Thanks for Watching and Don't Forget to SUBSCRIBE!! There's limited availability of footage for some of the handheld games, and I have no way of capturing 3DS footage myself, so sorry for some of the lower quality visual parts
Also Sylvain and Felix like "in their later years, they became so close that they passed away on the same day, as if conceding that one could not live without the other
Yeah, that is kind of sus, that they were buried together, but not with their wives. We also know that Dimitri would marry somebody if he get the ending with person he does not involved romantically, for example Felix
Because in FE games, friendship is portrayed in a fairly intimate way. If Dimitri was gay, there would definitely be a chance that M!Byleth would marry him. But it's not like that. Rather, this ending demonstrates the opposite, such an intimate friendship does not necessarily end in a romantic interest.
Maybe my favorite argument for Ike’s endings being romantic is that, if they were with a woman, there would be no discussion. If you take Ike and Soren’s ending and replace Soren’s name with any female, it would be unanimously accepted that those two are a romantic pair; but because they’re both men it has to be platonic somehow.
@@CaptainAstronaut It's been said that the reason Shouzou Kaga left Intelligent Systems is because he hates the idea of FireEmblem being in 3d. When I saw the Graphics of Three Houses and the Art style of Engaged I have to say, (He was RIGHT). The good news is that there are other Strategy games to chose from thanks to third parties. Valkyria Chronicles 4, Triangle Strategy, Wargroove, Live a live, Tactics Ogre Reborn, and Front Mission.
That's a very dumb line...Priam was never that at all. He was just dumb fanservice done poorly like everything else in Awakening. Honestly, I treat it like Ike's romance was never fleshed out ever besides the supports in FE9...FE10 they hugged. Meanwhile Sauske and Naruto kiss and Naruto goes to almost gay level of extremes to get him back in the end of that show...ended up with Hinata or we going to talk about how that's gay washing. I think anime has always been pretty gay in that regard with homie casts. I wouldn't even care if people ship Ike and Soren, but it does come down to that argument of "canon" imo there is no canonical end besides him leaving on a journey. Honestly, shipping can be harmless until it gets too toxic which IkeXanything general can get out of hand more often. We all like Ike boys and girls, we all like Ike and he likes us all. I don't care if you ship them imo the evidence has never been strong to prove any point and all of it has had double vague meanings not just one to people who look at it. Can anyone also tell me about Edward and who he romances in FE10? Imo FE10 has such a gutted support system that it feels story first and answer built up questions which was the whole point of FE10 to begin with, to finish was FE9 put up without going into detail. Or are we going to talk about how Top tier ElinciaXGeoffrey is because imo that shit is underwhelming. Also technically if we're contradicting IkeXElincia on the whole she can't abdicate or anything, I could challenge IkexRanulf because I hardly doubt Ranulf was supposed to be the top advisor for Skrimir...or would you think him dancing around with Ike in some random location as not an issue for Gallia then with that logic? I don't really like how FE10 leaves Ike just leaving or abandoning Tellius almost...he just disappears even though it contradicts the whole arc from Fe9.
@@iguy6571 Yes, I do aplogogize for the word bomb but I am passionate about FE and Ike's games. Although, to sum end of the day moderate and don't go to the extreme and ship what you want, just don't get toxic into fights because it is inconclusive...with *theories* and improve Radiant Dawn in a defivinitive edition.
There was an exhibit it Germany about LGBT history in gaming & they actually had a card specifically about Ike and Soren’s relationship & Ike’s sexuality in general. Regardless of if his being gay is “canon,” it’s really cool how so many of us read him that way anyways, even across languages.
That shit proves it might have been deep, but not gay. What? You gonna give your best friend a hug and say it was gay? During an emotional moment? You sound braindead
Ike definitely has that classical hero feeling of "killing dudes all day but at night I just want to cuddle with my boy(s)". I actually love this as an idea because like you said he's so different from the usual gay male characters. Subtle gay/bi inclusion is actually my favourite because something about not making a big deal out of it makes it feel more validated? Another great video Mr Spaceman, and as we say in the UK, aubergine.
I always figured he was some form of asexual like he cares for anyone he considers his friend but never actually thinks about romance. Just protecting the those close to him and constantly bettering himself. A dude mostly focused on doing what’s right. Though I forgot ALOT about who he has ending with as well. So...yeah I also felt that he was uncomfortable with women flirting with him was HOW they did it, Soren and ranulf, he's known them for YEARS...most of his life. So he's comfortable going back and forth with him. Most of the women, especially the shopkeep, did it when they FIRST meet him. If they developed an actual relationship with him, before the heavy flirting happened I think we would have a less bias answer. Then again as you said and as I agree he's focused more on the job than the eggplant. As anyone should be lol, cause honestly... I ALWAYS hated the gay sterotype...I honestly depised it even before I came out, not because a dislike towards gays...but it screamed forced inclusion.
@@SuperGamefreak18 I also headcanon him as asexual, he never looks interested in flirting and always felt attracted to people for their good hearts and abilities in combat; the relationship of him with Soren is so sweet to me because the tactician only want to be with him and makes him happy to the point of even his emblem form in Engage wants to learn a meat recipe to make to Ike (even though emblems are unable to eat, so that's still a natural reaction from the original Soren).
@@astrolatte_ the only thing that stops me from headcannoning him as ace is the fact that he doesn't have a paired ending with a woman. If his endings were truly platonical, what's stoping him from having one with Titania or Mist?
@@nacoto180 Who said his endings were platonic? Ace people can date y'know. Personally I see Ike as asexual homoromantic since he's pretty gay, but in the ace way.
I read a comment that I like that went like: "IkexSoren ship is like your reverse fanship, because instead of people making vague arguments to defend it, it's the haters that make tinfoil theories to prove that Ike has to be heterosexual" Also, I'm always happy to see that the Makalov slander it's still strong even nowadays; Astrid, dear, blink if you need help.
Since I was a kid playing Brawl, Ike has given me bigg eggplant vibes, and it's pretty fucking dope that aside from being a badass he's actually a well if not decently written gay bro instead of the usual flamboyant dudes used in most media
@@twilimess honestly, niles x M!corrin wasn’t a well written LGBT pairing as it was. missed opportunity to make M!Robin x Chrom canon, but it’s nice to see that it’s been heavily implied even through warriors
I see it more so as on rushed development on FE10. Why Ranulf and Ike are focused on is because they wanted to get Ike back into the conflict and even then he started with Leanne which honestly kind of neat since he rescued her back in FE9, and get him to help his war homie, Soren was a case of they wanted to fully flesh out Soren's true origins and backstory and how he was tied to Ike's past which is why those two have those flags in FE10, every other canonical relationship from this logic MicaiahxSothe, ElinciaXGeoffrey (Cringe this is like brother and sister bonds, not by blood but imo kind of creepy) as rushed things that weren't well told. They wanted MORE of a robust support than any FE game but they couldn't get enough time to flesh it out so it got ditched for the end result. I think a lot of the FE9 supports are awesome but I wouldn't say there is a canon one.
I think the funny thing about Priam is that even people who don't involve themselves with the gay Ike debate hate him bc of how badly he fucked up the timeline if we take him literally. He feels like such a lame character who rly shouldn't be taken as telling the truth, to an extent where it borders on feeling like part of the joke. Also, shoutouts to how Ike and Soren got alternate costumes around Valentine's Day in FEH, as well. Totally a bro thing 🍆
@@jeddgangman4502 Forgot to respond but you're right actually, I went and rechecked the dialogue in Priam's paralogue and Chrom does state Ike was a hero from another world
I like the idea that Priam just kinda....found (stole?) Ragnell and just claimed to be descended from the radiant hero. I like also like the idea of him being Mist's decedent, but him being a lying eggplant is more interesting.
The Rumor Come Out: Does Ike is Gay? Ike is gay is the most discussed in the media in the few years ago. Even it has happened in 2005, but some of the public still curious about what is exactly happening and to be the reason there is a rumor comes out about his gay. At that time he became the massive video gaming rumor. The public, especially his fellow mercenaries are shocked. He just came out with his bad rumor which is spread massively. This time is not about his sword fighting career, but his bad rumor. The rumor is out of standardize of hoax, according the last reported this mercenary revealed himself as homosexual. Do you still believe or not, this rumor is really much talked by people even in a person of his mercenaries.
You know what makes it worse with the same-sex options in Fates? So we all know that Revelation is the canon route of Fates by this point. There’s no point in debating it. But when it comes to the association of Birthright, Conquest, and Revelation with individuals, on one of the most common official arts I’ve seen (the one with the Nohrian and Hoshidan siblings + both Corrins and Azura), male Corrin is associated with the Hoshidan route Birthright because they’re standing alongside the Hoshidan siblings, female Corrin is associated with the Nohrian route Conquest because they’re standing with the Nohrian siblings, and Azura is associated with Revelation because she’s standing at the center and she is the one that reveals the secret that kickstarts Revelation (she’s also a recruitable unit on all three routes, though I’m pretty sure the only route she survives is Revelation). The two same-sex options in Fates are Rhajat and Niles. However, Rhajat can only be recruited in Revelation and Birthright, while Niles can only be recruited in Revelation and Conquest. Due to the previous association of male Corrin with Birthright and female Corrin with Conquest, this means that male Corrin players on Birthright and female Corrin players on Conquest don’t have a same-sex option.
I disagree. Conquest is every bit as likely to be Canon Warriors and Engage both doubled down on something: Female Corrin is canon. This confirms that birthright isn't, but not much else. (Oh, except that Scarlet is thus canonically dead) Revelations could easily be played off as a "what if" scenario with a shaky foundation In the game literally called "If". From a writing standpoint, Corrin making the decision to go down Conquest is frankly the only sane decision available. Revelations may be the "complete picture" but whether or not that picture is actually true is pretty dubious to me.
@@cheesecheese6459 I literally said it was dubious. I still hold that for a variety of reasons we can strike out Birthright And if you've seen the datamine, you'd know that they're going to continue to be fine with "Not Birthright"
@@1stCallipostle what I dont get is the completely ruling out birthright like it's no more canon than conquest and I'd argue revelations has the best chance of being canon plus the cover is just marketing you can choose either gender in all routes
@@cheesecheese6459 Once again I bring up Warriors very clearly stating that it was Male Corrin who chose Birthright Byleth's canon is more questionable because warriors and Engage have disagreements there But for Corrin it's pretty damn clear when they choose the same one both times and have one of those appearances have a choice that was already associated with that version in marketing Also, as I implied, spoilers below Do you really think they'd pick Emblem Camilla to make if they weren't okay with throwing BR out the window
In regards to Priam being Ike's descendant, I've always agreed that Priam is likely the descendant of Mist, not Ike. Just like how Marth is said to be the descendant of Anri the great, and Marth even looks identical to Anri. But Anri actually never had children and Marth is really the descendant of Anri's younger brother, Marcelus.
For all we know, he could just be neither and flat out bullshit lol. I don't think it's strong evidence for anything besides fanservice unless IS somehow connects it which a lot of people won't like. I think Ike sexuality is still a point of debate and the theories have plenty of strengths and weaknesses to them that it's still up to debate and not a fact or canon.
When it comes to Priam, I don't think he's as lore-breaking as it might appear. I think it might be intentional that he doesn't bring up being Ike's descendent in FEH, for the same reason he only off-handedly mentions it once in Awakening (and only because Chrom assumed that's who he was) - he's not. In FEH, Priam says that Ragnell has "chosen so many prominent heroes over the years", not that the sword was inherited down a bloodline. In this case, Priam is a 'descendent' of the concept of the Radiant Hero, in the same way as whoever were the numerous heroes that Ragnell chose in between him and Ike. Ike even calls Priam a "fellow Ragnell enthusiast" by the end of their conversations. That being said, I don't have a horse in this race. I do believe that Ike is gay or bi, but it's not a position I feel strongly enough about to argue it. Priam has come up among my friends a few times in the past and I decided to read into it at the time. This is off-topic, but did you know that in Fate/Grand Order, 'Eggplant' is a bit of a meme nickname for Mash Kyrielight?
tbf that also has to do by belief as they aren't trying to whole DIVINE destiny thing which Ike was not. He was a simple force that was lending a helping hand and the same goes to Priam anyway. But Outrealm literally makes the most bizarre twists and spins that literally multiverse Ike can be anything and that slapping canon is kind of pointless...
First off, I want to say that your last point about Priam being an easter egg and nothing more, is almost certainly 100% correct. He just *feels* like a character who didn't have a lot of thought put into him. Secondly, you covered the option of surrogates through magical or time traveling means, but there is also the magical world of... actual surrogate mothers. Gay and lesbian couples have children all the time through whatever means works for them. I myself raise a daughter with another woman. When two people love each other and want to build a family together, they will make it work. I played Path of Radiance way back when it came out and even back then, I had a feeling that Ike was bisexual. I thought it was strange that Ike didn't have a "marriage" ending like you had talked about with the other games, and based on the intimacy of some of the supports, I thought the writers were setting up Ike to have a choice of four characters in a sequel; Soren, Ranulf, Elincia, or Lethe. That's two men, two women, two beorc, and two laguz to choose from. That said, I think Ike is definitely written as gay in Radiant Dawn, so maybe that's what was intended for him all along or it was another direction that the writers wanted to take his character, or maybe he just spent the time between games figuring himself out. This is kind of a minor point but I almost think that the absolutely ridiculous amount of things you have to do just right to see that tender moment between Ike and Soren on the final chapter is another point in favor of Ike being gay. If Ike were in a hetero relationship I imagine the moment he embraces his partner just before the big battle would be an important and hard-to-miss moment for players. But since it's a gay pairing, it gets locked behind gameplay and support mechanics that span two titles. It's one of Ike's best character moments and the vast majority of players will never see it. Excellent video that was both funny and interesting, I give it five out of five eggplants.
@@lilben4184 Bait or not, it legitimately sucks that demons like yourself will, completely without reasonable justification, simply label anyone who happens to be LGBT as groomers. An accusation without merit is one thing, but it also demonstrates a clear disregard for real victims, seeing them not as wronged people, but instead as a valuable tool of defense on which to stake your hatred for a group you don't like. It's utterly shameful, to say the absolute least.
@@megamillion5852 🤨🤔 Now that's interesting. Why would you take offense to being called a groomer? Are you suggesting that there's something wrong with appreciating the company of children and being appreciated back? #LoveIsLove #LoveWins
Me reading Ike's and Soren's dialogue while playing the game for the first time: FELLAS?!? ❤️ Thanks for the video, your knowledge on fire emblem lore is very eggplant.
Ike x Ranulf will always be one of my favorite endings. Ike's only goal is to be a mercenary and chill with his bros, he also likes laguz, his 2 endings are male (part) laguz who like the mercenary life... it reads as queercoded to me
I view Priam existence as I see Gangrel, Emmeryn, Aversa, Yen'fay and Walhart allying with us in the paralogues: extra content easter egg, to not take serious.
Well, you've convinced me Mr Astronaut. 🍆 I've only played Shadow Dragon & everything since Awakening, but "he can only be paired off with one of two guys" is a pretty open and shut case imo.
@@YuuyaKZMI We don't care if you are tired, we keep pointing out to you that you are wrong. This is how a public comment area works. I noticed how adamant you were on Ike not being gay despite this being a fictional character in a video game, the audacity...
I agree that Priam is at best canonically dubious. But if we really need to treat him as canon and not a LARPer, then I think the Mist x Boyd lineage works a lot better than people give it credit. I know not a lot of people have played Marth's games, and even for those who have, the lore is obscure at best, but one of the most important aspects of Marth's place in the world and his importance to the story is that he's "Anri's descendant." EXCEPT! Anri died alone and childless. He had a romantic interest in the ancient war named Artemis, but she chose to marry a different guy who went on to rule Archanea (country, not continent), with Anri sticking to his small country of Altea, where Marth is from. Anri's royal lineage was continued indirectly via his brother, and it was this matter of disputed succession which actually split the neighbouring country of Gra away from historic Altea's borders (Gra became ruled by the stuck up nobles who didn't accept Anri's brother as king). POINT BEING: the genesis of this series literally involves its most iconic character (Marth) claiming descent from a mythic-historical figure through an indirect lineage continued by that figure's sibling. I think whether the Awakening writers were aware of this or not (probably not; I agree that they didn't put any thought into Priam, period), it very clearly establishes the precendent that Priam can be descended from Mist while still being considered and referred to as Ike's descendant. Also, while I didn't care much one way or another in this debate about Ike's sexuality, though probably leaning toward gay if anything, I think you pushed me over the edge. Your schpiel about how heterosexual relationships never need to openly state that they're romantic, yet because of our biases toward normativity we unreasonably expect hard confirmation before acknowledging any homosexual fictional relationships, really sold me on the idea of Ike being gay. Especially when I consider if Ranulf, and especially Soren, were simply genderswapped but otherwise remained the exact same, I think their romantic chemistry and paired endings with Ike would never be called into question like they have been.
Artemis also died in childbirth and to me it implies a further tragedy to "the curse" TM that most similar stories (and/or those reading them) about marrying for duty ignore cause of similar social biases. She didn't even have the chance to abandon Archanea (again country, not continent) to be with Arni after continuing the line or whatever else because she died. Apologies for drawing even further into Archanea (continent, not country) lore, but I've gained a new appreciation for it from searching up the games cause of media like this video.
@@thesilkenmanster8208 See my second paragraph, there is literally a precedent for this usage within the Fire Emblem series itself. Claiming descent from someone has always been a political statement more than a genetic one, especially for most of human history which lacked methods for testing genetics. The implication is genetic of course, but the important part is "I'm related to this prior important person, so now I am important." In Marth's case it was to validate his claim over the Falchion, Fire Emblem, and Archanaea. In Priam's case it's to validate his fanboyism and how he roleplays as Ike. Whether or not they actually come from a strict line of genetic descent doesn't really matter, and for at least one of these cases they objectively don't.
@@LoudWaffle Yes, I’m well aware of the whole Marth and Anri precedent. But in Priam’s case, there is no political advantage to be gained. His men follow him because he is strong, charismatic, and able to tie together a band of different races and people, much like his ancestor did. There is no need to validate his fanboyism as he is genuinely powerful and worthy of respect outside of his descent. There is no need to roleplay as Ike because it is in his character and blood to be quite like him. And of course the most important thing to consider when using any word - authorial intent. Marth and Anri had story basis for the way they use descendant. Chrom and every other descendant character are understood to be descendants in the more traditional sense, and it is wrong to assume that they went with the exception in Priam’s case. Why is it wrong to assume? Authorial intent. There is absolutely no reason, from Intelligent Systems’ perspective, to create a character meant to invoke Ike’s popularity (even giving him a remix of Ike’s Resolution) via making him his descendant, only for him to secretly or subtlety be Mist’s descendant. This is where Occam’s Razor comes in because the people who want Priam to descend from Mist forget that Ike x Soren shippers are not in fact at the forefront of the developers’ minds. And don’t even get me started on the fact that Ike is the one who actually left Tellius
@@thesilkenmanster8208 If you want to focus on authorial intent then the simple and most obvious answer voids all discussion on the topic: there was no intent. Priam like most other details in Awakening tied to previous games is purely for the same of fanservice. Hell, even many details exclusive to Awakening itself were done for fanservice, not any sense or deeper meaning, like Emmeryn, Gangrel, and Aversa surviving and joining you. The authorial intent had nothing to do with Ike's bloodline, they just wanted to reference a popular character; any attention given to him beyond that is moot.
Another point towards Ike's sexuality is his Radiant Dawn design. Instead of being pretty bishounen like Marth or even a pretty man like Chrom, he's well built and masculine, to the point where some characters bring up comparisons between him and the laguz, something almost unheard of for JRPG protags. In Japan, hyper-masculinity is the gay stereotype, hence the Bara genre. And the design was definitely intentional, because the Japanese audience voiced backlash towards his Radiant Dawn design for looking like, and I quote, "a gorilla", something the devs would've known would be the case.
He's already unconventional lol...he's a Merc what is he supposed to have a fancy hat? I've seen plenty of guys do shit like that who aren't gay lol. So is Guts from Berserk gay then? Tbh I don't mind multiple pairings and I'd like to see a better support system because FE10's is fucked. Hell best actual support dialogue that's unique with Ike is with Mist on actual lines he says in combat. But it's like SylvainXMarianne, it didn't happen even though they were opposite sex people. Idm pairing but we don't need OMG HE'S GAY CANON YOUR TOXIC for DIFFERENT PAIRING...like you want Ike and Soren being gay, idc I've seen Ike and Marth being gay lol...but don't go after people who also do Ike pairing with Elincia, Lethe, Ranulf, whatever. I'd like to see a better support system and fully fleshes out all the stuff from FE9 more because it was heavily scrapped
Additionally, people here when first seeing Marth and Roy already thought they were GAY af lol. Makes sense, Marth is gay such a rebel for no pants, a shame he had an arrange marriage with Ceada. See how I can twist any perception of a design to do so? So Ike could be seen as that or he could just be masculine because he's trying to fill his father's shoes and show progression of that through the story...I'm just saying, people can come to many different perspectives that should be taken to account
@@nah4467 no pants is him being based on the mediterrenean peeps during the ancient times, like the Romans and Greeks, the fact his name was originally Mars Roman God of War, while his descendant Lucina is named after Lucina Roman Goddess of Childbirth.
@@nah4467 Let's never speak about Fates LORE. The game part and most characters are great. It's just the unnamed continent and questionable writing in the way
The most cursed thing in any Fire Emblem game is definitely pairing Azura with Silas, then marrying mCorrin to Sophie, and then S-supporting the resulting fKana with Shigure. I should reiterate for clarity that Corrin and Azura's mothers are sisters, for those unaware. Th-thanks, Fates...
Growing up I was quite happy that Fire Emblem would have any LGBTQ+ representation at all....but then I realized that almost every gay or bisexual character is of the thief or rogue class? Like, what is THAT about? Legault, Heather, Niles...Fire Emblem Three Houses was the first to really break this sequence, I think....but then the male romance options are so limited...
not to mention other LGBT (mostly gay) characters are also more of a harmful stereotype than properly written characters....which is kinda distasteful to say the least lol
@@ohandthefracking The sterotypical options wouldn’t be so bad if they had a few more characters. Some gay people are “feminine.” Meanwhile some don’t present that way. They need to account for multiple ways of representation. I’m honestly more upset that females got a lord and bunch of great girls, while men got two old guys and lindehart 😂
Don’t forget everyone’s least favorite thot rhajat and the 2 twitter equivalents of hitler, edelgard/rhea (depending on who u ask, diff people hate them and love them)
My theory is that ragnell exists in the shadow dragon/valentia/awakening timeline kinda how the fire emblem appears throughout several games in different lands. The radiant hero in the Archanea timeline might just be a different character who isnt Ike. Any semblance of him was just a callback to Ike from the writers.
It could be for various reasons either way an Ike did pass through everywhere because Awakening left a hole in that logic a bit. For all we know could be multi-versus where Ike is straight and another where he's flamboyant af lol. Honestly people just need to relax on "THIS IS CANON" in general imo lol. Shipping and having them with said things is fun or sometimes hot but I don't want it to get toxic extremes imo
@@gamechanger8908 That is a possibility. there are plenty of things Awakening has broken because of outrealms and time travel for the sake of fanservice sadly. People just don't specific types of fanservice. Priam isn't a strong point to prove he's not gay anyway but just an endless supply of possible reasoning because they pulled the fanservice card. He could be Ike's son and he got married to a lady, gay, descendent, or he's just a flat out liar and just has Ragnell and wanted to have a cool title and idolized him. Not like we haven't seen impersonators or liars in FE ever. Biggest problem with the whole thing that makes this all up to debate and open ended as just theories is just how contradicting some endings are and how it really doesn't work.
You know it's also funny because somebody made a crazy theory that got well liked that Ike got with Genny because of very interesting circumstances because Genny in the end ends up with a mysterious man. I'm just saying that exists not that it is for a fact though.
Gonna be honest, I'm a Ike stan I love this man for his morals and values. He reminds me alot of robin hoods story doing the right thing for the right reason I honestly couldn't care less who he ends up with
OK so I need to point out that was NOT the Soliel support in Japan. She was shy around girls so Corrin used a potion to look like a girl for her to practice on. It's weird but it wasn't sexual nor conversion at all.
The investigation we’ve all been waiting for. Either way, we like Ike. Also, I’m pretty sure Awakening has 2 Black characters (Basilio & Flavia). But I guess you meant Robin specifically. Regardless, Ike is at least homoromantic & worthy of an eggplant.
Hell yeah we like Ike. Idk on homo but let's be real Ike can be asexual, gay, straight or bisexual for all we know because it's all theories in the end and open to interpretation. Even regardless it's not going to stop people from him exploring different types of ships because he is a fictional character in the end.
Priam could be related through adoption. Ike, Soren and ranulf find sime kids adopt them time passes and waoh one of their decendants has a penchant for (off color) blue hair and fighting and he is related because adoption is family binding and all that Also explains why he doesnt have aether but learned luna and sol to be like his ancestor
Possible but I really do think it's just bad and horrible FE10's story (in some areas) and support was that it needed refining to begin with...and we got that issue of Awakening breaking a lot of shit in FE history with Outrealms and time travel which is why it's not that great in retrospect. It's open ended and shouldn't be pushed on as canon whether he's canonical gay or not...you can make him gay and whatever, people can make him romance Elincia...is that really a crime, especially on the internet? I think delving in canon is hard because it was story first and foremost. This game has a lot of jank from FE2 and Ike from FE9 feels like what the supports should've been and even further developed but they scrapped it, Ike's support were all supposed to transfer over and if you look at all the supports, sometimes you even see coding errors where 2 of the same letter are apparent, text issue on skills were more abundant, and Blood pact...the game was definitely rushed and had the development time equivalent to a GBA game maybe another year more which is bad for how big it was.
adoption is a super weak possibility as a ton of evidence outweighs it, most notably that it's very unlikely the writers intended adoption and there's no hints whatsoever at that idea
@@YuuyaKZMI Honestly, the whole argument for him being straight or gay is very weak...OH MAN THEY HUGGED! In Naruto Sauske and Naruto literally kiss at one point and have had a lot of gay moments hell, Naruto almost feels very gay for how far he goes for Sauske compared to Ike here. Ike has been shipped with being gay, so has Marth and Roy ever since Smash. I honestly would not care if it's just a harmless OTP and not treated as canon because then it becomes a RWBY case imo. Not saying don't ship, I'm not here to say that but I come in to say moderate beliefs because lets say we get a game where he is gay, would I care? Not really...I don't personally see it but if they felt they couldn't do it, fine. But let's say they go full on he's straight angle we're going to see people rave hard as losing his characterization and gay washing which isn't the case, we've seen that the writing can be written in two ways and it seems to me more platonic from how Japanese people view it usually. Honestly, I do IkeXElincia because it's a little bit taboo when you think about it and I can see Ike and how he might see Elincia as a bird in a cage type of scenario. Elincia does have characterization with or without royal status imo and I always felt she'd step away on a higher support as spoiler someone does comeback so it could've been possible for her to abdicate and not have a position forced upon her which it was or not, you know? Like that's not canon it's not really hurting anything but idk I think Elincia's whole thing shows she was willing to do what she needed for others but really didn't like the position but I get how she does what needs to be done too. Ike and Mia never had dialogue and I always felt that and Mist was confusing in FE9 as a lack of support option as well, I think Ike should've had at least all the Greil Mercs and a few outside but tbf the supports he has are solid in FE9 whereas FE10...yeah they're there I guess...
@@nah4467 That is an enormous block of text (might want to consider line separation no offense) but I did read through all of it. I personally don't care whether he's straight or gay. Can we just point out that Ike's sexuality is trivial af compared to the rest of his character? The fact people are trying to prove something so small and vague is canon with a whole *"investigative" video* just.. why? Let me make _this_ point. Say he _is_ gay, stated officially by the writers. What's the difference? LGBTQ representation? Ike's games aren't even remotely relevant enough to where it'd matter. Ike x Elincia is very understandable ship considering the events of Path of Radiance (in fact I'd agree with that ship). Ike even gets angry at Sanaki (the empress of _BEGNION_ of all regions in Tellius), something that could get him killed, for Elincia's sake. Sure, on impulse, but it still matters to his character. Supports are kinda jank, yeah, but personally I never pay too much attention to 'em. There was an adorable interaction between Ike and Soren in PoR which I enjoyed, but not even close to gay implications. (again I should point out I didn't watch the whole video cause ike x soren salt was what I was probably going to get)
@@YuuyaKZMI Fair point, could've cleaned it up by doing your method of spacing each sentence. I'll edit it thanks for saying something and not being rude about it! Anyway, I agree with a lot of your points personally, I don't really like these types of videos around Ike for that reason. Personally, people go FE10 endings for Ike but tbh I don't see FE10 as Ike's game or if this was canon it is very clumsy on its writing which is just a general problem with FE10. Radiant Dawn was Micaiah's game but it feels so unfinished and jank that most people just see it as Ike's sequel when literally half the game segments are Micaiah's or she has a few more chapters. Micaiah has 16 and Ike has 13. Elincia makes up 8 without sharing and then there is the 5 chapters at the end game bringing it to 42. However, maps wise Micaiah has 17 maps because of pt1/2 Ike has 13 and Elincia keeps 8 making it 43. Yet she feels so underwhelming in her own game. Personally if Ike were to have canon endings, I more think FE9's pairings are fine and what should be what sticks should they make a remake or something, they need to really improve some of those aspects that negatively hurt FE10 when it released. I think narratively and game design do take more precedence but they should adjust the transfers as well, and it feels very rushed sadly.
i mostly disrespect priam's existence as a retcon by a different writer. ike's one of the best-written lords in the series, and his character is very deliberately built as a result. i think he's absolutely totally intended to be gay, but now we're just in a state where things are unconfirmed since it was understandably subtle back then and they mostly don't want to mess with his canon
I don't think it was ever meant to be a retcon. In the parologue there is a guy who says "This guy is said to be descendant of the Radiant Hero". Talking with Priam, you know that he is a HUGE Ike fanboy. He would absolutely says "my ancestor is the radiant hero himself" but he never does. Priam was a way to port the legacy of Ike in a game without him, he wasn't suppose to be his "blood" relative. PoR and RD has a story of "continue the legacy" as a subplot between the Black Knight and Ike, who are the heirs of Gawain's legacy. Priam is the heir of the Radiant Hero, but not because of his blood, bit because he took Ragnell and used, again, to save the world, keeping the enemies back while the childrens were returning to the past
Eh, Marth is considered a descendant of Anri, even though his direct ancestor was Anri's sibling. The same could be said for Priam. Or Priam is just a crazy Ike fanboy who got a hold of some primo memorabilia. Either explanation works. Or maybe Ike just found an orphan while traveling and went 'my child now.' Who knows.
I really want to believe this because if he is ( eggplant btw) than I think he is the most complex written gay character in the series. I would like that his sexuality didn't overshadow the character or become part of his motives. The implication is alluring and although he doesn't do much for representation (hard to say you represent when your sexuality is an implication at best) he does tons to add diversity to how gay characters are written into the series ( AKA more than just an optional sexuality to appease the gay agenda).
He never tells anything about that, he never states "i am Ike bloods descendant". He is a huge Ike fanboy who basically ripped his idol from history books and used for himself. He took the mantle of the Radiant Hero to be what Ike was for his world, a beacon of hope and justice. He inherited the will of Ike, not his blood. In fact, he basically copied even Ike skills(Aether) at the best he can(Sol and Luna)
@@micheledelloglio5820 Uh, Ragnell? Ragnell is literally 100% Ike's weapon, given to him by Sanaki (iirc), apostle of Begnion. It's hard to say Priam is just an Ike fanboy when he literally has _the Ragnell that was once blessed by the goddess_ in his possession.
the fact that people will vehemently refute that ike (a character with no explicitly stated sexuality) could be interpreted as gay but just as fervently claim he's straight like it's the default will never not be funny to me. "heterosexual until proven otherwise" 🍆
Awesome video! As a gay guy myself I always liked the way Ike was handled (and I’m still on the fence regarding which way he swings). It’s so much better than making him like Sylvando (I have no problem with him either, but there are plenty of other ways to portray gay characters). Ike and Soren are two reasons I go back to FE9 and 10 so much. I also like how Soren goes from a racist self-hating (kinda) little bastard In 9 to a much more reserved and humorous little bugger in 10.
The algorithm lead me to this video, and I instantly love your presentation style and tone for approaching the subject. Definitely going to be diving into your other videos!!
As someone who enjoys writing, the idea of other ways to have children through magic and such is very interesting. You could do a lot with the concept. 🍆
Right? Is it reaaaally a stretch to assume there was any other way for a character to have a kid outside a straight marriage in a medieval fantasy game…
@@popskar I mean it is, it's just awakening and fates combined just emphasise it with how the children mechanics work specially fates where the gay pairings erase the children's existance in-game, the endings in revelations do state they adopted but suffice to say those I don't think are Kana and Nina. It could be something they should try to do for a new installment if they want to bring in the children mechanic because how it works in awakening and fates wouldn't work as shown in fates so it needs a rework (but do it right this time)
@@nightwish1453 I dont think the practice of adoption or time traveling babies existing nullifies surrogacy nor other methods it could have happened tho.
@@popskar I know they just really push that as the status quo in-game. honestly it could have just been me and just never thought about it because the games rarely viewed magic as something beyond healing and damage
I remember one of the supports in awakening, I think Miriel and Henry, they actually talk about the idea of creating babies with magic. Who's to say that the magic already didn't exist somewhere in some limited form?
I am a firm believer that Ike also liked EGGPLANT, but due to the times the games were released they really didn't wanna alienate whatever fanbase they had left (considering conservative Japan and US back then...and uh, now again?). Once Fire Emblem became a financial success, they felt more free to include whatever kinds of sexualities they want (looking at you, Three Houses of Bisexuals). Thanks for the video Cap'n!
I think it's just a really rushed out story tbh, a lot of elements from FE10 felt like in the middle of game development or in that state because there are numerous issues with the game and a lot more cut content equivalent an Obsidian game almost which is surprising. FE9 had quite a bit of cut content but that was in Dev for a while whereas FE10 easily doubled that. A lot of people critique the odd balancing of FE10 and Dawn Brigade chapters being really annoying or subpar on-top of their characterization.
Option 4: Ike had special fun time with a woman, but the child was raised by both Ike and Soren. It isn't impossible for a gay person to have special fun time with a woman, especially if they need to carry on the family name. (Philippe I, Duke of Orléans comes to mind).
🍆 Ike and Elinicia's relationship was invented by the localization team. In the original JP dialogue Ike and Elinicia were very professional relationship turned friendship with Elinicia all but admitting to Ike that she liked Geoffrey, which is why Ike pushes her to order him to save Geoffrey.
Wrong, even without localization, the scene with Begnion Senators was genuine and a sign of Ike breaking out of character over mistreatment over her. It was very stark and different compared to before and I feel like while his supports were a little different, they could still be more platonic or romantic depending. I don't think it's a canon ship (The only end I believe is Ike ventures off alone which feels like a bad contradiction to his character) but I think it does have some support just like SorenXIke even though that has a few holes like Titania's ending in RD contradicting Ike leaving because who becomes in command of Greil Mercs? Nothing is said on who becomes the actual leader. I've always read them as a bird in a cage type of story, because even in FE10 you see her breakdown by Leanne hating responsibility she has to do. She still accepted it but I still think she's more just trying to be a good person and because nobody else can do it until they discover Renning is alive. THEY HAD no Support in FE10, actually in unused content a lot of units didn't get supports they wanted to add in at A support for unique lines and scrapped one of them being Ike and Elincia we don't know the contents and it could've been platonic or it could've been romantic pairings. The game did have two years only.
@@nah4467 Yeah no, all of the "hints" were made up by the localization. In fact, something that the localization doesn't really emphasize is Ike's distaste for nobility and the fact that Ike is actually stressed out by his responsibilities. What you mistake for romance is actually respect. Highlighted by the fact that Ike and Elincia speak to one another like they do everyone else as both characters adjust their speech pattern depending on who they are speaking to. Also Path of Radiance does not exist in a bubble it has a canonical sequel that was planned during PoR's development that shows that the relationship is indeed and always was platonic. Any other interpretation is just wrong. This is actually highlighted by FEH of all things as vanilla Ike's lines come directly from his support with Elinicia. Elinicia's relationship with Geoffrey is in the same boat. Fun fact, Ike has one canon A support and that's his support with Soren, as Ike's official profile from IS itself mentions events that only unlock if you had him and Soren A support across both games. So yeah Ike leaving Tellius with Soren is canon. And that profile was made after years after Awakening came out. Elinicia's words have nothing to do with Ike. If the devs wanted it to be seen as romantic then they would have had interactions in the story itself, as RD had a habit of referencing PoR supports. But again the fact that they didn't, shows that the relationship was indeed platonic.
@@brightlight8852 Again, respect or not, it's uncanny for him lol as he has a distaste in general from the norm. I've seen some what they've translated officially and while not as THICK as Localization, it still does have a form of admiration and his disgust at nobles when Elincia went to Begnion doesn't change. I'm not treating it like it is canon but I do think there is something plausible there lol. I love it when people get crazy about headcanons even though I more just say it's a cute pairing but not canon at all lol. I challenge Soren because of Titania's ending and how it contradicts the ending of Ike leaving as she remained 2nd in charge of the Mercs...ok then...who's the leader then? Ike just left and never to return and who is there to take charge then? I always read all japanese versions of things and there is evidence of Soren and Ike but it's not factual lol, it's if anything double meaning or implied at most not really canon unless the game got a proper sequel. Also they did scrap a lot of supports and you know what is also a so called canon ending? Aran and Laura and look how well developed that support really was. I'm just saying supports and endings were an afterthought compared to FE9. Also Localization bad is such a dumb take when they had a better reason for BK and even added a few funny details or lines. Idm people who do ship them but Ike and Elincia is a good relationship even if not canon because imo FE10 canon end is just he yeets off somewhere...alone. FE10 has no real canonical end in terms of support though, art book or not because it had a rushed deadline but there was a support that was thrown out along MANY others which was originally planned which I would've like to see, one being Elincia and Ike but don't try to tell me Soren's end is canon. It's a theory* but not a fact. Imo I always saw it as telling a story more so but I would like to see a restoration of what they wanted to add or Kotor 2 because it really does turn everything on its head if you did. Or how about we dismiss those counterpoints because Priam is the only argument you can tackle? He is stressed out from dealing with it but I always felt like he doesn't like or is also upset Elincia has to do deal with it, which we do see in FE10 as she melted down by Leanne. We also see that it takes a while for him to leave nobility behind but I feel like Elincia was always an exception.
@@brightlight8852 Also I know FE9 had a sequel lol I have played and went through it plenty of times, but don't try to tell me the sequels story and writing was a masterpiece, it has a mess of plotholes and contradictions that line up to rough pacing due to the RUSHED nature of the games devs time window. FE9 was already a big game but FE10 was even bigger and that doesn't mean always better. Gameplay is amazing but the story was besides a few moments were not executed well, Blood contracts were poorly explained, supports were rushed and felt very jank for endings equivalent to FE7 writing which has numerous plot holes and issues, and hey a ship similar to Ike which is RavenXLucius. My point is, I like good writing and I feel like the ships from FE9 worked and should be moved over to FE10 regardless but they weren't because they ended up ditching it all besides stuff that were important to the story. Ephraim I mean Geoffrey imo was always more brotherly protective and a Milk sibling literally, so seeing that along with Micaiah and Sothe feels very odd imo. Ranulf has duties to being an advisor to Gallia's future king Skrimir to him being canon is questionable. And Soren I just more see as brotherly, but again I get why people say it and the evidence to support it. It's not like I haven't seen the points and go NOPE, NOPE, NADDA, PRIAM lol. I just think slapping CANON on his pairings from FE10 is where I draw a line because it's verrrrry debatable as most people concluded than you think. Also it's not as if the localization did willy nilly shit, they worked very much with the Japanese translators as well. www.nintendoworldreport.com/interview/2266/fire-emblem-path-of-radiance-interview. WITH THAT Said, your point that they do leaner hard than JP is true kind of in some areas but his whole outbursts, and even not using her proper title shows how he was reallly pissed off on both versions over Elincia and he still demands that they apologize to her.
@@nah4467 Actually, localization bad is an accurate take. It gets a lot wrong and made a lot of pointless changes, literally even altering the personalities of characters for no reason. Ike is impulsive a fact that the localization tried to downplay. His reaction to the senators came from a combination of them just being dicks, his stress, the fact that he already hates nobles, and the fact that he's impulsive, it was far from being ooc. As for Ike's stress is you really know about the jp script then you'd know that the sign of Ike being stressed out is him furrowing his eyebrows. Which his expressions do show, so it acts as a visual cue for the player, and what's constantly commented about in RD. You can say like one thing where it's change actually worked and that's the Black Knight bit. But really it's just that one thing, it doesn't erase all the areas where the localization messed up. Heck they didn't even localize the full script for RD. Again no its a fact that Ike's A support event with Soren is mentioned in both of their profiles. So yeah calling it canon is accurate because it's the only Ike support that gets acknowledged. Ike's other supports did not get the same treatment. Not that changes the fact that Ike leaves Tellius anyway. RD doesn't really change anything of our understanding of the characters merely it's a continuation of the story. The only reason why it feels like a 360 because the localization made so many pointless changes, which made issues because it created confusion in the long run. As for Tatiana's ending she probably leads them now, or maybe even Mist. Because, there really aren't any counter arguments that actually relies on official material, just fan theories and headcanon. Which I'm not taking into account. For instance you bringing up Elinicia's talk with Leanne about being queen and insisting that that had something to do with Ike is factually wrong. Because in that same conversation Elincia overcomes it. Also I never said anything about the QUALITY of RD merely that it exists and is a continuation of PoR and that PoR was made with RD in mind so any theory made with just PoR that ignores what's shown in RD is automatically wrong. I also never said anything about Ike and Soren being romantic, merely that their A support is canon. Not all headcanon valid, if it goes against something stated in either game then it's invalid. In fact calling it headcanon is damning it with false praise. Rather its just a disproven theory. I believe in commending people when they actually do a good job. I don't believe in participation trophies and refuse to kiss their assess when they make mistakes or do a bad job. Because that's exactly what they are doing, job that they are being paid for.
Eggplant and hard agree on everything you said. I've been team "Priam is Mist's decendant" personally since Awakening came out but explination 3 reallly is the most likely story. Here's hoping we one day get a remaster of these games so the next generation can experience them.
People tend to forget in the early 2000s homosexuality was still taboo, even when we started to talk more openly about the matter and wanting rights for them and other sexual and gender identities. That's explains why Ike's sexual orientation was left vague since not only writers thought it would scared players (yes, homophobia was (and still is) an ingraine thing in pop culture, videogames wheren't an exception) but because when we think "gay" many would write based on stereotypes rather than bother to make a proper character. And also censorship was more heavier on this topic, even changing the gender of a couple of Animal Crossing characters because they thought parents in the West might complain about the inclusion of "queer" looking characters. At least nowadays we are trying to move on and add more inclusion. 11:45 Wait, didn't Ike had a sister? So even if Priam is not a descendant of Ike he might be still related with him. Still doesn't prove Ike is heterosexual. PS: Funny how most folks would rather accept Ike being gay rather than open the possibility he might be bisexual. I guess is because that means he would hook up a lot or even cheat his partner or spouse, when ingame it seems he is not really into relationships. But hey, maybe he got drunk one day...
I always kinda assumed Ike was Ace and possibly Aro. I definitely don’t think he’s into women, but even with the men he’s close to, it always felt more like a relationship closer than friends but not romantic. Like AroAce domestic partners or something
Theres a lot of funny easter eggs/call backs in Awakening that, if taken at full face-value canon, absolutely demolish any sort of idea story coherency between games. Especially with the Jugdral references in Awakening. We know that Jugdral and Valentia/Archanea (and thus Ylisse) exist in the same world, with Jugdral being on a different continent that was ~1000 years ahead of the others. Loptyr, later followed by Naga and the other divine dragons, come to Jugdral and cause the plot of FE4/FE5 before fucking off back to Archanea. Makes sense, related but separate continents with light story ties. Yet somehow the **SUPER IMPORTANT** Holy Weapons of Jugdral just end up in Awakening because... they just do. This and also the map used in Paralogue 2 "The Secret Seller" of Awakening is a copy of part of Genealogy of the Holy Wars Chapter 4 "Dance in the Sky" which would make 0 sense cause theyre separate continents. These little callbacks in Awakening are all fine as long as you see them as little fun easter eggs for players but if you take them as canon it falls apart reallll fast and Priam is no different.
You might not like it but that's because FE Awakening pulls a lot of shit from its ass and how Tiki is part of that universe. You don't have to like it but Priam is a character you can't just write off now. Outrealm was a horrible idea that should've never happened but they wanted to celebrate and go out with a bang with a dating sim and it worked
@@nah4467 I will agree that Outrealm is a huge idea but I will also agree that Priam exists and therefore like it or not, Ike had some "relations" with a woman
@@shupasopni how Lifis is the (according to the novel of Thracia 776) thief that created Archenea, how is it possible that Chrom is Sigurd's descendant????
@@AzumarillConGafasBv Idk man. I just remember that apparently a bit of Japanese dialogue implies Chrom is Sigurd's decedent. This was years ago I heard this, but something abt someone (Tiki? I think? Naga?) saying he is decedent of/looks like another lord from long ago, and the amount of years was too long to be either Marth or the Exalt, and was the right amount of time for Sigurd or Selith. For the record I never finished FE4 or 5 so I don't even know what you are talking about I just know I heard about this a long time ago now, I think on Serenes. Take what you will from that. Grain of salt and all that I guess.
@YuuyaKZMI ppl dont even have blue hair irl how would you know that And please dont respond saying "ugh im done arguing" bcuz if so you shouldntve spam replyed to ever fucking comment on the video
After watching the original video, the one with robin's "Eggplant" on the thumbnail, I looked it up, got no results, and was thoroughly confused for the rest of the day. nice to get a follow up. Also cool to see cap's studio through his visor.
Ya know I’m always confused why people always assume Priam is Ike’s direct descendant when Mist and Boey clearly got hitched up and had descendants of their own.
Mist and BOEY from FE2 YOOOO. Jk but I can see that, or adoption or whatever but we'll never know and it was rough fanservice to say the least on how shoe horned it was, last minute.
@@YuuyaKZMI First, how do you know blue is recessive? You're literally just making that up, real life blue hair doesn't exist so there's no real world presendent for that arguement nor are there enough relatives in Ike's family tree to infer it from the game. Second, that's not how genetics works, if brown is dominant, Mist would still be carrying recessive blue (she has to because her mother would have had to pass it to her) and Mist can therefore easily pass it down her line where it may re-emerge in future descendants, not that I think the developers would have thought about it at all.
People have their shipping and theories, honestly knowing IS. they'd probably compromise and do Ike bisexual which tbh wouldn't be the worst thing. Hell bisexual with a pref is whatever too but I feel it's just the case that even if you're not gay, you'll have wallpaper of the beast himself somewhere
One small counter to one point. Sanaki basically gifted ragnell to Ike when he became the general of all the armies again. She basically said that the sword has a special connection to him. Ike most likely took the sword since it would be even more unlikely that Begnion would give away ragnell.
Nah, you forget it was a "Down payment" as in it's his now. Ike has Ragnell and there's no way around it. But Priam is fanservice af but how else do you look at him disappearing never to be seen again there? It sucks but no doubt he did Outrealm, outrealm was a horrible idea ever since Awakening on time travel but we're stuck with what we got.
On a dumb or shitpost joke though, literally means any character has a counterpart variant that can be anything from straight, bisexual, gay, lesbian, asexual...so ship what you want in the end...just don't get carried away on *Canon* on ships because it's stupid in the end.
Its important when discussing representation made by big companies like Nintendo that compromise is a big factor, age ratings are very important to Nintendo and in countrys like russia just having a gay character would get the game rated obsurdly high (thats what happened to the tomodachi life sequel) so if the game’s creators do want to explore themes like that which they often do with fire emblem. Even if they want be more explicit about it they cant just write in the text that he IS gay. Obviously its not an ideal situation but good art often comes from limitations and I actually like it more that ike is only subtly implied to be gay and never stated outright wether they would have or not if they were able to.
🍆, I've been telling my bf about Ike and how he should give the tellius games a shot (thanks dolphin). I can't say it's canon, but anyone who reads Ike as being straight is kind of covering their eyes and ears. I'd say he could be read as ace too, but Soren? The evidence is a lot stronger on his end, though I wouldn't call it entirely one sided either.
lol this is awful reasoning Priam shares way too much of Ike's character and the addition of Ragnell outright tosses any "coincidence" fallacy out the window
@@YuuyaKZMI I don't see where my reasoning is awful for *reads back comment* a character being implied to be not straight. Where did I mention Priam? Personality isn't entirely genetic. Also, what's stopping Ike and Soren from getting a surrogate?
@@marimecham "but anyone who reads Ike as being straight is kind of covering their eyes and ears." this is why I bring up Priam I actually enjoy your surrogate argument more than the others, that's quite valid. Though it kind of more attempts to prove the possibility of him being bi over gay, which I don't believe is a problematic view either.
@@YuuyaKZMI I could see him as bi, which (not to be rude) is not straight. It's moreso that anyone would have to provide more evidence for Ike being straight than any other sexual preference (bi, gay, asexual). I'm not too attached to Priam, mainly because I haven't played awakening but yeah, a surrogate isn't too far fetched.
@@marimecham Yes, it is not. But trying to dispute Priam to force a sexuality is not the greatest thing to do. Instead perhaps we should take this compromise or drop it and I'll just go.
Priam shares a bunch of traits (same blue hair, same blue eyes, same starting class, same skill albeit split up) and also, Ragnell, which all of thiscan't be written off as coincidence have fun standing by that assumption now
@@willgpb_ I didn't watch all of it cause it mainly just feels like salt; hence my argument. And I don't see how it'd be able to be disputed either way.
Fantastic video. Gave me a good laugh. Found myself here through UA-cam suggestions. I don't normally comment, especially since I'm wary of my English and getting my words confused, but I wanted to comment on a couple of things. Apologies for any misunderstandings. I want to point out that some things are lost in translation. For example, the Ike and Elincia ship tease was only in the localisation version, but they gave up in the second game as Geoffrey was Elincia's only marriage choice. Another thing is Priam in the Japanese version of Awakening reveals that he's not a direct descendant. Something like a descendant "in a way", similar to Marth not being a direct descendant of Anri because Anri never had kids. That's why I don't see the Priam counter-argument from others as something really important to consider. I also liked the way you presented that part in the video. Gay people can still have kids one way or another. Overall, Ike is one of my favourite FE characters, not because he's gay but because I like the way he's written, especially when compared to the other lords.
Gay Ike is best Ike. I love his paired endings with Soren. I guess I gotta go read up on the Ike/Ralnuf supports because Ike having a paired ending with him was news to me. (My fault for only playing the game once I guess)
Great video and as an FE fan, love all the subtle things that show the extensive FE knowledge. Ike getting or giving that eggplant. Though I do like the ships of him with Elincia and Mia.
Fantastic video. I’ll also add that Intelligent Systems has also made queer characters in other games, such as Vivian in Paper Mario the Thousand Year Door.
Id also like to state. Jist because they're gay doesn't mean they have each other inside one another. Ike nor Soren or Ranulf show any signs of wanting to bone. Only that they enjoy being close to one another. Relationships can be based on feelings alone not just sexual
You really think a game from 2007 would hint at gay sex? Thats the most they could do. I mean not even Three Houses gave hints towards gay sex, just that they wanted to marry and be together (but the sex is implied being married and such)
Eggplant. Also even when I played both games as a kid I felt it was clear that Soren had a crush on Ike, and that Ike was not mad about it. Also that Ike clearly did not like any of the girls that hit on him so often. So...even as a kid the subtext was evident enough.
eggs and plants.... im really happy you posted a video like this! im a huge fan of the stuff you put out, i feel like seeing a gaming channel cover topics like this is hard for me to find, and on top of that your jokes are funny!!! i appreciate you going more indepth about this a lot.... also, sylvando supremacy (>__>)b
Great analysis lol. I also thought Raven and Lucius' relationship from FE7 kind of mirrored Ike and Soren so he's not the only (potentially) non-stereotypical gay man from the series
As someone who's asexual myself, I have always head cannoned Ike as being somewhere on the ace-spectrum. There arent many other main characters in the Fire Emblem games who give me more ace-vibes than Ike does. Him being at least fruity is the very least that can be said about his romantic interactions and that's a hill that I'm willing to die on
So if I summarize correctly, there is no direct evidence of Ike being gay, but there is one, albeit weak, for the opposite ? Sorry fam I think its pretty clear, I guess its interesting as an example of people unconsciously projecting part of their own identity on characters when there is a blank spot. eggplant.
10:19 i have a feeling that you were lying when you said that there's a fire emblem character named walmart, but instead of factchecking it, im going to assume you were absolutely telling the truth and that walmart is absolutely, unambiguously the name of this guy.
Counterpoint Elincia ascended says maybe she should train with lord Ike and even comments in a teasing way that even she can't quite understand him lol...Both of them are just close and you can do whatever you want with it lol. Hell Ascended Ike says Mist and Soren won't leave him in peace which was a line in the JP version which confused EN people lol.
this is kinda off topic but i didnt know that in the english version f!byleth and edelgard dont marry each other? i played the italian version and it explicitly says that they get married
Tellius Recollection the official data book confirms his paired ending with Soren is romantic, in fact it pisses off some fans so bad intelligent systems got death threats
If I don't recall incorrectly from your Q&A video, you're not a gay or bisexual person; which is why it really makes me happy when you talk about these things in defense, despite it mostly likely not being a hindrance for you. Whether it be your lgbt supportive Twitter posts or videos like this, it is very inspiring. I am not black, and I've never been racist, but I didn't use to care THAT much about race in media. But seeing your videos about issues concerning my communities, it's inspired me and made me realize that oppressed groups of people can and should stay together and support each other; and now, I care a lot about race representation in media, and about racism in general. After XCX had a black female protagonist with a plot centered around immigration and overcoming xenophobia, it is an absolute disappointment and an embarrassment that Xenoblade 2 only had one main black character, that also died a few hours later. Eggplant
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #1 НАЧАЛО ПУТЕШЕСТВИЯ [Новый сезон] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/380Q7gLWGvk/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks for Watching and Don't Forget to SUBSCRIBE!!
There's limited availability of footage for some of the handheld games, and I have no way of capturing 3DS footage myself, so sorry for some of the lower quality visual parts
Hmmmmmm I don’t see the code word, did you watch the video??? 🤔
u did a great job thanks so much for your epic vids
priam is the result of magic mpreg dont at me
we need a fundraiser to get Captain Astronaut a REAL astronaut helmet
Do you stream ?
"Yeah, sex is cool, but have you tried Fire Emblem?" I'm listening to this at work and I just LOST IT
same
That line is accurate, whether we like it or not
I fully agree, sex is overrated (at least from an ace perspective lol)
The whole "epilogues are never explicit" is so true. Just look at Dedue/Dimitri : "they behaved like family in private and were buried together"
Also Sylvain and Felix like "in their later years, they became so close that they passed away on the same day, as if conceding that one could not live without the other
Yeah, that is kind of sus, that they were buried together, but not with their wives. We also know that Dimitri would marry somebody if he get the ending with person he does not involved romantically, for example Felix
Yeah, Dimitri ensures his crestline once and then got drill pecked, I mean close guarded in the bedroom by Dedue
Because in FE games, friendship is portrayed in a fairly intimate way. If Dimitri was gay, there would definitely be a chance that M!Byleth would marry him. But it's not like that.
Rather, this ending demonstrates the opposite, such an intimate friendship does not necessarily end in a romantic interest.
Maybe my favorite argument for Ike’s endings being romantic is that, if they were with a woman, there would be no discussion. If you take Ike and Soren’s ending and replace Soren’s name with any female, it would be unanimously accepted that those two are a romantic pair; but because they’re both men it has to be platonic somehow.
@@nah4467 Jesse wtf are you talking about
They only think he's gay because they are gay and TV has brainwashed them to thinking gay is ok so now they think eeveyone is gay
Ike isn’t romantic at all tho he’s not interested in men or women. At least not in his games. He banged a woman at least once because… you know,PRIAM.
@@nah4467 you good?
@@flygonkerel781 not canon
I think this is your best written video yet, and yes this is only 80% because of GRINCEST and GRILD MURDER
Gotta do what I can to keep the video advertiser friendly lmao 🤑
"Sigurd meets a mysterious forest lady that has him acting unwise" I love it xd
@@CaptainAstronaut It's been said that the reason Shouzou Kaga left Intelligent Systems is because he hates the idea of FireEmblem being in 3d. When I saw the Graphics of Three Houses and the Art style of Engaged I have to say, (He was RIGHT).
The good news is that there are other Strategy games to chose from thanks to third parties. Valkyria Chronicles 4, Triangle Strategy, Wargroove, Live a live, Tactics Ogre Reborn, and Front Mission.
"Priam the personification of the straight agenda" is literally the perfect description for him.
or you know; he was added in because meeting descendants is a theme in Awakening and it just so happens Priam is canonically Ike's descendant
@@YuuyaKZMI or maybe not?, there's nothing that confirms it
That's a very dumb line...Priam was never that at all. He was just dumb fanservice done poorly like everything else in Awakening. Honestly, I treat it like Ike's romance was never fleshed out ever besides the supports in FE9...FE10 they hugged. Meanwhile Sauske and Naruto kiss and Naruto goes to almost gay level of extremes to get him back in the end of that show...ended up with Hinata or we going to talk about how that's gay washing.
I think anime has always been pretty gay in that regard with homie casts. I wouldn't even care if people ship Ike and Soren, but it does come down to that argument of "canon" imo there is no canonical end besides him leaving on a journey. Honestly, shipping can be harmless until it gets too toxic which IkeXanything general can get out of hand more often. We all like Ike boys and girls, we all like Ike and he likes us all. I don't care if you ship them imo the evidence has never been strong to prove any point and all of it has had double vague meanings not just one to people who look at it.
Can anyone also tell me about Edward and who he romances in FE10? Imo FE10 has such a gutted support system that it feels story first and answer built up questions which was the whole point of FE10 to begin with, to finish was FE9 put up without going into detail. Or are we going to talk about how Top tier ElinciaXGeoffrey is because imo that shit is underwhelming.
Also technically if we're contradicting IkeXElincia on the whole she can't abdicate or anything, I could challenge IkexRanulf because I hardly doubt Ranulf was supposed to be the top advisor for Skrimir...or would you think him dancing around with Ike in some random location as not an issue for Gallia then with that logic? I don't really like how FE10 leaves Ike just leaving or abandoning Tellius almost...he just disappears even though it contradicts the whole arc from Fe9.
Nice Essay.
@@iguy6571 Yes, I do aplogogize for the word bomb but I am passionate about FE and Ike's games. Although, to sum end of the day moderate and don't go to the extreme and ship what you want, just don't get toxic into fights because it is inconclusive...with *theories* and improve Radiant Dawn in a defivinitive edition.
"If you want pride, I got it." - Ike Fire Emblem.
The fact that he actually said that in the game lol
There was an exhibit it Germany about LGBT history in gaming & they actually had a card specifically about Ike and Soren’s relationship & Ike’s sexuality in general. Regardless of if his being gay is “canon,” it’s really cool how so many of us read him that way anyways, even across languages.
Many of us, lol who? Not the many, not me da fuq? He’s not gay and the “evidence” he gave is not actual proof
That shit proves it might have been deep, but not gay. What? You gonna give your best friend a hug and say it was gay? During an emotional moment? You sound braindead
This dude gay or a gay ally himself so of course he wanna say he’s gay, biased af
@@ancapgrandscribe9546 you mad? gonna cry??
Can you link actual proof of this I can’t find it anywhere online and that leads me to believe that’s cap.
Gay people can be Chad's to
No
Yes
@@peppermint_8 no
@@Elegies22 But why
@@Elegies22 Yes
Ike definitely has that classical hero feeling of "killing dudes all day but at night I just want to cuddle with my boy(s)". I actually love this as an idea because like you said he's so different from the usual gay male characters. Subtle gay/bi inclusion is actually my favourite because something about not making a big deal out of it makes it feel more validated?
Another great video Mr Spaceman, and as we say in the UK, aubergine.
I always figured he was some form of asexual like he cares for anyone he considers his friend but never actually thinks about romance. Just protecting the those close to him and constantly bettering himself. A dude mostly focused on doing what’s right. Though I forgot ALOT about who he has ending with as well. So...yeah I also felt that he was uncomfortable with women flirting with him was HOW they did it, Soren and ranulf, he's known them for YEARS...most of his life. So he's comfortable going back and forth with him. Most of the women, especially the shopkeep, did it when they FIRST meet him. If they developed an actual relationship with him, before the heavy flirting happened I think we would have a less bias answer. Then again as you said and as I agree he's focused more on the job than the eggplant. As anyone should be lol, cause honestly... I ALWAYS hated the gay sterotype...I honestly depised it even before I came out, not because a dislike towards gays...but it screamed forced inclusion.
@@SuperGamefreak18 I also headcanon him as asexual, he never looks interested in flirting and always felt attracted to people for their good hearts and abilities in combat; the relationship of him with Soren is so sweet to me because the tactician only want to be with him and makes him happy to the point of even his emblem form in Engage wants to learn a meat recipe to make to Ike (even though emblems are unable to eat, so that's still a natural reaction from the original Soren).
@@astrolatte_ yup major sign of a true relationship, period.
@@astrolatte_ the only thing that stops me from headcannoning him as ace is the fact that he doesn't have a paired ending with a woman. If his endings were truly platonical, what's stoping him from having one with Titania or Mist?
@@nacoto180 Who said his endings were platonic? Ace people can date y'know. Personally I see Ike as asexual homoromantic since he's pretty gay, but in the ace way.
I read a comment that I like that went like: "IkexSoren ship is like your reverse fanship, because instead of people making vague arguments to defend it, it's the haters that make tinfoil theories to prove that Ike has to be heterosexual"
Also, I'm always happy to see that the Makalov slander it's still strong even nowadays; Astrid, dear, blink if you need help.
Astrid: I can fix him! (TBH: It would be kinda nice if Makalov had a redemption arc... but memes are also cool.)
Why do you all care so much about who a fictional character wants to bang?
Nevermind, the "straight agenda" line says everything I need to know.
For the Priam part one possibility could just be that Ike adopted a child whose bloodline ended in Priam.
Eeh I still prefer the Mpreg option. It's the funny one
Lol funniest shit I've ever seen
@@glordery2 Or somewhere in the multiverse there are females Sorens and Female Ikes.
Then he wouldn't REALLY be Ike's descendant would he?
@@rpgfanatic9719 He still would be just but just not for the Ike we know.
Since I was a kid playing Brawl, Ike has given me bigg eggplant vibes, and it's pretty fucking dope that aside from being a badass he's actually a well if not decently written gay bro instead of the usual flamboyant dudes used in most media
Yeah, MUCH better written to be FE LGBT than Niles
@@twilimess honestly, niles x M!corrin wasn’t a well written LGBT pairing as it was. missed opportunity to make M!Robin x Chrom canon, but it’s nice to see that it’s been heavily implied even through warriors
@@tacticixn Very true, I like the potential Corrin and Robin one since it's one of my big ships next to Female Robin x Lucina
I see it more so as on rushed development on FE10. Why Ranulf and Ike are focused on is because they wanted to get Ike back into the conflict and even then he started with Leanne which honestly kind of neat since he rescued her back in FE9, and get him to help his war homie, Soren was a case of they wanted to fully flesh out Soren's true origins and backstory and how he was tied to Ike's past which is why those two have those flags in FE10, every other canonical relationship from this logic MicaiahxSothe, ElinciaXGeoffrey (Cringe this is like brother and sister bonds, not by blood but imo kind of creepy) as rushed things that weren't well told. They wanted MORE of a robust support than any FE game but they couldn't get enough time to flesh it out so it got ditched for the end result. I think a lot of the FE9 supports are awesome but I wouldn't say there is a canon one.
So your secretly gay?? Lmao ok
I think the funny thing about Priam is that even people who don't involve themselves with the gay Ike debate hate him bc of how badly he fucked up the timeline if we take him literally. He feels like such a lame character who rly shouldn't be taken as telling the truth, to an extent where it borders on feeling like part of the joke.
Also, shoutouts to how Ike and Soren got alternate costumes around Valentine's Day in FEH, as well. Totally a bro thing 🍆
I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH THIS I DONT GET HOW PEOPLE ACTUALLY THINK OF HIM AS ACTUALLY IKE'S CHILD😭
How does he fuck up the timeline he’s just Ike’s descendent
@@jeddgangman4502 Cause Ike's not even from the same implicit universe as Marth
@@KrissyBlues yeah but Priam got to Martha world through the outrealms he says that and we know people can travel to different world via the outrealms
@@jeddgangman4502 Forgot to respond but you're right actually, I went and rechecked the dialogue in Priam's paralogue and Chrom does state Ike was a hero from another world
I like the idea that Priam just kinda....found (stole?) Ragnell and just claimed to be descended from the radiant hero. I like also like the idea of him being Mist's decedent, but him being a lying eggplant is more interesting.
He is a *direct* descendent
i like the idea that soren is a trans man and ike impregnated him
The Rumor Come Out: Does Ike is Gay?
Ike is gay is the most discussed in the media in the few years ago. Even it has happened in 2005, but some of the public still curious about what is exactly happening and to be the reason there is a rumor comes out about his gay. At that time he became the massive video gaming rumor.
The public, especially his fellow mercenaries are shocked. He just came out with his bad rumor which is spread massively. This time is not about his sword fighting career, but his bad rumor. The rumor is out of standardize of hoax, according the last reported this mercenary revealed himself as homosexual. Do you still believe or not, this rumor is really much talked by people even in a person of his mercenaries.
So did he actually come out as gay?
Nice Bruno Mars Shitpost lol
'sword fighting career'
Damn! It was obvious all along!
Jesus christ this an esoteric shitpost. Impressive, very nice.
it's been a while since I seen this
i got watching this randomly and laughed, thank you lol
Thanks KBash!! Been watching you for years, love your videos!!
You know what makes it worse with the same-sex options in Fates?
So we all know that Revelation is the canon route of Fates by this point. There’s no point in debating it. But when it comes to the association of Birthright, Conquest, and Revelation with individuals, on one of the most common official arts I’ve seen (the one with the Nohrian and Hoshidan siblings + both Corrins and Azura), male Corrin is associated with the Hoshidan route Birthright because they’re standing alongside the Hoshidan siblings, female Corrin is associated with the Nohrian route Conquest because they’re standing with the Nohrian siblings, and Azura is associated with Revelation because she’s standing at the center and she is the one that reveals the secret that kickstarts Revelation (she’s also a recruitable unit on all three routes, though I’m pretty sure the only route she survives is Revelation). The two same-sex options in Fates are Rhajat and Niles. However, Rhajat can only be recruited in Revelation and Birthright, while Niles can only be recruited in Revelation and Conquest. Due to the previous association of male Corrin with Birthright and female Corrin with Conquest, this means that male Corrin players on Birthright and female Corrin players on Conquest don’t have a same-sex option.
I disagree.
Conquest is every bit as likely to be Canon
Warriors and Engage both doubled down on something: Female Corrin is canon.
This confirms that birthright isn't, but not much else. (Oh, except that Scarlet is thus canonically dead)
Revelations could easily be played off as a "what if" scenario with a shaky foundation
In the game literally called "If".
From a writing standpoint, Corrin making the decision to go down Conquest is frankly the only sane decision available.
Revelations may be the "complete picture" but whether or not that picture is actually true is pretty dubious to me.
@@1stCallipostle that doesn’t confirm anything lol neither is more canon than the other
@@cheesecheese6459 I literally said it was dubious.
I still hold that for a variety of reasons we can strike out Birthright
And if you've seen the datamine, you'd know that they're going to continue to be fine with "Not Birthright"
@@1stCallipostle what I dont get is the completely ruling out birthright like it's no more canon than conquest and I'd argue revelations has the best chance of being canon plus the cover is just marketing you can choose either gender in all routes
@@cheesecheese6459 Once again I bring up Warriors very clearly stating that it was Male Corrin who chose Birthright
Byleth's canon is more questionable because warriors and Engage have disagreements there
But for Corrin it's pretty damn clear when they choose the same one both times and have one of those appearances have a choice that was already associated with that version in marketing
Also, as I implied, spoilers below
Do you really think they'd pick Emblem Camilla to make if they weren't okay with throwing BR out the window
In regards to Priam being Ike's descendant, I've always agreed that Priam is likely the descendant of Mist, not Ike. Just like how Marth is said to be the descendant of Anri the great, and Marth even looks identical to Anri. But Anri actually never had children and Marth is really the descendant of Anri's younger brother, Marcelus.
Where does Luna as a skill come from, then? Mist *never* learns it.
@@YuuyaKZMI A lot of dlc units in awakening have Luna, I doubt gameplay would matter at all.
@@SageMerric I'll just admit I'm kind of done arguing in this comment section, mainly cause it eventually gave me a headache.
For all we know, he could just be neither and flat out bullshit lol. I don't think it's strong evidence for anything besides fanservice unless IS somehow connects it which a lot of people won't like. I think Ike sexuality is still a point of debate and the theories have plenty of strengths and weaknesses to them that it's still up to debate and not a fact or canon.
@@nah4467 why though
tbh isn't it a bit trivial?
(only reason I responded is cause I got a notification)
When it comes to Priam, I don't think he's as lore-breaking as it might appear. I think it might be intentional that he doesn't bring up being Ike's descendent in FEH, for the same reason he only off-handedly mentions it once in Awakening (and only because Chrom assumed that's who he was) - he's not. In FEH, Priam says that Ragnell has "chosen so many prominent heroes over the years", not that the sword was inherited down a bloodline. In this case, Priam is a 'descendent' of the concept of the Radiant Hero, in the same way as whoever were the numerous heroes that Ragnell chose in between him and Ike. Ike even calls Priam a "fellow Ragnell enthusiast" by the end of their conversations.
That being said, I don't have a horse in this race. I do believe that Ike is gay or bi, but it's not a position I feel strongly enough about to argue it. Priam has come up among my friends a few times in the past and I decided to read into it at the time.
This is off-topic, but did you know that in Fate/Grand Order, 'Eggplant' is a bit of a meme nickname for Mash Kyrielight?
ew, fate.
@@malum9478 Was that the only thing worth responding to in my overly long comment? Because if so, fair game, I do ramble a lot :v
tbf that also has to do by belief as they aren't trying to whole DIVINE destiny thing which Ike was not. He was a simple force that was lending a helping hand and the same goes to Priam anyway. But Outrealm literally makes the most bizarre twists and spins that literally multiverse Ike can be anything and that slapping canon is kind of pointless...
First off, I want to say that your last point about Priam being an easter egg and nothing more, is almost certainly 100% correct. He just *feels* like a character who didn't have a lot of thought put into him.
Secondly, you covered the option of surrogates through magical or time traveling means, but there is also the magical world of... actual surrogate mothers. Gay and lesbian couples have children all the time through whatever means works for them. I myself raise a daughter with another woman. When two people love each other and want to build a family together, they will make it work.
I played Path of Radiance way back when it came out and even back then, I had a feeling that Ike was bisexual. I thought it was strange that Ike didn't have a "marriage" ending like you had talked about with the other games, and based on the intimacy of some of the supports, I thought the writers were setting up Ike to have a choice of four characters in a sequel; Soren, Ranulf, Elincia, or Lethe. That's two men, two women, two beorc, and two laguz to choose from. That said, I think Ike is definitely written as gay in Radiant Dawn, so maybe that's what was intended for him all along or it was another direction that the writers wanted to take his character, or maybe he just spent the time between games figuring himself out.
This is kind of a minor point but I almost think that the absolutely ridiculous amount of things you have to do just right to see that tender moment between Ike and Soren on the final chapter is another point in favor of Ike being gay. If Ike were in a hetero relationship I imagine the moment he embraces his partner just before the big battle would be an important and hard-to-miss moment for players. But since it's a gay pairing, it gets locked behind gameplay and support mechanics that span two titles. It's one of Ike's best character moments and the vast majority of players will never see it.
Excellent video that was both funny and interesting, I give it five out of five eggplants.
Genuinely, I assumed Priam's ancestor/IkeSoren's child was made via dragon magic, given Soren's ties
ok groomer.
Priam probably a distant relative like a cousin or nephew
@@lilben4184 Bait or not, it legitimately sucks that demons like yourself will, completely without reasonable justification, simply label anyone who happens to be LGBT as groomers.
An accusation without merit is one thing, but it also demonstrates a clear disregard for real victims, seeing them not as wronged people, but instead as a valuable tool of defense on which to stake your hatred for a group you don't like. It's utterly shameful, to say the absolute least.
@@megamillion5852 🤨🤔 Now that's interesting. Why would you take offense to being called a groomer? Are you suggesting that there's something wrong with appreciating the company of children and being appreciated back? #LoveIsLove #LoveWins
Me reading Ike's and Soren's dialogue while playing the game for the first time: FELLAS?!? ❤️
Thanks for the video, your knowledge on fire emblem lore is very eggplant.
Ike x Ranulf will always be one of my favorite endings. Ike's only goal is to be a mercenary and chill with his bros, he also likes laguz, his 2 endings are male (part) laguz who like the mercenary life... it reads as queercoded to me
I view Priam existence as I see Gangrel, Emmeryn, Aversa, Yen'fay and Walhart allying with us in the paralogues: extra content easter egg, to not take serious.
Well, you've convinced me Mr Astronaut. 🍆 I've only played Shadow Dragon & everything since Awakening, but "he can only be paired off with one of two guys" is a pretty open and shut case imo.
until you realize Priam has Ragnell
@@YuuyaKZMI Priam does not prove anything, watch the video again he explains it very well.
@@isaac3000 4 months ago and I've said on other comments I'm done trying to argue with people
@@YuuyaKZMI We don't care if you are tired, we keep pointing out to you that you are wrong. This is how a public comment area works. I noticed how adamant you were on Ike not being gay despite this being a fictional character in a video game, the audacity...
@@isaac3000 but you act as if I still give a shit, that's the difference
I agree that Priam is at best canonically dubious. But if we really need to treat him as canon and not a LARPer, then I think the Mist x Boyd lineage works a lot better than people give it credit.
I know not a lot of people have played Marth's games, and even for those who have, the lore is obscure at best, but one of the most important aspects of Marth's place in the world and his importance to the story is that he's "Anri's descendant." EXCEPT! Anri died alone and childless. He had a romantic interest in the ancient war named Artemis, but she chose to marry a different guy who went on to rule Archanea (country, not continent), with Anri sticking to his small country of Altea, where Marth is from. Anri's royal lineage was continued indirectly via his brother, and it was this matter of disputed succession which actually split the neighbouring country of Gra away from historic Altea's borders (Gra became ruled by the stuck up nobles who didn't accept Anri's brother as king).
POINT BEING: the genesis of this series literally involves its most iconic character (Marth) claiming descent from a mythic-historical figure through an indirect lineage continued by that figure's sibling. I think whether the Awakening writers were aware of this or not (probably not; I agree that they didn't put any thought into Priam, period), it very clearly establishes the precendent that Priam can be descended from Mist while still being considered and referred to as Ike's descendant.
Also, while I didn't care much one way or another in this debate about Ike's sexuality, though probably leaning toward gay if anything, I think you pushed me over the edge. Your schpiel about how heterosexual relationships never need to openly state that they're romantic, yet because of our biases toward normativity we unreasonably expect hard confirmation before acknowledging any homosexual fictional relationships, really sold me on the idea of Ike being gay. Especially when I consider if Ranulf, and especially Soren, were simply genderswapped but otherwise remained the exact same, I think their romantic chemistry and paired endings with Ike would never be called into question like they have been.
Artemis also died in childbirth and to me it implies a further tragedy to "the curse" TM that most similar stories (and/or those reading them) about marrying for duty ignore cause of similar social biases. She didn't even have the chance to abandon Archanea (again country, not continent) to be with Arni after continuing the line or whatever else because she died.
Apologies for drawing even further into Archanea (continent, not country) lore, but I've gained a new appreciation for it from searching up the games cause of media like this video.
Ah yes, standing by the incorrect definition of a descendant only ever used in this one instance but claiming Priam is at best "canonically dubious"
@@thesilkenmanster8208 See my second paragraph, there is literally a precedent for this usage within the Fire Emblem series itself.
Claiming descent from someone has always been a political statement more than a genetic one, especially for most of human history which lacked methods for testing genetics. The implication is genetic of course, but the important part is "I'm related to this prior important person, so now I am important."
In Marth's case it was to validate his claim over the Falchion, Fire Emblem, and Archanaea. In Priam's case it's to validate his fanboyism and how he roleplays as Ike. Whether or not they actually come from a strict line of genetic descent doesn't really matter, and for at least one of these cases they objectively don't.
@@LoudWaffle
Yes, I’m well aware of the whole Marth and Anri precedent. But in Priam’s case, there is no political advantage to be gained. His men follow him because he is strong, charismatic, and able to tie together a band of different races and people, much like his ancestor did. There is no need to validate his fanboyism as he is genuinely powerful and worthy of respect outside of his descent. There is no need to roleplay as Ike because it is in his character and blood to be quite like him.
And of course the most important thing to consider when using any word - authorial intent. Marth and Anri had story basis for the way they use descendant. Chrom and every other descendant character are understood to be descendants in the more traditional sense, and it is wrong to assume that they went with the exception in Priam’s case. Why is it wrong to assume? Authorial intent. There is absolutely no reason, from Intelligent Systems’ perspective, to create a character meant to invoke Ike’s popularity (even giving him a remix of Ike’s Resolution) via making him his descendant, only for him to secretly or subtlety be Mist’s descendant. This is where Occam’s Razor comes in because the people who want Priam to descend from Mist forget that Ike x Soren shippers are not in fact at the forefront of the developers’ minds. And don’t even get me started on the fact that Ike is the one who actually left Tellius
@@thesilkenmanster8208 If you want to focus on authorial intent then the simple and most obvious answer voids all discussion on the topic: there was no intent. Priam like most other details in Awakening tied to previous games is purely for the same of fanservice. Hell, even many details exclusive to Awakening itself were done for fanservice, not any sense or deeper meaning, like Emmeryn, Gangrel, and Aversa surviving and joining you.
The authorial intent had nothing to do with Ike's bloodline, they just wanted to reference a popular character; any attention given to him beyond that is moot.
Another point towards Ike's sexuality is his Radiant Dawn design. Instead of being pretty bishounen like Marth or even a pretty man like Chrom, he's well built and masculine, to the point where some characters bring up comparisons between him and the laguz, something almost unheard of for JRPG protags. In Japan, hyper-masculinity is the gay stereotype, hence the Bara genre. And the design was definitely intentional, because the Japanese audience voiced backlash towards his Radiant Dawn design for looking like, and I quote, "a gorilla", something the devs would've known would be the case.
some of those artists definitely like Ike lol… taste!
He's already unconventional lol...he's a Merc what is he supposed to have a fancy hat? I've seen plenty of guys do shit like that who aren't gay lol. So is Guts from Berserk gay then? Tbh I don't mind multiple pairings and I'd like to see a better support system because FE10's is fucked. Hell best actual support dialogue that's unique with Ike is with Mist on actual lines he says in combat. But it's like SylvainXMarianne, it didn't happen even though they were opposite sex people. Idm pairing but we don't need OMG HE'S GAY CANON YOUR TOXIC for DIFFERENT PAIRING...like you want Ike and Soren being gay, idc I've seen Ike and Marth being gay lol...but don't go after people who also do Ike pairing with Elincia, Lethe, Ranulf, whatever. I'd like to see a better support system and fully fleshes out all the stuff from FE9 more because it was heavily scrapped
Additionally, people here when first seeing Marth and Roy already thought they were GAY af lol. Makes sense, Marth is gay such a rebel for no pants, a shame he had an arrange marriage with Ceada. See how I can twist any perception of a design to do so? So Ike could be seen as that or he could just be masculine because he's trying to fill his father's shoes and show progression of that through the story...I'm just saying, people can come to many different perspectives that should be taken to account
@@nah4467 no pants is him being based on the mediterrenean peeps during the ancient times, like the Romans and Greeks, the fact his name was originally Mars Roman God of War, while his descendant Lucina is named after Lucina Roman Goddess of Childbirth.
Most folks here would have thought Ike is based on Guts from Berserk, but speaking of bara no wonder there is some "material" of him in the Internet.
We have a male dragon in Anankos who asexually reproduced Lilith as well.
Let's never speak about Fates
@@nah4467 Kek.
@@nah4467 Let's never speak about Fates LORE.
The game part and most characters are great.
It's just the unnamed continent and questionable writing in the way
The most cursed thing in any Fire Emblem game is definitely pairing Azura with Silas, then marrying mCorrin to Sophie, and then S-supporting the resulting fKana with Shigure. I should reiterate for clarity that Corrin and Azura's mothers are sisters, for those unaware.
Th-thanks, Fates...
@Reborn Reaperpostle [1st of The 12, Archbishop] technically it was named. 2 subcontinents, meaning named after the major power on each side.
Growing up I was quite happy that Fire Emblem would have any LGBTQ+ representation at all....but then I realized that almost every gay or bisexual character is of the thief or rogue class? Like, what is THAT about? Legault, Heather, Niles...Fire Emblem Three Houses was the first to really break this sequence, I think....but then the male romance options are so limited...
not to mention other LGBT (mostly gay) characters are also more of a harmful stereotype than properly written characters....which is kinda distasteful to say the least lol
That and three houses’ male options all look objectively kind of like girls💀
@@ohandthefracking The sterotypical options wouldn’t be so bad if they had a few more characters. Some gay people are “feminine.” Meanwhile some don’t present that way. They need to account for multiple ways of representation.
I’m honestly more
upset that females got a lord and bunch of great girls, while men got two old guys and lindehart 😂
Don’t forget everyone’s least favorite thot rhajat and the 2 twitter equivalents of hitler, edelgard/rhea (depending on who u ask, diff people hate them and love them)
@@shaktra1563 men didn't even GET the two old guys (plus Alois is amazing, whatchu mean?) they ended up being platonic cuz they had canon wives
My theory is that ragnell exists in the shadow dragon/valentia/awakening timeline kinda how the fire emblem appears throughout several games in different lands. The radiant hero in the Archanea timeline might just be a different character who isnt Ike. Any semblance of him was just a callback to Ike from the writers.
Or... Outrealms, there's a reason why Owain, Severa and Inigo are in Fates.
It could be for various reasons either way an Ike did pass through everywhere because Awakening left a hole in that logic a bit. For all we know could be multi-versus where Ike is straight and another where he's flamboyant af lol. Honestly people just need to relax on "THIS IS CANON" in general imo lol. Shipping and having them with said things is fun or sometimes hot but I don't want it to get toxic extremes imo
@@gamechanger8908 That is a possibility. there are plenty of things Awakening has broken because of outrealms and time travel for the sake of fanservice sadly. People just don't specific types of fanservice. Priam isn't a strong point to prove he's not gay anyway but just an endless supply of possible reasoning because they pulled the fanservice card. He could be Ike's son and he got married to a lady, gay, descendent, or he's just a flat out liar and just has Ragnell and wanted to have a cool title and idolized him. Not like we haven't seen impersonators or liars in FE ever. Biggest problem with the whole thing that makes this all up to debate and open ended as just theories is just how contradicting some endings are and how it really doesn't work.
You know it's also funny because somebody made a crazy theory that got well liked that Ike got with Genny because of very interesting circumstances because Genny in the end ends up with a mysterious man. I'm just saying that exists not that it is for a fact though.
Gonna be honest, I'm a Ike stan I love this man for his morals and values. He reminds me alot of robin hoods story doing the right thing for the right reason I honestly couldn't care less who he ends up with
if you love him when he kicks ass you have to love him when he pounds it too.
OK so I need to point out that was NOT the Soliel support in Japan. She was shy around girls so Corrin used a potion to look like a girl for her to practice on. It's weird but it wasn't sexual nor conversion at all.
So if anything Corrin is a magical crossdresser?
The investigation we’ve all been waiting for. Either way, we like Ike. Also, I’m pretty sure Awakening has 2 Black characters (Basilio & Flavia). But I guess you meant Robin specifically. Regardless, Ike is at least homoromantic & worthy of an eggplant.
Flavia is so pretty💀
@@thenewmissinglink8501 She is
The east khan can whoop me anytime
Hell yeah we like Ike. Idk on homo but let's be real Ike can be asexual, gay, straight or bisexual for all we know because it's all theories in the end and open to interpretation. Even regardless it's not going to stop people from him exploring different types of ships because he is a fictional character in the end.
@@nah4467 No matter if Ike is heterosexual or homosexual, Ike is still our Ike
Priam could be related through adoption. Ike, Soren and ranulf find sime kids adopt them time passes and waoh one of their decendants has a penchant for (off color) blue hair and fighting and he is related because adoption is family binding and all that
Also explains why he doesnt have aether but learned luna and sol to be like his ancestor
Possible but I really do think it's just bad and horrible FE10's story (in some areas) and support was that it needed refining to begin with...and we got that issue of Awakening breaking a lot of shit in FE history with Outrealms and time travel which is why it's not that great in retrospect. It's open ended and shouldn't be pushed on as canon whether he's canonical gay or not...you can make him gay and whatever, people can make him romance Elincia...is that really a crime, especially on the internet?
I think delving in canon is hard because it was story first and foremost. This game has a lot of jank from FE2 and Ike from FE9 feels like what the supports should've been and even further developed but they scrapped it, Ike's support were all supposed to transfer over and if you look at all the supports, sometimes you even see coding errors where 2 of the same letter are apparent, text issue on skills were more abundant, and Blood pact...the game was definitely rushed and had the development time equivalent to a GBA game maybe another year more which is bad for how big it was.
adoption is a super weak possibility as a ton of evidence outweighs it, most notably that it's very unlikely the writers intended adoption and there's no hints whatsoever at that idea
@@YuuyaKZMI Honestly, the whole argument for him being straight or gay is very weak...OH MAN THEY HUGGED! In Naruto Sauske and Naruto literally kiss at one point and have had a lot of gay moments hell, Naruto almost feels very gay for how far he goes for Sauske compared to Ike here. Ike has been shipped with being gay, so has Marth and Roy ever since Smash. I honestly would not care if it's just a harmless OTP and not treated as canon because then it becomes a RWBY case imo.
Not saying don't ship, I'm not here to say that but I come in to say moderate beliefs because lets say we get a game where he is gay, would I care? Not really...I don't personally see it but if they felt they couldn't do it, fine. But let's say they go full on he's straight angle we're going to see people rave hard as losing his characterization and gay washing which isn't the case, we've seen that the writing can be written in two ways and it seems to me more platonic from how Japanese people view it usually.
Honestly, I do IkeXElincia because it's a little bit taboo when you think about it and I can see Ike and how he might see Elincia as a bird in a cage type of scenario. Elincia does have characterization with or without royal status imo and I always felt she'd step away on a higher support as spoiler someone does comeback so it could've been possible for her to abdicate and not have a position forced upon her which it was or not, you know? Like that's not canon it's not really hurting anything but idk I think Elincia's whole thing shows she was willing to do what she needed for others but really didn't like the position but I get how she does what needs to be done too. Ike and Mia never had dialogue and I always felt that and Mist was confusing in FE9 as a lack of support option as well, I think Ike should've had at least all the Greil Mercs and a few outside but tbf the supports he has are solid in FE9 whereas FE10...yeah they're there I guess...
@@nah4467 That is an enormous block of text (might want to consider line separation no offense) but I did read through all of it.
I personally don't care whether he's straight or gay. Can we just point out that Ike's sexuality is trivial af compared to the rest of his character? The fact people are trying to prove something so small and vague is canon with a whole *"investigative" video* just.. why?
Let me make _this_ point. Say he _is_ gay, stated officially by the writers. What's the difference? LGBTQ representation? Ike's games aren't even remotely relevant enough to where it'd matter.
Ike x Elincia is very understandable ship considering the events of Path of Radiance (in fact I'd agree with that ship). Ike even gets angry at Sanaki (the empress of _BEGNION_ of all regions in Tellius), something that could get him killed, for Elincia's sake. Sure, on impulse, but it still matters to his character.
Supports are kinda jank, yeah, but personally I never pay too much attention to 'em. There was an adorable interaction between Ike and Soren in PoR which I enjoyed, but not even close to gay implications.
(again I should point out I didn't watch the whole video cause ike x soren salt was what I was probably going to get)
@@YuuyaKZMI Fair point, could've cleaned it up by doing your method of spacing each sentence. I'll edit it thanks for saying something and not being rude about it!
Anyway, I agree with a lot of your points personally, I don't really like these types of videos around Ike for that reason. Personally, people go FE10 endings for Ike but tbh I don't see FE10 as Ike's game or if this was canon it is very clumsy on its writing which is just a general problem with FE10. Radiant Dawn was Micaiah's game but it feels so unfinished and jank that most people just see it as Ike's sequel when literally half the game segments are Micaiah's or she has a few more chapters. Micaiah has 16 and Ike has 13. Elincia makes up 8 without sharing and then there is the 5 chapters at the end game bringing it to 42. However, maps wise Micaiah has 17 maps because of pt1/2 Ike has 13 and Elincia keeps 8 making it 43. Yet she feels so underwhelming in her own game.
Personally if Ike were to have canon endings, I more think FE9's pairings are fine and what should be what sticks should they make a remake or something, they need to really improve some of those aspects that negatively hurt FE10 when it released. I think narratively and game design do take more precedence but they should adjust the transfers as well, and it feels very rushed sadly.
i mostly disrespect priam's existence as a retcon by a different writer. ike's one of the best-written lords in the series, and his character is very deliberately built as a result. i think he's absolutely totally intended to be gay, but now we're just in a state where things are unconfirmed since it was understandably subtle back then and they mostly don't want to mess with his canon
AND EGGPLANT, for the record >:^P
Totally agree!
I don't think it was ever meant to be a retcon. In the parologue there is a guy who says "This guy is said to be descendant of the Radiant Hero". Talking with Priam, you know that he is a HUGE Ike fanboy. He would absolutely says "my ancestor is the radiant hero himself" but he never does. Priam was a way to port the legacy of Ike in a game without him, he wasn't suppose to be his "blood" relative. PoR and RD has a story of "continue the legacy" as a subplot between the Black Knight and Ike, who are the heirs of Gawain's legacy. Priam is the heir of the Radiant Hero, but not because of his blood, bit because he took Ragnell and used, again, to save the world, keeping the enemies back while the childrens were returning to the past
Could be a retcon... it would still mean he's straight. Whether he was intended to be gay is completely speculatory.
Eh, Marth is considered a descendant of Anri, even though his direct ancestor was Anri's sibling. The same could be said for Priam.
Or Priam is just a crazy Ike fanboy who got a hold of some primo memorabilia. Either explanation works. Or maybe Ike just found an orphan while traveling and went 'my child now.' Who knows.
Thank you for making video essays that aren’t 24 hours long
I really want to believe this because if he is ( eggplant btw) than I think he is the most complex written gay character in the series. I would like that his sexuality didn't overshadow the character or become part of his motives. The implication is alluring and although he doesn't do much for representation (hard to say you represent when your sexuality is an implication at best) he does tons to add diversity to how gay characters are written into the series ( AKA more than just an optional sexuality to appease the gay agenda).
I like the idea that Priam is lying, makes it more interesting
Like he just heard about Ike in a book or something and went “yeah, I wanna be that!”
He never tells anything about that, he never states "i am Ike bloods descendant". He is a huge Ike fanboy who basically ripped his idol from history books and used for himself. He took the mantle of the Radiant Hero to be what Ike was for his world, a beacon of hope and justice. He inherited the will of Ike, not his blood. In fact, he basically copied even Ike skills(Aether) at the best he can(Sol and Luna)
More interesting and less nonsense
@@micheledelloglio5820 And then that argument is disproven when you consider he has Ragnell
@@micheledelloglio5820 Uh, Ragnell?
Ragnell is literally 100% Ike's weapon, given to him by Sanaki (iirc), apostle of Begnion.
It's hard to say Priam is just an Ike fanboy when he literally has _the Ragnell that was once blessed by the goddess_ in his possession.
the fact that people will vehemently refute that ike (a character with no explicitly stated sexuality) could be interpreted as gay but just as fervently claim he's straight like it's the default will never not be funny to me. "heterosexual until proven otherwise" 🍆
I say he's exceptionally asexual.
3:37 Wrong, I can’t self insert as Robin as I can never even hope to be even half as perfect and lovable as him, and neither can anyone else.
Also for the sword , Marth inherited the falcion from his ancestor's brother
Awesome video! As a gay guy myself I always liked the way Ike was handled (and I’m still on the fence regarding which way he swings). It’s so much better than making him like Sylvando (I have no problem with him either, but there are plenty of other ways to portray gay characters). Ike and Soren are two reasons I go back to FE9 and 10 so much. I also like how Soren goes from a racist self-hating (kinda) little bastard In 9 to a much more reserved and humorous little bugger in 10.
The algorithm lead me to this video, and I instantly love your presentation style and tone for approaching the subject. Definitely going to be diving into your other videos!!
As someone who enjoys writing, the idea of other ways to have children through magic and such is very interesting. You could do a lot with the concept. 🍆
Right? Is it reaaaally a stretch to assume there was any other way for a character to have a kid outside a straight marriage in a medieval fantasy game…
@@popskar I mean it is, it's just awakening and fates combined just emphasise it with how the children mechanics work specially fates where the gay pairings erase the children's existance in-game, the endings in revelations do state they adopted but suffice to say those I don't think are Kana and Nina. It could be something they should try to do for a new installment if they want to bring in the children mechanic because how it works in awakening and fates wouldn't work as shown in fates so it needs a rework (but do it right this time)
@@nightwish1453 I dont think the practice of adoption or time traveling babies existing nullifies surrogacy nor other methods it could have happened tho.
@@popskar I know they just really push that as the status quo in-game. honestly it could have just been me and just never thought about it because the games rarely viewed magic as something beyond healing and damage
I remember one of the supports in awakening, I think Miriel and Henry, they actually talk about the idea of creating babies with magic. Who's to say that the magic already didn't exist somewhere in some limited form?
"If you're looking for pride... I have it." LOL
eggplant
If Ike is gay can I please pleas please have him as my lover I've been loving that man since forever omg
reach level 20and kill ashera then you can MABEY get a hug
THANK YOU FOR MAKING THIS
You just won a subscriber
I am a firm believer that Ike also liked EGGPLANT, but due to the times the games were released they really didn't wanna alienate whatever fanbase they had left (considering conservative Japan and US back then...and uh, now again?). Once Fire Emblem became a financial success, they felt more free to include whatever kinds of sexualities they want (looking at you, Three Houses of Bisexuals). Thanks for the video Cap'n!
I think it's just a really rushed out story tbh, a lot of elements from FE10 felt like in the middle of game development or in that state because there are numerous issues with the game and a lot more cut content equivalent an Obsidian game almost which is surprising. FE9 had quite a bit of cut content but that was in Dev for a while whereas FE10 easily doubled that. A lot of people critique the odd balancing of FE10 and Dawn Brigade chapters being really annoying or subpar on-top of their characterization.
Option 4: Ike had special fun time with a woman, but the child was raised by both Ike and Soren.
It isn't impossible for a gay person to have special fun time with a woman, especially if they need to carry on the family name. (Philippe I, Duke of Orléans comes to mind).
Not to mention Ike could also be bi... just because he's attracted to men (assuming he is) doesn't mean he can't be attracted to woman either...
🍆 Ike and Elinicia's relationship was invented by the localization team. In the original JP dialogue Ike and Elinicia were very professional relationship turned friendship with Elinicia all but admitting to Ike that she liked Geoffrey, which is why Ike pushes her to order him to save Geoffrey.
Wrong, even without localization, the scene with Begnion Senators was genuine and a sign of Ike breaking out of character over mistreatment over her. It was very stark and different compared to before and I feel like while his supports were a little different, they could still be more platonic or romantic depending. I don't think it's a canon ship (The only end I believe is Ike ventures off alone which feels like a bad contradiction to his character) but I think it does have some support just like SorenXIke even though that has a few holes like Titania's ending in RD contradicting Ike leaving because who becomes in command of Greil Mercs? Nothing is said on who becomes the actual leader. I've always read them as a bird in a cage type of story, because even in FE10 you see her breakdown by Leanne hating responsibility she has to do. She still accepted it but I still think she's more just trying to be a good person and because nobody else can do it until they discover Renning is alive. THEY HAD no Support in FE10, actually in unused content a lot of units didn't get supports they wanted to add in at A support for unique lines and scrapped one of them being Ike and Elincia we don't know the contents and it could've been platonic or it could've been romantic pairings. The game did have two years only.
@@nah4467 Yeah no, all of the "hints" were made up by the localization. In fact, something that the localization doesn't really emphasize is Ike's distaste for nobility and the fact that Ike is actually stressed out by his responsibilities. What you mistake for romance is actually respect. Highlighted by the fact that Ike and Elincia speak to one another like they do everyone else as both characters adjust their speech pattern depending on who they are speaking to. Also Path of Radiance does not exist in a bubble it has a canonical sequel that was planned during PoR's development that shows that the relationship is indeed and always was platonic. Any other interpretation is just wrong. This is actually highlighted by FEH of all things as vanilla Ike's lines come directly from his support with Elinicia. Elinicia's relationship with Geoffrey is in the same boat.
Fun fact, Ike has one canon A support and that's his support with Soren, as Ike's official profile from IS itself mentions events that only unlock if you had him and Soren A support across both games. So yeah Ike leaving Tellius with Soren is canon. And that profile was made after years after Awakening came out.
Elinicia's words have nothing to do with Ike. If the devs wanted it to be seen as romantic then they would have had interactions in the story itself, as RD had a habit of referencing PoR supports. But again the fact that they didn't, shows that the relationship was indeed platonic.
@@brightlight8852 Again, respect or not, it's uncanny for him lol as he has a distaste in general from the norm. I've seen some what they've translated officially and while not as THICK as Localization, it still does have a form of admiration and his disgust at nobles when Elincia went to Begnion doesn't change. I'm not treating it like it is canon but I do think there is something plausible there lol. I love it when people get crazy about headcanons even though I more just say it's a cute pairing but not canon at all lol. I challenge Soren because of Titania's ending and how it contradicts the ending of Ike leaving as she remained 2nd in charge of the Mercs...ok then...who's the leader then? Ike just left and never to return and who is there to take charge then? I always read all japanese versions of things and there is evidence of Soren and Ike but it's not factual lol, it's if anything double meaning or implied at most not really canon unless the game got a proper sequel. Also they did scrap a lot of supports and you know what is also a so called canon ending? Aran and Laura and look how well developed that support really was. I'm just saying supports and endings were an afterthought compared to FE9. Also Localization bad is such a dumb take when they had a better reason for BK and even added a few funny details or lines. Idm people who do ship them but Ike and Elincia is a good relationship even if not canon because imo FE10 canon end is just he yeets off somewhere...alone. FE10 has no real canonical end in terms of support though, art book or not because it had a rushed deadline but there was a support that was thrown out along MANY others which was originally planned which I would've like to see, one being Elincia and Ike but don't try to tell me Soren's end is canon. It's a theory* but not a fact. Imo I always saw it as telling a story more so but I would like to see a restoration of what they wanted to add or Kotor 2 because it really does turn everything on its head if you did. Or how about we dismiss those counterpoints because Priam is the only argument you can tackle? He is stressed out from dealing with it but I always felt like he doesn't like or is also upset Elincia has to do deal with it, which we do see in FE10 as she melted down by Leanne. We also see that it takes a while for him to leave nobility behind but I feel like Elincia was always an exception.
@@brightlight8852 Also I know FE9 had a sequel lol I have played and went through it plenty of times, but don't try to tell me the sequels story and writing was a masterpiece, it has a mess of plotholes and contradictions that line up to rough pacing due to the RUSHED nature of the games devs time window. FE9 was already a big game but FE10 was even bigger and that doesn't mean always better. Gameplay is amazing but the story was besides a few moments were not executed well, Blood contracts were poorly explained, supports were rushed and felt very jank for endings equivalent to FE7 writing which has numerous plot holes and issues, and hey a ship similar to Ike which is RavenXLucius. My point is, I like good writing and I feel like the ships from FE9 worked and should be moved over to FE10 regardless but they weren't because they ended up ditching it all besides stuff that were important to the story. Ephraim I mean Geoffrey imo was always more brotherly protective and a Milk sibling literally, so seeing that along with Micaiah and Sothe feels very odd imo. Ranulf has duties to being an advisor to Gallia's future king Skrimir to him being canon is questionable. And Soren I just more see as brotherly, but again I get why people say it and the evidence to support it. It's not like I haven't seen the points and go NOPE, NOPE, NADDA, PRIAM lol. I just think slapping CANON on his pairings from FE10 is where I draw a line because it's verrrrry debatable as most people concluded than you think. Also it's not as if the localization did willy nilly shit, they worked very much with the Japanese translators as well. www.nintendoworldreport.com/interview/2266/fire-emblem-path-of-radiance-interview. WITH THAT Said, your point that they do leaner hard than JP is true kind of in some areas but his whole outbursts, and even not using her proper title shows how he was reallly pissed off on both versions over Elincia and he still demands that they apologize to her.
@@nah4467 Actually, localization bad is an accurate take. It gets a lot wrong and made a lot of pointless changes, literally even altering the personalities of characters for no reason. Ike is impulsive a fact that the localization tried to downplay. His reaction to the senators came from a combination of them just being dicks, his stress, the fact that he already hates nobles, and the fact that he's impulsive, it was far from being ooc. As for Ike's stress is you really know about the jp script then you'd know that the sign of Ike being stressed out is him furrowing his eyebrows. Which his expressions do show, so it acts as a visual cue for the player, and what's constantly commented about in RD. You can say like one thing where it's change actually worked and that's the Black Knight bit. But really it's just that one thing, it doesn't erase all the areas where the localization messed up. Heck they didn't even localize the full script for RD.
Again no its a fact that Ike's A support event with Soren is mentioned in both of their profiles. So yeah calling it canon is accurate because it's the only Ike support that gets acknowledged. Ike's other supports did not get the same treatment. Not that changes the fact that Ike leaves Tellius anyway. RD doesn't really change anything of our understanding of the characters merely it's a continuation of the story. The only reason why it feels like a 360 because the localization made so many pointless changes, which made issues because it created confusion in the long run. As for Tatiana's ending she probably leads them now, or maybe even Mist.
Because, there really aren't any counter arguments that actually relies on official material, just fan theories and headcanon. Which I'm not taking into account. For instance you bringing up Elinicia's talk with Leanne about being queen and insisting that that had something to do with Ike is factually wrong. Because in that same conversation Elincia overcomes it.
Also I never said anything about the QUALITY of RD merely that it exists and is a continuation of PoR and that PoR was made with RD in mind so any theory made with just PoR that ignores what's shown in RD is automatically wrong. I also never said anything about Ike and Soren being romantic, merely that their A support is canon. Not all headcanon valid, if it goes against something stated in either game then it's invalid. In fact calling it headcanon is damning it with false praise. Rather its just a disproven theory.
I believe in commending people when they actually do a good job. I don't believe in participation trophies and refuse to kiss their assess when they make mistakes or do a bad job. Because that's exactly what they are doing, job that they are being paid for.
Priam is stated in in game dialog that comes from another world.
Ike give'n Palu flowers, Smash cannon.
Eggplant and hard agree on everything you said. I've been team "Priam is Mist's decendant" personally since Awakening came out but explination 3 reallly is the most likely story.
Here's hoping we one day get a remaster of these games so the next generation can experience them.
People tend to forget in the early 2000s homosexuality was still taboo, even when we started to talk more openly about the matter and wanting rights for them and other sexual and gender identities.
That's explains why Ike's sexual orientation was left vague since not only writers thought it would scared players (yes, homophobia was (and still is) an ingraine thing in pop culture, videogames wheren't an exception) but because when we think "gay" many would write based on stereotypes rather than bother to make a proper character. And also censorship was more heavier on this topic, even changing the gender of a couple of Animal Crossing characters because they thought parents in the West might complain about the inclusion of "queer" looking characters. At least nowadays we are trying to move on and add more inclusion.
11:45 Wait, didn't Ike had a sister? So even if Priam is not a descendant of Ike he might be still related with him. Still doesn't prove Ike is heterosexual.
PS: Funny how most folks would rather accept Ike being gay rather than open the possibility he might be bisexual. I guess is because that means he would hook up a lot or even cheat his partner or spouse, when ingame it seems he is not really into relationships.
But hey, maybe he got drunk one day...
I always kinda assumed Ike was Ace and possibly Aro. I definitely don’t think he’s into women, but even with the men he’s close to, it always felt more like a relationship closer than friends but not romantic. Like AroAce domestic partners or something
Theres a lot of funny easter eggs/call backs in Awakening that, if taken at full face-value canon, absolutely demolish any sort of idea story coherency between games.
Especially with the Jugdral references in Awakening. We know that Jugdral and Valentia/Archanea (and thus Ylisse) exist in the same world, with Jugdral being on a different continent that was ~1000 years ahead of the others. Loptyr, later followed by Naga and the other divine dragons, come to Jugdral and cause the plot of FE4/FE5 before fucking off back to Archanea. Makes sense, related but separate continents with light story ties. Yet somehow the **SUPER IMPORTANT** Holy Weapons of Jugdral just end up in Awakening because... they just do. This and also the map used in Paralogue 2 "The Secret Seller" of Awakening is a copy of part of Genealogy of the Holy Wars Chapter 4 "Dance in the Sky" which would make 0 sense cause theyre separate continents.
These little callbacks in Awakening are all fine as long as you see them as little fun easter eggs for players but if you take them as canon it falls apart reallll fast and Priam is no different.
The Japanese version also implies Chrom is not only a decedent of Marth, but also Sigured.
You might not like it but that's because FE Awakening pulls a lot of shit from its ass and how Tiki is part of that universe. You don't have to like it but Priam is a character you can't just write off now. Outrealm was a horrible idea that should've never happened but they wanted to celebrate and go out with a bang with a dating sim and it worked
@@nah4467 I will agree that Outrealm is a huge idea but I will also agree that Priam exists and therefore like it or not, Ike had some "relations" with a woman
@@shupasopni how
Lifis is the (according to the novel of Thracia 776) thief that created Archenea, how is it possible that Chrom is Sigurd's descendant????
@@AzumarillConGafasBv Idk man. I just remember that apparently a bit of Japanese dialogue implies Chrom is Sigurd's decedent.
This was years ago I heard this, but something abt someone (Tiki? I think? Naga?) saying he is decedent of/looks like another lord from long ago, and the amount of years was too long to be either Marth or the Exalt, and was the right amount of time for Sigurd or Selith.
For the record I never finished FE4 or 5 so I don't even know what you are talking about I just know I heard about this a long time ago now, I think on Serenes. Take what you will from that. Grain of salt and all that I guess.
9:48 AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNND It can easily be disproven when you consider Priam could be descended from Ike thanks to his sister Mist
AAAAAAAANNND that idea can easily be disproven when you consider Mist's dominant gene for hair color would be brown and not blue
@YuuyaKZMI ppl dont even have blue hair irl how would you know that
And please dont respond saying "ugh im done arguing" bcuz if so you shouldntve spam replyed to ever fucking comment on the video
After watching the original video, the one with robin's "Eggplant" on the thumbnail, I looked it up, got no results, and was thoroughly confused for the rest of the day. nice to get a follow up. Also cool to see cap's studio through his visor.
Ya know I’m always confused why people always assume Priam is Ike’s direct descendant when Mist and Boey clearly got hitched up and had descendants of their own.
But why would mist's descendant have ragnell?
Mist's dominant gene for hair color is brown, not blue
Elena's hair color is a recessive gene, therefore wouldn't be passed down
Mist and BOEY from FE2 YOOOO. Jk but I can see that, or adoption or whatever but we'll never know and it was rough fanservice to say the least on how shoe horned it was, last minute.
@@YuuyaKZMI Huh, kind of a good point too tbf.
@@YuuyaKZMI First, how do you know blue is recessive? You're literally just making that up, real life blue hair doesn't exist so there's no real world presendent for that arguement nor are there enough relatives in Ike's family tree to infer it from the game. Second, that's not how genetics works, if brown is dominant, Mist would still be carrying recessive blue (she has to because her mother would have had to pass it to her) and Mist can therefore easily pass it down her line where it may re-emerge in future descendants, not that I think the developers would have thought about it at all.
My headcanon is that Priam is actually Mist's descendant, not Ike's. People kind of forget Ike has a sister.
People have their shipping and theories, honestly knowing IS. they'd probably compromise and do Ike bisexual which tbh wouldn't be the worst thing. Hell bisexual with a pref is whatever too but I feel it's just the case that even if you're not gay, you'll have wallpaper of the beast himself somewhere
Mist has to be adopted.
No way a girl inherits strength that low from that father
@@1stCallipostle This is the hot take I'm here for, thank you!
One small counter to one point. Sanaki basically gifted ragnell to Ike when he became the general of all the armies again. She basically said that the sword has a special connection to him. Ike most likely took the sword since it would be even more unlikely that Begnion would give away ragnell.
Nah, you forget it was a "Down payment" as in it's his now. Ike has Ragnell and there's no way around it. But Priam is fanservice af but how else do you look at him disappearing never to be seen again there? It sucks but no doubt he did Outrealm, outrealm was a horrible idea ever since Awakening on time travel but we're stuck with what we got.
On a dumb or shitpost joke though, literally means any character has a counterpart variant that can be anything from straight, bisexual, gay, lesbian, asexual...so ship what you want in the end...just don't get carried away on *Canon* on ships because it's stupid in the end.
Its important when discussing representation made by big companies like Nintendo that compromise is a big factor, age ratings are very important to Nintendo and in countrys like russia just having a gay character would get the game rated obsurdly high (thats what happened to the tomodachi life sequel) so if the game’s creators do want to explore themes like that which they often do with fire emblem. Even if they want be more explicit about it they cant just write in the text that he IS gay. Obviously its not an ideal situation but good art often comes from limitations and I actually like it more that ike is only subtly implied to be gay and never stated outright wether they would have or not if they were able to.
You knowledge about this game series is honestly admirable.
I'm glad Ike enjoys him some eggplant. Bedsides It's nice to have a not super flamboyant gay guy in games.
"wait...people beleave Ike is straight? i thought it was a joke"
when people say nanhhh he isnt gay (shutting down every woman who flirts with him)
Honestly a fucking amazing analysis and reminds me of eggplant.
Ikr same
🍆, I've been telling my bf about Ike and how he should give the tellius games a shot (thanks dolphin). I can't say it's canon, but anyone who reads Ike as being straight is kind of covering their eyes and ears. I'd say he could be read as ace too, but Soren? The evidence is a lot stronger on his end, though I wouldn't call it entirely one sided either.
lol this is awful reasoning
Priam shares way too much of Ike's character and the addition of Ragnell outright tosses any "coincidence" fallacy out the window
@@YuuyaKZMI I don't see where my reasoning is awful for *reads back comment* a character being implied to be not straight. Where did I mention Priam? Personality isn't entirely genetic. Also, what's stopping Ike and Soren from getting a surrogate?
@@marimecham "but anyone who reads Ike as being straight is kind of covering their eyes and ears."
this is why I bring up Priam
I actually enjoy your surrogate argument more than the others, that's quite valid. Though it kind of more attempts to prove the possibility of him being bi over gay, which I don't believe is a problematic view either.
@@YuuyaKZMI I could see him as bi, which (not to be rude) is not straight. It's moreso that anyone would have to provide more evidence for Ike being straight than any other sexual preference (bi, gay, asexual). I'm not too attached to Priam, mainly because I haven't played awakening but yeah, a surrogate isn't too far fetched.
@@marimecham Yes, it is not. But trying to dispute Priam to force a sexuality is not the greatest thing to do.
Instead perhaps we should take this compromise or drop it and I'll just go.
priam is descendent of ike with Sothe, micaiah said herself.
Eggplant! I never heard anyone saying Ike was gay but now that I heard it, I'll stand by that assumption with all of my heart.
Priam shares a bunch of traits (same blue hair, same blue eyes, same starting class, same skill albeit split up) and also, Ragnell, which all of thiscan't be written off as coincidence
have fun standing by that assumption now
@@YuuyaKZMI I'll have, thank you very much for your imput that has already been discussed in the video.
@@willgpb_ I didn't watch all of it cause it mainly just feels like salt; hence my argument.
And I don't see how it'd be able to be disputed either way.
@@YuuyaKZMI than watch the freaking video. He makes great points.
You know what. The man as a point. Eggplant.
Fantastic video. Gave me a good laugh. Found myself here through UA-cam suggestions.
I don't normally comment, especially since I'm wary of my English and getting my words confused, but I wanted to comment on a couple of things. Apologies for any misunderstandings.
I want to point out that some things are lost in translation. For example, the Ike and Elincia ship tease was only in the localisation version, but they gave up in the second game as Geoffrey was Elincia's only marriage choice.
Another thing is Priam in the Japanese version of Awakening reveals that he's not a direct descendant. Something like a descendant "in a way", similar to Marth not being a direct descendant of Anri because Anri never had kids. That's why I don't see the Priam counter-argument from others as something really important to consider. I also liked the way you presented that part in the video. Gay people can still have kids one way or another.
Overall, Ike is one of my favourite FE characters, not because he's gay but because I like the way he's written, especially when compared to the other lords.
Gay Ike is best Ike. I love his paired endings with Soren. I guess I gotta go read up on the Ike/Ralnuf supports because Ike having a paired ending with him was news to me. (My fault for only playing the game once I guess)
I forgot to mention, your discussion of eggplants was entertaining.
Great video and as an FE fan, love all the subtle things that show the extensive FE knowledge. Ike getting or giving that eggplant. Though I do like the ships of him with Elincia and Mia.
Fantastic video. I’ll also add that Intelligent Systems has also made queer characters in other games, such as Vivian in Paper Mario the Thousand Year Door.
Id also like to state. Jist because they're gay doesn't mean they have each other inside one another. Ike nor Soren or Ranulf show any signs of wanting to bone. Only that they enjoy being close to one another. Relationships can be based on feelings alone not just sexual
You really think a game from 2007 would hint at gay sex? Thats the most they could do. I mean not even Three Houses gave hints towards gay sex, just that they wanted to marry and be together (but the sex is implied being married and such)
He's still my favourite character so I don't care about if he's gay or bi
I'd say bi is fair or player choice
You had me until the Genealogy slander.
That game needs an autobattle so I can start the chapter, go do my laundry, then come back when my units have actually reached the enemy haha
Based
Eggplant. Also even when I played both games as a kid I felt it was clear that Soren had a crush on Ike, and that Ike was not mad about it. Also that Ike clearly did not like any of the girls that hit on him so often. So...even as a kid the subtext was evident enough.
I wonder if Ike's world had eggplants as plants 🤔
y'know that's actually the real question we should be asking here
Your words wound me with the genealogy remake. i must stay strong
eggs and plants.... im really happy you posted a video like this! im a huge fan of the stuff you put out, i feel like seeing a gaming channel cover topics like this is hard for me to find, and on top of that your jokes are funny!!! i appreciate you going more indepth about this a lot.... also, sylvando supremacy (>__>)b
Great analysis lol. I also thought Raven and Lucius' relationship from FE7 kind of mirrored Ike and Soren so he's not the only (potentially) non-stereotypical gay man from the series
As someone who's asexual myself, I have always head cannoned Ike as being somewhere on the ace-spectrum. There arent many other main characters in the Fire Emblem games who give me more ace-vibes than Ike does.
Him being at least fruity is the very least that can be said about his romantic interactions and that's a hill that I'm willing to die on
I've always said Ike's either Ace or Gay, CERTAINLY not straight.
aww, i'm glad for Ike eggplant, maybe i should try playing radiant dawn again
So if I summarize correctly, there is no direct evidence of Ike being gay, but there is one, albeit weak, for the opposite ? Sorry fam I think its pretty clear, I guess its interesting as an example of people unconsciously projecting part of their own identity on characters when there is a blank spot. eggplant.
eggplants are back in season, lets get this back on peoples feed too
10:19 i have a feeling that you were lying when you said that there's a fire emblem character named walmart, but instead of factchecking it, im going to assume you were absolutely telling the truth and that walmart is absolutely, unambiguously the name of this guy.
That Video was cool. Btw nice Eggplant
Reminds me of that time back in like the late 2000s/early 10s when a bunch of ppl shipped him w Marth. And meta knight was there
This made my day.
This isn't even the first "explicit" gay character, in fe7 raven and Lucius get married and start an orphanage
And depending on how much you trust the fan translation, Marty in FE5 was "the man Dagdar loved."
which is a little gay.
@@maagic2031 Doesn't also one translation of Thracia made Homer said something like "today I'm not in the mood for a man"
Bro we knew this you seen how Ike handles that bigass sword?! cmon now.
in the mobile game, if you get Soren he straight up asks if Ike is there
sus
Soren was one of his closest friends and his main strategist.
That question means basically "he wants to know if Ike is there" and nothing else.
Counterpoint Elincia ascended says maybe she should train with lord Ike and even comments in a teasing way that even she can't quite understand him lol...Both of them are just close and you can do whatever you want with it lol. Hell Ascended Ike says Mist and Soren won't leave him in peace which was a line in the JP version which confused EN people lol.
I screamed when ya suggested mpreg, good editing right there. Peak comedy.
this is kinda off topic but i didnt know that in the english version f!byleth and edelgard dont marry each other? i played the italian version and it explicitly says that they get married
Tellius Recollection the official data book confirms his paired ending with Soren is romantic, in fact it pisses off some fans so bad intelligent systems got death threats
never laughed so hard at the backstories of the fire emblem games and most of the characters XD im dying this is fucking great
11:33 Priam could also be adopted, that would explain the lack of Ike's skill
If I don't recall incorrectly from your Q&A video, you're not a gay or bisexual person; which is why it really makes me happy when you talk about these things in defense, despite it mostly likely not being a hindrance for you. Whether it be your lgbt supportive Twitter posts or videos like this, it is very inspiring.
I am not black, and I've never been racist, but I didn't use to care THAT much about race in media. But seeing your videos about issues concerning my communities, it's inspired me and made me realize that oppressed groups of people can and should stay together and support each other; and now, I care a lot about race representation in media, and about racism in general.
After XCX had a black female protagonist with a plot centered around immigration and overcoming xenophobia, it is an absolute disappointment and an embarrassment that Xenoblade 2 only had one main black character, that also died a few hours later.
Eggplant
12:15 That joke was timeless. Subcribed now