The Cookie Files: The History of the Gaza Blockade
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- Опубліковано 1 жов 2024
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#destiny #vaush #politicaldebates
Sage banned to stop Hamas from performing witchcraft 😔
Isn't sage primarily used to COMBAT witchcraft? Leaving the Gazans open to curses and ghosts, that's worse than denying them cookies.
I really appreciate your nuance. "It's not Imperial" isn't something I really took the time to think about critically.
That's a really good observation he made I wouldn't have put that together but he is correct
Facts. I stupidly always conflated the two terms. Loner making the distinction actually prompted me to open the dictionary and educate myself. Based good faith analysis
Do you mean that you thought of zionism as an imperial movement implicitly since it's commonly labeled as colonial?
What did you think the point of the movement even was if that's the case? I'm genuinely asking
You can tell Box does a ton of research because whenever he gets down to it, the answer is always "well it's actually really frickin' complicated"
But it is complicated
@@franklingoodwin yes, correct
Yes but some things are simple like Hamas is bad for everyone and shouldn’t be in power anywhere.
To me that’s as simple as Nazis are bad and shouldn’t be in power anywhere.
First!!! Do I get a cookie..? 🙏🙏🙏
Catch! 🍪💨👋😊
@@HillBelichick Jokes on you! Thanks for the free rocket fuel 😉😈😁
u get a jdam
@@billybobthornton9668noooooo
@@HillBelichick What can I say? I'm a bad Santa 🤭
the cookie rocket discourse was double funny for me cuz idk if anybody else had watched those king of random videos where they make DIY rocket fuel with sugar
there is an old blog i found where some guy made "rocket candy" by freezing Milky Ways or Twix , grounding it up, and mixing it with an oxidant or whatever.
As a Destiny fan myself I appreciate this video extremely and even if we have differing political views, I greatly respect you as a human Lonerbox.
he is an hypocrite that sympathize jihad
Why did no one even bother to check if sugar was banned in the first place??
Ita not about that.
It's about "necessities of life" if they need x amount of sugar to survive (which they do) and you give them x amount +y amount of sugar in cookie form then they have some percentage of x amount to use for something that isn't sustenance.
I asked my dad ( a chemist) about this 20 years ago.
He said," ya it would take about 20 years, but if someone is full of intent, then it could /would be doable."
Sugar and salt are soluble in water. Both are not soluble in alcohol however. It isn't hard to conceive of... if you know enough.
@robertcampomizzi7988 DUDE you lost me towards the end.
You asked your dad what exactly? Full of intent to do what?
What's the significance of sugar and water being soluble in water but not alcohol?
I'm not questioning what you're saying, just trying to understand what you're saying.
It's also possible my questions will be answered from the video but I just started and lack patience
@@robertcampomizzi7988from a quick goog. Humans do not need the "added sugar" from things like cookies to live. The amount of glucose humans need is naturally occurring in many non-sweet foods. "Added" sugars do nothing but increase calorie count.
@@robertcampomizzi7988sugar is not a necessity lol, you can survive and even thrive without a single gram of sugar
@arenegadeboss there is salt in cookies that would not make great fuel. "Water cannot be used to separate a mixture of sugar and salt as both sugar and salt show very good solubility in water. However, salt being an ionic compound would not be soluble in alcohol ( like dissolves like). On the other hand, sugar is very much soluble in alcohol. So on dissolving the mixture of sugar and salt in alcohol, the sugar would dissolve in alcohol, but salt would remain undissolved. The undissolved salt will settle at the bottom and can simply be separated by filtration. Now the solution of sugar and alcohol can simply be evaporated over a water bath (as alcohol is inflammable) and the sugar can thus be separated from the alcohol solution."
You're a real g for all the research you do into these topics. It's really helped me develop a more nuanced view on the history of Israel and Palestine. I really appreciate it. It'd be great to have a single location to access all the sources you use.
"SINWAR WE NEED TO COOK"
“You’re way to confident about the cookie thing” is a very funny thing for a person confidently declaring that it’s impossible to extract sugar from cookies to say. At least destiny is upfront about that he knows jack about chemistry.
tbf, destiny was also ridiculously confident as well and basically took israel's statements at face value. at least he was willing to acknowledge that he's not knowledgeable about the topic which is pretty great but that doesn't take away from the criticism about destiny's confidence
Nah bro. That shit is ridiculous
@@Sensei_gojo he may have been confident and wrong, (i actually don’t think he came off that overconfident considering all the ‘statements like ‘it’s been a million years since I took chemistry’ etc that tempered it), but I don’t remember him making any claims about his guest being overly confident. This is me making fun of the guys hypocrisy, after all. And the hypocrisy doesn’t exist if he’s not making a big deal about it. Destiny also didn’t take Israel statements at face value, as far as I can tell, so much as he was just unreasonable charitable toward them. I don’t think it was anything actually said by Israel that resulted in the conclusion. I think it was just the charitability coupled with the (correct) knowledge that sugar can and was used in rockets before and the (correct) understanding that sugar could be extracted. It was still an incorrect conclusion to draw, of course.
@@SS-xr7jf that is true, it would be more accurate to say he’s being overly charitable rather then he’s taking their statements at face value. However I do feel like it’s odd to talk about how you’re not very knowledgeable about a topic only to talk at a really high energy level when discussing a topic. It gives the impression that you’re confident even when you say you’re not.
However, if I was to make the charitable argument in his favor, I would also argue that he was just pushing back against his guests overconfidence which made him sound as though he’s also overconfident when he didn’t mean to be.
But considering his debate on (I think) breaking points with the badly, he did also seem pretty confident in his charitably towards Israel so I would doubt he’s “just” mirroring his interlocutors energy.
I agree with everything else you said though.
@@Sensei_gojo to be fair, I think a giant chunk of “debate” relies on saying stuff with confidence. When you don’t, you look weak and it opens you up for nitpicking. It’s kind of like the background radiation level for debate. So destiny probably has to put effort to move the perceived confidence meter from that default level, especially when the opponent is coming in hot.
I personally interpreted his statements downplaying his knowledge as him just trying to be as accurate to his knowledge as possible. He knows he doesn’t have the science background necessary to really know with confidence the ins and outs of its scientific possibility, even though he thinks he’s right. Meanwhile, the other data points that probably led to his conclusion are things he’s much more confident about. He knows confidently that they’ve used sugar rockets before, and that Israel blockades for security purposes. (Remember, charitability towards Israel is his failure here, which means the latter is a blind spot that he’s confident in when he shouldn’t be). So, by being more clear about the limitations of his knowledge, he’s probably trying to adjust the expectations of people on that part of it, either because that’s the part that his argument is most likely to fail on and adjusting expectations makes it less embarrassing if it blows up there. or because he just doesn’t want to argue the specifics of it, because he knows he can’t. So engaging in that argument would be pointless, especially when his opponent clearly didn’t know either.
The power of chemistry
Look at the comments on the recent Breaking Points video on 9/11. Israel being blamed for it by evidence of some dancing people.
This discourse is the perfect example of a larger issue, being that Destiny staked out a position, and uncritically defended that position and made ridiculous arguments in pursuit of defense for it. Destiny couldn’t bring himself to say Israel was punitive and cruel so he has to find ways to justify their punitive cruelty. He should have taken the L instead of painting himself into a corner where he has to use videos of people explicitly not extracting sugar out of rockets to try and prove he was right.
Of course pasta was banned for security though. Haven't you heard of Hamas's fearsome first gen canolli cannons?
Loner I fw you heavily
Destiny is so hard to listen to, his voice and speech cadence make my skin crawl
What happened here, is Destiny took the pro palestine claim in good faith, and came up with an argument against the claim that made logical sense without doing a bunch of research into cookies. The problem is Omar was being dishonest, and Destiny didn't immediately question the claim itself.
The problem is also that the moderators just sit there looking pretty and let dishonesty dominate the debate. If Destiny questioned the claim, that wouldn't have stopped Omar inventing a new one.
The argument was logically valid by itself, but I think it should have been obvious to him that it wasn't sound. While it is technically true that you can make rocket fuel out of cookies (and literally anything else that contains any sugar, can be processed into sugar like corn, and possibly any other forms of combustible calories), the only way this would work as an argument was if you were willing to starve everyone - or possibly remove all sheet metal that exists in Gaza.
Qassam-type rockets are little more than a steel tube full of sugar and fertilizer (anything that oxidizes can work though, including common medical gases like NOS, and compounds found in household detergents), with a base plate welded to the bottom, the nozzles are literally just drilled into this plate and don't necessarily need an external bell if accuracy is not a concern, which it isn't for Hamas. The only reason you can't build such a weapon in your backyard is that the cops will (correctly) arrest you.
He took the claim in his faith and spit out an absurd bad faith rebuttal "cookie rockets". If he didn't know and omar was wrong (or lying) destiny should have fact checked him. Not like you can't do that with Ryan and Emily having open laptops.
He gets no credit for pretending that he knew what he was talking about
@@Tirinirquestion that too. Destiny has done that before
@@Blaze6108so do you think we should ban sugar in gaza? Send like they can get rocket fuel so they don't bother with sugar rockets
Really enjoy your content, you analysis and breakdowns. You often make me rethink positions. Hence me paying to support(prior to being muted) and watching. Sad to get muted because I challenged casual racist/bigotry towards a racial group in your chat (ironically as you watch a video and challenge the blatant bigotry and weaponizing of bigotry by the person in the video).
Edit: For reference, I challenged the statement 'white people from rural England are evil'. In a discussion where LonexBox was challenging a guy for calling a group of people with a shared group characteristic from a certain region (middle eastern muslims) evil.
"COOKIES?" bro sounded like the Cookie Monster 😂
Great insight as always Lonerbox. Love your videos.
Biscuit is the English word for cookie!
Ok so as someone with a little bit of organic chemistry experience, you can get the sugar but it is an arduous process that you need to be skilled at. I'm assuming you would have to dissolve the chips or cookie and then mix it with a reagent (or multiple) to get your sugar. However, that sugar would be dissolved in a solvent and you would have to evaporate it in this thing called a rotovap, at which point you would then get the original sugar. However, the equipment in terms of reagents and machines you need are quite expensive and you wouldn't even get that great of a yield most likely so it'd be a waste of time and money to get sugar that way
Um actually as alchemy is an arabic invention everyone knows KKKKKHHAmas can create nuclear weapons out of simple cookies
So basically there’s no way a bunch of ragtag terrorists in Gaza could have extracted sugar from cookies for rockets
plus baked goods can have a greater density of calories (energy) than raw sugar, so with some clever work, they could probably get more fuel out of just the cookies
I also have organic chemistry experience, but I don’t think this requires such advanced reactions. You could easily get a crude sugar product by dissolving some crushed up cookies in some warm water. This would allow you to seperate the oils and filter out a decent chunk of the flour and denatured egg proteins. You could then refine the sugar from the other water soluble compounds using the crystallisation process used by typical sugar refineries.
@@davidwright6591yes king we love making fun of certain peoples pronunciation! Im sure you wouldn’t get mad if people started mocking how Arabs pronounce “khaza”
Ryan Grimm is an NPC
One time I went to jail because I make a thing with sugar and stump remover
Been waiting for this
Ryan Grim runs the Intercept into ground so hard even his financial handler Klippenstein bailed.
nice
Can’t believe I heard a British guy say pissin in the wind 😂😂I thought only people from the southern United states said that shit lol
It's funny to me that I can't hear about this topic without thinking of the Fallout 4 crafting system. Where everything from toothpaste to detergent counts as "antiseptic" that can be used for medical supplies, and where everything from a soap bar, gasoline canisters, cooking oil bottles to paint cans counts as "oil" that can be used for everything from combustion generators to food recipes. I'm imagining a Hamas guy going through a wrecked house, bringing up his quick-loot interface, analyzing the explosive potential of an Israeli bomb, and a box of cereal he found.
I came here for the cookies . . .
I’ve watched the entire video and I still haven’t gotten a cookie.
As we are in the realm of assumptions, I wouldn't rule out that during a blockade, much like in active war times, Israel must let items that sum up to sufficient nutritional values and therefore prioritize items that amount to those values for a given incoming capacity... Only an idea.
"Hey what happened to my community note?" might be the least self-aware statement ever spoken.
LonerBox, thank you for continuing to provide a nuanced take to the world.
We need less hyperbole and more careful language!
I like this guy! He’s actually trying to figure out what’s going on!
A white list of permitted items is a blacklist
I talked about this on my stream today and talked mad shit but it seems Lonerbox doesn't have the opinion I thought he did so my bad lmao
I swear the way people talk about lonerbox makes him sound like a hardcore Zionist and that’s just not the truth
Do you think most people actually engage with anything on this topic with critical thinking?
@@RanEncounterit’s usually pro-Israel people that are extremely uneducated
💜🤠
Brocolli? Fuck dat, gimme 🍪
Colonialism requires a mother country. Otherwise it is just migration and settlement.
The mother country is the United States, at least in a geopolitical sense.
@@PlatinumAltaria lie. At least 90% have never lived in the US or had descended from any Americans.
@@PlatinumAltaria BS. Most Israelis are Not even American citizen or have any family connections to the country.
Where does israel extract recources from the middle east to the benefit of a foreign power like the US. The colonialism word is just wrong in this context. Israel was for a substantial part of its existence not even considered to be part of 'the West'.
Not necessarily the case. The term "surrogate colonialism" is used to describe Israel and South Africa.
Im hyped
Destiny can sometimes be a conclooder too. He conclooded himself into a scientifically plausible position that had almost no accordance with the real world.
Just like any Israel supporter you just ignore reality because it’s convenient to explain the existence of Israel
Destiny was wrong, but literally no one else was able to demonstrate it, except for his friend who isn't on the side of the opposition.
Love you for being objective ❤❤❤❤
“You’re way to confident about the cookie thing” is a very funny thing for a person confidently declaring that it’s impossible to extract sugar from cookies to say. At least destiny is upfront about that he knows jack about chemistry.
The same could be said about the mental gymnastics used to even infer you can use cookies for rocket fuel you would need like 5 trucks of cookies to possibly get a small amount of sugar or you could just by buy pure sugar because it wasn’t even blocked to begin with if you know jack shit about chemistry, then please give an example that relates to how many cookies does it take to extract the amount need led for that chemical reaction to have efficacy?
@@amaruandujar not really. Destiny’s leap was that they were banned for sugar rocket reasons. Obviously wrong but he’s not wrong about sugar being both possible to use and having previously been used. And he’s also not wrong that you can extract it. His failure is assuming way too much charitability to israel. But he’s not basing that dumb conclusion on nothing.
Meanwhile, the other guy is basing his argument on essentially nothing. It doesn’t matter how many cookies you would need or that they could just use regular sugar, as it wasn’t blocked, because the crux of his argument was that you couldn’t extract the sugar, period. Otherwise he would have just said as such lmao. Also I don’t think destiny said anything about the other guys undue confidence, and my entire comment is about the guest’s hypocrisy.
@@amaruandujarI think you missed the point of the exchange.
Destiny was giving an example of WHY something as innocuous as cookies COULD be banned.
He wasn't claiming that is THE REASON for the restriction.
Just before that he said you could and should talk about what is blocked and why.
But he said it was pointless to have in that conversation because the other guy thinks the blockade SHOULDN'T exist.
Then everyone wanted to meme on cookie rockets and the main point was lost.
@@Toanleigh Yeah this. It is obvious people are sub 80 IQ failing to understand because they really want to get something on Destiny...lmao
@@Toanleigh he did, stop trying to revise history he said the cookies were banned because they can make rockets out of it because of the sugar i them. full stop
500 views in 24 min. Bro fell off
Maybe, but it's also the live/2nd channel.
@@DrownedLamp it’s a meme I’m just messing around lol
I generally agree w/ Loner’s points, but I don’t think he realizes how much more his argumentation sides w/ Bidar over Destiny. Omar not having the time to say that Israel technically had a white list instead of a black list & that the specific items they have arbitrarily banned have changed over time doesn’t make his point wrong or prove bias. Destiny STILL arguing that you can soak cookies in water to separate sugar that burns cleanly enough paired w/ an oxidizer to not only not blow up, but launch heavy missiles (not small PVC pipes, as you see on UA-cam) thousands of meters is much worse. He also completely mischaracterized the flotilla incident in that debate & went straight for ad hominem attacks when he knew he was losing. Just saying, Omar is maybe 20-30% wrong on this, but destiny is at least 70% wrong, so the 50-50 conflation for your buddy is a little disingenuous.
You're missing what they were arguing for during this debate. Omars point was that Israel was using this as a form of collective punishment. So Israel having a white list would eliminate that point that cookies were intentionally banned for the sole purpose of hurting the Palestinians. I honestly don't think the cookie thing matters at all and the fact that it's brought up is super reductive.
"Look I know you're mad about me beating and starving you.
But after *other* people found out I reluctantly stopped starving you!"
...
No one was getting starved bro. Just watch the video
Lonerbox is indeed right,
Israel's first goal is survival
And unfortunately, Israel sometimes uses punitive measures, but lonerbox is an intelligent person, so he could have provided better proof than the cookie story
...? he did? He listed several examples
Way to spin what he said to make it look like he supports those punitive measures lol
I just want the Gaza supporters to stick to good arguments instead of insane ones. The fact that they cannot is in itself an issue and worst they obfuscate reality. Israel isn't always in the right, but if you keep promoting a false victim narratives the real stories that are an issue never make it to the surface.
Sanctions are also punitive measures. Why shouldn't a country be allowed to embargo another hostile country? In the end it is the responsibility of a countries leadership to ensure the population is fed. Hamas responsibility for the punitive measures cannot be ignored
@@RonMi95 it's like you don't understand who has always ultimately had control of what and doesn't go into Gaza. Do you think Palestine is a state within Israel? There's a reason it's called Gaza and not Palestine. Hamas can do what they want, but if Israel decides aid isn't going into Gaza they can ensure it doesn't.
I loved the 22:53 "fluor, yeah, sugar, why not, beans, yeah, cookies... I hate gazan children... No, corn nyeah, lentils, meh, peas, yeah" 😂 cause this absurdity was what ficlt cawe to my mind when i started imagining what the extereme pro palestine people think is occuring and i found it humorous back then too :)
What about the opinions on food allowed is extreme 😂
Pro Israel people think if you support peace and equality that you are an antisemite and should be stripped of your career and future
Didn't address Destiny's ridiculous assertions that Hamas were extracting sugar from cookies. That's the issue with you partisans. So selective...
Everyone says he is a loser, a weekipedia warrior, a college dropout but this man, this genius has revolutionised the military industry. Cookie rockets are his gift to the world!
The allies of the Palestinians (like Baddar or Grim) are their biggest curse
this is a list that israel provided am i right?
so why isnt it also Egypt's fault to not contribute aid themselves if they were occupying gaza in the 60's . all of this implying that israel is the big bad guy when gaza shares a border with Egypt where the Egyptian population is mostly in favor of gazans struggle and aint really helping for the better of gazans , because they clearly smuggled guns and rockets within Egypt why didnt they snuggled biscuits within Egypt as well.
Egypt is also evil and was a literal dictatorship...
The point about Israeli ordinance being a source for current rockets is perfectly reasonable for this discussion. They're literally talking about the flow of materials used to make rockets and Grim mentions the primary source. His point is unbelievably obvious for anyone not looking to pick nits like a child: if you want to stop the flow of materials used to create rockets, then you should stop sending them materials they can use to build rockets.
The issue is that under normal circumstances those bombs would not be used.
The "ah ah ah by trying to defeat me you actually lose" position is insane and doesn't work outside of rhetoric. Pretty sure the Germans also made stuff out of crashed B-17s but does that mean the Allies had a moral responsability to just stop and shake hands?
@@ChucksSEADnDEAD but that "ah ah..." position wasn't Grimes' point. The conversation was literally: "they're stopping cookies" - "yes because cookie sugar is used to make rockets" - "so why not stop sending other rocket components?"
Lonerbox said the same thing with a different noun: "so why not ban straight sugar?"
Grimes point was that "banning sugar" = "stopping flow of rocket materials" = "stop bombing, thereby providing rocket parts".
There certainly is room for ADDITIONAL nuance to explore there, but people aren't able to unlatch their jaws to unleash a rainbow beam of cosmic profundity - they usually say one single thing at a time. And if they don't, and they try to attach too much nuance or preface to their point, they're rightfully accused of "gish-gallop".
Lonerbox is being, like many young edgelord historians, a pedantic both-sider. But his historical analysis by itself is unmatched, so I struggle through his silly semantic shenanigans for the glorious prize of knowledge.
@@jackpurvis the utter insanity of arguing about import restrictions on the basis of a conflict entering a phase of munitions usage is about on the level with debating the rudeness of entering someone's house with shoes on after we agreed that we'd settle our grudge by boxing in your living room.
The fact that it came down to us throwing hands sorta nullifies basic politeness.
If I don't want you to build bombs but it came to the point I have to use my own bombs... I don't care. I'm not gonna change my import rules because of an "ACKTHUALLY", I'm just gonna win the fight first. Then see what needs changing.
@@ChucksSEADnDEAD we've made no such agreement, I'll not box ANYONE if they insist on wearing shoes. We need to win the fight with baseball, beer, Milwaukee has a funny potatoes cannon with steel welding pylon upgrades!
Where's the soap yellow pumpkin man, this is a stepford banana Choamsky Tangier, not a Penguin yacht!
I feel like common sense tells you that's not how they are making the rockets.