I always love the head cannon interpretation that a large part of the reason for Voldemort’s fall to darkness and evil is the idea that because he is born under the effects of a love potion he is unable to feel the emotion of love; as a result he cannot feel empathy or other related emotions like guilt for a friend passed away
@@alexandermckenzie-robinson3653 yeah I’m not sure about the last part but if I remember correctly the inability to experience love is a result of his conception
Narcissa might have been skilled at Occlumency, but i honestly think that fear betrayed Voldemort as he was so afraid that he had failed again to kill Harry that he did not actively used Legilimens around his followers, following when Harry had collapssed, remember that Voldemort also had collapsed and probably felt either some sort of pain or weakening within himself and this fear had such a strong hold of him and he was so desperate to be relieved of that fear that when he heard the words, he did not want to find out if she was lying, he had heard what he had wanted to hear and was ''happy'' about that.
I agree also. He had just had a piece of his soul destroyed. I think after he was in a weakened state and that's why he relied on someone to confirm Harry's death instead of just blasting him with Crucio to make sure.
@@unholyiiamas Funny thing, in the books he did just that after he was declared dead by narcissa, to show his power he started to toss Harrys body around while using the crucio curse and it took all of Harrys will and might to not show any sign of pain and allow himself to be tossed around like that.
Can you imagine if he simply didn’t want to believe her or she slipped up out of fear and he was able to read her mind and see that she lied and that he was still alive? She would have suffered the worst death out of everyone in the series. And Mr potter would have died immediately right next to her. I wish that the next Dark Lord is similar but yet a different version of the outcome. Like I want the next dark Lord to actually end up winning, and killing his enemy, and then completely ruling over hog warts and the wizarding world, then go further and start to take control over the real world outside of the hidden wizard world for a time and time and a half, so that we could see the world out of the perspective of the evil one this time, just for the rise of the good wizards and witches to make a come back and arise again, and maybe even team up with the military in the real world to take back control against the dark lord, and then the ultimate outcome becomes that the real world governments and the wizarding governments team up, and there is a full blown world war against the evil dark lord, and then the dark Lord and all his power over everyone, and all of his people. To the point that the world nearly ends, and the dark Lord nearly wins full control over the entire world in such a way dictatorship, and maybe even having Harry Potter die in this series along with Ron Weasley. But hermonie survived and her and her family ends up taking back full control with her intelligence and the the end of it all is hermonie beating the next dark Lord being the ultimate and most hated enemy of the pure bloods being a muggle. And then the good guys make a huge come back and win again, ultimately destroying all darkness and evilness, ending the entire series with multiple unexpected deaths, much sadness and pain and blood and death and war. But ultimately the evilness has lost this time for good. 😊😅
And maybe even having a couple of people go insane and they end up being neither good or bad witches and wizards, like they end up being some sort of Marauder or bounty Hunter, taking revenge of their families which has suffered. And the dark Lord straight up exposing the magic world to the real world. Such as Neville long bottom turning insane after finding out that his son and wife face the same fate as his parents, so he goes insane killing anyone that gets in his way to fine the death eaters that did this to him once again, even if he has to kill teachers or students to get to them, and his focus is not on the dark Lord but simply in the focus on the death eaters that tortured his wife and son, killing everyone and everything in his path to the point that Harry and Ron before they died in the hands of the dark Lord could no longer save Neville, and they end up dueling or something, and ultimately they let Neville lose his mind to kill the death eaters, for they simply deserve it. It would be so insane to see that Harry Potter and Ron dying in this series, seeing Neville go insane, seeing the dark Lord win and have victory not only over the magic world, but the real world too dictating the entire world and eliminating half bloods and muggles, just to see hermonie end up dueling and killing the dark Lord Himself as being the ultimate enemy to the pure bloods being a muggle. I would pay hundreds to see such things unfold. And hermonie and everyone else who saw Harry Potter win the previous series, especially hermonie being completely heart broken seeing the people she grew up with die in such gruesome ways.
Narcissa is an interesting character As I recall she was not a death eater. Even though her husband and son were. So she did not have that tattoo that connected to the Dark Lord. She was seemingly aloof. She didn't care one way or the other about Harry. The other Voldemort devotees cared about him. Curiously she didn't seem as fearful of him, like the others. She also despised Voldemort for charging Draco with the task of killing Dumbledore. And Draco ends up with his mother's wand after Harry disarmed him, but did not kill him. I thought it was interesting that Voldemort would ask her to check the body.
Narcissa was never a Death Eater, nor was she devoted to Voldemort, she was devoted to her husband and went along with Lucius. When Voldemort sent her son Draco on what she considered a suicide mission she became his enemy.
Yup, don't know where he came up with that part. She was never shown in the books doing or having anything to do with any of the Death Eaters and their acts.
Moreover, in the episode where Narcissa asks Snape to protect her son, I think JKR put both sisters there to show the actual devotee, Bellatrix, and how Narcissa was nothing like her.
What was Narcissa *feeling* when she lied to Voldemort. Intense relief that her son was still alive. Voldemort may have misunderstood the reason for that feeling as he was likely feeling it himself in the belief he'd finally won.
I think it was a perfect storm. She told him what he had most wanted to hear for over 17 years, that the danger to his precious existence had finally been eliminated. What's more, we see how he was suffering in limbo while Harry was talking to Dumbledore. Even if he wasn't aware of his surroundings as Harry was, I'm sure he felt and remembered that pain afterwards, when they both woke up again. In addition, he felt fear and shame for having failed again in front of his followers, which was unbearable for him. Her answer relieved him of these undesirable feelings. Finally, even if he had the strength of mind and emotion to suspect her and try to read her mind, the love and dread she felt for her son acted like Harry's sorrow for Sirius did when Voldmort tried to possess him at the Ministry of Magic, repelling him immediately.
Maybe many factors at play. One could be that Voldemort was weak after being affected by Harry's brief time in limbo. Also Narcisa could have put a lot of effort into her Occlumancy so Voldemort wouldn't reach her thoughts. And yeah, the motherly love that played a crucial part. Maybe activating a protective charm. Who knows.
Didn't "killing Harry" also hurt Voldemort? I think they said that Voldemort even fell unconscious for a second when he killed Harry and it shocked everyone. Voldemort may not have been in a state to check to see if Harry was alive since a piece of his soul was just destroyed that hurt him that badly. And Narcissa is a pure blood witch from a long line, I'm willing to bet she was powerful enough to at least repel a weakened Voldemort from reading her mind if he even cared enough to, while incompetent, the Malfoy's were at least always loyal, well until they just bailed at the last moment lol.
Narsissa strikes me as this quietly skillfull person. And I think she tries to survive in a den of snakes, rather than actually being that evil on her own. Her being skilled at occlumancy makes perfect sense I bellieve. Particularly if its boosted by like, maturnal love-magic.
@m.c1689 even though jk says the cursed child is cannon it doesn’t stick to HP cannon.why would Voldemort want an heir especially since he thought he would live forever
I think it's a mix of maternal love that protected Harry here once again. And then also, because there were so many witches and wizards there in the forest that night that it might have been harder for V to figure out whose feelings and thoughts were whose. Plus I think that Legilimency works a lot like feeling reading, and V would have read first hesitation and fear (V: Is Harry Potter dead? N: Is my son still alive?) and then relief, jubilation and determination (V: we conquered! Harry Potter defeated! N: I'll get to see my son again!). Their goals were completely different at that point and because V doesn't understand love, he probably didn't even think that Narcissa's concern and love for her son could be a possible interpretation of what he read.
I disagree that Narcissa wouldn't have been a strong occlumens. Draco was good enough at it to block Snape, and Snape guessed he learned it from Bellatrix. Whoever in his family he learned it from, it seems well established his family was really good at occlumency. Although the fact that Snape didn't guess he learned it from Narcissa may support that she wasn't good enough to teach it. But that also could be that Narcissa wasn't a deatheater.
Her decision to lie had nothing to do with Harry saying Draco was alive. Telling the truth would have gotten Harry killed, and she didn't have the stomach to see a boy who was her own son's age die. Narcissa may have had a death eater husband but she wasn't a freaking monster.
I think another video needs to be done to explain what would happen if she told the truth. From what I can see, they just would've killed Harry again and still taken his body to Hogwarts. Narcissa's reason to lie couldn't have been just to see Draco again. No matter what, that was going to happen anyway. It seems more likely that she either wanted to return a favor to Harry for the info or had an underlying reason to protect Harry.
Imagine she _had_ said: " The boy is alive." *tumbleweed blows past* non-descriptive or background wizard/witch: " ... don't worry, V, happens to the best of us" *background coughs*
I have grown to the concept of "ancient" magic over time now. Just compare it to instinctive magic for example. Harry did various things instinctively in his youth, even without knowing about his magical abilities. Many of these things happened because of various spontaneous emotions, like fear or anger. And now imagine a feeling.. like the undying love of a mother and the will to protect her child.. in such a situation. No wonder voldemort imploded instantly on touching harry.
The Black family were fanatical. They likely expected their kin to study advanced magic. Sirius is believed to be a skilled occulmens. How Sirius sneaks around so easily and why the Wizengamot didn't learn the truth when they interrogated him. It wouldn't surprise me if his cousin was too. It would give deeper context for Bella and Cissa making Snape swear an Unbreakable Vow. When they tried to get a read on him and were blocked, they knew there was only one way to trust him. I always kind of expected Snape was as skilled with it out of being constantly surrounded by people who could read his mind.
I believe that Narcissa was able to deceive him by the power of love combined with ocumency and the fact that Voldemort's soul was weakened by all the destroyed horcruxes. So there was no way he was going to be full of power to be able to find out whether Harry was alive or dead.
Dropped a like of course is very interesting. How yet again love is the thing that catches Voldemort off guard. He never guessed that one of his loyal subjects would betray him over love of one of their family members to see if they were safe. Just like he never guessed that snape would go to Dumbledore since Voldemort said he was going to kill all the potters So Snape went to Dumbledore to plead for Lily's life. An act of love that Voldemort could not predict Lily herself sacrificing herself for Harry for the protective love charm. An act of love that Voldemort could not predict. He never seems to learn from this mistake
I think the reason she was able to lie to him as well as cuz Voldemort was so caught up in his victory that he just wanted to believe that he had one and that it was over so he chose to believe her lie as well as her love for malfoy just being something that he can't comprehend I think has something to do with it as well shielding her mind from his
I believe it was a combination of Narcissa's maternal instinct triggering ancient magic and Voldemort's arrogance that allowed her to successfully lie about Harry being dead. At that point, the conflict no longer mattered to her, and all she cared about was her son and was still resentful of the dark lord charging Draco with killing Dumbledore. Further, Voldemort wanted to believe that Harry was dead.
Once it came down to it, Narcissa was as much a bad ass as Molly. She lied to Voldy and got away with it!!! Thought she loathed Harry, she still understood that the only way to get to her son was through Harry. And she did what she did out of a mother's love....very much like Lily and Molly. It was well established that it was near impossible to lie to Voldy, but she did it, and did it well. In the end, she was a total badass.
The series mentions several times that Voldemort doesn’t understand love or the magic surrounding his connection with Harry. The prophecy implies it and Dumbledore lays it out clearly in OOTP. Voldemort himself admits it to his Death Eaters during his restoration in the graveyard, when he mentions that maternal love was ’old magic’ that he should have remembered. (Incidentally, Diary Voldemort also forgets that phoenix tears have healing properties.) After everything, he needed to believe that he had finally fulfilled the prophecy and become the strongest wizard and the only true immortal being. Since, you know, Harry was relatively always so casually immune to death: mother’s love x2, phoenix tears, Dumbledore at the quidditch match, time turner, priori incantatem, and so on.
I always assumed this was because Voldemort was stunned from the Harrycrux was just destroyed, and Voldemort's ability to detect lies was greatly diminished.
I think she knew her family was in the doghouse. Her husband and sister had failed to many times and if Voldy won they would be in an even worse position having absolutely no more purpose. Even as meat shields. The why was self/family preservation. The how? Bellatrix taught Draco to shield his mind. She probably her sister too.
I think it makes total sense that the death eaters and their spousers became occlumens when he was gone for those twelve years. They probably knew he would come back.
That's funny how we both kind of came to the similar conclusion before I finished the end of the video, which I just did 👍 I definitely agree that her active love to try and see if Malfoy was okay. Might have been an act of love that prevented Voldemort to be deceived
Yes. I agree. I guess, Voldemort just heard what he wanted to hear. It was a great oversight, but he got so increasingly frustrated over the course of the Deathly Hallows, that he just wanted an easy win and didn't question it. If anything he only got more and more frustrated why it took Narcissa so long to confirm his death. Edit: However with JK Rowlings comment on the moment, that would make the last theory the most likely. Maybe not necessarily ancient magic, but at least she would have been able to pull of occlumency because of her maternal love. Maybe it's a mix of all of these theories.
In this you say that in the books she's been portrayed as a loyal follower of Voldemort. I don't recall that at all. She was hardly in the books and when she was, it wasn't in scenes that were showing anything to do with working for or with Voldemort as a death eater.
Please, where can I find this beautiful Background music? I am sure it is a royalty-free version of "Lily's Theme" but for real. Where can I find it? Perfect meditation music ❤
Molly Weasley defeated Bellatrix because she was a strong witch and very focused on protecting her children. Nothing old magic or mystical about it. She's related to the Black family and to Bellatrix as well so that shows she has a family history of strong witches and wizards in her blood.
In that moment and duel in the forest, ancient magic was re-performed by Harry and Narcissa was a collaborator/instrument in it. That's the beauty of "the close".
4:50 "She realized there was a very good chance the good guys would prevail" Do you hear from what perspective you are talking here? Do you think Narcissa would think of herself as one of the 'bad guys'? We have never seen any sign she thinks this is the case, so more likely, although she does believe in her group's cause, she doesn't believe anymore in the person leading it. 'Bad guys', like terrorists and the such, like to think of themselves as rebels or fighters for freedom, etc.
I absolutely think narcissa could have been a great occlumens as I believe Bellatrix was, at least in the books. I believe HBP has Bellatrix teaching Draco how to shield his mind from Snape, and she'd have to be pretty good to teach someone how to resist Snape occulency.
Another great video, Dean! I am not sure you have covered this, but could Harry's sacrifice be similiar to his mother's? He did so voluntarily. He had a choice on if he should go. Lastly, it was based on his LOVE for his friends. Curious on your thoughts.
Actually the book mentioned this… “Your spells are no longer binding, Tom. You can’t hurt them. I did what my mother did.” - Harry (something along those lines)
There is one other way, though its more a mental and emotional feat. She could have, even for a moment, convinced herself that he truly was dead, in every way that Voldemort would have perceived passively. I.E. self delusion. For her to exist in such an oppressive environment as the one she found herself in, after luscious fell from favor; she would need to possess a certain degree of an ability to believably lie to herself. "Its ok, everything will be fine, draco will be fine, Severace promised he would. Well find a way to get through this." Even if part of herself knew that it was a lie, at least for a few moments during the worst of it, in trying to be strong; she could have to been able to convince herself he was dead on a somewhat emotional level. When she knew he was alive, but needed to be convincing that he was now dead; perhaps she told herself he was. Told herself that he was, shut out all doubt that he was not dead. Only if for a moment. Long enough to tell Voldemort that it was so. And for him to believe her, because for that moment, she believed it as well. After all, she had been loyal to that point, even if she had the occasional doubt. So he wouldn't have been all that suspicious of her; even if his arrogance wasn't clouding his own perception. So it wouldn't take all that long of staying in that state to be convincing. Especially after so long lying to herself that things were alright. All durring that long year. Then all she would have to do, is tie her thoughts up into only worrying about Draco. So that if he did passively look into her emotions, and thoughts; all he would see is a devoted mother. All do to an emotion he didn't ever understand. He might think her weak, and yet think no more about it. After all he had a triumph to gloat about. As with all the best liars, if they want convince others that their lies are true, first they have to convince themselves. A simple trick given the horrible circomstances. A survival skill. Narcissa was anything but simple or weak. She was complicated.
Voldemort could have just been weary after having a piece of his soul destroyed. We saw that him casting Avada Kedevra on Harry knocked him down, and maybe even caused him to black out for a few seconds. He likely wasn't in top form, allowing Narcissa to keep her thoughts hidden. Also, Voldemort doesn't understand love. He knew the Malfoys were desperate to get back on his good side and thought they'd do anything to gain his favor, and so overlooked the possibility of Narcissa lying to him for her son.
I believe it's something so much more simple. And was even explained in the books. When Harry took occlumency lessons with Snape. Snape said it has a lot to do with eye contact in the book which is way more cannon than the movies it never said Narcissa turned and spoke to voldemort it just said she said that he is dead. If there was no eye contact voldemort could not use his powers of legilimence
Yes, I think it is because of Narcissa's love for her son. It all goes back to what Harry said to Voldemort during their last encounter, regarding his old Potions Master: "Snape was Dumbledore's... from the moment you started hunting down my mother. And you never realised it because of the thing you can't understand." Yes, Snape was an Occlumens, but when, as Voldemort reveals in his answer to the above, Snape told him there were "other women and of purer blood worthier of him" it simply didn't occur to him that such a thing could be untrue, so he didn't put extra effort in trying (literally) to see through it. In a similar way, Narcissa- Occlumens or not- was motivated by love for her son. Voldemort did have the sense to call Lucius's bluff when he asked Voldemort to end the fight at Hogwarts lest Harry were killed accidentally, understanding that he really just wanted to go and find Draco- but that's because he made the mistake of mentioning him immediately prior. Narcissa was easier to overlook and she was also subtler in her approach. Voldemort- half-dazed, no doubt, from having destroyed part of his own soul in Harry's body- could not entertain the possibility that a mother might risk everything to get near her son, so he didn't (and perhaps couldn't) attempt to penetrate the lie of Harry's death. It's like if someone described an elephant to you and you'd never seen one. You can't say for certain that their description is inaccurate if your mind can't picture an alternative, so you might as well believe them. Voldemort has never felt love, so he can't fathom people's motives for acting upon it and this led him to believe Narcissa.
I do actually think it does make sense to assume she might have been skilled at Occlumency; her sister Bellatrix was skilled at it too I believe and their niece Tonks was also known to be skilled. I think we can assume fairly certainly that she would be training it knowing that she is often in the presence of one of the strongest, darkest, and most dangerous legilimens. She strikes me as a very cunning and intelligent person unlike her husband, she would be capable of forming such "mental defences". If you think about it, she did do things behind Voldemort's back like the unbreakable vow, she would need to be able to hide that from Voldemort. Finally, Rest in Peace Helen McCrory, who portrayed Narcissa Malfoy so wonderfully
Another way that she could have lied is that he might have sensed her happiness that Draco was still alive and mistook it for happiness that Harry was dead. Combined with his deep desire to believe that Harry was dead, would assume that such happiness had to be for his success.
Another explanation as to the 'how'. In the books, Voldemort flings Harry's 'dead' body about a bit in triumph, Harry has to remain limp and not cry out in pain at any point else he will give himself away... This is done in front of a sobbing Hagrid so by that point Voldemort would be pretty certain that Harry was dead even if he doubted Narcissa in any way.
I've often wondered if she knew who Harry was when he was brought to Malfoy Manor. I know she knew who Ron and Hermione were, since she saw them at Diagon Alley not long back with Harry. Also, she was never mean toward Harry and his friends, like her son was. After Draco lied about Harry, he stood with his mother, and after the trio's escape, the Malfoys witnessed Vodermorts wrath after killing another Goblin, where he then began striking down his followers at their manor. The book said that the Malfoys pushed people out of the way to flee his wrath. The above all occurred before the battle, and my guess was that when it happened, her main priority was to find her son and leave. Draco was just foolish enough to stay behind, thinking that he could best Harry and retrieve his wand. After the battle, and in the Great Hall, the three Malfoys were found setting together at one of the tables. I don't think Narcissa was as bad as some make her out to be. She was married to Lucius, and it looked as if that was very strained in the movie. All the Blacks of that age, besides Bellatrix, ended up helping Harry in some form along the way.
She could have felt severus snape's death because of unbreakable vow that had broken, and this got her enough motivation to turn back from failed(Harry was still alive) lord. For Voldemort there was no time to doubt. he was desperate, dizzy and shocked because of the Horcrux that had lost.
As people have said before, Bellatrix is an extremely powerful occlumens, so it would make sense that Narcissa was too, but she didn't lie to Voldemort because of her power in occllumency, she did it because her intentions during the final night of the war were entirely driven by her love for her family, especially Draco. If Voldemort went into her mind, he wouldn't be able to understand it, he wouldn't even be interested in searching anything remotely related to love, he doesn't feel the need to look that way so he would never find out
It is possible that Dumbledore and Snape decided if Harry survived in the end to teach Narcissa in master Occlumency to make sure that her family is save if she needs to lie someday to Voldemort I think Snape warned her for Voldemort
Could it be that the protection that Lily gave to Harry that lives in his blood also help block the Dark Lord from getting the truth from Narcissa or that it recognized the same kind of Motherly love and help block the Dark Lord? After all the Dark Lord did once said it was Old magic something he should have foreseen, and yet he still underestimate its' power
From the book series "The Sword of Truth" The Wizard's First Rule. "People are stupid. They can be made to believe any lie because either they want to believe it's true or because they are afraid it's true"
I think its even more simple than the 'mothers love' though that theory has been given creedence. Voldemort wouldnt necessarily be expecting anything other than for harry to be dead, he believes by this point he has taken all necessary steps to ensure harrys death, so he is less likely to doubt what he is told because hes expecting it. While the malfoys have been hapless their loyalty isn't seriously in question so hes not likely to doubt narcissa will tell the truth. Couple these two things with the excitement, elation and no doubt preoccupation with the battle i think its entirely plausible voldemort simply didnt use his abilitites in this instance. I also dont doubt that the fact that the life of her and her family depended on the lie being believable, it wouldnt ve surprising if narcissa was impossible to read in that moment
There are several factors that I can see. First of all, many spells are less effective if you don’t have eye contact, so if Voldemort did not have direct eye contact she could probably get by a little easier. Second, most likely each death eater who escaped Azkaban had some experience with occlumancy. Third, Voldemort probably really wanted the death to be true, so there was probably a little bit of self deception. And fourth, Voldemort does not comprehend love, so the only thing that he could imagine that she could be happy about would be the death of Harry Potter, not the chance to rescue her own son. I imagine that he more was reading her feelings than thoughts as she said what he hoped to hear, and, seeing no other reason for her reaction to the corpse of Harry Potter, accepted that he had been successful.
Draco lied about "knowing" that Harry was Harry to Bellatrix too 🤔 ... Voldemort could have read them both !! Had Snape taught them occlumens? Snape SWORE to protect them maybe something also occurred with the "unbreakable vow". Combined with maternal love, Snape's love for Lilly, is what drives him to protect Harry, and thus Draco. Its all intertwined very delicately.
At one point, Draco was the rightful owner of the elder wand. If Narcissa knew that, she would fear Voldemort. If I were rewriting the story, I would have her use a spell to make him look dead. I would also give her a wasp that would land on Hagrid's ear and tell him to cover Harry in the invisibility cloak. It would then land on Harry's ear and explain the situation to him. It would then sting Harry to wake him up. Harry would stun Narcissa so that Voldemort could not ask her any questions.
Draco learned Occlumency from his Aunt, Bellatrix Lestrange. I think it's perfectly reasonable that Narcissa, as Bellatrix's sister, was also proficient at Occlumency herself. But maybe Bellatrix was a little better so she let Bellatrix teach Draco.
I don't think this has anything to do with magic at all. This is just down to Riddle hearing what he wanted/expected and his massive ego. Tom knew Snape was a slippery sort, so Snape always needed to have his defences up. But Narcissa is not someone he takes overly seriously. Tom also wouldn't for one moment think that she'd put Draco before him, he is the center of the universe afterall. Essentially, his guard was down, he wasn't focused on her truthfulness, and he was all puffed up in his moment of victory.
I’ve always thought that it was clear occlumency, but amplified by ancient magic. I think she made Voldemort “see” her touch a motionless and cold body that was left breathless. Under normal circumstances, I don’t believe she would be powerful enough to pull off such a feat, but in that moment her drive to get to her son was more powerful than anything Voldemort could comprehend. Similarly, under normal circumstances a muggle is not capable of dead lifting a large tree, but if that tree fell on top of your child, moving it would be as easy as tossing a twig. You could almost say that the combination of ancient magic and maternal love is thee most powerful magic because it is fueled by the adrenaline of the purest form of the hearts deepest desires.
Actually, it isn't a matter of which one is best, most effective, or even factual. Because once again, we have a situation that is nuanced where all things feed together and produce one outcome. In other words it isn't A, B, C, or, D. It is E, all of the above.
Thwe first two explanations (Occlumency and Voldemort's arrogance), the obvious ones, have never fully convinced me. I am absolutely fascinated by the third, I will definitely go and check out more about Ancient Magic- is it something that dates back to a time when there was no clear border between Magic people and Muggles, maybe? A time when magic was just part of humans and nature, before humankind unconsciously rejected/outgrew/lost a part of its nature?
I think that why Voldemort couldn't detect that Narcissa was lying is because it was a act of love a act to protect her son and Voldemort of course cant feel love so he didn't know and i also think harry explaines in the final duel that why he didn't know snape was unloyal was because he did it for lily and therefor love and he didn't understand love and therefore didnt know about snapes betrayal because it was a act of love
I don't think it's so weird to think that Narcissa may have been skilled at Occlumency, given that her own sister Bellatrix was. After all, Bellatrix taught Draco occlumency.
I think you may have missed one. Voldemort himself fell and was out of sorts as a result of the killing curse. He may have been a bit off his game as a result. For this reason, I would shy away from the arrogance theory. The fact that he found it necessary to ask whether Harry was actually dead suggests some level of suspicion that all had not gone to plan. True, his arrogance recovered quickly as he quickly went to torture and brag--but he was not immediately arrogant after the curse. My vote would be that she got away with it because it was what he wanted to happen and he wasn't on his game enough (this would have been the third time that his killing curse failed to kill Harry and was the second to at least knock him down) to suspect or detect Narcissa's lie.
The most simple answer, she used occlumens. She is a member of the house of black, a family of powerful purebreds. There is no way she WASNT taught that ability at a young age. She may not be a heavy hitter like voldemort or snape, but it was enough to keep put a victory addled voldemort
Harry was fully possessed by Voldemort during the Duel in the Ministry Atrium, hoping that Dumbledore would kill the boy in an attempt to destroy Voldemort himself, but Harry's heart, full of grief over the death of his godfather Sirius Black, became too overwhelming to bear and he was able to force Voldemort out of his mind, as Voldemort did not understand the concept of love. Not just a mothers love. But any strong love. That's also HOW snape has always been able to keep Voldemort out, his love for Lilly. And yes, the magic of emotions is a form of ancient magic (according to hogwarts legacy).
Listening to the first part of the video sorta sparked a random theory in my head and I wonder if there's any pieces that can be connected... What happened to Harry at the end, specifically his soul being whole and that he was still "anchored" to the world of the living, and it's similarities to "creating Horcruxes". To me, it feels like "creating Horcruxes" could be a failed attempt (or inferior version) of what happened to Harry, Being anchored to the living world without ripping the soul to pieces. Would there be enough information to see if they stem from the same type of magic? For example if it's a form of Ancient magic that was duplicated by Dark magic or something....
I wanna know why the elder wand did not switch allegiances to Voldy when he killed him. Albus himself says that Harry has died so how does this not count as a win? Especially when the wand is fickle enough to switch owners when Harry grabs Malfoy's wand.
I always put it down to the fact that he had just killed a piece of his own soul. I can't remember if it's in the books, but in the film he's collapsed on the floor after he uses the killing curse. So it would make sense to me that he is not 100% around this time and this plus his arrogance allows her to lie to him effectively. What I never understood, is how Harry stayed alive (and well) all the way back to the castle. He's the one that "beat" the dark lord as a baby, surely some of the death eaters and Voldemort himself would want to kick and disrespect his body a little. Or drag him to the castle by rope. Instead they give him to Hagrid to hold gently until they get to the castle.
To add to this theory, I feel that by this time only 12.5% of Voldemort was alive and it did not have the same powers that it once has as Tom Riddle/Voldermort. Yes he was a great duelist and he had changed a prophecy at that point that he was way more overconfident that the remaining 1/8th soul wasn't conscious enough to perform leglimens
ok, so my theory is that because you stated (sorry my memory is fuzzy on the exact video) that Harry and voldemort were rendered unconscious when voldemort hit Harry with the killing curse, he was too discombobulated to look into Narcisse's mind
The main question here should be - why did Voldemort asked Narcissa instead of, say Bellatrix, who was practically in love with Voldemort (just remember how Harry describes Bellatrix's voice after coming back from the limbo). Even without Bellatrix, there were a bunch of other deatheaters who would've revealed the truth. So why did Voldemort asked the very person who's suppose to betray him the most? I see a possible plothole.
The most illogical part of this part of the story is that Voldemort, an extremely intelligent individual, is curiously incurious about Harry just standing there, waiting to be killed. He knew by this time that Harry was a fighter. He should have been very suspicious about this sudden capitulation to death. I would have had Voldemort start to get suspicious as to why Harry was just standing there, then have Harry see Voldemort become suspicious, and suddenly grab his wand to provoke Voldemort into attacking him. It would make Harry much more proactive in causing Voldemort to make a fatal mistake.
This happened after Harry had come back from the dead. None of the spells that Voldemort and his followers cast would stick to those who defended Hogwarts. Another example of sacrificial love at work.
The one thing you mis here: If Voldemort is so good in reading minds, how was it that he couldn't with Harry if he were alive as we already know, Harry isn't great at blocking his mind. How can he not sense Harry is alive? In order to read a mind you have to sense it too.
I feel like he didn’t know because of all of his horcrux’s being destroyed by that point, making him too weak to really use his power how he would like to.
Actually the only one who claimed Voldemort to be the greatest Occlemency of all time was Voldemort. After all, he had no idea that Harry was seeing his thoughts in dreams. He had no idea Snape was in love with Lilly. Voldemort secretly was afraid of SNAPE because he could never tell what was going on with SNAPE. Why else did he not know, SNAPE hated him and actually cared a great deal for Lilly's child, that should have been his. HE cried when he found out she was dead, and protected Harry until Haggrid got there to take him to the Dursleys. Also, thats why Haggrid knew SNAPE was never a threat in Soccer's Stone. SNAPE's revenge came full circle when he gave his tears to Harry. It changed everything about him, which is why Harry gave his child Snape's name. The most successful Wizard in Deathly Hallows was Snape, Besides when Snape cornered Professor Quingley/Voldemort and was trying to save Harry when his broom was bewitched. Voldemort should have figured out where Snape's loyalties lied right then and there. Right? Okay, I am a writer, and I have been a fan since I read the first book. JK Rowlings is a genius in her imaginations of her characters. So as a writer, we get in our characters head, not the other way around. So when you get in the head of SNAPE, you Know VOLDEMORT murdered Lilly. THAT IS NUMBER ONE. Lilly was always kind and friend-perfect to Snape. She accepted him for who he was. She was the LOVE of his LIFE. Voldemort hated half bloods (including himself), Where SNAPE believed 100% in his abilities and embraced his human side, and therefore knew compassion. ...Let face it, James Potter saw Snape as a threat that could come between him and Lilly. That is why he attacked Snape. Lilly loved Snape as a trusted friend, first and foremost. Dumbledore could see the future, and could read other people's individuality. He knew what drove SNAPE, and he knew in his absence, Snape would protect Harry with his life. SNAPE saw himself as Harry's absent father. That is why he wanted to point out what a horrible bully Harry's father was. In the end, it made sense to Harry, that despite his father, James... Snape adored Lillly. Therefore as a tribute to her...He protected Lilly's Child, as she did when she gave her life. So in the End, he finished what Lilly started. The Boy Lived because SNAPE lived his life and then gave it, to protect Lilly's Child.
I know it's just a fictional story and there's many logical/realistic errors that are overlooked (i.e. the first book when the snake "winks" at Harry at the beginning), but one thing cannot be overlooked in my opinion. Voldemort has murdered countless people throughout his life, he would know that the eyes stay open after death. The eyelid muscles are contracted when we blink. Harry kept his eyes closed the entire time. I know it wouldn't have been realistically possible to not close his eyes the entire time he was faking death, but it always kind of bothered me. Still love the series though.
Probably looking into someone's mind is somewhat like casting a spell. It requires some level of effort. Just because he can read people's minds doesn't mean hes doing it all the time to everyone. If he looked he probably would've known she was lying but he just didn't look because he had no reason to suspect her. He just saw himself murder Harry with a killing curse which he had done to countless others and asking her was verification of what his own eyes had already just seen.
I think 🤔 it may have been easier than that. Voldemort was hurt himself in the moment he kills Harry in the Black Forest. It may have simply been that he hadn’t fully recovered himself yet. Otherwise he just would’ve entered Harry’s brain again and seen Harry was still alive.
I think occlumency is more likely than you think. Just because Harry had a hard time learning it, doesn't mean it is a difficult skill to master. I think that probably a lot of high ranking Death Eaters, or Death Eaters that were not fully devoted to Voldemort, were able to use occlumency well enough to block Voldemort.
Again another Mom "defeats" Voldemort...Mothers are kind of the Antagonists in Voldemorts Life. His own ,Harrys and Dracos Mom.
Don't forget Molly icing Bellatrix, his best minion, which caused him much distress.
I always love the head cannon interpretation that a large part of the reason for Voldemort’s fall to darkness and evil is the idea that because he is born under the effects of a love potion he is unable to feel the emotion of love; as a result he cannot feel empathy or other related emotions like guilt for a friend passed away
@@alexandermckenzie-robinson3653 not really a headcanon that’s just confirmed to be true
@@davidshatto7604 Really? Cool! I never found my own source to confirm it but I’m glad that’s canon
@@alexandermckenzie-robinson3653 yeah I’m not sure about the last part but if I remember correctly the inability to experience love is a result of his conception
Narcissa might have been skilled at Occlumency, but i honestly think that fear betrayed Voldemort as he was so afraid that he had failed again to kill Harry that he did not actively used Legilimens around his followers, following when Harry had collapssed, remember that Voldemort also had collapsed and probably felt either some sort of pain or weakening within himself and this fear had such a strong hold of him and he was so desperate to be relieved of that fear that when he heard the words, he did not want to find out if she was lying, he had heard what he had wanted to hear and was ''happy'' about that.
I agree with this
I agree also. He had just had a piece of his soul destroyed. I think after he was in a weakened state and that's why he relied on someone to confirm Harry's death instead of just blasting him with Crucio to make sure.
@@unholyiiamas Funny thing, in the books he did just that after he was declared dead by narcissa, to show his power he started to toss Harrys body around while using the crucio curse and it took all of Harrys will and might to not show any sign of pain and allow himself to be tossed around like that.
@@Vakaria-plays ah nevermind, didn't remember the book haha
Agreed
She told him what he wanted to hear and, as a narcissist, he believed her
Can you imagine if he simply didn’t want to believe her or she slipped up out of fear and he was able to read her mind and see that she lied and that he was still alive? She would have suffered the worst death out of everyone in the series. And Mr potter would have died immediately right next to her.
I wish that the next Dark Lord is similar but yet a different version of the outcome. Like I want the next dark Lord to actually end up winning, and killing his enemy, and then completely ruling over hog warts and the wizarding world, then go further and start to take control over the real world outside of the hidden wizard world for a time and time and a half, so that we could see the world out of the perspective of the evil one this time, just for the rise of the good wizards and witches to make a come back and arise again, and maybe even team up with the military in the real world to take back control against the dark lord, and then the ultimate outcome becomes that the real world governments and the wizarding governments team up, and there is a full blown world war against the evil dark lord, and then the dark Lord and all his power over everyone, and all of his people. To the point that the world nearly ends, and the dark Lord nearly wins full control over the entire world in such a way dictatorship, and maybe even having Harry Potter die in this series along with Ron Weasley. But hermonie survived and her and her family ends up taking back full control with her intelligence and the the end of it all is hermonie beating the next dark Lord being the ultimate and most hated enemy of the pure bloods being a muggle. And then the good guys make a huge come back and win again, ultimately destroying all darkness and evilness, ending the entire series with multiple unexpected deaths, much sadness and pain and blood and death and war. But ultimately the evilness has lost this time for good. 😊😅
And maybe even having a couple of people go insane and they end up being neither good or bad witches and wizards, like they end up being some sort of Marauder or bounty Hunter, taking revenge of their families which has suffered. And the dark Lord straight up exposing the magic world to the real world. Such as Neville long bottom turning insane after finding out that his son and wife face the same fate as his parents, so he goes insane killing anyone that gets in his way to fine the death eaters that did this to him once again, even if he has to kill teachers or students to get to them, and his focus is not on the dark Lord but simply in the focus on the death eaters that tortured his wife and son, killing everyone and everything in his path to the point that Harry and Ron before they died in the hands of the dark Lord could no longer save Neville, and they end up dueling or something, and ultimately they let Neville lose his mind to kill the death eaters, for they simply deserve it. It would be so insane to see that Harry Potter and Ron dying in this series, seeing Neville go insane, seeing the dark Lord win and have victory not only over the magic world, but the real world too dictating the entire world and eliminating half bloods and muggles, just to see hermonie end up dueling and killing the dark Lord Himself as being the ultimate enemy to the pure bloods being a muggle. I would pay hundreds to see such things unfold. And hermonie and everyone else who saw Harry Potter win the previous series, especially hermonie being completely heart broken seeing the people she grew up with die in such gruesome ways.
But why would you want the evil wizards to win?@@jacobgreer1512
Ironic isn’t it, A narcissist getting told a lie by someone called Narcissa.
Narcissa is an interesting character
As I recall she was not a death eater. Even though her husband and son were. So she did not have that tattoo that connected to the Dark Lord. She was seemingly aloof. She didn't care one way or the other about Harry. The other Voldemort devotees cared about him. Curiously she didn't seem as fearful of him, like the others. She also despised Voldemort for charging Draco with the task of killing Dumbledore. And Draco ends up with his mother's wand after Harry disarmed him, but did not kill him. I thought it was interesting that Voldemort would ask her to check the body.
Narcissa was never a Death Eater, nor was she devoted to Voldemort, she was devoted to her husband and went along with Lucius. When Voldemort sent her son Draco on what she considered a suicide mission she became his enemy.
Yup, don't know where he came up with that part. She was never shown in the books doing or having anything to do with any of the Death Eaters and their acts.
She even lacks have the ability to use Dark Magic in Lego Harry Potter 2 (then again, so does Snape).
Moreover, in the episode where Narcissa asks Snape to protect her son, I think JKR put both sisters there to show the actual devotee, Bellatrix, and how Narcissa was nothing like her.
What was Narcissa *feeling* when she lied to Voldemort. Intense relief that her son was still alive. Voldemort may have misunderstood the reason for that feeling as he was likely feeling it himself in the belief he'd finally won.
I think it was a perfect storm. She told him what he had most wanted to hear for over 17 years, that the danger to his precious existence had finally been eliminated. What's more, we see how he was suffering in limbo while Harry was talking to Dumbledore. Even if he wasn't aware of his surroundings as Harry was, I'm sure he felt and remembered that pain afterwards, when they both woke up again. In addition, he felt fear and shame for having failed again in front of his followers, which was unbearable for him. Her answer relieved him of these undesirable feelings. Finally, even if he had the strength of mind and emotion to suspect her and try to read her mind, the love and dread she felt for her son acted like Harry's sorrow for Sirius did when Voldmort tried to possess him at the Ministry of Magic, repelling him immediately.
Maybe many factors at play.
One could be that Voldemort was weak after being affected by Harry's brief time in limbo.
Also Narcisa could have put a lot of effort into her Occlumancy so Voldemort wouldn't reach her thoughts.
And yeah, the motherly love that played a crucial part. Maybe activating a protective charm. Who knows.
Didn't "killing Harry" also hurt Voldemort? I think they said that Voldemort even fell unconscious for a second when he killed Harry and it shocked everyone. Voldemort may not have been in a state to check to see if Harry was alive since a piece of his soul was just destroyed that hurt him that badly. And Narcissa is a pure blood witch from a long line, I'm willing to bet she was powerful enough to at least repel a weakened Voldemort from reading her mind if he even cared enough to, while incompetent, the Malfoy's were at least always loyal, well until they just bailed at the last moment lol.
Narsissa strikes me as this quietly skillfull person. And I think she tries to survive in a den of snakes, rather than actually being that evil on her own. Her being skilled at occlumancy makes perfect sense I bellieve. Particularly if its boosted by like, maturnal love-magic.
Based on what I’ve heard Narcissa and snape were able to successfully lie to him because they understand the 1 thing Voldemort doesn’t.Love
@M.C You don’t have to love someone to have a baby with them.
@m.c1689 even though jk says the cursed child is cannon it doesn’t stick to HP cannon.why would Voldemort want an heir especially since he thought he would live forever
@m.c1689 but the reason he was so good at it was because of lily since Voldemort would’ve probably found out if not for snapes love for lily
@@elijahyoung8116 And an heir could go against him and try to kill him.
I think it's a mix of maternal love that protected Harry here once again. And then also, because there were so many witches and wizards there in the forest that night that it might have been harder for V to figure out whose feelings and thoughts were whose. Plus I think that Legilimency works a lot like feeling reading, and V would have read first hesitation and fear (V: Is Harry Potter dead? N: Is my son still alive?) and then relief, jubilation and determination (V: we conquered! Harry Potter defeated! N: I'll get to see my son again!). Their goals were completely different at that point and because V doesn't understand love, he probably didn't even think that Narcissa's concern and love for her son could be a possible interpretation of what he read.
Love the music you have in your videos. Also, your commentary and theories are well thought out. Thank you!
I disagree that Narcissa wouldn't have been a strong occlumens. Draco was good enough at it to block Snape, and Snape guessed he learned it from Bellatrix. Whoever in his family he learned it from, it seems well established his family was really good at occlumency.
Although the fact that Snape didn't guess he learned it from Narcissa may support that she wasn't good enough to teach it. But that also could be that Narcissa wasn't a deatheater.
Her decision to lie had nothing to do with Harry saying Draco was alive.
Telling the truth would have gotten Harry killed, and she didn't have the stomach to see a boy who was her own son's age die.
Narcissa may have had a death eater husband but she wasn't a freaking monster.
I think another video needs to be done to explain what would happen if she told the truth. From what I can see, they just would've killed Harry again and still taken his body to Hogwarts. Narcissa's reason to lie couldn't have been just to see Draco again. No matter what, that was going to happen anyway. It seems more likely that she either wanted to return a favor to Harry for the info or had an underlying reason to protect Harry.
I most definitely need to revisit the series as an adult (books)♥️I missed all these little details as a child .
Voldemort definitely just believed her... BECAUSE HE DIDN'T BELIEVE HE COULD HAVE FAILED THERE.
Imagine she _had_ said: " The boy is alive."
*tumbleweed blows past* non-descriptive or background wizard/witch: " ... don't worry, V, happens to the best of us" *background coughs*
I have grown to the concept of "ancient" magic over time now. Just compare it to instinctive magic for example. Harry did various things instinctively in his youth, even without knowing about his magical abilities. Many of these things happened because of various spontaneous emotions, like fear or anger. And now imagine a feeling.. like the undying love of a mother and the will to protect her child.. in such a situation. No wonder voldemort imploded instantly on touching harry.
The Black family were fanatical. They likely expected their kin to study advanced magic. Sirius is believed to be a skilled occulmens. How Sirius sneaks around so easily and why the Wizengamot didn't learn the truth when they interrogated him. It wouldn't surprise me if his cousin was too. It would give deeper context for Bella and Cissa making Snape swear an Unbreakable Vow. When they tried to get a read on him and were blocked, they knew there was only one way to trust him. I always kind of expected Snape was as skilled with it out of being constantly surrounded by people who could read his mind.
What if destroying the last Horcrux (Harry) made him too weak to actually tap in his power as well as his overconfidence causing his downfall?
But Harry wasn’t the last horcrux
I believe that Narcissa was able to deceive him by the power of love combined with ocumency and the fact that Voldemort's soul was weakened by all the destroyed horcruxes. So there was no way he was going to be full of power to be able to find out whether Harry was alive or dead.
Dropped a like of course is very interesting. How yet again love is the thing that catches Voldemort off guard. He never guessed that one of his loyal subjects would betray him over love of one of their family members to see if they were safe. Just like he never guessed that snape would go to Dumbledore since Voldemort said he was going to kill all the potters So Snape went to Dumbledore to plead for Lily's life. An act of love that Voldemort could not predict Lily herself sacrificing herself for Harry for the protective love charm. An act of love that Voldemort could not predict. He never seems to learn from this mistake
I think the reason she was able to lie to him as well as cuz Voldemort was so caught up in his victory that he just wanted to believe that he had one and that it was over so he chose to believe her lie as well as her love for malfoy just being something that he can't comprehend I think has something to do with it as well shielding her mind from his
I believe it was a combination of Narcissa's maternal instinct triggering ancient magic and Voldemort's arrogance that allowed her to successfully lie about Harry being dead. At that point, the conflict no longer mattered to her, and all she cared about was her son and was still resentful of the dark lord charging Draco with killing Dumbledore. Further, Voldemort wanted to believe that Harry was dead.
Once it came down to it, Narcissa was as much a bad ass as Molly. She lied to Voldy and got away with it!!! Thought she loathed Harry, she still understood that the only way to get to her son was through Harry. And she did what she did out of a mother's love....very much like Lily and Molly. It was well established that it was near impossible to lie to Voldy, but she did it, and did it well. In the end, she was a total badass.
The series mentions several times that Voldemort doesn’t understand love or the magic surrounding his connection with Harry. The prophecy implies it and Dumbledore lays it out clearly in OOTP. Voldemort himself admits it to his Death Eaters during his restoration in the graveyard, when he mentions that maternal love was ’old magic’ that he should have remembered. (Incidentally, Diary Voldemort also forgets that phoenix tears have healing properties.)
After everything, he needed to believe that he had finally fulfilled the prophecy and become the strongest wizard and the only true immortal being. Since, you know, Harry was relatively always so casually immune to death: mother’s love x2, phoenix tears, Dumbledore at the quidditch match, time turner, priori incantatem, and so on.
I always assumed this was because Voldemort was stunned from the Harrycrux was just destroyed, and Voldemort's ability to detect lies was greatly diminished.
I think she knew her family was in the doghouse. Her husband and sister had failed to many times and if Voldy won they would be in an even worse position having absolutely no more purpose. Even as meat shields. The why was self/family preservation. The how? Bellatrix taught Draco to shield his mind. She probably her sister too.
I think it makes total sense that the death eaters and their spousers became occlumens when he was gone for those twelve years. They probably knew he would come back.
That's funny how we both kind of came to the similar conclusion before I finished the end of the video, which I just did 👍 I definitely agree that her active love to try and see if Malfoy was okay. Might have been an act of love that prevented Voldemort to be deceived
Yes. I agree. I guess, Voldemort just heard what he wanted to hear. It was a great oversight, but he got so increasingly frustrated over the course of the Deathly Hallows, that he just wanted an easy win and didn't question it. If anything he only got more and more frustrated why it took Narcissa so long to confirm his death.
Edit: However with JK Rowlings comment on the moment, that would make the last theory the most likely. Maybe not necessarily ancient magic, but at least she would have been able to pull of occlumency because of her maternal love. Maybe it's a mix of all of these theories.
Voldemort not checking himself if Harry was dead was the most stupid thing ever…..
IMO made him look weak.
In this you say that in the books she's been portrayed as a loyal follower of Voldemort. I don't recall that at all. She was hardly in the books and when she was, it wasn't in scenes that were showing anything to do with working for or with Voldemort as a death eater.
Please, where can I find this beautiful Background music? I am sure it is a royalty-free version of "Lily's Theme" but for real. Where can I find it? Perfect meditation music ❤
Molly Weasley defeated Bellatrix because she was a strong witch and very focused on protecting her children. Nothing old magic or mystical about it. She's related to the Black family and to Bellatrix as well so that shows she has a family history of strong witches and wizards in her blood.
In that moment and duel in the forest, ancient magic was re-performed by Harry and Narcissa was a collaborator/instrument in it. That's the beauty of "the close".
Harry had been saved by a Mother's love three times his own Mother Lily Mrs.Weasley and Narcissa
Yeah 😊
Except Lily and Mrs. Weasley aren't evil.
4:50 "She realized there was a very good chance the good guys would prevail" Do you hear from what perspective you are talking here? Do you think Narcissa would think of herself as one of the 'bad guys'? We have never seen any sign she thinks this is the case, so more likely, although she does believe in her group's cause, she doesn't believe anymore in the person leading it. 'Bad guys', like terrorists and the such, like to think of themselves as rebels or fighters for freedom, etc.
I absolutely think narcissa could have been a great occlumens as I believe Bellatrix was, at least in the books. I believe HBP has Bellatrix teaching Draco how to shield his mind from Snape, and she'd have to be pretty good to teach someone how to resist Snape occulency.
Another great video, Dean! I am not sure you have covered this, but could Harry's sacrifice be similiar to his mother's? He did so voluntarily. He had a choice on if he should go. Lastly, it was based on his LOVE for his friends. Curious on your thoughts.
I’m not Dean! That’s Harry Potter Folklore. I’m Silas. But thanks! Good questions, sounds video worthy!
@@HarryPotterTheory My apologies Silas! I was binge watching content and screwed up names.
Actually the book mentioned this… “Your spells are no longer binding, Tom. You can’t hurt them. I did what my mother did.” - Harry (something along those lines)
Yes, except Lily didn't have a choice to come back or not. Harry only did because of the horcrux in him, Voldy technically killed that and not Harry.
@@ImReverseGiraffe but he still chose to make the sacrifice.
There is one other way, though its more a mental and emotional feat.
She could have, even for a moment, convinced herself that he truly was dead, in every way that Voldemort would have perceived passively. I.E. self delusion.
For her to exist in such an oppressive environment as the one she found herself in, after luscious fell from favor; she would need to possess a certain degree of an ability to believably lie to herself.
"Its ok, everything will be fine, draco will be fine, Severace promised he would. Well find a way to get through this."
Even if part of herself knew that it was a lie, at least for a few moments during the worst of it, in trying to be strong; she could have to been able to convince herself he was dead on a somewhat emotional level.
When she knew he was alive, but needed to be convincing that he was now dead; perhaps she told herself he was. Told herself that he was, shut out all doubt that he was not dead. Only if for a moment. Long enough to tell Voldemort that it was so. And for him to believe her, because for that moment, she believed it as well.
After all, she had been loyal to that point, even if she had the occasional doubt.
So he wouldn't have been all that suspicious of her; even if his arrogance wasn't clouding his own perception. So it wouldn't take all that long of staying in that state to be convincing. Especially after so long lying to herself that things were alright. All durring that long year.
Then all she would have to do, is tie her thoughts up into only worrying about Draco. So that if he did passively look into her emotions, and thoughts; all he would see is a devoted mother. All do to an emotion he didn't ever understand. He might think her weak, and yet think no more about it. After all he had a triumph to gloat about.
As with all the best liars, if they want convince others that their lies are true, first they have to convince themselves.
A simple trick given the horrible circomstances. A survival skill.
Narcissa was anything but simple or weak. She was complicated.
Late but RIP Helen McCrory
Voldemort could have just been weary after having a piece of his soul destroyed. We saw that him casting Avada Kedevra on Harry knocked him down, and maybe even caused him to black out for a few seconds. He likely wasn't in top form, allowing Narcissa to keep her thoughts hidden. Also, Voldemort doesn't understand love. He knew the Malfoys were desperate to get back on his good side and thought they'd do anything to gain his favor, and so overlooked the possibility of Narcissa lying to him for her son.
I believe it's something so much more simple. And was even explained in the books. When Harry took occlumency lessons with Snape. Snape said it has a lot to do with eye contact in the book which is way more cannon than the movies it never said Narcissa turned and spoke to voldemort it just said she said that he is dead. If there was no eye contact voldemort could not use his powers of legilimence
Yes, I think it is because of Narcissa's love for her son. It all goes back to what Harry said to Voldemort during their last encounter, regarding his old Potions Master: "Snape was Dumbledore's... from the moment you started hunting down my mother. And you never realised it because of the thing you can't understand."
Yes, Snape was an Occlumens, but when, as Voldemort reveals in his answer to the above, Snape told him there were "other women and of purer blood worthier of him" it simply didn't occur to him that such a thing could be untrue, so he didn't put extra effort in trying (literally) to see through it. In a similar way, Narcissa- Occlumens or not- was motivated by love for her son. Voldemort did have the sense to call Lucius's bluff when he asked Voldemort to end the fight at Hogwarts lest Harry were killed accidentally, understanding that he really just wanted to go and find Draco- but that's because he made the mistake of mentioning him immediately prior. Narcissa was easier to overlook and she was also subtler in her approach. Voldemort- half-dazed, no doubt, from having destroyed part of his own soul in Harry's body- could not entertain the possibility that a mother might risk everything to get near her son, so he didn't (and perhaps couldn't) attempt to penetrate the lie of Harry's death. It's like if someone described an elephant to you and you'd never seen one. You can't say for certain that their description is inaccurate if your mind can't picture an alternative, so you might as well believe them. Voldemort has never felt love, so he can't fathom people's motives for acting upon it and this led him to believe Narcissa.
I do actually think it does make sense to assume she might have been skilled at Occlumency; her sister Bellatrix was skilled at it too I believe and their niece Tonks was also known to be skilled. I think we can assume fairly certainly that she would be training it knowing that she is often in the presence of one of the strongest, darkest, and most dangerous legilimens. She strikes me as a very cunning and intelligent person unlike her husband, she would be capable of forming such "mental defences". If you think about it, she did do things behind Voldemort's back like the unbreakable vow, she would need to be able to hide that from Voldemort.
Finally, Rest in Peace Helen McCrory, who portrayed Narcissa Malfoy so wonderfully
Another way that she could have lied is that he might have sensed her happiness that Draco was still alive and mistook it for happiness that Harry was dead. Combined with his deep desire to believe that Harry was dead, would assume that such happiness had to be for his success.
Another explanation as to the 'how'.
In the books, Voldemort flings Harry's 'dead' body about a bit in triumph, Harry has to remain limp and not cry out in pain at any point else he will give himself away...
This is done in front of a sobbing Hagrid so by that point Voldemort would be pretty certain that Harry was dead even if he doubted Narcissa in any way.
I've often wondered if she knew who Harry was when he was brought to Malfoy Manor. I know she knew who Ron and Hermione were, since she saw them at Diagon Alley not long back with Harry. Also, she was never mean toward Harry and his friends, like her son was.
After Draco lied about Harry, he stood with his mother, and after the trio's escape, the Malfoys witnessed Vodermorts wrath after killing another Goblin, where he then began striking down his followers at their manor. The book said that the Malfoys pushed people out of the way to flee his wrath.
The above all occurred before the battle, and my guess was that when it happened, her main priority was to find her son and leave. Draco was just foolish enough to stay behind, thinking that he could best Harry and retrieve his wand.
After the battle, and in the Great Hall, the three Malfoys were found setting together at one of the tables.
I don't think Narcissa was as bad as some make her out to be. She was married to Lucius, and it looked as if that was very strained in the movie. All the Blacks of that age, besides Bellatrix, ended up helping Harry in some form along the way.
Are you going to make a video about the Harry Potter Reboot TV series
Voldy ego really what got him killed instead of winning the war 👌 he truly a slytherin thru & thru 💀💀💀
To quote Mai.
I love Zuko more than I fear you.
Narcissa had enough and just wanted her loved ones safe.
She could have felt severus snape's death because of unbreakable vow that had broken, and this got her enough motivation to turn back from failed(Harry was still alive) lord.
For Voldemort there was no time to doubt. he was desperate, dizzy and shocked because of the Horcrux that had lost.
Its crazy how the love in Mother's are just undefeated against Voldemort, and he never see's it coming.
Great video❤🎉
As people have said before, Bellatrix is an extremely powerful occlumens, so it would make sense that Narcissa was too, but she didn't lie to Voldemort because of her power in occllumency, she did it because her intentions during the final night of the war were entirely driven by her love for her family, especially Draco. If Voldemort went into her mind, he wouldn't be able to understand it, he wouldn't even be interested in searching anything remotely related to love, he doesn't feel the need to look that way so he would never find out
Would you please do a video on what would have happened if Harry DID die.
Would there still be a final battle?
How would it go?
That’s interesting
It is possible that Dumbledore and Snape decided if Harry survived in the end to teach Narcissa in master Occlumency to make sure that her family is save if she needs to lie someday to Voldemort I think Snape warned her for Voldemort
Could it be that the protection that Lily gave to Harry that lives in his blood also help block the Dark Lord from getting the truth from Narcissa or that it recognized the same kind of Motherly love and help block the Dark Lord? After all the Dark Lord did once said it was Old magic something he should have foreseen, and yet he still underestimate its' power
From the book series "The Sword of Truth" The Wizard's First Rule. "People are stupid. They can be made to believe any lie because either they want to believe it's true or because they are afraid it's true"
LOVE trumps everything.
I think its even more simple than the 'mothers love' though that theory has been given creedence.
Voldemort wouldnt necessarily be expecting anything other than for harry to be dead, he believes by this point he has taken all necessary steps to ensure harrys death, so he is less likely to doubt what he is told because hes expecting it.
While the malfoys have been hapless their loyalty isn't seriously in question so hes not likely to doubt narcissa will tell the truth. Couple these two things with the excitement, elation and no doubt preoccupation with the battle i think its entirely plausible voldemort simply didnt use his abilitites in this instance.
I also dont doubt that the fact that the life of her and her family depended on the lie being believable, it wouldnt ve surprising if narcissa was impossible to read in that moment
There are several factors that I can see. First of all, many spells are less effective if you don’t have eye contact, so if Voldemort did not have direct eye contact she could probably get by a little easier. Second, most likely each death eater who escaped Azkaban had some experience with occlumancy. Third, Voldemort probably really wanted the death to be true, so there was probably a little bit of self deception. And fourth, Voldemort does not comprehend love, so the only thing that he could imagine that she could be happy about would be the death of Harry Potter, not the chance to rescue her own son. I imagine that he more was reading her feelings than thoughts as she said what he hoped to hear, and, seeing no other reason for her reaction to the corpse of Harry Potter, accepted that he had been successful.
Draco lied about "knowing" that Harry was Harry to Bellatrix too 🤔 ...
Voldemort could have read them both !!
Had Snape taught them occlumens? Snape SWORE to protect them maybe something also occurred with the "unbreakable vow". Combined with maternal love, Snape's love for Lilly, is what drives him to protect Harry, and thus Draco.
Its all intertwined very delicately.
At one point, Draco was the rightful owner of the elder wand. If Narcissa knew that, she would fear Voldemort. If I were rewriting the story, I would have her use a spell to make him look dead. I would also give her a wasp that would land on Hagrid's ear and tell him to cover Harry in the invisibility cloak. It would then land on Harry's ear and explain the situation to him. It would then sting Harry to wake him up. Harry would stun Narcissa so that Voldemort could not ask her any questions.
Draco learned Occlumency from his Aunt, Bellatrix Lestrange. I think it's perfectly reasonable that Narcissa, as Bellatrix's sister, was also proficient at Occlumency herself. But maybe Bellatrix was a little better so she let Bellatrix teach Draco.
I’ve been a potter fan my whole life but can’t remember what occlumency is
I don't think this has anything to do with magic at all. This is just down to Riddle hearing what he wanted/expected and his massive ego. Tom knew Snape was a slippery sort, so Snape always needed to have his defences up. But Narcissa is not someone he takes overly seriously. Tom also wouldn't for one moment think that she'd put Draco before him, he is the center of the universe afterall. Essentially, his guard was down, he wasn't focused on her truthfulness, and he was all puffed up in his moment of victory.
I’ve always thought that it was clear occlumency, but amplified by ancient magic. I think she made Voldemort “see” her touch a motionless and cold body that was left breathless. Under normal circumstances, I don’t believe she would be powerful enough to pull off such a feat, but in that moment her drive to get to her son was more powerful than anything Voldemort could comprehend.
Similarly, under normal circumstances a muggle is not capable of dead lifting a large tree, but if that tree fell on top of your child, moving it would be as easy as tossing a twig.
You could almost say that the combination of ancient magic and maternal love is thee most powerful magic because it is fueled by the adrenaline of the purest form of the hearts deepest desires.
Actually, it isn't a matter of which one is best, most effective, or even factual. Because once again, we have a situation that is nuanced where all things feed together and produce one outcome. In other words it isn't A, B, C, or, D. It is E, all of the above.
Thwe first two explanations (Occlumency and Voldemort's arrogance), the obvious ones, have never fully convinced me. I am absolutely fascinated by the third, I will definitely go and check out more about Ancient Magic- is it something that dates back to a time when there was no clear border between Magic people and Muggles, maybe? A time when magic was just part of humans and nature, before humankind unconsciously rejected/outgrew/lost a part of its nature?
I think that why Voldemort couldn't detect that Narcissa was lying is because it was a act of love a act to protect her son and Voldemort of course cant feel love so he didn't know and i also think harry explaines in the final duel that why he didn't know snape was unloyal was because he did it for lily and therefor love and he didn't understand love and therefore didnt know about snapes betrayal because it was a act of love
I don't think it's so weird to think that Narcissa may have been skilled at Occlumency, given that her own sister Bellatrix was. After all, Bellatrix taught Draco occlumency.
Wait, I thought Harry could come back from death only because he had the philosopher's stone. "I open at the end," etc...
but he didnt have the phillosphers stone, he had the resurection stone
I think you may have missed one. Voldemort himself fell and was out of sorts as a result of the killing curse. He may have been a bit off his game as a result. For this reason, I would shy away from the arrogance theory. The fact that he found it necessary to ask whether Harry was actually dead suggests some level of suspicion that all had not gone to plan. True, his arrogance recovered quickly as he quickly went to torture and brag--but he was not immediately arrogant after the curse. My vote would be that she got away with it because it was what he wanted to happen and he wasn't on his game enough (this would have been the third time that his killing curse failed to kill Harry and was the second to at least knock him down) to suspect or detect Narcissa's lie.
The most simple answer, she used occlumens. She is a member of the house of black, a family of powerful purebreds. There is no way she WASNT taught that ability at a young age.
She may not be a heavy hitter like voldemort or snape, but it was enough to keep put a victory addled voldemort
Harry was fully possessed by Voldemort during the Duel in the Ministry Atrium, hoping that Dumbledore would kill the boy in an attempt to destroy Voldemort himself, but Harry's heart, full of grief over the death of his godfather Sirius Black, became too overwhelming to bear and he was able to force Voldemort out of his mind, as Voldemort did not understand the concept of love.
Not just a mothers love. But any strong love. That's also HOW snape has always been able to keep Voldemort out, his love for Lilly. And yes, the magic of emotions is a form of ancient magic (according to hogwarts legacy).
Listening to the first part of the video sorta sparked a random theory in my head and I wonder if there's any pieces that can be connected...
What happened to Harry at the end, specifically his soul being whole and that he was still "anchored" to the world of the living, and it's similarities to "creating Horcruxes". To me, it feels like "creating Horcruxes" could be a failed attempt (or inferior version) of what happened to Harry, Being anchored to the living world without ripping the soul to pieces. Would there be enough information to see if they stem from the same type of magic? For example if it's a form of Ancient magic that was duplicated by Dark magic or something....
I wanna know why the elder wand did not switch allegiances to Voldy when he killed him. Albus himself says that Harry has died so how does this not count as a win? Especially when the wand is fickle enough to switch owners when Harry grabs Malfoy's wand.
I always put it down to the fact that he had just killed a piece of his own soul. I can't remember if it's in the books, but in the film he's collapsed on the floor after he uses the killing curse. So it would make sense to me that he is not 100% around this time and this plus his arrogance allows her to lie to him effectively.
What I never understood, is how Harry stayed alive (and well) all the way back to the castle. He's the one that "beat" the dark lord as a baby, surely some of the death eaters and Voldemort himself would want to kick and disrespect his body a little. Or drag him to the castle by rope. Instead they give him to Hagrid to hold gently until they get to the castle.
I thought that legilimency required eye contact, which Narcissa wouldn't have given if she had looked into the crowd when announcing Harry's death
I think it's a combination of 2 and 3. He underestimates his own followers as they shower him with flattery and fear and ancient magic
To add to this theory, I feel that by this time only 12.5% of Voldemort was alive and it did not have the same powers that it once has as Tom Riddle/Voldermort. Yes he was a great duelist and he had changed a prophecy at that point that he was way more overconfident that the remaining 1/8th soul wasn't conscious enough to perform leglimens
ok, so my theory is that because you stated (sorry my memory is fuzzy on the exact video) that Harry and voldemort were rendered unconscious when voldemort hit Harry with the killing curse, he was too discombobulated to look into Narcisse's mind
I once heard a theory that Voldemort knew Narcissa was lying the whole time, but he ignored it to save face with his Death Eaters.
The main question here should be - why did Voldemort asked Narcissa instead of, say Bellatrix, who was practically in love with Voldemort (just remember how Harry describes Bellatrix's voice after coming back from the limbo). Even without Bellatrix, there were a bunch of other deatheaters who would've revealed the truth. So why did Voldemort asked the very person who's suppose to betray him the most? I see a possible plothole.
The most illogical part of this part of the story is that Voldemort, an extremely intelligent individual, is curiously incurious about Harry just standing there, waiting to be killed. He knew by this time that Harry was a fighter. He should have been very suspicious about this sudden capitulation to death. I would have had Voldemort start to get suspicious as to why Harry was just standing there, then have Harry see Voldemort become suspicious, and suddenly grab his wand to provoke Voldemort into attacking him. It would make Harry much more proactive in causing Voldemort to make a fatal mistake.
This happened after Harry had come back from the dead. None of the spells that Voldemort and his followers cast would stick to those who defended Hogwarts. Another example of sacrificial love at work.
Look who she lived with of course she knew how to lie and get away with it..
honestly i just think voldemort was so arrogant he didnt think narcissa would dare to lie to him
The one thing you mis here: If Voldemort is so good in reading minds, how was it that he couldn't with Harry if he were alive as we already know, Harry isn't great at blocking his mind. How can he not sense Harry is alive? In order to read a mind you have to sense it too.
I feel like he didn’t know because of all of his horcrux’s being destroyed by that point, making him too weak to really use his power how he would like to.
Another part of Voldemort's soul just died and he was weakened as a result. So he didn't have the energy to tell what Narcissa was thinking.
Actually the only one who claimed Voldemort to be the greatest Occlemency of all time was Voldemort. After all, he had no idea that Harry was seeing his thoughts in dreams. He had no idea Snape was in love with Lilly. Voldemort secretly was afraid of SNAPE because he could never tell what was going on with SNAPE. Why else did he not know, SNAPE hated him and actually cared a great deal for Lilly's child, that should have been his. HE cried when he found out she was dead, and protected Harry until Haggrid got there to take him to the Dursleys. Also, thats why Haggrid knew SNAPE was never a threat in Soccer's Stone. SNAPE's revenge came full circle when he gave his tears to Harry. It changed everything about him, which is why Harry gave his child Snape's name. The most successful Wizard in Deathly Hallows was Snape, Besides when Snape cornered Professor Quingley/Voldemort and was trying to save Harry when his broom was bewitched. Voldemort should have figured out where Snape's loyalties lied right then and there. Right? Okay, I am a writer, and I have been a fan since I read the first book. JK Rowlings is a genius in her imaginations of her characters. So as a writer, we get in our characters head, not the other way around. So when you get in the head of SNAPE, you Know VOLDEMORT murdered Lilly. THAT IS NUMBER ONE. Lilly was always kind and friend-perfect to Snape. She accepted him for who he was. She was the LOVE of his LIFE. Voldemort hated half bloods (including himself), Where SNAPE believed 100% in his abilities and embraced his human side, and therefore knew compassion. ...Let face it, James Potter saw Snape as a threat that could come between him and Lilly. That is why he attacked Snape. Lilly loved Snape as a trusted friend, first and foremost. Dumbledore could see the future, and could read other people's individuality. He knew what drove SNAPE, and he knew in his absence, Snape would protect Harry with his life. SNAPE saw himself as Harry's absent father. That is why he wanted to point out what a horrible bully Harry's father was. In the end, it made sense to Harry, that despite his father, James... Snape adored Lillly. Therefore as a tribute to her...He protected Lilly's Child, as she did when she gave her life. So in the End, he finished what Lilly started. The Boy Lived because SNAPE lived his life and then gave it, to protect Lilly's Child.
Another possibility is that as Voldemort temporarily collapsed after "kiling" Harry, it is possible that he was still momentarily weakened.
I really enjoy this
I know it's just a fictional story and there's many logical/realistic errors that are overlooked (i.e. the first book when the snake "winks" at Harry at the beginning), but one thing cannot be overlooked in my opinion. Voldemort has murdered countless people throughout his life, he would know that the eyes stay open after death. The eyelid muscles are contracted when we blink. Harry kept his eyes closed the entire time. I know it wouldn't have been realistically possible to not close his eyes the entire time he was faking death, but it always kind of bothered me. Still love the series though.
Probably looking into someone's mind is somewhat like casting a spell. It requires some level of effort. Just because he can read people's minds doesn't mean hes doing it all the time to everyone. If he looked he probably would've known she was lying but he just didn't look because he had no reason to suspect her. He just saw himself murder Harry with a killing curse which he had done to countless others and asking her was verification of what his own eyes had already just seen.
I think 🤔 it may have been easier than that. Voldemort was hurt himself in the moment he kills Harry in the Black Forest. It may have simply been that he hadn’t fully recovered himself yet. Otherwise he just would’ve entered Harry’s brain again and seen Harry was still alive.
I think occlumency is more likely than you think. Just because Harry had a hard time learning it, doesn't mean it is a difficult skill to master. I think that probably a lot of high ranking Death Eaters, or Death Eaters that were not fully devoted to Voldemort, were able to use occlumency well enough to block Voldemort.
there are a lot of stories that say pure blood children learn it from childhood, and Narcissa is a black, she WOULD have learnt it
Is other words Voldemort needed to double tap, to make sure motherly love didn't screw him over again.