My Statement regarding EKWB...
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- Опубліковано 21 вер 2024
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/ der8auer
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Music / Credits:
Outro:
Dylan Sitts feat. HDBeenDope - For The Record (Dylan Sitts Remix)
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"What Steve said is just the tip of the iceberg"
Jesus Christ.....that's one hell of a statement
exactly i'm also wondering what other skeletons are hiding inside that closet
Tech Jesus
@@hammaadhussain9974 Or why if everyone has had these problems (JayzTwoCents, DerBauer, who knows who else), why are we only hearing about it now?
Not only is that a hell of a statement, but it's a statement that I can 100% believe. GN's video was based on a week's worth of investigation (they cited that about a dozen employees had shared their stories within 36 hours), so who knows how much more is found out given more time and more eyes on EK.
@@hammaadhussain9974 nah they arent hiding skeletons in their closet
they needed a mansion to hide all those bones in
F's sake... one of the few local companies I could be proud of for putting our country on the map and they pull this shit...
at least be glad u have a company representing ur country.
It's really a shame because their products are excellent. Hopefully they can get their shit together.
*got caught pulling this shit.
By the sounds of it they've been doing it for years, it's just only now catching up with them.
I was one of the first ones, buying from Eddy when he was making blocks after work. I was always behind them and always very proud to be a part of their history - even just in a small little part.
Škoda..
A company failing is rarely pretty.
Steve has often sited/collaberated/referenced Roman's work, ethics, equipment, knowledge etc and here's Roman throwing the compliments and appreciation right back at Steve. It's gotta be like 2 kids in a candy store every time they video chat. The level of personal and professional acumen with these 2 is simply amazing. 👍
*cited
Yeah, but still can't compare with when Steve is hanging out with the OG Gordon.
hahaha the video they have about AM5 thermals is one of my favourite videos.
I wish all companies did business with the same ethics as your company!
I know I'm only using thermal grizzly from now on.
expensive as hell, but I'd rather support a company that pays its employees any day
@@OriflammeGamingimho they’re reasonably priced for what you get (quality). Always liked TG.
@@MikeDQB Just bought their mycro direct die block last month. Excellent machining on the product, I'm not tearing down my hardloop yet as my cpu is already delidded and I'm waiting to see if R9000 would be worth the upgrade 🙂
Naw bro gamers nexus business model
Nice way of talking about your staff, "they give us their time and effort." What a contrast to "we give them a job." Thanks Der8auer.
Derbauer is on another level when it comes to honesty.
Der Bauer is German for integrity!
@@treyquattro It actually means The Farmer but I like Integrity more lmao
I liked that he checked up with Steve, so that he could get a look at the evidence against EK, before making the decision to stop their cooperation, as you far too often see people and companies cut ties over unsubstantiated claims.
And so is Steve Burke of Gamer's Nexus!
I love his honesty and integrity!!
The integrity of Stephen Burke ( Gamers Nexus ) is beyond reach , we are lucky to have such an individual in such a position. My hat off also to you Roman, you are a man of integrity and value !
Steve's easily the best investigative tech journalist on the internet right now. The weird thing is, some people would actually prefer his videos to be less detailed. Steve wouldn't be the man who can move mountains if all he did was a quick video that said, "This company/group is bad" and didn't thoroughly explain why.
Nice of you to not demand the takedown of the co-branded products, that would indeed create much more troubles, than solve.
Hope EK gets their act together.
Actually, the contract shown on screen basically establishes that. No new manufacture orders can be made, but anything that was already rolling can continue going until it runs out.
@@Fay7666 Exactly, thus removing the extra unnecessary expenses. Very thoughtful one.
They are embezzling money, tax invasion, they owe thousands of dollars to their partners company and more , I don't think they are going to make it😅
Why? They've done nothing wrong
A measured and appropriate response in my opinion.
better than the US Navys "proportional" response aka operation praying mantis^^
@tlv8555 I am not a guy, and why weird?
I just mention a funny/half serious comparison to something else, intended to be well measured and had a worse execution (due to the circumstances) than Der8auer.
Also mentioning a meme from "The Fat Electritian", that kind of went popular
@@emmata98Came across more as "here have my political views".
And most will have absolutely zero clue who that UA-camr is.
@@Scarlet_Soul no, this has nothing to do with politics
He always does. He is the most level headed and speaks like someone who runs a business instead of just making observations about other businesses.
This is why I support your brand and gamersnexus brand. You guys actually are honest and are for the people.
Cringe levels on this comment is off the chart
As soon as I saw the Gamers Nexus video I was curious what your response would be. This is pretty much exactly what I expected. I have a very much respect for your ethics. You are a shining example.
There is no ethics in big business. There are only financial interests and the pursuit of profit.
@@stonehardy580 Not always just.
No royalty fees.
So Roman is being paid just as much as their employees contractors and youtuber/media then.
That made me laugh :))
My guess is that if he got payed it was a one-time up-front payment, otherwise... i don't get it "payed in exposure" ???
It might make him the only one who's fully paid up
I mean, he had a joint business venture with them, it's not really "youtuber who covers companies and is not otherwise related to them got money to give them press".
So, he got money one way or the others, and not he walks away - I don't really care how the "my name is on your product" is being paid for - it's all the same thing. If you think any way of handling is makes it better or worse, you are wrong.
gold lol
@@IcecalGamer His company supplies EK deliding tool. I think that is enough revenue for him, as his company thrives. He doesn't need extra money on his own.
Some time ago he did interview with Steve where he talked about R&D costs of TG stuff. And that he has to count them as 0, because that cannot be quantified.
Roman is one of the true, down to earth guys, that does stuff well just because they can and want.
Damn, it almost brings tears to my eyes, because that is kind of job and boss you WANT
At industry events, you can always tell a lot about the company culture and I’ve always noticed how happy the thermal grizzly folks are, they always have cool stories about the company outing they just went on, or what awesome thing they are working on. Always a nice pleasant conversation. Great people all around, starting with Roman himself.
Your ironclad commitment to transparency is the reason I trust both the derbauer and thermal grizzly brands. Actual king. Unfortunate events all around. Ive had my fair share of companies with slimy execs just out to fuck you over and have a laugh about it at the coffee machine. Best of luck to the employees hit by this situation, and worst of luck to whoever encouraged this behaviour in the upper echelons of EK.
I appreciate your candor and your resolve to handle things as ethically as possible. Kudos.
This is such a sad situation.
I have a few EK products and they have been working great ever since I got them.
I hope the good parts of EK survive this, but it is looking ruff right now.🤞
Its not about EK products are bad overall, its just they cost too much and are hard to sell. To many custom designs and niche market.
There are loads of YT video reviews doing custom water loops with EK stuff but often they dont mention how much it costs. Those are paid reviews.
They definitely have a very high-quality product albeit expensive. I paid over $400 USD for just a GPU block! But their business practices are irreparable. Doesn't matter how great your product is, if you don't pay the people producing, marketing and designing your product, then you aren't going to be doing it for long. Hopefully they can correct the ship and get back on course.
@@jasonburkett3101 I beg to differ, EK's quality got really dogshit and nowadays it is just too expensive when you have quality wise the same level like barrow or bykski that are waay cheaper.
It's a good example of amazing people working at a company & management messing up, you cant blame people working.
I hope they can get past the bad patch, fix the problems and do there staff right.
Love the transparency. Thanks for keeping us informed :D
Big thumb up for the high standards of your best practices both as a company and as a personal brand.
Respect Roman and at the same time, high hopes EK will manage that crisis!
Thank you for being transparent & doing the right thing. 💜much respect!
I didn't know you were the CEO of Thermal Grizzly. I'll have to try out some of your thermal pads and paste. I'm reluctant to try liquid metal for fear of shorting something out.
Just use some clear nail varnish on everything near the part you are pasting. I've got some but haven't decided to use it yet.
@@D1craigRob Thank you for the suggestion. I'll try that on a cheaper motherboard and processor so if something does short out, I won't be frying expensive components.
@@chadstewart8567 If you're doing it for fun then go ahead, it's always good to learn new skills. But just FYI liquid metal is rarely worth it unless you're doing direct die cooling, and even then a phase-change pad is surprisingly close in performance but a lot easier to apply.
@@Zilli_341 Thank you for the info. I'm doing a retro AMD FX-8350 build and I wanted to tinker around with different cooling solutions, pads, paste, and liquid metal. I'm also going to try delidding and direct-die cooling.
@@chadstewart8567 same but 3930k build. I wish we could do direct die stuff with this platform though, intel epoxy'd this one on & got my ass
subbed and came here to say good for you for honouring your ethics and principles. another fine example of a human being
straight to the point and honesty. Highly appreciated!
I purchased a couple of months ago the AM5 Mycro Direct-Die RGB block and the delidding tool, i was sceptical about purchasing a block that wasnt EK, i really glad i purchased the block one of the best decisions ive made for my loop, the delid tool also worked flawlessly.
yes i got my first mycro direct die for am5 recently too.. it performs BETTER then what i was seeing on the video here. Plz continue to make more cpu blocks in the future. EKWB lost me when they upped all the prices on everything last year. prices that were already way too high.
they work well how ever there other products are over priced i had to pay 49$ for some plastic g1/4 rings for my ekwb gtx 1080 waterblock found the same thing made of aluminum for 3$ on aliexpress
”Sceptical about buying a block that wasn’t EK”. You really need to widen your view. EK is not the only watercooling manufacturer and there’s a lot of great manufacturers besides EK.
I truly hope that the Thermal Grizzly brand will fill the waterblock market gap. The quality of your products is amazing.
I’ve said every time an employee employer topic is discussed that the world would be much better with more employers like you Roman. You, consistently demonstrate values, morals, principles that you should hear are extremely appreciated🫶.
holy cow, royality free. I never knew this. My german friend, I'm even more proud now, using a pc case with your name inside.
After I saw the Gamers Nexus video I checked your channel knowing of your affiliation. This was a classy response. Was going to order the EK delid tool but I bought yours instead. I feel proud of that purchase now. I was just starting to put my water cooling system plan in motion and now I have to change half of my parts list. Thanks for the years of honest hard work you put in for the enthusiast community!
Thank you for being so open about this with us
honestly not surprised that this has been a problem especially in the US branches, a lot of US companies are doing this kind of stuff to their employees right now. glad that you are taking the actions that you are to separate from the issue, but also glad that you are not forcing them to remove existing products from stock as it would not only create further financial issues for the employees but also cost physical waste of materials
Thanks for adding your voice. You're setting a good example by putting best practices ahead of money!
Once again, Roman proving why alot of us have a lot of respect for him due to his ethos, ethics and morals. Never change Roman, never change.
Love der*auer, awesome channel. Tons of respect for this guy and his work on this channel and the products Thermal Grizzly makes.
love you man. you always do what's right instead of caring more about whether you're going to lose money. I will continue to be an avid supporter of yourself and your products but I will never buy another product from EK after what I have learnt about how they have treated people, especially the people whom without they wouldn't even have a business, ie. their staff.
Really shitty to have to do a video like this. But I, and Im sure everyone else too, really appreciate your honesty and integrity.
Agreed. Hate seeing a renowned brand get cancelled like this. Hopefully EK actually does what it takes to dig their way out of this hole and make things right as best as possible.
Der8auer is the nicest person in this industry. Most humble for sure.
Smart move with your licensing details, Roman. I was concerned you might get caught up in this but it looks like you have yourself covered. Good. Keep up the great work.
Compliments on how you talk about this and how you deal with it. Really admirable - hats off!
I´m not a subscriber but I amazed with your integrity and the genuinely good why you handle this including your partnership from the beginning.
Good guy. Even though you could stick it to em, you choose the high ground. Appreciate this immensely.
Good on you, brother. I'll always support people and brands who make a clear effort to be moral/ethical.
You can hear it in your voice that you are not happy about this and took a moral stand. Well done Sir, if only there were more like you in higher places.
For those looking for alternatives to EK, I would recommend the following brands: Watercool, Alphacool, Aquacomputer, Hardware Labs, Bitspower, Koolance, and Barrow (fittings only).
It's really a shame aquacomputer parts can be tough to get in the states without buying directly with incredibly high overseas shipping costs. Their website is also pretty terrible but the work is amazing and every time I wonder why X product doesn't seem to exist, it usually turns out they make it.
@@JJFX- FrozenCPU (now under new ownership) is a pretty good US source. But yeah, it can be hard to get their stuff at ModMyMods/PPCs/Titan Rig. The shipping from Germany is crazy expensive as well.
@@JJFX- Did you try to look ? for example modmymods is US side and have Aquacomputer stuff in stock.
To be honnest, I had prety bad luck with EK stuff with multiple CPU/GPU blocks (nickel plating flaking, corrosion, inadequate contact with VRM on full cover block etc) and their cooling fluids (degraded after 3 months with gunk and corrosion on blocks) as well.
Now I am only using their EK quantum fittings, EPDM tubing and trying their radiator, for anything else I am looking elsewhere.
Alpahcool, Watercool for Blocks | Aquacomputer Ultitube Pro reservoir with D5 next pump (direct control of fans and no software needed) | Hardwarelabs, Alphacool for radiator.
For softtube fittings pretty much anything, For hardline tubing have to be bit more carefull in choices.
I would strongly recommend EPDM for soft tubing, no plasticizer leaking to fluid, chemicaly stable and does not degrade over time.
And Corsair premix fluids.
Also add to the list : Singularity,yes expensive but damn good stuff.
GN, Jay, and Der8auer continue to prove why they're my go-to Tech channels.
Transparency, honesty, and integrity.. That's what you guys have proven to represent in the Tech Space.
This is a very wise approach and I appreciate your contribution to the community
Der Bauer, thank you for the transparency with the direct die collab. I was going purchase the AM5 direct die kit, but not after all this. I greatly appreciate everything you do us enthusiast's.
Thanks Roman ❤ I really appreciate your dedication.
The kit I got from EK in 2018 or 2019 ( from Slovenia ) was well engineered & not horribly expensive, and the support staff have always been fantastic. I've obviously never dealt with the US branch. The covid explosion does not seem to have done them any favours in the long run sadly. I hope they can turn all this around. Must totally suck after you put all that effort into a colab, I feel for you.
Now I need a new source for open loop kit ( I'm sick of AIO problems and I actually just like open loop anyway ) that isn't Corsair... suggestions welcome.
You, GN, and JTC are my go-to PC/Tech news providers. You guys sound like someone who cares and is open to scrutiny. You speak as someone not gaining anything by just being informative. Thank you.
You did good. So happy to hear you value you employees so well ❤
It's refreshing to see you have good ethics ... pretty rare to find in business these days. I'd recommend you get current batch/quantity numbers from EK to confirm they stay honest.
To this day, the one product I've regretted purchasing above all else was EK's direct die cooler. Wish I could sell it to recoup something. . . anything, but I don't want anybody else to suffer with it.
I appreciate you Roman, you are a thoroughly good egg, I can hear it in your voice.
Always appreciate your integrity Roman, as well as others in the community like GN Steve. Because of your history and your transparency, we know that you wouldn't act on this if it wasn't the right thing to do. It's a shame to see EKWB possibly go down like this, but I hope it can serve as a lesson for other companies about how to run the business
Thank you, short, direct, to the point.
While I've been using Primochill and other brand fittings and blocks in my current build, unfortunately EK seems to be one of the very few choices for the system I am starting to rebuild and work on for a new rig. ... And that sucks after all this damning news comes out. Used EK's coolant for years without issue but now I have to wonder if they'll even be in business after this fiasco. Thank you, DerBauer for bringing your perspective into view. Also, Thermal Grizzly is great paste, too! Had no idea you owned that.
I think what you did was perfectly acceptable. I am also glad that you run your business with the mindset that you do.
Steve and his team, Jay and his along with your channel and company are the ones I always follow and respect, it has been show time and time again the Ethics that you all stand for, support and are willing to stand up for folks when needed.
Steve is one of those rare, mythical creatures who embody trust and and almost instinctive moral compass. Der8auer says he trusts Steve, which normally would not be a good argument. That being said, Steve's history of due diligence, frankness, and fairness have instilled in all who pay adequate attention a justified position of being able to say, 'Steve said it, and I believe him.'. A gargantuan promise to live up to for most. For Steve, however, to do otherwise would go against who he is at his core.
Sorry if I sound like a cult member.
EKWB getting cancelled was not something I had on my 2024 bingo card. It’s a messed up situation and only time will tell how they’ll respond to this
Cancelled!? This isn’t a Twitter beef, mate. The writing is on the wall and it’s looking like it will end in a Chapter 11 Bankruptcy
amazed you did English version of this as well
Glad to hear thermal grizzly treats its employees with respect and appreciates their contribution.
Putting people and principles before profits. It too rare these days.
You have my respect Roman 🤜🤛🏾
grizzly is a brand name not a company.....
@@chloedevereaux1801 They make products and have employees. Call it whatever you like my friend.
@@gasracing5000 Roman's Labour Extraction Polycule Funtime Camp?
@@chloedevereaux1801 The company is called Thermal Grizzly Shop GmbH, if you want to be pedantic.
It was great to hear your side of the story, much respect
Damn this video is the best sell i have seen for your delidder and direct die cooler xD You also just made the EK/8 kits a collectibe :D
You have my respect for the way you conduct yourself, your concerns are the right ones, thank you for your professionalism.
Derbauer on top always.
I actually have so much respect for you now knowing there was no money in those deals with EK. You're truly just so passionate about pc parts and overclocking and that's just really cool.
Might wanna add a link to Gamer Nexus's video in the description so people can get a better understanding in case they dont know what's going on
how hard is it to go to GN's channel lol
@@maag78 Still, best to cover all the bases.
@@maag78 Some people would rather ask (type) questions and WAIT for answers. This is probably part of the reason for the "let me Google that for you" meme. It drives me bonkers the extreme laziness that is prevalent everywhere.
what do you think how many people watching here have never seen GN? under 1%?
@@maag78 it's called professional courtesy. The only reason this video was made, was because of GN. A video also mentioned in the video. I've already seen GNs video but not even adding the link to the video on the description is an unprofessional action on their part. Maybe grow up and think before you speak? 😀
Ohhhh.... It took me a while to realize you were saying cooperation, not corporation. Good video!
Awesome statement, just the right personal standards and sensible attitude .
I know it's a hard decision but a necessary one; like you I believe if they can get back on track and prove themselves after some time then a partnership could be a good thing. Time will tell and hopefully they can get their stuff together and get the right people with the right attitudes in there working.
very honest video and hats off to you sir. keep up what your doing and good luck for future endeavours
Thanks for being transparent and honest. Hopefully EK can do the same. The cat's out of the bag EK, be open with us because you're not going to bounce back from this by lying and crafting BS PR statements.
Thank you for the update and good call.
After watching this I'm really glad I bought your Kryosheet for my 7900xtx.
Holy shit 11% is a _massive_ failure rate for a product. The more and more that comes about from this drama I just can't see EK being able to salvage this. It sounds like they have plenty of competent people working for the company but it looks like management is rotten to the core.
It's one thing if products have problems or you have outstanding balances with suppliers, but when you don't pay your help that's directly fucking up people's lives and families. This is instantly unforgivable to me.
I think you are treating them pretty fairly given the situation.
Good for you to stand on integrity. Looks like EK investors need to replace the board of directors and the CFO. I noticed their loss of quality two years ago in the quality of thier metals and machining. I think they started using Chinese OEM crap, but they of course denied it. Look at them now.
Thanks for your TIM, I can now get it at Micro Center. That's where I buy a majority of my computer parts.
Just as an aside can you do some topics on Alphacool and Watercool products? I use both of their radiators in a couple of pc's. My Alphacool rads and D5 755 pump are 10 years old still working like new. But I of course service them on a regular basis. By the 4th or 5th year I replaced the gpu and motherboard. So a complete teardown and cleaning of the case and all fittings inside and out with nylon brushes. So yea, quality lasts w/o discoloration in my case of any block. I have switched to borosilicate glass for my reservoirs as the acrylic ones always cracked after two years.
True German quality manufacturing along with design should be showcased not what's cheap or of compromised quality, like you exposed Laptron for. That's for the Chinese Market, they seem to like it let them keep it all to themselves.
You Either Die a Hero, or You Live Long Enough To See Yourself Become the Villain............oh EKWB
I always wondered how EK survived on such a small niche business. They have to build hundreds, maybe thousands of units of every SKU of every graphic card they chose to support and every CPU water block, and I don't think that there are that many buyers. They must have tons of dead stock collecting dust somewhere.
Yeah, I bet they have millions worth of products in stock just waiting for hardly anyone to buy it, must suck b/c it is some of the best water-cooling stuff. Even though I'm way too poor to buy any myself, I do love seeing builds with it. I hope they can do the right thing and not go under, cuz this is bad.
10k min order quantity
I can't believe that they didn't do in house machining on atleast their water blocks. The economy of scale are not there.
I really appreciate the part where you say that you value your employees giving up their time (albeit compensated) for your business.
I had not heard this news, but the statement "just the tip of the iceberg" really resonates with me, as I was in a similar position as an employee at my former company where I was discriminated against and treated like garbage for years before they sacked 90% of the staff including me and went into administration early this year due to 10s of millions of debt.
i think it’s very wise to allow EK to continue selling the old collab products, if anything the sales will aid any legal costs or hopefully payments to the staff that deserve them. otherwise like you said, it would only add to the mess at the moment.
Don’t know what happened in this case but I have seen companies and owners that are otherwise professional pull stuff like this when under severe economic strain. Not justifying it. But regardless der8auer has a high professional standard and I think this is a good response from him. People like him and Steve are what the business needs.
I respect you all the more, Der Bauer!
Tough decision to stop a project that was just launched given the effort it takes to create it in the first place. I think we can all appreciate your strong commitment to respecting ethical values. Thank you very much for making the world a better place.
After the video GN launched today, You made an excellent move Roman!
4:24 - Roman this is exactly how I think about this topic... the value of employees as human and which are the soul of companies has to be kept!
I hope EK's founder can right his ship and continue to supply the good quality products that they have been. I get the feeling after watching Jay, Gamers Nexus and now der8auer that the CEO the the founder put in place was just a bit of a tool that was either wholely incompetent or was deliberately trying to run the company into the ground (or both).
For me, I have purchased many EK products. My loop is all EK fittings, tubes, I have the EK mono block for Zenith II Extreme. I have an EK block and backplate for the RX5700XT, EK Res/Pump, twin EK radiators. And I use Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut paste. I have also built a few CPU only water cooled PCs using nothing but EK products, and I have never had a major issue with thier products. I have had some minor cracks appear in the clear plexi areas right around where the tube fittings screw in. But that occured over the course of 2 years, and I contacted EK support and asked if I can buy some new plexi fittings. And they just couriered me 2 or 3 monoblock plexi pieces without charge within a week.
So I can say that I have never had any issues with EK to date, and I would certainly use EK blocks in my next build as they are quality products as far as I can tell.
This guy just proving time and time again that he's a man with morals.
I've spent a week building spec's for a new build using EK, on the one hand I don't want to support a company that doesn't pay it's employee's or supplier but on the other hand supporting them financially is likely the only way they survive and pay people.
I bought my pc's motherboard after a Gamers Nexus review starring this man. I trust him to know what he is talking about then and I trust him now.
My favorite quote as a leader.
"People are a resource - Negan"
It's really great that so many tech influencers have such a good standard of proof/ethics. Even with missteps, I feel like I can trust so many of you because of these stands that are taken. Back to you, Steve.
Steve to EK's lawyers- "we have everything" tech Jesus to the layman translation- "you will lose. your last legs has no ground to stand on"
It's unfortunate to see companies falter and maybe close as a result of mismanagement, either from within, or from ownership above. The employees suffer, the third party suppliers suffer etc. Hoping this attention acts as an intervention.
Man you gotta admirer how the TechTubers always have each others back when a company really F up something, they all unite and talk to each other before putting up a video and band together to force these companies to do the right thing.
My respect to you guys!
Integrity is a baseline fundamental for all companies.
It's a shame. I have a very expensive rig that has an absolutely over the top EK cooling loop in it. My experience with their products has been universally stellar. I love their gear and think it's the most beautiful stuff on the market.
Couldn't agree more. The only water cooling parts I've ever used for twenty years.
They said they have the money but its all in product stock so good news for us is we are going to have one heck of a sale on their website.
@@bismuth7730 I hope they can save the company. That said, I'd love to get a good deal on the Edge RGB CPU block. It's stunning.
Woudnt touch any of their products with a 10ft pole after this, have fun dealing with waranty when the company is non existing
@@tessierrr i dont need warranty for a radiator.
Wow...really hope they can pull their heads out and get it together. Their PR just hit rock bottom. And unfortunately deservedly so.