Honestly I blame Dr Mike's influence on this, at least for myself. When I started at the gym i though "oh the weight doesn't matter, and even if I do try to go heavy It will still be the warmup of others so there's no point in me deviating form even an ounce. My Ego was attached to the form very much so and I'd tell myself 'well he may be lifting 4 times ur weight but like, look at the deep stretch and controlled paused eccentrics bro'." Nowadays we're seeing the pendulum shift again.
I think there's a possibility that both extremes are simultaneously right and there's a time and place for both. Heavy cheat lifts for explosive power and maximal overload of the eccentric (and perhaps what Boogz calls peaking the nervous system"), and cyborg yoga-with-weights to truly own a certain weight and create strenght in all ROMs. Until people realize this, the pendulum will continue to swing back and forth.
Agreed. It doesn’t help when they have videos of an IFBB pro doing barbell rows at 40kg but taking 6 days to lower the weight, acting like it’s the secret everyone has missed. Not once does anyone mention this person got giant (drugs aside) shifting a large amount of weight without such farting about.
I've found it's roughly 1/3rd of people ego lifting with too much weight/crappy form, 1/3rd ego lifting with excessive control, with maybe 1/3rd who are fairly spot on. I think each type needs radically different messaging to wake up. Also...I can usually tell who they've been following based on their form...
I agree, I think we are achieving a synthesis. I've always used great form to failure and then used body English to hammer extra reps. It only makes sense to do it that way.
I’m doing as you say progressive overload, decent range of motion, decent form and markers of progression. Definitely worthwhile having had that coaching!
Yea I just always focused on good enough form and weight progression, that's gotten me to a decent point. Also being willing to reset the weight to improve form, but also the balancing act of when you know the form is adequate, add weight when you're supposed to! LOL
This is so true Faz! I see a lot of this in the commercial gym like you said instead of ego being the weight it’s the tempo and form although I feel like yes good points. You also need to put some weight on the bar and progressively overload obviously not getting snapped up but progressing overtime great video. Great video and topic💪🏽
Very interesting point, boss. Makes sense. It's a version of ego lifting on the opposite end of the weight vs form spectrum compared to the old way of ego lifting.
So important to find exercises that work for you and progress them, working with a ROM the is appropriate for your own body’s strengths and limitations not someone else’s. Your only loyalty is to the results :).
I think pushing your ROM is great because you get stronger in the range of motion you train in. If you half rep you will always do it but other than that push it fucking hard.
Faz what kills me is these people seem to be a subset of a more larger group of lifters who are obsessed with finding the optimal aka most efficient way to make gains in the gym. That fella you spoke with probably suffered some shock and had cognition dissonance when you mentioned getting stronger as that takes some time and that probably goes against his view about how lifting should be.
Both approaches will yield the same result if effort is the same for both Technical lifting is , or should be, for injury prevention The problem is the Dr Mike simps don't understand that for hypertrophy, effort and progression is all that matters , not magic parts of the ROM or any of that meme stuff I lift with ridiculously precise form purely for injury prevention but my hypertrophy would be identical with short sloppy sets
Funny enough most people trying to learn : How to do "Slower tempo , controlled pause , strict technique , not rushing progression" while on the other hand i am actually trying to learn the complete opposite now : "Being more explosive and not as controlled , speeding up tempo a bit , being Ok with a bit more loose form , forcing progression and not being afraid of the weight" . even tho i always make fun of ultra strict technique and Cyborg form , but i catch myself a lot of the time controlling the weight way too much (even on the concentric weirdly enough) , and when i let the freedom of progression up to me i usually stick with the same weight for a while to "master" it and not feel like i could progress onto the next weight . i am guessing because i started from a "Science-based" point of view , i never learned how to "HORSE C**K SOME WEIGHTS" (lol) that's why i felt that most advices now is GOOD but it applies to people already coming from the other side of "powerlifting" to tone them down a bit because they already have the other things in check , but the same advices applied to someone like me it'll do more harm than good . For example : Alex's way of training now , i believe it's more conducive to someone like him (really strong , advanced , and was already lifting like a mad man back in the days) , that's why i think his old methods of being as explosive and lifting fast and focusing on getting stronger would apply more to me because it's the other way around with me (i have the other things in check) (if that makes any sense tho) (Btw Faz , i quit my overly complicated program and doing too much and having way too much variety and complexity than i would ever need to "specially at my level of not even having intermediate numbers to begin with" , and just started from the BASICs of running *Alpha Destiny's Novice program* , and soon his *Naturally Enhanced* and getting as STRONG as i can on the basics , even if it's not "Optimal" for hypertrophy it would be optimal for me and my current situation)
Yeah, i think these form fixated people may not focus on an explosive concentric because that's one of the factors that improves strength via weight or reps.
I've started doing at least two ego-lifting heavy sets per exercise, because I'm also a certified pencil neck I also do some backdown sets with better form, when I hit failure on backdowns I still force a couple reps with some body english toward the end of the set
I'm competetive person, I see the other ppl in the gym, I try to lift heavier with technique that's almost art to the eyes. I grow. Yes I admit I'm an ego lifter, but I consider my self a sophisticated ego lifter. :P
This reminds me of nother video from Eric Bugenhagen, where he says something along the lines of "It's all ego. Whether your lifting super heavy or with overly strict form and technique" There are a couple of people in my gym that i see doing the "technique cyborg" style lifting. I haven't actually witnessed any "old school" ego lifters in there, but that may be more to do with it being a cookie cutter 24 hr place.
Not defending them, but the guys at my gym with very bad form, who cut range of motion a lot, but move a lot of weight, usually have muscular development. Maybe not a very good one, but still, they aren't small. No idea how their joints feel on what some of them are on.
Technique doesn't seem to be the most important to me. You'll see jacked people train with chaos ego lifting and others with the controlled "perfect" technique. I just use a form that I can be consistent with and that's still enjoyable to me.
How is it ego if tour form is solid? Without belt, knee wraps or that other trash that people bring in? If i am dead lifting 505 without any gear and my form is solid how is that ego if that became my work weight then if i stretch between sets? How it if Can run 5 miles in 31 minutes? And weigh 180lbs? All this because i focused on form and full rom also how is it ego if i can do muscle ups? All because i do beginner stuff and not advance lifting? Just because people want to be big weak and shit at cardio and feel better about being mentally and physically weak that they had to jump on sarms, anabolics then feel bad that some one who had been lifting the right way is out performing them with better form more weight more reps etc…. Doesn’t make them an ego lifter as a matter of fact in my 20 years of exercising the people take anabolics and sarms love to do half reps and quarter reps and good enough reps they seem to have a problem with people doing full rom with more weight then them. Lay off the anabolics leave let your test drop to natural levels stop lying to the young kids who dont know how to lift.
My friend you wrote this on a Friday night, are you okay? I'm not saying that ironically but if you are going through some things and need someone to talk to then email me at faz@fazlifts.co.uk or DM me on IG. Take care.
Honestly I blame Dr Mike's influence on this, at least for myself. When I started at the gym i though "oh the weight doesn't matter, and even if I do try to go heavy It will still be the warmup of others so there's no point in me deviating form even an ounce. My Ego was attached to the form very much so and I'd tell myself 'well he may be lifting 4 times ur weight but like, look at the deep stretch and controlled paused eccentrics bro'." Nowadays we're seeing the pendulum shift again.
I think there's a possibility that both extremes are simultaneously right and there's a time and place for both. Heavy cheat lifts for explosive power and maximal overload of the eccentric (and perhaps what Boogz calls peaking the nervous system"), and cyborg yoga-with-weights to truly own a certain weight and create strenght in all ROMs. Until people realize this, the pendulum will continue to swing back and forth.
"dont be an idiot but dont be a nerd" is my favorite way to go about it haha
Bald omni man "control the weight but dont be a tryhard"
Dr Mike Technique Cyborgs I think you're talking about. Obsessed with perfect form yet have the width of a pencil.
Agreed.
It doesn’t help when they have videos of an IFBB pro doing barbell rows at 40kg but taking 6 days to lower the weight, acting like it’s the secret everyone has missed. Not once does anyone mention this person got giant (drugs aside) shifting a large amount of weight without such farting about.
I like to use both forms of “ego” lifting.
I've found it's roughly 1/3rd of people ego lifting with too much weight/crappy form, 1/3rd ego lifting with excessive control, with maybe 1/3rd who are fairly spot on. I think each type needs radically different messaging to wake up.
Also...I can usually tell who they've been following based on their form...
I think that's pretty spot on!
Funny thing is over here in the UK you can tell the guys who listen to TrainedbyJP after just 30s of talking to them 😂
Technique cyborgs are what they are calling these type of ego lifters. See it all the time.
I agree, I think we are achieving a synthesis. I've always used great form to failure and then used body English to hammer extra reps. It only makes sense to do it that way.
I’m doing as you say progressive overload, decent range of motion, decent form and markers of progression. Definitely worthwhile having had that coaching!
How about using the safety squat bar, trap bar deadlift, and the swiss bar bench as your exercises to see if you are getting stronger?
Yea I just always focused on good enough form and weight progression, that's gotten me to a decent point. Also being willing to reset the weight to improve form, but also the balancing act of when you know the form is adequate, add weight when you're supposed to! LOL
Loving the new perspective as of late!
This is so true Faz! I see a lot of this in the commercial gym like you said instead of ego being the weight it’s the tempo and form although I feel like yes good points. You also need to put some weight on the bar and progressively overload obviously not getting snapped up but progressing overtime great video. Great video and topic💪🏽
"ego-techniquing" is what they're doing. gvs also covered this as well. slow eccentrics, "proper form", and acting like anything else is heresy
Very interesting point, boss. Makes sense. It's a version of ego lifting on the opposite end of the weight vs form spectrum compared to the old way of ego lifting.
So important to find exercises that work for you and progress them, working with a ROM the is appropriate for your own body’s strengths and limitations not someone else’s. Your only loyalty is to the results :).
A good tip is after your heavy set lower the weight a little and focus on tempo and pauses. Carry that forward as your lifts progress
I think pushing your ROM is great because you get stronger in the range of motion you train in. If you half rep you will always do it but other than that push it fucking hard.
Amazing content as always. Thanks Faz!
Good technique for the muscle, ego lift for the soul
Faz what kills me is these people seem to be a subset of a more larger group of lifters who are obsessed with finding the optimal aka most efficient way to make gains in the gym.
That fella you spoke with probably suffered some shock and had cognition dissonance when you mentioned getting stronger as that takes some time and that probably goes against his view about how lifting should be.
Underrated comment 👊
Both approaches will yield the same result if effort is the same for both
Technical lifting is , or should be, for injury prevention
The problem is the Dr Mike simps don't understand that for hypertrophy, effort and progression is all that matters , not magic parts of the ROM or any of that meme stuff
I lift with ridiculously precise form purely for injury prevention but my hypertrophy would be identical with short sloppy sets
Funny enough most people trying to learn : How to do "Slower tempo , controlled pause , strict technique , not rushing progression" while on the other hand i am actually trying to learn the complete opposite now : "Being more explosive and not as controlled , speeding up tempo a bit , being Ok with a bit more loose form , forcing progression and not being afraid of the weight" .
even tho i always make fun of ultra strict technique and Cyborg form , but i catch myself a lot of the time controlling the weight way too much (even on the concentric weirdly enough) , and when i let the freedom of progression up to me i usually stick with the same weight for a while to "master" it and not feel like i could progress onto the next weight .
i am guessing because i started from a "Science-based" point of view , i never learned how to "HORSE C**K SOME WEIGHTS" (lol)
that's why i felt that most advices now is GOOD but it applies to people already coming from the other side of "powerlifting" to tone them down a bit because they already have the other things in check , but the same advices applied to someone like me it'll do more harm than good .
For example : Alex's way of training now , i believe it's more conducive to someone like him (really strong , advanced , and was already lifting like a mad man back in the days) , that's why i think his old methods of being as explosive and lifting fast and focusing on getting stronger would apply more to me because it's the other way around with me (i have the other things in check)
(if that makes any sense tho)
(Btw Faz , i quit my overly complicated program and doing too much and having way too much variety and complexity than i would ever need to "specially at my level of not even having intermediate numbers to begin with" , and just started from the BASICs of running *Alpha Destiny's Novice program* , and soon his *Naturally Enhanced* and getting as STRONG as i can on the basics , even if it's not "Optimal" for hypertrophy it would be optimal for me and my current situation)
Yeah, i think these form fixated people may not focus on an explosive concentric because that's one of the factors that improves strength via weight or reps.
Here in France, most people ego lift with WAY too much weights lol
Balance is key. For some it's not easy to find.
I've started doing at least two ego-lifting heavy sets per exercise, because I'm also a certified pencil neck I also do some backdown sets with better form, when I hit failure on backdowns I still force a couple reps with some body english toward the end of the set
I'm competetive person, I see the other ppl in the gym, I try to lift heavier with technique that's almost art to the eyes.
I grow. Yes I admit I'm an ego lifter, but I consider my self a sophisticated ego lifter. :P
This reminds me of nother video from Eric Bugenhagen, where he says something along the lines of "It's all ego. Whether your lifting super heavy or with overly strict form and technique"
There are a couple of people in my gym that i see doing the "technique cyborg" style lifting. I haven't actually witnessed any "old school" ego lifters in there, but that may be more to do with it being a cookie cutter 24 hr place.
2:51 holy calves
Not defending them, but the guys at my gym with very bad form, who cut range of motion a lot, but move a lot of weight, usually have muscular development. Maybe not a very good one, but still, they aren't small.
No idea how their joints feel on what some of them are on.
Lifting heavier is hard and IMO takes far more concentration and focus than medium/light lifting with "perfect" form. Maybe that's part of the issue.
BTW was that "YOUR MOM" that I read under TO DO LIST? 😅
lol yes
@@Fazlifts 😅
Balancing weight and form is important, but that shirt is importanter. Drop the sauce boss
Jk found it on Amazon. Legendary
Whats wrong with a 140kg squat faz? 12x140kg on a back squat will give u some three trunks, especially if u re able to make them quad dominant
He said 140 for 1 rep
@@jackwilliams9889 oh, so it was a misunderstanding from my part, thank you
Is strength the end of it all? Moving thru space, functional training, athleticism, for me.
Technique doesn't seem to be the most important to me. You'll see jacked people train with chaos ego lifting and others with the controlled "perfect" technique.
I just use a form that I can be consistent with and that's still enjoyable to me.
UA-cam stuff ✅
How is it ego if tour form is solid? Without belt, knee wraps or that other trash that people bring in?
If i am dead lifting 505 without any gear and my form is solid how is that ego if that became my work weight then if i stretch between sets?
How it if Can run 5 miles in 31 minutes? And weigh 180lbs? All this because i focused on form and full rom also how is it ego if i can do muscle ups? All because i do beginner stuff and not advance lifting?
Just because people want to be big weak and shit at cardio and feel better about being mentally and physically weak that they had to jump on sarms, anabolics then feel bad that some one who had been lifting the right way is out performing them with better form more weight more reps etc…. Doesn’t make them an ego lifter as a matter of fact in my 20 years of exercising the people take anabolics and sarms love to do half reps and quarter reps and good enough reps they seem to have a problem with people doing full rom with more weight then them.
Lay off the anabolics leave let your test drop to natural levels stop lying to the young kids who dont know how to lift.
My friend you wrote this on a Friday night, are you okay? I'm not saying that ironically but if you are going through some things and need someone to talk to then email me at faz@fazlifts.co.uk or DM me on IG. Take care.
Algo comment…
Ego
Faz keeping the scene in check as always 🫡