Does Cassette BRAND Affect Sound? | Type 2 cassette shootout
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- Опубліковано 5 лип 2024
- Can you hear the difference between Maxell and TDK or BASF or Sony or Fuji or SKC or Denon or NAC tapes? We explore that question today!
two great vids on new type ii cassettes:
ANA(DIA)LOG: • Tascam, ATR & NAC bran...
WeHappyFewMusic: • New Type II Cassette T...
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00:00 Intro
01:58 The Lineup
03:11 Cassette Comeback
04:00 The Experiment
05:25 Listening Test 1
12:34 Thoughts on each tape
20:58 Listening Test 2
22:50 Final Thoughts
28:08 All Mixes
Yes tape can be Lo-Fi, but it isn't ALWAYS. Thanks for putting the time in with these videos. Fun to mess about with anaogue formats. I was born in the 70s and can now buy devices that were out of reach financially back then.
Dude I love comparison videos like this. Thanks for starting with the drum machine for comparisons: not subject to variability between performances. Great vibes, great info, great production. I want to get a porta studio now!
Thank you for watching! hope you're inspired and can find a cool machine! I like using drum machines, too, for the exact reason you stated, thanks for noticing!
Whenever you make a video, it genuinely makes my day. I'm working on an old Fostex 160 and loving every minute of it. Cheers from Scotland!
~ Mike
that’s very kind of you! Happy recording!
That maxell sounds the best I'm glad I bought mostly those for my supply
Thank you man! you saved me a lot of time doing this! love your channel! thanks so much!
thanks for watching and listening! I hope you get down with some cool experiments in your recordings!🤘
This is so useful! I just bought my first Tascam Portastudio MK III.
Loved this test! You should do this test on the 464, the high frequencies are really sensitive depending on the formula. Also if you ever do this again, the TDK SA-X used to be considered by some to be the best tape for four tracks. The reason those tapes (SKC, BASF) smelled like crayons is because those are actual chrome formulas, compared with the others which are mostly cobalt-doped ferric 🤓. Oddly enough, in my experience chrome formulas work better for dubbing standard tapes on a tape deck, and end up sounding dull on multitrackers 🤷♂️. I learned all that tape stuff on Cassette Comeback - great channel(s) 😉 👍🏻
LOVE Cassette Comeback! I think I mention in this video that's where most of these tapes were ordered from. Thanks for watching! It would be fun to try it on the 464 at high speed...
@@MadeOnTape Do it (if you want 😄)! And grab an SA-X - great tapes!
Basf tapes used 2 b "real chrome". Agfa was the same. They were made in Germany so u could get the best results by recording them on a DUAL or a Grundig Deck (maybe on other decks 2). Short: for real chrome tapes u need a deck made in Germany. Or a good deck which can calibrate them. I know the videos of cassettecomeback and enjoyed them much. But I still use tapes in 2024 for private purposes. I listen to tapes, sometimes I do mixtapes from Vinyl or from spotify. I've got one deck which i get the best results by using basf tapes and i got more decks which can record very well on TDK, Denon, Sony, Maxell etc. But it's important to calibrate the tape before recording. So there is no difference between source and tape.
thanks for this hard work!!!! Great video as ever
thank you for watching and listening! always great to see you in the comments
Sony was the hardest, but in the drum test i always recognize Maxell!
thanks for this video, man
yo thanks for listening!
Such a fun and informative shootout
hey there! really appreciate that. Let me know if there's anything you'd like to see on the channel down the road!
Picked the Maxell every time. It's punchy and buttery all at the same time... lovely. Thanks for the comparison 🙏
thanks for listening! 👂
Hi, another awesome video! Thanx for this comparision, I am using TDK, but love Maxell too. But - what about that Tascam tapes, would you mind this kind..?
I've noticed that the maxell is bright compared to every other cassette by far on the drums but I had some problems with the full mix (maybe because I've been acommodated to the cassette sound?idk)
check out the very end of video and you can hear them back to back ! Yes, our ears can get accustomed quickly. thanks for listening 🙏
Type II Sony tapes are the best of the Type IIs imo. You need the 100 min ones with the blue trim on them, not the 90 min ones.
In fact, Sony seems to have the best Type IVs too. They're just not naturally as loud overall. But, they're super bassy without being dull. The Maxell Type IVs are the worst. The mid is through the roof and the treble tends to get scratchy. The bass is just not smooth and clear either, and I personally hate that. I equalize my stuff with an entirely separate EQ and I run my source from a Blu Ray that plays WAV, AAC, and FLAC files from a thumb drive. Plus, in the settings it shows that it plays at the max quality possible of 96 @320. I also edit all of my audio files before putting them on the thumb drive, making sure that I get my songs at the maximum quality.
I imagine the formulation of the coating would have the biggest effect
For a full multi-track mix, a bright tape is always nice. If you're only bouncing one stem to/from tape (like just the drums, for example), you might be surprised that a duller tape mixes better.
I recently compared TDK D60 [Type I] and TDK SA90 [Type II] tape on drums, and though I preferred the Type II solo'd, when I mixed the drums back in with the keyboards and bass, I preferred Type I so the keys could sit on top.
Always fun doing these types of experiments. Thank you for sharing your work!
thanks for watching and listening! I was just replying to another comment: I will definitely use those NAC tapes for something. Perhaps record drums and bounce those out and bring into a "nicer" cassette for a full mix. Thanks for sharing!
Well done! Thanks for the time and money put in to this video!
thanks for listening! do you have any favorite cassettes and if so, why?
Always been Maxell type II for me. I tried the new Tascam and was very disappointed.
yes for portastudio the new type ii's are disappointing and I prefer even a Maxell type i over the new type ii. The ONLY thing those bad cassettes are good for is if you want a purposefully bad sound... which can be cool in the right context! @@adee2569
awesome video, i have a ton of different tape stock and haven't put in the effort to test all the differences. I listened to this with a subpac and the differences between a lot of these were especially noticeable in the very low end that you might not hear on headphones. The maxell was way more balanced overall, the TDK and the Denon both had some serious punch in the low end compared to everything else though.
yes, i truly love them all for different reasons, too. Just like different colors to paint with ✌️
Oh man that NAC comparison really ruined my day... I just bought a whole box of the things. :(
the good news is that they're very affordable! I have a whole box, too, so you bet I'm gonna use them!
At the very least, now you have a lot of type ii tape for making cassette loops hahaha
A good vid. Thanks. And you just confirmed ebay prices of these brands =)
thank you for watching! what’s your favorite brand so far in your experience?
@@MadeOnTape “Modern” Type II Maxells and TDKs due to affordable prices ;) But I’m thinking about some r2r because metal tape prices are insane, and I’d like to “backup” my vinyl disks with max quality.
Got a handful of Fuji tapes recently, I'm hoping a little bias calibration can help punch it up a bit. I remember reading that they can need some calibration to really shine. At least I feel better about the 20 used XLii's I impulse bought the other day. Those new ones are RUFF.
new ones had me like "old maxell type 1 sound better than this"
I dig pretty much all of them for portastudio and they all have creative applications...even the new type ii.... purposefully crappy is a vibe haha
@MadeOnTape definitely!! I like brighter old type ii's for a lot of stuff that I listen to, but sometimes you just want to get lost in the murky waters for a bit! Might as well grab a little bit of everything while you still can.
A very comprehensive and interesting comparison and it was great to hear the difference between brands on the same source material! I’m even more convinced that the NAC and ATR tapes are the same formula after hearing your test. I’ve also found BASF tapes to be quieter and more muffled than other type 2 tapes as well. The Maxell, TDK and Sony all performed well on your test, it’s just a shame that they don’t produce them anymore. 🙌
i couldn't confirm, but I've heard from many many people that NAC is making the tapes and ATR or TASCAM is selling them or both. I just don't know where else new tape is made in the States? It's like...I can name almost all the vinyl pressing plants in the US. It's not a secret hahaha
I put a link to your excellent vid in the description!
@@MadeOnTape oh yes, thanks very much for linking my video. Much appreciated! 👌🤘
Yeah NAC makes all of it. Tascam claimed that they reformulated the new cobalt type II’s to suit the 424 line. I saw folks online stating they could hear virtually no difference between the 799 and the ATR/Tascam tapes, despite those brands charging 3-4 times the price 🫠. And nice shoutout to Cassette Comeback - Tony’s insane level of knowledge is why I can guess accurately what the sonics might be on NOS tapes. He also has stated how much he dislikes the 799. Personally I feel like NAC deserves serious props for trying, but I’ve had issues with both their type I’s and II’s, so I’d say folks on the other side of the pond aren’t missing much by not having easy access to those.
@@ericvannielsen many thanks for the extra background info. Yeah Tonys definitely the man when it comes to cassette tapes supply levels and manufacturers, which is particularly impressive considering how little information is out there. At least we’re not missing out then by not being able to get hold of the Tascam tape over here.
@@wehappyfewmusic Yeah, of course. I’d be reasonably mad if all new cassettes weren’t legitimately available over here. I wish RTM in France would consider making a type II; I emailed them tomask because pf how good the Fox tape is, amd they said they were not interested because of lack of a profit margin. Also love your channel - it seems we share the same addiction to making music on these things 📼 🎚️🎚️🎚️🎚️ 🎸!
TEAC Gold reel cassettes tha came with the Porta One and assuming rest of Tascam line were great…width of tape had alot to do with it. Also just visually cool looking …Expensive tapes to buy these days, still great!
yes those had legit metal reels right? their new tapes are just plastic reels painted gold 😂
What kind of 1/4” to rca cable brand so you use? My hosa cables keeps breaking
Cool stuff, glad to see you’re still making this kind of content!
hey there appreciate it! I only use RCA cables with an RCA - 1/4" adapter.
I think I mostly use Pro Co brand, but I crazily even have two Mogamis. I wouldn't necessarily recommend that, although I know they'll last me decades.
I've also inherited RCAs from older folks' studios here in town. Happy recording!
@@MadeOnTape Oh gotcha! Yes those look high quality. I use this cable all the time and trying to find a high quality one that will last. Will look into mogami. So if I understand you correctly you use a rca - rca and then use an adapter to convert?
@@littlevibetown yes that's correct for me! I think i have one pair of RCA to 1/4" but the rest of the time I use adapters. Lots of RCA connections in my portastudio (tape outs are a great mixing tool)
@@MadeOnTape Same i use the mkII all the time and am letting go of an akai mg614 atm. Gotta have those rcas !
Nice shootout. Goes to show you should just grab any cobalt type 2 you have in hand and make some music. Totally agree with the dropout aesthetic’s, keep it real.
thanks for listening Jacob!
Ok we discussed this on another video...now the detailed breakdown!!
Yes Hundred Percent.
I ended up...on my Tascam 688 that I preferred Denon HD8. 30minute tapes
I noticed a lot of differences in tape brands...for example Hitachi Type 2 were very Hissy on the upper sibilance range area.
Maxell I loved but the Denons were just more balanced with a better mid and high mid end.
Toshiba sounded thinner.
TDKs I preferred for Party Tape Mixes...I made mix tapes with my Brother from a young age.
And lastly it cost more but the shorter tapes have Thicker tape and last longer and seem be better even though costing more.
I would do 3 demo songs per tape.
I haven't even watched this yet, but I was fanatical about tapes...I lived across the road from Tower Records on Sunset and the had huge stock of everything.
And I 5 got songs in Life 101 with Corey Haim and Amy Dolenz, broadcast released with that 688 on cassette, and used Denons or Maxells, in that order which I settled on.
In fact if I filled my tapes with rough ideas then demo them properly, and had I had no Denons or Maxells...I'd take a couple of days off as my whole board, EQ my BBE, shitty Alesis micro comoressor, was all 90% set levels eqs aux sends...and it was just Denon or Maxell thst just seemed to suit MY STYLE and the way I ran my Board.
Also to note, which you gave discussed,...saturation, tape saturation.
Every peak I had I ran into tipping into the Red Zone and averaging orange the drops green in the old Tascam cools screen.
So I was getting preamp transformer AND tape Saturation, on thos two Tape Brands for MY Sound.
Make sense?
I'll edit later... dying to watch this video and get your Link for some HD8's and Maxells!!😆😜
party tape mixes! thanks for sharing Harris: i hear you on preamp distortion and tape saturation. I dig the blend as well 🤘
I think they’re all super similar and that it’s probably be worth going back and seeing if the extra top end from the other tapes is due to having more saturation. It could be a similar situation to swapping pickups. Swapping pickups has less difference in tone than it has in headroom. (Within reason ofc. Single cool and hum bucket will almost always sound different)
Very good
I used Maxell type II cassettes more than anything else. I liked the sound.
me too! I have a nice supply that will take a while to use. have you tried TDK or Sony at all before?
@@MadeOnTape Yes, I have received recordings on those. They sound great, also.
I found TDK stuff is quitest and Maxell is number 2 and way more available for me.
BASF and SKC tapes are pure chrome and should be recorded at 0db and have very little hiss ,usualy used from recording from vinyl and not really for portastudio use .....maybe for a mixdown .....the cobalt (maxell,TDK,Sony,Denon) are best for portastudio
100%! thanks for listening 🙏
Asfar as I'm aware you haven't made a video along these lines, but I was wondering if worn tape adds mojo? I noticed undamaged tape sounds more or less the same but would intentionally somewhat mangled or crinkled tape add something? Maybe when mixed with the undamaged signal?
this is a fun idea and ambient composers use this frequently... could be interesting on a groove track...
Well, if the deck can't calibrate for the tape, be prepared that some otherwise decent tapes will sound dull and muffled. It's not their fault, it's the factory settings of the deck.
What's worse, some of these tapes like the 1990s BASF CEII shown here can easily fool auto-calibration algorithms. I have two decks with auto-calibration, and both can't bias the CEII correctly.
100%
this experiment is meant for people who have decks that can't be calibrated. Different tapes can give you different colors for your art
In the drums department, Maxell sounds better than most, perhaps that's what the deck was biased for. Basf was easy to pick out for its lower noise floor vs Maxell. Also I picked out the fuji correctly BASF sounds good but could probably do with some positive bias and a bit more level, being cro2. Denon is a bit hissy , but not as hissy as NAC. , NAC easily worst tape of them all and can be picked out easily. , it would probably be easier to tell more details if I was familiar with the music. Good video .
I'm gonna have to use that NAC tape for something weird
Wow I picked the Denon over the maxell no doubts.
That charcteristic affect on mids.
Been years too!
love how the bass sounded on the Denon
Well done for calling them Type II cassettes as most of them are not true chromes but ferro-cobalt.
thanks for watching!!! 🙏🏻🤘🏻
Thanks for doing this, I recently recorded on a Fuji for the first time, noticed it was darker than the tdks i use. Might pick up a couple of those Sonys cause they sounded fat.
i loved the bass on the sony!
Do you do any digital mastering?
I’m looking for somebody to master an ep I’m nearly finished with.
@@thomasjacques2822 Hey Thomas! either I could do it or one of my colleagues. email me at madeontape@gmail
9:31 maaannn, those NAC tapes are NASTY. In a bad way!
i hope to use their nasty character in a creative way down the road...
Esse aparelho não tem regulagem de bias, por isso nas fitas de cromo o som é mais baixo, porque esse aparelho é regulado para fitas de cobalto. Tenho um deck Tascam 103 que grava bem em todas por causa da regulagem de bias.
when you have no bias adjustment, it’s fun to experiment with these different sounds ☺️
Can changing the deck's bias change the results much?
maybe for the BASF and SKC? You should check out the Anadialog video! he has a great deck for this test.
The portastudio doesn’t have adjustable bias, or at least not without opening it up and circuit bending . Thanks for watching!
I wanted to let everyone know that true chromium dioxide or CR02 formulated tapes are no longer being produced.
NAC and a few other companies use a formula of tape that may be semi compatible with the cassette decks Type 2 bias setting.
However, these are not true Type 2 or chrome formula tapes.
The reason for this was the cost for disposal of chromium waste.
Aside from chromium being bad for the environment.
The only true CR02 tapes available in 2023 are new old stock CR02 cassettes, or used CR02 cassettes.
And this is why the prices for true Type 2 chromium tapes are through the roof.
casettes add some saturation (wow and flutter) and people think that tape sounds better.Only there're some magic harmonics.That's all.
yes ,there are type II cassettes that are garbage ,one after testing several only uses the best built cassettes ,one brand might have better tapes but if the casing it´s badly built it´s a deck destroyer ,the cassette as to be well built in it´s whole, as an example one day i found a older person in late 70'´s that had a incredible record colection and because i needed a lotof cassettes and i couldn´t spend much money i went for the older SKC chrome with a golden sticker or inlay papper ,it´s incredible that today all sound perfect and do not dirt the heads ,after i bought other model of skc and they were garbage,at the time each C-90 cassette cost me 20 cents. each i bought maybe 20 and not one is bad today ,that i can´t say of the BASF LH-super I or maxima I, or agfa´s or scoth
ive also heard that 60min vs 90min is supposed to be better. The 60 because there is less time the tape is thicker so you can maybe hit it harder. idk could be not true but seems plausible.
60 min is definitely preferable, but I'm not sure it has to do with the sonic qualities, but more of the durability. THAT could be a VERY nerdy shootout... 60 min vs. 90 min vs. 110 min
the video would only get like 100 views, but it would be the best people watching!
Why am I watching this entire video, I’ll never record on cassettes ever lol.
haha well thank you 😂 you never know …
Youre missing out…sound in analog that cant be replicated digitally.
Back in the day, tapes were our Playlist, a way of making records portable and they were indispensable for hearing my school band concerts after I performed them. Now I am digitizing them to share and preserve them.
Sure you can hear the difference..only on an expensive cassettedeck type-1 will play almost as good as a type-2..
yes an expensive deck with adjustable bias can make any decent tape sound good! thanks for watching!
Fun fact about Sony. The founder was a Quaker.
really? a Japanese Quaker?
@@MadeOnTape Well, one of them
Sony (formerly Tokyo Tsushin Kogyo, or Tokyo Telecommunication Engineering, Co.), TTK's founding board president was Tamon Maeda, a Japanese Quaker, prewar Japanese ambassador to ILO, and postwar Minister of Education
@@Mark761966 wow crazy! my association in American history is that some of the most outspoken abolitionists in the 1700s were Quakers. Benjamin Lay...check him out!
the light grey casing on maxell if you use them will destroy any deck perfect alignement or tune first you´ll notice you can´t calibrate other brands cassette because of a badly built cassette ,the tape might be the best but if badly built it destroys any cassette deck ,that mini recorder with inputs it´s what early teen kids uesd to buy to record their first band demos at home, they were the cheapest and no quality at all, the reel deck you have behind you it´s better than any cassette deck if working properly and already set up to record in stereo 4 track recording, home recording conected to a litrle mixing board, the best thing to do is spend money on a good microphone to catch all band sound from above in a litle room ,i´m talking about 13 to 14 years old
It's really unfortunate that the NAC is such garbage. I bought some ATR cassettes some years back and it was also terrible, like unusable like you showed here. Which is odd since their studio master is what I use on my 1/4" and 1/2" reel to reels and I love it, it's a great stuff. I know the rumor is that it's the same as NAC but I'm surprised they would drag down their brand like that.
it is unfortunate. ATR type 1 is better, even if you can’t bias your portastudio for it
@@MadeOnTape I wonder if they make that or what. Seems odd they would make type I tape themselves and outsource type II. I know RTM is making their Type I in house (while discontinuing SM468 and 7 inch reels, which is a reel heartbreaker). Makes me sad to think we might lose all new tape in my lifetime. Once that happens, it's over.
I only use NIKE cassettes
brand loyalty is key
fyi the tascam type 2 cassette is just loaded with NAC type 2 tape, the only difference is just the TASCAM one has the reels in it
that’s honestly what i’ve heard but i couldn’t confirm it officially and didn’t want to put out wrong information 🙏 thanks for watching!
@@MadeOnTape love the videos man keep it up 👍👍
@@MadeOnTape NAC actually mentioned this in PR. I realize most UA-camrs don't do research, but this info is very easy to find.
@@gordonshumway7465 this is why we need you 🙏🏻 thank you
To me SONY was the best and TDK was a close second , I don't know if it's the same thing now.
Does the Fuji smell of hot lava and cherry blossoms?
it should....
They might be type 2 but they're 4 times the price 😅
😂😬
Stick to Maxell and TDK, they both make great sounding tapes just be careful with TDK, there tape formulas don't seem to age well, New Old Stock TDK to get moldy and dusty inside the cassette shells
thanks for the tip!
TDK numba 1
love TDK! Since I made this I've also used Maxell UDS-ii, and that's way closer to the TDK SA on the portastudio than the Maxell XL
@@MadeOnTape finna buy a few maxells to see what they hittin on.
@@MadeOnTape would you know how to route a 4 track Into an SSL G+ analog. Board?
i could make some guesses but that's above my pay grade 😂 @@lars6104
@@MadeOnTape do you have any general videos on how to use an external mixer with a 4 track?
I hear the most difference always in the high end. It changes drastically from cassette to cassette. Listen to the hi hats. and for a "studio master" its not very master of the studio ha.
yes I will still try and get my money's worth and use those 10 studio masters for something...maybe really vibey drums that I bounce to a better cassette afterward? At the very least, now I have a tone of type ii tape for loops. Who doesn't love vibey loops? haha thanks for listening!
Yes definitely!..you also get sticky tape syndrome..maxell is awsome.stay awY from ampex
oooh I'd assume ampex would be good, since they were the OG
@@MadeOnTape sorry..I should have said. Ampex bad on the reel to reel..maybe not so on the tape deck
@@mickrinaldiofficial979 ahhh thanks for clarifying!
You deck s biased for colbolt doped type 2 tapes the basf needs the biased and level backed off
100%! As an artist, it's fun to know what colors you have available, and I would still find uses for under/overbiased tapes on the portastudio. thanks for watching!
The new type 2 is worse you better off with type 1 also the new type 2 is not the same its cobalt old 70s tech and not even Chrome.