Klingon Warcrimes: Septimus 3 Q&A
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- Опубліковано 22 лис 2023
- Today i Answer your questions on the Fall of Septimus 3 and the wider issues it raises: from the structure of the klingon defence forces, their relationship with their vassals, and the attitudes of their federation allies. we also compare the massacre of Septimus 3 to other actions in the dominion war that were previously overlooked.
Sources:
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"Rom was war criminal" sounds like Lore reloaded title video tbh lol
Don’t give him ideas
rom a war criminal no thats quark venting because he didn't become grand nagus. either that or brunt is out for revenge.
What do you call a retreating Cardassian officer? A Legate.
I’ll see myself out
Klingons when they get too consumed by the fog of war in a nutshell. Also the self replicating mines being an analog to the Stargate's iris is pretty fitting, except one is very explosive, while the other makes things go splat.
In all fairness, putting Marines on a ship is also a means of repealing boarding actions. Sure a ship's crew can do the job, but having men (and women) that are better trained to fight. That is a better security than the crew.
Thus, on a Klingon Ship. Having the Marines placed between the Crew section and the Bridge also acts as a barrier to keep boarders from taking the Bridge. Being that teleporting onto the Bridge is dicy and not as common as people like to think.
Keeping the Marines there to not only send some out to fan out removing the threat within the ship. Also, that narrow neck acts as a funnel and makes a hallway a killing box for the rest.
And interesting series of Q&As; some serious and some comedic.
Quite looking forward to seeing the 3rd episode of this apocalypse arc when it arrives. Oh, and Happy Thanksgiving.
Glad your enjoying.
I would love to see you cover ship production and logistics for the war. In this attrition warfare, both sides must be, somehow, pumping out a fleets worth of ships every month or two, and I'm not sure how that would even be accomplished. I'd also like to know a rough production time for many of the more "modern" ships, and whether Starfleet is actually producing more older ships or if they've really mothballed that many to make up for extreme losses during the war.
EDIT: Also curious how the Cardassian ship production was improved from the start of the Cardassian-Klingon war, and whether Klingon ship production methodology changed during the war or if the existing House-based (as in, the Houses pay and work with the Shipwrights to create ships) impacted what the Klingons could field.
It is just my opinion, but this conflict mark switch to STO era. At the time Federation need unleash its fill capacity and they needed utilize a lot of half finished hulls and parts, what could be made faster then others. As such algorithm was designed what allow creation of hamera ships, what were rapid combinations of several ship classes and reconfirmation of one ships into another (something we did happen with Titan in Picard S3). Previously most ships needed to be designed from ground up, even if TMP ships already were extremely modular and TNG ships basically were flying drone hives.
As for Cardassians, they start far under capacity of Federation, compensating with ferocity, when for Federation it was just insignificant border conflict despite potential close proximity and threat to Earth. As technically it was a fault of unregulated Earth colonists calling themselves Maquis. Until DS9 start Cardassians could equalize themselves with Federation, thanks to selling ancient artifacts to Ferengi in exchange for tech and parts. With Galor being roughly equivalent of Excelsior. When they join alliance with Dominion, they get technology exceeding Federation but many did not realize that they traded freedom for that. After the war, ruined Cardassians join the Federation.
One of the things referenced in the Star Trek books is the brain drain from losing so many good officers that take so long to train. This is where the Dominion with their clones have a significant advantage. You can pump out Weyouns and Jem Hadar but it takes twenty years to train up a Starfleet Officer at least and okay you've got a large galactic federation filled with colony worlds but Starfleet is an entirely voluntary organisation and the closest they get to payment is the chance of a career promotion (that means little) and the fact that if you visit a Ferengi run place at a Starfleet facility then Starfleet can give you some latinum to spend there but anything you wanted could be gotten for free as a Federation Citizen anyway. So one of the things that is mentioned is that as the war goes on the standards for who Starfleet will accept drops and drops. This arguably accounts somewhat for the ethical shift in Starfleet's approach.
Glory to you and your channel!!
I suppose the safety factor of the self-replicating mines is they have to get their replicator mass from somewhere, presumably a lot of the same mass over and over when it gets blown up and reformed?
also the wormhole itself emits energy they can use.
I've always been a big fan of the Kirk era starships. I really especially like the analysis on the ships.❤
So this is something that always bothered me about the self replicating mines. It has been shown in various ways throughout trek lore, Voyager specifically comes to mind, that replicators require a great deal of energy to function. So where the hell is all the energy coming from to allow a mine to both replicate itself while also still having enough energy on board to be an effective explosive device against something the size and durability of a starship? I suppose one could equip a mine with some kind of energy collecting equipment like an advanced solar panel and once enough energy had been harvested it could replicate itself. However, we see no such equipment on the mines deployed by the Defiant and even if it was there but just not activated, good luck collecting solar energy while cloaked. The only other solution I could come up with, and the one I prefer, is that the mines must be deployed with a built in energy surplus, perhaps an antimatter reserve which would allow the mines to replicate themselves. However, this would mean that the mines can only replicate a finite number of times before running out of this reserve. Therefore, fresh mines would need to be laid from time to time or periodic resupply of the existing mines' energy reserves would have to be done in order to maintain the mine field. I think this is a solution to the problem that adds a bit of realism to these mines while also creating interesting logistic issues that would need to be solved in order to use them as intended.
Probably from wormhole itself. I assume it is what was limiting they unregulated expansion.
i'd assume the debris from ships destroyed or disabled by the mine would provide the mass and energy required to replicate more mines. depending how many mines per ship used the field itself could expand and become denser
That's a great point and one I had not considered. Given the similarities between replicator and transporter tech I would imagine the on board replicator could also function as a transporter and simply dematerialize the needed mass from the available debris provided said debris was in transporter range. Some of the dematerialized mass could also be retained as energy and directed to recharge the mine's power supply.
You know, I kinda love the idea that there were 'limited' replications before 'refueling' was needed, meaning that the entire thing was mostly a bluff to keep the Dominion from just shoving ships through until the field ran out of material. And they got away with it because they're Starfleet and the enemy couldn't be sufficiently sure they hadn't somehow figured out a way to get around that issue.
That being said, using transporters to resupply off wreckage also feels like a crazy thing Starfleet would come up with, so that works too.
@@nekophht TBH best part of Star Trek is that most wers in universe were asymmetric.
During Earth-Romulan War, Earth was serious underdog. But thanks to international support and enemy overconfidence. It ended with positive stalemate. It actually was quite like war in Ukraine (coincidentally).
During Federation-Klingon War we see clash of ideologies. It was more a Cold War with series of hot conflicts.
Caucasian Border Conflict was reversal of this issue. Where Federation was the dominat side, but due to political weakens things escalate beyond control. It was sort of mix of war on Terror and Vietnam.
Dominion War was kind of interesting, because Dominion legitimately could destroy Federation. But they actually were making a point. And that with threat of eldritch horror in background.
Finally we have Iconian Temporal Cold War of STO. Where both sides have own advantages. But that is bit of complicated.
The thing with the self-replication, or mass-replication of ships is that apparently, there are still several things the Federation needs to mine traditionally. Dilithium appears to be a material that cannot be replicated with sufficient purity (I think it was never stated in the shows, only in the Tech-manuals that replicated Dilithium has a far shorter deterioration span and is generally less efficient in terms of power conversion). Other materials seem to be lithium (lithium mine on Rigel XII), Topaline (Capella IV), sulfur mines (mentioned is a moon of Jupiter) and of course Dilithium. There was some unknown mining operation on Quadra Sigma III, and the there are the mining companies such as Dytallix Mining Co., Galactic Mining Company, the Jupiter Mining Corporation, and the Tigan pergium mining business.
So it's quite obvious that while a mass-replication of ships would work for basic skeletal hull parts where only the basics like Duranium, Tritatnium and Transparent Aluminium were needed, the Replicator could not mass-replicate certain parts, namely those that replied on processed mined materials. What precisely they were? Who knows. Certainly the warp-core assembly with the Dilithium crystal. Certainly some life-support systems where Topaline was a vital part.....
And even if that were eventually surpassed; synthetic dilithium reached the potential of actual dilithium; synthetic topaline became a thing, etc., it would still be the question of actually crewing the ship. Granted, in "Message in a Bottle", we saw how two EMH programs were able to not only handle a ship under duress but even how they were able to retake that ship from enemy forces all commando/Died-Hard style. And keep in mind, they were not even programmed for that type of behaviour. They improvsied. So just imagine how holoprogram characters could perform if they were programmed for such tasks specifically, able to rely on the collective m,ilitary training from thousands of soldiers for dozens of species.
Of course, this would raise a whole barrel of questions of sentienthood as we saw them in TNG "Measures of a Man" concerning Data and androidic lifeforms (by synthetic life in general) as well as Voy "Author, Author" with the EMHs (holographic characters) in particular..
But there's the benefit of hindsight 20/20 now, look at Star Trek Picard and the synthetics massacre of Mars. Mass-replicate them entire fleets of ships and set them out to seek out new life and explore the galaxy - all fine and dandy.
But it takes just one nifty Romulan hacker or one ruthless Changeling and suddenly the peaceful fleets turn on you. And their advanced AI-minds have developed plans and cintingencies for all your weaknesses faster than it takes me to write that sentence.
Great video's, keep up the good work!
From what I understood Replicators still need a source of matter to replicate something. I never imagined that they created something out of nothing. If thats the case my respect for Start trek technology just went out the window, its just magic at that point.
Thank you for answering my question I really enjoyed the episode
Thanks for answering my question, Venom. Until the next one 😊
In my 'head canon', I always assumed that the power source for the self-replicating mines around the Bajoran wormhole was the wormhole itself. It must take a *huge* amount of energy to self-replicate, as E=mc^2 is still a thing in the future, and c is pretty damn fast, so you'd need something truly powerful nearby, such as a stable wormhole, to use as a power source to replicate stuff without a pre-existing source of matter. Rom must have figured out a clever way to draw energy from the wormhole to make them work.
That's how I used physics and a bit of hand-waving to explain to myself why the entire Alpha quadrant was not filled to capacity with self-replicating mines by the end of the war.
Coincidentally, I surmised the same head canon hypothesis myself. Having the Bajorian wormhole be the power source addresses the issue of why such mines can exist without there being many berserker Von Neumann swarms threating the galaxy.
We know from the DS9: Explorers, that tachyons can be found to seemingly naturally occur in space. It does not fit within our current model of physics for tachyons to naturally exist (or really exist at all), but I head canon that the Bajoran region is unusual, in that the Denorios anomaly (wormhole) emits tachyons. I expect this sort of tachyon radiation could be utilised.
So they can only function near a giant power source
Yes, I think the same.
@@venomgeekmedia9886 They can only self-replicate if they have access to either some energy and a source of matter with the correct types of elements (metals, explosive components, etc.), or else a huge amount of energy. They could use a transporter to gather materials and remove the elements that are needed while rejecting the useless stuff.
If they are deployed in a dense asteroid field inside a nebula with a bright star nearby, then they could use solar energy to power replicators and essentially consume some of the asteroids and gases to copy themselves. It would be a rare concurrence of "weak energy source + metals + gases" that would allow a low-powered mine to self-replicate. This would also be a slow process, unlike replicating coffee for Janeway, since there isn't a warp core powering this tiny mine.
If there isn't a source of mass but there is a huge source of energy, then E=mc^2 is in effect and it requires lots of E to get a little bit of m.
You can't just dump one mine in empty space and expect it to turn empty vacuum into a million copies of itself.
They will still go boom if the power source is removed, they just can't replicate.
Shipyard of the era DID employ Industrial Replicators. These could simply create out of raw energy various compartments, with all the furnishings and "electronics". But putting it together still takes some time. And some components require non-replicatable materials. Plus, if you have 10,000 sovereigns, and personnel to crew five, then you have 9995 targets that can be stolen. The most important component of a Starship takes (for Terrans) about 18-22 years to produce.
Interesting about the Klingon Houses raising levies of subject races. That is an under explored topic. Similar to the Romulan use of Reman troops.
I still think you're too hard on the "K ting uh's". With 24th century tech (including weapons and shields), and some ablative armor on the hull, I think that they could be formidable assault-ships; especially in groups. [and, if you survived their initial assault, they could 'wave goodbye to you' with their aft torpedo-launcher 😉]
The thing is a self replicating mine is actually quite simple. You have some kind of explosive, some kind of sensor and then some kind of code saying "scan xy area, if space to build mine, build mine." The difficult bit is getting a replicator to build a replicator but that's where Rom being a genius and the mines being small comes in.
Now yes there are the ethical issues except 1. There's already a massive war and DS9 has been parked outside the wormhole with the Defiant since before the war began. People know about the wormhole. The Dominion knows about the wormhole. 2. The entire reason the Prophets get involved is because the Dominion bothers to wait until they can deactivate the mines safely. Meaning you can actually switch the mines off 3. It's quite easy to check if the mines are still active. Fire at wormhole coordinates. If mines active wait. 4. Without the mines the Gamma Quadrant reinforcements come streaming in and they make the ethical concerns look pathetic. It's still wrong but it's less wrong than allowing everyone in the Alpha and Beta Quadrants to be wiped out. The mines are a known deterrent and to my knowledge there is no instance of the Dominion trying to run reinforcements through the minefield.
That said much discussion is made about why didn't Voyager pick the Gamma Quadrant wormhole to return through, imagine how darkly comical it would be if the ending of Voyasger was flying headfirst into Rom's self replicating minefield. There's Tom and B'Ellana with their newborn baby. There's Harry Kim anxious to see Libby. There's Seven of Nine liberated Borg and hero of Voyager and there's Captain Kathryn Janeway finally having got her people home and wham! Admiral Paris watches his son and grandchild go up in smoke. I know the minefield is deactivated by the time they get home but still, they may have been the one ship that didn't know about it.
Replicating a bomb is one thing but replicating a sophisticated FTL capable Starship is another
L-24 the Excelsior/Nova counterpart!
Cheers. Sure septimis video
Section 31 is messing with the algorithm
You should do the battle of the basin rift
Maybe. Its a smaller scale battle but maybe worth doing a play by play.
How come they did not use self replicating mines to prevent raids on the edge of Chitaka??
The NightWitches were Fighter pilots (not Bombers) all were confirmed Aces at the end of the war.
Re: Raiders. Gee, maybe the Klingons shouldn't have rushed to get rid of the F5...
Maybe the F5 would've been a savior.
@@merafirewing6591 good luck trying to "refit" that thing-
while you could say female klingon warriors are inspired from the night witches, you can't say they are inspired from soviet soldiers. They have little in common other than that they are soldiers. they have more in common with north European shield maidens or Scythians
I do think they should've gone through with the idea of a shipyard that could rapidly build or repair or refit a ship as they'd encountered the tech in archers time - yes I know enterprise came after ds9
They more of less did that. Federation basically start program what allow Frankenstein ships, what later become base of 25'th century design (STO). For reminder in this game you can make ships composed from parts of various other ships. And that is how canonically Federation could keep up with production, recycling parts of other ships.
Ladt British mutiny. 1931 hms valiant. 1000 men . Over s pay cut dispute.
And exercise had to be cancelled. Hms hood and ajax and achillies . Were supposed to participate.
Huh. Was it against the admiralty or the officers?
@venomgeekmedia9886 admiralty, I think.
Why does your intro show a phaser beam coming out of the Klingon forward torpedo tube?
Lance phaser See DS9
ok@@laisphinto6372
Rom had just the idea. Jadzia and Miles executed rhe while thing.😊
probably the warcrime situaiton on septimus 3 you know youtube and censoring words on smaller channels
Not sure why YT is suppressing so many of my subscriptions. Didn't even see that video had come out.
You know what to do...
Yeah, Stargate!
Don't get me wrong, I do like Lore reloaded.
But the man do got anti-Fed tunnel vision, lol.
He IS a time travel romulan
second
First.
Didn't those soviet women play load noise to deprive Germans of sleep. ?
Probably.
It will be a sorry day if the Klingons ever drop the D-7 from their navy.
Oh man... your not gonna like next weeks video.
@@venomgeekmedia9886 Impossible. That is why Vor'cha still makes use of them.
@@venomgeekmedia9886 I guess all cool things must come to an end. I will mess the D-7 bad boy class. Maybe one of the great houses will be a old fashion die hard for them or Worf may want one to turn into an RV. LOL
Thanks for making this great video.
Klingosn are baed off the Vikings and Sumari
Do we at least concur that the nexus causes certain amphibious species to periodically exhibit ardent homosexual behaviour?
The nexus is turning the frigging frogs gay!!!