The Plot Thickens: Lucy - Episode 8: The End of Desilu
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- Опубліковано 7 вер 2024
- Lucy and Desi's production company expands as they buy the RKO lot and produce new shows under the Desilu banner. The strain of running an empire takes its toll, and Desi falls further into gambling, drinking and philandering as a refuge from work. Lucy doubles down on her career, but after shooting a tearful final episode of her signature TV show, her marriage reaches its breaking point.
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Ricky and Lucy's relationtionship remind me of the song,.." It's a Thin Line Between Love and Hate"".
Amazing that after all the cheating and outrageous disloyalty, Desi writes "My wife doesn't love me."
He didn't see he had killed Lucy's love.
Of course she loved him!
But how much did Desi think a woman could take?
What a tragic end to that remarkable coupling.
That was a drunken delusion. Both Lucy and Desi fought really dirty and you have no idea what she may have said or done to make him feel like that in the moment.
I thought the same thing, he took no ownership in what caused his wife to no longer love him.
@@SJ-ni6iy that's not what this is about.
@@saraschneider6781 I don’t agree with you and I’m referring to the original comment because I share her viewpoint.
Yes, his playing "dumb" is despicable!!! Even the daughter seems to excuse his behavior! Just sick!
Even when you know how the story ends, you can’t help feeling sad….and this made feel sad 😞….
Though Forever Darling wasn't a very good film, The Long Long Trailer was delightful.
The marriage and partnership may not have lasted, but the love and connection between Desi and Lucy would carry on until the end of their lives. There is that.
I loved the long trailer. It was on Netflix this past year and I watched it again. You could sense the friction. It was electric and worked in their favor. But it was there.
The Long Long Trailer is a classic. Forever Darling not so much.
I actually liked "Forever Darling".
And the song is nice too.
TCM does the Best podcast of anyone . So well researched and not the usual narritive we're used to hearing . I Thoroughly enjoy these
This is such a good series thank you
I totally agree. Wonderfully entertaining & informative series.
I found tears coming down my cheeks during this podcast. I grew up with Lucy and Desi……so very sad!
I got emotional too. So wish things could have worked out.
Don’t be sad. They still cared for each other. Look for the home movies of them in the 1980s before they died. The love was still there.
@@LAFan
Yes, the love was always there. It was sad they were not able to stay together.
Such an excellent series! Thank you.
I heartily concur. I've learned so much from this series.
Very sad but based on the title, I knew it was coming. Also, it’s always wonderful to hear Robert’s voice. I still miss him. Looking forward to the next episode!
Ben Mankiewicz
I think Desi was tortured by his past and it was never fully addressed. Therapy at an earlier age may have saved him from the pent up rage...he was obviously using alcohol as a means to escape all of what he had suffered through at such a young age. And I think his views of women had been skewed during this time as well by how he had been taught culturally. I have no doubt he loved Lucy. But he had no frame of reference as guide to help him make it grow. And Lucy also had her own demons and things she had not fully addressed either. So, their relationship was like a speeding train. Exhilarating at first but headed for a horrific derailment...it's such a sad but fascinating story at the same time...
Julie, you may be very, very right. I know nothing of his childhood. I did not know he was an alcoholic. I do not judge him. All I know is that the betrayal of a spouse, for a woman, is very often devastating. She was lucky there was no baby by another woman, like Arnold S. (Okay, as far as we know.) Yes, lucky. Lucy.
Well, escaping Communist Cuba with his family who was extremely poverty stricken is not something therapy can fix nor the cultural solutions to that at the same time.
My sister in law was raped beatened by a brother in law (27 children from her parents relationship) in Honduras. Did not need therapy to recover as this was quite common in Honduras and psycho terrorism would have ingrained emotions that made situation worse not better.
Desi's culture in Cuba was dictorial with machismo of men the rule. All of the men were expected and did have at least 1 mistress and alcohol was the method allowed to deal with the mood of the country.
Lucy was not a very nice person at all and Desi had to apologize for her treatment of subordinates on multiple occasions.
The fact that she was 6 years older than him and tried to control him set really badly against that instinctual machismo making him not a man in his cultural view. Not a good situation, I know, but not one that even a 50s psychiatrist could resolved.
@@Friendofstfrank And I beg to differ, proper therapy WORKS. But I have no doubt either one of them would have been open enough for it, not to mention the copious amounts of time it would have taken to make any real progress with it. That's NOT where their priorities were...obviously.
@@Friendofstfrank You went through a lot to explain Desilu! I hear you. Just remember that even still, many Americans are not okay with adultery.
@@dianedo1234 Desi was an addict: sex, gambling and booze.
Such an interesting and very well done podcast.- greetings from the Netherlands.
This was "the end of Desilu, part 1." Part 2 was when Ms. Ball sold the company in 1967 to Gulf + Western, which proceeded to rebrand it as Paramount Television.
HOW CAN SOMETHING THAT IS SO RIGHT, GO SO HORRIFICALLY WRONG, I BELIEVE THEY HAD A REAL LOVE ( NOT JUST SEX) THEY HAD A DEEP PASSION FOR ONE ANOTHER..BUT FAME CAN DESTROY IT ALL!!...I LOVE THIS PODCAST & I STILL LOVE LUCY & DESI💓.
Alcohol can destroy everything, too.
This is what makes their love story so fascinating. They were in love with each other until the day they each died.
♥️♥️♥️
Two people as damaged as they were can never make it together. At least one person in a relationship has to have some emotional stability, & I don’t think either Lucy or Desi had it.
i'm sure she was a dead fish 🎣 in bed lol
Both had trauma in their past - but Desi did have 16 years that was carefree - while Lucille lost her beloved father before aged 4 and her mother remarried a man who did not want children. Lucille's mother was often away - up to months at a time, trying to earn money. For awhile she was in the care of the 2nd husband's parents who were stern and severe.
Such a heartbreakingly sad love story. Aaron Sorkin should make a movie about that. Two people who loved each other madly but just couldn't make it work.
There is a movie in the works with Nicole Kidman...
@@gdmoore That’s not what it’s about.
@@gdmoore They totally screwed up Kidman’s makeup. She doesn’t look like Lucy or herself, she looks awful.
@@RuthLopez-tn3uv I’m sorry but no amount of makeup can make Nicole Kidman look like Lucille Ball.
@@RuthLopez-tn3uv my big gripe is u need an elastic, expressive face if ur going 2 portray Lucy Ricardo..ill leave it @ that.
Very thoroughly and well=done, which not always case = we get many lacklustre presentations which are poorly researched and narrated nowadays!
Cheating warrants no forgiveness.
Bravo! Such a brilliant series.
When Tallulah Bankhead was in Hitchcock"s LIFEBOAT she didn't wear underwear.
great podcast, as usual-but i'm concerned about the statements that, in choosing to go forward ("get big"), lucy was choosing her career/ ambition over her marriage-and the suggestion that she was somehow responsible, therefore, for desi's continued drinking and the collapse of her marriage. it's a facile bit of anachronistic sexism that's never interrogated, in an otherwise engaging narrative.
@shillanassi I think it sounded to me as if they BOTH chose their careers over the marriage, it was a mutual decision to GO BIG. Both of them had a tremendous drive and ambition. They both also had huge egos. That got in the way when it came to the marriage. Marriage can be difficult and challenging under any circumstances. But all that fame and notoriety can mess with your head as well as your heart. And you have to remember what decade they were living in as well and the way people viewed marriage, even with celebrities during that time. Things were accepted and tolerated that would never be today by a woman or a man. It was actually a very common tale of a celebrity marriage tbh.
Interesting point. I wonder what would have been a viable alternative, being fully retired, or occasionally working when they were only in their 40's, living off their nice income, and devoting all their time to their marriage and children. Does that sound like that would have worked, given their personalities, personal histories, and prior successes in such a competitive industry. Seems Desi had deeply embedded psychological issues perhaps with roots in his rather precarious earlier life as refugee, and maybe worsened by the bigotry he had to confront in Hollywood. I'm sure that neither was perfect (who ever is?) but it seems like he needed to do the real psychological self-confrontation to save his marriage, but his addictive personality over ruled that. Sad.
Ah, looking at the 1950's from a 2021 standpoint to assure that the marital trouble was a 1 side only while failing to understand communist Cuba from which Arnez escaped with his family. Nevermind, it fits with your 'feminist' view that says pic men are always wrong when an older white woman might be too blame.
@@Friendofstfrank In my post I said they were BOTH at fault in how they dealt with the marriage part of their relationship. It's never one sided. It takes two people to make it work or break it apart for whatever reasons...he was at fault for his womanizing and she was at fault for putting up with that for as long as she did...
@@Julieglam3 She was at fault for never giving an inch. Desi gave her the chance to have a quiet life & she preferred to work. If she had really wanted a real life & normal marriage she could have tried a little harder for it & she chose not to.
This is so good, and keeps getting better and better. Thank you.
Ty for sharing Lucille ball with us very intriguing podcasts bless u all tcm😁🇨🇦🇨🇦
It’s Their 81st Anniversary
Thank you for this series!
Great TCM podcast
all these series shows are great.
Amazing series 🥰
I'm devastated again 😞😢 Lucy became so cold. What a tragedy. We were invested.
The saddest installment.
Lucy sounds like a jerk. How much did she appreciate home? She loved WORK. Her own kids said that, Desi Jr. said he was raised by his black nurse. Lucie said her mother came home & she was still working. SHE chose work instead of a quiet life. And she seems to have been blind to the pressure that was on Desi. A friend said Ball had all the trappings of a “normal” life but she was just disconnected somehow. She is the saddest one to me, just an ambitious train (wreck). Both kids took up mightily for their dad. --Something happens to people who have a bad, desperate childhood. They know they can either sink or swim. My husband is like this. He decided to swim, he was going to do better than what he had come from. Trouble is you are too afraid to stop swimming, & nothing matters more than the work. He has a self-esteem problem, his whole being is wrapped up in what he does, he goes from feeling sorry for himself to narcissism; but he is a kind & successful man. I understand why he is what he is, it’s hard to be around him sometimes, but it calls for a lot of forgiveness. A lot of traumatized people don’t know how to Forgive. Looks like Lucy & Desi’s problem was, they were BOTH sink-or-swim types, and there is no way a relationship like that can last. Also, Lucy had to grind working or die apparently. I think she needed some deep therapy. Lucie said it herself, they didn’t need to keep grinding & winning, there was more to life. I think Desi found it, Ball never did.
Read about Lucy's bio about working - she certainly was not a jerk, also to have a husband whom you deeply loved: How great was Desi? He was an addict: sex, booze, gambling even before marriage to Lucy. She did not cause it - those addictions were already there. Got worse the older he got. I could not be married to a man who had one of those addictions, no less all three. I decided not to marry the "Love of my Life", when I realized that he was an alcoholic. He died from alcoholism at age 39! He of course denied he had the problem and was angry at me for suggesting such. Desi denied he was an alcoholic till very last years of his life when he went to AA - but by then it was really too late, too much physical damage.
Desi didn’t know himself but the largest part he did know loved Lucy but his trauma bond that happened when his family lost everything definitely harmed Desi’s ability to trust life and believe in his own power, always expecting the vultures landing when there were not any . He self destructed .
I wouldn't call RKO a B studio. They produced the Astaire/Rogers Pictures, KING KONG, and CITIZEN KANE.
Thank you!!!!
Very good podcast
The divorce was messy and hard for their children.
Actually the divorce wasn't messy - they used same lawyer and both agreed to what was arrived out - re. money, custody, visiting. No disagreements or playing games. Both children, naturally, were hurt by the divorce and wanted their parents to stay together. But Lucie Arnaz said that their parents became friendlier after the divorce. No more fighting, etc. And even tho they hoped they would patch things up - the reality set in when both remarried. When Lucy remarried, her daughter cried and cried and her father called her and he cried too, finally saying "Give him a chance." Lucie Arnaz said her father was devastated when mother remarried, but a few years later when he married Edith Hirsch he was happier too. Both her parents had long successful re-marriages that lasted till the end.
Im loving this series! So well done! Fascinating to learn the different sides of this complex talented lady.
"Sex workers"? In 1955 they didn't use that term. They said prostitutes. Sex workers is a modern term which tries to make having sex for money sound respectable. It isn't respectable.
I'm sure they didn't use a term as nice as prostitutes. They are people just like you and I and deserve the title of sex workers.
The trouble is most if not all, s3x workers were abused as children. That means they're not choosing it as a career, they're acting out their abuse.
@@saraschneider6781 it’s called prostitute. It’s A horrible thing to be. They are exploited and abused and sometimes killed. It is NOT A WORD TO TRY TO BE PC ABOUT.
@@Patrick3183 shut up.
I was afraid that I might have somehow missed any " chapters " after number 7, I was almost frantic as this series has been excellent so far. I don't remember Forever Darling, I wonder if it is purposely kept off the air? Listening to bits of it at the beginning to this video I have to wonder if James Mason was the best choice as " marriage counselor "?
TCM occasionally shows "Forever Darling" since it was an MGM movie & TCM's parent company (Warner Media) owns the MGM film library. As noted in this segment, the movie was not a box office hit. As I do when I take off hat, you make a good point in regards to James Mason perhaps not being the best choice as a "marriage counselor" (after all, he played so many sinister roles over the years). Plus, his own real life marriage to his first wife Pamela ended in divorce in 1964 after 23 years of marriage.
I watched forever Darling on TV yrs ago . I believe one of the reasons it's not on is because it got bad reviews .
Forever Darling has played a few times over the years on TCM. Taking it at face value as a fantasy/dramedy it was quite entertaining.
What are you talking about? It's shown multiple times a year.
They play the movie on tv sometimes. TCM mostly I guess
LOVE this podcast! Calling Desi a "spic" and a "wetback" must have been hard for Desi to hear from Lucy...
That was brutal. I’d love to hear her side of the story, not that I don’t believe Desi, but I have a feeling he said a lot more in that situation than he revealed.
@@SJ-ni6iy in her autobiography (that she didn’t publish herself), she gives Desi the number to her divorce lawyer herself after the fight at the office. She doesn’t go into any detail about what she said or didn’t say.
I hope he did embellish this bit for his autobiography but I can totally see someone as hot headed as Lucy trying to tear him down and hurt him when she knew it wasn’t worth fighting for anymore. They did become friends after the divorce, so who really knows?
That must have been VERY hard for her to say it. After all, for decades she always protected him from any type of disparagement. I believe she did that at her final breaking point to really hurt him. My god, they had two children and he would use their bedroom. Who could take that?
@@angelgstag using their bedroom is horrible and completely disrespectful. I can’t believe she stayed that long.
@@angelgstag They were friends till death. They played with grandkids together. There are home movies of them in the pool in the 1980s and still you could see the love was there between them.
Your next Podcast should be about "Man of a Thousand Faces" Lon Chaney.
Powerful couple but toxic 😪. Great podcast.
I had no idea that Desi's alcoholism was THAT HORRIBLE. I came from an alcoholic family....both parents & brothers were alcoholics and the brothers, I think still are. Don't know for sure because they've lived out of state for 30+ years now. I never touched that poison. What an incredibly sad, but real story. Behind allllllll that hysterical laughter and love such misery. You'd love to think that tragic stories like these would help alcoholics dry up or possibly steer people away from it altogether but human nature was, is and eternally will be SO horribly flawed that it won't make any difference.
FOREVER DARLING was based on a story originally intended for Katherine Hepburn and Spencer Tracy.
Terrible movie. Embarrassing actually.
Is it just me or is the lack of visuals somewhat annoying?
Lucy was right when talking to waltersin 79” desi had to lose , He’d build it up but he had to lose it all - he’s a loser . “ we accept the love we feel we deserve and Desi didn’t think much of himself - he was a damaged soul . Not a bad person just a damaged one .
People complained that Lucy was denigrating her ex here. I did not think so - she was talking about his process about buiilding things up and damaging them. With his severe addictions: sex, gambling and booze, everything would come crashing down - even if you were a genius, with many many accomplishments. I felt that not only the trauma of the revolution in Cuba in which the family lost everything - both Desi's parents were seemingly self involved and entitled. Lolita his mother came from a very wealthy family - and expected Desi to do everything for her (which he did but it was never enough) Father was also a bastard - divorced mother immediately when they came to Miami and Desi was expected to be her sole caretaker - even tho he was a teenager. Father was in competition with Desi. Neither parent expressed their appreciation for who Desi was and what his accomplishments were. Desi supported mother till he died and left money for her in his will.
Being brought up with so much privilege in Cuba then the Revolution and coming to America at 17. Wow! I feel that both his parents were entitled pricks. Desi took care of his mother since he was a teenager (father divorced her when he came to USA and married an American woman). Then she became Desi's responsibility. Lolita from all accounts - never learned English and never had appreciation for all Desi did for her - so many stories. And the father was equally narcissistic. Neither told Desi how wonderfully he was doing or thanked him in any way for what he did for them.
Norman Vincent Peale was a great man. Why the snarky remark about him being a conman? I followed his career and never observed anything like that. Uncalled for.
You can watch the Lucy Desi comedy hour and see how unhappy they were. It shows. He was a Latin lover who couldn’t be tamed.
again, when I hear this is cultural or Desi's a "Latin lover." Sexual addiction has 0 to do with being a lover or culture.
Just think - he was very jealous of Lucy. Also, in his notebook wrote that she just doesn't love me. It sounds like on some level he was a 3 year old who needed to get his way on anything and expected the adult to pick him up and pet him.
The original toxic relationship😅
💔
They should have included Edie Adams take on the last days of Lucy &Desi ua-cam.com/video/WitntQ1b0XE/v-deo.html , ua-cam.com/video/W-IL4tSg1x8/v-deo.html Lucy wanted Bette Davis her old acting school nemeses...says a lot. There have also been quotes about Lucy allegedly snapping her fingers at Bankhead during one rehearsal, and Bankhead warned Lucy to NEVER do that again to her.Tallulah Bankhead did have a diva reputation, but by all accounts she was a professional and put 100%effort into any role she took on ..PS actor John Emery, who was married to Tallulah Bankhead. He appeared on two episodes of I LOVE LUCY, "The Quiz Show," and "Little Ricky Gets A Dog."Sorry, man, but you left a lot out of this one.
Tallulah Bankhead was NOT a consummate professional - was a drinker did not learn her lines and disrupted all the players on the show. She had a bad reputation re. drinking on set ie, taking her pants off while not wearing underpants - and other such not funny escapades.
Rolling Stone?
I know how it Feels To Be Cheated on
It’s seems trivial to break up a marriage and leave the love of your life over the occasional call girl
Lol what
There was no occasional call girl. Desi was a sex addict - 4 hookers at a time and sex in your wife's bed. If you read up and call it trivial - hope you never marry or go out with someone who loves you - save her the heartbreak and humiliation.
I think lucy didn't respect desi. She knew that people always looked down on desi being from cuba so she too brought him down.By her calling him spick and wet back says it all.
Ive never heard of and dont believe that at all.
Lucy Never looked down on Desi being from Cuba in fact risked her whole career - when CBS and the sponsors wanted Richard Denning (co-star on My Favorite Husband) to be the tv husband on the show, not Desi cause he was Latin and spoke with an accent. Lucy said, either take Desi or find another actress to play the part.
She sold Desilu to Paramount because their productions including Star Trek was too expensive to produce for them but they still didn’t put any more money into producing the cheap looking series.
No, Lucille Ball sold Desilu to Paramount because she got sick and tired of having to deal with the intricate business dealings of a huge Hollywood studio. She hated the business/financial aspect of things. She had to take over as president of the studio (making her the first woman head of a major Hollywood studio) because she bought out her ex husband, Desi Arnaz. But that wasn’t something she aimed to achieve or strives for. She was a performer and all she wanted to do was perform. So once she got a good offer, she sold her interests in Desilu 100% to Paramount. And then immediately founded Lucille Ball Productions. But she hired the right people to handle the business aspect of things.
Yes, Desilu started to deteriorate financially over time. But she did not sell Desilu to Paramount because Star Trek was too expensive to produce. It was definitely very expensive but Desilu produced it because it was a huge capital gain for the company in the long term.
Watch the Desilu Story Documentary on UA-cam for more detailed information.
@@alexbregman6786 Star Trek at the time was not a commercial success for desilu. They really only produced it because they needed productions other than mission impossible to produce, but at the time again Star Trek was not a commercial success for them.
Second
I LOVE this series but I'm going to say that having the The End of Desilu episode end on what would have been their anniversary is completely sucky and down right insulting.
Bummer I haven't watched till the end yet ,I was already looking forward to #9 . Wow you're right this sucks
I doubt it was intentional. Each episode is released on the same day every week. This one just happened to fall on their anniversary.
I loved the show growing up with my Grandmother, BUT, as growing up and seeing Lucille Ball and the Public as PEOPLE (not actors*-their ACTING! TV is an ILLUSION!) and Waking Up to true reality - she's a greedy woman. I care about the memory with my Grandmother, not freaking Lucy
FIRST!!!
She couldn't hold that racist tongue no longer. It was boiling all those years.
Yea not sure about that! Sometimes people say the most hateful things when in anger but one does wonder!
Uh she was not racist.
@@saraschneider6781 well maybe not but saying things like that could make one wonder.
@@TitanicTubi no it doesn't.
@@saraschneider6781 you clearly must not be black, brown, yellow, red person or you might understand.
Everyone want William Frawley's body. Don't fault Lucy for lusting after him.
F***ing troll
It was the affair between lucy and william Frawley that did it.
What? I never heard that rumor before lil
What in the actual F***???
She couldn't get enough of his high waisted slacks.
Yes, and that almost destroyed her friendship with Vivian Vance who couldn't bear the idea of William Frawley being stolen away from her.
That’s Ludicrous