The BEST Metal Casting Alloy That Everyone Ignores
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- Опубліковано 23 бер 2023
- Everything you need to know about casting zamak (zinc alloy) at home. Almost. Hey this is youtube, don't count on finding all the answers here. Crack a book, maybe.
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Historical note for the bronze spear, the lines were likely not cast in, but instead cold worked in to provide edge retention.
Good point, I know the edges were hammered but I hadn't considered those ridges were hammered in. Makes sense though
or a combo of both? once a rough shape was made? and then economic work hardening needed
Work hardened. ;)
I always wondered how they sharpened it.
@@edi9892 with rocks or wood with powdered stone slurries
Alot of the bad press about zamak alloys comes from the fact that companies realize it's strength and fluidity, so they cast stuff out of it that is extremely thin to the point that it almost becomes brittle, so in use, it ends up breaking and the bad press comes from that. I said to leave it in the sand a little longer because most people tend to think it chills instantly, but doing thicker parts, it tends to stay fluid for quite a while unlike aluminum and feeds from risers/feeders, and if you opened it with a larger part, you may end up with a casting that isnt fully solid and things may just break off into a crumbly mess or at best, just warp. With the half nuts I poured in ZA12 for my lathe, it took close to an hour to cool down, but I had poured it into a hot investment mold too (which you will get a better finish from a cool mold). Some people just get excited and cant help themselves from just opening the mold right away after pouring instead letting it sit and fully solidify, lol. Gingery lathe bed is a good one of those examples, you want at least an hour or two for that casting to solidify or it will really warp badly.
That's a good point, some zamak stuff is crazy thin. Almost to the point i would think it's formed from sheet, but then you can see mold lines. The lathe bed will probably sit overnight, just in case. I usually get too excited and open a mold too soon lol often you can see i'm moving the casting around in my hands, thats because i'm getting burned lol
@@PaulsGarage lol, yea, the longer the bed has to set in the mold, the slower the part cools down and it relaxes alot of the stresses that's built up from casting and the cooling/shrinking, so the slower it can cool, the less it will move once it's cast and machined up.
Also, as I said on the discord, I would make sure to get that stuff machined up somewhere instead of trying to file it to shape, it is some very slippery stuff and is fairly hard, so you will not be having much luck trying to file it perfectly flat.
Yeah its weird how it solidifies; it can have this seemingly solid appearance but then crumble anyway. I suppose you first get a bulk of grains solidifying out of the melt, but the remaining grain boundaries staying liquid far longer; or something to that effect.
Also, yeah ive ran into its brittleness limits before; it definitely is not bronze in that regard, and I dont have high hopes how a spear point would hold up if youd start whacking things with it; but for parts with a little beef to them it really is an excellent material.
It's not "bad press", it's just a bad product. If you're making anything more than a monopoly player piece or cheap temporary display-only replica it's going to be fragile garbage, and even then it's still a bad choice since zinc rot will destroy it eventually. Pretty much anywhere you'd use Chinesium you're better off using a decent plastic.
Also worth checking out EZAC (a newer Zinc Alloy of 88% Zinc, 5% Copper, 7% Al - Melts at 412c and Cast between 425-455). Harder than Zamak 12 with much better creep resistance.
probably a dumb question but I was wondering if EZAC or ZA 12 can be worked as in heated, hammered and shaped or will it just crack like cast iron?
@@user-ly6vk6cx1h An other zinc alloy is made for that : Kayem
be careful with the amount of parting dust you put on with that if its reproducing that kind of detail from the sand grains. I had an issue with some super fine petrobond that I made for high quality finishes and it was reproducing the parting dust in my final castings, when I blew most of it off before casting the sandy texture was gone and I got WAY better surface finish. took me a long time to figure that out...
Interesting! I hadn't considered that but it makes sense
I noticed the same in some of my earlier castings, I now put the talc in a cloth bag and shake out a very fine even layer, way better than shaking the bottle.
I agree. Fine facing material gives a fine finish. I used to use a cloth dusting bag and then a light brush to smooth any "bumps". But use a very fine brush as the Zamac will show the brush marks!
@@dpeter6396 I recommend Squirrel hair mop brushes. I use them for gilding in my job, didn't take me long to figure out they were quite good for casting as well. Only down side though is they can get quite pricey.
UA-cam suggested me one of your videos for some reason, and I couldn't be happier. I do exactly 0 metalworking, but your enthusiasm and animated style of presenting are absolutely infectious. Looking forward to videos of your future projects!
Thank you very much! Metal work is fun, but i think sometimes it's more fun to WATCH because you don't get burned haha! Besides, this video was fun to do and all, but for every minute or 2 of finished video there's half an hour of cleanup!
Uh, in metalworking NOTHING is exact. So if you say you do exactly zero metalworking, just using the word ‘metalworking’ places the amount to exactly just above zero. This has been a zero content comment. Never happened.
@Lauri Lahr Same!
@@PaulsGarage interesting that your post popped up on me.. I used to make lead cast soldiers etc in the late 60s-70s when I was young.. & being retired have thought about it again.. just thought though.. how the hell UA-cam did this.. you've got me inspired again.. funny how we go back to our youth when we're old.. life inverted 😷🤧🤔.. try plaster casting.. hot molds to the touch to avoid cracking.. can take days to dry & bake though.. also try sieving plaster powder over wax patterns & slow steaming to avoid premature melting, to set rather than water.. almost crack proof I suppose it vents ok.
Zinc alloys in general are super easy to cast, certain alloys have zero shrinkage, and they take details excellently. At one factory we used a lot (LOT) of zinc castings for anything that had to be more wear resistant than plastic, relatively precise as-cast, and didn't have to be particularly strong. It was possible with investment casting to get this stuff within +- .003" dimensionally, which is better than most students in their first year of machinist school. For light duty parts this stuff is great.
Wow that's crazy, .003? I gotta get better at investment casting lol
@@PaulsGarage The key word is "possible", we had a few dozen different parts that were investment cast (wax method, specifically) and as we went along, we got better and better at it. Repetition and consistency were the most important: the same toolmaker made the investment molds out of the same alloy every time, found out and used the same wax as the foundry when we did our test investments, we chose a very common alloy to cast with so that we didn't have to give the foundry a backup option, etc.
My lathe uses Zamak for the change gears. While they do wear faster than steel gears the original set is still going strong since being cast in 1953.
Good to know! The gingery projects eventually Include lathe gears after the mill project, looks like I'll just stick with this metal
@@PaulsGarage don't disregard pewter alloys. I made a sear for a paintball marker with Prince August's 5 Star metal (94.5% Tin / 3% Zinc / 2.5% Antimony). It has to withstand 1200 psi of pressure on a 2 millimeters thick protrusion (it's the sear of the milsig m17).
Theoretically, depending on the alloys used, pewter can have tensile strengths ranging from 6000 to 8600 psi. Perfect for gears, even when torque is involved. After all, the cheapest air compressors are also made of pewter, which is a proof of reliability.
So far, mine resisted the repeating impacts of a badly designed marker like a pro; the sear must withstand all the pressure of compressed air and it's a single lever system which requires an extreme effort when pressing the trigger, which are all stresses that, according to popular beliefs, should have bent and deformed my part, which did not happen, even after some thousand shots.
If love to use pewter for stuff, the super low melting point is really tempting for silicone molds and stuff. The only problem is the $40 per pound price vs. $20 for 4 pounds. Someday I'll check it out
Hi Paul, Great video! I share your enthusiasm for what you call zamak, and what we brits call zl12 (88% zinc, 12% aluminium). I buy mine from Artisan foundry supplies in Liverpool, where the Beatles come from. I used to fine sieve my green sand and ram extra hard. The surface finish was amazing. I am hoping to try an oil bound sand some time soon, and also an epoxy resin bound sand. Myfordboy uses zl12 a lot, especially for flywheels as it isn't much lighter than cast iron, almost double the weight of aluminium. Lee
Interesting! Myfordboy does some good work, I love his channel
Been casting bullets with Zamak alloys off and on for about 30 years.
They offer some specific advantages over lead alloys having lighter weight that allows them to be driven faster but having much less overall range which can bea great benefit.
Folks need to learn the properties of the different Zamak alloys and proper fluxing but it's worth the effort.
Hi Samuel, What do you mean by "much less overall range"? I was thinking about using this for bullets as well, especially round ball and conicals for black powder guns including flint lock muskets and cap and ball pistols. . Can you give me some pointers from your experience? Thanks
@@hazcat640 Less range because, as a less-dense material than lead, the sectional density of the projectile is lower and thus air resistance slows it down much faster.
@@Directrix_Gazer Thank you
This makes me think of the 7.92x41 the spanish toyed with ( which was ultimately killed by the mediocre 7.62 nato ) in the 50's.
@@hazcat640 Use in black power guns is not a good idea.
Zinc alloy bullets are too hard for muzzle loader use.
In a cap and ball revolver, you would likely break your rammer, or spring the base pin on a Colt pattern revolver.
I have been a fan of zinc alloys for more many years. All my zinc is scrap. And as you rightly said, it is used in so many things. Zinc's lower melting temperature is one of the main reasons it is used for die casting. Because of the high density the head height does push the zinc more int the sand and picks up more grain. So use a shallower mold if possible.
Buying commercial zinc alloys is preferred. ZA-8 and ZA-12. The problem is that a lot people would rather melt free cans rather pay a few dollars for good casting metal. I do collect free metal to melt but I am pretty selective. Stuff that is less desirable I sell to scrap yards.
yeah free cans will take all of your money back in wasted time, wasted fuel, and bad castings. But some people can't see past that. This za-12 stuff is definitely nice though.
My father was an aerospace engineer in Los Angeles starting around 1950. One of his first jobs was with a company that made specialty metal castings for commercial purposes. This job made him VERY popular with Hollywood's starlet-wannabes. All he has to do was give them his business card with the company name on it -- Commercial Casting -- and he was in like Flynn.
Haha that's hilarious
😂 that's very funny! Where did your dad work? My grandpa worked for NASA/TRW as a computer programmer in the early 60s. He played a big roll in programing the lunar module Eagle. All of the auto pilot, landing, and returning to the orbiting rocket module. I realize there were thousands of people working on the Apollo program, but being in the LA area, your dad and him might have crossed paths? Who knows!
Zamak was used for making change gears for atlas/craftsman lathes, so it is a fairly durable metal.
Durable and supposedly a bearing alloy too, which is pretty cool
can confirm cast zamak gears work great, and are pretty quiet.
Thanks for the video! I'm glad that you shared a supplier. Old Craftsman lathes used zamak change gears, and the surface finish is precise.
i've heard about zamak gears, didn't know about it on lathes. Zamak is a bearing material, would probably make great gears and cheaper to make than bronze ones
I had an Atlas Craftsman lathe and that's how I learned about Zamak.
Lots of stuff besides the gears were cast with Zamak.
When designing, ive a thought to galvanic corrosion if the zamak will be in contact with other metals in humid air or water.
Zamak gears would be great to replace the plastic large gears on entry level machines
Great stuff. One of the qualities that has made it unpopular is that designers use it as one of the go to materials for planned obsolescence. Since the zamak metals have predictable shrinkage they can for example, be used to make sure a fan will seize up after a predictable period of time. This is really good stuff, but it has been used in evil ways.
Thats interesting bud!
If it hasn't been melted down yet, it might be worth breaking it to see the whatever grain structure or whatever it forms internally. If it's going in the melt pile, that's a great excuse for all kinds of destructive testing.
zamak is actually pretty close to low grade mild steel in terms of tensile strenght, wich is pretty impressive for such a low melting point alloy
Yeah it's really cool stuff. Most stuff I make doens't need the high heat or increased strength of steel anyway, so this is just easier
"amak is actually pretty close to low grade mild steel in terms of tensile strenght"
... No.
it is closer to human hair than to construction steel (which is anything but strong).
Most zamak-alloys are sin the range of 250-330 MPa.
Human hair is 200-250, aluminium in the range of 300-500, and most forms of steel 500-1000.
@@ABaumstumpf bullshit, the most common construction steel in europe is S235, wich has a yield strength of... 235 MPa. It has 0.2% carbon and minor additions of elements. Zamak has a similar strength to steel, but its surface still is softer, about 60% that of mild steel, and about the same as copper
@@jeanladoire4141 "S235, wich has a yield strength of... 235 MPa."
Sorry but gotta disagree there. the 235 is NOT the tensile strength but Yield-strength - those are very different characteristics.
(Aside from "construction"-steel being literally the group containing the weakest forms of steel )
But lets just give the real numebrs, shall we?
Zamak - yield strength typical ~280, ranges from 220-360. Tensile-strength 270-330.
Human hair - ~150 yield, 200-250 tensile
And steel - how about some 1070 spring steel. Yieldstrength 500, tensile strength 640. yeah, nearly twice that of Zamak and Zamak is indeed closer to human hair than to most types of steel.
@@ABaumstumpf The problem with your entire argument is that Jean Ladoire's first statement SPECIFICALLY stated "low grade mild steel", not any of the other types of steel that you kept trying to compare it to.
You can get away with using high temperature silicone moulds (molds) for the lowest temperature Zamak alloys. The mould material does degrade but it's worth it for the fine detail you can get.
I've seen some people do that, it looks really interesting
If the mould is degrading I’d be very careful about fumes…
@@athannaelanderson3806 From silicone? Should be nearly inert.
@@Sgtassburgler Key emphasis on nearly, hardly any products on the market are pure silicone, most companies include filler for extra profit, also silicone is stable yes but at high temperatures it does break down and if you read the scientific papers on Google scholar about it, it typically isn’t something you want to inhale, especially with those fillers, in fact silicone cooking utensils can also break down and liquefy in foods and than be absorbed when eaten, wreaking havoc on your system. Silicone is a great product when not used with heat, any kind of heat and silicone should not come to mind. Everyone considers something safe until they can’t profit off of it or until enough idiots die. You want to make proper moulds like our ancestors did, you want fine details, learn how to make your own clay! I’ve been moulding with clay for years, you can make it nice and liquid and pour it to make moulds just like silicone…
I'm really glad your video caught my eye. I'm a tinsmith, and have been using Zamac mushroom plugs for years to fasten sheetmetal to masonry. I thought it was a lead alloy, but had no idea that the other component was zinc. When you started to describe where and how it is used in our world, a light bulb went off. Voila, "pot metal". This info will probably never help me at trade, but I'm glad I watched, nonetheless. I have an artist friend who casts bronze . Mostly lost wax, but some sand too. Zamac seems like a really easy, lower cost material to cast with.
5:55 my dad worked in the Canadian Coast Guard and was also a janitor before that, all around blue collar worker. Anyway he said it was well-known that any workers that breathed in zinc had to drink milk to help lessen effects of metal fume fever. It also happens probably more for welders who use zinc rods and no mask, so home or welding shops with no safety procedures.
Did some huge castings in Zamak 12 years ago, and discovered that when liquid it will dissolve aluminum. Much like gallium dissolves aluminum.
Shrinkage on BIG castings is insane. It will rip itself apart while cooling. You can cast long thin rods and use it as "miracle rod" the same soldering rod they sell at stores for hobby repairs.
Interesting! Didn't know that about big castings. Here in my test I thought the shrinkage didn't seem bad but I'm comparing it to the wrong alloy of aluminum, one with horrendous shrinkage haha
7:46 - I’d epoxy, a small neodymium magnet in the bottom of the Bit Well to make the bits hold again, then I would dip the handle part in some of that black handle coating. You can buy it at hardware stores or big home improvement centers. You’d have a great tool, then! Excellent video!
thats a great idea. I have a couple of the tiny magnets that fell out of some other screwdriver bits, i could just jam one in there with some epoxy. All fixed!
@@PaulsGarage Well hindsight being 20/20… neodymium magnets are really brittle, so you wouldn’t be able to put a whole Lotta pressure on it and definitely not hammer on it. It might be worth machining (or filing) a flat spot on the outside till you just break through to the inside, then just stick the magnet on the outside over the hole. Can you visualize what I’m talking about? You probably do, but I can send a drawing to your email if you like.
Good video, thank you. I learned about Zamak years ago from a retired machinist that rebuilt magnetos. Lots of old cast pot metal parts there that had deteriorated over time. He didn't do casting so he couldn't rebuild a housing. But it he could do miracles with replacing the corroded interior parts. And Zamak was his secret weapon. For the parting dust I've always used a bag made from a bit of a sock or similar material. Works great for applying a light dusting. You don't get the clumps like with a shake bottle :) It's been years since I've had my casting equipment set up. That's going to be job #1 when I retire in a couple years. At least the small jewelry equipment. Dunno about the blast furnace and such, it would take a fair chunk of time and money to get a safe setup for that equipment.
In Poland, due to low quality and brittleness of many parts made from alloys like that, we call it "gównolit" which means somehing like "s*itlyte" or just "s*it material" :D
Lol I believe it! Here we call it pot metal usually. Gotta get quality metal and don't screw up the casting or you have ruined junk
My guess it was not high quality Zamak 12. Like Paul said in the video, impurities like lead significantly lower the quality of the alloy.
@@PaulsGarage The term extends to other alloys too, usually bad castings and brittle parts that brake usually get that reputation. Also things hard/impossible to weld too.
Lead acetate was used to sweeten cheap wine. Acetate is vinegar acid (technically the conjugate base) so simply put elemental lead or lead oxide (white pigment) into vinegar then let the water fraction evaporate.
Hey Paul! Good to see you still making videos!
Oh yeah! I was on a slow down for a couple years, back at it now
This looks like it could be the metal of choice for your wood/metal hybrid art projects.
It would probably work way better, yeah. I was hoping to make bronze work, though lol i guess that's on hold until i forget how poorly the bronze test went and i try again haha
When you started to talk about zinc , the skit from the Simpsons about zinc popped into my head,. That's right Johnny it was made from zinc
Come back, zinc! Come Baaaaaaack!!! 😂
I can't hear anything about zinc without calling out for "zinc.... ZINC!"
"Zincpest" is due to traces of lead being present in the alloy. So if you are going to do Zinc alloy castings, make sure that your use material with a known source and composition. MTRs are highly recommended for these alloys.
This type of material is excellent for lost wax casting. Essentially make your part out of wax, dip it repeatedly in a plaster of paris slurry to build up the mold, add additional mold material to add strength, then bake in an oven to melt out the wax. The amount of surface details and finish is absolutely amazing.
lost pla is almost the same, but you can 3d print your part
I'm really enjoying this channel.
Already found some really useful advice here.
Thank you for this video! I've been looking for some casting alloys for replicas. That spear point looks amazing! The detail picked up is really nice.
Machines great too. Turned a vbelt pulley out of a simple puck of zamak I cast in an open faced sand mold. Melted zamak in a stainless pipe crucible over charcoal in about 10 mins setup to pour
"The Metal Fume Fever" is no joke and something I learned to be aware of real quick when alloying bronze From Copper/Zinc/Tin back in the day. Hated the zinc shakes, we used to call it "The Zinkies" was some weird stuff man......but that bronze was ohh so sweet. Nice to see someone else using petrobond; that and french sand is the good stuff. We would re-mull my old petrobond with non detergent 30 weight motor oil and it kept casting fine details for well over 15 years shooting flames and all.....Keep on melting.
The zinkies, eh? What a clever name for a terrible thing lol. I love bronze, but so far I have avoided brass. Tin bronze and aluminum bronze only, no brass, even though I have a bunch of it laying around
@@PaulsGarage I hear ya Paul, my Father was a classically trained bronze sculptor and started his own artisan bronze foundry fortunately I was drawn to it at a young age and became involved in the endeavor. Turned out he was a good teacher and I slowly over the years became a proficient at coreboxes and slowly became the master patternmaker and foundry floor foreman. I witnessed the industry standard evolve from black tuffy molds to silicone. Even the old school lost-wax chicken wire investment matured into the, now "modern" suspended colloidal ceramic slurry. Boy do we take the ease of a suspended colloidal ceramic slurry for granted these days! Back then it had to be constantly agitated and a VERY bad day ensued when you came in and learned the timer broke the night before on the investment agitator. If that stuff settled you were S.O.L. Stuck chipping it out for the next couple days! We did everything "in house" so to speak. From waxes, casting, alloying, machining, finishing, and even patina. TIG welding went by the name of heliarc back then.
I naturally became his engineer and he remained my eccentric artist professor. We made an unstoppable team. I learned so much from him and was extremely lucky to have had the opportunity to glean as much from him as I could back then. God rest his soul. He was truly "one of a kind". I didn't realize how lucky I was to work with him every day until he was gone. I miss him; "Father-son" arguments included! Ha!
Keep up the phenomenal work Paul. It's very reassuring to see someone like you using proper materials and technique. Consider this the highest compliment you could get from me. Considering all of the strange backyard videos that come up using "lost foam" these days it's good to see the real thing is still being done. I respect the traditional methods in which you get real results. Unfortunately much of this work is now a lost art these days and
Thank you for allowing me to reminisce in those countless fond memories I had; back when my Father and I were a team. I will cherish them till the day I die.
@@PaulsGarage I hear ya it's smart to start with what you know. Once you have experience under you belt and the circumstance arises; only then should one progress into the more complex/dangerous stuff that requires a solid knowledge and skill to deal with safely.
Silicon Tin and Alum Bronze are certainly workhorse alloys. In our foundry we dealt mostly with Silicon and Commercial Bronzes (Cu/Zn) for Artisan Sculptural applications and on occasion Naval Bronzes (Cu/Sn/Zn). Matter a fact I've got neat story you may appreciate. Many of the NDA contracts we had with the Groton Naval sub base here in CT required Manganese Bronze in the specs. The largest patterns and coreboxes we did for them were some of the most complex I've ever done. Lets just say they were very interesting "stealthy" bladed things and gun mounts that required it. Because of the security requirements, photos of these patterns do not exist. It was out of the question even having some locked away in a safe for posterity. Subsequently It was a rough thing having to destroy those beautiful patterns after the contract! Those memories and images only exist in my mind now.
That Manganese Bronze was insanely nasty stuff to cast and exponentially more complicated & dangerous. Gates with modified runners and risers; even cooling ribs throughout to reduce local hot spots, as it liked to be poured cool.
-B
Cast on Paul!
That's really interesting thanks for sharing! I've never tried manganese bronze, but I've seen some stuff made with it. Ship parts are pretty awesome for sure. The first time I saw a photo of a bronze ship propeller I was blown away when I realized it was surrounded by people and they looked so small! Its too bad some of that stuff is shoved underwater and we don't get to see it
And did you say Groton? I've been there a couple times. Last time was a visit to the mystic seaport when they were rebuilding that whaling ship. Did they ever get it finished?
I used it to cast the front plate for the lexoptical camera using a lost PLA process. It worked amazingly well and resulted in a stiff strong component which easily holds lenses true.
hmm if i read corret the melting point of zamak12 is around 380C the silocon molds hold up to 450C you could cast small series of items :)
Just made some custom keychains out of ZA-8 for my friends then did an oil finish on it. Great stuff.
Zamak castings can take a fine polish and be chrome plated. Someone I used to know had a business making Zamak castings via injection-moulding followed by hand-polishing and chrome-plating. His bread-and-butter business was making things like door handles and other fittings for car and motorbike restorers. He also made trophies for major awards and presentations.
That's pretty freaking cool. I haven't done any metal casting, more woodwork and some very amature blacksmithing, might have to try it out!
Cool I'll have to give this a try! I like how you made that screwdriver handle!
Thanks! and yes you should definitely try zamak, i'm really shocked how nice it is to cast. It flows so much nicer than aluminum, and its even easier to melt.
@@PaulsGaragethe reason your magnet died is the curie point (loss of magnetism) tends to be around 200°c if I'm not mistaken, so you'd need something with a really low melting point to cast a magnet in
Thank you for this. It's getting almost to casting weather here, now I have another thing to try!
Definitely give it a try! I'm shocked how nice it is to cast. I probably won't even bother with aluminum for a long while now.
I used to manage a crematory. I was able to watch very closely and ask a ton of questions during a week long shutdown. A manufacturer came in and rebuilt two different styles of machine in two different ways. I was able to see what materials and techniques showed better wear.
Great video. Makes me a little more eager to get into casting. Already have the the printer to do lost PLA, now I just need to build myself a foundry.
Go for it! and if you are interested in lost PLA you might want to catch the next video 😉
@@PaulsGarage Aaaaaand...Subscribed
I use Zamak a lot, and is great because of low temp melting point, but I found it can break under stress, so it is not convenient for moving parts or which take some load. On the other hand, it is perfect for casting jewerly or toys.
Also, don’t get zinc in your lead. I once ruined a pot of bullet metal by accidentally getting zinc into it. The entire melt suddenly looks like lumpy oatmeal. BTW if you’re thinking to salvage the lead from old large tamp-ins, it turns out the threaded wedge part is zamak, not steel.
Weird, it turns all lumpy? That's crazy
@@PaulsGarage even a little zinc in normal lead/tin/antimony bullet metal will do that. Maybe a metallurgist could explain it.
@@lanedexter6303 there's a trick to removing zink from lead, can't remember exactly what it is, might just be something like adding sulfur. The point is, the additive binds to the zink, not the lead, and leaves you with pure lead.
The trick should be on one of the old firearm forums, and probably WikiHow by now
@@torg2126 Thanks, that’s worth a search.👍
Zinc and lead hate each other.
Lead in your zinc leads to zinc pest.
Zamak, also know in the UK as ' Mazak', colloquially known as 'mystery metal' or 'monkey metal'.
Although I have never cast anything I have known about mazak for many years, thanks for making the connection, its a very good material when used within its boundaries.
looking forward to your casting adventures! always a joy haha
thank you!
Also worth noting... zinc if heated above around 900-1000F will release toxic fumes. glade you mentioned it. also... instead of turning down the furnace... just leave and cut the breaker outside....
UA-cam recommended this video to me after I watched a handful of knife forging videos. Imagine my shock when I didn't catch on this was a casting video and not a knife making video for several throughly confused moments of staring at the text on the thumbnail 😂 Despite all that, I really enjoyed the video!
Glad you enjoyed it either way! I did forge a knife once. It was awful 🤣🤣
I never heard about this alloy. Will try.
Lots of great info there! I’m ready for some lathe bed…
You and me both! well technically i'm not ready, i don't have enough sand to fill that massive flask 😂 I ordered more and it's on its way, though... sooooon (tm)
@@PaulsGarage I hadn’t even thought of that as an issue…
I'm interested in the ZA12 that you have so nicely advocated. I will buy some from Rotometals but I noticed they had a disclaimer: "We do not recommend machining zamak, as there will be many air pockets like swiss cheese." I haven't heard anyone else mention that in your comments below or other vids of yours or even on the Internet. Do you have a comment on it?
Love your videos! I'm just starting the Gingery projects in the big green book. I got it 12 years ago and built a charcoal furnace too, but then stopped. Now I'm back at it. So I've got you beat on dropping a project and getting back to it later :D
Thank you for this video! I learned a thing or two.
"Saturday night special" like the raven from the pheonix arms company usually made in .25acp like the jennings and Lorcin or the Jimenez, the list goes on and on these "ring of fire" pistol were predominantly made from this zic alloy. Thankyou George jennings!!!
I ended up with a metal casting furnace but didn't want to mess with aluminum cans, and bronze seemed a bit much for a beginner, I will definitely try zamak though.
Yeah I think zamak is a better starting point.
Great Video
Like you I have been wanting to make machine parts for a long time. Next best thing to cast iron and I don't care to go there. Great video. My plain bearing Atlas 10" is maybe from the 50s. Has lots of Zamic parts and it is fine.
interesting, you're the second person to mention zamak lathe parts, maybe it's a good idea after all! Cast iron is pretty awesome stuff, no denying that, but it's a beast to melt. The radiant heat alone made my welding gloves smoke from a couple feet away!
@@PaulsGarage Yup I decided to leave the cast iron to chirpy.
great info, tyvm
You should try ZA27! It's mechanical properties are comparable somewhat to that of steel!
I've heard that! I have a friend who has done a bit in ZA27 and he really likes it. I'll definitely take a look at that at some point. This ZA12 is going to become a Gingery Lathe, which is designed to use aluminum, so this is a significant step up
@@PaulsGarage
There are alloys if certain elements that totally break the stereotype of the element. The Aluminum Bronze specialist company AMPCO. Their first product the brought to market in the early 1900s was an alloy used for making cutting tools meant for machining steel.
@@mpetersen6 aluminum bronze is amazing stuff
Zamak was also used in a lot of "Saturday Night Special" pistols from the 60s to the early 2000s
Thy made revolvers from zamac which works great.
Super Video!👍
Hi point has been making handgun slides from this for years. They're not high quality or the most consistently reliable but if you get a good one they do work. They're a LOT more durable than I would expect from a handgun with a zinc alloy slide.
It's pretty durable stuff, I have real trouble breaking it with a hammer
@@PaulsGarage kinda crazy that it holds up to thousands of micro explosions and the wear of the internal parts.
Do you per chance use beeswax on your flap and grinder discs, with this stuff or Aluminum? If not, grab a puck or bar of the wax an run the disc or flap on it until it all coated. You won't have to worry about gumming up, but you do have to re-apply as needed. I learned this trick from a machine shop over 20 years ago.
I feel bad watching anyone cutting alu or anything cloggy and doesn't use wax, it makes the blade sing! Though I havn't used bees wax..
People wonder why I have old used candles (from wife; no scent, stick ones are the best) all around the band saws and the grinder/flaps. It's like drilling metals and using lube.
We use corn syrups because they do several orders of magnitude LESS damage directly to teeth when eaten.
Don't chew on lead metal, that makes sense
I use Kirksite for casting jigging fishing lures.
Awesome castings, it's 35% lighter than the original lure. Lighter lure makes the lures stay longer in shallower water column.
I saw many kirksite ingots at my old aluminum foundry in Akron but never saw it used for anything, however a couple of the fellows who raced inserted them in car frames to provide a lower center of gravity. They felt very heavy like lead.
i like the sandy texture so much more! it reminds me of what iron age people had to deal with!
I kinda like the sand cast texture too. maybe a full polish and then brushed finish would be cooler, but that's lots of work. The sand finish is straight out of the mold
Zamak is used to make the slides of Hi-Point pistols too.
New sub here … loved the video Paul!
Thank you! I appreciate it!
Please ALWAYS use a respirator when melting. Especially when, using Zinc or Brass!
With Brass yes, definitely, but you don't actually need it with Zinc-based alloys.
The issue with Brass is that it's melting temperature is very close to the boiling point of Zinc, so you're bound to get some vapourised Zinc, and if you overheat it (Really easy to do) you get disgusting amounts of zinc fumes thrust into your nose.
But that's because it's a copper-based alloy, and copper is a motherfucker to melt.
Zinc-based alloys have a far, FAR lower melting point, so in normal usage there's no chance it boils and it's a low enough temperature that the vapour pressure is negligible.
Before watching the video I looked up what Zamak was. It was supposed to be the first alloy made with high-purity zinc, so as to avoid the zinc pest.
That's interesting
awesome video !
You can remagnetize the bit. Is an easy thing to do and the DIY methods are easy to find online. It requires another magnet though and preferrable a strong one like neodymium. I think an electromagnet will work too if done right and has the potential to be much more effective.
I did some medals with Zamak 5 in sand, that's a reeaaaallly good stuff, it takes all details :-)
Thanks so much for doing the experiements! I've beedn curious about using Zinc for heavy metal hero props. If you weren't using a respirator, its possible you feel terrible because Zinc fumes are EXTREMELY bad for you.
I heard of this from Dave Gingery's _Build your own metal working machine shop from scrap_ series of books. An inexpensive alloy stronger than aluminium, that casts extremely well and that you melt in a pot on your your stove? Yes please!
Oh nice. I have some old laptop shells that are some sort of zinc/aluminum alloy, probably similar to this stuff. I'll take a stab at melting it down this summer.
We were taught in High School that Zamak 'melts only once'.
Low-temp for original casting; a much higher heat was required to re-melt and that 'ruins the alloy'.
It was their justification for not allowing students to work with it!
The Shop Manual compared the process of casting Zamak to mixing and curing polyester resin.
You get one shot to mold a part, can't reuse anything.
"If a Zamak part breaks, you must throw it away and buy a new one, impossible to fix."
You'd think they know better in 1972.
That was back when zinc Alloys were still full of lead maybe a good idea to throw it away then! I'll certainly try melting this stuff multiple times, see what happens.
@@PaulsGarage Best I can recall, Teacher said it was caused by precipitated iron crystals that formed while the metal cooled in the mold.
He said that re-melted Zamak would be loaded with 'iron sand'.
Didn't know about the Lead content!
Oh weird maybe that's why they specify this is such a low iron content?
It's crazy what they make out of this stuff, I have an entire lever action toggle link mechanism made of Zamak that has handled a lot of rough treatment.
hahaha oh man the Atlas Lathe guys are just gonna die watching this! I love it!. I cant wait to post this video on decade old forum posts.
Casting!! 🎉 Great explanation
Thanks 👍 and yeah definitely back on the molten metal train. The only problem being I ruined my foundry furnace and haven't fixed it yet (can still do low temp zamak, though) and despite fixing my heat treat/burnout oven/kiln, i managed to break it in a different way and i haven't fixed that yet either 😂😭
We would get super high-resolution of wooden carvings by making a silicone rubber mold off of the casting and then pouring a gypsum part in the mold. Then the zinc would be cast into the gypsum and the wood grain looked like the original part.
About the magnet. The melting point of the zinc is close enough to the currie temperature of the magnetdc material. That much heat will ruin magnets.
very nice alloy. My biggest rookie mistake was wasting my time with extruded scraps and never getting a good finish, even when trying degassing and vacuum casting. 2nd biggest mistake was mixing casting grade scraps with the extruded scraps 🤦
Atlas (Craftsman) lathes used Zamak for the gears and certain other parts to keep the price down. I guess that worked because there are a bunch of these machines floating around still. Having owned a couple of them I wished Atlas had used cast iron like practically every other machine maker in the world.
The original Gibson ABR-1 bridges & tailpieces were made using Zamak #5. Which isn't really manufactured anymore & hard to come by. That's one reason the newer Gibson ABR's & other companies "replicas" like gotoh, kluson, allparts etc. don't sound like the bridges from the late 1950's & early 1960's. The other reason is the saddles on the old abr-1 have a very blunt top with a much shallower pitch than any if the newly made "ABR-1" replicas.
7:48 Curie Point (or temperature) is where magnetized materials permanently lose their magnetism, think your molten zamac meets that.
I LOVE casing in zinc!
Hey Paul, just found your channel a couple days ago-- this is 2nd video I've watched. I've been watching an Aussie guy for a bit over a year now-- he does castings, too. Name is BigStackD. His vids are more like ASMR, he doesn't talk or show his face. Very interesting, though. You are probably already aware of the guy, but if not give it a look! Anyway, enjoyed the video and the very informative comments below! I sub'd just now and will be following along.
Dude, The Simon Leach mug!!!!! 👍👍👍👍
It's my favorite mug! Ever since I broke my last Simon Leach mug...
WHY IS LEAD SO GOOD Y.Y
I am working with pewter right now though zamak seems like a good stepping stone before I hit aluminum.
This reminds me of the Simpsons when they showed a film reel, "A World Without Zinc."
"COME BACK ZINC, COME BACK!"
I'm tempted to get into casting to try this, then again I'm waiting on my dad to buy himself a forge, mostly cus I want to do hobby level armouring
Pretty durn cool to get this scoop on a material I haven't tried before. Do you know if it's hot enough to do styro or pla burnout casting? Yeah man once my stupid-#$s overheated a 400lb crucible of brass and the zinc separated and ignited lol.
Had a gig welding galvanized steel for a bit. Even with a respirator and controlled breathing, there was low-grade ache and weakness everywhere.
The guy who took over only lasted four days before going to hospital. I have it on good authority that zinc poisoning really sucks.
Hey Paul,
According to the USPS tracking, the package of zinc ingots has arrived at your PO Box. These are cast from boat zincs, so they are lead-free otherwise they won't provide corrosion protection.
Let me know if you have any questions.
Cheers
Thank you! I'll go check it out tomorrow when they open
@@PaulsGarage you might want to film opening the box. I'm not sure how well it survived the trip. 😕
Zinc-pest is a problem related to there being not enough lead in the alloy. It was resolved around 1900, became a thing with war economy from 1935 on and then only resurfaced when lead was banned from alloys in the 1990ies.
I think you might have that backwards
That was the favorite casting alloy in my high school shop class.
awesome. subbed
The irony is that those of us who cast lead for bullets and sinkers hate getting zinc into our pots because it ruins the alloy and causes it not to fill properly.
Like the Farm and Barn 5 gallon bucket
Zamack can be very touchy. We had a welder (1) who also did Southwestern jewelry on the side. Somebody brought in an old ornament and asked if he could build up the breasts. Took him a week in his spare time but he got it done. The key was careful temperature control.
1) Specialized Tool Steel and Die welding.
Welding on zamak? I'm not sure if want to be around that much zinc fumes! But good that he got it done
@@PaulsGarage
Well, the welding fumes from a lot of tool steels aren't all that great. And this was pre-filtered helmets to my knowledge. Having retired as Tool Room machinist I can tell you that when machining alloy and tool steels dry you can smell it being cut.
Paul... your videos are pretty darned good. Where you getting the petribond? I was going to try making my own greensand ala ball mill and kitty kitty litter but you have me thinking maybe not? I dunno. Cant wait to see this lathe of yours doing lathey things.
I got petrobond on amazon, usually from PMC supplies' amazon page, same where I get my crucibles. amzn.to/3lJOxbN there's a link. If you end up going with home made greensand, don't bother milling kitty litter, just buy powdered bentonite from a pottery supplier. It's super cheap and already in powder form
Sounds useful for prototyping
Definitely. Cheap and stronger than something like printed plastic if you need to test with a load