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Let's be honest. Most people don't have careers. They have jobs to pay their bills and maintain their lifestyle. Very few people express much interest in "climbing the ladder" aside from vague remarks about wanting a promotion. Similar to dating, job advancement is largely about who management likes and who they don't. HRs job is to justify those preferences.
this is very true ... only a really tiny amount of people really achieve a big career .. the rest will be average. just like with everything in life ...
Oh geez. This was so triggering. I spent 6 years in my last job thinking opportunities were coming. They didn't. Now I am trying to make up for lost time in the middle of a pandemic, and it's super discouraging.
I spent 5 years before I realized this. the kick in the gut for me was a Level 1 SW Dev making more than me after 4!!! Promotions. I don't blame anyone but myself for getting complacent. That is not going to happen again!
@@alaind276 wow my employer laid me off during pandemic otherwise i would have stayed at the job for much longer. my boss kept pushing the deadline for a promotion every annual review. then i realized i was being paid too low. i got a new job with 20k more pay.
I just left a job after two years for a different company, I was being paid 41% below the market average and had no room to advance. Now I have doubled my pay, I get to save, invest and fix my credit, and I get to work from home now. Best decision ever.
Leaving my "steady" job was the best decision I made for my career! I doubled my salary within 2 years by leaving. Thank you for your information. I've been binging on your channel :)
Yeah, I got forced out, was making 21 an hour. started making 24 an hour, quit that shithole job. Then went directly to 80 grand a year. Got assaulted, beat the guys ass, and got canned. Now I make good money when work is hopping. House paid for, 3 trucks paid off and in tip top shape. I can't complain.
You were probably able to double your salary because your company was able to see that you were a person on your previous job that stayed for a long time lol! That did help whether you think it did or not, I bet.
I was a Joe, for nearly 7 years, working a terrible job and feeling under-valued and under-appreciated, and generally depressed as I saw others promoted up and over me. It nearly cost me my marriage. Never ever: get too comfortable, stop developing, let anyone devalue your work, tolerate inconsideration of your well-intentioned input and creativity, and most of all, never lose your passion for serving people in a manner that is reflected in your pay.
If the manager is ambivalent to you, your performance doesn't matter. All your achievements will be overlooked, at best. At worst, only your flaws will be noticed.
I believe there is a type of role bias when you slowly work your way up. People will always think of you as the person that started entry level. You tend to get more respect when a new company evaluates you with fresh eyes. Or, when there is a leadership change and the new leader sees you were you are not where you were.
Steady jobs mattered when company loyalty still existed. People worked with companies for 20+ years and retired with the gold watch and the pension. It doesn’t work that way anymore. If you are hired for a particular job, you are more than likely going to stay at the job, and you get maybe a few raises and a title change from “associate” to “senior”. If you don’t really move up the ladder in a company after 3 years, it’s time to go.
I worked in a small auto shop since i was 19yo. I am now 62 and will be retiring soon from there. I may not have been able to move up because it was family owned , but they invested in a generous retirement plan for me all those years and now i can retire comfortably. So it depends where you work.
Promotion is not necessary better. I have one colleague that decided to become a specialist instead of remaining a manager, and he did so because the company I work for value specialist, read same pay. and that he prefers it. So if a company values your work you get paid well and have a lot to say. There are other companies that have a huge inflation of titles it everybody is a manager in their title. You know why? because then employer can omit overtime rules.
Exactly. It depends on what you’re looking for as well. You can certainly make more money by job hopping every 2-5 years, but sometimes that’s not what we really need. Applying to jobs and starting all over again with new coworkers, policies, healthcare, etc all take energy and time away from the rest of your life. It all comes at a cost.
You worked for a business that had values that came from the early 20th century. Most people work for guys of your age that literally ruined everything in today's society..
This is very rare nowadays. Your lucky to get a thank you note these days. If there are any younger people reading this, dont get too comfortable, get your experience and move on. Be weary of promotions as it could mean a raise but still doing the job of 3 people
It all comes down to this - they either like you or they don't. They never tell you that but that's what it comes down to. There are a small percentage of preferred people at the top that will be offered every opportunity that comes along - even if they make a few mistakes along the way. They will also receive the best performance appraisals and peer rankings and hence, the best merit raises. The rest will be ignored even if they are performing well. That's why most of us are in the "steady job" category. We're good at what we do but we're also expendable. I do agree that if you want significant promotions and/or pay raises, you need to look outside the company you work for. I've heard this from several people I've worked with over the years.
@@greyhound-t3k yes my boss at my last job low key kept pushing unpaid hours and taking on more work if i wanted to "succeed". it was code for succeed at the company. i stuck to my guns and my boss kept me barely busy. luckily i got laid off with a healthy severance. and realized i was way underpaid. got 3 offers at least 15-20k more than last job.
If you work for a big company, just by exploring opportunities in different departments can be rewarding financially. There are departmental budgets, so it wont hurt to seek internal opportunities before you look outside. I was getting a pretty standard 2.5% raise every 6 months or so. I felt like I was in a rut with no hope. There was an opening in another department, plus I had some strong referrals, I was able to increase my annual salary by $15K. So yes, never stay in a position for too long.
@@HISHAM931 that sounds like a lot of brown nosing bosses and justifying your raise much like in the video. and your standards of work life balance don't change. if you worked like a dog with last boss, you will work like a dog with new boss. and due to same company boss will be more transparent with new boss. you will be seen as a flight risk or as someone who lacks commitment.
@@asadb1990 Just to give some context, I was in that previous role for almost two years. I’m not exactly the type of person to change roles every 6 months. In terms of my current and former bosses crossing paths, its highly unlikely. I work for one of the biggest telecomm firms in Canada with tens of thousands of employees/managers spread across the country. Plus it is a completely different department. During the extensive interviews and the due diligence they already did with my former bosses, the air was already cleared.
In my experience all loyalty gets you is a small bonus and a sincere thank you, don't put down your own dream for someone else's! When you go to pick it back up pieces will be missing!
My family has always told me that I needed to stay put rather than trying to move up the ladder. I started young in security, making min wage, but I refused to stay at the bottom. I moved up to site supervisor within 2 years and then got a job doing military force protection. In that company I became a trainer, and then I started my own company. A few years later I accepted a Security Director position for an electronics manufacturing company. Then I moved to Florida and became a Security Director for some condos. Just this week I landed my dream job as Security Director in Boca Raton, making a good salary, benefits, and good work-life balance! Moral of the story: Stay put for a minute, then use your experience to move up to better things. Keep going up until you're happy where you've landed.
You’ve hit it right on the nail. Get that experience! Receive all the information and work expertise. Work up, find other openings that make it more worthwhile for you. I’m trying to do that right now at a bank. Just started, and I just want experience to be able to get used to the job and from there move up.
I left a company after 2 years, because I knew layoffs were coming. And ended up getting paid 30 percent more immediately. My earnings for the new company increased another 25 percent within 2 years. Don’t be loyal to anyone unless they are paying the most and you like everyone you work for and with.
Put in 9 years at a fortune 100, after years of being passed over, i trained on new technologies, took interviews to learn the current market, and eventually left for a better title and a 80% pay bump, base. Now that doesn’t happen often, but I was grossly underpaid (I’m still behind my peers who left long ago).
Exactly what happened to me. Going forward I vowed I will stay nowhere for more than 2 years. You don’t always have to plan for the CEO job, but if you work to always improve your skillsets and keep your eyes open for new opportunities (even if it means leaving the company) you’ll be fine.
Some people just want to show up, get a pay check, and leave. They have other things going on in their life that they like more and are not looking for more work.
@@celestialknight4407 It boils down to that they care more about their time than they do getting money. If you do something to make yourself rich, it will most likely consume all your time.
This is me. I was getting pecked at by a nosey coworker today about why I haven’t been trying as hard as her to move up and it’s because I’m fine with what I do and I also freelance on the side which is what I actually want to do full time but it’s not there yet. Now here I am searching “I hate my job” videos on UA-cam.
I tend to be loyal to my job by nature (22 years in the Navy), but after my retirement I entered the IT field and I find this video particularly relevant. My year-over-year raises paled in comparison to walking in the door at a new company. In my experience, salary at your current job is rarely impacted by additional formal education or certifications, whereas stepping into a new position forces your prospective employer to assess everything you bring to the table.
As a former Navy man myself I can very much relate to this. Every large "promotion" I've received since separating from the Navy have all been by leaving my job in favor of a new higher paying one.
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Yeah, the yearly raise in IT is not going to be much bigger than it has to be to compensate for inflation. From what I gather, the best strategy is to get your employer to pay for training and certifications, and then use those for future employments.
It’s a strange industry. There’s a near perpetual skills shortage yet companies routinely undervalue their existing staff then pay a fortune to replace them.
100% agree. If you work for a company, they already see you as an asset with its price tag. No reason to pay you more. If you start doubting your pay they will turn on their propaganda machine with key words such as “Team” “Loyalty” “Alignment” etc.
- Staying in a job too long makes you appear too steady, unremarkable & unlikely to have a diverse range of skills opposed to others that have moved around - Staying in a job too short makes you look unreliable, un-committed & potentially problematic The general theme I get from “job advise” is that companies are more pickier than Goldilocks when it comes to the perfect porridge Candidates are scrutinised on so many elements these days, it’s no wonder depression rates are going up… after all, it’s never simply about can you do the job & do it well 🤷🏻♂️
I once worked for someone who worked for several years for the same company. They were still working very hard to get promoted. People from outside the company kept getting put in above them, but they kept trying.
Why would upper management ever promote them if they were working extra hard at their current job for free, essentially. Unless they're also brown-nosing and playing golf on the side they're going nowhere in that type of company. Upper management types tend to not think of people like people unless they're useful or pleasant to them in some very direct manner. That's how most companies work. Sociopathic behavior is rewarded.
People trying to prove themselves and be team leaders, meanwhile I live below my means and rejected 2 promotions on two different jobs because I don't find the appeal in trading in your free time for more money. Promotions usually mean you work more, overtime, have to be on standby at any time, answer mail past working hours etc. Screw that. I'll take my average salary, but when I leave the company premises, I don't know any of you, and at night, not only do I get to sleep, I also don't dream about work.
Money doesn't make you happier. So if you're making less, but you have peace of mind and mental health, then you're doing the right thing This whole work until you're dead thing is ridiculous to me.
Unless one is lucky enough to land a job where one's work lines up almost exactly on one's passion, no clue how anyone would want to work a moment over 40 hours. Even with a standard 8hr work day it is so hard to find time to exercise, do self improvement, and follow one's passions. 8 hours of work, .5-1.5 hours for a commute, take a few hours here and there for food prep/eating and hygiene, >15 minutes to fall asleep, 8 hours of sleep...
yes promotion within a company just means more work, less personal time, more unpaid overtime, etc. which is why its best to look elsewhere for an increase in pay at same workload.
I disagree. Promotions don’t always equal more work time. It isn’t binary. The key is to work smarter, not harder. Just gotta know how to delegate effectively
After a firing , off work, I brushed up on skills,, watched lots if you tube videos and landed a contract job. Did the job ,contract cut short. No job. Updated my resume with a new skill and Back to the job hunt. I've watched many of your videos for helpful hints. You are a GIFT And very precise! Thank you.
I am Jill. Wish i was joe. Jill is a high performer and strategic / aggressive. Fast forward 12 years later. Jill is burnt out because she realizes she’s smarter than this stupid corporate grind. Now wishes she was Joe, Joe could have cruised BUT worked to build a business on side or juice up his investment to be ready once let go.
Currently in this situation -been with the same company for 10 years. Have been promoted like 4 times. Decent pay but it’s just time. I’m definitely going to follow Jill’s lead. I like how deliberate she is with her actions. She’s ok with saying no if it doesn’t help her reach her ultimate career goals.
The story about "Joe" really hit me...couldn't be more similar to him...worked at the company for over 10 years...me and my boss were like brothers...company went through development and reorganizations, at some point he decided to leave, his position was given someone else over me and it all went downhill from there...sidelined, did some easy stuff for two more years, because the money was good, and eventually the first chance they had, they got rid of me...now I'm almost 50 and "back to the job market" :( There are so many things I wish I did differently...
I have been with my company, a restaurant for 8 years. I did more work than others would of. Now I just got promoted and start my position in 10 days. My pay is doubled and I get vacations that are paid for and bonuses. I don't want to say I got lucky, cause I earned it. I picked up everytime. I trained all new hires, and I did all jobs needed in my place. I am thankful. My life has begun
This is why I'm seeking a new company even thought I have only been with my current company for two years. No room to advance and my capabilities surpass my job title. The company is too stuck on degree's, not experience and real World knowledge.
I definitely think there is definitely a middle ground with job hopping and being with a company for a good bit of time. Hop too much and it reflects badly. Don't hop at and it will also reflect badly. But watching this actually inspired me to revamp my resume and put myself out there. I got an offer I'm pretty excited about now and a great pay increase. While I will miss the people I work for and with its time to take the next step career wise.
It depends on what one wants out of life. Most people from my generation seemed to have stayed with a company, in most cases in the same position, for 20 + years and then either retired early or in many instances got let go when they were making a high salary so the company could cut costs. In business, most everyone is expendable.
@@christopherdelcastillo0077 If you don't mind working 80 hour weeks, putting every dime of your savings on the line, and still risk losing everything, starting your own business is great.
What if you really like your job and don’t feel like moving up into management? What if you just want to do more and more skilled work? I think more companies would do well to reward their non-leadership “key player” positions. These are often people who will improve your processes specifically because they don’t like organizing teams. They will cut out the BS that managers create to justify their positions.
Have you thought about speaking with your manager as well as some mentors in your industry about tips as well as certifications you can get? In my industry, I need a PE license as well as get the CPDT certification. Those are things I can do to have more responsibilities without going into management.
So much yes. I am a massive individual contributor and subject-matter expert but I have enough self-knowledge to know I don't have the right personality to do well in management. Management is a separate vocational discipline in itself - sucks that so often the only way 'up' is to abandon your genuine vocational discipline for a completely different one.
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I kind of feel the same. I really enjoy what I do, but I know roughly what salary range I have available, and when I'll run out of opportunities for raises before having to go the management route and I'm not sure I'd want to go that route, in which case I'd be trading job satisfaction for a pay raise, and that's not really my MO.
@@belindajrule Companies usually work according to the Peter Principle when promoting from within. Typically, middle management is terrible because those that got promoted to such a position and haven't moved on are just plain incompetent at it even if they were competent at the previous job that landed them the promotion.
I always knew that a stable job is bad. One guideline is that if you are really good at your job to the point that you don't have to put any effort anymore, you are not getting anything that is difficult for you, or you are better at it than everyone else, it's time to move on.
If your job isn’t giving you fulfillment, and that is important to you, then maybe. But there are many things in life that can give us fulfillment, and we have a finite amount of energy to spend. Sometimes maximizing the amount of effort we put into our career won’t lead to a better life.
@@ZePopTart That's not what he said. If you don't have to put _any_ effort into a job, then you're not improving/growing and eventually the market will leave you behind.
I became a Jill, achieved seniority in a new branch of my career in 2 years based on strategic job hopping and by leveling up key skills. I think the company I'm in right now can help me grow even more, I've been transparent about my goals and they seem to have the means to help me get there. Let's see what happens.
Totally agree I think your channel is one of best out of at least a dozen of others I have watched and I think it’s great for career coaching in general, I am lucky myself to have never been laid off so that’s not the reason I watch this channel
I stayed in the same company for 16 years, but they had a system where you could get promoted, grow your role, but stay in the same place. They were an engineering company and didn't want technical experts to job hop, become people managers, or leave the company to move on.
You are absolutely correct ! When you described Joe, you described my 28 year career with 1 company, but I was not waiting for the promotion, I was applying and networking for the promotion within my own department. Great video, awesome advice ♥️
My unfortunate situation is that I absolutely loved my position of nine years and felt like it WAS my career goal. I received wonderful feedback from my supervisor and our client. Unfortunately, my employer lost a contract and I lost my job. I’m finding that your comments are totally accurate…the fact that I had only one position for so long seems to be hurting me in the aftermath. I didn’t want a promotion because i was happy but…this lack of mobility seems to be working against me.
This is an excellent video and I wish I knew this earlier. When I first graduated I got the job I wanted at the time, and I had this idea that I could be there for a long time. But often due to work politics (or other company related things), there was no potential for growth beyond the first few years I was there. My salary ended up lagging quite a bit behind also. Many companies are like this. You spend a few years learning skills mastering your role, but beyond that, there is nothing for you. This is why it's important to have career goals and don't shy away from job hopping (as long as you're progressing with each job you have).
Changing seats every 2-3 years seems to be the sweet spot. You don't necessarily need to leave your company, but if you are trying to have a career instead of a steady job, you can't sit still. The only exception might be if your boss is a rock star and he or she has committed to being your mentor and wants to take you along for the ride.
Wow, why did you just describe me! 8 years in, I do the work for upper management, and they’re scared to lose me, but I don’t get good promotions. They’ve capped me at $75k. Im literally watching back listening to how others are fucking up, and I have to fix it, but yet they won’t pay me anywhere near as much.
Been actively looking for work after my previous job laid me off. You've been a veritable goldmine of information for me and I'm legitimately grateful for that; very glad I found you, thanks.
Just paused for a sec to comment because you literally just told my story and it’s been insanely difficult to bounce back from being kid off while feeling like a superstar...I’m feeling so much of the story you just laid out and it hurt me so badly. Just came across your channel and can’t say how much I appreciate what you have been doing here with what I’ve seen so far.
To the people saying it’s “who you know” that is a very valid reason to change jobs and reinvent yourself. It’s called tabula rasa. Be the blank slate and do things differently to become likeable.
At my last job the CEO kept bringing in friends, distant relatives, and even a couple of his neighbors to fill all the best positions. The other people who succeeded were the ones who enjoyed the same sports as the CEO. He was personally involved in every single raise and promotion within the company and it showed. All of that would have been tolerable if the friends, relatives, neighbors, and buddies were competent at their jobs but they weren't and business suffered. It was a relief to get out of there.
This is good. I'm on my way to becoming a Joe - which is what has me looking at videos like this. I need motivation (a kick in the arse) and a master plan. My co-worker always brags that she's been with the company for almost 25 years. 25 years in and she only recently became supervisor (not even manager)...with less than a $10k bump in salary. No thanks.
I had two steady jobs, one after the other (22 years total) and I'm finding now, five years after leaving the second one, just how truly far behind I am. I don't aspire to the C suite, but even keeping/staying engaged at a mid level job is so hard these days.
Im going through that right now after 5 years. Listen to this people and act. Look after yourself and if you feel in any hindered move on to another opportunity and don’t wait.
Great video - 9 years ( no promotions at all - I had became just an average Joe ) of a loyal service ( 2nd one in command ) and no pay overtimes led me to being terminated with no cause last year - new owners... new rules - but thanks to your video I'm smarter now and know why it has happened and I got a feeling it was a good thing for me cuz I was getting burnt out of working at that place ! - live and learn - always at a survival mode and forget loyalty...
I feel for you. Happens to many of us. I stayed with the same company for almost 15 years and was made redundant. My new manager felt threatened and didn’t like me. I was happy with the payout but shows you no matter how good you are, how many people you educate to improve their knowledge, they’ll shaft you in an instant. There are many poor and cruel managers out there causing havoc onto people’s lives. Loyalty is nothing these days. Move on when we find a better opportunity.
Yup, I had a stable job a long time ago, and I stayed in it for nearly 10 years until I decided my income growth was getting nowhere, and decided to change jobs. The new job instantly gave me additional 10k in income, and 2 years later another 20k with a promotion.
Worker loyalty is a mirage society keeps trying to convince us is the best thing for everyone. I have gotten huge raises by jumping around to different companies the past few years. If I had stayed with any of the companies I used to work for 3 to 5 years ago, I would be making way less than what I do now. You will be told everywhere that job hopping appears to be bad on your resume. I have never experienced that, but I usually stick it out for about a year before jumping ship. Normally I look elsewhere after I find out I am getting a small raise (if any) and my boss is "moving" elsewhere. That's how you get ahead now. Apply for jobs in your field that are a bit higher on the corporate ladder and/or demand more money from the new job if you make a lateral move in the same position.
Well I am that average Joe. One who has had no interest in climbing the rat race ladder. I've worked at the same company since I was 18, 42 years ago and plan to retire in 5 more. In that time I have seen a number of people leave for better opportunities and return either several years later or just a few weeks later working at their old job or a different one. The grass is not always greener on the other side.
Life outside work has alot to offer A higher paycheck doesnt attract me enough to climb the ladder I know what would motivate me most to climb the carreer ladder is a higher purpose other than a paycheck I wonder what carreer goals I should set myself for that Soon it will be time to start figuring that out. For now im good
As accountant whose company just went outside the firm to filled a manager role, words cant describe how shitty it feels. At the same time, i have 3 out of 4 CPA exams done. I always factor in a plan B move when i plan my game. Always have a backup plan and dont be naive.
Hi Bryan, totally get it and I agree that people should work like a free agent. I’ve always worked with this type of paranoia - fear of being laid off and unemployable. I remembered during the pandemic I was able to land a job within two months of being laid off because I invested heavily in my career with the expectation that eventually bad times will be ahead. Covid was absolutely terrible with 10,000s of applicants looking for jobs. But because I was positioned well I was able to land another job pretty quickly.
There is a balance. You have to prove that you are stable as well and need to give a good explanation for you leaving your position during interviews. I know, not fair, but this world isn't. Good luck everyone.
@@void________ no you keep the same time. just less jobs with no gap. by shrink i meant to adjust timing so its appropriate for a job. lets say you are laidoff and you need a job asap. you can't just be patient for a high paying job so a junior level job is available and you take it and then keep looking.
We realky should get away from the idea that becoming a 'manager' is the only success criterion. Most people are not managers but create value in other ways. and many bosses are not fit for the task.Problem is that many bosses are overpaid and many others are underpaid.
I used to think staying at a company long term was a goal, then I kept getting laid off, kept finding new jobs, and my skillset and salary increased rapidly. Meanwhile my friends who gave me the side eye for "jumping around" stagnated.
There's a positive side to everything Job hopping increases your skills over a wide range, but it does make you appear unreliable. But if you do happen to get a interview make sure you have a good enough reason to explain why you left each job in such a short period of time. During high-school and college years I don't think employers from entry level jobs care too much just as long as the company is desperately hiring or you have good enough references. The mass resignation is giving worker the upper hand in the job market
Your videos are extremely well put together, I'm impressed particularly by how professional you keep the register of the video while still spitting hard facts! 👏👏👏
What I didn't learn from this video, though I really wanted to: - Why Joe wasn't promoted despite being a good worker. What a "leadership potential" means and how to measure it (edit: it seems that by the frequency of job changing; the more the frequency, the more the leadership potential). - Why HRs prefer Jill over Joe despite Joe being as good as Jill at work and probably cost less. How HRs determine that Jill has a "leadership potential".
The reason Joe wasn't promoted is that from the companies standpoint if they promote Joe who is good at his job, they would have to pay to train Joe and the person replacing Joe. If they hire from outside, they only have to pay to train one person. The age old saying is true.. People always rise to their level of incompetence
fatslapper123 already gave a good answer to this, but i just wanted to add on top of it that Joe doesn't exhibit signs of assertiveness, go-getter-attitude or the prioritize-my-assignment-above-all-else mentality (even though the assignment is what the company wants you to do.. one day you will realize that YOU simply want a better job and thus make that your #1 goal for the time being). Someone who is content doing the same thing for years will net the company similair results to what is already known, while for a leadership position there are a LOT more of unknown variabeles.. it's like a storm you got to navigate your ship through. You need to have someone who is strong of character to navigate that ship through it and make the though choices to do so. It's more of a mentality/mindset and the actions you do which exhibit that type of desired mindset. A company just like a ship on the ocean needs both type of people.. leaders and workers. A worker will always do a good and predictable job but will probably not go above and beyond and do whatever it takes (hence why Joe stayed at his position for so long, doing the same thing, passively believing one day positive change will come). A leader type of mindset will do whatever is necessary to advance their own goals (hence Jill left her job to not simply chase a better paying job, but a role which she desired more than what she had. She took the actions necessary to get that). To answer your second question which nicely adds on what i already posted; "leadership potential" is determined by your previous actions, the results you made in your past career journey and what achievements you gained personally and/or for your company. Leadership is not simply just doing what is required but it is figuring out what is needed ahead of time, anticipating on events, managing them succesfully etc.
Other than what fatslapper said, Jill is more motivated and goal driven. These would be seen as better characteristics of leaders, as opposed to someone who just does their job well and then goes home. You can't expect to spend years in a particular role and then get promoted to manager just by being good at your job. It doesn't usually happen that way.
@@Jackques Joe has to show the company i guess that if they don't promote him soon, they won't just have to train the new "leader" but also joe's replacement, so, they will have to deal with 2 unknown variables. instead of a good variable and an unknown one. I guess that's about it. While in my case I didn't do something similar, at one point i just decided to leave and that's that. Even informed the higher ups like 6months prior since I did get along with them.
Oh my God Joe story is my story 🤦🏾♀️ received my severance package in 2020. I ended up taking another position so that I could have a job and just figured out another career path that I am more passionate about. This is a really good video! I am mid-career in my 40’s starting all over again so if you are in your 20s or 30s, please listen to the advice. Don’t stay too long and think about career goals.
I had been working on-and-off (project-based, short breaks in between) for the same huge company for over 6 years, and it even changed my behavior to the point where I would promote the company all the time in normal convos, without even thinking about it. When I got laid off I felt numb, almost like a part of my personality had gone missing. It's only now, almost half a year later, that I have un-learned that. Company loyalty can be good but you slowly get brainwashed, I realize that now.
This channel is almost like a diary for me at this point, with me returning to it after each layoff. Once again, I'm brainwashed for my current "company"/governmental institution that I work for, and I know my contract ends at NYE. The step to walk right into the work force for next year feels like an obstacle I'm struggling with right now, but I guess I'll be able to tackle it somehow. My only complaint is how crappy it is to use a person (aka me) as a "start-up resource" for something you know a hella lot about and then turn the responsibility of that role to someone who is not as "in-tune" with what you have been doing and improving for the workplace. Well, in 2022 it's once again not my problem, the same as in 2021 for the previous company. Everyone working from home and stuff the past year(s) made companies think they can downsize a lot. When society completely goes back to normal, oh boy...
Thank you for your good advice. I had the same idea in my mind. I wanted to climb up the ladder so I took a job that pays less but promises promotion after a year. I was a junior officer in a totaly different industry, I saw some red flag signs but I ignored them. Because I thought the person who referred me would fulfill her promise. I also informed her beforehand that I had no experience to the position she offered. After further discussion I accepted the offer. I’ve been in the comp for 6 months now and I am miserable. Not only my boss micromanages me ahe always finds way to scold me even in small things. I should have paid attention to my gut feeling. But on the positive note, I learned to control my emotions and improve my maturity level. To act professionally and calmly in difficult situations. In the past, I would always panic but now I see the difference. I learned that For every negative situation you’re in, satu calm and find ways to solution it. If you have done everything and the result is minimal then leave it as it is. Pray hard instead
In my case, I change companies every 2-3 years and so far I have always been able to achieve an upgrade of ~20% more salary. However, this is usually associated with the fact that I have to get out of my comfort zone and have new challenges, which I always grow. Sometimes it's scary and stressful, but it's always worth it.
I just subscribe to your channel because it is something I needed. I am one of those company people begrudgingly.... I currently work for a that does online shipping for furniture. Being mr. Consistent where I am, I stayed there for a whopping six years. There are positions that were open where I knew my skills would fit me in, but like usual they put their friends in those spots. One of those friends of a supervisor told me I complain too much, and I thought that myself yes about people like you. In a nutshell, supervisor was cool with him and thrusted him into the position. To me that's too much of butt kissing, and favouritism being done
I find it a dilemma. Stagnating in a stable easy job or moving around and taking risk. Either way your working for someone else and getting screwed over
For me a steady job is great because I have my other dreams to pursue. I dont like giving my extra effort and creativity to boost other companies revenue. I will do it with my own company🙂
Sir. You are a GODSEND!!!! I wish I had seen this video after I was laid off. I am attempting to move into a new, highly competitive field that I find so interesting that I am willing to do math to do it. LOL. Thanks again for your assistance.
I had the opposite experience for the first 6 years of my career where I stayed with the same company (up until recently) because I was promoted 5 times, nearly doubled my initial salary and was given a company car towards the end HOWEVER I recognized when I hit a road block that would have costs me hundreds of thousands in the long term had I stayed. I went against the grain and left for an elevated position with a $50,000+ raise. My Managers were shocked, despite prevalent industry issues that were making compensation a challenge. I let them know that loyalty and culture don't pay the bills lol Unless the job is excruciatingly toxic I would give the job 18-24 months to prove worthy of elevating your career and earnings. After that, its time to do your research and head out if it's not conducive to that.
Tech workers often leave not for titles, but for new technologies to work on. I think we’re a bit different from everyone else looking for a new title.
I am 63 years old. My longest gigs were a corporate job that lasted 12 years and a contract gig with three stable clients that lasted 11 years. For the most part, if you look at my resume, you will see a list of jobs lasting 2 years tops and I did that because I was chasing work that paid the bills. In that time I taught school, was an art director, a media designer, a project manager and even a shipping and receiving clerk. The problem with the idea that you somehow control your destiny is you don't. You might be ready to move on. You jump ship and take on a leadership role with a great small company only to have planes fly into towers and destroy the industry you work in. (True story) Stuff happens in life.
He is right about one thing. Loyalty means nothing. The company doesn't care about you. The corporate ladder at most companies is broken, for most people. That is why 95% of the employees don't get promoted. This is the reason I went out and started my own business.
I tried to be Jill and it didn't work due to boss playing favourites so I'm stuck being Joe and have lost all motivation. Sometimes hard work and aggressiveness doesn't pay off when you're in the wrong work environment. What matters most then is having the courage to realize this and do something about it like go somewhere else where you can be recognized and achieve your goals.
Personally, having had trouble getting a job after getting laid off of my last one, I just want a steady job that fits my skills, pays the bills, is a good workplace and is a job where I can stay a long time.
Spot on. My last company offered token COLAs each year, but kept adding to my workload with no real love outside of my boss's appreciation. When I let it be known that I was leaving, the CEO's case for me to stay was "stability." "Here peasant, have a COLA" is what I heard. I said no thanks, and left for $10k more. A year later I was promoted and got another $10k, plus two bonuses as well. Yes, job hopping is good.
It’s funny bc during the golden age of economic expansion 1946-1980 stable jobs were the rule not the exception. I’d take stability any day of the week over instability
Left my first job after three and a half years and it was the best decision ever. It's been 10 months since then and I have 2.5x my salary and am at a much better position. I will say from experience that staying a little long at your first company does have its benefits. If I had switched in a year, I would have been questioned for it in every interview. Loyalty left the room when my first job laid off senior folks who had been working tirelessly in the company for more than 8 years, as a part of the downsizing. "We are a family" is corporate lingo for "You are a line item in a spreadsheet". If you leave your job, you will get replaced faster than you can imagine.
Thank you for your video. I totally agree with you. Misplaced loyality can cost you a lot especially these days. Unfortunately people of a certain generation were bought up to be loyal and then they would be rewarded. Generally speaking certainly not true.
I'm probably going to be moving companies every 2 years. It's the best way get those salary increases we deserve as our experience grows, so if that's job hoping then hey
@@mackenziegray2090 definitely not lol. Screw those employers. Peoplev who don't job hop earn on average 50% less than their coworker. 5-10 years is too long considering i plan to only work at most 40 years. I'd be cheating myself tremendously. What i read is it's best to move around in your early career and around 40 you should be looking for a company you can retire at or do that 5-10years
Why would you? That is like making your best football player the coach while still being on peak performance. The result you are one star player short and have an inexperienced coach to deal with that loss. Plus especially in Sales Top Salespeople tend to earn more than the person they report to (at least in the companies I worked in).
I feel this video. I spent way too long with my first company, partially because they WERE a great employer for the first 7 years, but then became mediocre to bad in they next 7. I left after numerous conversations trying to break through only to watch outsiders take those open senior positions. Since I left, I went to another company for 2 years and saw similar red flags, so I'm starting a new job soon. Compared with the first company, my salary will be 50% higher in a senior level position. Bottom line: don't job hop just for the sake of change, but be open to opportunity, especially when you're not getting it where you are.
It's not about WHAT you know, it's WHO you know. I've been in the workforce for 34 yrs and have personally witnessed incompetent management. Makes you wonder how they ever got the job! Think about it!
I'm a painter making $25 an hour. I'm fine moving from job to job every 3-5 years simply for newness if the job isn't incredible. Then I'd stay as long as the job is awesome. Also maintaining $25 an hour or eventually more from job to job. That's a great outlook in my opinion. Healthy all around.
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Let's be honest. Most people don't have careers. They have jobs to pay their bills and maintain their lifestyle. Very few people express much interest in "climbing the ladder" aside from vague remarks about wanting a promotion. Similar to dating, job advancement is largely about who management likes and who they don't. HRs job is to justify those preferences.
Just witnessed a TOP PERFORMER get axed today. All because the new boss didn't like her....🤷♀️
this is very true ...
only a really tiny amount of people really achieve a big career .. the rest will be average.
just like with everything in life ...
Basically. It doesn't matter how good you are. If upper management doesn't like you, they'll find a way to get rid of you.
@@MsPrice-pn2py who likes you at work is often very important. High school never ends.
This needs to be top comment.
Oh geez. This was so triggering. I spent 6 years in my last job thinking opportunities were coming. They didn't. Now I am trying to make up for lost time in the middle of a pandemic, and it's super discouraging.
better late than never.
I spent 5 years before I realized this. the kick in the gut for me was a Level 1 SW Dev making more than me after 4!!! Promotions. I don't blame anyone but myself for getting complacent. That is not going to happen again!
@@alaind276 thats the correct attitude sire
@@alaind276 wow my employer laid me off during pandemic otherwise i would have stayed at the job for much longer. my boss kept pushing the deadline for a promotion every annual review. then i realized i was being paid too low. i got a new job with 20k more pay.
Are you me?
I just left a job after two years for a different company, I was being paid 41% below the market average and had no room to advance. Now I have doubled my pay, I get to save, invest and fix my credit, and I get to work from home now. Best decision ever.
Lovely. Congratulations!
Nice Congrats
Leaving my "steady" job was the best decision I made for my career! I doubled my salary within 2 years by leaving. Thank you for your information. I've been binging on your channel :)
Glad to hear it! Did you start your own biz?
Yeah, I got forced out, was making 21 an hour. started making 24 an hour, quit that shithole job. Then went directly to 80 grand a year. Got assaulted, beat the guys ass, and got canned. Now I make good money when work is hopping. House paid for, 3 trucks paid off and in tip top shape. I can't complain.
Congratulations!!!
You were probably able to double your salary because your company was able to see that you were a person on your previous job that stayed for a long time lol! That did help whether you think it did or not, I bet.
OK, you made more money, but did you advance in your career?
"If someone likes you, you can do NO wrong, but if someone doesn't like you, you can do NO right." -DJ
Fax!
Never get too comfortable in Life, always be prepared for change. The only thing constant in Life is change.
True. Adaptability is the most important human skill.
@@dieglhix Adaptivity is why we are here so long throughout history.
I was a Joe, for nearly 7 years, working a terrible job and feeling under-valued and under-appreciated, and generally depressed as I saw others promoted up and over me. It nearly cost me my marriage. Never ever: get too comfortable, stop developing, let anyone devalue your work, tolerate inconsideration of your well-intentioned input and creativity, and most of all, never lose your passion for serving people in a manner that is reflected in your pay.
Sorry if it’s to personal but how did your job nearly cost you your marriage?
How did you get out? I stayed in a job too long because my wife is disabled and I am the only breadwinner so I didn't want to risk job hunting
Same here
@@earthsteward9 SO TRUE...
If the manager is ambivalent to you, your performance doesn't matter. All your achievements will be overlooked, at best. At worst, only your flaws will be noticed.
I believe there is a type of role bias when you slowly work your way up. People will always think of you as the person that started entry level. You tend to get more respect when a new company evaluates you with fresh eyes. Or, when there is a leadership change and the new leader sees you were you are not where you were.
Steady jobs mattered when company loyalty still existed. People worked with companies for 20+ years and retired with the gold watch and the pension. It doesn’t work that way anymore. If you are hired for a particular job, you are more than likely going to stay at the job, and you get maybe a few raises and a title change from “associate” to “senior”. If you don’t really move up the ladder in a company after 3 years, it’s time to go.
I worked in a small auto shop since i was 19yo. I am now 62 and will be retiring soon from there. I may not have been able to move up because it was family owned , but they invested in a generous retirement plan for me all those years and now i can retire comfortably. So it depends where you work.
You didn't let schooling interfere with your education. Well played. Congratulations!
Promotion is not necessary better. I have one colleague that decided to become a specialist instead of remaining a manager, and he did so because the company I work for value specialist, read same pay. and that he prefers it. So if a company values your work you get paid well and have a lot to say.
There are other companies that have a huge inflation of titles it everybody is a manager in their title. You know why? because then employer can omit overtime rules.
Exactly. It depends on what you’re looking for as well. You can certainly make more money by job hopping every 2-5 years, but sometimes that’s not what we really need. Applying to jobs and starting all over again with new coworkers, policies, healthcare, etc all take energy and time away from the rest of your life. It all comes at a cost.
You worked for a business that had values that came from the early 20th century. Most people work for guys of your age that literally ruined everything in today's society..
This is very rare nowadays. Your lucky to get a thank you note these days. If there are any younger people reading this, dont get too comfortable, get your experience and move on. Be weary of promotions as it could mean a raise but still doing the job of 3 people
It all comes down to this - they either like you or they don't. They never tell you that but that's what it comes down to. There are a small percentage of preferred people at the top that will be offered every opportunity that comes along - even if they make a few mistakes along the way. They will also receive the best performance appraisals and peer rankings and hence, the best merit raises. The rest will be ignored even if they are performing well. That's why most of us are in the "steady job" category. We're good at what we do but we're also expendable.
I do agree that if you want significant promotions and/or pay raises, you need to look outside the company you work for. I've heard this from several people I've worked with over the years.
If you get passed over for a promotion twice, then it is time to leave.
@@greyhound-t3k yes my boss at my last job low key kept pushing unpaid hours and taking on more work if i wanted to "succeed". it was code for succeed at the company. i stuck to my guns and my boss kept me barely busy. luckily i got laid off with a healthy severance. and realized i was way underpaid. got 3 offers at least 15-20k more than last job.
If you work for a big company, just by exploring opportunities in different departments can be rewarding financially. There are departmental budgets, so it wont hurt to seek internal opportunities before you look outside.
I was getting a pretty standard 2.5% raise every 6 months or so. I felt like I was in a rut with no hope. There was an opening in another department, plus I had some
strong referrals, I was able to increase my annual salary by $15K.
So yes, never stay in a position for too long.
@@HISHAM931 that sounds like a lot of brown nosing bosses and justifying your raise much like in the video. and your standards of work life balance don't change. if you worked like a dog with last boss, you will work like a dog with new boss. and due to same company boss will be more transparent with new boss. you will be seen as a flight risk or as someone who lacks commitment.
@@asadb1990 Just to give some context, I was in that previous role for almost two years. I’m not exactly the type of person to change roles every 6 months.
In terms of my current and former bosses crossing paths, its highly unlikely. I work for one of the biggest telecomm firms in Canada with tens of thousands of employees/managers spread across the country. Plus it is a completely different department.
During the extensive interviews and the due diligence they already did with my former bosses, the air was already cleared.
In my experience all loyalty gets you is a small bonus and a sincere thank you, don't put down your own dream for someone else's! When you go to pick it back up pieces will be missing!
My family has always told me that I needed to stay put rather than trying to move up the ladder. I started young in security, making min wage, but I refused to stay at the bottom. I moved up to site supervisor within 2 years and then got a job doing military force protection. In that company I became a trainer, and then I started my own company. A few years later I accepted a Security Director position for an electronics manufacturing company. Then I moved to Florida and became a Security Director for some condos. Just this week I landed my dream job as Security Director in Boca Raton, making a good salary, benefits, and good work-life balance! Moral of the story: Stay put for a minute, then use your experience to move up to better things. Keep going up until you're happy where you've landed.
You’ve hit it right on the nail. Get that experience! Receive all the information and work expertise. Work up, find other openings that make it more worthwhile for you. I’m trying to do that right now at a bank. Just started, and I just want experience to be able to get used to the job and from there move up.
I left a company after 2 years, because I knew layoffs were coming. And ended up getting paid 30 percent more immediately. My earnings for the new company increased another 25 percent within 2 years. Don’t be loyal to anyone unless they are paying the most and you like everyone you work for and with.
Put in 9 years at a fortune 100, after years of being passed over, i trained on new technologies, took interviews to learn the current market, and eventually left for a better title and a 80% pay bump, base. Now that doesn’t happen often, but I was grossly underpaid (I’m still behind my peers who left long ago).
Exactly what happened to me. Going forward I vowed I will stay nowhere for more than 2 years. You don’t always have to plan for the CEO job, but if you work to always improve your skillsets and keep your eyes open for new opportunities (even if it means leaving the company) you’ll be fine.
My wife sent this to me after being with a company for 18 years. I'm done at this point and not scared to "Act my wage" as she calls it. Thank you!
*phew* still a couple years short of 18 at mine lol
Goin on 17 years at mine.
Some people just want to show up, get a pay check, and leave. They have other things going on in their life that they like more and are not looking for more work.
That's right, why waste so much of your time and energy to make someone else rich
@@celestialknight4407 It boils down to that they care more about their time than they do getting money. If you do something to make yourself rich, it will most likely consume all your time.
@@KennTollens You can make money but don't have to work for it. It's called passive income.
Quiet quitting for the win
This is me. I was getting pecked at by a nosey coworker today about why I haven’t been trying as hard as her to move up and it’s because I’m fine with what I do and I also freelance on the side which is what I actually want to do full time but it’s not there yet. Now here I am searching “I hate my job” videos on UA-cam.
I tend to be loyal to my job by nature (22 years in the Navy), but after my retirement I entered the IT field and I find this video particularly relevant. My year-over-year raises paled in comparison to walking in the door at a new company. In my experience, salary at your current job is rarely impacted by additional formal education or certifications, whereas stepping into a new position forces your prospective employer to assess everything you bring to the table.
As a former Navy man myself I can very much relate to this. Every large "promotion" I've received since separating from the Navy have all been by leaving my job in favor of a new higher paying one.
Yeah, the yearly raise in IT is not going to be much bigger than it has to be to compensate for inflation. From what I gather, the best strategy is to get your employer to pay for training and certifications, and then use those for future employments.
Nice
It’s a strange industry. There’s a near perpetual skills shortage yet companies routinely undervalue their existing staff then pay a fortune to replace them.
100% agree. If you work for a company, they already see you as an asset with its price tag. No reason to pay you more.
If you start doubting your pay they will turn on their propaganda machine with key words such as “Team” “Loyalty” “Alignment” etc.
- Staying in a job too long makes you appear too steady, unremarkable & unlikely to have a diverse range of skills opposed to others that have moved around
- Staying in a job too short makes you look unreliable, un-committed & potentially problematic
The general theme I get from “job advise” is that companies are more pickier than Goldilocks when it comes to the perfect porridge
Candidates are scrutinised on so many elements these days, it’s no wonder depression rates are going up… after all, it’s never simply about can you do the job & do it well 🤷🏻♂️
What’s too long or too short in your opinion?
@@sheacrawford9868 5 Years - Too Long (Unless you have had promotions along the way, then at least there's progression there)
I once worked for someone who worked for several years for the same company. They were still working very hard to get promoted. People from outside the company kept getting put in above them, but they kept trying.
Why would upper management ever promote them if they were working extra hard at their current job for free, essentially. Unless they're also brown-nosing and playing golf on the side they're going nowhere in that type of company.
Upper management types tend to not think of people like people unless they're useful or pleasant to them in some very direct manner. That's how most companies work. Sociopathic behavior is rewarded.
I agree, but its hard to just leap into the unknown when you have a family to support. Jump around while youre young. It really does work
And save up a nest egg while you’re young for when you do start building a family. You will have a cushion and more financial freedom.
People trying to prove themselves and be team leaders, meanwhile I live below my means and rejected 2 promotions on two different jobs because I don't find the appeal in trading in your free time for more money. Promotions usually mean you work more, overtime, have to be on standby at any time, answer mail past working hours etc. Screw that. I'll take my average salary, but when I leave the company premises, I don't know any of you, and at night, not only do I get to sleep, I also don't dream about work.
Money doesn't make you happier. So if you're making less, but you have peace of mind and mental health, then you're doing the right thing
This whole work until you're dead thing is ridiculous to me.
Unless one is lucky enough to land a job where one's work lines up almost exactly on one's passion, no clue how anyone would want to work a moment over 40 hours.
Even with a standard 8hr work day it is so hard to find time to exercise, do self improvement, and follow one's passions.
8 hours of work, .5-1.5 hours for a commute, take a few hours here and there for food prep/eating and hygiene, >15 minutes to fall asleep, 8 hours of sleep...
yes promotion within a company just means more work, less personal time, more unpaid overtime, etc. which is why its best to look elsewhere for an increase in pay at same workload.
Fair enough mate, I applaud you in going another way on this.
I disagree. Promotions don’t always equal more work time. It isn’t binary. The key is to work smarter, not harder. Just gotta know how to delegate effectively
Your channel and being furloughed made me realize how much staying at my job has hurt me.
After a firing , off work, I brushed up on skills,, watched lots if you tube videos and landed a contract job. Did the job ,contract cut short. No job. Updated my resume with a new skill and Back to the job hunt. I've watched many of your videos for helpful hints. You are a GIFT And very precise! Thank you.
you need to work on your writing skills
I love promotions without pay. They see you are a leader and then dump responsibilities on you. Or they want you to train your replacement(s).
Why would anyone accept more work for no additional pay? Looks like a red Flag to me.
😂 this happened to me during lockdown. I resigned immediately
I am Jill. Wish i was joe. Jill is a high performer and strategic / aggressive. Fast forward 12 years later. Jill is burnt out because she realizes she’s smarter than this stupid corporate grind. Now wishes she was Joe, Joe could have cruised BUT worked to build a business on side or juice up his investment to be ready once let go.
I'm 28, I just want to retire already :(
You can, just buy property in a property tax free state and get out of debt. THEN you can do what you love for money.
@@EveryDooDarnDiddlyDay 32 and I'm tired
@@GameOn71213 , how'd you get there so quick? If you don't mind :)
😂😂😂
@@ALCRAN2010 he didn’t sleep now his tired
My company is great. But sees me in 1 way, I am boxed in. Thank you for giving this mid career worker a bit of hope and real advice!
Currently in this situation -been with the same company for 10 years. Have been promoted like 4 times. Decent pay but it’s just time. I’m definitely going to follow Jill’s lead. I like how deliberate she is with her actions. She’s ok with saying no if it doesn’t help her reach her ultimate career goals.
The story about "Joe" really hit me...couldn't be more similar to him...worked at the company for over 10 years...me and my boss were like brothers...company went through development and reorganizations, at some point he decided to leave, his position was given someone else over me and it all went downhill from there...sidelined, did some easy stuff for two more years, because the money was good, and eventually the first chance they had, they got rid of me...now I'm almost 50 and "back to the job market" :( There are so many things I wish I did differently...
I have been with my company, a restaurant for 8 years. I did more work than others would of. Now I just got promoted and start my position in 10 days. My pay is doubled and I get vacations that are paid for and bonuses. I don't want to say I got lucky, cause I earned it. I picked up everytime. I trained all new hires, and I did all jobs needed in my place. I am thankful. My life has begun
This is why I'm seeking a new company even thought I have only been with my current company for two years. No room to advance and my capabilities surpass my job title. The company is too stuck on degree's, not experience and real World knowledge.
I definitely think there is definitely a middle ground with job hopping and being with a company for a good bit of time. Hop too much and it reflects badly. Don't hop at and it will also reflect badly. But watching this actually inspired me to revamp my resume and put myself out there. I got an offer I'm pretty excited about now and a great pay increase. While I will miss the people I work for and with its time to take the next step career wise.
It depends on what one wants out of life. Most people from my generation seemed to have stayed with a company, in most cases in the same position, for 20 + years and then either retired early or in many instances got let go when they were making a high salary so the company could cut costs. In business, most everyone is expendable.
Most ? U mean everyone ! No questions asked
Yikes, seems like opening your own business doesn’t seem that bad…
@@christopherdelcastillo0077 If you don't mind working 80 hour weeks, putting every dime of your savings on the line, and still risk losing everything, starting your own business is great.
Damn, 10:20 is just mindblowing. No wonder they tell you never talk about pay at work omg. Loyalty literally does not pay.
What if you really like your job and don’t feel like moving up into management? What if you just want to do more and more skilled work? I think more companies would do well to reward their non-leadership “key player” positions. These are often people who will improve your processes specifically because they don’t like organizing teams. They will cut out the BS that managers create to justify their positions.
Have you thought about speaking with your manager as well as some mentors in your industry about tips as well as certifications you can get? In my industry, I need a PE license as well as get the CPDT certification. Those are things I can do to have more responsibilities without going into management.
OP, your "key player" philosophy is excellent. I agree with you because I feel that is my role in my career and industry.
So much yes. I am a massive individual contributor and subject-matter expert but I have enough self-knowledge to know I don't have the right personality to do well in management. Management is a separate vocational discipline in itself - sucks that so often the only way 'up' is to abandon your genuine vocational discipline for a completely different one.
I kind of feel the same. I really enjoy what I do, but I know roughly what salary range I have available, and when I'll run out of opportunities for raises before having to go the management route and I'm not sure I'd want to go that route, in which case I'd be trading job satisfaction for a pay raise, and that's not really my MO.
@@belindajrule Companies usually work according to the Peter Principle when promoting from within. Typically, middle management is terrible because those that got promoted to such a position and haven't moved on are just plain incompetent at it even if they were competent at the previous job that landed them the promotion.
I always knew that a stable job is bad. One guideline is that if you are really good at your job to the point that you don't have to put any effort anymore, you are not getting anything that is difficult for you, or you are better at it than everyone else, it's time to move on.
Call me lazy but easy work sounds good to me.
When exactly is the point where you reach your highest level though? Eventually you’ll have to be complacent.
LoL I don't wait around till I gain mastery. 36 months is all it takes.
If your job isn’t giving you fulfillment, and that is important to you, then maybe. But there are many things in life that can give us fulfillment, and we have a finite amount of energy to spend. Sometimes maximizing the amount of effort we put into our career won’t lead to a better life.
@@ZePopTart That's not what he said. If you don't have to put _any_ effort into a job, then you're not improving/growing and eventually the market will leave you behind.
4:23 Jill is so on-the-ball that she crosses off "take a sip of coffee" whenever that task is accomplished.
I became a Jill, achieved seniority in a new branch of my career in 2 years based on strategic job hopping and by leveling up key skills. I think the company I'm in right now can help me grow even more, I've been transparent about my goals and they seem to have the means to help me get there. Let's see what happens.
401k what a scam. Not a good reason to stay. I want to control my money not Wall Street. Great video Sir.
I’d recommend renaming your channel though. The info is much broader than layoff info
Totally agree
I think your channel is one of best out of at least a dozen of others I have watched and I think it’s great for career coaching in general, I am lucky myself to have never been laid off so that’s not the reason I watch this channel
I do agree - this info is truly helpful to everyone ☺️
That!
Don’t listen to this guy
Keep going
I stayed in the same company for 16 years, but they had a system where you could get promoted, grow your role, but stay in the same place. They were an engineering company and didn't want technical experts to job hop, become people managers, or leave the company to move on.
You are absolutely correct ! When you described Joe, you described my 28 year career with 1 company, but I was not waiting for the promotion, I was applying and networking for the promotion within my own department. Great video, awesome advice ♥️
I've been there, had it happen to me. It was devastating but taught me a huge life lesson.
My unfortunate situation is that I absolutely loved my position of nine years and felt like it WAS my career goal. I received wonderful feedback from my supervisor and our client. Unfortunately, my employer lost a contract and I lost my job. I’m finding that your comments are totally accurate…the fact that I had only one position for so long seems to be hurting me in the aftermath. I didn’t want a promotion because i was happy but…this lack of mobility seems to be working against me.
This is an excellent video and I wish I knew this earlier. When I first graduated I got the job I wanted at the time, and I had this idea that I could be there for a long time. But often due to work politics (or other company related things), there was no potential for growth beyond the first few years I was there. My salary ended up lagging quite a bit behind also. Many companies are like this. You spend a few years learning skills mastering your role, but beyond that, there is nothing for you. This is why it's important to have career goals and don't shy away from job hopping (as long as you're progressing with each job you have).
Changing seats every 2-3 years seems to be the sweet spot. You don't necessarily need to leave your company, but if you are trying to have a career instead of a steady job, you can't sit still.
The only exception might be if your boss is a rock star and he or she has committed to being your mentor and wants to take you along for the ride.
Wow, why did you just describe me! 8 years in, I do the work for upper management, and they’re scared to lose me, but I don’t get good promotions. They’ve capped me at $75k. Im literally watching back listening to how others are fucking up, and I have to fix it, but yet they won’t pay me anywhere near as much.
Sounds like time to freshen up the resume and start the hunt.
This is me 100%. I’ve been too complacent , too comfortable and am going to look into my next opportunity.
This is so useful, I wish I had found your chanel two years ago.
Been actively looking for work after my previous job laid me off. You've been a veritable goldmine of information for me and I'm legitimately grateful for that; very glad I found you, thanks.
Just paused for a sec to comment because you literally just told my story and it’s been insanely difficult to bounce back from being kid off while feeling like a superstar...I’m feeling so much of the story you just laid out and it hurt me so badly. Just came across your channel and can’t say how much I appreciate what you have been doing here with what I’ve seen so far.
*laid off
To the people saying it’s “who you know” that is a very valid reason to change jobs and reinvent yourself. It’s called tabula rasa. Be the blank slate and do things differently to become likeable.
At my last job the CEO kept bringing in friends, distant relatives, and even a couple of his neighbors to fill all the best positions. The other people who succeeded were the ones who enjoyed the same sports as the CEO. He was personally involved in every single raise and promotion within the company and it showed. All of that would have been tolerable if the friends, relatives, neighbors, and buddies were competent at their jobs but they weren't and business suffered. It was a relief to get out of there.
This is good. I'm on my way to becoming a Joe - which is what has me looking at videos like this. I need motivation (a kick in the arse) and a master plan. My co-worker always brags that she's been with the company for almost 25 years. 25 years in and she only recently became supervisor (not even manager)...with less than a $10k bump in salary. No thanks.
I had two steady jobs, one after the other (22 years total) and I'm finding now, five years after leaving the second one, just how truly far behind I am. I don't aspire to the C suite, but even keeping/staying engaged at a mid level job is so hard these days.
Im going through that right now after 5 years. Listen to this people and act. Look after yourself and if you feel in any hindered move on to
another opportunity and don’t wait.
Great video - 9 years ( no promotions at all - I had became just an average Joe ) of a loyal service ( 2nd one in command ) and no pay overtimes led me to being terminated with no cause last year - new owners... new rules - but thanks to your video I'm smarter now and know why it has happened and I got a feeling it was a good thing for me cuz I was getting burnt out of working at that place ! - live and learn - always at a survival mode and forget loyalty...
I feel for you. Happens to many of us. I stayed with the same company for almost 15 years and was made redundant. My new manager felt threatened and didn’t like me. I was happy with the payout but shows you no matter how good you are, how many people you educate to improve their knowledge, they’ll shaft you in an instant.
There are many poor and cruel managers out there causing havoc onto people’s lives. Loyalty is nothing these days. Move on when we find a better opportunity.
Yup, I had a stable job a long time ago, and I stayed in it for nearly 10 years until I decided my income growth was getting nowhere, and decided to change jobs. The new job instantly gave me additional 10k in income, and 2 years later another 20k with a promotion.
So glad this channel exists. You are providing much-needed direction for me.
This means more to me than you can imagine. 🙏
Worker loyalty is a mirage society keeps trying to convince us is the best thing for everyone. I have gotten huge raises by jumping around to different companies the past few years. If I had stayed with any of the companies I used to work for 3 to 5 years ago, I would be making way less than what I do now. You will be told everywhere that job hopping appears to be bad on your resume. I have never experienced that, but I usually stick it out for about a year before jumping ship. Normally I look elsewhere after I find out I am getting a small raise (if any) and my boss is "moving" elsewhere. That's how you get ahead now. Apply for jobs in your field that are a bit higher on the corporate ladder and/or demand more money from the new job if you make a lateral move in the same position.
Well I am that average Joe. One who has had no interest in climbing the rat race ladder. I've worked at the same company since I was 18, 42 years ago and plan to retire in 5 more. In that time I have seen a number of people leave for better opportunities and return either several years later or just a few weeks later working at their old job or a different one. The grass is not always greener on the other side.
Life outside work has alot to offer
A higher paycheck doesnt attract me enough to climb the ladder
I know what would motivate me most to climb the carreer ladder is a higher purpose other than a paycheck
I wonder what carreer goals I should set myself for that
Soon it will be time to start figuring that out. For now im good
As accountant whose company just went outside the firm to filled a manager role, words cant describe how shitty it feels. At the same time, i have 3 out of 4 CPA exams done. I always factor in a plan B move when i plan my game. Always have a backup plan and dont be naive.
That’s great! I imagine you’ve passed all 4 now and moved on?
Hi Bryan, totally get it and I agree that people should work like a free agent. I’ve always worked with this type of paranoia - fear of being laid off and unemployable. I remembered during the pandemic I was able to land a job within two months of being laid off because I invested heavily in my career with the expectation that eventually bad times will be ahead. Covid was absolutely terrible with 10,000s of applicants looking for jobs. But because I was positioned well I was able to land another job pretty quickly.
There is a balance. You have to prove that you are stable as well and need to give a good explanation for you leaving your position during interviews. I know, not fair, but this world isn't. Good luck everyone.
which is why as long as you worked for a company, you can shrink or expand the times as you see fit.
@@asadb1990 indeed, if the company is big enough for you to be able to expand. Otherwise, you have to move on. Thank you for your comment.
@@chrisodebeek787 actually i meant in terms of how long you worked there to avoid coming off as a job hopper.
@@asadb1990 How? If u shrink the time, you'll have a gap in employment to explain or expand the time at another job.
@@void________ no you keep the same time. just less jobs with no gap. by shrink i meant to adjust timing so its appropriate for a job. lets say you are laidoff and you need a job asap. you can't just be patient for a high paying job so a junior level job is available and you take it and then keep looking.
We realky should get away from the idea that becoming a 'manager' is the only success criterion. Most people are not managers but create value in other ways. and many bosses are not fit for the task.Problem is that many bosses are overpaid and many others are underpaid.
I used to think staying at a company long term was a goal, then I kept getting laid off, kept finding new jobs, and my skillset and salary increased rapidly. Meanwhile my friends who gave me the side eye for "jumping around" stagnated.
There's a positive side to everything
Job hopping increases your skills over a wide range, but it does make you appear unreliable. But if you do happen to get a interview make sure you have a good enough reason to explain why you left each job in such a short period of time. During high-school and college years I don't think employers from entry level jobs care too much just as long as the company is desperately hiring or you have good enough references. The mass resignation is giving worker the upper hand in the job market
Your videos are extremely well put together, I'm impressed particularly by how professional you keep the register of the video while still spitting hard facts! 👏👏👏
What I didn't learn from this video, though I really wanted to:
- Why Joe wasn't promoted despite being a good worker. What a "leadership potential" means and how to measure it (edit: it seems that by the frequency of job changing; the more the frequency, the more the leadership potential).
- Why HRs prefer Jill over Joe despite Joe being as good as Jill at work and probably cost less. How HRs determine that Jill has a "leadership potential".
This is why i dont work for anyone they are just full of shit and they dont care about anyone they enjoy palying with peoples livelyhood
The reason Joe wasn't promoted is that from the companies standpoint if they promote Joe who is good at his job, they would have to pay to train Joe and the person replacing Joe. If they hire from outside, they only have to pay to train one person.
The age old saying is true.. People always rise to their level of incompetence
fatslapper123 already gave a good answer to this, but i just wanted to add on top of it that Joe doesn't exhibit signs of assertiveness, go-getter-attitude or the prioritize-my-assignment-above-all-else mentality (even though the assignment is what the company wants you to do.. one day you will realize that YOU simply want a better job and thus make that your #1 goal for the time being).
Someone who is content doing the same thing for years will net the company similair results to what is already known, while for a leadership position there are a LOT more of unknown variabeles.. it's like a storm you got to navigate your ship through. You need to have someone who is strong of character to navigate that ship through it and make the though choices to do so.
It's more of a mentality/mindset and the actions you do which exhibit that type of desired mindset. A company just like a ship on the ocean needs both type of people.. leaders and workers. A worker will always do a good and predictable job but will probably not go above and beyond and do whatever it takes (hence why Joe stayed at his position for so long, doing the same thing, passively believing one day positive change will come). A leader type of mindset will do whatever is necessary to advance their own goals (hence Jill left her job to not simply chase a better paying job, but a role which she desired more than what she had. She took the actions necessary to get that).
To answer your second question which nicely adds on what i already posted; "leadership potential" is determined by your previous actions, the results you made in your past career journey and what achievements you gained personally and/or for your company. Leadership is not simply just doing what is required but it is figuring out what is needed ahead of time, anticipating on events, managing them succesfully etc.
Other than what fatslapper said, Jill is more motivated and goal driven. These would be seen as better characteristics of leaders, as opposed to someone who just does their job well and then goes home. You can't expect to spend years in a particular role and then get promoted to manager just by being good at your job. It doesn't usually happen that way.
@@Jackques Joe has to show the company i guess that if they don't promote him soon, they won't just have to train the new "leader" but also joe's replacement, so, they will have to deal with 2 unknown variables.
instead of a good variable and an unknown one. I guess that's about it.
While in my case I didn't do something similar, at one point i just decided to leave and that's that. Even informed the higher ups like 6months prior since I did get along with them.
Oh my God Joe story is my story 🤦🏾♀️ received my severance package in 2020. I ended up taking another position so that I could have a job and just figured out another career path that I am more passionate about. This is a really good video! I am mid-career in my 40’s starting all over again so if you are in your 20s or 30s, please listen to the advice. Don’t stay too long and think about career goals.
I had been working on-and-off (project-based, short breaks in between) for the same huge company for over 6 years, and it even changed my behavior to the point where I would promote the company all the time in normal convos, without even thinking about it. When I got laid off I felt numb, almost like a part of my personality had gone missing. It's only now, almost half a year later, that I have un-learned that. Company loyalty can be good but you slowly get brainwashed, I realize that now.
This channel is almost like a diary for me at this point, with me returning to it after each layoff. Once again, I'm brainwashed for my current "company"/governmental institution that I work for, and I know my contract ends at NYE. The step to walk right into the work force for next year feels like an obstacle I'm struggling with right now, but I guess I'll be able to tackle it somehow.
My only complaint is how crappy it is to use a person (aka me) as a "start-up resource" for something you know a hella lot about and then turn the responsibility of that role to someone who is not as "in-tune" with what you have been doing and improving for the workplace. Well, in 2022 it's once again not my problem, the same as in 2021 for the previous company. Everyone working from home and stuff the past year(s) made companies think they can downsize a lot. When society completely goes back to normal, oh boy...
Whatever happens, happens for good..... Believe in this old adage. 👍🏻
Thank you for your good advice. I had the same idea in my mind. I wanted to climb up the ladder so I took a job that pays less but promises promotion after a year. I was a junior officer in a totaly different industry, I saw some red flag signs but I ignored them. Because I thought the person who referred me would fulfill her promise. I also informed her beforehand that I had no experience to the position she offered. After further discussion I accepted the offer. I’ve been in the comp for 6 months now and I am miserable. Not only my boss micromanages me ahe always finds way to scold me even in small things. I should have paid attention to my gut feeling. But on the positive note, I learned to control my emotions and improve my maturity level. To act professionally and calmly in difficult situations. In the past, I would always panic but now I see the difference. I learned that For every negative situation you’re in, satu calm and find ways to solution it. If you have done everything and the result is minimal then leave it as it is. Pray hard instead
that person who referred you deserve to be bitch slapped
If you’re miserable, that’s a red flag 🚩 to GET OUT. Pray that you can find another job fast. Good luck 🍀
In my case, I change companies every 2-3 years and so far I have always been able to achieve an upgrade of ~20% more salary. However, this is usually associated with the fact that I have to get out of my comfort zone and have new challenges, which I always grow. Sometimes it's scary and stressful, but it's always worth it.
Yep. Big raises only happen when you get promoted or start a new job.
I just subscribe to your channel because it is something I needed. I am one of those company people begrudgingly....
I currently work for a that does online shipping for furniture. Being mr. Consistent where I am, I stayed there for a whopping six years. There are positions that were open where I knew my skills would fit me in, but like usual they put their friends in those spots. One of those friends of a supervisor told me I complain too much, and I thought that myself yes about people like you. In a nutshell, supervisor was cool with him and thrusted him into the position.
To me that's too much of butt kissing, and favouritism being done
I find it a dilemma. Stagnating in a stable easy job or moving around and taking risk. Either way your working for someone else and getting screwed over
Excellent video - I wish I'd seen it 10+ years ago and will be putting a lot of what you shared to practice in the coming weeks and months.
This is where I'm at right now. I've been stuck in a warehouse job and I have a civil engineering degree.
Marketing degree and stuck in a warehouse.. I feel your pain and wish you the best
For me a steady job is great because I have my other dreams to pursue. I dont like giving my extra effort and creativity to boost other companies revenue. I will do it with my own company🙂
Sir. You are a GODSEND!!!! I wish I had seen this video after I was laid off. I am attempting to move into a new, highly competitive field that I find so interesting that I am willing to do math to do it. LOL. Thanks again for your assistance.
I AM Jill!!! I can't believe how closely her experience resembles my own. I am definitely heading over to your website. Thanks for the great advice!
I had the opposite experience for the first 6 years of my career where I stayed with the same company (up until recently) because I was promoted 5 times, nearly doubled my initial salary and was given a company car towards the end HOWEVER I recognized when I hit a road block that would have costs me hundreds of thousands in the long term had I stayed. I went against the grain and left for an elevated position with a $50,000+ raise. My Managers were shocked, despite prevalent industry issues that were making compensation a challenge. I let them know that loyalty and culture don't pay the bills lol Unless the job is excruciatingly toxic I would give the job 18-24 months to prove worthy of elevating your career and earnings. After that, its time to do your research and head out if it's not conducive to that.
Tech workers often leave not for titles, but for new technologies to work on. I think we’re a bit different from everyone else looking for a new title.
I am 63 years old. My longest gigs were a corporate job that lasted 12 years and a contract gig with three stable clients that lasted 11 years. For the most part, if you look at my resume, you will see a list of jobs lasting 2 years tops and I did that because I was chasing work that paid the bills. In that time I taught school, was an art director, a media designer, a project manager and even a shipping and receiving clerk. The problem with the idea that you somehow control your destiny is you don't. You might be ready to move on. You jump ship and take on a leadership role with a great small company only to have planes fly into towers and destroy the industry you work in. (True story) Stuff happens in life.
He is right about one thing. Loyalty means nothing. The company doesn't care about you. The corporate ladder at most companies is broken, for most people. That is why 95% of the employees don't get promoted. This is the reason I went out and started my own business.
I tried to be Jill and it didn't work due to boss playing favourites so I'm stuck being Joe and have lost all motivation. Sometimes hard work and aggressiveness doesn't pay off when you're in the wrong work environment. What matters most then is having the courage to realize this and do something about it like go somewhere else where you can be recognized and achieve your goals.
I love these stories. Speaks volumes
Personally, having had trouble getting a job after getting laid off of my last one, I just want a steady job that fits my skills, pays the bills, is a good workplace and is a job where I can stay a long time.
I guess it really depends what we all want from life and the lessons we learned along the way.
Spot on. My last company offered token COLAs each year, but kept adding to my workload with no real love outside of my boss's appreciation. When I let it be known that I was leaving, the CEO's case for me to stay was "stability." "Here peasant, have a COLA" is what I heard. I said no thanks, and left for $10k more. A year later I was promoted and got another $10k, plus two bonuses as well. Yes, job hopping is good.
It’s funny bc during the golden age of economic expansion 1946-1980 stable jobs were the rule not the exception. I’d take stability any day of the week over instability
Left my first job after three and a half years and it was the best decision ever. It's been 10 months since then and I have 2.5x my salary and am at a much better position. I will say from experience that staying a little long at your first company does have its benefits. If I had switched in a year, I would have been questioned for it in every interview. Loyalty left the room when my first job laid off senior folks who had been working tirelessly in the company for more than 8 years, as a part of the downsizing. "We are a family" is corporate lingo for "You are a line item in a spreadsheet". If you leave your job, you will get replaced faster than you can imagine.
Thank you for your video. I totally agree with you. Misplaced loyality can cost you a lot especially these days. Unfortunately people of a certain generation were bought up to be loyal and then they would be rewarded. Generally speaking certainly not true.
It’s really surreal that I had this exact conversation yesterday and this video showed up in my feed today.
This describes EVERY architecture firm I’ve worked at!
I'm probably going to be moving companies every 2 years. It's the best way get those salary increases we deserve as our experience grows, so if that's job hoping then hey
Two years is really short. Job hoping can hurt you aswell. Some employers will catch on with the pattern. Maybe within 5-10 year mark.
@@mackenziegray2090 definitely not lol. Screw those employers. Peoplev who don't job hop earn on average 50% less than their coworker. 5-10 years is too long considering i plan to only work at most 40 years. I'd be cheating myself tremendously. What i read is it's best to move around in your early career and around 40 you should be looking for a company you can retire at or do that 5-10years
I wouldn’t recommend this strategy long term.
Most companies consider those with less than 2-3 years per job to be job hoppers
@@mackenziegray2090 lol how many 5-10 year do you have in your working life
There is a saying... You don't promote your best salesman.
Catch 22.
Why would you? That is like making your best football player the coach while still being on peak performance. The result you are one star player short and have an inexperienced coach to deal with that loss. Plus especially in Sales Top Salespeople tend to earn more than the person they report to (at least in the companies I worked in).
This is a thing in a show called the Office. Michael is incompetent at being a manager, but is an amazing salesperson.
So you actually have to promote your best salesman. Your competition would love that opportunity.
I feel this video. I spent way too long with my first company, partially because they WERE a great employer for the first 7 years, but then became mediocre to bad in they next 7.
I left after numerous conversations trying to break through only to watch outsiders take those open senior positions. Since I left, I went to another company for 2 years and saw similar red flags, so I'm starting a new job soon. Compared with the first company, my salary will be 50% higher in a senior level position.
Bottom line: don't job hop just for the sake of change, but be open to opportunity, especially when you're not getting it where you are.
It's not about WHAT you know, it's WHO you know. I've been in the workforce for 34 yrs and have personally witnessed incompetent management. Makes you wonder how they ever got the job! Think about it!
I'm a painter making $25 an hour. I'm fine moving from job to job every 3-5 years simply for newness if the job isn't incredible. Then I'd stay as long as the job is awesome. Also maintaining $25 an hour or eventually more from job to job. That's a great outlook in my opinion. Healthy all around.
Great advice. You have to act as a free agent and work on your skills and see how you can become that super talent companies desire.