Inductii: Space Marine Aspirants of the Horus Heresy (Warhammer 40,000 Lore)
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- Опубліковано 30 сер 2023
- Being a record of Legiones Astartes recruitment during the Horus Heresy, with discussions of those Inductii born of this benighted epoch.
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Veterans of the great crusade be like: "Man, it was so much better when we stomped through the galaxy with barely any resistance. Symmetrical warfare sucks, and i'm now surrounded by toddlers".
but honestly i think the Astartes that were created during the time of the heresy that ended would most likely end up being even more badass than those of the great crusade, (if they lived long enough that is) because before the heresy most of the Astartes had never seen or felt what REAL war was like you said it was asymmetrical and one sided. The heresy born Astartes literally had a trial by fire.
"great men are forged in fire it is the privilege of the lesser men to light the flame"
The doctor- doctor who.
@michaelkean5969 That is a falacy, the wars of the Great Crusade were even more brutal in some circumstances, the Dark Angels lost a vast amount of their numbers fighting superior enemies in the Rangdan Xenocides and the Auretian Technocracy held back 3 Astartes Legions for a year before collapsing, costing numerous Astartes lives. There were MULTIPLE wars that were much brutal in difficulty and the power of their enemies than the Horus Heresy, it's simply that the Heresy hit hardest because it was so close to home, and the individual fighters were so evenly matched but the warriors of the Great Crusade did not have a cake walk in the least, Murder was vicious enough to send TWO Primarchs running away after all.
@@DaniMolnot saying the Astartes of the crusade were weak not at all, what i am getting at is that the vast majority of the Astartes within the legions would not have been truly challenged in the same way the heresy Era Astartes would have been. the true chads of the legions however would be the Astartes like Rylanor who where veterans of the unification wars plus the crusade and the heresy.
@@DaniMoltrue . Salamanders were almost destroyed fighting in the himaleyha
@michaelkean5969 the biggest Chad I would say was the anchorite probably the most op dreadnought we need a follow up to that story once they bring lorgar back have him go out like rylanor
Guy who was flash inducted 6 months ago and doesn't realize it refusing to let a guy who was flash inducted last week sit with him at lunch
In the grim darkness of the far future, one historitor battles against the tide of ignorance and superstition. Praise be to his efforts, and praise be to the Emperor, beloved by all!
He truly fights against the censors of the Imperium.
Ave Imperator... Gloria In Exelsis Terra.
Dude, I read that in an 80s-cop movie trailer voice…
He says while praising the Emperor😂
@@owenparris7490 uh oh introspection and questioning authority!! Definitely heretical who thinks in the imperium?
Flash indoctrination, forcing the memories of the dead into new aspirants to quicken their "training". Unification era blood angel in the corner: "Oh no ... the horror. How.could.one.ever.do.such.a.thing. *blank face* "
The ultimate tragedy of the Inductii is that they were stolen from their worlds and then stolen from their own legion culture; truly the damned within the doomed. The dark irony of the Warhammer 40k universe raises it's head once more.
The truly bitter irony of those space marines who slowly replaced their Terran-born predecessors being replaced themselves by those they barely consider to be members of the Legiones Astartes is simply excellent storytelling.
You'd think the Blood Angels wouldn't be too opposed to Flash Indoctrination considering that they, even before the heresy, consumed their fallen to recover their memories and experience and even sometimes took on their names. Its not like Sanguinius even put a stop to it, he just classed it up as the "Rite of Remembrance". So inductii with memories of fallen marines wouldn't be anything out of the ordinary.
The tragedy of both the inductii and veterans is so palpable here. The vanishing culture, the separation within legions of those who should and should not be seen as equals... It makes the Second Founding make even more sense. Those groups had to be split for their own good.
Dark Angels Inductii: "For the Emperor! For the Lion! come on gramps, lets get-"
Dark Angels Veteran: "Shut the hell up kid, you didn't fight during the Xenocide, you don't get to talk to me. Lets kill some Night Lords, don't slow me down,"
That is such an interesting point. That's the new head cannon I'm going with.
The Imperial fists are a good example. The Imperial fists and fists exemplar are the closest to the imperial fists, while the Crimson fists are the new blood, foreign to the legions ways under Alexius, and the Black Templars consist of the Rowdy and radicalised (for want of a better term) Veterans and Inductii of the Heresy, united under Sigismund and unleashed against the enemy.
Really explains a lot of successor chapters that are nothing like their predecessors.
The issue of the inductii not only broke the cultures of the legions, in many it actually broke the genetics of the legion. No doubt the gene seed flaws of the imperial fist and raven guard were worsened due to the rapid induction of marines to offset losses. It is also likely worsened defects in the space wolves and blood angels, and it likely created or worsened psychological defects in the dark angels, white scars, iron hands, ultramarines, and salamanders. In all honesty, in order to salvage the astartes as a formation it feels like the second founding was a necessary response to both the inability of the legions to be sustained as a formation due to the loss of the luna gene labs and the necessity to isolate the astartes to try and prevent further gene seed degradation. No doubt it would be preferable to only write off a chapters worth of marines and gene seed instead of a legions worth and it makes the second founding more reasonable.
The cultural rifts between many Inductii and the original marines of the legions seems like it's setting up the eventual splits when the legions become chapters- it wouldn't surprise me if, when forced to split up, many legions would boot out the troops who culturally are the most divergent from the wider legion, and then they'd form new chapters where their culture forms the bedrock of it.
That's a really good point actually. Wonder how that will effect the lore of the Second Founding chapters that we know and love today.
@mcchicken1849 Well if you look at the dorn family tree; Imperial Fists kept the core veterans, Crimson got the rawest marines and all the problem children went to the Black Templars. A good example of how the various internal cliques within legion kinda ended up being divvied up.
I would argue the break-up of Legions was already happening, informally. The adoption of the Chapter system may have been an attempt to relieve mounting internal pressures within the Legion. Inductii who could barely stand to be around the vanishing minority of old veterans could simply file themselves into Chapters. Rather than threaten to become so discontent, they potentially fall into renewed treason.
Funny how the Rapid Hypno-Indoctrination was "pioneered" by the IV Legion in the late stages of the Crusade... and is rumored to still by used by that ever-evasive Chapter, the Minotaurs...
What a funny and interesting "coincidence".
Novas 5oo?
If any legion could be unaffected culturally by this process, then I'd put good money on the Iron Warriors
Big E: "Horus, My son! You have proven yourself trustworthy to finish the Great Crusade! For that, I trust you with the title of Warmaster. I placed great trust in you."
Horus: "Thank you, Father. What are you going to do?"
Big E: "I'm heading back to Terra of course!"
Horus: "I see. You're helping out with Uncle Malcador in stabilizing the bureaucracy and government of the Imperium?"
Big E: "Ohohohoho! I have much bigger plans than that, Horus!"
Horus: "Will you tell me about it?"
Big E: "Sorry My boy, but I can't."
Horus: "But why?"
Big E: "Because I don't trust you."
Big E: Horus I must return to terra, powering the astronomicum from this distance is really tiring and I must finish a project which I will reveal to you when ready it will change everything my son
Horus: daddy doesn’t love me 😢
"horus, is your big tiddy mom still single? yes? here, take this sword and go conquer the galaxy, i have to go do something"
The Emperor is hands down one of the most awful parents in the entire galaxy
“Because it would ruin the surprise!”
Seriously just this alone would fix it. Get them excited for the big reveal.
Legion to Inductii relations in a nutshell:
"I'm so excited to be here"
*"STFU NOOB!"*
Sounds like the Legions were sundering even before the adoption of the Codex or the Chaos Legion Wars. With Astartes split within their Legions by homeworld, era of induction, and ideological disagreements about how to organize and replenish their dwindling manpower, and without the common experiences that bound the Crusade era Legions together, it sounds like it would be easy to break the Legions down into Warbands and Chapters.
This is a theme I’ve noticed after staring to listen to the heresy series. It’s highlighted most in the difference between Terran born original legionaries and those who came from any of the primarchs’ home planets. Lots of examples of differences in loyalty (either to the Emperor above all or to the Primarch first). Easy to see how this could play out further with recruits brought in on the campaign from other worlds who would be caught in between these two groups and have to fight for the approval of both and getting respect from neither. They weren’t originals who fought with the Emperor or sons of their Primarch’s world.
Makes me wonder if that’s where differences in how each chapter sees the Emperor comes from. Original founding chapters with lineage to Terra, having fought with the Emperor seeing him as the perfect human being.. but still ultimately human, and chapters with roots potentially back to worlds that had not fully adopted the ‘imperial truth’ before raising legionnaires seeing him as a god.
I keep forgetting that all Astartes are basically child soldiers. It explains so much about their emotional maturity and behavior regardless of all the hypnotherapy & engineering. Inside that monstrosity of ceramite is basically a scared & emotionally traumatized child...
That concept was brought up very briefly in the Night Lords trilogy, and it has colored my understanding of Space Marines ever since I read those books.
I love the inductii lore. I had the idea of my word bearers chapter using large alien plants to effectively clone the grey matter of falling legionaries, flash inducting *all* the children of their cultist auxiliaries. Creating space marines with the memories of many dead warriors. Glad it actually makes sense in the lore now.
Super cool idea brother
Warhawk has a great scene where White Scars inductii was assembled for deployment and onw of the Keshig is there to swear them in and they draw attention their shiny new mk.6 against the old marines battered terminator armour.
I remember that scene. It feels like the last ditch German use of high end armoured vehicles being often given to new guys in hopes they get enough experience and their good kit offsets their lack of experience.
From what I read, the bulk production Mk VI was worst off than the standard mass production Mk VI.
Jangsai's exchange with the Skye station commander was honestly a small heart warming spot in a rather bleak novel. The duel between Sigismund and Kharn was honestly tragic that didn't help with the bleak mood of that novel.
The negative impact of hypno indoctrination is interesting. It makes me wonder about the long-term reliability of Cawl's first crop of Primaris Marines. 10k years of hypno indoctrination may not have such acute effects as this rushed process, but still, one of Cawl's projects has got to blow up in his face eventually.
It wouldn't be 40k if it didn't.
Its actually quite sad, Ironic and fascinating that the Blood angels went back to their 'Revenant Legion' roots, eating the flesh of their comrades instead of their enemies.
I really like this, brings back some of the body horror and misery of the rogue trader days.
Love this upload, honestly, the nuances of Space Marine creation are what I most want to be elaborated upon in official lore. Like, how exactly does an apothecary cultivate gene-seed from recovered progenoid glands, what form does it take, does it get wasted if the aspirant fails? So much of it is left in the dark and leaves serious holes in the operation of Astartes chapters
The deathwatch roleplaying game goes into pretty good detail and is worth a read for the lore alone.
I'd love to hear the good Occuls expound on how the Astartes elevation process differed between the Crusade/ Heresay era and that in use in the modern Imperium.
I've not really found a source detailing exactly how and why Scout Companies are required in the 41st Millenium and not in the 30th, aside from vague hand waives towards so much knowledge being lost since the orignal foundings.
huh? I dont think its mandatory because of technical reasons.Its more a codex astartes thing. The Space Wolves dont do it
Your transmission comes as a welcome surprise. Praise the God-Emperor.
Happy to see a vid from your efforts.
Come to Chaos
Always nice to get some more broad context to the Horus Heresy. Trying to read 60+ books is a little daunting and these lore vids help a lot.
You can skip about 40 of them
The aesthetics of this channel remain an impeccable delight.
Flash indoctrination: You know, like updating your motherboard, but your updating a brain. Something tells me the mechanicum didn't like this
“Do you remember who your parents were?”
“No.”
“Me neither! High five!”
I would say that Alpha, the first Primaris that ArcMagos Cawl made being one of best examples of both savage warrior almost unbeatable, who is probably thousands of years old, while also being one of greatest Primaris psykers, beside his depressing demenour, is probably closest to invincible, that humanity in the 42nd milenia can make..
Yet his demenour, being surrounded with arogant Cawl creations all the time is rather expected..
You’re well on your way to Servo-skull status after a long life lived in service to the Imperium.
History doesn't repeat, but it often rhymes. Great Crusade Astartes slowly getting phased out by Inductii, just like Firstborns are slowly getting phased out by Primaris.
Honestly, although I do disagree with a lot of the codex's tenants and aims, The Horus Heresy pretty much damn near shattered many legions and birthed chapters, not legions, leading a pretty unavoidable legion disintegration.
On the loyalist side, the Iron hands are the best example. The Iron hands were brutalised on Istvaan, and while they were much, larger than the others 2 legions, being able to keep fighting after the heresy, they were shattered and splintered and their senior leadership and primarch had died. Iron Hands forces spent the 7 years of the heresy fighting on their own, or alongside other imperial forces, but most importantly *without contact from other Iron Hands*. So these conditions led to the diversification of the Iron hands. One chapter sized group of broken and bruised veterans fighting a guerrilla war against the advancing traitor hordes in the frontlines would differ vastly from a chapter of newer recruits fighting alongside the Ultramarines. The newer influx of scratch built recruits, would vary different from the older ones. Combine that with the various Blackshield warbands being turned into chapters and you have a bunch of completely different and alien forces.
This also explains the disintegration of the Traitor legions just as well as the influence of chaos and the degeneration of the legion command structure and order of battle. The traitor legions on average took the most attrition, being spread out and thrust into the fires of battle, and being flooded by the new and cheap Inductii. Combine that with various legions like the Night Lords being absolutely thrashed by the Dark Angels or the World Eaters being, well, *The World Eaters* then it can be easily explained why they would turn into chaos warbands, the Sons of Horus and Night Lords becoming thugs and street gangers in power armour.
A fresh Oculus report on pizza night? Truly The Emperor does provide!
In the grim darkness of the far future, there is only logistics.
0:19 It always makes me laugh when GW artwork - especially Space Marines - depict someone like this, looking up at the horizon but firing into the ground... Bolt rounds do not grow on trees, soldier! lol
Easily the best WH40k channel
Top 3 of my favorite long form youtubers. You make painting my minis so much more enjoyable
Im honestly surprised that ritualistic cannibalism of veteran astartes didnt become a big thing. I feel like people forget they can get memories from the fallen that way.
I seem to recall it being a thing for at least one successor chapter. The Mortifactors, maybe? Seems like it'd be logistically challenging on the wide scale, but I'm sure it happened sometimes.
@angusmuir6180 oh, i mean, it's definitely a thing in the 'modern' chapters, since the Blood Drinkers and the Flesh Eaters exist. I just meant during the Heresy. Occulus mentioned some pretty out there methods of getting recruits trained up, i was just surprised that having veterans offer themselves up for the munching didnt become more common since they all have that implant. One vet giving their experience to a few dozen recruits sounds pretty effective.
I was learning about these guys in the newest white dwarf. Then my dog destroyed it 😢
The Oculus provides!
Huh this didn't sound like a huge topic but it ended up really good
This Flash induction sounds a lot like Cawl's brain downloads
It’s certainly interesting to see just what changes in training does to change the culture of a fighting force. Most profound differences I have personally seen is when I went in the United States Marine Corps could kinda be split up every few years by the nature of the training at the oldest we had the SNCOs and Officers who came up either just before or immediately after 9/11 so generally like 98-09. Then you had the ones post Iraq to around when I enlisted in late 17, I was the first cycle to have a large change in the training since about 2009. Then everything changed again when Covid hit. It’s not overtly noticeable to those on the outside looking in but it is one of those things that when you’re in you can mostly tell the generational difference.
Noteably, Inductii were only one form of rapid reinforcement during the heresy. Newbloods were grown over about four years, and used by both sides. This rapid growth created issues, of course, but it was a way to get reinforcements when needed. This was then further reduced by the SoH to six months into what they called "Newborns". Usually only having a success rate of one in thousands, again, it was all about rapid reinforcement, especially for the Solar campaign.
Listening to this in an empty room and the echo gives it extra gravitas
Oculus Imperia AND Noah Caldwell-Gervais uploading on consecutive days?
Be still; my beating heart...
Mayhaps losing ones rememberances of childhood and empathy is actually a blessing, if one is to become a living, walking weapon of mass destruction.
Nice, the noise marines remains. Rock on!
wow, holy shit, this whole "not a TRUE Astartes/shit-ass half-breed" mindset wasn't just for Iron Warriors against Honsou. Seems the loyalists had similar misgivings. It is so ironic, because they are *DOING* these kinds of half-measure marines, yet they complain about it.
Hydra mundus nova
Actually "terata" (térata) means monsters in Greek...A good choice of a word for Fabius' creations...
All hail hypnotoad!
I loved the depictions of the 16th legion Inductii in the first seige of terra book. Really made the decline of the Sons of Horus feel personal. You spend the first few books of HH learning about how glorious and efficient the 16th legion was, and then the first book of SoT shows you the Inductii's existence as purely barbaric despoilers and cannon fodder to be sacrificed in any number to seize the system.
Traitor Inductii, the only group that makes an Imperial Guard Penal Regiment seem enviable by comparison. Its like the worst parts of being a whiteshield, skiitari and Thunder Warrior all in one horrifying package.
Loved the lore about Inductii that GW added, its a great addition to show the desperation of the times and how it would shape the legions and how it resulted in some having damaged geneseed with organs that had degraded to literal uselessness. Only thing I can complain about is how GW decided they'd all be using mark 6 power armor instead of the vastly easier to repair and manufacture Mark 5, which was literally made for such desperate times. I hate how they took mark 6 and retconned it from being a prototype near the end of its development that was very well suited to the Ravenguards style of warfare to something that every forgeworld and their mother was mass producing and could therefore become the staple of the Inductii. Mark 5 just fits that so much better. My moneys on GW retconning it so they could market and sell the new mark 6 models they had released at the time. Which, in my opinion, acted more as a spoonful of vinegar then suger to "make the medicine go down better" so to speak.
Yeah everything about the Mk6 is lame, the old lore was well established it is great for it to be the favored suit for certain legions and not for others. Traitors could have occupied a forgeworld producing it, but it should be super rare for them and limited to recon teams, assault squads, and such. I'm worried the old heresy with all its depth and detail is going away due to GW's greed and it sucks.
@@JCDenton3 I agree, captured my thoughts perfectly.
Mark V was easy to mass produce and repair/maintain and had performance and durability/protection drawbacks as a result. Perfect for the heresy in which it was named, where supply lines were fractured and attrition rates on power armor were high. That was its niche. Now with Mark VI being so easily mass produced that entire companies can be equipped with it regardless of the style of warfare they partake of, it doesn't only shove Mark V, armor that truly encapsulates the desperation of the Heresy into near redundancy, and makes Mark VI less unique. It's a loss for both marks. And GW won't change that, its set now. Such a shame.
There wasn't really a "Mark V." Granted it all ended up coming together to a very similiar look due to shared ideas of what an ideal stopgap was or what were relatively ideal ad-hoc modifications in the field were. But no Mechanicum, loyalist or heretic, developed a Mk. V and called it the "Heresy Pattern." The name itself should clue you in what it was. As the heresy progressed and as supply lines were at their stretching point or were crushed, or as the demands of the war began to far outstrip the abilities of manufactirum to reliably supply equipment, you had techpriests or Marines observing their plate becoming exponentially more worn, but are forced to scrounge around for pieces to substitute damaged armor or try to find methods to lengthen the survivability or lifespan of usable plate. I think the term "Heresy Pattern" is instead a catch-all term for any significantly modified plate, created around the fime of the Heresy, with unique enough attributes ti constitute a "new suit" withoit being an officially created mark.
While it is a retcon to show mk vi as the prototypical Heresy era power armour, this is itself a retcon. The earliest depictions of the by GW Heresy showed marines in mk vi beaky armour
@rorythomas9469 that is well and good, but this new retcon really doesn't do anything to help the setting. The new Chaos kits are supposed to be the Heresy Veterans mixed with some new traitors, yet they all have an abundance of mk3, mk4, and mk7 pieces - no beakie helmets except one or two in the raptor kit and a shoulder pad. Where did it all go if every heresy era marine was decked out in mk6? They should have left it well enough alone. The mk6 is welcome and has its place, and sure plenty of companies within the legions probably wore it 100%, but the other variants should have remained dominant for certain legions (Iron Warriors prefer mk3, Word Bearers mk4, Shattered Legions mk5, Ravenguard mk6, etc...) It felt more realistic with more detail and depth to the setting, which is what made the whole HH era a favorite for a lot of players.
2:10 1 beakie = 1 upvote
most of the old art gets the the Imperium's tone just right.
Anything past 2000 is just marketing material from the GW sales department. John Blanche and Rick Priestly ARE Warhammer 40k. Nothing else is canon. Or good.
@@princeofcupspoc9073 that's certainly... a take :v
Okay Boomer
A suitably dark and chilling tale of a dark and chilling time.
Very interesting topic! Thanks for your work!
Well done brother! I enjoyed this one.
It is sorrowful that so many practices of imperium were only meant as stopgap measures during heresy and now imperium has lost its ability to use anything but said methods. Or even consider alternatives.
Superb! You bring a level of knowledge, nuance and understanding that almost none can match!
I honestly would like to hear your take on a conversation between Oculus Imperia and a Space Marine; just throwing it out there (i mean Oculus has spoken to a traitor marine and the inquisiton by now; possibly, for fun, maybe have Oculus given the chance to sit down for a face-to-face with an Aeldari.. ;) )
Imagine him talking to Yvraine. ..
@@qiushuang239 i need this to happen now! Lol
He talked to a traitor marine?
@@sonicman52Iskandar Khayon
You have a very special voice. Soothing and unique.
What an amazing topic
Really interesting video oculus! Hadn’t really considered this but it makes sense with the appalling casualties all the legions took during the heresy. Keep it up!
Another great way to add more depth to the Horus Heresy and the legions themselves. You always do a great job of expressing that depth, well done as always Oculus.
Amazing video as always
It seems that the salamanders are one of the better legions for inductii - though there seems to be little lore about theirs.
Most excellent
Love these best content and contributions on the lore out there
Always get excited when I see you've posted
Thank you so much for this video, that was a question lurking in the back of my mind for years.
Great video these are always a great listen
ood stuff...definetely well put together
My guy, you have a tvtropes page now, did anyone tell you that?
HOLY SHIT
Ok, yes I clicked as soon as I saw that Oculus had returned. Gosh dang I love your content, seriously. Especially when you start expressing the emotions and acting out the events of the Oculus’s life. So well written and a joy to listen too always. Thank you so much for sharing this all with us :)
Brilliant brother!
So wait there was imperial fists recruited from the 16ths home world?
Amazing work, as ever.
Bro, yoir content is fire. Much love from Aotearoa
Entire companies of inductii yet they have no rite of war for them.
Another master class, Occulus. Well done! When's that 100k QnA gonna drop, man?
Every episode is awesome. Love you channel, love WH, ave dominus nox.
babe WAKE UP!!! New oculus imperia video dropped!!!!
In the recent huron blackheart book there is a former sons of horus inductii in the red corsair ranks
Fluff from the Fluff God
Lore from the Throne of Oculus Imperia
His throne is probably either an office chair or a Lazy Boy recliner, and nice one to. This is canon.
@@mcchicken1849 this is canon.
I would really like to see a video focused on the armor and weapon adaptations forced upon loyalists and traitors alike.
More Librarium Chaotica please
Love this channel, juuuuust enough hope to have the grimdark crush down harder.... Maybe this is something I should worry about in my psycho-conditioning....😃
The emperor protects. Ave Imperator.
Wel done!
Good vid🤘
HUGE
I know that you probably get asked this all the time and its probably a subject with a ridiculous amount of conflicting information, but a video on the two lost legions would be amazing.
He’s done one
The blood angles should had been the master of this, the Eaters of the Dead , The Revenant Legion
Fabulous Bill 🎉
🎉
I know its not entirely possible, but this is why the Emperor wanted his legions atomized and not turned into little cliques, and disparaging different ideological and/or culteral means preventing combat effectiveness.
Hey Occi, can you cover the Navigators? :)
@Oculis can you do an in universe in character 8nterview with Baldemort
Sensei Le Dew
Yes !!!