It's not just with Mac. It's because the 20Gbps USB (3.2 Gen 2x2) Bridge from those external SSD and 40Gbps USB (4.0) port are not fully compatible. So when you plug 20Gbps-capable external SSD to 40Gbps-capable USB port, it will fall back to 10Gbps speed, which is theoretically 1250MB/s. The actual speed is then lower due to data overhead.
Whoa, this is excellent info, thank you! I'm a longtime mac user and could not figure out why some of the drives I've puchased, especially over the past few years, don't work as advertised. It also took me some time to figure out that cabling had to be rated to a codec equivalent to that of the devices you intend to connect. I now probably have enough cable to reach from here to Mars - no rocket required. Anyway, I'm so glad I just stumbled upon your channel, and I look forward to more of your videos. Cheers!
It was one of the biggest mistakes of the entire Computer Industry to fail with the “new” USB Standards naming. So chaotic with all the changes, so confusing with all the Name additiona and Generation numbers etc. The customers are confused and unsure.
Great video. I'm not worried about speed, I just want it to work. I use External HDD and SSD;s. As long as I can play my videos from the external drives, I'm good.
This is why with Apple Mac's you go with ThunderBolt standard external drives. This is why like you I also purchase the highest ThunderBolt cable I can because it is backward compatible with USB devices. Before ThunderBolt 5 it was the Cable Matters [Intel Certified] 40Gbps Active Thunderbolt 4 Cable 6.6 ft with 100W Charging and 8K Video - Fully Compatible with USB C/USB-C, USB 4 / USB4, and Thunderbolt 3. So if I need to purchase new cables it will now be the Cable Matters ThunderBolt 5 version.
Bought a Sandisk for my M1 Macbook Air not realizing that they came with just one cable that was usb-c to usb-a. So tried different usb-c to usb-c cables, none worked. Tried a hub, it was very slow and when tried to format it to APFS I would get an error message. Returned it and bought a Samsung T7 Shield, which has both cables, and worked just fine.
I've watched several videos around this topic and the answer is Thunderbolt. I have P3 NVMe SSDs but only get 900 Mbps on a cheap Orico enclosure. The crazy thing is that I have an old Windows desktop with two NVMe slots and I get full 3,500 Mbps on the NVMe drives in it - and that's for free. Apple could just add standard NVMe slots for storage and you could buy 4 TB for $250 and get screaming speeds. The thing is that a good Thunderbolt external enclosure runs about $200 and you might even have power and heating issues. I'm considering moving my NAS from my Mac Studio to my Windows desktop because it provides full speed of the drive and cooling isn't an issue as my system has a lot of large, slow fans and the system runs cool and quiet.
I learned of this a few years when I bought a new M1 mini. So I got the cheaper and larger San Disk on sale at Costco. I was not alone and they sold out fast. That model was also orange and black but had that same smaller hole in it. I guess to help differentiate them, they are now green and black. Back then, the faster Thunderbolt drives were too costly and I did not need the speed. I have not looked but, I imagine, they still cost the most. The implication in the video, but not mentioned? is that this drive type issue still remains the case Apple…
Yes this was the first test I tried back when I first learned about this. But the thunderbolt cable doesn’t affect speeds because the drives themselves don’t support thunderbolt so it rolls back to usb 3.2
And just looking at the animosity in these comments, this just illustrates the confusion that the manufacturers cause when they aren’t clear about the products they’re peddling served up without the full facts which results in misinformation.
The big problem with the new faster speeds are that many dont relize the CABLE makes a huge difference on what your max speed will be! Theres a reason the cable sellers have speed ratings on the web sites. Always make sure you use the high speed cable that came with the srive or one that is sold rated at the higher speeds.
The key modern drives that macs dont like are usb-4 /thunderbolt drives that switch between usb and thunderbolt. These occasipnally require unplug replug to benefit from the faster thunderbolt conection. The handshake needs to be just right. Some thunderbolt 4 drives actually run slow because they have dock chips, not drive chips and only provide one channel of pcie. Thunderbolt3. Is best not pluged into a hub.
This is a great video that taught me a subtlety that I wasn’t aware of regarding usb3.2. I have been tearing my hair out trying to figure out what combination of ssd, cable and enclosure to use for a new m4 Mac mini and now with this info I can eliminate a whole category of products reducing my chance of making the wrong purchase. Why on Earth it’s not generally made clearer that macs don’t support usb 3.2 is beyond me
Apple was slow to incorporate the faster protocols but try these same SSDs on the newer models and you’ll see some blazing results. Make sure you’re connected with some 40Gb/s cables as that’s often the bottleneck
Wow, I can forget about buying any 2000m/s portable SSD because I nearly bought one last week! I have been wondering if I need an external Thunderbolt 3 SSD. Thanks to your info, Thunderbolt has become the only option for me.
I have all of those drives and they work just fine for me, I edit 4K video no problem off them with a Mac Studio Max M2. Thunderbolt 4 driver are just too expensive still. I am going to build my SSD which might be faster than the standard Sandisk Extremes but still plenty enough. Good video though.
That could help on a case basis. I’ve experienced some drives get a slight bump but I’ve also experienced some drives slowing down after doing so. Always worth testing.
Those drives are ok though. Because It's the folks who economize with a base 256 GB hard drive on their macs. People who really need speed for work would have gotten 1 TB macs and bought the faster thunderbolt external drives.
For the most part this is true but there are those who may have to choose between getting less internal storage vs a thunderbolt drive and still need speed for work.
They'll definitely work. But they won't get the speed they expected. I know two people who got the 256GB option and then went with external. It's their first Mac for one. This has the potential to hurt the brand. When a drive works faster on a Windows PC the end user is going to think it's Apple's fault. I'd argue, it is. Of course consumers need to be informed, but Apple stuff is just supposed to work, and work well.
Great job! YES! USB is inherently ambiguous. And wow!, even on the m4mini they only support 3.1?.... ouch. Gee (intel), I guess I'll have to up my docking options.... Go big, or go home. Adam Savage dissected a Apple TB cable, revealing lots of tiny chips and circuits... s'pensive stuff, but great performance (=saving TIME).
That's why I choose NAS :D. I'm limited to 10Gbps, but at least I have 50TB of storage :D. I can upgrade to 25Gbps, but I do not need it for my 250Mbps codec. But other than that ... very useful info. Thx.
Clickbait title. Slower than the maximum advertised speeds does not mean the Mac doesn't like these drives. Yes, the maximum USB 3.2 gen 2 speed isn't achievable on a Mac because that protocol is not supported. Go with Thunderbolt if you need all the speed out of your external ssd. That being said, all these drives work perfectly well on any recent Mac.
@@rorobeckley My late 2012 Intel Mac Mini LOVES my Crucial 4TB SSD drive. But I do agree that with the new M-chip Macs, Thunderbolt is the way to go, and I will adapt to it when I eventually upgrade my computer.
@@rorobeckley If you say a Mac doesn't like something it implies it doesn't work properly. There are no issues with data corruption/data loss nor unexpected unmounting of the drive. The drives work great. Still clickbait.
I see where you’re coming from but still disagree. I’ve used these drives in a professional setting for years and work just fine. But them being limited to half of their potential is fundamentally wild 🤷🏽♂️
@rorobeckley no idea if changing my external Ssd's to Apple APFS had any play in it but my Samsung T7's get close to the 1,050 Read & the 1,000 write I also have a Samsung 970Evo Plus in an acasis Thunderbolt 4 enclosure getting close to 2,000/2,558 Read/Write. I expect varying degrees of results for everyone.
That definitely can help and is technically recommended if the drive will only be used on Mac. But I’ve also seen where the speeds drop after doing this so it can be a toss up. As for the speeds I agree they are theoretical to a point but the numbers can’t be drastically off and with no USB3.2 support that is unfortunately the case.
Correct they do support USB4 I never said they didn’t. I’m only referring to them not supporting USB 3.2 which is correct. When I show system settings in the video it displays Thunderbolt 4/USB4
@@rorobeckley But Macs *do* support USB 3.2 → specifically USB 3.2 Gen 1 (5 Gbps or 625 MB/s) and USB 3.2 Gen 2 (10 Gbps or 1,250 MB/s) → What Macs *do not* support is USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 (20 Gbps or 2,500 MB/s)? I think you were trying to say, "If you plug in a drive that supports USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 (20 Gbps), it will unfortunately fall back to USB 3.2 Gen 2 (10 Gbps) speeds." What is the solution? Buy a USB 3.2 Gen 2 if you're ok with 1,250 MB/s-or a USB 4 or Thunderbolt 3/4 drive if you want to reach 2,500 MB/s or above.
Yes the problem with that explanation is it will cause more confusion for Mac users as the Mac labels them as USB 3.1. So part of the larger issue is the out of control naming of each iteration. It shouldn’t have to be as confusing as it is.
It's not just with Mac. It's because the 20Gbps USB (3.2 Gen 2x2) Bridge from those external SSD and 40Gbps USB (4.0) port are not fully compatible. So when you plug 20Gbps-capable external SSD to 40Gbps-capable USB port, it will fall back to 10Gbps speed, which is theoretically 1250MB/s. The actual speed is then lower due to data overhead.
Whoa, this is excellent info, thank you! I'm a longtime mac user and could not figure out why some of the drives I've puchased, especially over the past few years, don't work as advertised. It also took me some time to figure out that cabling had to be rated to a codec equivalent to that of the devices you intend to connect. I now probably have enough cable to reach from here to Mars - no rocket required. Anyway, I'm so glad I just stumbled upon your channel, and I look forward to more of your videos. Cheers!
You are 100 % correct, I've learned this the hard way.
I think what you meant was USB3.2 Gen 2*2, that’s the 20gbps protocol. USB3.2 Gen2=USB3.1 Gen 2, and USB3.2 Gen 1=USB3.1 Gen 1=USB 3.0, damn USBIF!
Haha yes! But man that’s a crazy thing to try and explain 😖
It was one of the biggest mistakes of the entire Computer Industry to fail with the “new” USB Standards naming. So chaotic with all the changes, so confusing with all the Name additiona and Generation numbers etc.
The customers are confused and unsure.
Brand new subscriber here! I really like the way you present your stuff!
Appreciate it! Glad you enjoyed the video!
Great video. I'm not worried about speed, I just want it to work. I use External HDD and SSD;s. As long as I can play my videos from the external drives, I'm good.
This is why with Apple Mac's you go with ThunderBolt standard external drives. This is why like you I also purchase the highest ThunderBolt cable I can because it is backward compatible with USB devices. Before ThunderBolt 5 it was the Cable Matters [Intel Certified] 40Gbps Active Thunderbolt 4 Cable 6.6 ft with 100W Charging and 8K Video - Fully Compatible with USB C/USB-C, USB 4 / USB4, and Thunderbolt 3.
So if I need to purchase new cables it will now be the Cable Matters ThunderBolt 5 version.
Bought a Sandisk for my M1 Macbook Air not realizing that they came with just one cable that was usb-c to usb-a. So tried different usb-c to usb-c cables, none worked. Tried a hub, it was very slow and when tried to format it to APFS I would get an error message. Returned it and bought a Samsung T7 Shield, which has both cables, and worked just fine.
I've watched several videos around this topic and the answer is Thunderbolt. I have P3 NVMe SSDs but only get 900 Mbps on a cheap Orico enclosure. The crazy thing is that I have an old Windows desktop with two NVMe slots and I get full 3,500 Mbps on the NVMe drives in it - and that's for free. Apple could just add standard NVMe slots for storage and you could buy 4 TB for $250 and get screaming speeds. The thing is that a good Thunderbolt external enclosure runs about $200 and you might even have power and heating issues. I'm considering moving my NAS from my Mac Studio to my Windows desktop because it provides full speed of the drive and cooling isn't an issue as my system has a lot of large, slow fans and the system runs cool and quiet.
I learned of this a few years when I bought a new M1 mini. So I got the cheaper and larger San Disk on sale at Costco. I was not alone and they sold out fast. That model was also orange and black but had that same smaller hole in it. I guess to help differentiate them, they are now green and black. Back then, the faster Thunderbolt drives were too costly and I did not need the speed. I have not looked but, I imagine, they still cost the most.
The implication in the video, but not mentioned? is that this drive type issue still remains the case
Apple…
Have you tested them with a different cable,? A thunderbolt cable for example.
Yes this was the first test I tried back when I first learned about this. But the thunderbolt cable doesn’t affect speeds because the drives themselves don’t support thunderbolt so it rolls back to usb 3.2
Just built thunderbolt ssd with thunderbolt enclosure
@@ahmadafnan3756 Which case and which cable do you use? Would you recommend it to buy them?
And just looking at the animosity in these comments, this just illustrates the confusion that the manufacturers cause when they aren’t clear about the products they’re peddling served up without the full facts which results in misinformation.
This just helped me decide which ssd i shouldn't go for. Thanks, mate!
The big problem with the new faster speeds are that many dont relize the CABLE makes a huge difference on what your max speed will be! Theres a reason the cable sellers have speed ratings on the web sites. Always make sure you use the high speed cable that came with the srive or one that is sold rated at the higher speeds.
Agreed!
The key modern drives that macs dont like are usb-4 /thunderbolt drives that switch between usb and thunderbolt.
These occasipnally require unplug replug to benefit from the faster thunderbolt conection.
The handshake needs to be just right.
Some thunderbolt 4 drives actually run slow because they have dock chips, not drive chips and only provide one channel of pcie.
Thunderbolt3. Is best not pluged into a hub.
Really useful video especially easy for non tech oldie who just treated herself to new Mac mini for Christmas
Glad it was helpful and congrats on the new Mac mini!
This is a great video that taught me a subtlety that I wasn’t aware of regarding usb3.2. I have been tearing my hair out trying to figure out what combination of ssd, cable and enclosure to use for a new m4 Mac mini and now with this info I can eliminate a whole category of products reducing my chance of making the wrong purchase. Why on Earth it’s not generally made clearer that macs don’t support usb 3.2 is beyond me
Don’t get the Crucial X10 Pro, get the X9 Pro and save some money.
Subed, merry xmas and yeah I get it and its what I like about youtube! You find something out and this is the platform to share that wisdom!
Apple was slow to incorporate the faster protocols but try these same SSDs on the newer models and you’ll see some blazing results. Make sure you’re connected with some 40Gb/s cables as that’s often the bottleneck
Wow, I can forget about buying any 2000m/s portable SSD because I nearly bought one last week!
I have been wondering if I need an external Thunderbolt 3 SSD. Thanks to your info, Thunderbolt has become the only option for me.
I have all of those drives and they work just fine for me, I edit 4K video no problem off them with a Mac Studio Max M2. Thunderbolt 4 driver are just too expensive still. I am going to build my SSD which might be faster than the standard Sandisk Extremes but still plenty enough. Good video though.
Thanks Royce for all the information on drives and cables - Learned a lot - Liked and subscribed
Glad to help and appreciate the support!
How about reformatting those drives for APFS (Apple File system)? Would that help?
That could help on a case basis. I’ve experienced some drives get a slight bump but I’ve also experienced some drives slowing down after doing so. Always worth testing.
Superb video! Helpful information, factual, well presented ... nice dry sense of humour as well.
Much appreciated!
They will be slow also unless you have 512 sod on the Mac. The 256 standard is a bottle neck for Mac’s.
Those drives are ok though. Because It's the folks who economize with a base 256 GB hard drive on their macs. People who really need speed for work would have gotten 1 TB macs and bought the faster thunderbolt external drives.
For the most part this is true but there are those who may have to choose between getting less internal storage vs a thunderbolt drive and still need speed for work.
They'll definitely work. But they won't get the speed they expected. I know two people who got the 256GB option and then went with external. It's their first Mac for one. This has the potential to hurt the brand.
When a drive works faster on a Windows PC the end user is going to think it's Apple's fault. I'd argue, it is. Of course consumers need to be informed, but Apple stuff is just supposed to work, and work well.
Well reported and explained. It helps me to choose the right device for my music workstation.
Glad you found it helpful!
Thanks for the tip on using the about this Mac to help see what interface is being used.
No problem! It’s an overlooked feature for sure.
Great job! YES! USB is inherently ambiguous. And wow!, even on the m4mini they only support 3.1?.... ouch. Gee (intel), I guess I'll have to up my docking options.... Go big, or go home. Adam Savage dissected a Apple TB cable, revealing lots of tiny chips and circuits... s'pensive stuff, but great performance (=saving TIME).
Last time I checked, USB 3.2 gen 2x2 available only on some desktop PC. Windows laptops does not support gen 2x2 either.
Good to know. Thanks!
Really useful video, thanks for sharing this!
Glad I could help!
That's why I choose NAS :D. I'm limited to 10Gbps, but at least I have 50TB of storage :D. I can upgrade to 25Gbps, but I do not need it for my 250Mbps codec.
But other than that ... very useful info. Thx.
Excellent info, thanks.
No problem!
Thanks for a great video explanation.
No problem, glad it was helpful!
Helpful, thanks!
Glad it was helpful!
very useful. Thanks
Good video - clear explanation 👍😊
Glad it was helpful!
Clickbait title. Slower than the maximum advertised speeds does not mean the Mac doesn't like these drives. Yes, the maximum USB 3.2 gen 2 speed isn't achievable on a Mac because that protocol is not supported. Go with Thunderbolt if you need all the speed out of your external ssd. That being said, all these drives work perfectly well on any recent Mac.
Yes but their main selling point is not supported so I would disagree with the click bait. Macs may tolerate them but they clearly don’t like them…
This is not clickbait.
@@rorobeckley My late 2012 Intel Mac Mini LOVES my Crucial 4TB SSD drive. But I do agree that with the new M-chip Macs, Thunderbolt is the way to go, and I will adapt to it when I eventually upgrade my computer.
@@rorobeckley If you say a Mac doesn't like something it implies it doesn't work properly. There are no issues with data corruption/data loss nor unexpected unmounting of the drive. The drives work great. Still clickbait.
I see where you’re coming from but still disagree. I’ve used these drives in a professional setting for years and work just fine. But them being limited to half of their potential is fundamentally wild 🤷🏽♂️
All these drives work perfectly well for me and have done so for as long as I have been using them with both intel and M1/M2 Macs!!!
So using them with both Macs prevent the loss of transfer speed?
Welp no ish sherlock the Read/Write Speeds are Theoretical but they Go very very very close.. Whether on windows or Mac
But the problem is they weren’t close…
@rorobeckley no idea if changing my external Ssd's to Apple APFS had any play in it but my Samsung T7's get close to the 1,050 Read & the 1,000 write I also have a Samsung 970Evo Plus in an acasis Thunderbolt 4 enclosure getting close to 2,000/2,558 Read/Write.
I expect varying degrees of results for everyone.
@rorobeckley regarding the speeds it's like a known secret that they're Theoretical but I guess staring that would suck for marketing 😂
That definitely can help and is technically recommended if the drive will only be used on Mac. But I’ve also seen where the speeds drop after doing this so it can be a toss up. As for the speeds I agree they are theoretical to a point but the numbers can’t be drastically off and with no USB3.2 support that is unfortunately the case.
What a bunch of trolls in these comments. That was great video. Very informative. Thanks!
Appreciate it! The trolls keep the engagement up so can’t complain lol
My M4 Mac Mini has USB 4 ports, so…..
The Mac Mini Pro has USB4 so saying Mac’s only support USB3 and not 3.2 is not correct.
Correct they do support USB4 I never said they didn’t. I’m only referring to them not supporting USB 3.2 which is correct. When I show system settings in the video it displays Thunderbolt 4/USB4
@@rorobeckley But Macs *do* support USB 3.2 → specifically USB 3.2 Gen 1 (5 Gbps or 625 MB/s) and USB 3.2 Gen 2 (10 Gbps or 1,250 MB/s) → What Macs *do not* support is USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 (20 Gbps or 2,500 MB/s)? I think you were trying to say, "If you plug in a drive that supports USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 (20 Gbps), it will unfortunately fall back to USB 3.2 Gen 2 (10 Gbps) speeds." What is the solution? Buy a USB 3.2 Gen 2 if you're ok with 1,250 MB/s-or a USB 4 or Thunderbolt 3/4 drive if you want to reach 2,500 MB/s or above.
Yes the problem with that explanation is it will cause more confusion for Mac users as the Mac labels them as USB 3.1. So part of the larger issue is the out of control naming of each iteration. It shouldn’t have to be as confusing as it is.