tried to justify that everyone had to be in a black jumpsuit. That comic costumes couldn't be adapted. That it would never work. Then the MCU came along.
If the MCU did one thing great, apart from a successful shared universe, it's really making old times comics costumes work.
They made freaking Mysterio work. There is no excuse.
You don't even have to. Superman's CGI moustache removal was terrible and someone at home did better.
@@leirbag1595 honestly, one of my favorite parts of watching a Marvel Studios movie is seeing how they adapted designs for objects, tools and costumes to the big screen.
The first time I saw the Mark 3 Iron Man suit on screen, my mind was immediately blown
@@Actinide5013 Yeah, they really did this well.
And they managed to adapt the Marvel lore to ease its adaptation as well. For example, fusing the Infinity Stones with certain artefacts did well to both have McGuffins and let this be building up to other parts of the overall story.
If they "can't make it work" why are they trying at all?
Them : Faye looks were unrealistic so instead of making her a confident femme fatale, we made her a sacarstic insufferable gay goth tomboy
Us : That makes no sense...
Them: If you dont like it youre a bigot.
Us: That makes no sense...
Them: Bigot.
@@badbilly7499 Them: "Faye's anime costume was impractical."
Also Them: *Has Her Fighting in a Leather Jacket*
Reminds me of the Rose Tico character on the newest Star Wars trilogy.
100%
Should've gone with man-Faye. It would've been better.
Well a couple things I think needs to be said about Faye's outfit. One: practicality and sexy do not need to be mutually exclusive. Two: Faye was never a martial artist mean that practicality could come secondary to sexiness as that was one of her primary tools and weapons. As you said in this video Drinker, she's a femme fatale type. She uses her body as a weapon as much as a gun. And her methods were always about being sneaky, seductive, and cunning. In the anime she was always pretty much helpless in hand to hand combat. SO have an outfit that practical for anything more than moving and running in is not necessary for her. While having an outfit that shows off and lets her use her sex appeal IS necessary for her character. But even with all this my first point still stands. You CAN be both practical and sexy, if you are willing to try. And clearly the people behind this weren't.
They only need to watch The Outpost for 5 minutes and watch Jessica Green be tall, graceful, strong and sexy whilst in some very tight fitting attire and completely owning it to know how much they got that wrong. Jess Green looks like she would have been a near perfect casting for this role too.
@@malphadour Never heard of her before, and yes, 5 minutes of watching random action scenes from the show it's all it takes, you're 100% right, she'd be perfect as Faye.
In Jupiter Jazz Faya did go out looking for a fight. Granted it wasn't against necessarily experienced fighters.
Don't female wrestlers wear equally skimpy outfits (if not skimpier) and are still able to fight in them?
@@malphadour If the CW only does one thing well (which I would argue is true, but their millions of fans obviously disagree), it is making their characters look pretty and/or sexy. I can generally spot a CW production from a 30-second to 2-minute clip of any show (sound could be turned off), just by how they make-up and present their characters. It's as if they have their own art style, like anime, in how their characters appear on screen, regardless of the show. And it 100% works. Everyone looks hyper-pretty and/or hyper-sexy, no matter where they are or what they're doing. If the CW can figure it and absolutely master it out on limited TV budgets, anyone else ought to be able to manage some facsimile there-of.
edit: I just watched a compilation of some of Jessica Green's fight scenes from The Outpost, and while I'm definitely not inspired to watch the show, I have to say Ms. Green looks like she's having a great time, and like her character is really enjoying being in fights. She's able to convey a lot of enthusiasm with her expressions, which I imagine adds a lot of fun to the show. Always a nice change from today's generally dour, serious combatants. And you're right, she *does* look sexy doing it, especially with her apparent enthusiasm.
I remember when people found out Hugh Jackman was going to play Wolverine, and many fans (myself included) pointed out that he is like a foot too tall, and didn’t seem to be a good fit for the character. After all, he is called Wolverine because they are small and dangerous.
Instead of getting on social media and bashing fans for their options, he went out and did his job and attempted to prove all the haters wrong, and won over most of them. (I still think he’s too tall and at the very least the directors should have shot in ways to make him appear shorter).
Now the actors and studios just fight and squabble with fans and turn them off from even wanting to give the movie a chance.
Your points at #3 are dead on - Pineda's egotistic, snarky diatribe made NetflixBop DOA. Watching this unfold, I recognized the massive shift in tone from audiences after she pulled that stunt. Before, I think most people were willing to give the show a shot and see how it played out, then they just wanted to watch the show go down in flames. Audiences have been antagonized, belittled, and talked down to by Hollywood for years and everyone is just tired of it.
How is she not getting sued is a mistery.
She probably honestly thought she was *entitled* to saying that B.S., too. She was basically Greta, only a little cuter.
Tbf the writing encourage the behavior of the character so it's the writer's fault
Agree completely. I had next to no interest in the show, but it was Bebop so I was gunna at least give it a go. After her rant I was straight up out
Faye's outfit would've been difficult to adapt for sure, but there were compromises that could've been made.
Instead of trying to be realistic, and (to a lesser extent) push agenda, they should've understood why Faye looked the way she did.
Anime Faye lived a tough life and the setting of Bebop was very much a "dog eat dog" world. Faye understood that and also knew she was a beautiful looking woman, so she played that up. Yes, a lot of it was artistic design, but it had a purpose. She knew her appearance would distract others (particularly men), and she played on that. Men were often so taken with her beauty they dismissed how dangerous she was and by the time they realized it it was too late.
Anime Faye played on her appearance, but she was still a very dangerous, competant, experienced, and crafty individual.
They didn't have to make it a straight adaption, but they should've understood there was a purpose to her appearance and found a compromise to keep it as part of her character.
After I saw "Knocking on Heaven's Door" I realised why Faye's red cardigan was an essential part of her outfit. It was disturbing.
Faye was literally introduced to us *at a casino running a scam.* Her entire character is built around deceit and manipulation. Her sexuality is her biggest tool toward that end. It's the entire reason when you finally get a glimpse of her as a kid it hits _so_ hard. You see this bright, sweet, naive, optimistic girl contrasted with a jaded, cynical, deceptive, desperate woman.
The moment you saw how they'd changed her costume alone you knew they'd missed the entire point of her character.
The Fifth Element's main character wears basically the same outfit as Faye's the whole film, including much more active fight scenes than Faye would've been involved with, and the outfit worked just fine. Faye's more about using her looks to get out of a situation, than being some martial artist bad ass anyway.
the writer of this garbage show: purpose? what is that? some kinda food?
@@roryasrorri701 I smell some high spices here xD
Funny enough Daniela Pineda is 5'5" and Faye is 5'6" so they're pretty accurate in height, it's Daniela's lack of understanding of the character that she was cast in to spout the "6 foot DD breasts" quote she tried to call a "clapback" and those photos of her in an outfit from another production looking an awful lot like Faye's booty shorts didn't help either.
Must be so hard for someone to just research about their character to get a good understanding lf who they're playing. But I guess that's just too much work.
Especialy when the very first image you get when googling cowboy bebop is the cast doing a police lineup. With their height in obvious display.
Faye is under the 170cm line.
I think she confused Katarina from the first episode with Faye, Katarina is around 6 foot tall and very busty (she's supposed to look like Salma Hayak from "Desperado", and Salma's a large D-cup). Maybe Pineda should've actually watched the anime entirely before ranting about fans....
@@berserkasaurusrex4233 I think she accidentally watched Slayers and thought her character was Naga the White Serpent.🙄
Plus the idea that less clothing makes it harder to move is idiotic.
I am actually glad that this didn't get a second season. Could you imagine watching several episodes with that portrayal of Edward constantly mugging for the camera and screeching every line?
You know, I feel like Henry Cavill was the reason so many people liked The Witcher show, my mother loved the show for him alone.
Plus, add on the fact:
-Not an asshole to the fans
-Actually respects the IP
-Understands the frustration and gives reasonable responses to why everything wasn't a 1x1 recreation
If Faye's actress took some notes, there wouldn't be so much backlash on her, and maybe lessen the frustrations with the redesign.
I enjoy the witcher show but ive started reading the books and damn it could have been a million times better if it was closer to the source
People don't love Henry Cavill for his acting abilities. He's a lousy actor.
People 'love' Henry Cavill for his objectively great looks, classicly handsome features and roided up build.
Faye's actress was also super passive aggressive about not being admired for her work. She didn't match the character from the show, but if her rendition of Fay had been particularly good, it wouldn't have mattered.
Cavill is a true nerd 😆 Plays 40k, collects toys, and trust me there are videos of him nerding out at conventions. He's an awesome dude. Same with Vin Diesel. Another admitted super nerd.
@@pennywisedaclown51
I hated Cavill in the Superman movies, precisely because I thought he was all looks and nothing else.
I **completely** turned around when I watched some interviews with him about The Witcher.
I now think he's an amazing person, and I'm really glad someone gave him a chance at redemption after the _awful_ script of those DC movies almost torpedoed his career.
"I want to apologize to the fans" - then proceeds to insult the fans, showing that an apology is the last thing on her small mind..
An apology wasn't needed. Literally nobody who matters is mad that Faye's anatomical impossibility wasn't perfectly rendered in the real world.
However, Pineda allowing a handful of manbabies to get under her skin like that indicates lack of maturity and lack of self-respect.
Uh... the very line was delivered with sarcasm. She was an asshole in that video but your particular statement is irrelevant. We were obviously never *intended* to think she was apologizing.
@Andi Magna I have my problems with stuff in this guy's overall attitude.
I decided not mention them to others here. The faults that don't require I subjectively read into things to find are obvious. Those who I could convince of them *know* he has them, so the comment would be useless. Any who haven't recognized them likely don't think they *are* flaws, and probably couldn't be brought about by reason.
Enumerating the guy's issues just starts ugly fights which no one really wins.
Let’s not forget that while he is snarky and touts his own opinion, the show did tank in 3 episodes. So, apparently he is not alone in these opinions. Considering what passes for entertainment these days, you have really got to screw up to kill a show that quickly. I didn’t see it, and it seems I won’t get to either.
@Andi Magna first time I ever see his video and clicked cos I was wondering by the show was so odd , and now I regret giving this guy a view because he spent so much time lambasting the actress, calling her angry/seething when she made a valid point, its almost like he was trying to truly blame her for all of it. anyway, defs never watching this dude again cos "the message" bits makes it clear white kind right wing empty vessel crap this channel is. eew
I actually finished watching the original anime earlier this year, absolute banger of a show.
Good on you
People also forget that one of the biggest reasons why anime doesn't translate well to American film is that anime takes advantage of being animated. There are so many unique stylistic choices that would never work in live action.
Agreed. I will never understand Hollywood's obsession with turning everything into live action. Is it cheaper? That's the only reason I can come up with.
One of the biggest reason is because these talent-less hacks don't respect the original content. Alita was the closest Hollywood has ever gotten and that's because the directors gave a fuck about the material. That being said, I still personally think Alita fell short because it follows the OVA so it pales in comparison to the manga.
@@jase276 I agree that's another reason as well.
Too bad anime is just so fucking cringe though...
@@PKMN37 Creating original series take too much effort and creativity. Nothing wrong with live action adaptation, just don't half-ass it or discredit the source material with your incompetence
It’s funny that Gal Gadot copped similar criticism for not looking like Wonder Woman. Instead of blaming the fans she gave some context to the criticisms and just did her job. A job which ended up winning over the naysayers and showed she was the right choice. Why can’t other actors do the same?
Olivia Munn even took it a step further. When they were going to change the Psylocke costume in Age of Apocalypse, she asked that they make it more like the comics, because that was what she figured fans wanted. Too bad they couldn't make the movie better.
I disagree she was the right choice, not looking like she has any strength at all and her acting being terrible, but I agree that she was a lot more mature about it.
I don't think it was anywhere near as much, though. Gal actually doesn't look too far off from Wonder Woman except maybe being slightly smaller-chested, but yeah, only a few folks who expected a PERFECT casting complained about that; she was still athletic, beautiful, and can act well enough for action movies. Faye looks completely wrong in every way, like it wasn't a compromise over limited options, it was just outright not fucking trying.
Probably cause she isn't hot-headed and short sighted. Some, well most people lack restraint especially in Hollywood where ego dictates.
@@kelp7060 Sounds like 1984 left you jaded. The first wonder woman was actually good and she played the part well.
Cowboy bebop, ghibli films and Akira maybe the only three stories that have been so perfectly and distinctly executed that all you can do is rerelease it or lose money
there were some really good bits in the live version... the message thing i didn't need... glad though that it wasn't exactly the same as that would have been a bit boring...
“Coming from a guy who knows just about as much about anime as Seth Rogen knows about being funny” never sell yourself that short
Seth Rogan knows as much about being funny as he knows about anything.
@@truthbetold1855 you are right!
@@brandonmshrock ha! Nice
I mean Pineapple Express is pretty funny
@Andi Magna nigga what?
Here's a fun fact; Faye Valentine was actually Singaporean in the original show. I know it can be hard to tell when everyone is drawn in a consistent art style, but episode 18 "Speak Like a Child" confirms that Faye Valentine (not her real name, by the way) was born and raised in Singapore. I know some people complained about how they race swapped Spike and Jet for more diversity, but I guess an actual Asian woman wasn't diverse enough for them? Or maybe they just didn't actually watch the original source material. 18 episodes is a lot to slog through if you don't actually give a shit what you're doing.
Hollywood loves doing that. They will change the races of their white characters to appear more diverse but whitewash their actual POC characters. This is seen in DC with Talia and Damian
I think I read somewhere that Spike was based on Bruce Lee and a Japanese actor “Matsuda sth” (I’m not good with names sorry ) so I thought the casting for him was pretty accurate ngl (him being Asian). My memory could be failing me though ! But Spike and Faye I completely agree !
@@valmuncfezarion8607 Yusaku Matsuda, yeah. He was an actor popular in the 70's known for playing badass noir tough guys, and a lot of anime characters homage him. Spike's fluffy hair and blue suit are direct references to his signature style. I'll do you one better though, Watanabe once explained that the main design inspiration for the Bebop cast was actually Lupin the Third. Spike's physique and mannerisms are modeled after Lupin, they often do the same hands-in-pockets slumped walk and even wear the same weird high top boots. Faye is an homage to Fujiko, Vicious echoes Goemon, and Jet is a blend of both Jigen and Zenigata. Watanabe really likes Lupin, because Space Dandy also was based on Lupin as well.
except Spike was literally said to be Oriental(Asian)
@@Easy420skate That was only in the shojo spinoff manga, Shooting Star. Not considered canon, since Watanabe had no involvement in it. To be fair though, Spike being Asian would actually make sense, he's based on a Japanese actor and was a member of what is clearly implied to be a Chinese crime syndicate, it's just never made concrete in the show proper. I guess that's just part of him being mysterious.
What was wrong with Netflix version of Cowboy Bebop?
1. being subtle as a brick: anytime there was a silent moment in the anime, the live-action had to spell it out loud, treating the audiences as a bunch of 7 years old.
2. butchering the characters: the problem was not the appearnce, but the substance being completely off-track (I think Faye's look was totally fine, the fact the she was no longer an addicted gambler but default Hollywood badass woman was more of an issue; and don't get me started on what they did to Vicious).
3. the "message": the anime was actually very inclusive and progressive, and had real social commentary... but I guess that taking a stab at e.g. healthcare insurance costs or widespread corruption among the police was too dodgy for the SJW bunch, which played it safe with their woke crap.
@Andi Magna *Bruh*
@Andi Magna Even if that were true, correlation is not equal causation. One likely interpretation would be that some directors want to push a political message with their movies, which leads to worse movies but also to hiring of a more inclusive cast, leading to inclusive casts and worse movies being correlated even though the performance of actors of different ethnicities and backgrounds is the same.
@Andi Magna you forgot to include the “/s” I think people are taking you seriously
I mean Drinkers do goes over the top when he sees strong black female characters. Movies did made him a hater.
Get started on Vicious because holy shit.
Dude, I accidentally found out your channel. You are killing it! Keep up the work. We need voices like that in today's world where it's about "the message", or being politically correct and not quality oriented, or blaming the fans for incompetence of the creators or... well, you got it.
Cheers.
That speech - what I heard was “how dare the fans expect actors to convey the look and feel of a character!” But isn’t that what actors are paid to do?
That's why they're called actors. An actor is supposed to play into the role or character the story revolves around. But nowadays they think they are awesome enough by themselves so if you don't like them you're a virgin/incel/racist/maga whatever
Rather, actors & screenwriters are nowadays paid & pressured by higher-up movie executives. These movie execs, who don't know a thing about good story-telling or movie production, are forcing the actors to be a Woke Messenger in every form of movie/anime/manga/book novel character they adapt to screen.
Contrast to Hugh Jackman who was first regarded with skepticism because he was physically dissimilar to the comic book wolverine but he simply played the roll well and won over the fans
@American Hero we're not talking Bugs Bunny, this seems to be a character that could be adapted for live action in a manner true to the spirit of the character it would never please everyone but I think it's a missed opportunity
@American Hero I don't like constant negativity either (and this channel does a goodly number of positive reviews as well) but the recent trend of taking an intellectual property and adapting it in a manner that is untrue to the original vision is upsetting to those who enjoy the original and who paid money to make it successful and it ticks those fans off when they are ignored and belittled, why is that wrong or unreasonable? Still I have things I like and things I don't, I don't get overly passionate about fictional characters but I do enjoy them and I enjoy discussing what makes a character, a story, or a franchise worth making an emotional investment in, I say if I like it or if I don't, I don't think that makes me dumb, bearded or inbred or whatever else you think people you disagree with are.
No one talks about how an anime director whose work is known for its distinct kinetic visual flair as animation does not translate well to live-action. Critical Drunkard’s focus on bad story writing is good, but let’s be honest, the Netflix adaptation just doesn’t even have the precision and refinement of the anime at all. As someone who enjoys the high marks of 90s anime, this was the first and biggest turn-off.
Well written. This was my biggest turnoff, the clumsy cuts, the awful pacing, the complete lack of dynamism. I was bored by the casino fight.
I recommend 'My Name'. It's korean and on Netflix. It's proof you can get awesome fight scenes on a TV budget. There was no excuse.
Nor the fight choreography too go up against the fluidity
of some of yutaka Nakamura's best works when it comes to hand to hand combat
This is why a live action Ghost in the Shell was never going to work and why the Vampire Hunter D series I was hearing about a while back would never work. And why this Akira is going to be awful no matter who does it. The only good anime adaptations are The Matrix movies.
Agreed, as son as I saw Netflix's version of the opening I lost interest, some shots that are ripped right from the OG opening like Spike and Jet sprinting somehow look worse and janky that the animated ones.
Same with fight scenes, despite being live action and shooting that kind of scenes is easier and less complex that hand drawing them frame by frame, they look less fluid and more robotic than the anime.
The man who made this show, Shinchiro Watanabe, literally said to "pray the show is good" when asked about it. He knows it won't & it didn't. The cinematography was garbage.
It comes down to hubris. The writers of this thought they knew better than the creators of the original. Instead of understanding and respecting the genius of the source material they thought they could disregard it and "improve" it. They were delusional.
If there was ever a spot for the "Pure. Fucking. Hubris." clip it was in this review.
@@asshat6482 I'd go with J. Jonah Jameson.
What adds insult to injury is they claim they consulted with the creator of the series and then basically ignored any notes or comments from them. I've heard very clearly that the original creator said they completely disavow this current iteration basically knew it was going to be bad.
I saw this video about 3 weeks ago, and started watching the original animation on your recommendation, CD. Good God, man, you've done it again!! Spectacularly great show, and I loved all but 2 episodes of it! (Sorry, I had to be honest with you.)
How to fuck up a franchise:
1- Do a Kathleen Kennedy (force activism: "the message").
2- Do a JarJar Abrahams (mediocrity and laziness: parasite from previous work).
3- Do a Ruin Johnson (fuck up original characters to make the new ones seem better: diversity and inclusion).
4- Do a Brie Larson. Feed you ego and virtue signaling by antagonizing the fans and then double it down in anticipation to rejection and failure.
5- Blame fans and customers for failing.
Eh, Wait! Brie L'Arson wasn't credited with the act of dissing a fandom already put on alert by previous lame pandering productions? In the words of Queen Brie: "Is that a personal attack or something?"
@@Solon_The_Lich Oh, yeah, she should the the N4. Edited.
@Andi Magna You're just looking for races to feed your racist RRRRREEEE. I bet you he's praised Idris Elba and other blacks in GOOD MOVIES they were in,not bad ones.
@Andi Magna I really hope you're a parody
@@horrificpleasantry9474 Judging from the other comments made on the channel my guess is no.
Not too long ago I wasn’t really into anime. The stereotypes and extremists made me wanna avoid it at all costs so I wouldn’t feel associated with them. However, after seeing several different series recommended by my brother and friends, it’s no mystery why anime has seen such a huge surge in recent years. They tell good, compelling stories that don’t feel aggressive or preachy, and don’t make it feel like the writers hate me bc I’m white, straight, or a guy. And what’s even more funny and ironic to me is that so many of these shows actually incorporate many things that these nutcase SJWs demand, that being strong female characters, diversity, etc., the difference being that it’s done in a smart, compelling way that makes you care about them as characters regardless of what race, sex, or whatever meaningless characteristic they have. It’s just nice to know that somewhere in this fucked up world there’s still people who just want to tell good compelling stories
Well, they are preachy (specially shonen) when it comes to "the power of friendship"
Anime and books are the last bastions of good story writing.... :(
@@osez111 True, but 'friendship' is something everyone can be a part of, not confined to groups depending on their race, sexuality or religious beliefs. and at the end of the day, feeling like you have friends you can count on is a better feeling than being told you're an overpriviliged piece of shit because you're not a minority.
@@osez111 They can be (looking at you, Fairy Tail) but at the end of the day... is that really the worst thing ever? Yeah it can be heavy-handed. But everyone needs friends, and good friends are absolutely worth fighting to keep. (And remember.... shonen is targeted at young boys. So... duh.)
For me Anime does LGBT characters better than anything SJWs create.
Soon as I heard a live action Cowboy Bebop by a western production I thought "wow this is a mistake." So hearing it crashed and burned brought a smile to my face.
Attention seeking kids award
@SamSam Don't even have to look anything up about it to answer that confidenly with-- no. It won't be.
@@mgh7634 Have no one learned from DeathNote. Huh. nobody?
You should watch Rouge Origin fan films. Their Spike is sooo cool, even though his hairstyle is different, he is still 99 % closer to the original spirit than the old dude from failed Netflix series
ua-cam.com/video/DQcykdQ6xks/v-deo.html
Damn. Rude much? Don't like it, don't watch it. Next.
Similar happened with ghost in the shell, so much potential gone to waste. Alita was a step in the right direction.
"The message" is so nuted. Well said drinker 👍🏼👍🏼
I watched the live action show, but only after binging the original all the way through, and I found my hate right in the first episode. My moment of clarity? Vicious. It's like taking a classic ubervillain, Sephiroth or Sauron or Voldemort, and just neutering them. You can't show the most terrifying killer in the original show by creating a new scene in which he yells pointlessly at his wife! Why? If the villain is no longer scary then no one will care if the hero takes him on, how is this so hard to understand?
Anime Vicious would never yell. Anime Vicious is all cold hate.
He's like the Joker. You can never tell what he will do. You can never guess where his whims lie and what he's thinking.
He could be there to kill you. He could be there to just say hi. You don't know. You never know. And what's worse is he might show up just to say hi, and, mid-conversation, decide to kill you... and there would be no sign outwardly that this has happened. You could go from a friendly conversation and both of you laughing to his sword out and your headless body slumping to the ground IN A MILLISECOND.
And all that uncertainty is exactly what made him so terrifying in the anime. Him even being in the room was nerve-wracking and tense and dramatic because you just had NO CLUE if someone was about to die or not.
Netflix Vicious was a joke character, they had to show him choking out Julia just to shove it down the audience's throat how evil he was. Plus that nonsense about getting his goons to buy chocolates for her after. Seriously? I switched off after that episode as it was just a complete waste of my time and attention.
@@Negativvv Did he also kick the corgi while he was at it?
When the only thing your brain can think of is "THE MESSAGE" all else is hard to understand and gets drowned out.
Was coming to say I did not really have any issues with the casting except for Vicious, when I saw him acting like a little bitch I lost interest in the show and stopped watching. I was completely unaware of the pre-release issues the Drinker spoke of in the video, but I can see why a lot of people were turned off right away. I didn't have my hopes up anyways, I always assume all live actions will end up being a new M Night Airbender, but enjoyed the three main actors portrayals of the characters.
But as soon as I got a couple of episodes of Vicious, I saw where it was going and decided to save the few hours of my life rather than continue down the drain.
I didn't care how much she looked like Faye. She just didn't seem to be written like Faye. She was a different character entirely.
She was reduced from "perpetually lost, persecuted, but independent, manipulative and dangerous femme-fatale" to "generic female action lesbian, this time without the side of her head shaved".
Naomi Markman : "Fuck you're missing out"
Sorry but we learned our lesson from Picard and STD and Dr. Who. They basically said the same thing "Ok, ok, it may SEEM like it sucks now but just wait, it gets better."
Nah. I didn't waste my time (even though I have time to waste) on those and from the reviews I've seen it was the correct decision. And yes, I'd rather watch hours of reviews of a bad show rather than watching the bad show itself. Far more entertaining.
Hollywoods God awful responses to reviews of their shit has become infinitely more entertaining than anything they intentionally create anymore.
Right there with you, I'm just waiting for be day when it's illegal to review a movie and you have to be okayed by the studio or you'll get sued.
naomi markman stands with black lives matters. LOL. All I need to know right there not to watch this hot garbage.
"Give it a chance, how do you know it's shit if it hasn't come out"
*season 1 drops*
"it's just the first season, plenty of shows have had a rough first seasons"
*second season drops*
"There has been production problems as to be expected, but they will pull through"
*third season drops*
"Ok the fans probably may have slightly been the tiniest bit correct in a few places, but this is a show of the now and it's what society needs during these troubling times"
We won't missing out. We have the original anime to watch.
The only highlight of this show was Mustafa as Jet Black. He actually nailed the characters sound, voice, mannerisms and appearance quite well. I think with a better script him and to a lesser extent, Cho could have actually made this work. Cho was also really really dedicated. It's just too bad the script was so terrible. They changed everything about the stories ending that made the show's story function properly. If they had just fired this one out, with a script that mostly matched the original and made it a one-off 12 episode homage and kept the core story the same, I dont think anyone would have been too upset, but instead they had to shoe-horn in so many changes to the core characters and story that they ended up just throwing out the baby with the bathwater and totally missed the mark. A lot of wasted potential here.
"The art comes before the politics." Well FUCKING said.
That's a weak argument for why it was bad. There is politics in lots of art though. Even the original was filled with political themes.
@@JS-oh2dp Because to certain people, art MUST be politics. If it isn't political, to them, it's simply not art.
That's a thought, but some would disagree. I believe that the political nature of art takes precedence to its aesthetic, not the other way around. But that's not the argument we're having right now.
Anyway, on Cowboy Bebop. If anything, the live action version is less political than the original show. There are a lot of themes that were lost in the translation, which leads us to... This.
@@redflags6583
There is a good way to use politics in entertainment and a bad way
Good way :90 X men show and comics
Bad way : modern X men
@@painvillegaming4119 all art is by nature political. It is a reflection of the artist's material condition, their values, beliefs, what is important to them, and so on. There is no "good" or "bad" way of using politics in art. Such ideas come from interpretations of the reader/viewer, or from its aesthetic execution. But the political nature of art, in itself, is as natural as the artform itself.
as was pointed out elsewhere, they do these adaptations of beloved franchises thinking they will inherit a built-in fanbase, but what they actually inherit is a built-in critic base. it's like playing a game on hard difficulty while thinking it's on easy difficulty. doomed to fail from the start.
That's a great analogy. With a known property there are certain expectations that have to be met. Some of these expectations are undue or uncalled for. Other expectations are the foundation for what made the original popular in the first place.
I like that -- "built-in critic base". And it's absolutely true -- I saw Chris Reeve play Superman in the theater back in 1978, and thought "He isn't built like Superman". If anything, I've gotten pickier over time.
The most frustrating thing is despite this obvious result they still don't learn, and then continue to repeat the same process on another existing IP...
That's the definition of insanity if I'm not mistaken 🤨
Given how regarded it is, it's setting yourself up for failure. If you're going to remake/adapt a masterwork (with a specific form), it probably makes sense to try and appeal to a different audience. As a comparison, if you were attempting to recreate the mona lisa, you'd have two options. 1) Use the same form and INEVITABLY fail to live up to the level of artistry/originality. 2) do something that was a radical enough departure to avoid the expectations that came with the original and appeal to a different base. Regarding Cowboy Bebop, there were enough people unfamiliar with the original that a tv show could work IF IT WERE INDEPENDENTLY GOOD and they were careful to only get existing fans with a managed understanding of the different product. ABSENT THIS, the message is "You loved the original? Here's a bad photocopy."
I’m trying to think of an example where this actually worked out. Ah Dune… dune worked pretty well.
I don't know if it's feminine insecurity or what, but I can't help but notice how often actresses sabotage themselves by aggressively responding to critics where male actors would just let shit go knowing that their performance would ultimately be what brings their detractors around. Like when fans were going off on Heath Ledger being cast as the Joker prior to The Dark Knight's release, Heath never called out the "haters" and admonished them for not liking him. Likewise when Robert Pattinson was cast to play Batman, which I certainly thought was a miscast until I saw the first trailer. I don't recall him ever taking to social media to shame people for not immediately accepting him. Another commenter below also brought up Tom Cruise playing Jack Reacher. I'm sure there are many more examples, but it's hard to recall them because the outrage has long since been forgotten; which is the whole point.
Whenever you're adapting something with an established fanbase, a portion of those fans are invariably going to be upset at things they feel aren't faithful to or respectful of the source material. The appropriate response to criticism is to keep your mouth shut and let the final product do the talking for you. If you feel your adaptation is good, then it will stand for itself and the haters will be silenced. All lashing out and trying to shame the fans into silence does is tell everyone that they're probably right to be concerned.
I recall Michael Keaton and Hugh Jackman were also go-to's when talking about actors who did not initially seem like the right fit for an adapted character, and instead of popping off, they bided their time, and let their performances win people over.
Let's also not forget Lord of the Rings. I'm sure the Tolkien fan base was skeptical as fuck all the way to release.
I'll say this: Women are less used to open rejection than men. Men (in most cases) deal with the rejection, harsh criticism, and open mockery with quiet stoicism and move on. They're expected to. Women aren't. (I'm working on majorities and averages here - Gal Gadot didn't attack WW fans who doubted her, she let her work speak for itself.)
Imagine if any of the guys did what Faux!Faye did. They'd likely be fired. A woman? Completely different. Fortunately for us? These self sabotages have been happening so frequently that I'm hoping hollywood gets a clue.
Women generally have the emotional maturity of a six year old, on their best days. It's rare that you find one who acts much older than that. But in Hollywood, I think the real issue is that there's so many women trying to be movie stars and so they are all so replaceable. If any of them gets a shot, they know it's probably the only shot they'll get. Even the slightest threat to that shot and they'll have a breakdown as they imagine being waitresses in LA forever.
Women nowadays would disagree and feel they are being unreasonably attacked for being female and men don't deal with this sort of hate because the patriarchy. They always blame men and not once do women ever examine themselves. I cannot stand the victim mentality.
In The Bebop Beat podcast interview, the showrunner André Nemec talked about what would happen in season two: the reveal of the Cosmonaut; Ed finds out the true meaning of family; Jet's mechanical arm trips out; while Jet is tripping out, his arm is unusable and plays the saxophone with one hand; Spike's demons of the Blue Crow massacre will be put to bed; Faye finds who she is; Julia discovers "Heavy is The Head That Wears The Crown"; Vicious is reborn and Ein saves the day.
Funny thing is, in the anime character Faye's bio it states she's supposed to be 5'6" the actress that played her is 5'5". She was never supposed to be 6' so she's just lying or is just that ignorant about the character she is supposed to be portraying.
She just LOOKS tall because of how lanky she is, so she just assumed six feet probably lol
@@dethmaul Exactly, she is assuming. As to assume is one of the big no- nos of woke culture, I am once again baffled by the double standards of the people which represent it.
She could've pulled it off its just she's not as busty and the clothes aren't as revealing
its a hyperbole. faye wasnt the reason bebop was so great
I paused it long enough to read the director's twitter bio, about being a raging lesbian / feminist / eco anarchist / leftist revolutionary / advocate for restorative justice, etc. etc. I appreciate her telling me everything I ever need to know about her and her "art." I'm looking forward to never watching anything she produces, ever.
nah man dat girl's profile looks like a meme lol, never thoght that i would see an over the top activist, crazy world we live in
oh jeez.. i didn't know that ... expl;ains so much....
@@lit2347 Reality is stranger than fiction lol.
You know if someone's twitter has their pronouns on their bio, it's an ultimate red flag
Daniella really was the reason I couldn’t bring myself to try and watch it. I have an issue when actors attack fans prior to release, like Ghostbuster 2016 or the whole Brie Larson fiasco.
Or the Doctor Who Impersonator. It's officially a trend now. Maybe they take specific classes in acting school? "Method Acting", "The Stanislavski Method", "How to alienate a whole fanbase before release", ...
Brie Larson. *spit*.
@@angelat7957 tbh for Dr. Who it was more the writers then it was the actor playing the doctor
She's hot but sucks at acting.
Yeah because the fans are kind to those actors and really speak with a reasonable mind. I hate it when Netflix (or any other platform and/or media) changes things so they can be more "woke", but I can't say I'm not with the actress in that case.
I'm impressed by the way that you said "Hollywood sensibilities" without breaking out laughing. I don't think I could. And listening to the actress playing the Valentine's character was like listening to nails on a chalkboard. God help whoever has her in their lives.
John Cho seems like a nice man and I didn't see any antagonism from him, and he was clearly very invested in the project, and he's very crestfallen that it's been cancelled.
I can't help but feel bad for him. Feels like a nice guy in a crap situation. F in chat for John Cho.
He really isn't a bad Spike. He needs to get more in tune with how depressed Spike comes off as and most times just looking physically exhausted and uninterested so when he perks up before fights or hearing something he's happy or interested in the impact is more meaningful.
I like John Cho but the guy is pushing 50. He's way too old to be spike now. Maybe 15 years ago.
The guy who play Jet and the girl who played Ed seemed more sad than Cho.
I like him but he is absolutely not the right person for this role.
Jon Cho should have played Spike 20 years ago when he was 30 now he just looks lame and old