This goes to show that losing your parents is a terrible thing that will scar you for life, but losing your child is something that truly breaks your spirit and sanity beyond repair.
@YoungD3mon314 ok so if your son gets shot in front of you he bled all over you and himself and cried in pain and asked you why did you not help me then he dies just like not in peace but in serious pain and suffering so I’m sure as a loving parent the most logical thing to do after you cleaned your self of all the blood and brain matter and now your son lays In a coffin 6feet on the ground when just 2 days ago he was sleeping next to you in bed I am sure that though all of that the 10 years you spent with your child will not continue the life you thought you should have with him is home gone in a instant the years you will never have with him ever I am sure the frist thing that hits your mind is don’t worry sweet heart we will make another one how twisted is that. I seen a father in real life and his one year old son died but getting hit by a car and he was at the funnel and he said something that I’ll never forget he said as a father “ I should not be here at my sons funeral he should be at mine now take that with the added pain of getting shot and watching him die.
Arthaslepeureux ikr? I remember this one Batman comic. I forgot who was Batman in that, but he beat the crap out of criminals, and was batshit insane. But this guy probably takes the cake!
Just think the original Joker in this universe is probably out there living a normal life with a wife and kid or something. Hopefully not living in Gotham though.
Actually He is dead in this universe, remember this batman kills, so when the Joker was made to pose as the Red Hood and ran into Batman where unlike when Bruce attempted to apprehend him leading to his unfortunate slip and fall into a vat of acid, Thomas simply riddled him with bullets end of story. Some more possibilities are ThomasBatman never running into the The Red Hood Gang at ace chemicals, the man who would be Joker never was pressganged into the Red Hood Gang and many more alternatives that step into the unknown.
Martin Sevcech But what if since Barry started a sort of time domino affect, that instead of the joker having to go to crime, he actually had a successful comedy career. That would actually be a nice thing to happen.
for anyone wondering why thomas wayne choose the bat costume, this might be the reasons: 1.he knows the batcave because the wayne manor comes with it 2. in the silver age (i think it is the silver age) he told bruce that he met martha for first time in a costume party, in which he dresses as a bat, which inspired bruce the idea for the costume. 3. he wears it as a way to confront his wife since it is the very thing he dressed as when they first met
"Wanna know how I got these scars? I used to have a husband.He was handsome.One night,we're walking home in the dark.A mugger comes a long and kills my precious son.And Tom,well...He just goes out of his mind! He beats the mugger to death with his bare hands,smiling as he does.I look down at the blood on my son's clothes and think of how he could have become a super-hero if he wanted... Now,I see the funny side! Now,I'm always smiling!"
Hrittik Azad True But to be honest i can't see the mom turning into the joker. More like the Mr an Mrs Wayne teaming up together as batman and batwoman (and or catwoman.)
Hontoni Arigato yeah because there was no bruce wayne batman that scared the joker into falling over the chemical plant or thomas just killed him instead of scarng him accidentaly
This movie had. An apocalypse, mass genocide, children getting stabbed and shot, blood, mutilation and torture, a guy getting shot in the head, and people bitch that Man of Steel was dark?
Plus, Man of Steel came out in theaters, while this went straight to video. Those sorts of movies tend to feel like they have the justification to go more dark.
TheReccher All that stuff is supposed to show that this a nightmare reality, and dark and twisted version of the main DC universe. Man of Steel's DEFAULT state is dark and brooding.
+Mr Mxyzptlk Yeah but then in the 90s frank kind of lost his mind, not going crazy but, any comic he wrote especially batman, wasn't very good or needs to be burned straight away.
+Evan Farley Everything he does is like a 14 year old kid going through his emo Nu-metal phase writing fanfiction. "Yeah Batman's killing people now because he's the best there is and Supermans a total queer and it's going to be metal as fuck! He's going to fight the Joker in the Tunnel of Love while Slipknot plays in the back ground!" I mean I liked Dark Knight Returns but it still had that feel to it.
“Despite all your sick, vicious little games. He’s as sane as he ever was. So maybe ordinary people don’t always crack. Maybe there isn’t a need to crawl under a rock with all the other slimy things when trouble hits… maybe it was just you all the time.” - The Batman
My favorite bit of this qoute is it's almost always taken ad Joker speaking the truth when the stories about how he's just spewing bs to make himself feel better
@@lock376 which is lost on pretty much everybody who loves the killing joke. I couldn’t tell you how many people I’ve talked to about it that think the Joker was right. Quite possibly the most misunderstood piece of media in human history.
Its a bit disappointing the movie never further explores Martha as Joker like in the comics as in one major plot in the comics was Thomas finding Martha and despite the issues, revealed they still loved each other and then ask her blessing to change the universe where they both die and Bruce live, which Martha agrees until she asks what happens to Bruce in the other universe and realizes what happens and is driven to suicide
in the comics version of this, batman has killed almost all the supervillains in gotham but he just cant kill the joker or martha and its a slow decent into madness not like in the movie. its really intense and worth the read
To clear it up for all you DC fans who don't understand why the original Joker never made an appearance in this timeline, the answer is simple. Since Thomas Wayne became a violent, criminal-killing Batman in this universe, he never spared the lives of any law breakers. In all versions of Joker's origin story, it was during a crime under the identity of Red Hood. In this universe, Thomas Wayne probably killed him instead of causing him to be immersed in chemicals. Those that Joker was never created and the role was left open for Martha to fill.
Since Thomas Wayne didn't become Batman until AFTER Bruce was killed--the same night that Martha became The Joker--that makes no sense. SHE IS THE ORIGINAL JOKER. There was no hole to fill. Flash's ripple-effect on time made it so that whomever became the Joker in the Timeline(s) we are familiar with never became The Joker ... probably never even did crimes as The Red Hood. Thomas became Batman on the same night The Joker came into existence ... the night Bruce died.
Ah! But you forget! In the Killing Joke version of Joker's, he WASN'T a criminal. He was swept up in ONE crime. So, you can't assume that was the case in his life. Besides, Professor Zoom said it only changed things only a tiny bit. So it likely didn't change the events leading up to that except for the likely possibility of Thomas killing him that night.
+Superdarkcloud666 That very-questionable "little bit" he spoke of actually caused HUGE change. Like a world-ending war between the Atlanteans & the Amazons, for instance. That "little bit" he spoke of was either sarcasm, GROSS underestimation, or outright stupidity. This changed in HUGE, drastic, cataclysmic ways. How could Thomas--as Batman--have killed the "original Joker" when he became Batman the night his wife became the Joker? There was no void for her to fill, as there was no Batman yet--until that night--who would have killed an "original Joker." She IS the "original Joker." The ripple in time, for all we know, caused the death (maybe in a car accident) of the man who would go on to be the Joker we know years before Bruce's death.
+Priaperos he means the joker that we know, assuming that the events of the killing joke origin of the joker still takes place, there's every reason to believe this batman would shoot on sight at seeing the red hood. to him it would have been him just putting down another criminal scum, to us it's just one of many ripples further altering the time line. also, zoom mentions that the changes are small. they are themselves very subtle differences, but every action has a reaction and it's the repercussions of said actions that make things the way they are in this paradox
The Killing Joke is canon but Joker has no real canon origin. Even at the end of the killing joke he debunks his own backstory. Nobody knows where the Joker comes from, they don't know his name, and hopefully we never will as that is the charm of his character. So the Joker very well could have still appeared in this.
If you read "The Killing Joke", you'll see it actually it doesn't. Joker jumps into the chemicals trying to escape Batman. When he arises, he's all disfigured, thus becoming the Joker. Batman also explains how Gordon "is as sane as ever", thug again proving that it really doesn't take one bad day lol.
Thugastrike For what you say about "the killing joke" In the end of the comic though gordon "is as sane as ever" batman changed. He was also part of jokers plan to cause one bad day. Barbra was important to him as well. At the end of the comic when the joker tells a joke, both he and batman break out into hysterical laughter. This shows that the bad experience had affected him psychologically if only short term.
Mr. born in 1993, no Batman didn't change. At the start of the comic he was talking to the Joker about how it would come down to one of them killing the other. It was already foretold. The breaking out in hysterical laughter wasn't Batman going insane either. And to Mr. Gavin, it doesn't matter if Joker's backstory wasn't 100% accurate. Without the disfigurement, he wouldn't be the Joker. The whole point that Joker was trying to make was that "all it takes is one bad day" is his excuse for his lunacy, when in fact it was not. Gordon not going insane, after what Joker did to him, is proof that it doesn't. Case closed.
All it takes is being weak minded and not having strength of will or character, you mean. Batman debunked that belief of Joker in the movie himself, him and Gordon are the prime examples.
When did I talk about the batman of this universe in this comment? He's doing his best, at least he is trying, he didn't give up and snap completely. I was talking about the killing joke movie.
That's why I love the alternate universes of DC. Everyone could die, and everybody could kill, everybody is really "human", no one respects a moral code of no killing. And everyone suffers. That's realistic.
Ivan Colonna The climax in Flashpoint Paradox is amazing, though. Right after Batman kills Zoom and the entire world explodes, The Flash is desperately trying to outrun the explosion to fix his mistake. Great movie moment.
SDR3088 Its a movie, stupid. Thats the fucking sense of Flashpoint, a distopic world where the heroes of the current universe could so evil to fight endless wars, and kill everyone in the name of the cause. Maybe you should watch Peppa Pig, more suitable for minds like yours.
Ivan Colonna And our real world really will die too. Not soon, not even remotely soon, but it WILL die, along with everything else that’s ever had any meaning to us. That’s the ultimate reality, that everything will eventually die to time. Portraying any happy ending would simply be lying.
See Barry? This is what happens when you mess with time, you fuck shit up and you knew this would happen. You know that time travelling is never a good idea but you did it anyways :/ now we got New 52. I liked the story of the Flashpoint Paradox comic but what Barry did was really stupid.
I do kind of blame Barry for all of the most recent retcon. well, Barry and you know the writers of DC that decided to piss on all of our back issues... again.
They didn't handle Martha's transformation well at all.In the comics she spent days being depressed and Thomas was saying to her how much he had missed her smile.After Thomas Wayne tracked down and murdered Joe Chill with his bare hands,he returned to Wayne Manor to inform his wife but she had gone completely insane and scarred her face ever worse than the real Heath Ledger Joker.Her teeth were coming out from her cheeks!
Well losing your beloved kid isn't something easy to let go to make matters worse you even witnessed their death with your own eyes while being unable to do something to save them, something like that is enough to scar or haunt a parent for the rest of their life due to their failure to save their child.
Immature TeenyWeeny seems like a lot of batman's rogue gallery, or maybe not those going insane but at least turning to crime because of tragedy and/or /loss/etc.
This makes The Joker Vs. Batman Dynamic even more interesting because instead of just Order Vs. Chaos and Bruce's "No Killing" Moral Code. Thomas kills every supervillain in Gotham except The Joker. Because he just can't put himself to kill his beloved Martha. It's an Unstoppable Force Vs. Immovable Object again but this time, It's Personal.
Thi Nguyen Batman's excuse is just bullshit in my opinion. He has no ties to the Joker. Thomas Wayne Batman can't kill Joker because that was his wife whom he built a life and created a child with. I can see that being hard on him.
Not an excuse to go that insane. Bruce didn't, Gordon didn't in the Killing Joke, if you don't have strengh of will or character, you snap, doesn't mean everybody does on such a bad day.
***** Then explain to me why Batman or Gordon didn't snap? Explain to me why my mom didn't snap when she was abused by my father? Explain to me why did I not snap seeing all of that and suffering cause I was too young to even help or understand? Things I regret to this day. I maybe coulda snapped as a kid and stabbed my father when he wasn't looking. Joker was touched by toxins, so it's a tad different. That doesn't mean he is right at all. Only weak minded or people who don't have strength of will people snap completely. People who give up and don't see anything better beyond the abyss they have fallen into. Sometimes they are strong enough to get out of that place but sometimes they are not. My mom had every "excuse" to snap, she had not a very bad day, she had a great deal of bad days. She did not, she grasped on what she could and pushed on for the best of everyone, me, my brother, herself, she never gave up hope. So did Batman, so did Gordon. Perhaps it's not sensible to compare the two but I don't care. My point stands, Batman's point stands. He debunked what Joker said in the movie itself.
Thomas Wayne Batman, Punisher Batman (the assistant of the batman who laughs in his early appearances), Redhood, and Punisher working together would clean out Gotham.
*SPOILERS FOR CONVERGENCE* Bruce met this Batman in Convergence, Thomas even said that if the Thomas from our Batman's universe he'd be proud. This happened in Convergence #2
This sort of show that a subtle mental illness or psychological issue that responds to trauma runs in the Wayne family. Bruce becomes batman when his parents die. Let's face it you have to be at least a little insane to do what batman does without any powers. In this alternative timeline (the timeline was changed, so it is not a different dimension) when bruce is killed, his mother becomes the joker and his father a drunkard batman.
anyone else bothered by martha just automatically going crazy? i just dont buy it. know she witnessed her son being shot but to go from despair to psycho in such a short amount of time is unbelievable.
In the comics, Bruce already met his alternative father who is Batman, but he still doesn't know his mom became the Joker. This will surely be the hardest punch he ever receives, and I really want to see his reaction.
Joshua Oh Either Thomas Wayne killed him during the Red Hood incident or things turned out better for him in this universe and he lived a happy life with his wife.
jokers killing joke origin was the same he went insane because everything bad happened to him on one day.....that and getting bleached white with green hair but ya know who wouldn't
Wow, very interesting to see the alternate side of what could've happened on that night, this film was pretty dark too, may have scared some underaged viewers to insanity and praised by critic's and adults for having some dark themes in a cartoon. Not always happy faces and colours now eh?
Animation was never just for kids. While cartoons are very popular among ages 1 to 14, that doesn't mean cartoons are only for kids. Obvious examples of cartoons that kids should never watch include things like Southpark and Family Guy, but there are also more serious animated shows and movies intended for adults, Flashpoint paradox being a case in point.
I understand that, I'm not indicating that this is only for kids, I was just saying that some kids may have watched it and been scared of there fucking ass from this sort of content is all.
Unfortunately you never see her in the movie. Though she appears in Batman's issue in the Flashpoint series. She kidnaps Harvey Dent's children then tricks James Gordon into shooting one of them. Afterwards, she slits his throat, killing him.
Almighty Doge Fuck, dude. That's messed up. Then again, the original Joker cut off his own face just to prove a point to Batman. Not only that, (and i'm not sure if this is canon or not) in a Batman Beyond flashback he kidnaps Robin, tortures him for info on Batman, and proceeds to jack him up on serums which made him into a "Joker Jr." At this point, i think i'm gonna go ahead and say the original is more fucked in the head. And that's putting it lightly.
Sanzel Clarke The Flashpoint comics are tragic as hell, man. Just reading Batman's point of view and some of the other stories will fuck your day up xD
Okay, that's a somewhat justifiable reason to go crazy. I wonder what would happen if Bruce ends up in this alternative timeline (or what) and meet both his parents. Maybe his mom would be so socked she would became mentally normal.
In the comic its based off of, when Martha finds out an alternate reality Bruce lives, she commits suicide after everything she has done do to her son's death, who was meant to live, caught up to her. So probably the same thing, causing even more mental scars for Bruce. Maybe best he didn't go that alternate future.
What a fresh take on batman. I like how this one doesnt put criminals in the same prison they already broke out of six hundred times and just ends the scumbags right then and there.
What's great about this is that in this universe batman STILL won't kill the joker because it's his wife. It's the same realtionship they have on the main universe.
No that's still NOT the "same relationship. Thomas Wayne and Martha Wayne are married so it makes sense why he wouldn't kill her for that. Bruce Wayne Batman doesn't know the Joker AT ALL nor does he care about him in the slightest, he just doesn't want to kill him because he doesn't want to kill ANYONE, only difference being that Joker keeps pushing him over the edge TO try to have Batman kill to prove the point that everyone can snap to chaos like him, including Batman. THAT'S the main MASSIVE difference between the two dynamics as it's NOT at all "tHe sAME rELaTiOnsHIP" AT ALL.
This goes to show that losing your parents is a terrible thing that will scar you for life, but losing your child is something that truly breaks your spirit and sanity beyond repair.
@YoungD3mon314 only a non parent would say that. 🙄
YoungD3mon314 You may be able to make a new kid, but they won't be the one you lost.
That’s true, losing your child is the most terrible thing in anybody’s life.
@YoungD3mon314 ,If Your parents Young like 35- They can,If They 40+ nope
@YoungD3mon314 ok so if your son gets shot in front of you he bled all over you and himself and cried in pain and asked you why did you not help me then he dies just like not in peace but in serious pain and suffering so I’m sure as a loving parent the most logical thing to do after you cleaned your self of all the blood and brain matter and now your son lays In a coffin 6feet on the ground when just 2 days ago he was sleeping next to you in bed I am sure that though all of that the 10 years you spent with your child will not continue the life you thought you should have with him is home gone in a instant the years you will never have with him ever I am sure the frist thing that hits your mind is don’t worry sweet heart we will make another one how twisted is that.
I seen a father in real life and his one year old son died but getting hit by a car and he was at the funnel and he said something that I’ll never forget he said as a father “ I should not be here at my sons funeral he should be at mine now take that with the added pain of getting shot and watching him die.
This is easily one of the darkest DC Animated Movies I've ever seen.
And that's why I love it so much!
And this Batman is probably the mosty dangerous superhero Ive ever seen. Seriously, this guy is a freaking demonic vigilante.
Arthaslepeureux ikr? I remember this one Batman comic. I forgot who was Batman in that, but he beat the crap out of criminals, and was batshit insane. But this guy probably takes the cake!
what movie is this
Kirithan
I just remember it had Flashpoint in the name. Flashpoint Paradox or Paradox Flashpoint, one of those.
Just think the original Joker in this universe is probably out there living a normal life with a wife and kid or something. Hopefully not living in Gotham though.
Actually He is dead in this universe, remember this batman kills, so when the Joker was made to pose as the Red Hood and ran into Batman where unlike when Bruce attempted to apprehend him leading to his unfortunate slip and fall into a vat of acid, Thomas simply riddled him with bullets end of story. Some more possibilities are ThomasBatman never running into the The Red Hood Gang at ace chemicals, the man who would be Joker never was pressganged into the Red Hood Gang and many more alternatives that step into the unknown.
Martin Sevcech I guess we'll never trully know.
I know what happened to him :3
He...
Became...
A...
Normal guy :3
Falcon Lover Wow. That might actually be true.
Martin Sevcech
But what if since Barry started a sort of time domino affect, that instead of the joker having to go to crime, he actually had a successful comedy career. That would actually be a nice thing to happen.
for anyone wondering why thomas wayne choose the bat costume, this might be the reasons:
1.he knows the batcave because the wayne manor comes with it
2. in the silver age (i think it is the silver age) he told bruce that he met martha for first time in a costume party, in which he dresses as a bat, which inspired bruce the idea for the costume.
3. he wears it as a way to confront his wife since it is the very thing he dressed as when they first met
Woah….genius! Not just an alternate, there’s deep lore to it!
Holy shoot that’s cool
The Martha trick won't work in this timeline.
Bruce...WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME?
But Bruce would.
"Bruce"
Thomas: WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME?!?
How bout Bruce and Thomas why did you say that name
immediately get's beaten to death and shot in the head.
"Wanna know how I got these scars?
I used to have a husband.He was handsome.One night,we're walking home in the dark.A mugger comes a long and kills my precious son.And Tom,well...He just goes out of his mind!
He beats the mugger to death with his bare hands,smiling as he does.I look down at the blood on my son's clothes and think of how he could have become a super-hero if he wanted...
Now,I see the funny side!
Now,I'm always smiling!"
The Joker from the comics doesn't have scars though
Hrittik Azad True
But to be honest i can't see the mom turning into the joker.
More like the Mr an Mrs Wayne teaming up together as batman and batwoman (and or catwoman.)
Hrittik Azad but martha wayne does have scars in the comics xD
Big Bad Biker Nerd Even then lol. I could see her as playing as either batwoman or a supporting character
But still she lost her mind she could've just made her owne scars with a knife
Kind of wanted to see what Martha Wayne looked like as The Joker.
They show it in the comics. There is a scene where they both stop fighting and pay their respects to Bruce in crime alley.
Rony Theronin she looks exactly like Heath ledger's joker.
ty
Auriansmule thats interesting
Hontoni Arigato yeah because there was no bruce wayne batman that scared the joker into falling over the chemical plant or thomas just killed him instead of scarng him accidentaly
This movie had. An apocalypse, mass genocide, children getting stabbed and shot, blood, mutilation and torture, a guy getting shot in the head, and people bitch that Man of Steel was dark?
The fan criticism for Man of Steel in general was lazy and one sided.
Almighty Doge
agree
Plus, Man of Steel came out in theaters, while this went straight to video. Those sorts of movies tend to feel like they have the justification to go more dark.
TheReccher All that stuff is supposed to show that this a nightmare reality, and dark and twisted version of the main DC universe. Man of Steel's DEFAULT state is dark and brooding.
TheReccher When they said dark, they meant the colour palette. All greys, no typical superman vibrancy.
"What happened to you Bruce? You were the James Bond of Super Heroes. What turned you into the Unabomber?" "Frank Miller, Barry...Frank Miller."
***** Shhh, we don't talk of THAT comic; The Dark Knight Returns was a one-off, NO SEQUELS....
Frank Millar, the man who saved Batman from permanent cancellation.
+Mr Mxyzptlk Yeah but then in the 90s frank kind of lost his mind, not going crazy but, any comic he wrote especially batman, wasn't very good or needs to be burned straight away.
+Evan Farley Everything he does is like a 14 year old kid going through his emo Nu-metal phase writing fanfiction. "Yeah Batman's killing people now because he's the best there is and Supermans a total queer and it's going to be metal as fuck! He's going to fight the Joker in the Tunnel of Love while Slipknot plays in the back ground!" I mean I liked Dark Knight Returns but it still had that feel to it.
theAngryscotman read all star Batman or go to back issues
Shame Martha Wayne didn't fully appear as the Joker in this movie.
yea that would've been funny to see
Agreed
Judging from what she did in the comics...It's probably the best give or take.
“All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day.” - The Joker
"Madness is like gravity......All you need is a little push"
@@indepth9930 the dark Knight by Christopher Nolan
“Despite all your sick, vicious little games. He’s as sane as he ever was. So maybe ordinary people don’t always crack. Maybe there isn’t a need to crawl under a rock with all the other slimy things when trouble hits… maybe it was just you all the time.” - The Batman
My favorite bit of this qoute is it's almost always taken ad Joker speaking the truth when the stories about how he's just spewing bs to make himself feel better
@@lock376 which is lost on pretty much everybody who loves the killing joke. I couldn’t tell you how many people I’ve talked to about it that think the Joker was right. Quite possibly the most misunderstood piece of media in human history.
Its a bit disappointing the movie never further explores Martha as Joker like in the comics as in one major plot in the comics was Thomas finding Martha and despite the issues, revealed they still loved each other and then ask her blessing to change the universe where they both die and Bruce live, which Martha agrees until she asks what happens to Bruce in the other universe and realizes what happens and is driven to suicide
sadly I think that they can't fit everything in one movie so they had to some cut corners
@@MattRogan28 really wish they made a movie about this batman.
@@tfwthelsdkicksin6083agreed
I'm interested to see Jeffrey Dean Morgan as The FlashPoint Thomas Wayne...
Or Lauren Cohan as the joker.
But yeah, seeing someone as brutal as the comedian in watchmen, I'd say he'd nail it as Thomas Wayne batman.
He'd bring his own bat.....
Howard Au Negan:Hi!Im Negan.
Maggie:I'm Martha.
Negan:huuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhh!!
Hopefully we will see it. BECAUSE THEY'RE MAKING A FREAKING MOVIE ABOUT FLASHPOINT IN THE DCEU! If it doesn't get cancelled.
Sooo, Bruce got killed, his father became Batman, that's fine, but his mother became the Joker o.O?
... that's messed up
I watched this movie, the main protagonist is The Flash right? Isn't the title.. Umm... Something Flash Point Paradox?
in the comics version of this, batman has killed almost all the supervillains in gotham but he just cant kill the joker or martha and its a slow decent into madness not like in the movie. its really intense and worth the read
ifIsaytestify Yeah, and its Thomas Wayne as Batman.
ifIsaytestify That's awesome, I need to read up on that
I wonder what happened to that actual Joker
To clear it up for all you DC fans who don't understand why the original Joker never made an appearance in this timeline, the answer is simple. Since Thomas Wayne became a violent, criminal-killing Batman in this universe, he never spared the lives of any law breakers. In all versions of Joker's origin story, it was during a crime under the identity of Red Hood. In this universe, Thomas Wayne probably killed him instead of causing him to be immersed in chemicals. Those that Joker was never created and the role was left open for Martha to fill.
Since Thomas Wayne didn't become Batman until AFTER Bruce was killed--the same night that Martha became The Joker--that makes no sense. SHE IS THE ORIGINAL JOKER. There was no hole to fill. Flash's ripple-effect on time made it so that whomever became the Joker in the Timeline(s) we are familiar with never became The Joker ... probably never even did crimes as The Red Hood.
Thomas became Batman on the same night The Joker came into existence ... the night Bruce died.
Ah! But you forget! In the Killing Joke version of Joker's, he WASN'T a criminal. He was swept up in ONE crime. So, you can't assume that was the case in his life. Besides, Professor Zoom said it only changed things only a tiny bit. So it likely didn't change the events leading up to that except for the likely possibility of Thomas killing him that night.
+Superdarkcloud666 That very-questionable "little bit" he spoke of actually caused HUGE change. Like a world-ending war between the Atlanteans & the Amazons, for instance. That "little bit" he spoke of was either sarcasm, GROSS underestimation, or outright stupidity.
This changed in HUGE, drastic, cataclysmic ways.
How could Thomas--as Batman--have killed the "original Joker" when he became Batman the night his wife became the Joker? There was no void for her to fill, as there was no Batman yet--until that night--who would have killed an "original Joker." She IS the "original Joker."
The ripple in time, for all we know, caused the death (maybe in a car accident) of the man who would go on to be the Joker we know years before Bruce's death.
+Priaperos he means the joker that we know, assuming that the events of the killing joke origin of the joker still takes place, there's every reason to believe this batman would shoot on sight at seeing the red hood. to him it would have been him just putting down another criminal scum, to us it's just one of many ripples further altering the time line. also, zoom mentions that the changes are small. they are themselves very subtle differences, but every action has a reaction and it's the repercussions of said actions that make things the way they are in this paradox
The Killing Joke is canon but Joker has no real canon origin. Even at the end of the killing joke he debunks his own backstory. Nobody knows where the Joker comes from, they don't know his name, and hopefully we never will as that is the charm of his character. So the Joker very well could have still appeared in this.
Martha Wayne as Joker is an idea you'd expect from the cocaine-fueled 1980s
+David Curry All it takes is one bad day.
Yalwin Khales Don't explain the joke, brother.
+Yalwin Khales That's all it took,just one...bad...day!
+LegendOfLegends19100 these references are making me all gidy
Cocaine is a helluva drug!!
That was Martha Wayne's bad day.
She watched her little boy get shot and die in agony on her arms while she couldnt do anything but watch...
Eric Gallegos Why's Martha laughing?
Paul Bauman She snapped, similarly to the Joker.
Becoming joker duh
Eric Hernandez you would too if you lost a son
1:19 All it takes is one bad day....
man the nostalgia you just gave me..
If you read "The Killing Joke", you'll see it actually it doesn't. Joker jumps into the chemicals trying to escape Batman. When he arises, he's all disfigured, thus becoming the Joker. Batman also explains how Gordon "is as sane as ever", thug again proving that it really doesn't take one bad day lol.
Thugastrike For what you say about "the killing joke" In the end of the comic though gordon "is as sane as ever" batman changed. He was also part of jokers plan to cause one bad day. Barbra was important to him as well. At the end of the comic when the joker tells a joke, both he and batman break out into hysterical laughter. This shows that the bad experience had affected him psychologically if only short term.
Thugastrike Much like the film, it is implied he lied about that. Never trust a joker back-story, he's always trying to trick someone
Mr. born in 1993, no Batman didn't change. At the start of the comic he was talking to the Joker about how it would come down to one of them killing the other. It was already foretold. The breaking out in hysterical laughter wasn't Batman going insane either.
And to Mr. Gavin, it doesn't matter if Joker's backstory wasn't 100% accurate. Without the disfigurement, he wouldn't be the Joker. The whole point that Joker was trying to make was that "all it takes is one bad day" is his excuse for his lunacy, when in fact it was not. Gordon not going insane, after what Joker did to him, is proof that it doesn't. Case closed.
So if Martha Wayne becomes the Joker... then does Martha Kent become Lex Luthor 😂 bald Martha XD
You are so stupid but in good way, I am still laughing
It wasn't really meant to be taken seriously :P lol
whaaaat?
That's not what happened it was Bruce's parents that were killed
Martha Kent become Lex Luthor!?
Not Cool.
looks like she had a bad day.
No duh
One Bad Day
No s*** her son died…😭
It's heartbreaking to see Martha's sanity is breaking so fast, unable to comprehend that her child is dead.
All it takes is just one bad day.
All it takes is a little push.
All that chit-chat's gonna getcha hurt.
You either die a hero
or live long enough to see yourself become a villian.
All it takes is being weak minded and not having strength of will or character, you mean. Batman debunked that belief of Joker in the movie himself, him and Gordon are the prime examples.
When did I talk about the batman of this universe in this comment? He's doing his best, at least he is trying, he didn't give up and snap completely. I was talking about the killing joke movie.
That's why I love the alternate universes of DC. Everyone could die, and everybody could kill, everybody is really "human", no one respects a moral code of no killing. And everyone suffers. That's realistic.
and the world actually dies... which really sucks...
Ivan Colonna The climax in Flashpoint Paradox is amazing, though. Right after Batman kills Zoom and the entire world explodes, The Flash is desperately trying to outrun the explosion to fix his mistake. Great movie moment.
yea alternate universes were wonder women kills kids u guys are fucking sick im done with this stupid movie
SDR3088 Its a movie, stupid. Thats the fucking sense of Flashpoint, a distopic world where the heroes of the current universe could so evil to fight endless wars, and kill everyone in the name of the cause. Maybe you should watch Peppa Pig, more suitable for minds like yours.
Ivan Colonna And our real world really will die too. Not soon, not even remotely soon, but it WILL die, along with everything else that’s ever had any meaning to us. That’s the ultimate reality, that everything will eventually die to time. Portraying any happy ending would simply be lying.
all it takes is one bad day ...
Big Bad Biker Nerd you got that right !
That laughter is going to haunt me
This scene is creepy and sad at the same time. I get goosebumps every time Martha starts laughing.
"you want to know how i got these scars?
-Martha Wayne
See Barry? This is what happens when you mess with time, you fuck shit up and you knew this would happen. You know that time travelling is never a good idea but you did it anyways :/ now we got New 52. I liked the story of the Flashpoint Paradox comic but what Barry did was really stupid.
he couldn't have known...
*****
he didn't watch the movie butterfly effect...
I doubt Barry knew any of this would of happened.
He's one of the Flashes, they all know the risk of time travelling.
I do kind of blame Barry for all of the most recent retcon. well, Barry and you know the writers of DC that decided to piss on all of our back issues... again.
They didn't handle Martha's transformation well at all.In the comics she spent days being depressed and Thomas was saying to her how much he had missed her smile.After Thomas Wayne tracked down and murdered Joe Chill with his bare hands,he returned to Wayne Manor to inform his wife but she had gone completely insane and scarred her face ever worse than the real Heath Ledger Joker.Her teeth were coming out from her cheeks!
again she went insane for no reason, what mother hasn't been depressed for days probably weeks after her child's died?
+LegendOfLegends19100 in what comic did you read that? i want to read about this alternate timeline
Aiden Phoenix In one of 2011's Flashpoint spin-offs.
Well losing your beloved kid isn't something easy to let go to make matters worse you even witnessed their death with your own eyes while being unable to do something to save them, something like that is enough to scar or haunt a parent for the rest of their life due to their failure to save their child.
@@piplup2009 her child died in front of her
0:16 Ooo Look just like Damian too
Like father like son LITERALLY
I kinda wanna see his joker-batman husband and wife thing. it's gonna be heart wrenching fun
So Thomas Wayne is like Harley Quinn...
SAM HAYES yeah
A-ok mr J
This is like the warhammer 40k of dc with all its grim darkness
Read the Batman: Knight of Vengeance mini-series.
I wish Thamos Wayne had his own tv series, I actually like this Batman more than the original Bruce Wayne Batman!
so what, Martha Wayne's psyche just snaps over Bruce's death and she becomes the joker??
exactly
+jo Ben She started to kill like crazy to make people feel what it means to lose someone you love.
Moe Dihani ah, I see now
People deal with trauma in different ways. A LOT of them in the DC Universe just go insane.
Immature TeenyWeeny seems like a lot of batman's rogue gallery, or maybe not those going insane but at least turning to crime because of tragedy and/or /loss/etc.
I need a 20 minutes and five episodes series of thomas wayne as batman
This makes The Joker Vs. Batman Dynamic even more interesting because instead of just Order Vs. Chaos and Bruce's "No Killing" Moral Code. Thomas kills every supervillain in Gotham except The Joker. Because he just can't put himself to kill his beloved Martha. It's an Unstoppable Force Vs. Immovable Object again but this time, It's Personal.
they need to make this into an actual movie would love to see martha as joker and thomas as batman ^^
They are making this into a movie. And I fear for it since the directors mentioned 'comedy'. Rip Flashpoint
@@TheSkyrimInquisitor nah this flashpoint will definitely come out after 2020
been 4 years
This is the only time I can understand Batman not wanting to kill the joker.
Batman said he does think about killing him a lot but just doesn't want to go to that level
Thi Nguyen Batman's excuse is just bullshit in my opinion. He has no ties to the Joker.
Thomas Wayne Batman can't kill Joker because that was his wife whom he built a life and created a child with. I can see that being hard on him.
+xKingx16 Batman doesn't kill joker because he made him. He feels responsible.
HOLY SHIT!!! Untrue, and The Killing Joke doesn't correspond with the current comcis.
Joker jumped in the chemicals,Batman didn't make him fall.
Other interpretations view it different I guess.
I think Martha was having a bad day there.
All it needs is just a little.... push muahaha !
Tell that to James Gordon.
"WHO (PUNCH) THE HELL (PUNCH) ARE YOU?! (PUNCH )"
If you'd stop kicking his ass he could probably tell you.
in a morbid intriege sort of way it's kinda disappointing there wasn't more martha wayne joker.
I want a movie based on this Batman universe. With Thomas Wayne as Batman and Martha as the Joker.
On the bright side, Thomas showed Joe Chill the same mercy he would’ve shown the Waynes.
I love the flashpoint Batman; I really think DC should make a series or a animated movie, because this awesome!
They should do it. Have Thomas Wayne as Batman against Martha Wayne as Joker. That would be insane.
Yea having that a tv series would be awesome but i has to be for teen or up with Thomas killing people and everything.
have you ever had a really bad day?
She watched her son get shot and die right in her arms while she couldnt do anything but watch...a really bad day.
Not an excuse to go that insane. Bruce didn't, Gordon didn't in the Killing Joke, if you don't have strengh of will or character, you snap, doesn't mean everybody does on such a bad day.
K0ragg and here's the inevitable "that's not an excuse" comment.
*****
Then explain to me why Batman or Gordon didn't snap? Explain to me why my mom didn't snap when she was abused by my father? Explain to me why did I not snap seeing all of that and suffering cause I was too young to even help or understand? Things I regret to this day. I maybe coulda snapped as a kid and stabbed my father when he wasn't looking.
Joker was touched by toxins, so it's a tad different. That doesn't mean he is right at all. Only weak minded or people who don't have strength of will people snap completely. People who give up and don't see anything better beyond the abyss they have fallen into. Sometimes they are strong enough to get out of that place but sometimes they are not.
My mom had every "excuse" to snap, she had not a very bad day, she had a great deal of bad days. She did not, she grasped on what she could and pushed on for the best of everyone, me, my brother, herself, she never gave up hope. So did Batman, so did Gordon. Perhaps it's not sensible to compare the two but I don't care. My point stands, Batman's point stands. He debunked what Joker said in the movie itself.
K0ragg jesus christ dude you need something else to do.
BRUCE.WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME?
*aim kryptonite bullet at superman*
superman : Save, Bruce....
batman : WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME??
Thomas why did you say that name
there is no greater pain then burying your own child
thomas is way scarier than bruce ever was
Bruce dies. The father becomes Batman and the mother Joker.
I'd love to see a story set in this universe that sees the two fight.
Wow. This is like The Killing Joke reimagined.
Alex Palmer it would be n awesome comic
Thomas Wayne Batman, Punisher Batman (the assistant of the batman who laughs in his early appearances), Redhood, and Punisher working together would clean out Gotham.
No matter what reality, Batman's life is always fucked.
Riley Tiegs sadly tru
It's all because of the parents' killer, Joe Chill.
So what happened to Alfred?
Got fired
***** You think Thomas lets criminals who are not his wife live long enough to commit further crimes?
+A guy who watches cartoons
That's some bullshit right there. Alfred is the best
Became MOTHER FUCKING ROBIN OF COURSE!
Where Nightwing,DeadHood, and Oracle?
Ya gotta be able to make yourself laugh, y'know.
Thomas Wayne is like Frank Castle 2.0
Bruce's mother becomes the Joker
but who became joker ?
That explains why the Joker is so obsessed with Batman! xD
:o SEX CHANGE!!!!
neko glasses oh just imagine that the joker is actually a woman ...
This is perhaps my most favorite version of Batman ever.
*SPOILERS FOR CONVERGENCE*
Bruce met this Batman in Convergence, Thomas even said that if the Thomas from our Batman's universe he'd be proud. This happened in Convergence #2
No. Is Earth 2 Thomas.
Edu iranzo Oops, sorry, my mistake
Are they all together?
Batman, Thomas Batman to Owlman?
"You see madness as you know is like gravity...All it takes is a little push!"
It would be intrusting to see a thomas wayne batman series and martha Wayne's as the Joker and Harley Quinn as yoyo.
When you cry so hard it crosses into laughter.
This sort of show that a subtle mental illness or psychological issue that responds to trauma runs in the Wayne family. Bruce becomes batman when his parents die. Let's face it you have to be at least a little insane to do what batman does without any powers. In this alternative timeline (the timeline was changed, so it is not a different dimension) when bruce is killed, his mother becomes the joker and his father a drunkard batman.
I can see this Thomas Wayne in the recent Joker film. Perfectly captured.
Possibly one of the most unsettling scenes in dc animated films
The joker thinks breaking batman would be a funny thing till he turns in to Thomas Wayne and kills him
Thank God that Bruce Wayne survived the shooting in the alley, but either way their stories begin in tragedy.
Tom looks super scary as batman. That's his intention though is to show fear with the red eyes and all.
alternate timelines are insane
No matter the timeline, all it takes is one bad day.
So Martha Wanye become Heath Ledgers Joker, lol okay.
anyone else bothered by martha just automatically going crazy? i just dont buy it. know she witnessed her son being shot but to go from despair to psycho in such a short amount of time is unbelievable.
That's so messed up yet epic. That was a great way to change the batman story.
In the comics, Bruce already met his alternative father who is Batman, but he still doesn't know his mom became the Joker. This will surely be the hardest punch he ever receives, and I really want to see his reaction.
I wonder what became of the Joker's human self in this world?
probably became a local comedian
I know it's late but in this universe joker=Bruce mother
tyler graham Yeah I know. I can tell by her new evil smile.
Joshua Oh
Either Thomas Wayne killed him during the Red Hood incident or things turned out better for him in this universe and he lived a happy life with his wife.
Or the mobs killed him in that incident, or before the incident even happened, or he died with his wife in that accident, many posibilities....
This is what makes me enjoy cartoons again
so Martha Wayne became the Joker ? dafuq ?
The Heath Ledger Joker.LOL!
+Cường Anh Hoàng Yeah
jokers killing joke origin was the same he went insane because everything bad happened to him on one day.....that and getting bleached white with green hair but ya know who wouldn't
What happens to the real joker then, is he just a normal person?
Optik Muestic Either that or he didn't exist at all in that universe.
I allways wanted to see what would happen if Bruce Wayne was murdered instead of his parents.
Wow, very interesting to see the alternate side of what could've happened on that night, this film was pretty dark too, may have scared some underaged viewers to insanity and praised by critic's and adults for having some dark themes in a cartoon. Not always happy faces and colours now eh?
whoever said this was a kids movie?
Well, MOST Children like cartoons so it's pretty much BASED For kids but adults do watch and like it (Kind of like brony's but in a different way.
Animation was never just for kids. While cartoons are very popular among ages 1 to 14, that doesn't mean cartoons are only for kids. Obvious examples of cartoons that kids should never watch include things like Southpark and Family Guy, but there are also more serious animated shows and movies intended for adults, Flashpoint paradox being a case in point.
I understand that, I'm not indicating that this is only for kids, I was just saying that some kids may have watched it and been scared of there fucking ass from this sort of content is all.
Censorship is not allowing everyone in the restaurant to eat the steak because one person is a vegetarian.
I wish Hollywood had the balls to make a movie about this Batman considering how violent he is i doubt they would
So is true all it takes is just one bad day
Watching this again made me cry a little.
So bruce's mom becomes...the joker in this universe? fascinating
Unfortunately you never see her in the movie. Though she appears in Batman's issue in the Flashpoint series. She kidnaps Harvey Dent's children then tricks James Gordon into shooting one of them. Afterwards, she slits his throat, killing him.
Almighty Doge Fuck, dude. That's messed up. Then again, the original Joker cut off his own face just to prove a point to Batman. Not only that, (and i'm not sure if this is canon or not) in a Batman Beyond flashback he kidnaps Robin, tortures him for info on Batman, and proceeds to jack him up on serums which made him into a "Joker Jr." At this point, i think i'm gonna go ahead and say the original is more fucked in the head. And that's putting it lightly.
Sanzel Clarke The Flashpoint comics are tragic as hell, man. Just reading Batman's point of view and some of the other stories will fuck your day up xD
Classic Batz would have the WORST case of diarrhea ever recorded if he found this out.
Finally got around to ordering all the Flashpoint trades the other day (including "Road to Flashpoint"), so can't wait for them to arrive. :)
Okay, that's a somewhat justifiable reason to go crazy.
I wonder what would happen if Bruce ends up in this alternative timeline (or what) and meet both his parents. Maybe his mom would be so socked she would became mentally normal.
Or it could do the opposite and she becomes Super-Joker!
+00Grunk lmfao
In the comic its based off of, when Martha finds out an alternate reality Bruce lives, she commits suicide after everything she has done do to her son's death, who was meant to live, caught up to her. So probably the same thing, causing even more mental scars for Bruce. Maybe best he didn't go that alternate future.
Oh, so that's what happened in the comics. Yeah, in that case it's best if Bruce doesn't go there.
No matter what timeline it is there will always be a good psycho laugh
Who is here after joker movie?
Losing a child is a pain that no parents should ever feel
guess she was having a bad day...
It wasn't just Bruce that died that night.
What a fresh take on batman. I like how this one doesnt put criminals in the same prison they already broke out of six hundred times and just ends the scumbags right then and there.
UGH! That laugh gives me goosebumps every time!!!
This is really fucked up.
The moment chill gets murdered by thomas
No matter who died in that alley that night, it’s heartbreaking. 😭
Doesn't matter who dies both parents
Or just Bruce
SOMEONE is going to be the Goddamn Batman!!!
Seriously... Martha needs to just chill, amirite? You guys better get the pun
what pun
Middle Class Asian Boy the pun was that the dude who shot them in the alley was named Joe Chill. Get it? She needs to chill? Plz laff
Idris Abdullah In his defense, I didn't get it either.
I'm picking up what you putting down
Idris Abdullah In this universe Martha became a Joker counterpart
Joker always said one bad day can turn a person insane...
I feel like this would be an amazing arkham game. Also am i the only one who wants the full scene like a regular wayne shooting video.
What's great about this is that in this universe batman STILL won't kill the joker because it's his wife. It's the same realtionship they have on the main universe.
No that's still NOT the "same relationship. Thomas Wayne and Martha Wayne are married so it makes sense why he wouldn't kill her for that. Bruce Wayne Batman doesn't know the Joker AT ALL nor does he care about him in the slightest, he just doesn't want to kill him because he doesn't want to kill ANYONE, only difference being that Joker keeps pushing him over the edge TO try to have Batman kill to prove the point that everyone can snap to chaos like him, including Batman. THAT'S the main MASSIVE difference between the two dynamics as it's NOT at all "tHe sAME rELaTiOnsHIP" AT ALL.
my god that bloodly smile, did martha became the joker.
yes
This is the coolest joker concept I ever seen