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Question: Sorry to put this here, but could you make a UA-cam about rank in Sanditon? We are trying to determine if Charlotte is higher ranking than Colbourne. Very Lizzie/Darcy-esque. Thx for your video about rank in P&P!
Hello! I recently discovered your channel and am enjoying the contents of it thoroughly, specially the close readings. A request, would you please consider doing a close reading of what events made Mr Darcy partial and then fall in love with Lizzy? Since we know the narrative from Lizzy's point of view of events unfolded. I would very much love to hear you pick apart the evolution of Mr Darcy's emotions. 😄
Videos like this clearly prove that well-written novels like Pride and Prejudice are actually made of several novels hidden into one. I can easily imagine Austen outlining every character's individual journey beforehand and then, from each one, picking only the scenes that serve the general "main" narrative's purpose and filtering them through Lizzy's eyes. This is masterful writing!
Agree! This is one of the (many) reasons I call her the greatest novelist and this the greatest novel of the English language. She puts it all together. Next to her art, Charles Dickens is just a cartoonist.
Wickham has no good reason to run away with Lydia. Weak character; just a weak creation of crisis for Darcy to be a hero and rescue Lizzy indirectly with wow money!!!
@@huypt7739 Surely for Wickham it's more fun to run away from his debts in Brighton with a young girl, even if he soon bores of her...he couldn't care less about her or her family's reputation...demonstrating just how despicable he is.
I'd always thought that Lydia was trying to "steal" Mr. Wickham from Lizzie and seemed really proud to have done just that when she came back all gloating about being the youngest but first to be married.
Yes and I think her belief that Lizzie had a high opinion of Wickham served as a character reference for her and probably made her more vulnerable than she might otherwise have been.
I think in light of this video it’s more that Lydia got a crush on first sight of him and became upset that Elizabeth seemed to like him as well and felt a bit jealous because Wickham gave her attention at first. So she needed to gloat a bit because if she was the main character of the story Elizabeth would have been an antagonist (not that Lydia hated her, but she is the older sister seen more beautiful and respected who Wickham noticed first).
I think she was a typical young and pleasure bent narcissistic teen. No respect or empathy for the predicament caused to her family members reputations. She was proud of her illicit relationship with Wickham prior to forced marriage.
Isn’t it interesting how for most of the novel, Lydia is practically an exhibitionist when it comes to her attractions and intentions, but when she is at Brighton, her letters to Kitty are secretive? It’s the only time that we are witness to the intimacy between Kitty and Lydia. There’s something sad in the fact that Kitty’s personality is entirely ignored, and that the person she is closest to in the world is her self-absorbed, capricious sister. Also, another reason why the family was not concerned about Lydia’s behavior all along was because Kitty was there, kind of as a built in chaperone. As soon as they are separated, Lydia lets loose.
She knows it's wrong. Lizzie and Jane have told her enough times, she has seen how her older relatives behave, she's had an education of some sort, she is the daughter of a gentleman in a god-fearing household and goes to church every week. However, when she writes things she has the capacity to use restraint and think about it, as writing takes time. But when it's action in the moment, everything is immediate so it is harder to check yourself. As her parents fail to do so either, there's no restraint to stop her exposing herself.
I honestly felt sorry got Kitty when the story ended. Then again, I guess she is now better off with having more interactions with Elizabeth and Darcy while Mrs Bennet is occupied with Mary.
All three of the younger sisters are let down by their parents (and in extension the story). Mary tries to find self worth in becoming “accomplished” and preachy with everyone laughing at her. Kitty just tags along to whatever Lydia is doing and tends to receive the scolding for the behaviour. And Lydia obviously only defines herself through male attention and is shipped off to a very risky situation because her father doesn’t want to deal with her being petulant. She promptly gets herself into a terrible situation and then ends up in a loveless marriage far away from her family at the age of 16. At least the other two get some redemption at the end. All five of the sisters are not particularly accomplished by the standards of their peers, they don’t seem to be very good at or interested in the typical female pursuits like playing instruments, singing, embroidery, or languages. (With the exception of Mary, but her attempts don’t seem to be encouraged at all). Which means even being a governess is out of the question. They HAVE to marry. In desperation Mrs Bennet has thrown them all out into society at the same time, even Lydia, who is only 15 when the novel begins. Mr Bennet not only doesn’t stop his wife from potentially ruining the future of their children, he also hasn’t put any money aside for dowries or to look after his wife and unmarried daughters if he should die. Both Bennets are terrible parents, though it is hinted that they were still trying with Jane and Lizzy and then just kinda gave up. The younger ones never really stand a chance - that is, until two of their sisters marry well and turn the family dynamic around. Sadly it’s too late for Lydia at that point.
Since Wickham was the only officer that Lizzie had ever shown any interest in, I always thought Lydia loved the mistaken idea that she was stealing Mr. Wickham away from Lizzie as much as, if not more than, she loved Wickham himself.
"She is a great fool for going away if she liked him" was said about Mary King, but it could have easily been about Lizzy leaving to visit the Colins and leaving Wickham uncontested. I think Lydia is so focused on winning Wickham and competing to miss the fact that Lizzy isn't interested in him. Lydia wants the recognition of being the first married and upstaging her sisters by having the most handsome charismatic husband. I think Lydia still wants to think Lizzy a fool since it boosts how clever she is.
More to this I think initially Lizzie very much was interested. Despite Lydia's resentment of her older sister she clearly had an appreciating of Elizabeths intelligence and sense and this both probably led to her believing Wickham to be more desirable and encouraged her to trust him. I don't think Lydia was in any way aware of the change in Elizabeths opinion or view of him, infact the book goes to quite a bit of trouble to explain that Elizabeth doesn't make the rest of her family aware of Wickham's character. It's not clear if Elizabeth tries to warn Lydia about Wickham (it's not mentioned as far as I remember) eitherway it's likely Lydia would have interpreted it as Lizzie trying to protect her own interest in Wickham.
Very smart! So Lydia, unlike both Mary King and Elizabeth, never “went away,” until she went to Brighton, to which place Mr. Wickham was also going. Good on Lydia for never being a “great fool!” 😂
Zaneel. Hmmm... I had the impression that Lydia didn't notice her sisters much. She did want to be married first or to dance more than her sisters and knew that she was the tallest. But these are general thoughts. I don't think that she was specifically aware of or cared about Liz' interests or feelings.
Adding to this I would argue that while Wickham obviously chooses Lydia because he believes we can get away with seducing her and then most likely abandoning her after he's had his fun, I feel an undercurrent of spiteful revenge against Lizzie since by the time Lydia goes to Brighton it's already clear to Wickham that Lizzie sees through him. I think he sees in Lydia an opportunity to hurt Lizzie before (in his mind) she can damage him by revealing his character to others.
It's interesting how Lizzie is, in some respects, an unreliable narrator where Lydia and Wickham are concerned. In lumping Lydia and Kitty together, as you point out, we are misdirected into taking Lydia's attachment less seriously. It strikes me that Lizzie takes her sisters, Jane excepted, so unseriously that she exerts minimal attention to understanding their inclinations, and we, as readers, follow her lead.
I've often wondered why Kitty is there at all as a character. Aside from hyperbole - five daughters to marry off somehow seeming very much worse than four - she never seems that essential to the plot, but its clear now that Austen created her with the purpose of misdurecting us. As Dr Cox points out, having not one but two silly girls gushing over Wickham effectively camouflages that one of them actually has such an overwhelming crush on him that she will be persuaded by his seduction of her. Incidentally in the wonderful Lizzie Bennet Diaries - a modern day P&P adaptation done as a vlog - there are just three sisters (Jane, Lizzie, Lydia) while Mary is a first cousin and Kitty is - you guessed it - a cat!
Yes once you point it out like this, Lizzie seems downright neglectful of Lydia, as you say, like Mr Bennet. I feel quite sorry for Lydia. At least Jane and Lizzie paid more attention to Kitty after they got married.
What you said about us following Lizzie's lead in what we pay attention to is so spot on. One of the things I love about Austen's writing is everytime we go back, there's a treat, a new layer of meaning that changes things and, consequently, changes us as readers. Following Lizzie's lead in her treatment and perception of Lydia gutted me when watching The Lizzie Bennet Diaries bc at one point I was confronted with how I mistjudged and neglected Lydia.
I can’t imagine the amount of time it takes to pick a topic, thoroughly research it, and script out talking points for a 45+ minute video... and deliver a video almost weekly. But you make it look effortless! Another great video - thank you x 10000!
This is interesting. I had never put Lydia’s behavior in the lottery tickets scene together with Wickam’s gambling. I thought it only to accentuate her being scatterbrained. It is a brilliant touch. No one is better at characterizing “ridiculous”than Austen. Thank you for your analysis. The next time I read P&P, I will notice more subtleties.
Austen is such an acute writer of families. I wonder if the fact that the older Bennett daughters have more sense of decorum and moral norms than the younger might have some correlation with their father's engagement with parenting. He seems to have been the closest the family had to some kind of moral compass, a post he abandons over time. Jane and Lizzy have a more-or-less accepted view of correct behavior, Mary (seeing the approval the older girls get) goes a bit over the top in the morality department, and Kitty has little and Liddy almost no sense of propriety, being more under the influence of their mother. By the time the younger girls come along, Mr Bennett has practically thrown up his hands and given up, to the point of letting Liddy go off to Brighton with questionable guardians. It isn't really odd that a family of five daughters (or sons, for that matter) should find five such distinctly different personalities and attitudes, at least to anyone who knows large families -- as Austen clearly does.
Your interpretation and mine are similar. I think Lizzie and Jane had the most stable early childhood, before Mr. and Mrs. Bennet tired of each other. Mary is the rule enforcer, trying to hold them all together and find some stability. Kitty and Lydia are benignly neglected by their mother and almost completely dismissed by their father. Mrs. Bennet has done what many lonely wives do, making allies of her youngest daughters rather than acting as their parent.
Interesting point, although I think the fact only Jane and Elizabeth frequently stayed with the Gardeners had more to do with their superior characters. Their parents would never have made nor set such good examples of propriety or felicity in relations between husband and wife.
@@joanwerthman4116 Interrstingly, it's quite likely that the Gardiners married when Jane was about 12 or 13, given that their eldest child is eight at Christmas. They would have been role models for Jane and Lizzy during adolescence, but later they may have been too busy with their own growing family to do much for the younger girls.
Actually this question has bothered me for a while, and I cannot disagree with your reading of it. Now I know that my shock of Lydia's elopement was due to seeing the whole story through Elizabeth's eyes only. My blindness is rightfully a statement of Austen's writer genius which will never end to surprise me.
I believe that Lydia's infatuation with Wickham became more single-minded while Lizzie was staying with Colinses and traveling with the Gardners, and her designs on him were solidified at Brighton. So, naturally, Lizzie would not have seen that attachment and partiality form.
“And Mary King is safe.” 😂 I love this line. I am fond of the idea that someone who cared about Mary King got wind of who Wickham was and decided “eff that- you are going to your uncle’s, wether you like it or not.”
Oooooh. I completely missed that Lizzy had not been there and that she ignored Lydia so often that she was not a reliable source on the subject! I also missed the very strong hints about Lydia''s competitiveness. I'm always seeing new points of view and subtlety from these videos,, and I love it. English class was never this interesting!
I think Lydia had her eye on any man in a uniform. In the States, we call girls like her boot-chasers. Lizzie was always trying to rein in Lydia and Kitty's wild antics and I am sure Lydia resented it. Running off with her sister's perceived suitor was a way of getting back at her. She also was tired of being the youngest and wanted her independence. Her friend Mrs. Forster is described (I think by Lizzie) as a very young woman and she was married and free from parental control. Lydia wanted the same.
But then she'd be under her husband's control, and whoever he would turn out to be, he probably wouldn't put up with Lydia flirting with every officer in the regiment. I wonder if Lydia did end up continuing her flirtatious ways after she was married. I don't see why her personality would have changed just because she got married. I would not be at all surprised if she ended up having affairs with other officers.
I can see the Wickham marriage essentially being 'open'. While Lydia wouldn't stop her flirting, neither would Wickham. He would continue to seduce young ladies.
@@SchlichteToven Yes, but Lydia is not a great thinker and that aspect would have probably alluded her. Also, I think Col. Forster was probably very indulgent with his young wife and she might have thought Wickham would be the same.
@@SchlichteToven I don't think she thought that through. She just saw being the first of her sisters to get married and having a wedding where she was the centre of attention. Both Wickham and Lydia were probably not faithful. They also didn't like each other after a while to add fuel to that fire. I think she is boy crazy in general. She wanted Mr Bingley to choose her without having ever seen him. Had he paid attention to her, she would have gone for him. She basically wants to be the centre of attention and she is a woman while the militia are men, so she is an oddity. However, and officer is exciting to her because they're much more accessible in many ways and there is the whole knight in shining armour thing. Wickham is very alluring to start with- but then people want what they can't have and they particularly want what others have- and because he pursues Lizzie then Mary, she wants him even more. He's the top prize rather than her love interest. While she prefers him, it's not deep feelings and more a trophy- "I got him and married him while you both lost him ha ha". Had someone Frank Churchill-like rocked up in regimentals, she'd feel the same and replace Wickham.
It's as if "the officers" was a boys band. Or the cast of a CW sort of TV show aimed at teenagers. They're all pretty and everyday a different one is the favorite, depending who's singing lead in the latest song or who's got the best storyline in the latest episode. And Lydia is a normal 15 year old, but with too much means, too much access and not enough supervision.
In the 1995 serial, in all the scenes they are together, Wickham glances at or mentions Lydia. I thought that was an interesting touch implying he was actually interested in HER, not Lizzie. It's interesting to see the opposite is true in the text, I never noticed it before.
Wow, seeing now for how long Lydia was interested in Wickham and then remembering your video about his motives/plans, I feel really sorry for her. Her parents failed her horribly! And it's really interesting to see how the "narrator" is so much Lizzy's perspective that so many things are glossed over!
Another fascinating lecture - thank you. At the risk of going "off-topic", something the significance of which, in all the times I've read this novel, I've somehow missed: in Jane's second letter to Lizzy, she writes "Poor Kitty has anger for having concealed the attachment but as it was a matter of confidence, one cannot wonder". This really is Jane speaking and shows what a reliable person she is - when, later, the (now) Lydia Wickham describes her wedding to Jane and Lizzy and reveals that Darcy was at present, she (Lydia) immediately is worried because she wasn't supposed to disclose that fact. Jane tells her to say no more of the matter (much to Lizzy's frustration) - and this is entirely of a piece with her sympathy for Kitty for not breaking confidences gained from Lydia's letters.
I am not totally convinced of the conclusions. For example: I think it could be possible that on the return from Kent Elizabeth had a more selective hearing of Wickham's name due to the shocking tales of Wickham’s past. Due to Lydia's flighty attraction to the officers (flirting with six at once) I perceive that the more serious attraction to Wickham in Brighton resulted from the torn gown which Mrs. Forster should have repaired before sending Lydia her possessions after her elopement. The mention of the gown is not accidental. I could imagine that the tear occurred during a more aggressive sexual interaction between Wickham and Lydia. For Lydia it would mean she would have to marry Wickham and to do that accompany him on his flight from Brighton. That would be the origin of the elopement. To have Kitty know of that altercation would require that it would have had to happen a few days before the elopement.
Thank you for returning to Pride and Prejudice. I am interested in your thoughts ( if any) about the similarity and parallels between the characters and personalities of Lady Catherine and Mrs Bennett. They are both monsters, crass , socially inept and selfish. Another parallel is the marriage proposals of Mr Collins and D’Arcy. Both are self serving lectures to Elizabeth on their own motivations and requirements.
While I admit, it has been years since I read the novel, but do pull out the 1995 classic quite often. I remember Lydia snipping at Lizzy, “Are going you Wickham all to yourself, Lizzy?” That was my first clue that indeed she fancied him from their first meeting. After, watching your videos going in-depth, I find I watch the film with a greater understanding and through new lens.
Ah!! I had recently reread Pride and Prejudice after watching your video on why Wickham eloped with her, and noticed for the first time all the little moments where she shows an interest in him. Every time I go back to her work, I'm more convinced Austen's skill as a writer was so ahead of her contemporaries.
It’s wonderful of Austen to tell us that the only thing higher in Lydia’s esteem than Wickham is a game of chance. In a way they’re a great match, since they both care about gambling and the pleasure of risk more than for other people.
I agree that Lydia and Wickham both get what they deserve. Yet, I think what they got was not all that bad. Moreover, I see Lydia in a different way. I see Lizzie's strong character as the center point of the entire story. I see the primary thread as being Lizzie and Darcy finding a chemistry that works, and I see Lizzie uplifting Darcy. For me, the second most important thread runs between Lizzie and Lydia. There was a real danger that all the girls would stay unmarried until Mr. Bennett's death. Instead of overthinking her situation until catastrophe arrives, Lydia strikes out and forces adulthood onto Darcy and Bingley. Lydia is vivacious and pretty so Wickham is not at a loss. Wickham is not a prince but nor is he a beggar on the street. Though Lydia's home might be modest she has the choice of at least two grand estates to visit. If Wickham screws up, he will be smashed between Lydia and Lizzie, i.e., Mrs. Darcy. Lydia informed Lizzie that Darcy attended her wedding. Lydia is the third most essential personality in the story.
Love your analyses. I have a question off the Lydia-Wickham issue. Would Elizabeth and Darcy have become engaged without the intervention of Lady Catherine at Longbourn? Darcy says as much: "It taught me to hope..". The narrator voice says explicitly "She [Lizzy] soon learnt that they were indebted for their good understanding to the efforts of his aunt..." (Chap XVI) However, Chap XVIII reveals they almost made a hash of it. Lizzy: "...what made you so reluctant to come to the point at last" Darcy: "Because you were grave and silent and gave me no encouragement"
love this investigation Dr Cox. In Austen, every word counts. I had forgotten ever reading about the cross-dressing incident. You make such a good point - this incident foreshadows Lydia's tendency to ignore conventional behavior and courtship roles. Listening, I was shocked that Colonel Forster would have allowed his wife's newfound female friends to humiliate the most senior male servant in his house (known by his surname Chamberlayne, not first name, therefore in a senior position and possibly employed by the Colonel for a long time) This servant might have been much older than the girls and Mrs Forster. The intention of the prank was for this presumably trustworthy employee to be put on show and laughed at. How would this senior employee have felt to be made into a laughing stock? as a servant he did not have a choice about participating, he had to do what his boss Mrs Forster ordered. The Meryton girls hardly know this servant, but this does not excuse why they have zero concern for his feelings. Were these teenagers standing watching while this man changed his clothes? he would had to have been touched by the girls, e.g be physically laced into the dress, as he would certainly not have known how to adjust the outfit, the jewellery and the cap properly. This kind of physical contact is something a non-related female might do to a child, but not to a grown man, no officer would have agreed to be gussied up like this in respectable mixed company, and the girls know it. The insensitivity, the disrespect for another human being inherent in this "joke" is absolutely appalling. It is a portent of what was to happen later at Brighton. Mrs Bennet later laments that there must have been some impropriety at Brighton by the Forsters, to cause Lydia to elope. She is absolutely right. This playing dressups with servants, as if they were dolls, is exactly the sort of boundary-crossing thing that went on in the Forster household, which allowed Lydia to consider and choose elopement, against all her upbringing. If it was exciting and different, the Forster set were in. Never mind how other people would be affected. No wonder that monumental selfishness and callous disregard for her entire family's feelings is what we remember most about Lydia.
This is an interesting perspective, and clearly the Forster's household was not the place to keep Lydia in check. But are we sure about Chamberlayne being the servant's surname, and of his age? The story is told about one of the two Harrington sisters having to stay at home and Pen coming by herself to Mrs. Forster's dance. My impression is that they dress up a young servant, perhaps a page boy, who could pass as a young girl, to fool the company who were expecting Pen's sister to be there. The fact that none of the men recognized him seems to bear this out; had he been and older man, no one would have been fooled.
@@coloraturaElise That was my impression, too. He'd have to be young enough not to shave. I'm pretty sure Chamberlayne is his surname. It is a little shocking, though I imagine he would have been able to refuse if he really hadn't wanted to do it - he'd have to co-operate in order to fool the officers.
@@coloraturaElise I agree that the servant may have been younger. I do have the impression that Austen uses first names for young servants, although I am ready to stand corrected on this aspect of Regency idiom. I did wonder if Mrs Phillip's gown was selected because she is a middle-aged woman, which would have made her clothes more believable on a mature man; whereas Mrs Forster's dresses would have been fashionably youthful and might have looked odd on an older person. But Mrs phillip's gown may have been chosen simply because her clothes were a larger size, and therefore had a better chance of fitting a male. (Mrs Forster may simply have been too petite for her dresses to be worn by a male, even though dresses of the day could expand to accommodate a full pregnancy). I do wonder whether the officers were actually taken in by the servant's costume, despite Lydia's gleeful insistence that they were. As gentlemen, they would have been too polite to comment on or react to the singular appearance (and voice!) of the "lady" they were introduced to. And as bachelors, they might see benefits of giving the appearance of having been outsmarted, in order to flatter the young ladies. Lydia wouldn't think of that, of course; she is too caught up in the "success" of the joke.
@@londongael I don’t think we can assume that Chamberlayne could refuse to participate without consequences. The Forsters may perhaps have been very caring, forgiving and accommodating employers; but military households like the Colonel’s could also have an uncompromising and punitive management style (see Northanger Abbey). In an era of high unemployment, no social security, no unions or industrial tribunals or decent labour laws, employers of the time could and did make unreasonable demands of their staff, and staff just had to accept it or get the sack. I'm pretty certain that being expected to cross-dress to entertain your boss's guests was not a normal part of the job description of a servant working at a typical gentleman's residence; so it’s not unreasonable for the listener to consider the likelihood that most servants would have been reluctant to do it. If Chamberlayne didn’t mind or even enjoyed cross-dressing, then of course there would have been no problem -- but, thanks to Lydia’s lack of empathy, blindness to the feelings of others, and her obsession with herself that her narrative displays, we are told nothing about this aspect that is so critical to our understanding of what actually happened at the Forsters’. We are stuck with Lydia’s blinkered version of events. That girl is so frustrating.
@@a24-45 Yes, it could have been like that - I'm not saying it couldn't. As you say, we just don't know. The glimpses we get of the servants in Austen's work are fascinating.
Just starting this video. My impression of Lydia’s infatuation with Wickham is that she was raised by a woman of little understanding whose primary goal was to get her daughters married off as quickly as possible. Lydia is also young and full of high animal spirits, whatever that means. I think it means that she was an impulsive teenager with a pretty good sex drive and nothinj in her character to restrain her. That combined with her monther’s goal made it inevitable that she was going to elope with a mr wickham type.
Lydia certainly refers to him to Lizzy as "a certain person *we all* like!" (ch.39). What she doesn't seem to notice in this scene, though, is that Lizzy has gone off him somewhat.
@lisamedla it also mentions at the end that he often went to amuse himself in London and Bath. My guess is by the end she just parked herself on whatever family she could while her husband was off on his own business, a defacto separation
I don't have the book in front of me , but it seemed to me that Mr. Wickham showed some particularity for Elizabeth. Lydia felt, as the youngest, a desire to compete with her sisters, especially in the matter of marrying early. She may have also thought she was succeeding in taking Wickham away from Elizabeth.
If Mr Collins started at the beginning of Fordyce's Sermons, at the foot of page three he would have read that it was not "gold, nor emeralds, nor purple, but modesty, gravity and decent deportment that can truly adorn a woman." I'm sure we can all agree. Alas that Lydia should not have marked the lesson.
John Mullan talks about the use of the titles of "Mr, Mrs, Miss" and how important the formality if these titles are. So the fact that she drops the Mr is a clue in itself that she's become more informal with Wickham, but to add "dear" too.... Huge alert to the readers of Austen's time!
@@Eloraurora Indeed. There more closely you can get into the mindset of Jane Austen's contemporaries, her first readers, the more each word brings new levels of meaning. In Austen every single word counts. She lived in a time of letter writing, where the *receiver* had to pay the postage. So she was acutely aware of how valuable space on the page was when putting pen to paper! To receive a letter from Jane would really be something. 😏
I love the way Austen writes from the bias of specific characters, sometimes blatantly, and sometimes more subtly. It is part of what makes her writing such a fun jesting of the foibles she obviously saw in the people around her. Whether she’s sarcastically pointing out that three women cannot dance half the evening with one man, or she is carefully avoiding direct mention of Lydia’s activities while Elizabeth is naturally distracted by her own concerns, Austen does such an incredible job of emulating specific characters in the narrative voice by turns, while maintaining that outside perspective that allows both narrator and reader to laugh at the characters.
Poor Kitty, always in a supporting role. I'd love an analysis of her character, if there is enough in the text to work with-she's always been a favourite of mine!
Another wonderful analysis! I know this book backwards and forwards yet your observations always show something I haven't noticed before. JA truly is inexhaustible!
I've watched a few of your videos on P&P. I've enjoyed the book for the story's sake, concentrating on Lizzie and Darcy and the scandal, without really thinking too much about sub-plots and hints of the supporting characters. Thanks so much for opening it all up and making it even more enjoyable 😁
Thank you for such a close engagement with the text, allowing the reader/listener to see the power of carefully selected and intentional language along with the realistic development and placement (appearance and disappearance) of characters and their dialog to the advancement of the plot. Austin's work has the same sense of cinema as Tolstoy's work and the same sense of moral satisfaction as Shakespeare's comedies. Incomparable. You help your audience to understand this. 'Good job, Dr. Cox.
I love the way you explain things like this. I have read this book many times, and I have never picked up on things like the way the narrative draws the reader's attention away from Lydia's attraction to Wickham. I read along, going where Austen wants me to go. Your explanations make the book so much more fun. Thank you!
I haven’t tuned in to Dr. Cox’s channel for many months. My mistake: her talks never fail to impress me. If you are a real Austen admirer then this channel should be a regular destination for you -.as there are so many new insights to be gleaned from these videos.
this was really fun!!! i read an essay in defence of Lydia which completely changed my perspective on her, and now I'm a ride or die Lydia fan. so really enjoyed listening to this breakdown!!!
Lydia is boy-crazy in general, but given that Wickham has a type (young, easily gullible), she was easy for Wickham to manipulate. I thought that Lydia had a thing for Lieutenant Denny, though. She seems to flirt with several of the militia. What sucks, though, is her age. Lydia is 15-16 and she has no clue about consent or power imbalance. Something that Austen may not have been aware of is that soldiers that were stationed in Newcastle often got sent to the front lines. I'd like to think that in the future, Wickham died in combat, leaving an older Lydia to learn how to think more critically about life. And that she'll find a better love with a more stable soldier.
There is some indication of their future - if I remember correctly, Jane Austen indicated that they had several children, Wickham was kicked out of the army for his profligacy, and they spent much of their lives mooching off their family, especially Jane and Bingley, who were too kind to get rid of them quickly.
Jane never put anything in her novels without a reason. I'm certain she knew of that detail, like innumerable others that she put in (it takes a dedicated reader years to uncover them).
I am an older sister of sisters. I did experience my younger sister being very interested in the young man I was dating, as I started dating, when she was too young to start dating herself. She was trying to compete with me. And to this day this behavior still defines our relationship. It is annoying to say the least. But perhaps such is the fate of younger sisters. It does not stop at trying to get the attention of the young man who walked me home, but to having better education, to having a better house, .... better everything. Exhausting for her. Jane Austen wrote the part of Lydia very well.
French anthropologist René Girard wrote of "mimetic rivalry", which may well apply here - both in Jane Austen's novel and the situation you have personally experienced.
I enjoyed this very much! I’ve read the book a number of times but was always distracted by Lizzie’s point of view. I assumed much of Lydia’s motivation to have more to do with stealing him away from Lizzie (in Lydia’s imagined point of view) but wasn’t entirely satisfied. I agree with your analysis, and appreciate the in-depth dive into the text. I plan to read Pride & Prejudice again with a clearer head.
On reflection, there could be another contributing factor to the emotional expression of Darcy and Elizabeth on the "walk out", apart from the Lady Catherine's role. Lizzy thanks Darcy for his assistance in the case of Lydia. This leads to Darcy's very warm and frank "I thought only of you". And that seems to have opened the dam to expression: his profession of unchanged "affections and wishes". And the rest is history. Darcy, however, later claims (chap XVIII) that Lizzy's expression of gratitude had no material impact. He claims that given the Lady Catherine's intelligence he was "determined at once to know everything " [concerning Lizzy's feelings presumably].
I love this explanation of Lydia and Mr Wickham. I've read Pride and Prejudice probably a dozen times and am still surprised to have that relationship explained in this way. I really enjoy your chanel, Dr Cox.
Thank you for your fascinating videos, which always go so I'm depth. I'd been influenced by the 1995 BBC adaptation, which showed Mr Denny being her main guy, so it was good to look closely at the actual text.
I get a slightly different impression from Jane Austen's representation of Lydia's attentions. I feel like she means to show the mood of the town through Lydia, since Elizabeth is often around her, and Wickham's popularity is crucial to the plot. In particular, I think she means to show how Mr. Darcy's omission allowed these kinds of unfair preferences to continue, while also painting Lydia as rather superficial: being obsessed with the most popular man in town, beyond any of the encouragement she may have gotten from other officers. However you did strike on something very interesting, which made me think. The wording indicated that Lydia "needed only encouragement," and later it is said that Wickham may have been flirting with half the town. Is it possible Wickham was more forward with his attentions towards Lizzy, while still taking plenty of opportunities to flirt with whomever was around? Certainly he had to perfect his talents somehow....
I agree, and I reckon neither of them would have been particularly faithful after the marriage either. Doesn't mean that they wouldn't have necessarily enjoyed each other's company. So many depictions show him getting sick of her, but they both like gambling, going out and spending. They would've made a great pair of scammers.
@@Nicciolai I got the same impression. That they were simply hedonistic, and he probably regretted his marriage immediately, but it didn't mean he didn't turn it into an opportunity.
@@Nicciolai we are told at the end of the novel that 'Lidia never lost the respectability her marriage had given her.' this clearly implies that she did not stray.
Great. Thank you. So clearly and nicely put. My enjoyment of this and other novels by Jane Austen I have read has been enhanced by your close readings. I had not clocked quite a lot!
Great Video !! I would love so much if you made a video on this subject : "Did Mr Wickham notice that Darcy loved Lizzy? And is this one of the reasons he eloped with Lydia ??" Thank you for your good work !
I honestly missed the entire lisya attachment to Wickham even if I have read the book numerous times. I just sort of dismissed it as teen fun, well until the elopement. It wonderful to find new takes on my fave Jane austen and other literary works, thanks for sharing 💕
I always suspected that Lydia's interest was strengthened and somewhat motivated by Wickham's interest in Elizabeth. She was competitive, and I think she wanted to prove herself better than her more intelligent and decorous older sisters. She tries to get some jealousy out of Elizabeth after the marriage, but is too dull-witted to realize that she has failed at that. You make a good point that Lizzy was too absorbed in her own feelings to notice Lydia's preference. One might add that she would never have considered Lydia competition in the same way Lydia saw her as competition, perhaps showing some arrogance or vanity. But the way the book is written, I think we're meant to understand that Elizabeth _was_ superior to Lydia in every way, and if she had wanted Wyckham, she could have had him. For my own part, while I don't agree with every judgment of Lydia, I do find the character insufferably lacking in self-awareness, intelligence, and concern for others. She never even glimpses how close she took herself and her sisters to ruin. I figure she eventually had to learn how mercantile her husband was about marrying her, or at least that he's neither an honorable man nor especially in love with her.
or with the lack of self-reflection become quite mercantile too. He's well over 10 years older than her and if he was smart, he'd have got her into his scams, and she would've probably seen it all as a lark. Many women in history have become their criminal husband's sidekick and I reckon she'd have been game.
Very interesting and entertaining video. Well done for finding so many illustrations of attractive young Regency men 😁 I found particularly interesting the analysis of Lydia’s willingness to upend conventions around gender roles.
How are you doing dr octavia thank you for wonderful cultural channel as literature lovers and foreigners subscribers as overseas students want to increase our cultural level improve our English language as well i gathered main points about famous character you mentioned Jane Austen described Lydia bennet in pride and prejudice as having high animal spirit sort of natural self consequence she is attractive charismatic she is also reckless impulsive stout well grown girl of fifteen with fine complexion good humoured countence in chapter 46 summary when Elizabeth returns to her inn she finds two letters from Jane first relates that Lydia has eloped with wickham second that there is word from couple they may not be married yet although they are not married they have Been convinced to do so provided that wickham debts are paid and Lydia receives small yearly spitend Lydia elopement the view of that time society were strict living together without marriage was banned under imminency of social exclusion of whole family . Lydia and wickham were impror match financially speaaaking Lydia had little money to bring to marriage and he was only soldier also earning little himself in Austen time gentry couldn’t just marry for love we appreciate your great efforts stay safe blessed good luck to you your dearest ones happy mother to you all mothers we in Arabic countries celebrate mother day as well as you in England best wishes for you your family friends
Austen always plays with multiple things with each sentence. Also @26:00, in addition to Lydia and Wickham's interactions it is unclear whether Lizzie wants to talk to Wickham to get better acquainted because of a perceived mutual interest with Wickham or to inquire about Mr. Darcy because of a possibly not yet realized interest in Mr. Darcy (as she is and always has nurtured a grudge/prejudice of sorts against him for slighting her at their first inetraction - and rightfully so for he was wrong, if i might add). By the atmosphere of the text, we are lead to believe she is enamored with Wickham, but it is atleast unclear to me whether she is interested in Wickham really or is eager to learn more of Mr. Darcy after the slighting, as she might have noticed something about Mr. Darcy that sparked her interest. The text says she desperately hopes to learn about Wickham's acquaintance with Mr. Darcy all the while she is talking with Wickham: that's where I'm unclear, for what girl is thinking about another man when is talking to the man she supposedly likes. OR maybe I'm just a sucker for the love that eventually develops and am overinterpreting this.
I would have loved to have seen a continuation or Part II of this Novel. To whom would have the other two girls marry? Lydia and Wickham’s marriage unraveling? The mother’s lack of class, immaturity and lax rein on Lydia and Kitty really showed in the girls! Surprised that the first two young women turned out fairly well. Mary was in her own world.
Hi Octavia. I think Lydia certainly had her eye on Wickham from the moment she first saw him, but I'm sure she would have transferred her admiration to another officer had he actively snubbed her. She seems to be more keen on the general idea of a man in regimentals than on a particular individual, and once snubbed by him she would have soon shrugged it off and moved on to the next Wickham, Carter or Denny.
Yes, but that would probably have faded when the next handsome young officer came along, if Wickham hadn't encouraged her, as he presumably does, in Brighton. Lydia doesn't seem capable of falling seriously in love. That said, I think the elopement was her idea - Wickham just wants to leave town in a hurry, to escape his debts. Suddenly, Lydia is there, and the easiest way to keep her quiet is to take her with him - certainly, he has no intention of marrying a girl without money. I sometimes wonder if Lydia is quite right in the head. She is literally unable to take anything seriously. There is a range of senses of humour in this "light, bright and sparkling" novel - Mr Bennet is too caught up in his own clever, sardonic humour to be a good parent, Lydia simply sees everything as a joke, several characters, including Jane and Mary, have no sense of humour at all. Elizabeth and Darcy eventually balance each other out - he learns to take himself less seriously and she to temper her wit with a bit of humility. Food for thought, as always, in this video. I had noticed, and found very odd, the cross-dressing incident, but just put it down to the questionable company. The point you make about the blurring of gender roles is illuminating.
Yes and no! Yes Lydia was infatuated with Mr. Wickham, but had he disappeared from the picture, she would have moved on to someone else just like she did from Mr. Carter to Mr. Denny to Mr. Wickham. She is only 16. It would worry me to no end if she was my daughter or granddaughter! But I see her first and foremost as a wild teenager in need of parental guidance!
Replying to own comment to add that it's similar to other "out of the blue" elopements and relationships in Austen's novels - all subtly seeded, when you look back. Julia Bertram and Mr Yates, Penelope Clay and Mr Elliot, and, the tour de force, Jane Fairfax and Frank Churchill.
I very much enjoyed this video. I've read many of the comments and have noticed that Lydia is described as 'boy-crazy'. We never talk about boys being 'girl-crazy', yet my understanding is that post-puberty hetero boys spend an awful lot of time thinking about girls/women and what they'd like to do with them. Lydia is out-going, gregarious, and has few (any?) inhibitions. But is she any more interested in men than other girls - without the ability to follow boy bands? I think part of her flirtatious behaviour is about enjoying attention and getting power, such as it is, through her sexuality. She appears to have limited interests other than chasing men, but what did she do before she hit puberty? If a girl like her were alive today (and I'm sure there are many) and had better parenting, an education, and the much greater opportunity to direct her energy in other directions, might she have been different? Or would she only be posting selfies all the time and be vulnerable to online sexual predators? I'd like to think that with the right guidance she'd at least have got into drama or basketball. Edit: Immediately after posting this I found this video, The Psychology of Lydia Bennet (which I hope Dr. Cox won't mind me adding because I think her video and the other work well together) ua-cam.com/video/sfQRgiBx5qk/v-deo.html
Just one question that had not occurred to me before- why doesn't Elizabeth tell her father Mr. Bennet about Wickham's past. The book goes to quite a lot of detail about her not feeling it was proper to embarras Georgiana by informing "her general acquaintance" but she does tell Jane and was very aware of Lydia being in danger if she went away with the regiment. I also discovered recently that Pride and Prejudice was the only book Austen published where she sold the copywright rather than on comission so she only made a fraction of the profit, seems awfully sad for such a great book. Another point given that at the time reading novels was considered frivilous (and Pride and Prejudice was considered to be so!) I think that Mr Collins sermons, Lydia's fate (although averted) and indeed to an extent Mr Darcy's response to Elizabeths rejection of him were an atempt to ensure that Pride and Prejudice didn't seem to condone scandalous behaviour/impropriety. I can see a formidable aunt being pointed to these passages in order to be persuaded that Pride and Prejudice was "improving literature" and served to point out the dangers to young women of running off with dashing young officers :-) !
I love your analysis of these works! Very good points on Lydia! Can you do more videos on Sense and Sensibility and on the topic of how it is Marianne and Willoughby spend so much time alone together unsupervised.
I love how the tv version gives you a tip off at the ball when he’s talking about missing one person and holds the gaze of Lydia as he says it. I felt it was a nice way of foreshadowing what the narrative voice reveals. It’s hard to adapt the films because there’s so much thought but unsaid. I always felt like Jane and Kitty were underwritten. Especially Jane who is so passive. Thanks for a great close reading!
I have just watched this video. I found it very enlightening. I am wondering if Lydia’s fascination with Wickam was partially up to being competitive with her older sisters. For example when she comes back to Longhorn after being married. She makes a large point to let the older sisters know that she walks into the house before them. She appears to have a lot of glee in doing so.
Dr. Cox, would you please consider doing a close reading of Mansfield Park to determine whether Mary Crawford had any suspicion of Fanny’s attachment to Edmund? A straight reading suggests not, but there are a few phrases that make me wonder... For example, when Mary comes to Fanny’s room to practice her lines and says that she will be embarrassed to say them to Edmund’s face, and then asks Fanny, “Could you do it? But then you are his cousin, which makes all the difference” or something to that effect. That gives me pause because I wonder if it’s a clue.
Thank you for these brilliant videos that enhance our appreciation of JA skills as an author. I've only just discovered them, while looking for audiobooks of P&P (for once, the algorithms did a good job!) and my comment is probably too late to contribute to the topic, but I would like to share it. I remember reading that the choice of the surnames Darcy and DeBurgh was aimed at stressing the aristocratic connections of both (they are of Norman origin, and so, but a little less obviously, is Bennet). Of course one cannot help noticing that the wicked Wickham is aptly named as well. So JA is sometimes particularly attentive to the connotation given by the name she chooses for a particular character (Lucy Steele would be another exemple). It strikes me that out of the five Bennet girls, four have traditional historical English female names: Jane, Elizabeth, Mary, Catherine and that Lydia is singled out as her name is more "exotic"-sounding, fancy and fashionable. It comes from ancient Greek but we can doubt that Mrs. Bennet (she is her last and favourite child, after all) chose it on that ground. Has it perhaps something to do with the Lydia Languish of "The Rivals"? I must confess I have never read the play but I know its plot involves a caricature of a young lady full of romantic notions whose most cherished dream is that of...*eloping with a pennyless soldier* Was the name deliberately chosen by JA both as a joke and as hint to contemporary readers, who must have been better acquainted with Sheridan's play?
Fools rush in, so here goes: early novelists were very mindful of the possibility of being sued, and so anonymised identifiable elements, where possible. Even today, I've seen comments on the rise of unlikely surnames in novels with a realistic setting, for the same reason. As Wickham is hardly a credit to whatever regiments he was in, this was probably wise.
But if Longbourne is made up, and Pemberley is made up, and Meryton is made up - - why couldn't she invent a shire? "Bemblyshire," or "Honkingshire," or "Squirrelshire" would be less jarring than ----shire.
@@lauradavis4610 Because a "shire" is more or less the equivalent of a state in the US, with the militia unit being like a National Guard unit belonging to that state. If someone made up the name of a state, it would throw us out of the story.
Can you please explain the militia in Jane Austen? I don't really understand what they were doing in the Blankshire. What does the militia mean to Jane Austen? In P&P the military seems to represent a space of looseness, fun. In Persuasion, a military appointment represents something different, a space for attaining wealth and title. In terms of class is it better to be in the militia or be a lawyer like Mr Gardiner? Perhaps you could go over what the militia (and the clergy?) mean in Austen?
Considering the second eldest son of the landed gentry usually became a clergyman and any subsequent sons often went into the military as officers, it seems that the military was considered a more distinguished profession than the law, etc. In "Sense and Sensibility", Fanny and her mother hope that Edward will enter the military and cut a dashing figure until such time as he comes into his inheritance.
Lydia wanted to be the first of her sisters to be married. She was tired of being last of 5. And she zeroed in on Wickham because he was Lizzy's favorite.
It is also interesting that while there is some of Lydia's interest in Wickham prior to Lizzy going to the Colins' house, she also continued to show some preference for Denny, the narrative voice seems to be telling us that a lot of Lydia's attachment occurred while Elizabeth was away (Both Elizabeth and Mary King are out of the picture), and that Lizzy's preoccupation with her own troubles is what misled her about Lydia's preference.
Thanks for your illuminating analysis, Ms. Cox. One sign of all great writers to be able to understand and render the different individual psychological personality of each character they create. This puts Jane Austen on a level with Shakespeare and Tolstoy.
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Question: Sorry to put this here, but could you make a UA-cam about rank in Sanditon? We are trying to determine if Charlotte is higher ranking than Colbourne. Very Lizzie/Darcy-esque. Thx for your video about rank in P&P!
Hello! I recently discovered your channel and am enjoying the contents of it thoroughly, specially the close readings.
A request, would you please consider doing a close reading of what events made Mr Darcy partial and then fall in love with Lizzy? Since we know the narrative from Lizzy's point of view of events unfolded. I would very much love to hear you pick apart the evolution of Mr Darcy's emotions. 😄
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Videos like this clearly prove that well-written novels like Pride and Prejudice are actually made of several novels hidden into one. I can easily imagine Austen outlining every character's individual journey beforehand and then, from each one, picking only the scenes that serve the general "main" narrative's purpose and filtering them through Lizzy's eyes. This is masterful writing!
Agree! This is one of the (many) reasons I call her the greatest novelist and this the greatest novel of the English language. She puts it all together. Next to her art, Charles Dickens is just a cartoonist.
Interesting. I'd never thought of that but it makes so much sense
Wickham has no good reason to run away with Lydia. Weak character; just a weak creation of crisis for Darcy to be a hero and rescue Lizzy indirectly with wow money!!!
@@thebuttermilkyway687 Yes, Dickensian female characters are caricatures whereas all of Austen's have the potential of further development
@@huypt7739 Surely for Wickham it's more fun to run away from his debts in Brighton with a young girl, even if he soon bores of her...he couldn't care less about her or her family's reputation...demonstrating just how despicable he is.
I'd always thought that Lydia was trying to "steal" Mr. Wickham from Lizzie and seemed really proud to have done just that when she came back all gloating about being the youngest but first to be married.
Yes and I think her belief that Lizzie had a high opinion of Wickham served as a character reference for her and probably made her more vulnerable than she might otherwise have been.
I think in light of this video it’s more that Lydia got a crush on first sight of him and became upset that Elizabeth seemed to like him as well and felt a bit jealous because Wickham gave her attention at first. So she needed to gloat a bit because if she was the main character of the story Elizabeth would have been an antagonist (not that Lydia hated her, but she is the older sister seen more beautiful and respected who Wickham noticed first).
Me too. Exactly. Gloating.
I think she was a typical young and pleasure bent narcissistic teen. No respect or empathy for the predicament caused to her family members reputations. She was proud of her illicit relationship with Wickham prior to forced marriage.
Isn’t it interesting how for most of the novel, Lydia is practically an exhibitionist when it comes to her attractions and intentions, but when she is at Brighton, her letters to Kitty are secretive?
It’s the only time that we are witness to the intimacy between Kitty and Lydia. There’s something sad in the fact that Kitty’s personality is entirely ignored, and that the person she is closest to in the world is her self-absorbed, capricious sister.
Also, another reason why the family was not concerned about Lydia’s behavior all along was because Kitty was there, kind of as a built in chaperone. As soon as they are separated, Lydia lets loose.
She knows it's wrong. Lizzie and Jane have told her enough times, she has seen how her older relatives behave, she's had an education of some sort, she is the daughter of a gentleman in a god-fearing household and goes to church every week. However, when she writes things she has the capacity to use restraint and think about it, as writing takes time. But when it's action in the moment, everything is immediate so it is harder to check yourself. As her parents fail to do so either, there's no restraint to stop her exposing herself.
I honestly felt sorry got Kitty when the story ended. Then again, I guess she is now better off with having more interactions with Elizabeth and Darcy while Mrs Bennet is occupied with Mary.
All three of the younger sisters are let down by their parents (and in extension the story). Mary tries to find self worth in becoming “accomplished” and preachy with everyone laughing at her. Kitty just tags along to whatever Lydia is doing and tends to receive the scolding for the behaviour. And Lydia obviously only defines herself through male attention and is shipped off to a very risky situation because her father doesn’t want to deal with her being petulant. She promptly gets herself into a terrible situation and then ends up in a loveless marriage far away from her family at the age of 16. At least the other two get some redemption at the end.
All five of the sisters are not particularly accomplished by the standards of their peers, they don’t seem to be very good at or interested in the typical female pursuits like playing instruments, singing, embroidery, or languages. (With the exception of Mary, but her attempts don’t seem to be encouraged at all). Which means even being a governess is out of the question. They HAVE to marry. In desperation Mrs Bennet has thrown them all out into society at the same time, even Lydia, who is only 15 when the novel
begins.
Mr Bennet not only doesn’t stop his wife from potentially ruining the future of their children, he also hasn’t put any money aside for dowries or to look after his wife and unmarried daughters if he should die. Both Bennets are terrible parents, though it is hinted that they were still trying with Jane and Lizzy and then just kinda gave up. The younger ones never really stand a chance - that is, until two of their sisters marry well and turn the family dynamic around. Sadly it’s too late for Lydia at that point.
Since Wickham was the only officer that Lizzie had ever shown any interest in, I always thought Lydia loved the mistaken idea that she was stealing Mr. Wickham away from Lizzie as much as, if not more than, she loved Wickham himself.
"She is a great fool for going away if she liked him" was said about Mary King, but it could have easily been about Lizzy leaving to visit the Colins and leaving Wickham uncontested. I think Lydia is so focused on winning Wickham and competing to miss the fact that Lizzy isn't interested in him. Lydia wants the recognition of being the first married and upstaging her sisters by having the most handsome charismatic husband. I think Lydia still wants to think Lizzy a fool since it boosts how clever she is.
Excellent point!
More to this I think initially Lizzie very much was interested. Despite Lydia's resentment of her older sister she clearly had an appreciating of Elizabeths intelligence and sense and this both probably led to her believing Wickham to be more desirable and encouraged her to trust him. I don't think Lydia was in any way aware of the change in Elizabeths opinion or view of him, infact the book goes to quite a bit of trouble to explain that Elizabeth doesn't make the rest of her family aware of Wickham's character. It's not clear if Elizabeth tries to warn Lydia about Wickham (it's not mentioned as far as I remember) eitherway it's likely Lydia would have interpreted it as Lizzie trying to protect her own interest in Wickham.
Exactly what I thought as well!
Very smart!
So Lydia, unlike both Mary King and Elizabeth, never “went away,” until she went to Brighton, to which place Mr. Wickham was also going. Good on Lydia for never being a “great fool!” 😂
Zaneel. Hmmm... I had the impression that Lydia didn't notice her sisters much. She did want to be married first or to dance more than her sisters and knew that she was the tallest. But these are general thoughts. I don't think that she was specifically aware of or cared about Liz' interests or feelings.
Adding to this I would argue that while Wickham obviously chooses Lydia because he believes we can get away with seducing her and then most likely abandoning her after he's had his fun, I feel an undercurrent of spiteful revenge against Lizzie since by the time Lydia goes to Brighton it's already clear to Wickham that Lizzie sees through him. I think he sees in Lydia an opportunity to hurt Lizzie before (in his mind) she can damage him by revealing his character to others.
It's interesting how Lizzie is, in some respects, an unreliable narrator where Lydia and Wickham are concerned. In lumping Lydia and Kitty together, as you point out, we are misdirected into taking Lydia's attachment less seriously. It strikes me that Lizzie takes her sisters, Jane excepted, so unseriously that she exerts minimal attention to understanding their inclinations, and we, as readers, follow her lead.
I've often wondered why Kitty is there at all as a character. Aside from hyperbole - five daughters to marry off somehow seeming very much worse than four - she never seems that essential to the plot, but its clear now that Austen created her with the purpose of misdurecting us. As Dr Cox points out, having not one but two silly girls gushing over Wickham effectively camouflages that one of them actually has such an overwhelming crush on him that she will be persuaded by his seduction of her.
Incidentally in the wonderful Lizzie Bennet Diaries - a modern day P&P adaptation done as a vlog - there are just three sisters (Jane, Lizzie, Lydia) while Mary is a first cousin and Kitty is - you guessed it - a cat!
In spite of being the Heroine, Elizabeth is not perfect. She doesn't notice some things, and misinterprets others, just as we all do.
Not only that, I think she got this habit from her father.
Yes once you point it out like this, Lizzie seems downright neglectful of Lydia, as you say, like Mr Bennet. I feel quite sorry for Lydia. At least Jane and Lizzie paid more attention to Kitty after they got married.
What you said about us following Lizzie's lead in what we pay attention to is so spot on. One of the things I love about Austen's writing is everytime we go back, there's a treat, a new layer of meaning that changes things and, consequently, changes us as readers.
Following Lizzie's lead in her treatment and perception of Lydia gutted me when watching The Lizzie Bennet Diaries bc at one point I was confronted with how I mistjudged and neglected Lydia.
I can’t imagine the amount of time it takes to pick a topic, thoroughly research it, and script out talking points for a 45+ minute video... and deliver a video almost weekly. But you make it look effortless! Another great video - thank you x 10000!
This is interesting. I had never put Lydia’s behavior in the lottery tickets scene together with Wickam’s gambling. I thought it only to accentuate her being scatterbrained. It is a brilliant touch. No one is better at characterizing “ridiculous”than Austen. Thank you for your analysis. The next time I read P&P, I will notice more subtleties.
I think Dickens is the best at characterizing "ridiculous". But, Jane Austen's characters are still very vivid while being more realistic.
This is a truly fascinating analysis, Lizzy actually ignores Lydia as much as possible so her not knowing Lydia’s preference is just right
Austen is such an acute writer of families. I wonder if the fact that the older Bennett daughters have more sense of decorum and moral norms than the younger might have some correlation with their father's engagement with parenting. He seems to have been the closest the family had to some kind of moral compass, a post he abandons over time. Jane and Lizzy have a more-or-less accepted view of correct behavior, Mary (seeing the approval the older girls get) goes a bit over the top in the morality department, and Kitty has little and Liddy almost no sense of propriety, being more under the influence of their mother. By the time the younger girls come along, Mr Bennett has practically thrown up his hands and given up, to the point of letting Liddy go off to Brighton with questionable guardians. It isn't really odd that a family of five daughters (or sons, for that matter) should find five such distinctly different personalities and attitudes, at least to anyone who knows large families -- as Austen clearly does.
Your interpretation and mine are similar. I think Lizzie and Jane had the most stable early childhood, before Mr. and Mrs. Bennet tired of each other. Mary is the rule enforcer, trying to hold them all together and find some stability. Kitty and Lydia are benignly neglected by their mother and almost completely dismissed by their father. Mrs. Bennet has done what many lonely wives do, making allies of her youngest daughters rather than acting as their parent.
Interesting point, although I think the fact only Jane and Elizabeth frequently stayed with the Gardeners had more to do with their superior characters. Their parents would never have made nor set such good examples of propriety or felicity in relations between husband and wife.
@@joanwerthman4116 Oh, I like this idea! It makes a lot of sense.
@@joanwerthman4116 Interrstingly, it's quite likely that the Gardiners married when Jane was about 12 or 13, given that their eldest child is eight at Christmas. They would have been role models for Jane and Lizzy during adolescence, but later they may have been too busy with their own growing family to do much for the younger girls.
Mr Bennet would have not taken any part in raising his daughters. They were solely on the responsibilty of their mother, and if possible nanny.
Actually this question has bothered me for a while, and I cannot disagree with your reading of it. Now I know that my shock of Lydia's elopement was due to seeing the whole story through Elizabeth's eyes only. My blindness is rightfully a statement of Austen's writer genius which will never end to surprise me.
I believe that Lydia's infatuation with Wickham became more single-minded while Lizzie was staying with Colinses and traveling with the Gardners, and her designs on him were solidified at Brighton. So, naturally, Lizzie would not have seen that attachment and partiality form.
“And Mary King is safe.” 😂 I love this line. I am fond of the idea that someone who cared about Mary King got wind of who Wickham was and decided “eff that- you are going to your uncle’s, wether you like it or not.”
Oooooh. I completely missed that Lizzy had not been there and that she ignored Lydia so often that she was not a reliable source on the subject! I also missed the very strong hints about Lydia''s competitiveness. I'm always seeing new points of view and subtlety from these videos,, and I love it. English class was never this interesting!
I think Lydia had her eye on any man in a uniform. In the States, we call girls like her boot-chasers. Lizzie was always trying to rein in Lydia and Kitty's wild antics and I am sure Lydia
resented it. Running off with her sister's perceived suitor was a way of getting back at her. She also was tired of being the youngest and wanted her independence. Her friend Mrs.
Forster is described (I think by Lizzie) as a very young woman and she was married and free from parental control. Lydia wanted the same.
I think that Wickham was also getting back at Elizabeth by ruining her sister.
But then she'd be under her husband's control, and whoever he would turn out to be, he probably wouldn't put up with Lydia flirting with every officer in the regiment. I wonder if Lydia did end up continuing her flirtatious ways after she was married. I don't see why her personality would have changed just because she got married. I would not be at all surprised if she ended up having affairs with other officers.
I can see the Wickham marriage essentially being 'open'. While Lydia wouldn't stop her flirting, neither would Wickham. He would continue to seduce young ladies.
@@SchlichteToven Yes, but Lydia is not a great thinker and that aspect would have probably alluded her. Also, I think Col. Forster was probably very indulgent with his
young wife and she might have thought Wickham would be the same.
@@SchlichteToven I don't think she thought that through. She just saw being the first of her sisters to get married and having a wedding where she was the centre of attention. Both Wickham and Lydia were probably not faithful. They also didn't like each other after a while to add fuel to that fire.
I think she is boy crazy in general. She wanted Mr Bingley to choose her without having ever seen him. Had he paid attention to her, she would have gone for him. She basically wants to be the centre of attention and she is a woman while the militia are men, so she is an oddity. However, and officer is exciting to her because they're much more accessible in many ways and there is the whole knight in shining armour thing. Wickham is very alluring to start with- but then people want what they can't have and they particularly want what others have- and because he pursues Lizzie then Mary, she wants him even more. He's the top prize rather than her love interest. While she prefers him, it's not deep feelings and more a trophy- "I got him and married him while you both lost him ha ha". Had someone Frank Churchill-like rocked up in regimentals, she'd feel the same and replace Wickham.
It's as if "the officers" was a boys band. Or the cast of a CW sort of TV show aimed at teenagers. They're all pretty and everyday a different one is the favorite, depending who's singing lead in the latest song or who's got the best storyline in the latest episode.
And Lydia is a normal 15 year old, but with too much means, too much access and not enough supervision.
Great comparison.
In the 1995 serial, in all the scenes they are together, Wickham glances at or mentions Lydia. I thought that was an interesting touch implying he was actually interested in HER, not Lizzie. It's interesting to see the opposite is true in the text, I never noticed it before.
Wow, seeing now for how long Lydia was interested in Wickham and then remembering your video about his motives/plans, I feel really sorry for her. Her parents failed her horribly! And it's really interesting to see how the "narrator" is so much Lizzy's perspective that so many things are glossed over!
Another fascinating lecture - thank you.
At the risk of going "off-topic", something the significance of which, in all the times I've read this novel, I've somehow missed: in Jane's second letter to Lizzy, she writes "Poor Kitty has anger for having concealed the attachment but as it was a matter of confidence, one cannot wonder". This really is Jane speaking and shows what a reliable person she is - when, later, the (now) Lydia Wickham describes her wedding to Jane and Lizzy and reveals that Darcy was at present, she (Lydia) immediately is worried because she wasn't supposed to disclose that fact. Jane tells her to say no more of the matter (much to Lizzy's frustration) - and this is entirely of a piece with her sympathy for Kitty for not breaking confidences gained from Lydia's letters.
That moment honestly hit the nail on the coffin for my sympathy for Kitty.
I am not totally convinced of the conclusions. For example: I think it could be possible that on the return from Kent Elizabeth had a more selective hearing of Wickham's name due to the shocking tales of Wickham’s past. Due to Lydia's flighty attraction to the officers (flirting with six at once) I perceive that the more serious attraction to Wickham in Brighton resulted from the torn gown which Mrs. Forster should have repaired before sending Lydia her possessions after her elopement. The mention of the gown is not accidental. I could imagine that the tear occurred during a more aggressive sexual interaction between Wickham and Lydia. For Lydia it would mean she would have to marry Wickham and to do that accompany him on his flight from Brighton. That would be the origin of the elopement. To have Kitty know of that altercation would require that it would have had to happen a few days before the elopement.
I've read this book so many times, and you still manage to teach me things I've overlooked. Highly enjoyed this video.
Thank you for returning to Pride and Prejudice. I am interested in your thoughts ( if any) about the similarity and parallels between the characters and personalities of Lady Catherine and Mrs Bennett. They are both monsters, crass , socially inept and selfish.
Another parallel is the marriage proposals of Mr Collins and D’Arcy. Both are self serving lectures to Elizabeth on their own motivations and requirements.
While I admit, it has been years since I read the novel, but do pull out the 1995 classic quite often. I remember Lydia snipping at Lizzy, “Are going you Wickham all to yourself, Lizzy?” That was my first clue that indeed she fancied him from their first meeting. After, watching your videos going in-depth, I find I watch the film with a greater understanding and through new lens.
Ah!! I had recently reread Pride and Prejudice after watching your video on why Wickham eloped with her, and noticed for the first time all the little moments where she shows an interest in him. Every time I go back to her work, I'm more convinced Austen's skill as a writer was so ahead of her contemporaries.
It’s wonderful of Austen to tell us that the only thing higher in Lydia’s esteem than Wickham is a game of chance. In a way they’re a great match, since they both care about gambling and the pleasure of risk more than for other people.
I think that's what makes them perfect for each other. they both get what they deserve!
I agree that Lydia and Wickham both get what they deserve. Yet, I think what they got was not all that bad. Moreover, I see Lydia in a different way. I see Lizzie's strong character as the center point of the entire story. I see the primary thread as being Lizzie and Darcy finding a chemistry that works, and I see Lizzie uplifting Darcy. For me, the second most important thread runs between Lizzie and Lydia. There was a real danger that all the girls would stay unmarried until Mr. Bennett's death. Instead of overthinking her situation until catastrophe arrives, Lydia strikes out and forces adulthood onto Darcy and Bingley. Lydia is vivacious and pretty so Wickham is not at a loss. Wickham is not a prince but nor is he a beggar on the street. Though Lydia's home might be modest she has the choice of at least two grand estates to visit. If Wickham screws up, he will be smashed between Lydia and Lizzie, i.e., Mrs. Darcy. Lydia informed Lizzie that Darcy attended her wedding. Lydia is the third most essential personality in the story.
Love your analyses. I have a question off the Lydia-Wickham issue.
Would Elizabeth and Darcy have become engaged without the intervention of Lady Catherine at Longbourn? Darcy says as much: "It taught me to hope..". The narrator voice says explicitly "She [Lizzy] soon learnt that they were indebted for their good understanding to the efforts of his aunt..." (Chap XVI)
However, Chap XVIII reveals they almost made a hash of it. Lizzy: "...what made you so reluctant to come to the point at last" Darcy: "Because you were grave and silent and gave me no encouragement"
@A Byron Thank you A Byron for your enthusiastic support for my question. You clearly have unique and discerning intelligence.
Enjoyed the discussion. It occurs to me that Mrs Bennet and Mrs Phillips were probably very like Kitty and Lydia when young!
Thank you for sharing your analysis on UA-cam. So interesting and increases my love of and interest in Jane Austen and her novels.
love this investigation Dr Cox. In Austen, every word counts.
I had forgotten ever reading about the cross-dressing incident. You make such a good point - this incident foreshadows Lydia's tendency to ignore conventional behavior and courtship roles.
Listening, I was shocked that Colonel Forster would have allowed his wife's newfound female friends to humiliate the most senior male servant in his house (known by his surname Chamberlayne, not first name, therefore in a senior position and possibly employed by the Colonel for a long time) This servant might have been much older than the girls and Mrs Forster. The intention of the prank was for this presumably trustworthy employee to be put on show and laughed at. How would this senior employee have felt to be made into a laughing stock? as a servant he did not have a choice about participating, he had to do what his boss Mrs Forster ordered. The Meryton girls hardly know this servant, but this does not excuse why they have zero concern for his feelings. Were these teenagers standing watching while this man changed his clothes? he would had to have been touched by the girls, e.g be physically laced into the dress, as he would certainly not have known how to adjust the outfit, the jewellery and the cap properly. This kind of physical contact is something a non-related female might do to a child, but not to a grown man, no officer would have agreed to be gussied up like this in respectable mixed company, and the girls know it. The insensitivity, the disrespect for another human being inherent in this "joke" is absolutely appalling.
It is a portent of what was to happen later at Brighton. Mrs Bennet later laments that there must have been some impropriety at Brighton by the Forsters, to cause Lydia to elope. She is absolutely right. This playing dressups with servants, as if they were dolls, is exactly the sort of boundary-crossing thing that went on in the Forster household, which allowed Lydia to consider and choose elopement, against all her upbringing. If it was exciting and different, the Forster set were in. Never mind how other people would be affected. No wonder that monumental selfishness and callous disregard for her entire family's feelings is what we remember most about Lydia.
This is an interesting perspective, and clearly the Forster's household was not the place to keep Lydia in check. But are we sure about Chamberlayne being the servant's surname, and of his age? The story is told about one of the two Harrington sisters having to stay at home and Pen coming by herself to Mrs. Forster's dance. My impression is that they dress up a young servant, perhaps a page boy, who could pass as a young girl, to fool the company who were expecting Pen's sister to be there. The fact that none of the men recognized him seems to bear this out; had he been and older man, no one would have been fooled.
@@coloraturaElise That was my impression, too. He'd have to be young enough not to shave. I'm pretty sure Chamberlayne is his surname. It is a little shocking, though I imagine he would have been able to refuse if he really hadn't wanted to do it - he'd have to co-operate in order to fool the officers.
@@coloraturaElise I agree that the servant may have been younger. I do have the impression that Austen uses first names for young servants, although I am ready to stand corrected on this aspect of Regency idiom. I did wonder if Mrs Phillip's gown was selected because she is a middle-aged woman, which would have made her clothes more believable on a mature man; whereas Mrs Forster's dresses would have been fashionably youthful and might have looked odd on an older person. But Mrs phillip's gown may have been chosen simply because her clothes were a larger size, and therefore had a better chance of fitting a male. (Mrs Forster may simply have been too petite for her dresses to be worn by a male, even though dresses of the day could expand to accommodate a full pregnancy).
I do wonder whether the officers were actually taken in by the servant's costume, despite Lydia's gleeful insistence that they were. As gentlemen, they would have been too polite to comment on or react to the singular appearance (and voice!) of the "lady" they were introduced to. And as bachelors, they might see benefits of giving the appearance of having been outsmarted, in order to flatter the young ladies. Lydia wouldn't think of that, of course; she is too caught up in the "success" of the joke.
@@londongael I don’t think we can assume that Chamberlayne could refuse to participate without consequences. The Forsters may perhaps have been very caring, forgiving and accommodating employers; but military households like the Colonel’s could also have an uncompromising and punitive management style (see Northanger Abbey). In an era of high unemployment, no social security, no unions or industrial tribunals or decent labour laws, employers of the time could and did make unreasonable demands of their staff, and staff just had to accept it or get the sack. I'm pretty certain that being expected to cross-dress to entertain your boss's guests was not a normal part of the job description of a servant working at a typical gentleman's residence; so it’s not unreasonable for the listener to consider the likelihood that most servants would have been reluctant to do it. If Chamberlayne didn’t mind or even enjoyed cross-dressing, then of course there would have been no problem -- but, thanks to Lydia’s lack of empathy, blindness to the feelings of others, and her obsession with herself that her narrative displays, we are told nothing about this aspect that is so critical to our understanding of what actually happened at the Forsters’. We are stuck with Lydia’s blinkered version of events. That girl is so frustrating.
@@a24-45 Yes, it could have been like that - I'm not saying it couldn't. As you say, we just don't know. The glimpses we get of the servants in Austen's work are fascinating.
Just starting this video. My impression of Lydia’s infatuation with Wickham is that she was raised by a woman of little understanding whose primary goal was to get her daughters married off as quickly as possible. Lydia is also young and full of high animal spirits, whatever that means. I think it means that she was an impulsive teenager with a pretty good sex drive and nothinj in her character to restrain her. That combined with her monther’s goal made it inevitable that she was going to elope with a mr wickham type.
I think Lydia had her eye on him only after Elizabeth showed interest.
Lydia certainly refers to him to Lizzy as "a certain person *we all* like!" (ch.39). What she doesn't seem to notice in this scene, though, is that Lizzy has gone off him somewhat.
@@DrOctaviaCox I think Mr. Wickham never loved Lydia, right? And-Lydia was in love with love.
@@janet8418 yes, Wickham seems incapable of loving anyone but himself
@@janet8418 in the end I think it says that her affection for him lasted longer than his.
@lisamedla it also mentions at the end that he often went to amuse himself in London and Bath. My guess is by the end she just parked herself on whatever family she could while her husband was off on his own business, a defacto separation
I don't have the book in front of me , but it seemed to me that Mr. Wickham showed some particularity for Elizabeth. Lydia felt, as the youngest, a desire to compete with her sisters, especially in the matter of marrying early. She may have also thought she was succeeding in taking Wickham away from Elizabeth.
Finding Dr Octavia Cox’s videos (and the associated comments below) has been the next best thing to discovering a new Jane Austen novel. Thank you xx
If Mr Collins started at the beginning of Fordyce's Sermons, at the foot of page three he would have read that it was not "gold, nor emeralds, nor purple, but modesty, gravity and decent deportment that can truly adorn a woman." I'm sure we can all agree. Alas that Lydia should not have marked the lesson.
John Mullan talks about the use of the titles of "Mr, Mrs, Miss" and how important the formality if these titles are.
So the fact that she drops the Mr is a clue in itself that she's become more informal with Wickham, but to add "dear" too....
Huge alert to the readers of Austen's time!
Great point! Like Emma getting mad at Mrs. Elton for calling Mr. Knightley just "Knightley."
@@Eloraurora
Indeed.
There more closely you can get into the mindset of Jane Austen's contemporaries, her first readers, the more each word brings new levels of meaning.
In Austen every single word counts.
She lived in a time of letter writing, where the *receiver* had to pay the postage. So she was acutely aware of how valuable space on the page was when putting pen to paper! To receive a letter from Jane would really be something. 😏
Captain Carter, we barely knew ye. 😂
A lucky escape, perhaps.
@@DrOctaviaCox for Captain Carter
Very interesting video, as always! I love how many subtle subplots are hidden in this novel, so much to discover!
I love the way Austen writes from the bias of specific characters, sometimes blatantly, and sometimes more subtly. It is part of what makes her writing such a fun jesting of the foibles she obviously saw in the people around her. Whether she’s sarcastically pointing out that three women cannot dance half the evening with one man, or she is carefully avoiding direct mention of Lydia’s activities while Elizabeth is naturally distracted by her own concerns, Austen does such an incredible job of emulating specific characters in the narrative voice by turns, while maintaining that outside perspective that allows both narrator and reader to laugh at the characters.
Poor Kitty, always in a supporting role. I'd love an analysis of her character, if there is enough in the text to work with-she's always been a favourite of mine!
Another wonderful analysis! I know this book backwards and forwards yet your observations always show something I haven't noticed before. JA truly is inexhaustible!
I've watched a few of your videos on P&P. I've enjoyed the book for the story's sake, concentrating on Lizzie and Darcy and the scandal, without really thinking too much about sub-plots and hints of the supporting characters. Thanks so much for opening it all up and making it even more enjoyable 😁
Thank you for your analysis! I have really never noticed Lydia continuously mentioning Wickham! This is interesting
Thank you for such a close engagement with the text, allowing the reader/listener to see the power of carefully selected and intentional language along with the realistic development and placement (appearance and disappearance) of characters and their dialog to the advancement of the plot. Austin's work has the same sense of cinema as Tolstoy's work and the same sense of moral satisfaction as Shakespeare's comedies. Incomparable. You help your audience to understand this. 'Good job, Dr. Cox.
I love the way you explain things like this. I have read this book many times, and I have never picked up on things like the way the narrative draws the reader's attention away from Lydia's attraction to Wickham. I read along, going where Austen wants me to go. Your explanations make the book so much more fun. Thank you!
I haven’t tuned in to Dr. Cox’s channel for many months. My mistake: her talks never fail to impress me. If you are a real Austen admirer then this channel should be a regular destination for you -.as there are so many new insights to be gleaned from these videos.
Another excellent video 💕
this was really fun!!! i read an essay in defence of Lydia which completely changed my perspective on her, and now I'm a ride or die Lydia fan. so really enjoyed listening to this breakdown!!!
Lydia is boy-crazy in general, but given that Wickham has a type (young, easily gullible), she was easy for Wickham to manipulate. I thought that Lydia had a thing for Lieutenant Denny, though. She seems to flirt with several of the militia.
What sucks, though, is her age. Lydia is 15-16 and she has no clue about consent or power imbalance.
Something that Austen may not have been aware of is that soldiers that were stationed in Newcastle often got sent to the front lines.
I'd like to think that in the future, Wickham died in combat, leaving an older Lydia to learn how to think more critically about life. And that she'll find a better love with a more stable soldier.
I love this!
The age of concent in the UK, was 12 until 1875, when it was raised to 13. It was raised to 16 in 1885.
There is some indication of their future - if I remember correctly, Jane Austen indicated that they had several children, Wickham was kicked out of the army for his profligacy, and they spent much of their lives mooching off their family, especially Jane and Bingley, who were too kind to get rid of them quickly.
Jane never put anything in her novels without a reason. I'm certain she knew of that detail, like innumerable others that she put in (it takes a dedicated reader years to uncover them).
Lydia would not make a very good wife. I imagine she will always be chasing after some man. She and Wickham deserve each other
I am an older sister of sisters. I did experience my younger sister being very interested in the young man I was dating, as I started dating, when she was too young to start dating herself. She was trying to compete with me. And to this day this behavior still defines our relationship. It is annoying to say the least. But perhaps such is the fate of younger sisters. It does not stop at trying to get the attention of the young man who walked me home, but to having better education, to having a better house, .... better everything. Exhausting for her. Jane Austen wrote the part of Lydia very well.
French anthropologist René Girard wrote of "mimetic rivalry", which may well apply here - both in Jane Austen's novel and the situation you have personally experienced.
@@catherineleclair3450 Thanks. I was not aware of this. Interesting thought.
I enjoyed this very much! I’ve read the book a number of times but was always distracted by Lizzie’s point of view. I assumed much of Lydia’s motivation to have more to do with stealing him away from Lizzie (in Lydia’s imagined point of view) but wasn’t entirely satisfied. I agree with your analysis, and appreciate the in-depth dive into the text. I plan to read Pride & Prejudice again with a clearer head.
On reflection, there could be another contributing factor to the emotional expression of Darcy and Elizabeth on the "walk out", apart from the Lady Catherine's role.
Lizzy thanks Darcy for his assistance in the case of Lydia. This leads to Darcy's very warm and frank "I thought only of you". And that seems to have opened the dam to expression: his profession of unchanged "affections and wishes". And the rest is history.
Darcy, however, later claims (chap XVIII) that Lizzy's expression of gratitude had no material impact. He claims that given the Lady Catherine's intelligence he was "determined at once to know everything " [concerning Lizzy's feelings presumably].
Thank you so much for sharing this! I absolutely can't read subtext in books so this is super interesting
The detail here is just amazing! Continually in awe of Miss Austen and you, Dr Cox, thank you for another wonderful video!
I love this explanation of Lydia and Mr Wickham. I've read Pride and Prejudice probably a dozen times and am still surprised to have that relationship explained in this way. I really enjoy your chanel, Dr Cox.
Thank you for your fascinating videos, which always go so I'm depth. I'd been influenced by the 1995 BBC adaptation, which showed Mr Denny being her main guy, so it was good to look closely at the actual text.
This is one of my favorite analyses so far, because I know it will change how I read the novel the next time.
That was fun! Seeing the illustrations, some of which I own too, made me appreciate them even more.
I truly enjoy your thorough delving into Jane Austin's stories. Thank you so much.
I get a slightly different impression from Jane Austen's representation of Lydia's attentions. I feel like she means to show the mood of the town through Lydia, since Elizabeth is often around her, and Wickham's popularity is crucial to the plot. In particular, I think she means to show how Mr. Darcy's omission allowed these kinds of unfair preferences to continue, while also painting Lydia as rather superficial: being obsessed with the most popular man in town, beyond any of the encouragement she may have gotten from other officers.
However you did strike on something very interesting, which made me think. The wording indicated that Lydia "needed only encouragement," and later it is said that Wickham may have been flirting with half the town. Is it possible Wickham was more forward with his attentions towards Lizzy, while still taking plenty of opportunities to flirt with whomever was around? Certainly he had to perfect his talents somehow....
I agree, and I reckon neither of them would have been particularly faithful after the marriage either. Doesn't mean that they wouldn't have necessarily enjoyed each other's company. So many depictions show him getting sick of her, but they both like gambling, going out and spending. They would've made a great pair of scammers.
@@Nicciolai I got the same impression. That they were simply hedonistic, and he probably regretted his marriage immediately, but it didn't mean he didn't turn it into an opportunity.
@@Nicciolai we are told at the end of the novel that 'Lidia never lost the respectability her marriage had given her.' this clearly implies that she did not stray.
Great. Thank you. So clearly and nicely put. My enjoyment of this and other novels by Jane Austen I have read has been enhanced by your close readings. I had not clocked quite a lot!
Thanks!
Great Video !!
I would love so much if you made a video on this subject : "Did Mr Wickham notice that Darcy loved Lizzy? And is this one of the reasons he eloped with Lydia ??"
Thank you for your good work !
I honestly missed the entire lisya attachment to Wickham even if I have read the book numerous times. I just sort of dismissed it as teen fun, well until the elopement. It wonderful to find new takes on my fave Jane austen and other literary works, thanks for sharing 💕
I always suspected that Lydia's interest was strengthened and somewhat motivated by Wickham's interest in Elizabeth. She was competitive, and I think she wanted to prove herself better than her more intelligent and decorous older sisters. She tries to get some jealousy out of Elizabeth after the marriage, but is too dull-witted to realize that she has failed at that.
You make a good point that Lizzy was too absorbed in her own feelings to notice Lydia's preference. One might add that she would never have considered Lydia competition in the same way Lydia saw her as competition, perhaps showing some arrogance or vanity. But the way the book is written, I think we're meant to understand that Elizabeth _was_ superior to Lydia in every way, and if she had wanted Wyckham, she could have had him. For my own part, while I don't agree with every judgment of Lydia, I do find the character insufferably lacking in self-awareness, intelligence, and concern for others. She never even glimpses how close she took herself and her sisters to ruin. I figure she eventually had to learn how mercantile her husband was about marrying her, or at least that he's neither an honorable man nor especially in love with her.
or with the lack of self-reflection become quite mercantile too. He's well over 10 years older than her and if he was smart, he'd have got her into his scams, and she would've probably seen it all as a lark. Many women in history have become their criminal husband's sidekick and I reckon she'd have been game.
I love your channel. It makes me see characters and passages in a new way, and see clues that I can't believe I missed once you bring them to light.
This is the second pride and prejudice video I've watched of yours in a row. These are fantastic! Thank you!! I love this!
Another awesome lecture! Thank you for this channel.
You’re good at what you do. You’re really really good.
Very interesting and entertaining video. Well done for finding so many illustrations of attractive young Regency men 😁 I found particularly interesting the analysis of Lydia’s willingness to upend conventions around gender roles.
How are you doing dr octavia thank you for wonderful cultural channel as literature lovers and foreigners subscribers as overseas students want to increase our cultural level improve our English language as well i gathered main points about famous character you mentioned Jane Austen described Lydia bennet in pride and prejudice as having high animal spirit sort of natural self consequence she is attractive charismatic she is also reckless impulsive stout well grown girl of fifteen with fine complexion good humoured countence in chapter 46 summary when Elizabeth returns to her inn she finds two letters from Jane first relates that Lydia has eloped with wickham second that there is word from couple they may not be married yet although they are not married they have Been convinced to do so provided that wickham debts are paid and Lydia receives small yearly spitend Lydia elopement the view of that time society were strict living together without marriage was banned under imminency of social exclusion of whole family . Lydia and wickham were impror match financially speaaaking Lydia had little money to bring to marriage and he was only soldier also earning little himself in Austen time gentry couldn’t just marry for love we appreciate your great efforts stay safe blessed good luck to you your dearest ones happy mother to you all mothers we in Arabic countries celebrate mother day as well as you in England best wishes for you your family friends
Austen always plays with multiple things with each sentence. Also @26:00, in addition to Lydia and Wickham's interactions it is unclear whether Lizzie wants to talk to Wickham to get better acquainted because of a perceived mutual interest with Wickham or to inquire about Mr. Darcy because of a possibly not yet realized interest in Mr. Darcy (as she is and always has nurtured a grudge/prejudice of sorts against him for slighting her at their first inetraction - and rightfully so for he was wrong, if i might add). By the atmosphere of the text, we are lead to believe she is enamored with Wickham, but it is atleast unclear to me whether she is interested in Wickham really or is eager to learn more of Mr. Darcy after the slighting, as she might have noticed something about Mr. Darcy that sparked her interest. The text says she desperately hopes to learn about Wickham's acquaintance with Mr. Darcy all the while she is talking with Wickham: that's where I'm unclear, for what girl is thinking about another man when is talking to the man she supposedly likes. OR maybe I'm just a sucker for the love that eventually develops and am overinterpreting this.
I would have loved to have seen a continuation or Part II of this Novel. To whom would have the other two girls marry? Lydia and Wickham’s marriage unraveling? The mother’s lack of class, immaturity and lax rein on Lydia and Kitty really showed in the girls! Surprised that the first two young women turned out fairly well. Mary was in her own world.
Mary married one of Uncle Phillips' clerks. Kitty married a clergyman who had a parish near Pemberley.
@@dorothywillis1 ah, good to know! 😂
Do you think that Lydia Bennet had her eye particularly on Mr Wickham while in Meryton?
Hi Octavia. I think Lydia certainly had her eye on Wickham from the moment she first saw him, but I'm sure she would have transferred her admiration to another officer had he actively snubbed her. She seems to be more keen on the general idea of a man in regimentals than on a particular individual, and once snubbed by him she would have soon shrugged it off and moved on to the next Wickham, Carter or Denny.
Yes, but that would probably have faded when the next handsome young officer came along, if Wickham hadn't encouraged her, as he presumably does, in Brighton. Lydia doesn't seem capable of falling seriously in love. That said, I think the elopement was her idea - Wickham just wants to leave town in a hurry, to escape his debts. Suddenly, Lydia is there, and the easiest way to keep her quiet is to take her with him - certainly, he has no intention of marrying a girl without money.
I sometimes wonder if Lydia is quite right in the head. She is literally unable to take anything seriously. There is a range of senses of humour in this "light, bright and sparkling" novel - Mr Bennet is too caught up in his own clever, sardonic humour to be a good parent, Lydia simply sees everything as a joke, several characters, including Jane and Mary, have no sense of humour at all. Elizabeth and Darcy eventually balance each other out - he learns to take himself less seriously and she to temper her wit with a bit of humility.
Food for thought, as always, in this video. I had noticed, and found very odd, the cross-dressing incident, but just put it down to the questionable company. The point you make about the blurring of gender roles is illuminating.
Indeed I do. She was jealous of his attentions to Lizzy. Don’t hog him, she says at some point.
Yes and no! Yes Lydia was infatuated with Mr. Wickham, but had he disappeared from the picture, she would have moved on to someone else just like she did from Mr. Carter to Mr. Denny to Mr. Wickham. She is only 16. It would worry me to no end if she was my daughter or granddaughter! But I see her first and foremost as a wild teenager in need of parental guidance!
Replying to own comment to add that it's similar to other "out of the blue" elopements and relationships in Austen's novels - all subtly seeded, when you look back. Julia Bertram and Mr Yates, Penelope Clay and Mr Elliot, and, the tour de force, Jane Fairfax and Frank Churchill.
I very much enjoyed this video. I've read many of the comments and have noticed that Lydia is described as 'boy-crazy'. We never talk about boys being 'girl-crazy', yet my understanding is that post-puberty hetero boys spend an awful lot of time thinking about girls/women and what they'd like to do with them. Lydia is out-going, gregarious, and has few (any?) inhibitions. But is she any more interested in men than other girls - without the ability to follow boy bands? I think part of her flirtatious behaviour is about enjoying attention and getting power, such as it is, through her sexuality. She appears to have limited interests other than chasing men, but what did she do before she hit puberty? If a girl like her were alive today (and I'm sure there are many) and had better parenting, an education, and the much greater opportunity to direct her energy in other directions, might she have been different? Or would she only be posting selfies all the time and be vulnerable to online sexual predators? I'd like to think that with the right guidance she'd at least have got into drama or basketball. Edit: Immediately after posting this I found this video, The Psychology of Lydia Bennet (which I hope Dr. Cox won't mind me adding because I think her video and the other work well together) ua-cam.com/video/sfQRgiBx5qk/v-deo.html
When I read your question, I immediately said, out loud, in the locker room, "No. Not always." I'll see if I'm right probably when I get home
Just one question that had not occurred to me before- why doesn't Elizabeth tell her father Mr. Bennet about Wickham's past. The book goes to quite a lot of detail about her not feeling it was proper to embarras Georgiana by informing "her general acquaintance" but she does tell Jane and was very aware of Lydia being in danger if she went away with the regiment. I also discovered recently that Pride and Prejudice was the only book Austen published where she sold the copywright rather than on comission so she only made a fraction of the profit, seems awfully sad for such a great book. Another point given that at the time reading novels was considered frivilous (and Pride and Prejudice was considered to be so!) I think that Mr Collins sermons, Lydia's fate (although averted) and indeed to an extent Mr Darcy's response to Elizabeths rejection of him were an atempt to ensure that Pride and Prejudice didn't seem to condone scandalous behaviour/impropriety. I can see a formidable aunt being pointed to these passages in order to be persuaded that Pride and Prejudice was "improving literature" and served to point out the dangers to young women of running off with dashing young officers :-) !
I love your analysis of these works! Very good points on Lydia! Can you do more videos on Sense and Sensibility and on the topic of how it is Marianne and Willoughby spend so much time alone together unsupervised.
I love how the tv version gives you a tip off at the ball when he’s talking about missing one person and holds the gaze of Lydia as he says it. I felt it was a nice way of foreshadowing what the narrative voice reveals. It’s hard to adapt the films because there’s so much thought but unsaid. I always felt like Jane and Kitty were underwritten. Especially Jane who is so passive.
Thanks for a great close reading!
I have just watched this video. I found it very enlightening. I am wondering if Lydia’s fascination with Wickam was partially up to being competitive with her older sisters. For example when she comes back to Longhorn after being married. She makes a large point to let the older sisters know that she walks into the house before them. She appears to have a lot of glee in doing so.
Dr. Cox, would you please consider doing a close reading of Mansfield Park to determine whether Mary Crawford had any suspicion of Fanny’s attachment to Edmund? A straight reading suggests not, but there are a few phrases that make me wonder... For example, when Mary comes to Fanny’s room to practice her lines and says that she will be embarrassed to say them to Edmund’s face, and then asks Fanny, “Could you do it? But then you are his cousin, which makes all the difference” or something to that effect. That gives me pause because I wonder if it’s a clue.
And perhaps Mary felt with Fanny married to Henry, her way would be clear to Edmund...
Thank you for these brilliant videos that enhance our appreciation of JA skills as an author. I've only just discovered them, while looking for audiobooks of P&P (for once, the algorithms did a good job!) and my comment is probably too late to contribute to the topic, but I would like to share it.
I remember reading that the choice of the surnames Darcy and DeBurgh was aimed at stressing the aristocratic connections of both (they are of Norman origin, and so, but a little less obviously, is Bennet). Of course one cannot help noticing that the wicked Wickham is aptly named as well. So JA is sometimes particularly attentive to the connotation given by the name she chooses for a particular character (Lucy Steele would be another exemple).
It strikes me that out of the five Bennet girls, four have traditional historical English female names: Jane, Elizabeth, Mary, Catherine and that Lydia is singled out as her name is more "exotic"-sounding, fancy and fashionable. It comes from ancient Greek but we can doubt that Mrs. Bennet (she is her last and favourite child, after all) chose it on that ground. Has it perhaps something to do with the Lydia Languish of "The Rivals"?
I must confess I have never read the play but I know its plot involves a caricature of a young lady full of romantic notions whose most cherished dream is that of...*eloping with a pennyless soldier*
Was the name deliberately chosen by JA both as a joke and as hint to contemporary readers, who must have been better acquainted with Sheridan's play?
Great work, super nerdy, thank you for making content (:
Bedankt
Wonderful - good fun to listen to and first time I’ve thought about that question. Thanks very much!
So glad I found your channel! Such intelligent insights! Could you please do more from Mansfield Park? You are my favorite!
Nice job!
Such an interesting subject! Thank you!
Thank you for Thais video. I had no clue before ! Regards from Spain
Someone, please explain "-------- shire". I've always wondered about that. Thanks!
Fools rush in, so here goes: early novelists were very mindful of the possibility of being sued, and so anonymised identifiable elements, where possible. Even today, I've seen comments on the rise of unlikely surnames in novels with a realistic setting, for the same reason. As Wickham is hardly a credit to whatever regiments he was in, this was probably wise.
@@londongael Thank You!
But if Longbourne is made up, and Pemberley is made up, and Meryton is made up - - why couldn't she invent a shire? "Bemblyshire," or "Honkingshire," or "Squirrelshire" would be less jarring than ----shire.
@@lauradavis4610 Because a "shire" is more or less the equivalent of a state in the US, with the militia unit being like a National Guard unit belonging to that state. If someone made up the name of a state, it would throw us out of the story.
Can you please explain the militia in Jane Austen? I don't really understand what they were doing in the Blankshire. What does the militia mean to Jane Austen? In P&P the military seems to represent a space of looseness, fun. In Persuasion, a military appointment represents something different, a space for attaining wealth and title. In terms of class is it better to be in the militia or be a lawyer like Mr Gardiner? Perhaps you could go over what the militia (and the clergy?) mean in Austen?
Considering the second eldest son of the landed gentry usually became a clergyman and any subsequent sons often went into the military as officers, it seems that the military was considered a more distinguished profession than the law, etc. In "Sense and Sensibility", Fanny and her mother hope that Edward will enter the military and cut a dashing figure until such time as he comes into his inheritance.
Lydia wanted to be the first of her sisters to be married. She was tired of being last of 5. And she zeroed in on Wickham because he was Lizzy's favorite.
It is also interesting that while there is some of Lydia's interest in Wickham prior to Lizzy going to the Colins' house, she also continued to show some preference for Denny, the narrative voice seems to be telling us that a lot of Lydia's attachment occurred while Elizabeth was away (Both Elizabeth and Mary King are out of the picture), and that Lizzy's preoccupation with her own troubles is what misled her about Lydia's preference.
Lovely analysis.
I always thought Lydia had affection for him and was the main driver behind her going with him on their “elopement”
Thanks for your illuminating analysis, Ms. Cox. One sign of all great writers to be able to understand and render the different individual psychological personality of each character they create. This puts Jane Austen on a level with Shakespeare and Tolstoy.
Very educational, infeef!! Thanks so very much!
Excellent as usual.
Great video! You convinced me.
"... and Kitty." 😣
I had to pause the video because I couldn't quit giggling. After all, that's the perfect summary of Kitty!