What would you do if you were given a budget for a bike? Upgrade a Retro classic? Buy a frame and pick your build kit? Or even just buy off of the shelf?
I’ve got retro mod I’ve built from frame up. C 1982 Battaglin frame within 9000 Dura Ace and mavic ksyrium elite wheels. Cost about £1.2k all up. It’s a great way to get cool bike at a decent price.
I'd buy an old frame with low-spec components on it and upgrade it with mid-range parts. You'd get 90% of the bike as in this video but at perhaps 1/6th the price. Restro-mods can be economical if you don't use the most expensive parts.
Scallmalloy frame, deep section wheels, 105 wireless Di2. But also, all the tools to do all installments and maintenance myself. Also, pay somebody to help me set up the bike.
I got an early 90's bottecchia and added a 11 speed Ultegra groupset from ebay, finishing kit from spare parts. It rides really well, looks battered in a good way and does everything I need it to - and cost about £800 in total. I looked for ages but my spares box didn't contain any dura ace cranksets!
Very nice,I'm looking to upgrade my Peugeot Monaco 90's road bike with 7800 dura-ace parts but the problem is that the 7800 crankset are usually badly worn.😏
Sounds a lot like my build! I got a free '86 Panasonic, bought Microshift shifters, bought a freehub axle for the 126 mm drops because I didn't want to keep the freewheel (and of course bought a correlating cassette), bought 40mm DT Swiss clincher rims and aluminum spokes. Laced up my own wheels, did the conversion myself. Sure, it's only 14 speed (up from 10, so I say that's a win), but with 53/40 biopace chainrings in the front and 11-28 in the back, it absolutely flies on the flats and the downhill (beats my modern bike on the downhill easily, surprisingly enough). SO much fun, and the upgrade cost me about $400. Sure wish I had Alex's box of spare Dura Ace parts, though. Would've turned it into even more of a beast than it already is!
That's actually the weight of a typical Budget Chinese all carbon build for probably 1/4 of the price for Alex's build... And the groupset, wheelset we are talking about are all entry level stuff.
To borrow an analogy from the car world, riding a slow bike fast is much more fun than riding a fast bike slow. Thrashing a retro bike as hard as it can take is much more thrilling than doing zone 1 or zone 2 training on a top end racer. If the bike gives Alex more smiles per mile, more power to him for this build.
You dont even have to ride a slow bike fast because the tiniest amount of speed is going to feel like youre going at lightspeed^^ Going downhill with cooked coaster brakes is a level of excitement you only reach with modern bikes when it becomes life threatening:D
i think so too. The placebo effect can be positive or negative. Like the stradivarius vaiolin experiment, the experts were unable to identify the million-dollar violin and mistook it for violins worth less than a thousand dollars when they listened blindfolded.
There's just something so elegant about a steel framed bike with a chromed fork. My retired 1991 colonia red Tommasini Super Prestige with Campagnolo C-Record is now the centerpiece of my man cave.
Can't believe how flexy that fork is at 10:13 !!! I have a 1980s' Eroica steel bike and always noted that (wanted) flex but with the rigidity of carbon wheel and slowmotion.. wow!!!
A+ Video! Reason: 1. Gave us a great passion project experiment 2. Went for a ride together 3. Honest, candid conversation that came to a great conclusion. This is the better GCN . (Less script and formula)
dazza9129 That's right dazz. The most important thing is to get out and cycle the cost of the bike and your clothing is secondary. For example there is little point in having a 3K bike if it never leaves the garage
Projects like these, in my opinion, don’t necessarily require top-of-the-line new modern components. A more moderate approach is likely more suitable, and I’d definitely recommend avoiding conversions to Di2, for example.
Yeah I feel that's where Alex is really disconnected from people who uses their own money to make this kind of build. He's a sucker for Durace. I really like the philosophy for these kind of builds, passion projects, but it just doesn't feel right
just from the perspective of making stuff work - Di2 is actually a bit of a hack. the lack of need for cable routing in the traditional sense, or literally anything under tension anywhere on the bike besides the chain, and the forgiving nature of shifting, chainline and chainlength with the system means you are more free to experiment. A Di2 derailleur will shift perfectly regardless of what's happening on the rest of the bike, basically. It's expensive, it isn't the moderate solution you're describing, but it's perfect for actually getting new tech to function on old hardware without any real fuss.
Alex how would you have faired on the original equipment supplied with the bike , that would be the ideal comparison to say if the upgrade was worth while or not
Yes this would be fair. I would guess it would be heavier and the wheels probably make quite a difference. I own an old steel, mavic tubular, down tube shifters, 9,5 kg bike that is actually quite fast. But it's no match for my considerable stiffer 11 speed 7kg carbon ride.
There is an old saying: " Beauty is in the eye of the beholder". The same can be said for value. I love what was done here, mostly because I am thinking of doing the same thing, but with a 25 year old Softride Road wing. I currently am riding a new Cervelo R5 built with Dura Ace, but also have this Softride that I bought new in 2000. I just pulled out the Softride a week ago, slipped on my Sidi Genius shoes from the same year, and dawned my old Briko sunglasses (Cippo would be proud!). I had such a great time riding this old steeds, that I have been searching for a new Dura Ace groupset. Worth the cost compared to a new modern bike? Well, again I must say that value is in the eye of the beholder. Well done guys, I loved this video and build of a classic bike.
I'm a huge fan of the orange paint scheme. I don't know why more manufacturers don't make orange bikes. It is the vehicle equivalent or a "resto-mod" with the retro frame along with the updated components. Love it.
that retro-rebuild Pinarello might be slower than the more modern bikes but that best they could ever hope to achieve in the Bike Vault is a 'Super Nice' but that bike you've built Alex... worthy of a Bell Drop! It looks amazing
I lately crashed a bike to no fault of my own and the frame got destroyed, so I had a full Ultegra R8000 group set laying around plus some stuff I had anyway (handlebars etc.). Got a Look 461 frame from like 2002 or so from eBay in very good condition and threw everything on that frame. Looks and rides absolutely sweet and saved a vintage frame from the landfill. And it's definitely not slow...
I ride a Look KG461 I bought from an older French Racer, fantastic bike. I know riders are suspect of old Carbon but those bikes that aren't yet vintage or collectable but just "old" are in a sweetspot for price for me and are just plain cool. Like you said, the bike is certainly not slow. Enjoy your rides ✌️.
Thanks! I "could" be worried about the carbon/aluminium construction, but I couldn't find a single indication online that one of those frames ever failed due to that, so I'm pretty confident that Look knew what they were doing when building this frame. And since even new bikes from top brands are breaking all the time (snapping forks etc.) I'd actually rather have an older frame that has a couple thousand kilometers on it and evidently DIDN'T break. Of course you never know the history for sure, but I nothing in life is certain anyway...
I did exactly that with my late ‘80s Bianchi Specialissima. Dura-Ace, Carbon Mavic tubular wheels, Columbus carbon fork and aero cockpit. And guess what I love it and don’t care when people tell me I’m crazy or doesn’t look “correct for the era”. 😊
Honestly I’d probably just keep the original restored period correct group set. Did Alex say just over a thousand quid?! Beautiful bike for the money. Obviously not with the modern di2 but still, a thing of beauty and perfection for a cafe ride, you’d be the envy of the group with that thing. Sure, if I was rich, I might do what Alex did, but I can only afford one bike at most with dura-ace di2 and given the cost, it’d have to be a modern carbon frame
Especially when you consider the original bike, with original groupset cost just £1000 he basically spent 7x the value of the bike on new components. A bit ridiculous.
I did something similar. Mid 90’s Bianchi TSX Ultralight Reparto Corse. With updated fork and Ultegra 11sp. Rides brilliantly, but not light by today’s standards at all. Fun to ride, super comfortable and I was able to keep my pride and joy.
I am 72yo. I currently have two bikes that I currently ride, both custom built for me. One was built in 2010 and the second I just had built in August with disc brakes. I am not going to be any faster on an aero bike with my realitive upright position. But new components (still 11sp) are pretty nice on my archaic rides.
you can build a bike that looks similar to that, with new lower end parts and end up with a bike that is better than the stock original build, nothing wrong with having a bike that you just enjoy riding without paying the absurd prices for these new bikes. have done it twice for less than $2000 per build.
I still have my classic bikes alongside my modern road bike, and still enjoy riding them. It's great to enjoy them and give them an outing on a club ride, where speed/pace isn't so critical. I have found that an upgrade to the fork can make a significant upgrade to a bike's performance... even to change its character. I have a steel Colnago master, and was able to locate an original Colnago star carbon fork with a 1" steerer (as fitted to the 1st generation C40s). Not only is it an authentic upgrade, the gap has been shortened somewhat.
I recently put together a 94' Trek 1400 with a 10spd record group I had laying around and it's such a joy. Its not the fastest but its such a hack putting a more modern groupset on an older frame.
I've got a modern Cervelo aero aluminum road bike, a modern carbon Colnago road bike, and another classic steel Colnago Master all equipped with Campagnolo componenty and the Cervelo is the fastest but when going on a longer 4+ hour ride I'll choose the steel Master as it's the most comfortable for longer stints. Take the three bikes tested out for a 6 hour ride with the same riders and see how far each would go and also quantify how the rider feels after a long day
@alex I reckon if you took my restomod look dura ace that you super niced recently in the bike vault, it’s 100% as fast as a modern “super bike”…or you could line up some other restomod projects from viewers next to yours in a resto mega test…big interest in these sorts of bikes now!
Awesome passion project, regardless the price. I love the contrast that Alex has done, old with new. The touch points remain to be the important aspects of the ride/feel. Most passion projects arent meant to be raced, rather enjoyed, fun to see Alex go toe to toe and race it. Great content ... I would love to see something a little more faux pas in the bike world .. being a high end frame built up with a low to mid range groupset with high value / lower budget wheels/rims. A "self build" per say, instead of how the bike industry has created a "bundled" "cheaper" priced bike ( bc being "stuck" into buying a bike, creates a lot of frustration for buyers) .. contrasting the value and effectiveness of both purchases. Uncovering the more reasonable and specific for the rider .
The bike looks sharp, the orange really pops. I've recently went back to more classic looking frames with a couple custom double triangle frames, one steel and the other titanium. The look of them with modern parts just appeals to me, but the tubes are a little bigger than a retro frame. I've sold off a lot of my modern carbon frames and opted for these. Plus, the classic look masks my lack of speed in my old age. 😂
The cool thing about a project like this that gets overlooked, is it's actually pretty low risk. Because the scope of the build dictated that most of the cost is in the components, and the nature of the build means the parts need to be standard. So you know if it doesn't ride well or to your liking, it almost certainly comes down to the frame-set, and it's probably the cheapest part of the build.
This had me looking for frames and bike parts like there is no tomorrow. The price tag Alex mentioned did make me reel in some of that enthusiasm and reconsider what level of components I'm looking into...
I prefer that vintage bikes remain vintage and stay appreciated for what they were (i.e., don't bother with expensive upgrades). Modern components, which are almost always black in color, look odd on colorful and partially chromed steel frames. I much prefer the vintage group sets on vintage bikes... especially when the aluminum is highly polished for an extra bit of "bling" that doesn't exist on today's bikes.
With the price of new bikes and equipment, I am updating my older frame with new parts and at my level of fitness I am just enjoying riding my bike rather than what watts I produce 😊
I love the idea of retromod bicycles. Most of mine are. I don't race. I will never own a groupset that needs plugged in. There's no reason to spend 3k on a groupset for these types of builds in my world. 46-30 cranks have become my go-to. I haven't had a reason to have more than 10 gear cassettes. My latest build is a 2008 masi speciale cx. 10 speed bar-end shifters from Microsoft 700-32 tires. Dia-Compe brakes. 105 derailleurs. Brooks saddle. Smiles for miles and comfortable doing it. Plus, the rear rack easily holds a six-pack.
Interesting video… that old bike is beautiful. I ride on full carbon. I rode a beautiful Klein Quantum Race for years. Aluminum with carbon fork and seat post. Then when I was about fifty-five years old, a younger buddy I was riding dropped me on a ten mile stretch of new chip & seal. I bought a Volagi Lisio all carbon bicycle with the first disc brakes on a road bicycle. It has custom built Aluminum wheels with carbon spokes. That changed things IMMEDIATELY and l was able to drop everyone on the the nasty parts of the ride. And on those big downhills on rainy days I rode with confidence. I now ride an all carbon Specialized Diverge with 28 mm tires. I have not broken any bones since I started riding on the road with 28 mm of tire under me.
That bike is actually something. This retro-orange stands out for sure. Head tube is bit high (possibly frame size forces it), but in general - nice toy to have. Keep it.
Man, I love my disc brakes on both my road and mountain bikes. But I do miss how cool radial lacing looked. I especially like the 3 cross/radial set up on the back of the original wheels. My last set of cool wheels like that were on my 1997 Bontrager Race Lite with Chris King hubs and some pretty early DT Revolution spokes. I wish I still had those. (the frame is hanging on my shop wall, however.)
Love it,but not 8k loving it !😂 Let's be honest,if you got hold of some deep wheels,the rest of the bike wouldn't be that important, 105 crank,105 derailleurs, aero alloy bars,well under 3k
as an owner of a 90s steel frame that is modern fitted... the answer is yes... however, the steel frame seems to generate, if allow me to say, "power losses" due to its flexibility and this can be felt. also... if your frame can accommodate larger width tires that is also part of the losses formula since narrow ones dont ride as fast
Do this, but give the vintage bike to the strongest rider of the 3 . And make it steel. Not the thinnest tubing (like SL or 531), but slightly thicker like SP, ishiwata 024, or even 525 maybe (something that doesn't flex like a spring absorbing your energy and returning it past the point where it was needed)
Beautiful Pinarello! I commend you, Alex. I'd do the full monte and add a carbon fork. After a Cervelo R3 and three S-Works Tarmacs over the last 16 years, just last month, I made the move to a Lynskey R300 titanium. Is it as fast as its carbon predecessors? Nope! But I am turning 60 in a couple months and am also not as fast as my previous iterations... 🥲
I've updated several 80s steel bikes with updated shimano 105 groupsets... and carbon wheels... they are fun... but not quite the Performance of my new carbon bikes with the same groupset. I do enjoy the sturdy and robust steel ride.
It is a thing of beauty. I love building resto mods, my current build is a C4 Joker, I just don't have the backing of Shimano so it's used Corima wheels, 11 speed Sram Rival mechanical, thinking of 12 speed ratio tech conversion...... Will be around £2000. If you say £7000 for Alex's build taking, away his cockpit mistake then he has built an absolutely beautiful bike that stands out from the sea of carbon that is everywhere......... Do the cafe thing again...... who looks at who's bike the most. I know which I'll be wolf whistling at ❤
@@mickchaganis6607 it was designed to be an endurance comfortable bike. It’s quite aero, especially the front fork. C4 used to build some crazy bikes and I understand that the joker was an adaptation of the track bikes that they designed for the Canadian Olympic team
I have a neo retro and love it. I went with with a 90s Ciöcc 7005 aluminum frame with modern components sans groupset. I absolutely love it. But mine, even with 90s a Campy groupset, is just as fast as a modern bike in my opinion. But honestly, for the money spent, I could have easily bought a modern alloy framed road bike. But it would not come close to the amount of soul of my Ciöcc.
I’m a vintage bike fan so probably biased that way. I think the bike looks great and is a unique ride. I’m always amazed that for me -a very aged rider! - my vintage bikes perform just as well for me as my modern Roubaix carbon Di2 bike. Well, except for steep downhill braking which is not for the faint of heart. I’d probably enjoy a resto mod without quite such high end equipment that I bet would perform maybe 95% as well but cost a lot less.
My Favourite Bikes that I own and ride. 1. Peugeot Perthus Reynolds 753r Z Team 2. Vitus Carbone 9 Racing Bike (Sean Kelly) KAS 3.Vitus 979 Duralinox (Sean Kelly) KAS Vintage, Rim Brakes, DownTube Shifters 🤙🤙
For those of us who are over 40, this bike really isn't "old". The lugged steel bikes are Old. Lance said, "It's not about the bike". And I'd have to agree with him. Although I'll admit that upgrading certain bike parts is more important than others. The aerodynamic carbon wheels are going to be a bit heavier. The addition of more gears helps. An aluminum frame is good for climbing, and sprinting, but this frame is just huge. Had you built up an old Litespeed, you'd have a more comfortable ride, and it would be lighter. Thanks.
I think it's beautiful. Downright beautiful. The bike has character. It has a classic frame that screams "I'm old, but I'm beautiful. I don't care what it cost. It's not built for racing. It's built for admiring. I have to admit that one of my bikes is a similar concept. An older aluminium Bianchi Celeste painted frame that I've owned since new 30 years ago, fitted with triple crank Shimano 105 mechanical group-set, skinny aluminium rims fitted with skinny tubs. No electronics. It's all analog. It never fails to get admiring comments and waves from fellow riders as they pass this 78 year old rider still suffering from Peter Pan syndrome. Even more than I get when riding my all original Trek Y 22 carbon mountain bike fitted with it's Synergy carbon wheels. It's an age thing. If you can't go fast, at least look good. Right, Alex?
I feel like the bike is dope af! I love it. I would have though for the cockpit upgrade i would have flipped that to a better fork, if i could find one that fit
Having worked in the trade and designed and built custom bikes, I would say that the retro scene is not about building something to beat modern bikes. It is about building something that moves the soul as well as the body. We develop a connection with something we build ourselves, it imbues that bike with spirit and narrative. Some days, you have to put your face in the wind and enjoy the moment of riding something special, even of the modern bike riders are dropping you because they care for speed more than journey. This is why I also ride a custom motorcycle as well as a custom bicycle. I can honestly say that I love my bikes more because I built them and I know every bolt and quirk. I may not be fast, but I am at peace with the world as I ride. Well done Alex on building something beautiful, how about we see you go to frame building school and you build your own frame too? It does not have to be metal these days, how fast can you go on a Bamboo frame with that finishing kit?
Here's the thing though... If I saw that group of three ride buy, the neo-retro conversion is the ONLY one I'm staring at and thinking about for the rest of the day. They look SO GOOD. And as a card-carrying low VO2max punter, I just want to look and feel steezy on my bike.
Beautiful build now that the front end has been resolved. I feel that the wheelset are the most limiting factor. The team at GCN really hold true to the idea of wider tyres being the key area to upgrade for speed and comfort. I wonder if that is the major factor that holds this bike's speed back more than all the other limitations it has combined? Pretty please do a comparison with this bike in the widest tyre wheelset you can squeeze into the frame/brakes. Even if that means not using a Dura Ace wheelset. Great video.
My thoughts on this....drop all of that chrome and blacken it all out. Black and orange scheme would look straight devastating to the competition on group rides, IMHO. Then save money by going for a less expensive groupset. Maybe even the 105 Di2, if it really needs to be wireless, but if this is a retro bike build, why not pay homage to the era with a used wired groupset since you've already got the cable guides? Either way, lovely bike. Remind me of my '95 Cannondale R600 in Afterburner (orange to yellow factory fade) that I use as my online trainer bike. I feel that it helps me benefit from the online training sessions being that little bit harder, while I use my '20 Bianchi Aria out on the road. It helps me to really appreciate the real world liveliness and power transfer of modern technology in a frameset. Maybe that's an idea for a training series for GCN to present. Use the retro Pinarello on an online trainer and then transfer to a modern day Superbike for a group ride and note the sensations as well as performance in the real world. Maybe even train in an old wool jersey like the one that Merckx wore. Tres cool!
Love the bike . It’s not about speed and times , but how you feel when you go into the garage and see it , and you just want to ride it. You couldn’t have done that for £1500 . 105 mechanical groupset . Drive wheels . Sorted .
I did a similar project with a Derosa Merak and Campy Corus. The frame was a hand me down and the Corus was mostly second hand 10sp off eBay with new carbon richly fork and titanium campy seatpost. So all in I was well under 3000.00 USD it was a sweet ride that was sadly stolen…
I like the Pinarello. I personally don't have any problems with mixing old school frames with new tech - esp. if it means an older bike can be rode around on vs being stuck on a wall stripped down to the frame as a trophy (or worse). I'm always for keeping a bike rolling, and it doesn't "have" to be kept like it was originally or period correct (though that is nice as well).
I'm all for it. I don't have a budget that can do much more than maintain my current bikes, but I would 100% contemplate what was done in this video if given that 8k$$ towards building a bike like that. In reality any future N+1 bike will be off the shelf for me, just because I would want it to work right out of the gate for my purposes (again, due to budgetary constraints). I always checkout and drool over retro bikes, whether they're upgraded or simply maintained as they were.
Wanting to do similar (ish) to a 1990's Raleigh Dyna Tech - I reckon you could get most of the way there with just 11 Speed mechanical Ultegra and some Fulcrum Racing Zero's, and end up with a gorgeous passion project for less than the price of one (literally one) Dura Ace 9200 power meter chainset 😌🚴 Enough left over for a round of coffees too ;)
I like the updated retro. It would have to be done on a bike with a lunched drive train in my opinion. However, something like Rival or 105 would have made this more than adequate. I don’t think the top tier on a steel or aluminum frame really makes sense. However, it’s your money and life. If it makes you smile…Worth it!!!!
Pinarello looks awesome,im currently trying to upgrade my Peugeot Monaco 90's road bike with 7800 Dura-Ace parts but the problem is that most of the cranksets chainrings are very worn.😏
What would you do if you were given a budget for a bike? Upgrade a Retro classic? Buy a frame and pick your build kit? Or even just buy off of the shelf?
Maybe buy off the shelf. I don't have the tools nor the experience to build one from the frame up.
I’ve got retro mod I’ve built from frame up. C 1982 Battaglin frame within 9000 Dura Ace and mavic ksyrium elite wheels. Cost about £1.2k all up. It’s a great way to get cool bike at a decent price.
buy an alu "entry" bike, with 105 groupset - and have a bike for the next 10 years... cheap and just as fun..
I'd buy an old frame with low-spec components on it and upgrade it with mid-range parts. You'd get 90% of the bike as in this video but at perhaps 1/6th the price. Restro-mods can be economical if you don't use the most expensive parts.
Scallmalloy frame, deep section wheels, 105 wireless Di2.
But also, all the tools to do all installments and maintenance myself.
Also, pay somebody to help me set up the bike.
I'm more concerned by the limits of a retro rider . . .
😂😂😂 love this comment
Comment of the century
Some components can’t be upgraded 😕
So, SO many limits
Brilliant comment 😅😅
I got an early 90's bottecchia and added a 11 speed Ultegra groupset from ebay, finishing kit from spare parts. It rides really well, looks battered in a good way and does everything I need it to - and cost about £800 in total.
I looked for ages but my spares box didn't contain any dura ace cranksets!
Very nice,I'm looking to upgrade my Peugeot Monaco 90's road bike with 7800 dura-ace parts but the problem is that the 7800 crankset are usually badly worn.😏
Sounds a lot like my build! I got a free '86 Panasonic, bought Microshift shifters, bought a freehub axle for the 126 mm drops because I didn't want to keep the freewheel (and of course bought a correlating cassette), bought 40mm DT Swiss clincher rims and aluminum spokes. Laced up my own wheels, did the conversion myself. Sure, it's only 14 speed (up from 10, so I say that's a win), but with 53/40 biopace chainrings in the front and 11-28 in the back, it absolutely flies on the flats and the downhill (beats my modern bike on the downhill easily, surprisingly enough). SO much fun, and the upgrade cost me about $400. Sure wish I had Alex's box of spare Dura Ace parts, though. Would've turned it into even more of a beast than it already is!
The Bike-ini edition...
Maybe look in the spare parts box again around Xmas.
How about now updating the frame, forks, bars etc to modern standards and see how fast you can push those retro bar end caps?
8:13 8.28kg isn't lightweight? GCN is like 90's Vogue for bikes. It gives regular bikes body image issues.
Is large frame, so is less then 1kg above a modern bike,With the light wheels you wil NEVER notice it.
My brand new bike is 11kg (admitted, including bottle cages, bottles, saddle bag with spare tube and multitool, garmin edge and garmin varia) 😮
They have weak arms.
It's lighter than entry road bike, but heavier than medium priced bikes like TCR 0 or SuperSix EVO 3.
That's actually the weight of a typical Budget Chinese all carbon build for probably 1/4 of the price for Alex's build... And the groupset, wheelset we are talking about are all entry level stuff.
To borrow an analogy from the car world, riding a slow bike fast is much more fun than riding a fast bike slow. Thrashing a retro bike as hard as it can take is much more thrilling than doing zone 1 or zone 2 training on a top end racer. If the bike gives Alex more smiles per mile, more power to him for this build.
This is party why I have picked up cycling. 25 mph on a bike is much more thrilling than 25 mph in a sports car.
You dont even have to ride a slow bike fast because the tiniest amount of speed is going to feel like youre going at lightspeed^^
Going downhill with cooked coaster brakes is a level of excitement you only reach with modern bikes when it becomes life threatening:D
I use this expression on my channel often!
Exactly! "s/m" (smiles per miles) should be the number one measurement for judging a bike.
Zone 2 on a sick bike is fun too
I love the passion Alex put into this project, and creating something like this makes ownership much more personal.
As long as you enjoy it so what my bike is 14 years old I look after it and enjoy riding it
Need some power meter tests with this really. Most of the disadvantages compared to the modern bikes must be psychological in the real world
i think so too. The placebo effect can be positive or negative. Like the stradivarius vaiolin experiment, the experts were unable to identify the million-dollar violin and mistook it for violins worth less than a thousand dollars when they listened blindfolded.
Shimano power meter so I don't know how valuable that data would be...
I’ve run this experiment - accidentally really - and the old bikes are MUCH slower up hills. It’s genuinely surprising.
Some wahoo numbers would have been useful. If they put down 400w for the ride and he did 350w that would prove it's the rider. So I agree there
@@mybuickskill6979 400w ???🤣
Neo retro bikes always look excellent
There's just something so elegant about a steel framed bike with a chromed fork. My retired 1991 colonia red Tommasini Super Prestige with Campagnolo C-Record is now the centerpiece of my man cave.
His bke here is an aluminium bike with steel fork, though.
@@slighter Yeah...and mine is steel.
Campy C Record 1st edition crank , rear derailleur - beautiful !
Can't believe how flexy that fork is at 10:13 !!! I have a 1980s' Eroica steel bike and always noted that (wanted) flex but with the rigidity of carbon wheel and slowmotion.. wow!!!
A full on neo-retro build with a classic frame and modern components...This is the one that I've been waiting for!
A+ Video!
Reason:
1. Gave us a great passion project experiment
2. Went for a ride together
3. Honest, candid conversation that came to a great conclusion.
This is the better GCN .
(Less script and formula)
No matter what the price of the bike is, as long as it makes you enjoy cycling and be healthy, it's money well spent. Health is wealth.
dazza9129
That's right dazz. The most important thing is to get out and cycle the cost of the bike and your clothing is secondary. For example there is little point in having a 3K bike if it never leaves the garage
Hmmm no. There's such a thing as financial irresponsibility.
Projects like these, in my opinion, don’t necessarily require top-of-the-line new modern components. A more moderate approach is likely more suitable, and I’d definitely recommend avoiding conversions to Di2, for example.
Second hands mechanical 11 speed dura ace + older version of C40 or C60 wheels should be more appropriate and way less expensive
Yeah I feel that's where Alex is really disconnected from people who uses their own money to make this kind of build. He's a sucker for Durace. I really like the philosophy for these kind of builds, passion projects, but it just doesn't feel right
@@popase05 the thing is, shimano sponsored the project so it's normal for them to use brand new parts. It's just not appropriate for normal users
100% agree. I did up a 90's Apollo steel frame with ~2019 11sp 105 and it was the most fun road bike I've ever ridden.
just from the perspective of making stuff work - Di2 is actually a bit of a hack. the lack of need for cable routing in the traditional sense, or literally anything under tension anywhere on the bike besides the chain, and the forgiving nature of shifting, chainline and chainlength with the system means you are more free to experiment.
A Di2 derailleur will shift perfectly regardless of what's happening on the rest of the bike, basically. It's expensive, it isn't the moderate solution you're describing, but it's perfect for actually getting new tech to function on old hardware without any real fuss.
Alex how would you have faired on the original equipment supplied with the bike , that would be the ideal comparison to say if the upgrade was worth while or not
Indeed. Also, I feel he had completely ruined the bike with the parts he had chosen.
Yes this would be fair. I would guess it would be heavier and the wheels probably make quite a difference. I own an old steel, mavic tubular, down tube shifters, 9,5 kg bike that is actually quite fast. But it's no match for my considerable stiffer 11 speed 7kg carbon ride.
There is an old saying: " Beauty is in the eye of the beholder". The same can be said for value. I love what was done here, mostly because I am thinking of doing the same thing, but with a 25 year old Softride Road wing. I currently am riding a new Cervelo R5 built with Dura Ace, but also have this Softride that I bought new in 2000. I just pulled out the Softride a week ago, slipped on my Sidi Genius shoes from the same year, and dawned my old Briko sunglasses (Cippo would be proud!). I had such a great time riding this old steeds, that I have been searching for a new Dura Ace groupset. Worth the cost compared to a new modern bike? Well, again I must say that value is in the eye of the beholder.
Well done guys, I loved this video and build of a classic bike.
I'm a huge fan of the orange paint scheme. I don't know why more manufacturers don't make orange bikes. It is the vehicle equivalent or a "resto-mod" with the retro frame along with the updated components. Love it.
that retro-rebuild Pinarello might be slower than the more modern bikes but that best they could ever hope to achieve in the Bike Vault is a 'Super Nice' but that bike you've built Alex... worthy of a Bell Drop! It looks amazing
I lately crashed a bike to no fault of my own and the frame got destroyed, so I had a full Ultegra R8000 group set laying around plus some stuff I had anyway (handlebars etc.). Got a Look 461 frame from like 2002 or so from eBay in very good condition and threw everything on that frame. Looks and rides absolutely sweet and saved a vintage frame from the landfill. And it's definitely not slow...
I ride a Look KG461 I bought from an older French Racer, fantastic bike. I know riders are suspect of old Carbon but those bikes that aren't yet vintage or collectable but just "old" are in a sweetspot for price for me and are just plain cool. Like you said, the bike is certainly not slow. Enjoy your rides ✌️.
Thanks! I "could" be worried about the carbon/aluminium construction, but I couldn't find a single indication online that one of those frames ever failed due to that, so I'm pretty confident that Look knew what they were doing when building this frame. And since even new bikes from top brands are breaking all the time (snapping forks etc.) I'd actually rather have an older frame that has a couple thousand kilometers on it and evidently DIDN'T break. Of course you never know the history for sure, but I nothing in life is certain anyway...
I did exactly that with my late ‘80s Bianchi Specialissima. Dura-Ace, Carbon Mavic tubular wheels, Columbus carbon fork and aero cockpit. And guess what I love it and don’t care when people tell me I’m crazy or doesn’t look “correct for the era”. 😊
Honestly I’d probably just keep the original restored period correct group set. Did Alex say just over a thousand quid?! Beautiful bike for the money. Obviously not with the modern di2 but still, a thing of beauty and perfection for a cafe ride, you’d be the envy of the group with that thing. Sure, if I was rich, I might do what Alex did, but I can only afford one bike at most with dura-ace di2 and given the cost, it’d have to be a modern carbon frame
Especially when you consider the original bike, with original groupset cost just £1000 he basically spent 7x the value of the bike on new components. A bit ridiculous.
I did something similar. Mid 90’s Bianchi TSX Ultralight Reparto Corse. With updated fork and Ultegra 11sp. Rides brilliantly, but not light by today’s standards at all. Fun to ride, super comfortable and I was able to keep my pride and joy.
@@mattkansy1763 since they started to use disc brakes and electronic shifting today standard is not light.
I am 72yo. I currently have two bikes that I currently ride, both custom built for me. One was built in 2010 and the second I just had built in August with disc brakes. I am not going to be any faster on an aero bike with my realitive upright position. But new components (still 11sp) are pretty nice on my archaic rides.
you can build a bike that looks similar to that, with new lower end parts and end up with a bike that is better than the stock original build, nothing wrong with having a bike that you just enjoy riding without paying the absurd prices for these new bikes. have done it twice for less than $2000 per build.
Can we get power meter readings for this? I know you guys have them. It would just be interesting to see
Do remember it's NOT semi wireless, it's fully wired as it's di2 rim brake. (Just built one myself)
Have really enjoyed this series 😁
I still have my classic bikes alongside my modern road bike, and still enjoy riding them. It's great to enjoy them and give them an outing on a club ride, where speed/pace isn't so critical. I have found that an upgrade to the fork can make a significant upgrade to a bike's performance... even to change its character. I have a steel Colnago master, and was able to locate an original Colnago star carbon fork with a 1" steerer (as fitted to the 1st generation C40s). Not only is it an authentic upgrade, the gap has been shortened somewhat.
I recently put together a 94' Trek 1400 with a 10spd record group I had laying around and it's such a joy. Its not the fastest but its such a hack putting a more modern groupset on an older frame.
I like it. Don't ever apologize for a passion project
I've got a modern Cervelo aero aluminum road bike, a modern carbon Colnago road bike, and another classic steel Colnago Master all equipped with Campagnolo componenty and the Cervelo is the fastest but when going on a longer 4+ hour ride I'll choose the steel Master as it's the most comfortable for longer stints. Take the three bikes tested out for a 6 hour ride with the same riders and see how far each would go and also quantify how the rider feels after a long day
Colnago Master + Campagnolo -parts👍🇮🇹❤️
Beautiful setup, enjoy !
He better enjoy it for what it cost! Thanks!
@@gcn He will probably sell this bike in few months for something like 4-5k hehe
@alex I reckon if you took my restomod look dura ace that you super niced recently in the bike vault, it’s 100% as fast as a modern “super bike”…or you could line up some other restomod projects from viewers next to yours in a resto mega test…big interest in these sorts of bikes now!
Awesome passion project, regardless the price. I love the contrast that Alex has done, old with new. The touch points remain to be the important aspects of the ride/feel. Most passion projects arent meant to be raced, rather enjoyed, fun to see Alex go toe to toe and race it. Great content ... I would love to see something a little more faux pas in the bike world .. being a high end frame built up with a low to mid range groupset with high value / lower budget wheels/rims. A "self build" per say, instead of how the bike industry has created a "bundled" "cheaper" priced bike ( bc being "stuck" into buying a bike, creates a lot of frustration for buyers) .. contrasting the value and effectiveness of both purchases. Uncovering the more reasonable and specific for the rider .
The bike looks sharp, the orange really pops. I've recently went back to more classic looking frames with a couple custom double triangle frames, one steel and the other titanium. The look of them with modern parts just appeals to me, but the tubes are a little bigger than a retro frame. I've sold off a lot of my modern carbon frames and opted for these. Plus, the classic look masks my lack of speed in my old age. 😂
The cool thing about a project like this that gets overlooked, is it's actually pretty low risk. Because the scope of the build dictated that most of the cost is in the components, and the nature of the build means the parts need to be standard. So you know if it doesn't ride well or to your liking, it almost certainly comes down to the frame-set, and it's probably the cheapest part of the build.
This is what I want from gcn. This is the kind of conversation you can have about a bike when you’re not being paid to promote it
This had me looking for frames and bike parts like there is no tomorrow. The price tag Alex mentioned did make me reel in some of that enthusiasm and reconsider what level of components I'm looking into...
The bike looks banging 👌
I prefer that vintage bikes remain vintage and stay appreciated for what they were (i.e., don't bother with expensive upgrades). Modern components, which are almost always black in color, look odd on colorful and partially chromed steel frames. I much prefer the vintage group sets on vintage bikes... especially when the aluminum is highly polished for an extra bit of "bling" that doesn't exist on today's bikes.
Love silver components!
With the price of new bikes and equipment, I am updating my older frame with new parts and at my level of fitness I am just enjoying riding my bike rather than what watts I produce 😊
I love the idea of retromod bicycles. Most of mine are. I don't race. I will never own a groupset that needs plugged in. There's no reason to spend 3k on a groupset for these types of builds in my world. 46-30 cranks have become my go-to. I haven't had a reason to have more than 10 gear cassettes. My latest build is a 2008 masi speciale cx. 10 speed bar-end shifters from Microsoft 700-32 tires. Dia-Compe brakes. 105 derailleurs. Brooks saddle. Smiles for miles and comfortable doing it. Plus, the rear rack easily holds a six-pack.
Interesting video… that old bike is beautiful. I ride on full carbon.
I rode a beautiful Klein Quantum Race for years. Aluminum with carbon fork and seat post.
Then when I was about fifty-five years old, a younger buddy I was riding dropped me on a ten mile stretch of new chip & seal.
I bought a Volagi Lisio all carbon bicycle with the first disc brakes on a road bicycle.
It has custom built Aluminum wheels with carbon spokes.
That changed things IMMEDIATELY and l was able to drop everyone on the the nasty parts of the ride. And on those big downhills on rainy days I rode with confidence.
I now ride an all carbon Specialized Diverge with 28 mm tires.
I have not broken any bones since I started riding on the road with 28 mm of tire under me.
Been riding for 30y. A Quantum (or even a C'dale) on chip and seal...great for your teeth fillings.
That bike is actually something. This retro-orange stands out for sure. Head tube is bit high (possibly frame size forces it), but in general - nice toy to have. Keep it.
Man, I love my disc brakes on both my road and mountain bikes. But I do miss how cool radial lacing looked. I especially like the 3 cross/radial set up on the back of the original wheels. My last set of cool wheels like that were on my 1997 Bontrager Race Lite with Chris King hubs and some pretty early DT Revolution spokes. I wish I still had those. (the frame is hanging on my shop wall, however.)
Love it,but not 8k loving it !😂
Let's be honest,if you got hold of some deep wheels,the rest of the bike wouldn't be that important, 105 crank,105 derailleurs, aero alloy bars,well under 3k
Really beautiful machine 👌👍
Looks absolutely stunning!
as an owner of a 90s steel frame that is modern fitted... the answer is yes... however, the steel frame seems to generate, if allow me to say, "power losses" due to its flexibility and this can be felt. also... if your frame can accommodate larger width tires that is also part of the losses formula since narrow ones dont ride as fast
Do this, but give the vintage bike to the strongest rider of the 3 . And make it steel. Not the thinnest tubing (like SL or 531), but slightly thicker like SP, ishiwata 024, or even 525 maybe (something that doesn't flex like a spring absorbing your energy and returning it past the point where it was needed)
Beautiful Pinarello! I commend you, Alex. I'd do the full monte and add a carbon fork.
After a Cervelo R3 and three S-Works Tarmacs over the last 16 years, just last month, I made the move to a Lynskey R300 titanium. Is it as fast as its carbon predecessors? Nope! But I am turning 60 in a couple months and am also not as fast as my previous iterations... 🥲
Been looking forward to seeing this video!
I've updated several 80s steel bikes with updated shimano 105 groupsets... and carbon wheels... they are fun... but not quite the Performance of my new carbon bikes with the same groupset. I do enjoy the sturdy and robust steel ride.
The difference between a traditional round bar and modern, narrow bars is around 25w at 45k/ph. That could account for all of the difference.
It is a thing of beauty.
I love building resto mods, my current build is a C4 Joker, I just don't have the backing of Shimano so it's used Corima wheels, 11 speed Sram Rival mechanical, thinking of 12 speed ratio tech conversion...... Will be around £2000.
If you say £7000 for Alex's build taking, away his cockpit mistake then he has built an absolutely beautiful bike that stands out from the sea of carbon that is everywhere......... Do the cafe thing again...... who looks at who's bike the most. I know which I'll be wolf whistling at ❤
Hi. I also have a c4 joker- pretty rare. With HED tri spoke wheels I used to time trial it quite successfully
@@royc6508I hadn't even heard of it till the frame turned up on ebay, I just had to have it........ Frame alone is over 2kg!! Lightweight carbon 😂😂
@@mickchaganis6607 it was designed to be an endurance comfortable bike. It’s quite aero, especially the front fork. C4 used to build some crazy bikes and I understand that the joker was an adaptation of the track bikes that they designed for the Canadian Olympic team
@@royc6508it will make a super cool resto mod.
Great idea, but probably second hand components would have been the way to go
Honestly, the bike looks absolutely amazing. A true thing of beauty.
I have a neo retro and love it. I went with with a 90s Ciöcc 7005 aluminum frame with modern components sans groupset. I absolutely love it. But mine, even with 90s a Campy groupset, is just as fast as a modern bike in my opinion. But honestly, for the money spent, I could have easily bought a modern alloy framed road bike. But it would not come close to the amount of soul of my Ciöcc.
I’m a vintage bike fan so probably biased that way. I think the bike looks great and is a unique ride. I’m always amazed that for me -a very aged rider! - my vintage bikes perform just as well for me as my modern Roubaix carbon Di2 bike. Well, except for steep downhill braking which is not for the faint of heart. I’d probably enjoy a resto mod without quite such high end equipment that I bet would perform maybe 95% as well but cost a lot less.
Stunning Neo-retro bike build. OK maybe a little overkill on the components but why not! 🧡
My Favourite Bikes that I own and ride.
1. Peugeot Perthus Reynolds 753r Z Team
2. Vitus Carbone 9 Racing Bike (Sean Kelly) KAS
3.Vitus 979 Duralinox (Sean Kelly) KAS
Vintage, Rim Brakes, DownTube Shifters 🤙🤙
Unless you're racing, it doesn't matter. As long as you're riding hard, you're getting a good workout
Well, you might want to include fast group rides too.
Published tomorrow. Have to for the rest of us!
For those of us who are over 40, this bike really isn't "old". The lugged steel bikes are Old. Lance said, "It's not about the bike". And I'd have to agree with him. Although I'll admit that upgrading certain bike parts is more important than others. The aerodynamic carbon wheels are going to be a bit heavier. The addition of more gears helps. An aluminum frame is good for climbing, and sprinting, but this frame is just huge. Had you built up an old Litespeed, you'd have a more comfortable ride, and it would be lighter. Thanks.
I think it's beautiful. Downright beautiful. The bike has character. It has a classic frame that screams "I'm old, but I'm beautiful. I don't care what it cost. It's not built for racing. It's built for admiring.
I have to admit that one of my bikes is a similar concept. An older aluminium Bianchi Celeste painted frame that I've owned since new 30 years ago, fitted with triple crank Shimano 105 mechanical group-set, skinny aluminium rims fitted with skinny tubs. No electronics. It's all analog. It never fails to get admiring comments and waves from fellow riders as they pass this 78 year old rider still suffering from Peter Pan syndrome. Even more than I get when riding my all original Trek Y 22 carbon mountain bike fitted with it's Synergy carbon wheels. It's an age thing. If you can't go fast, at least look good. Right, Alex?
Love it Alex. Class bike, forget the money and look at the end result. 👊
Build quality and style combined with modern shifting. Best of both worlds.
I feel like the bike is dope af! I love it. I would have though for the cockpit upgrade i would have flipped that to a better fork, if i could find one that fit
the bar end plugs really make it, those are hot
I'd love to see a comparison with a power meter.
Am I the only one who thinks the old school bike looks better than the modern ones?
No. But the Big Bike Content Creators would disagree.
I like it. Props to Alex for doing building that old frame back up. Not sure very bike needs to be built for speed and nothing else.
I have a titanium Basso from the 90s. I always wonder how much faster I would be on a modern bike. Thank you Alex
That bike looks amazing 😮
Having worked in the trade and designed and built custom bikes, I would say that the retro scene is not about building something to beat modern bikes. It is about building something that moves the soul as well as the body. We develop a connection with something we build ourselves, it imbues that bike with spirit and narrative. Some days, you have to put your face in the wind and enjoy the moment of riding something special, even of the modern bike riders are dropping you because they care for speed more than journey. This is why I also ride a custom motorcycle as well as a custom bicycle. I can honestly say that I love my bikes more because I built them and I know every bolt and quirk. I may not be fast, but I am at peace with the world as I ride. Well done Alex on building something beautiful, how about we see you go to frame building school and you build your own frame too? It does not have to be metal these days, how fast can you go on a Bamboo frame with that finishing kit?
Here's the thing though... If I saw that group of three ride buy, the neo-retro conversion is the ONLY one I'm staring at and thinking about for the rest of the day. They look SO GOOD. And as a card-carrying low VO2max punter, I just want to look and feel steezy on my bike.
Beautiful build now that the front end has been resolved. I feel that the wheelset are the most limiting factor.
The team at GCN really hold true to the idea of wider tyres being the key area to upgrade for speed and comfort. I wonder if that is the major factor that holds this bike's speed back more than all the other limitations it has combined?
Pretty please do a comparison with this bike in the widest tyre wheelset you can squeeze into the frame/brakes. Even if that means not using a Dura Ace wheelset.
Great video.
My thoughts on this....drop all of that chrome and blacken it all out. Black and orange scheme would look straight devastating to the competition on group rides, IMHO. Then save money by going for a less expensive groupset. Maybe even the 105 Di2, if it really needs to be wireless, but if this is a retro bike build, why not pay homage to the era with a used wired groupset since you've already got the cable guides? Either way, lovely bike. Remind me of my '95 Cannondale R600 in Afterburner (orange to yellow factory fade) that I use as my online trainer bike. I feel that it helps me benefit from the online training sessions being that little bit harder, while I use my '20 Bianchi Aria out on the road. It helps me to really appreciate the real world liveliness and power transfer of modern technology in a frameset. Maybe that's an idea for a training series for GCN to present. Use the retro Pinarello on an online trainer and then transfer to a modern day Superbike for a group ride and note the sensations as well as performance in the real world. Maybe even train in an old wool jersey like the one that Merckx wore. Tres cool!
Love the bike . It’s not about speed and times , but how you feel when you go into the garage and see it , and you just want to ride it.
You couldn’t have done that for £1500 . 105 mechanical groupset . Drive wheels . Sorted .
I did a similar project with a Derosa Merak and Campy Corus. The frame was a hand me down and the Corus was mostly second hand 10sp off eBay with new carbon richly fork and titanium campy seatpost. So all in I was well under 3000.00 USD it was a sweet ride that was sadly stolen…
It must look hilarious to passers-by to see the three of you all sitting on the same side of the bench drinking coffee
Probably the nicest bike I've ever seen.
The best of both worlds: the old and the new.
I like the Pinarello. I personally don't have any problems with mixing old school frames with new tech - esp. if it means an older bike can be rode around on vs being stuck on a wall stripped down to the frame as a trophy (or worse). I'm always for keeping a bike rolling, and it doesn't "have" to be kept like it was originally or period correct (though that is nice as well).
I'm all for it. I don't have a budget that can do much more than maintain my current bikes, but I would 100% contemplate what was done in this video if given that 8k$$ towards building a bike like that. In reality any future N+1 bike will be off the shelf for me, just because I would want it to work right out of the gate for my purposes (again, due to budgetary constraints). I always checkout and drool over retro bikes, whether they're upgraded or simply maintained as they were.
Wanting to do similar (ish) to a 1990's Raleigh Dyna Tech - I reckon you could get most of the way there with just 11 Speed mechanical Ultegra and some Fulcrum Racing Zero's, and end up with a gorgeous passion project for less than the price of one (literally one) Dura Ace 9200 power meter chainset 😌🚴
Enough left over for a round of coffees too ;)
Can you do a comparison with the same rider on both bikes. With speed differences on both bikes? This would be a really interesting compariosn.
as long as the bike fits you well, has nice wheelset and tire. doesnt matter if its claris or di2. it will ride awesome
It is lovley. Speed not all!
Love that Pinarello!
I think you did a fantastic job if that were to be made today it would be more money it's really badass!!
Amazing vid keep it up!
I like the updated retro. It would have to be done on a bike with a lunched drive train in my opinion. However, something like Rival or 105 would have made this more than adequate. I don’t think the top tier on a steel or aluminum frame really makes sense. However, it’s your money and life. If it makes you smile…Worth it!!!!
bike so awesome it give me chills
It's a beauty. Nuff said.
Alex you forgot a power meter! I think you were just having a bad day. The Pinarello is beautiful, unique, and with every penny
On the hill climb in Llandogo it’s lucky you went left at the fork and not right up the ‘Freedom’
Am I the only one that noticed the steel fork deflection on the slo mo intro? Beautiful build regardless of performance?
Killer looks!
Pinarello looks awesome,im currently trying to upgrade my Peugeot Monaco 90's road bike with 7800 Dura-Ace parts but the problem is that most of the cranksets chainrings are very worn.😏
Will there ever be a video on how Si did at the gravel world championships?
I second this comment.
It was mentioned in the GCN show - i think if i remember correctly, its currently banned by the UCI (sadly they HAD jurisdiction there ...).