“80% of Transgender Kids Detransition” DEBUNKED
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- Do 80% of transgender kids grow out of gender dysphoria? Do 80-90% of trans people desist?
Here, we look at the Desistance Myth using an informed understanding of Gender Dysphoria and its diagnostic criteria in the DSM 5, the defunct diagnosis of Gender Identity Disorder from the DSM 4, and recent research from reputable medical institutions. And yes, we analyze the famous Thomas Steensma study (2013) and detransition rates overall.
Sources cited:
docs.google.co...
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Chapters:
00:00 Intro
This video contains 100% therapeutic grade skepticism.*
*This statement has not been evaluated by the FDA
In the 90s in that study, I absolutely would have qualified for that study. I wore a lot of boy clothing, played sports like football, played with toys boys liked, and was often called a tomboy. I have always felt like a girl/woman. I’ve never said I was a boy. So I would have been in that 80% even though I never claimed to be a boy.
Still important to teach parents the difference so as to avoid something like your parents unintentionally pushing you toward it.
@@emperorsascharoni9577parents don’t do that tho. It’s not a thing that happens
Same
@@emperorsascharoni9577I feel like that's simply bad parenting
I believe we don't even disagree on this topic, but that seems like an issue that's only artificially tied to gender-questioning kids
@@emperorsascharoni9577I don’t think that happens to any degree to be remotely a worry. People are probably «pushed to» have spinal and knee surgeries they later regretted to ASTRONOMICAL larger degrees.
If anything, the larger issue is the fact that parents are in denial and opposed to their kids transition, something that kills trans people in WAY larger numbers than trans people regretting it. THAT is the harmful pushing happening. Pushing that is responsible for trans peoples high suicide rate.
The solution is obvious. LISTEN to the child. Explore it together with them, and have them talk to a therapist or specialist who knows how to avoid pushing them to anything at all. THEN if the gender dysphoria PERSISTS as they approach or undergo puberty, they can be put on puberty blockers (that are safe and reversible) to give them additional time to decide, and THEN as they approach early adulthood consider actually transitioning with hormones and/or surgeries - as adults.
And gues what? That is exactly what happens. Of course, we are only humans, some mistakes are bound to happen sometimes, but this is THE safest, most empirically supported way to do it. Hence why the regret rate is less than 1%, lower than knee surgeries.
I've known plenty of gay men who were more gender nonconforming than I ever was growing up. Yet I turned out to be trans, and they did not. Gender identity is not the same as gender expression, nor does it need to correlate with orientation, and this is the biggest mistake the flawed studies make. There are tomboyish trans women and tomgirlish trans men after transition.
On top of that, it's not uncommon for nonbinary people to undergo transition for a time, then stop once they get the changes they want. Under the flawed studies, they would be counted as desisters, even though they would not have regretted it. Desistance is not the same as regret, and this is the second major mistake. People who stopped or reversed their transition due to actual gender identity reasons did not regret their experience, and were grateful for the opportunity to have explored who they are.
THIS. It’s not too uncommon for trans guys to have a traditionally more feminine style and vice versa. I’m so glad you brought this up because some people fail to realize this. (Edit: emphasis on “some”)
The part that drives me nuts is these people who act like a person can "accidentally" transition and that being trans is a passing fad and social contagion will actual experience extreme disgust and horror at even the idea of being the other gender.
I came out as trans at 45 after slowly breaking my egg for 5 years and one of the big reasons for finally coming out was just how horrified most people were at the concept of being the other gender. I started asking almost everyone I knew this hypothetical: You become physically the opposite sex for a period of time. When that time is done you change back but you can't opt out at any point. How long would you be opposite sex?
I was truly shocked at the responses because _most_ people wouldn't change at all. Not a week, not even a day. This blew my mind. I finally had to accept that I truly was different as my own answer ranged from 10 years to life.
I don't understand people who feel actual disgust at the idea of being the opposite gender claiming that being trans is a delusion. You couldn't be paid enough to transition yet you think trans people, even kids, are doing all this based on a whim? Who are these people, and what planet do they live on? Lol
I can't believe people don't understand the difference between sexual attraction (like if you're gay or straight) and identity (like if you're transgender). I still don't know what I am in terms of sexual attraction - probably bisexual as a practicality! Growing up as as trans-teen, you KNOW you're a girl but your body is male. You think "Should I go out with a girl ... and if I do would I be a lesbian/gay?" so you think about going out with a boy ... then look down at your body and give up. Or you think "Sod it, life is just too short to worry about what other people think!" and go out with another human being who cares about you. Labels are pointless to me.
They're just focusing on a few screaming detransition cases that decided to hate on trans... Imagine same happening regarding other medical procedures...
There's a lot of non-binary folks at the queer bars i got to, who started out identifying as a gay men.
I think the increased visibility of different trans folks, has allowed for a lot of afab and amab to explore their gender identity.
I worked for a trans support group for nearly a decade. In that time i met over 100 trans people and helped then start their transition, herd their stories, and helped them decide what they wanted to do and what resources where available. In that whole time only 3 people even seriously considered detransitioning. All 3 only considered it at all because of abuse. In all 3 case the abuse was mostly religiously based.
Only 1 of those people ended up going through with detransition, and only after YEARS of dedicated targeted abuse from not just imitate family but from extended family and their church community. This abuse included having their kids line up outside their door and cy and pray loudly about how god wanted them to detransition. They would CONSTANTLY get calls from their spouse where they would just cry and wail about how they where giving into demons. Over the course of 3 years of this my friend finally broke and detransitioned.
I don't even know where to begin with this. It's abhorrent to the greatest possible extreme. I know I have no bearing on things, but I hope you and your friend are doing ok & that they especially are doing well for themselves.
This is so sad…
Ain't no hate like Christian love
@@EtamirTheDemiDeer By a HUGE margin the number one reason for being opposed to a family member's or friends transition was religiously based. Nearly all of the trans people I worked with in my time had family or friends that wouldn't accept them anymore and with nearly all of them it was because of religious reasons. The second most common reason was political. fallowed VERY distantly by concern over side effects or the trans person changing their mind later.
wow you know i aint surprised at all that religion is once again a big source of problems just like it was since it first came to be and yet somehow some claim its good it is not good at all it teaches people how to not think and how to folow blindly to a set narative with no questions which is wrong i would say
"He's clearly not read or understood the studies he's attempted to cite"
I'm shocked, I say! Shocked! 😱
My worldview has been irrevocably shaken and I don’t know what to believe anymore.
Well, not that shocked.
What do you mean I shouldn’t form my opinions based on just the title of an article I haven’t read???
Frank Turek of all people NOT understanding something, yet using it with unwarrented confidence? Color me flabbergasted.
really? @@realdaggerman105
As a dad of a trans daughter I appreciate you sharing the truth. I have had to testify in the state Senate defending my child. To me it was comical that the other side couldn't quote a study that was less then 25 years old. Most much older.
Did the other side quote a 2,000 year old book? Lol.
Failed parenting
@@saintpepsi8602 ???
@saintpepsi8602 educate yourself on the topic.
@saintpepsi8602 Thank you for candidly sharing your experience with parenting. We all make mistakes, I just hope you can make amends with your children and show them how much you love them. Don't give up! Your failures can be learning experiences - if not for yourself, at least for others.
Thank you for engaging in the comments here - it really helps promote and extend the reach of this channel! ❤
My little sister had a gender flavored identity crisis in her teens. At first our family was vehemently against trying to use he/him pronouns for her, despised her chosen name and insisted it was "just a phase". I said "Whether or not its a phase, I'm here for the ride kiddo, I'll meet you where you are". She thought about pursuing getting male hormones to be taken seriously, so I helped her research the effects, asked her nonjudgmental questions about how those effects being permanent would make her feel and ultimately she decided it wasn't for her. I eventually convinced our family to use the pronouns she requested at the time, and because of that she eventually decided that it didn't feel right, and returned to she/her. She's much more comfortable with her identity now, embracing her femininty and knows that no matter who she is, her family loves her and is here for her.
If there are people out there who regret their transition, it all comes back to the support they didn't recieve, transphobia and rejection. Blaming trans people who are happy in their transition for that is absurd.
Yep. Even if they are actually cis, getting so much family backlash might result in kids deciding to push forward with their transition. It becomes less of a "I am this gender" thing and more "I want them to respect my ideas, right to self expression and identity as a human, so to make a point I'm going to transition even if it doesn't feel right." Then when they inevitably detransition because it wasn't right for them, it becomes "I told you so, trans people aren't valid" ammo which is just further insult to injury, when all the kid originally wanted was respect and to be listened to.
Plus, if it's truly just a phase, then all they have to do is wait it out non judgementally and they'll get what they want in the end. What's the point of making your kid defensive and angry if they aren't even asking for surgery or hormones, just different pronoun usage?
Too true.
@@ettaetta439that just means doctors should wait a few years at minimum before allowing ANY hormones to be taken. She as a teenager was prayed upon by this wicked ideology and after being told the truth she turned away from it.
THIS. This is show it should be done. Thank you for supporting her!!!
I don't understand the “it's just a phase“ crap anyway. Loving princesses or trucks is also *just a phase*, yet we don't tell toddlers to get adult hobbies right away. LIFE is filled with phases. Phases are important for development. What matters is experiencing that you are loved and supported and get a safe space to experiment with identities or expressions.
@@EbonyPopewhere is the risk in calling her by her preferred name and pronouns? where is the risk in letting her dress the way she wants to dress? these are non-permanent ways to let her explore her gender identity, and would have let her figure out that she was cis so much quicker.
the same way you can't make a trans kid cis via conversion therapy, you can't make a cis kid trans via supporting them.
And a note on that 1% regret for various surgeries: wishing you’d never gone through with a trans surgery has no bearing on what your gender is. If it did, that would mean that me weighing the risks as higher than the benefit and not having surgery means I’m cis. Which would be a ridiculous argument.
Yeah. I do know people who aren't happy with how their surgery turned out. I have chosen not to get a specific type of surgery typical for my gender, because i do not like the results. too many complications. Too many friends who've had so many follow up surgeries. The regret isn't gendered, the regret is medical reasons.
I love that it starts getting more acceptable that you don't *need* gender affirming surgery to feel affirmed in your gender, if you choose that the surgery isn't working for you for whichever reason.
And a 1% regret rate is astoundingly low for any surgery, let alone ones as big as transition surgeries
Regret rate also includes things like infections, botched surgery, scarring, and other potential outcomes of any surgery.
So some of the 1% did not regret the concept of their transition but maybe some other factor.
Especially when you understand that gender and orientation are separate. One might be trans and more attracted to people of their current gender, have had surgery to be completely physically their new gender, and then discovered that they preferred how sex felt before the surgery. Even with the best possible outcome and everything functioning as it should, they might just prefer the act as it was. In that case, yes, they regret the surgery, but they do not regret transitioning.
@@LMF1716Yes, the regret rate for *any* surgery is higher than that.
as a queer ex-muslim, thank you so much for using your platform to advocate for my community 🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️
❤
I really admire your courage to be an ex muslim and queer❤️🏳️⚧️
❤️
What is your community?
oh thank god the reply section isn't what i expected. good for you btw!
I'm a trans man and I transitioned when my kids were 5 and 2. My 5yo asked if she was also a boy. I asked if she felt like one. She said no. I said that she probably wasn't a boy, then. She said, "Oh, good! I like being a girl!"
Kids have a more solid grasp on themselves than many adults give them credit for. If I had been asked that same series of questions when I was 5, I would have given very different answers.
Not sure if they have a better grasp or not, but I think that you asking that question to them was the right move.
This feels very professional! Parenting 101, ask your children their opinion and listen:)
Another conservative myth busted or at least shown that it has nothing to do with being trans or gay, more like having to do with the quality of the parent, no matter their gender, sex, sexual orientation, so on and so forth.
How do you feel like a boy without defining stereotypes?
@@skinnykneega9511 I'm a trans man and I felt like a boy my whole life. When I thought about who I would be when I grew up, I envisioned being a man wearing a business suit like my father and going to work. Other girls my age thought about being like their moms, wearing pretty things, getting a husband, and usually caring for babies but I couldn't imagine myself doing that. I would try on my father's shoes and coat and think about the person I wanted to grow up to be. I hated being forced to wear dresses or makeup because it didn't feel like who I was or how I wanted others to see and treat me. I just wanted to run around with the boys in my neighborhood, and I wanted be accepted as one of them.
When I started puberty I hated what was happening to my body. I couldn't date because I intimacy made me feel like a girl which was a horrible feeling. It's impossible to enjoy a partnership and intimate touch when it makes you feel like your body and existence is wrong.
In my dreams, I was usually male. When I was six I had a dream about walking through a large marble hotel where naked men and boys walked around ignoring like I was invisible. I was also naked, with my girl body and I would look at the men and understood I was supposed to be at this place with them but my body wasn't right.
I don't think any of that is stereotypical. I envisioned my future and patterned myself after a male role model because that felt most appropriate to me. I wanted other kids to acknowledge me as a boy and treat me like one. I wanted to date as a man and needed to be intimate as man. In my inner world I was male but my external world didn't always reflect that until I transitioned.
Things that made me feel feminine or caused others to treat me as a girl or woman caused emotional pain. Things that made me feel masculine made me feel relief, made me feel normal.
There's a difference between behaviors that are typically gendered and how you feel overall as a person. But there is also a sense of yourself and how you want to be perceived by others that is gendered. I have a beard and a low voice, I work a job where the vast majority of my coworkers are men, strangers and friends all know me as a man. I feel comfortable in my life because the way others see me and treat me lines up with how I feel internally. I did grow up to be the man I envisioned myself becoming as a child.
It's the kind of thing best perceived when there is discordance. When you thought about who you were and who you would become as a kid, was it a different sex than you are now? Or was it the same? If it was the same, why would you need to consider an existence where that wasn't the case, right? You don't know what it feels like for that sense of sex for the self and the body to be different, and the best way I can describe it to ask you to imagine waking up tomorrow in the body of the opposite sex and knowing you'll have to live in the that body for the rest of your life. Really imagine how people would treat you, how you'd feel looking in the mirror and putting on clothes. How you'd date and how you'd go out with friends. If none of that seems like a problem maybe your one of the people where gender doesn't matter that much, but for many this sense is very strong and innate.
@wrote Ummm... I don't remember asking for a dissertation on confused tomboys. My God...
This is comment section is a little icky man. Even if Frank was talking about desistence, the claim is false. Any outdated study that claimed 80% of desistence lumped gender non-conforming people in with trans kids. Gender expression is not the same as gender identity... The vast majority of medical associations recommend gender affirming care for trans people as medically necessary.
I can understand the concern for trans kids, but there is so much misinformation in the comments about this. Kids are not hooked up on hormones the moment they express any gender non-conformity. Children only get medical treatment when a team of pedatricians approve of it. Most of the time, transition for trans kids don't involve medical stuff at all, only social changes like clothing, name, pronouns, etc.
The scientific consensus is clear, gender affirming care drastically increases well-being
Thank you.
You’re 100% right. My next video will source all of these facts. The number of non-religious people who have fallen for anti-trans pseudoscience based in religion is insane.
@@GeneticallyModifiedSkepticnot only that, what you stated is also true. Upon analysis of the said study which they use, it was found most of the kids didn't even meet the criteria for gender dysphoria or GID. But I'm not surprised
@@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic Conservatives always need a minority group to scapegoat & demonize.
@@GeneticallyModifiedSkepticyou’re darn right. It sucks how so many people in the literal “skeptic community,” of all places, fall for pseudoscience and religion-based hatred as soon as the aesthetic appearance of religion is downplayed. It seems like some of us in the communtiy are more trained to recognize religion as bad than manipulative, dishonest rhetoric as bad. Excited to see your next video ❤
I know a guy who de-transitioned. He's still very friendly with and active in the trans community that welcomed him in the first place. 🤷♂️
Same here! This picture they're trying to paint of trans folks and detransitioners being at each other's throats is wild.
@@justseffstuff3308 there is a reason you always see the same dozen or so detrans people on right wing media. It's incredibly rare to detrans and dislike/hate the trans community.
If someone figures out they're not trans after all, but they're still a cool person, I'm here for it.
Of course, because we just want people to have freedom of self expression and the ability to live in a way that makes them happy. Whether that means transition, detransition, or no transition. It’s such an audacious lie that there’s a concerted “agenda” to manipulate or force people into being trans. We know it doesn’t work like that, but even if it did, what the fuck would be the point?
@@twooey8232 It seems to mostly be people who were sadly forced to detransition due to outside factors (mostly lack of any support from anyone around them / financial struggles) and who are internalizing "It must be something wrong in me that I need to suppress, and anyone who tell me otherwise is evil". That Prager U 'documentary' was extremely sad - not because they had de-transitioned, but because they seemed so utterly miserable and repressed after doing so.
As a trans girl ex evangelical I appreciate you 🖤
Same girl!
Cis Man, always been an atheist, I appreciate you both. ❤
Me too!!
Much love my dear friends! 🙏
@@TrulyWithGod123 are you 5??
I've heard the claim, but it has most often come from sources I wouldn't trust to properly clean and bandage a basic wound.
What you have is cognitive dissonance 🤡
@@emilgabl9069 , Most people do to some extent, it's a basic coping mechanism. Having trouble seeing as to how that applies to the post you are responding to. Feel free to explain.
Extra fun is when their sources often don't even say what they claim.
@@emilgabl9069 Not, it's called checking your sources.
@@Szadek23 only 1% of trans kids/adults cited regretting their transition surgery…look that up.
The 80% states is a lie.
I hate that they always imply that young kids are get hormones and surgeries. Hormones and hormone blockers don't happen until puberty, and surgeries for gender care are not going to happen before someone is finished growing.
And that's not even a moral or ethical thing, it is an impossibility to do any of those things prior to puberty.
So true! In my country you need to be an adult to transition and a whole year of therapy before going through the full transition, mostly to help the trans person cope with their new reality as their real gender and not the gender they were assigned at birth, not counting all the legal changes they need to go through as well such as their ID, driver's license and many personal documents.
People still think just in one day, any cis man can say he is a woman and be taken as such, go to women's bathrooms, participate in sports and do better than cis women, ignoring that trans people go through a lot just to be who they are.
Oh and in my country you get to do this just once, if you transition, it's legally forever, no way back.
Almost like the arguments used by these people are made up in the hop of shocking their cult like following.
But is it safe and ethical to block puberty?
@@BUSeixas11in some cases - like gender incogruence - yes. It's about comparing potential risks and benefits.
Remember y'all, the divide between trans people and people who detransitioned is purely fabricated by transphobic talking heads.
Many people who detransitioned are incredible allies. Besides being simply wrong, widening this divide by expecting malice from the ""other side"" plays right into the hands of the third side that's truly going to hurt everyone.
Being charitable and empathetic makes all of us stronger.
There is a reason why the right needs to trot out the same detransitioners over and over. First, they are a super rare subset of an already very rare group. On top of that you have to find people willing to actually be hateful to trans people. There have been state legislative hearings on trans issues where when the chair requires the right to only bring the testimony of in-state detransitioners, they literally have no one.
I appreciate that statement as well, the last thing we need is more in fighting to be social cannon fodder.
It baffles me why is talking about detransitioning or being trans-confused automatically considered transphobia, no matter how it's phrased. Just because someone has an issue with some aspects of trans-activism that's not skeptical and careful enough causing these mistakes, doesn't mean they hate trans people.
@@AmberyTear being skeptical of issues that don't exist is transphobic because it perpetuates the assumption that they are real. Skepticism towards trans activists grooming children, desiring to perform surgeries on children, or transitioning to assault people in bathrooms is not genuine skepticism but transphobia. Similarly, the issue I initially discussed is a fabrication by transphobic individuals, and the trans community, like any other group, can be susceptible to propaganda, including that from the opposing side.
You'll find some people on Twitter getting angry at those who don't understand being trans, but I assume that's because they are the minority that is going to post comments about it. In the trans groups that I am part of, such as trans subreddits or discord servers, lacking knowledge but maintaining a supportive spirit is seen as endearing.
@@ts4743Well, at least you shouldn't assume bad intentions like that. Lack of understanding and scepticism doesn't ALWAYS lead to hatred. What if someone thinks they themselves could be trans but aren't sure if the concept makes sense to them but since it's personal they feel they need to try to understand? I'm speaking from my own experience, the concept of gender being separate from sex is in fact very confusing. I respect transgender people as people, and I don't have a strong opinion on their experiences. Doesn't mean I can't privately have my doubts based on my own experience, knowledge and beliefs.
Why am I not surprised Jordan Peterson also cited this article?
L o b s t e r s
Because like Turek, he's a grifter with an axe to grind against trans people. Conservatives always need a scapegoat to direct their bigotry at.
I hope he mixed it up with his other talking points.
"80% of transgender people are older than trees!"
Its interesting how frauds and bigots always find the same, worst souces for their claims to confirm their bias.
JBP would cite the epic of Gilgamesh if he could twist it to support whatever he said.
i’m not trans but as a cis queer person, it means the world for you to cover this & do your part to combat the unfounded stigma surrounding gender transition. your videos regarding religion & theology brought me so much peace & understanding throughout my deconversion from christianity. i’m so happy that you’re using your platform & your research abilities to support the trans community & be there for them the way you’ve been there for so many ex-religious people
Having a "doctorate" in Christian Ministry is like having a doctorate in the study of vampires...
I have a doctorate in having-seen-way-too-much-Japanese-folklore-as-an-American-European
I would love to have a doctorate in the study of vampires ngl
@@_butter.cup_ same, it sounds cool
@@ScoutA.Mellivora I KNOW RIGHT?!?!
Hey! Quit dissing the vampires!🤣
9:52 this was the study helped me realize that the numbers of detransitioning had been inflated. That transition regret was a percentage of a percentage.
The study he cites is talking about trans people who temporarily detransitioned in the past. NOT the same thing as studying actual detrans people. This video is so misleading.
@@XxYwise not really, when you check the document that he left (the number 12 page 115 )the one he's talking about, you can read clearly how the percentages presented includes all people who ever detransitioned, not only those who detransitioned temporarly.
It's important that you check the documents before accusing someone from being misleading
Well, didn't expect a torent of statistics and an avalanch of methodological analysis.
Good to have some ammo against the 80% soundbite.
Thanks
@@pufffincrazy5275 so many people who are against the christians because they spread their harmful beliefs while sitting here spreading their own misinformed harmful beliefs. Neither of which are supported by any scientific evidence. Its hypocrisy at its finest
Another good source would be "Disco Psychiatry" an expose on Zucker and his weird claims about GID/GD by The Trans Advocate.
Basically, he was motivated by something and it wasn't the wellbeing of LGBTQ youth.
None of it is correct.
I felt like something was off with my gender at 4 years old and 48 years later I still feel the same way. Gender dysphoria never goes away.
Same, the feelings I had as a child didn’t change they remained consistent.
As a psychologist/small youtube creator who happens to be at the same time nonbinary - thank you for this video!
This myth is so common and I remember checking the research behind it and getting cringed by the "conclusion" they have from that. Research on gender identity has recently been very developing and the trans diagnosis and treatments get better and better.
I also often encounter people disbeliving that you can know your gender identity as a kid, even though most of 4 years old already have established sense of gender identity.
What's also annoying is that they often confuse gender identity with gender expression. Like, thinking that transboys are just tomboys. Or saying someone can't be trans becauee they exhibit traits and interests congruent with the expectations people have for their assigned gender at birth.
I won't even start on myths regarding nonbinary...
Anyway, if you wanna debunk more trans myths "coming from reliable research", I recommend checking "rapid gender dysphoria". 😵
My next video will address in debunk “rapid onset gender dysphoria,” among a few other myths like it
@@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic Can't wait! Let me know if you need some help with research or some more indeph knowledge from a psychologist like me. I remember having intensly researched trans topic when ICD-11 was about to officially be out.
@@GeneticallyModifiedSkepticomg i am SO excited for that video!
The fact that TERFs cling to ROGD despite how awful that study was just blows my mind.
@@cuesee.psyche oh cool! i look forward if this becomes a collab!
I have recently written my thesis on Gender Identity in developmental psychology age ~0-6 with a focus of trans, inter and non binary kids, maybe that'll be helpful too? didn't touch on ROGD though.
@@SartorialDragon That sounds cool! Are you willing to share that thesis? As a bargain chip I could show you my article on gender identity bias toward binarny and nonbinary trans people. 😅
It's funny how "you might regret it" is never used to ban things conservatives like. Playing football has the potential to cause injuries with lifelong impact (especially concussions, those can really mess you up!), but good luck trying to ban youth football. (It's also worth noting that not all detransitioners "regret" transitioning.)
Hell most detransitioners don't regret transitioning. They just couldn't continue because of a lack of support or abuse they were suffering. Nearly all of them go on to retransition as soon as it's safe for them to do so.
The same puberty blockers used in trans kids are used in kids with hormone instability that make them grow too high too soon, and the side effects, like the lower bone density that transphobes like to want about, are also seem in those kids. But they never did complain about it.
@@Vivi2372 that is objectively false. Site your sources.
@@cp37373Not saying they're wrong or right, but calling it objectively false and not siting your own counter source is so funny.
@@cp37373The source was literally in the video you're commenting under.
"Hell most detransitioners don't regret detransitioning": 9:54 - "Only 5% of those who had de-transitioned reported that they had done so because they realised that gender transition was not for them, representing 0.4% of the overall population [of people surveyed]."
"Nearly all of them go on to retransition as soon as it's safe for them to do so" - 9:29 "8% of [27,715] respondents reported having de-transitioned at some point. Most of those who de-transitioned did so only temporarily: 62% of those who had de-transitioned reported that they were currently living full time in a gender different than the gender they were thought to be at birth."
27,715 people is an extraordinarily large sample size. Yes, there are still people who regret transitioning because with hindsight they don't think it was right for them - after all, 0.4% of these 27,715 respondents, about 110 people, said as much. But they are a tiny minority of people who have transitioned, which itself is a tiny minority of the general population. To suggest that we should restrict people's ability to transition in order to protect these people from making a mistake they will regret is ridiculous. It would be like banning all vaccines on the grounds that some people will have allergic reactions to them. You don't hurt 27,605 people to help 110 people, especially not when there are easier ways to help those 110 people, like increasing general awareness of gender dysphoria and what it means to be transgender so people are less likely to mistakenly believe that that is what they're experiencing.
Actual research doctor here…great work and great summary!
This reminds me. I’m looking to conduct some new research on trans issues in the workplace.
I’m looking for some topic suggestions.
@@SofieSybellaOne that I would be interested to see is if there's a corelation between pay, promotions, and transitioning in the workplace. But if it's more social topics a good one I'd be interested in is how many trans people recieve pressure against or support for their transition from coworkers
@@LMF1716 thanks! Those both sound like interesting topics. I’ll look into what’s been done in those areas to see where the knowledge gaps are. Thanks again for the suggestions!
@@SofieSybellaI am out as a lesbian at work, but not really so much as trans even though I am out elsewhere. Might be interesting to see how common that is?
as a trans person myself, my single regret is not transitioning sooner.
Me too
My only regret as well.
Seems like a similar, sad trend...
I have regrets about my body modifications as a transgender... Some tattoos... LOL !
Same. And the fact that I cared so much about the opinions of people who are just...kinda shitty.
Thank you for covering this topic. It often feels like it is us who have to defend and "explain" ourselves, while people of all stripes attack us. This is very exhausting. There are too few of us to be able to defend ourselves completely.
And this is why trans people are and always have been part of the LGBT community
We stand together.
@@pufffincrazy5275 well, there are people that think otherwise. But indeed, from an outsiders perspective, they all are different sides of the same coin, besides, everyone is stronger united:)
@@A-A_Pthere are, but its only a minority pushed by right wing media.
besides there have always been assimilationists and exclusionary movements, that engaged in respectibility politics not just in the lgbtq+ community but in all human rights movements.
We will stand together and they cannot divide us.
Very good Drew. Christian apologists won't dare to dig into the study like this. They just go "well we both have studies" and hand wave it away.
it's disgusting how quickly transphobes will shift from "it's just Basic Biology" to "the Illuminati is controlling all of Science and Medicine in a conspiracy to trans your gender" the second Intermediate Biology shows up.
I mean I already knew the 80% thing wasn't true from my own subjective experience. I've met lots of trans people who knew that they were trans from an early age, and 0 cisgender people who thought that they were trans as children
Well why would someone say they were trans as a kid if there not trans as a adult?
@@tfordham13 I suppose they could be denying it as an adult because they don't want to admit they really are trans. If they really were transgender as a kid, they still are even if they don't want to be. And if they are happy, it's ok.
@@tfordham13 people would say "I wanted to be a girl when I was young, but I grew out of it"
You would think people trying to invalidate trans people would go around saying that.
I suspect people are overplaying instances of teens exploring identity, the ways teens always do. I personally had a few months where I considered whether I might have gender feelings when I was 15ish - I'm a relatively butch lesbian who was enjoying cosplaying male characters a lot, and I wanted to try getting mens clothes and dressing more masculinely and cutting my hair short. I discovered that while I like the broad concept of drag - i enjoy temporarily presenting more masculine as part of play-acting or performance - i don't personally want people to perceive my identity as a whole as male.
I can easily see kids who might be more ambivalent towards gender or feel out of place from same-sex peers for other reasons experimenting with the concept of being trans for a bit, and eventually deciding that that's not right. Obviously, this is extremely different from a pre-teen insisting that they are a different gender from their assigned at birth, but I suspect conservatives are lumping all instances into the idea of teens going through phases
@@Jacob-yb3hzif I heard “I’m no longer gay” I would definitely be skeptical of that OR think that they weren’t gay to begin with. Honestly I would just ask if they were no longer acting on homosexual tendencies.
Thank you for covering this topic, Drew!
I'm a queer enby, and I was homeschooled and grew up in a Christian fundamentalist cult and abusive, homophobic, and transphobic home.
I knew even when I was a kid that I was "different" in terms of gender, but I didn't know how and I didn't have the language to describe it. And I didn't feel safe enough to ask those questions, so I could only discover my sexuality and gender after I left the cult.
I’m sorry you had to go through that. I hope you have since found a supportive chosen family
@@snuffyd2973 thank you! ☺️ I have a partner and a best friend, they're my chosen family, and I am part of theirs. I hope to acquire more in my chosen family as time goes on.
Quick trauma dump, but oh well, I think it's important to say: As someone who is part of the LGBT+ community, who was a victim of CSA, thank you so much for pushing back on this new wave of anti-LGBT moral panic, Drew. Seeing the community that has shown me nothing but compassion, understanding and kindness being accused of "grooming" children (the very thing that ruined most of my childhood and put me in therapy for MANY years, lol) has been quite painful, to say the least. I know you've been getting backlash for defending trans rights, but you're doing the right thing by speaking out against all this (anti-scientific) nonsense. I know I'm just one person, but it really means a lot to me, so once again, thank you!
Just here to say that I hope you have more good days than bad and that you have a wonderful adult life. Know that this random internet person hopes only the best for you and that the people that hurt child you are going to be held accountable by either the law or their god.
As a trans individual who was repeatedly CSA'd by a right-wing family member, you're not alone 🫂
@@carolbaker2773 Thanks, random internet person! All things considered, I'm doing pretty okay (otherwise I probably wouldn't be commenting on a public video), so no worries!
“Facts over feelings”
“Well, here’s a study that shows these feelings are actually facts”
“NOOOOOO, BUT THAT GOES AGAINST MY FEELINGS!!”
I swear, it’s like this every time
Im actually pretty tired of that whole trans debate shit. Because in like 99.9% of matters you could and should just let people be people without holding them back. And it is on top of being unnecessary also distracting from other actually mattering matters like climate change, the economy, peace or whatever. I cant even imagine how that feels for someone who is trans.
It's basically no different from other minority groups. Only difference is the justifications used by bigots
Well, as someone who is trans, and worried about the economy and the environment and if I will be able to pay the rent next month, it really sucks to see politicians ignore those very real issues that affect us all in order to single me out and force me to now have to justify my very existence on top of dealing with all that other stuff. Life's a real party.
Well then maybe they should apply that to themselves?
I've found that it's not uncommon for transphobics to believe that "tomboys" are all now considered trans boys.
Isn't that just a masculine presenting woman/girl? (Much like myself. though I'm not the best example as I'm a bit confused on the whole gender identity stuff, mainly cause I don't really give 2 shits about what pronouns people use for me...) you don't have to be a boy/man to present yourself as masculine, nor a girl/woman to present as feminine. People really be wilding these days. (I sure hope Wilding means acting dumb/crazy...)
@@TearfulZorua I'm pretty ambiguous myself :) I don't even think it is about presenting masculine for transphobes, they think of a girl wants to play with boys and do "boy things" that people consider them "trans." I don't know if it is intentional or if the understanding is just so lacking.
@@TearfulZorua pretty sure that tomboy is just masc girl/woman
One thing I hardly see anyone mention. Why would we get rid of gender affirming care because of people who detransition? If we fund gac more, the methods will improve, and as it improves that wil directly improve the methods for people who want to detransiton for any reason
this. the regret rate for GAC is lower than knee replacement surgeries. it's lower than corrective surgeries for deviated septums. it has lower regret than treatments that are necessary to not become physically disabled.
It's a smokescreen. They think (and they'd be right if the statistics were right, which is why they lie about them) that if "80%" were real, then that would mean we need to stop letting people transition, because an 80% failure rate means there's something horribly wrong.
The goal isn't to help people, the goal is "stop people transitioning" which they'll lie about anything under the sun for. If they were sincere in following the science and common sense, then they wouldn't be pushing this stuff - the sheer fact that they are pushing this stuff, and have filled in their conclusion and come up with lies all about the shop to justify it, is proof enough that they should be ignored.
As a trans woman and long-time fan of yours, I appreciate your solidarity. ❤️ Anti-trans ideologues engage in intellectual dishonesty in much the same way as evangelicals. It’s emotionally exhausting for us to constantly have to call out disinformation, so when allies step up it’s really encouraging.
It's a bit sad that stating basic facts is seen as showing solidarity, goes to show how dishonest and bad-faith the discussion is. Let's hope the future is less bigoted
It's also worth noting, that although anyone who listens to this channel regularly would realize it's supportive towards trans people, it can be difficult to know where "New Atheists" stand considering the alt-lite leanings of people like Sam Harris or Ayaan Hirsi Ali
@@ashley1299This is really important to mention, thank you!
@@The8BitPianistVery true 😕
7:12 the way I rolled my eyes. "Simply asking the child is of great value in predicting the future outcomes for both boys and girls with GD"
What a shock. Who'd have thought. Groundbreaking.
Reminds me of how we used to do surgery on babies without anesthesia because we thought they couldn't feel pain. Then in the 80s we were like "Huh, babies DO feel pain. Perhaps they need anesthesia when we cut them open after all". Like no shit, really? 🙄
As the parent of a transgender child and the aunt of another transgender child…thank you for being a voice of reason and sharing the truth.
Either a vegan cat situation or someone's letting the internet do babysitting.
@@lainiwakura1776 or perhaps trans people exist, which leads to the occasional family with more than one trans person.
@@Idkpleasejustletmechangeit I do have to say I'm not familliar with the topic, but might there be some genetic etc reason transgender people might show up more in some families than in others? That would certainly explain that one clustering well, not that such proof would be needed or anything, rather as this question was raised.
@@A-A_PI wouldn’t be surprised if there is a genetic factor to being trans. The accepted theory is that it is similar to being intersex just that the difference lies in the brain instead.
@@A-A_P might be.
Fairly certain we don't really have a complete scientific explanation for why some people are trans yet.
My comment was more based on basic statistics, but there could probably be some influences from the person's genetics (I'm not qualified to talk about the science here. Don't take this as me saying that it's a fact).
I would definitely love to know these things.
As a trans woman, I've had this argument on the internet a thousand thousand times. I feel like most progressive/skeptic/leftist personalities online actually dodge this issue a lot, and I often hear them say like "oh well this isn't really my topic to talk about as a cis/het man." I really REALLY appreciate hearing this coming from cis people. One of the most annoying things about being trans is that I could go over this shit until I'm blue in the face but the type of people that cite awful myths like desistence theory also would discount my opinion after a nano second.
As a trans woman, thank you for addressing this. It's so tiring having to justify my existence. The misinformation is everywhere, and it's always coming from religious zealots. The abuse is non-stop and I wish I could just snap my fingers and make it all disappear.
Again, thank you. You have a louder voice than we do, so it means a lot.
Also, I see you have shinigami eyes, always awesome to see it!
Man in dress
@@saintpepsi8602 Bro just proved her point...
@@biffyushh! don’t tell them! they might actually start to use their brain!
@@saintpepsi8602 Why are you obsessed with trans people?
@@DebraKeyes-ib8rg bro did not get the point of what I was saying... yikes.
Transition is one of the few medical treatments that a person can get an idea of the impact of without actually going through it just by putting on clothing makeup and prosthetics. By the time someone gets to where they're trying to medically transition they've been cross-dressing for years and know exactly why they're doing it.
How is that possible if they're a child who has n't been alive for even two decades?
@@AndrewClunn exactly. What they do. They misrepresent what is actually going on and what is actually being talked about. Children should not ever be allowed to transition. They cannot make life-changing decisions for themselves. They don’t even even know who they are yet.
I appreciate the comment, but just to clarify, it's not cross dressing. It's a trans person dressing as their gender.
So in English we have plural nouns like many languages do, if something is pluralized that indicates more than one. Two decades is 20 years, and 2 is less than 20. If a kid has been presenting as a different gender than assigned at birth for two years and is happy presenting as that gender, it is a good indicator that they may be trans and that slowing down the very real and permanent effects of puberty until they're certain which ones they want can be life saving
@@AndrewClunnYou are aware that nowhere in North America can people under the age of 18 get SRS (bottom surgery) and that it's _extremely_ rare for any trans related surgeries even 16-17? The number of people under 18 who in the past decade have received gender related surgery is under 5000. We are talking actual hundredths of a percent of trans youth and only in extreme cases.
So what are you objecting to? Hormones? Okay, there is an easy solution, hormone blockers. Low risk, reversible and used far more commonly on cis children. Don't want youth on hormones or getting surgeries? Allow the use of puberty blockers under the care of qualified doctors.
Sadly, this whole debacle about no longer giving acceess to trans care isnt about protecting kids. Its about trying to erase the trans experience as a whole.
The moment these things will go treugh, they will go after transgender adults too and that breaks my heart.
Indeed
Hip replacement surgery has a higher regret rate than SRS. Just a personal favorite stat of mine.
The average regret rate for any surgery is about 14% and GCS regrets are so much lower than that.
I am a psychologist who works with transgendered children and have so for 15 years.. Very, very few ever "detransition."
End of story.
Yet, people always listen to everyone, except the very people who are actually qualified to have a say in such subjects, like you.
@@costelinha1867 ...or the kids themselves. They are the experts of what they are experiencing.
i’m a trans person and i am so incredibly thankful for this video. it’s a really approachable way to share this information with people - level, fact-based, and compassionate. i deal with a lot of harassment about detransitioning and this is going to help me a lot
Seriously, you are a blessing for the queer community! Your kindness and competence are soothing in a world full of scalding rhetoric.
blessing is religious language. Please don’t use it here
@@hippios don't do that
@@hippios guess what, there might be religious people who aren't bigoted listening to atheist voices. Not everyone needs to be an antitheist to value human rights and wellbeing above supposedly divine commandments.
@@hippiosblessing is also used by non religious people, it’s just a word. I’m an atheist, I still say “oh my god”. You aren’t the word police, stop it.
@@hippiosBless your heart.
Trans rights are human rights, folks.
Slight cap
Frank Turek 🤢🤮
I wouldn't believe FT if he was reading my autobiography to me.
In the immortal words of Thurl Ravenscroft and in reference to Frank Turek, “I wouldn't touch you with a 39-and-a-half foot pole!"
I met Frank Turek in person. Although I disagree with him on an incredible number of things, and he seemed very set in his ways, he did not seem like an awful person generally. I wouldn't bet on him ever changing his mind on anything, and he will continue to misrepresent science based on his preconceived religious notions, but he doesn't seem malicious or overly self-centered like Trump or Alex Jones.
@@benkesler487 Dude, come on... You just stated that he misrepresents science. Do you think people don't correct him on that? Do you really think he doesn't do that on purpose, after being corrected, time and time again?
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it."
He is the perfect example of that.
@@benkesler487 Frank is white suburban man nice. He is not upfront with his hostilities and performs shallow civility. I might be presumptuous but he comes across as a guy who would vote to have homeless people bussed out of his city. He is the kind of guy who would vote for laws that put queer people in danger. He basically wants to push people who don't conform to his ideals out out of society through political violence. All with a smile and a good attitude.
Commenting for the algorithm because we've been saying this for a decade, and we need to keep saying it where more people will see it.
Your thumbnail alone may do more good than most of our debates with transphobes online.
What's not exaclty hard, because debates are more and more being proven useless. People don't change their minds with debates, they always see their sides as the winner. Debates feed confirmation bias much more than critical thinking.
@raquelpardal5343 I've seen the argument that the debates CAN be useful in convincing spectators. But I haven't seen data that looks into it. I imagine there may be people on the fence who see a transpobe or homophobe or any other bullheaded bigot act unreasonably angry about simple questions and go "maybe he's not that smart." Or Paulogia and Genetically Modifed Skeptic did both start to deconvert when they started asking questions. Debates can provide an opportunity to pose such questions.
TL;DR I'm not entirely certain they CANNOT change minds, but they don't seem to be the main driving force
This is a strange experience for me.
When I first discovered your channel, I was a mildly (while inadvertently) transphobic Christian.
Now, about two years later, I've come to realise that I myself am trans. While I still go by Christian, I simply use it as an umbrella term for the set of morals I believe all humans should follow.
I've gone from being skeptical and somewhat biased against your content, to actively accepting and (in the case of this video) relating to it.
Thank you for being a consistent source of critical thought.
Seeing comments like these gives me hope as a trans person fr. Theres so much negativity thrown our way whenever a cis person makes a video like this, but stuff like this makes me think even those people can change with time.
As a trans person I already knew all this, but most people don't so thank you! I'll just add: it's actually a good thing if not every kid who goes to a gender clinic decides to transition. It shows that the therapists there are doing their job, which is to help patients figure out if transitioning is right for them in the first place.
Yes, good to point that out! That’s what gender clinics and therapists are there to help with.
I'm genuinely shocked that Frank Turek, this erudite paragon of intellectual honesty, is giving out inaccurate information.
:O
I'm so very tired, and seeing more people fighting disinformation on our behalf gives me the will to go on.
Thank you so much for making this video, we really do need it.
Thank you for covering this. The skeptic community has been pretty quiet about what’s going on. It’s getting very very serious.
@@MaulScarreign Being trans is not an ideology.
@@MaulScarreign "trans ideology" 😂
My gender isn't an ideological position
just leave people alone and let them be who they are.
giving minors cross sex hormones isnt „letting them be who they are” like i swear nobody cares who they are, they just want to be sure that children arent being hurt
@@superigg_ both puberty and hormones cause permanent changes. Besides, most of the time trans people take hormone blockers (which cause no permanent changes)
@@superigg_Prepubescent kids don’t get cross sex hormones. Literally just look at the study in this video on that
@@superigg_ minors arent being given cross sex hormones tho. Its insanely hard to get prescribed hormones. They arent just giving them away left and right
@@superigg_ The amount of permanent decisions kids are totally allowed to make really should raise an eyebrow as to why this one matters so much. There are military recruiters in highschools.
Frank Turek talking about medicine is like Sabine Hossenfelder talking about economics.
Funny enough, I got an ad for her on this video.
I wouldn't believe Frank Turek even if he was reading my autobiography to me.
Drew, thank you VERY VERY MUCH. I'm right now working in a script to a video to respond a brazilian psychology student who made a 1 hour long video "scientifically debunking gender ideology" and he cited de Desistance Myth (along with several arguments that I know how to respond) and he put the Steensma paper as a source. I'm reading it along with his other sources and I kind know how to answer it, but sincerely, you did it MUCH better than I'm even able to do. I will steal your arguments, OK? Maybe I even use some cuts from this video if you don't mind.
Use my arguments and clips from this video however you’d like! Just credit me. 🤝 Best of luck with your video!
Qual o youtuber ?
Jeff.
Oh my, for that 1 hour long video did he actually care to read at least one of the research? Like, my videos are rarely longer than 15 minutes and they take long hours for me to create because of how much time I spend on research. And yet some people just disrespect research like this... Shaking my head.
Good luck with the video, tho!
@@gigigameleira Postei o vídeo :)
It’s deeply distressing to me that no matter how many times I tell people exactly this, exactly how this study is flawed, and exactly how many other studies prove that transition is helpful, safe, and useful, and yet they still just don’t care. Every single time it’s like a bullet to the brain when all of the evidence is laid out before someone, and their own evidence is gone and debunked, and yet they just double down. And I know this is just a thing that happens; I know that I’m not really going to change anyones views no matter how much evidence I give, but it still hurts to see it happen.
Well yeah, they always knew they were wrong.
@@Peasham that’s the thing though… I don’t think most do. Most of the politicians and demagogues probably know they’re wrong, but I genuinely think the average transphobe is just deeply uncritical of their own beliefs.
Unfortunately, both you and this video are mistaken about the facts.
@@XxYwise observe as I do exactly what I just described in the above post and say: how so?
I absolutely hate this differentiation between "wishes to be" and "insists to be" by "experts". It's what kept me from even asking for help since age 7 and then even even longer since age 18 when I thought "It's too late now" after first puberty had done most of its damage. I actually started my transition 10 years ago in a rather bumpy manner, again thanks to a cis "expert" but, after a few years of hormones and some corrective surgeries, am finally living my true self in happiness. Most people who know my past accept me. People who don't know it think that I'm a cis woman. And the only regret I have is that I hadn't done this much earlier.
I know the feeling. I'm trans but also autistic. I tend to be very...pedantic about my words. As a child, I knew how the rest of the world identified me and I didn't want to say, "I *am*...", I would say, "I want to be.." or similar. But since I didn't insist I already was female, that hurt me with some of them.
bro wtf did they actually assume that if 80/127 people didn’t come back all of them desisted?
It was such a flawed “study”!
If you think that's surprising you should look at the methodology of the ROGD study next.
@@theclinger that “study” is equally bad
Well, back then there was nowhere else to get hormones, so yeah.
I absolutely love that my favourite skeptic channel ended up going left instead of right, like a lot of the rest of them did. Thank you for continuing to fight for our rights dude ❤
GMS, Suris, TJ, Repzion, Viced Rhino, Prophet Of Zod, TheraminTrees, and Actualjake have been and continue to be GOATs of what remains of the "Skeptic Community"
@@sluttyMapleSyrupbelief it or not and owen morgan are also chill
@@babs_babs Yes! Can't believe I forgot those two
Owen Morgan is actually great, though hes less of a religious skeptic in general and more focused on cults.@@babs_babs
Amen. The single best voice for the new atheist movement. Dawkins, play and Sam Harris are disgraces
I shared this with 2 people and liked it immediately.
I know how thorough you are, and how fair you are, so I did so confidently while still watching your video. You are awesome, Drew!
As an ex evangelical trans guy, thanks for this video. I remember hearing about that study and it's flaws but it's good to have other studies debunk it outside of just showing the flaws of the original study
Brilliant, that’s how research is done, great work, thank you. Unfortunately, it’ll have no effect on those causing the harm, since when did facts influence religious zealots?
I see a lot of atheists falling for transphobic propaganda too; it's good to have pushback within this space.
Even though people ditch the label of being religious, people can't seem to shake off religious thinking and dogma against "the other".
I appreciate the well-rooted atheist channels like yours taking a stand for the side of science and reason (the "left", as it's referred to in America). Too many similar channels just ended up being butthurt cishetties when it comes to gender stuff. They wanted to be rebellious but not "abnormal", essentially.
Yep. People who identified as "atheist" for the sake of being shocking and cruel
Thanks for covering this, debunking misinfo is important
The only thing i understood from that old "research" is that the healthcare was never good in america, not that people arent trans through adulthood.
I'm Nonbinary and ever since i was a kid ive been noticably trans. But because of being raised as a Jehovah's witness i didn't understand that what i felt had a word or that other ppl felt how i did. When i found out I'm trans, i felt excited to gind out i wasnt alone and that there was indeed a word to describe how i was feeling.
I discovered nombinary term when I was around 20 and then it just punched me. Because I finally knew a word to describe my feelings even since I remember.
Another issue with detransition statistics is that the decision to do it does not necessarily mean the discontinuation of dysphoria. I am over 50 and have dealt with gender dysphoria issues since I was at least 9 and did start a transition that I backed out of. But it was due to the many social, health and financial concerns among other things more complicated. I’m still gender dysphoric and it still causes distress I just chose not to transition. And at beyond the half way point of my life,whether I think that was the right decision changes all the time. I’ve been seriously depressed and stunted for most of it. So there is that. I certainly don’t tell my trans friends they made a mistake and my life is not one I would call admirable and lived to the fullest by probably anyone’s measure. But I am quite aware that I would be looked at as an example of someone who was just fine and got over it. Because it’s what they need to believe for their narrative.
I like to use the example of regret for "mainstream" surgeries, like knee replacement. Just picking one paper, decision regret post knee replacement was 17%. Instead of suggesting that we ban knee surgeries, they suggest looking into WHY people regret their knee surgeries and address those reasons. They've narrowed that down to 1) unrealistic expectations post-op, 2) difficulty managing pain, 3) dissatisfaction with hospital experience.
Folks who decide transition isn't for them do exist and deserve compassion, but it does not follow that the vast majority of people should be prevented from treatment to prevent a small amount of regret.
I'm pretty sure the regret rate on gender affirming surgeries like mastectomy, vaginoplasty, and phalloplasty are a lot lower than the regret rate on other surgeries as well. I think trans people, given the fact that we are forced to confront our bodies in a very visceral way, are more aware of the three points you bring up at the end there than most people are going into a surgery. Especially given how much scrutiny a trans person is likely to get about their decisions regarding what gender affirming care they pursue. I doubt most people who get a hip replacement have to justify it to their family and society at large lol.
THANK YOU FOR THAT VIDEO!!
Your work is very important.
I just saw a catholic video claiming that kids raised by same-sex parents suffer horrible times.
There are studies which do show that kids with gay parents do suffer in ways kids with both a mother and father do not.
For example, it's well documented that kids raised by two fathers suffer twice as many dad-jokes.
A similar statistic says kids raised by two mothers suffer twice as much from yo-momma jokes.
And that's where the harm begins and ends lol.
@@BIayne you had me in the first half, not gonna lie lol
@@BIayne this is terrible, might consider banning same sex parent soon. But we also need to put another perspective in this situation. For example, if someone use yo-momma jokes, those who have 2 dads are not harmed in the process, this is a pros. We can discuss the pros and cons to see if we should allow or ban same sex parents
@@BIayne the issue with 2 mothers is an infinite loop of go ask your mom
@@Thecollectorpoggers 😆
Media literacy is important folks, always check the sources cited within the sources
I'm pretty sure that's just basic literacy, but true lol
Tbh most conservative arguments wouldn't stand up to middle school or high school standards, let alone college level.
@@PeashamYou'd think so, yet somehow a majority of religious conservatives show a complete lack of that.
I've been watching for a while now. I am a transgender woman brought up in a very conservative narcissistic house, and got into an even worse narcissistically abusive relationship with someone. The entire time I was told and made to feel like I was the one in the wrong. Your channel has helped me see more of the lies and not feel alone. A lot of this. It fills me with joy seeing you help take up this fight as well!
Drew, I genuinely am re-evaluating my views on transgender healthcare for kids. I dont believe in surgeries for those under 18, but Im questioning my feelings on puberty blockers and hormones. I might be for them now.
My next video will cover trans psychology and healthcare in much, much more depth, including outcomes of medical intervention for adolescents. Tune in to that one and let me know what you think
Kids under 18 really never get surgery. Body isn't done doing its thing yet.
Intentionally changing a child’s anatomy and physiology because they are confused is 100% wrong. They don’t even know who they are yet. Children should not be making life-changing decisions for themselves.
No, you very much believe in surgeries for those under 18, just not gender-affirming ones.
You'll be happy to know that it is impossible for people under 16 or so to receive gender-affirming surgery, as that is how biology works. Furthermore, letting your children eat sweets is objectively more damaging.
@@twooey8232it does happen, only in rare extreme cases of dysphoria. I'm sure Drew will be covering this too in his next video.
I thought I grew out of it. Turns out, nope.
I can't believe religious conservatives would claim a text to proves their point without bothering to read or understand it!
LMFAO, this got a good laugh out of me. Thanks for saying this.
I transitioned at 30, transitioned back at 46, but I don’t usually talk about it because I don’t want these people to use me against the trans community. To this day, I don’t know whether I could have skipped that part of my life or if I had to go through that process.
Speak up. Uncomfortable truths are still truths, and the chances of you being the only one like you are vanishingly small.
From a trans person thank you for not letting your experiences be weaponised against us.
We still support you being you regardless of your gender
3 things:
1) to out the stats @8:45 into perspective, 5-10% of people regret having children, over 15% regret knee replacement surgery, and 65% of people regret getting plastic surgery.
2) @ 9:15 that study is no longer the largest study/survey of trans people in the US. They put out their findings from their 2022 survey a few weeks ago. Tho I'm sure this video had already been recorded and was being edited when that happened.
3) when worrying about/talking about puberty blockers, there's a fun track you can go down. The biggest issue people have is that they are "chemical castrators" as in they are the same thing used to decrease drive in some convicted offenders. But here's the thing: the effects are not permanent in most cases, and in the cases where it is, it's because of the drug being taken for decades. And that's only given to AMAB people. Not AFAB. But, let's say that, for sake of argument, because they are young, children who take this puberty blocker have a higher incident rate on a lower dose for a shorter amount of time than adults. And that rate is say, 10% (which is 4 times the evidence based incident rate of the drug) after 5 years.
And let's say that 5% of youth who say they are trans at the age of 11 actually aren't.
And let's say that everyone in the US alive today who thought they were trans at 11 took puberty blockers for the full 5 years it was available to them. No parents being against it. No financial issues paying for the meds. Every. Single. Person.
And let's take the high end estimate for how many people in the US are trans (2%).
That means the number of people who will be permanently infertile because of doctors mistakenly giving them puberty blockers is
331,900,000×0.02((1/0.95)-1)×0.5×0.1=17,468
Less than 20k. That's it. And that is the HUGELY impractical number after putting EVERYTHING in the other camp's favor. Not 20k a year, 20k total. Of every living person in the US. Not even enough people to fill a small city.
And if we actually went with the evidence-based numbers, AND STILL KEPT the entire US population, the number would be under a thousand.
If they wanted to decrease male infertility, they would be focusing on the 1.3 million people get prostate cancer EVERY YEAR.
They don't actually care about it. It's not actually issue. They're just using it as a scare tactic.
Thank you so much for making this. I am trans. This past December 12th was the 6th year anniversary of my bottom surgery. I have no regrets. Which is no surprise given the evidence.
Now I have a nice video to send people who believe the 80% nonsense.
Hopefully the future will be an happier one where trans people have the liberty to be their true selves without being forced to adhere to archaic norms or fearing repercussions. Gotta have freedom and happiness for all.
Giving freedom in one area can lead to a loss on freedom in another area. For example, if we had pure freedom of speech where you could literally say anything, you could have people openly being able to threaten violence against other people which in turn would leave those victims feeling a loss of freedom.
"I asked 50 people and 40 of them said they think trans is icky so that must apply to the whole population of the world right?"
If I don't get off of this comment section, I'm going to spiral for the day.
Bruh, I feel that.
Two subjects you should NEVER read the comments on:
Transphobia and Antisemitism
For many years, I was heavily involved in the Trans community. (I had to step back for personal reasons). In that time, I spoke to about 150 trans adults (I stopped counting after that), and I heard their stories. Of the 150+ at this point, I would first stipulate that 99% were trans women. About 7 people didn’t know until they were trans until they were in their teens, while the vast majority knowing between the age of 4 and 8. The age range of my personal sample is quite vast between the age of 23 and 60. What was consistent in these stories is that they hid! There was no so called “support” from parents for how they felt. They tried to deny it. Binge and purge (if you know, you know). They tried everything to live up to the expectations of friends and family, including risky behavior and joining the military… but it never went away. No matter how hard they tried to be straight , hetero and Cis… they just weren’t!
Of my small personal “survey”, I think perhaps 3 de-transitioned. Two of those because they didn’t want to lose their family. Both of these people later started their transition again. One dropped of the map, while the other is currently living her best life. 1 person de-transitioned because they were having difficulty getting and maintaining employment as a young trans person. In addition, there were about 4 or 5 people that while they identified as Trans, held off on transition for fear of losing their job, home, or family.
I’d say of the people I have spoken with, 99% are happy with their transition. That doesn’t mean “Happy with their life”, as trans people like everyone else have more going on in life than just transition.
After 10 years of my own transition, and being involved with other trans people, I have not met one person who regretted their transition because “it wasn’t right for them”.
Love to see a well researched and clearly sourced response to these awful claims. You’re awesome, Drew
The fact that you can do one google search and debunk it instantly
What, this whole video?
@@XxYwise The claims
The claims are correct; even WPATH was saying so until less than two years ago. This video is the misinformation.
@@XxYwise I'd love to believe you. Slide the wayback machine link rq
Thank you so much for making this video. Whenever I heard people say that "80% of trans people detransition" I always thought they were pulling that straight out of their asses. I had never heard of the source that actually came from, let alone heard anyone explain why it doesn't actually say that, and I'm trans myself. It honestly means a lot seeing cis people take this problem upon themselves and put in the effort to debunk transphobic arguments. So from the bottom of my heart, thank you so much Drew ❤
I read Brynn Tannehill’s article debunking the desistance myth back in 2017 or so.
I raised my kid gender neutral and guess what… she turned out 100% Princess
(when it came time for her to assert herself).
I was baffled at first and I only figured out a bit later it’s because I had gender dysphoria from being raised a girl. Welp… I’m trans masc non binary. You can pretend all you want, but it doesn’t go away. Most of us know who we are as young kids and nobody wants to be “normal” more than us. But just like my kid being a Princess, we are who we are and that’s fantastic. 💖💖💖
I am an elderly person in the USA. It amazes me that when I was young, there was nothing "in the air," so to speak, about so called gender dysphoria. Why has this so called disorder come into the public forum in just the last few decades and almost taken over public discourse when there never used to be almost nothing about it before? What has changed that it is suddenly such a big deal?
Well before people weren't questioning gender and gender norms as much
I'm 52 and I've insisted my gender didn't match my sex since I was old enough to speak, and there have been people who have transitioned their gender medically since the early 1900s. The only reason you weren't aware of it is because trans people didn't make it publicly known. They would just quietly transition, often disappearing from the lives of their friends and family, staying hidden until they could pass as the gender they identified with. That's assuming they even had the means to do so. Most trans people suffered quietly their entire lives.
Just because you hadn't heard of it doesn't mean it didn't exist.
By your logic, the same could he said about Autism, ADHD, EDS, POTS, or fibromyalgia.
I can't believe autism was a new phenomenon because you personally hadn't heard of it.
It got super politically polarized lately and now politicians won’t shut up about it. It also was a lot harder to transition back then and it wasn’t as talked about so many people just didn’t know that was a possibility for them and suffered in silence
Yeah, the statistic is really saying something more like "80% of kids who have ever exhibited gender non-conforming behavior don't turn out to be trans" which really just sounds like evidence that "gender conformity" has always been pointless BS.
No, gender-nonconforming behavior was never enough for a diagnosis.
Oh, I assure you, I know the difference. I'm commenting on the fact that "doctor" Frank Turek doesn't seem to know the difference.
Here's another way to look at it. Remorse rates for a lot of medically necessary, life saving treatments and procedures (like chemotherapy) is actually surprising high - like 20-30% sometimes. Are these people confused and should we stop anyone from seeking these treatments in order to drop remorse rates to 0%? No, because a lot of people NEED THE TREATMENTS, and it's difficult to differentiate among people that feel remorse between those that would have rather died, those that mistakenly believe they didn't need treatment, and that tiny minority that could have miraculously got by without treatment. Rather that bother with that mess... we can just offer people treatment and hope they and their doctors and therapists do a good job.
Treatment for what?
I sure wish these people would get as concerned about the nonconsensual, childhood genital mutilation epidemic known as 'circumcision'.
Turns out they don't actually care about children
Don’t forget the surgery they do on intersex infants!
@@lynnhettrick7588You think they are aware that intersex people exist, let alone are as common as people with red hair
(This is a report of personal experience, not unbiased research.)
My community has a very high transgender population, and I have been in this community for over 12 years. I have still to this day never encountered someone detransitioning or regretting their transition.
This video is a gold standard rebuttal to the anti-trans wing of the Republican party. Thanks!
As a transgender woman about to turn 50, having lived longer as my authentic self than not, an advocate, and someone involved in related scholarly work, I thank you for such a well-done video. Thank you!
Yeah, looking up and reading papers, studdies, bills, laws, proposals, codes, etc. is one of my favorite things. So many people being angry about nothing, or about things they don't/won't/can't understand. It's like watching Cumulonimbus clouds roll in for hours and then being angry and surprised when the storm happens.
So to boil the more recent (and more accurate at least by dint of modern definitions) 2022 percentages down, only 2.5% youths "de-transitioned" (or at least identified as their birth sex).
The Review a year before (on 2021) combined 27 studies to show that only 1% of adults regretted transition (the majority of whom were born female). And
The Study performed in 2023 showed 0.3% de-transitioned, though to be fair, this study was between 2 and 7 years post transition.
As for the 2015 US Transgender Survey, if you cut out the stats for those who transitioned back due to societal pressure, only about 111 people out of 27,715 de-transitioned out of their own preferences. For those who want the percentage, that's 0.4% of the whole group. Also, only 842 of the 2218 stayed de-transitioned, that's 3% of the whole.
Bottom line is that of just the studies GMS showed us here, we're looking at a rough 1% average of transitioned individuals regret the process. A far cry from the 80% that original study claimed.
It’s *almost* as if they care more about their rigid social order than actual people.
Wait, do you mean that more current data and less bias is... more accurately reflective of reality?
No way!!!!
That was some serious scholarly sleuthing. Sincerely impressed.
Putting my actual degree to good use for this one! 😅
When i was a child i always say or show the desire to be a boy. But i never felt like i was a boy. I understand now, as an adult, i just wanted to be a boy because i wanted them to treat me the way they treated the boys. There were a lot of things i was not allowed to do or have because of my gender. They would probably count me in those 80% even though i never claimed to be trans. I have always been afraid to share this story because bigoted people will use it against trans people, like they're doing it here.
What would actually happen if you were born today is that your parents or your social environment, your media, your culture would have convinced you were trans as a teenager, your impressionable teenage brain would have believed them and you would have undergone hormone and plastic surgery. Then, when you grow up, you realize what you just explained and then you would actually be in those 80%. Be glad you didn't grow up with the current gender-political madness.
@@gownerjones There is just no basis for any of this.