What Killed the Tuner Scene?
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- Опубліковано 14 жов 2024
- I share some of the history of the tuner scene and the events of the period from 2001 to about 2018 -- all of which contributed to consolidation and change in the tuner scene as we used to know it.
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The real reason we don’t do it is because it’s insanely expensive and that there’s not really universal parts. Back in the day every radio was the same size, single or double, now it’s car specific. Basically the same with every other part.
YOU don’t do it. Broke boy
@@charleshawk6668 lmao stfu if you can actually afford to blow 25k on a car (don’t call yourself a tuner if you just slapped on a 2k turbo and push 150 hp) then you don’t have time to be commenting on these sections. You would have to afford 45-55 k into a shitbox, and also have a backup car for when your tuner build breaks every week. What is it that you do Charles? 😂
@@300zxss it’s called making payments, I have a reliable daily that’s almost paid off and exactly a 25K JDM import lol , have 0 issue paying them , only 24 and don’t work s special job , if you want it you’ll make it happen
@zenzu2116 if you're saying you're 24 then I would like to know what bills your parents cover and if you live with them still
I'll argue that increasing living costs and increasing costs for car ownership is the main thing killing the car scene nowadays. Most enthusiasts can't really afford to buy a car to fuck around with and certainly don't have the time to wrench like they could even 5-7 years ago. Even if you have the money to buy parts and get them installed, you're not really willing to risk butchering your only car and end up hating it because you didn't realize that straight piping, de-catting, and slamming your Civic/S13/S2000/Miata/STi would actually ruin it and make it impossible to sell when your doctor tells you its ruining your ears and back and you'll die if you hit another pothole. Its half the reason why Hondas, Nissans and Toyotas of old have appreciated to almost MSRP if they don't have rust and poorly done mods on them. Back in the day they were still cheap enough that you could buy a half finished project and at least get it running while you slow built it up. Now you need 5k or more just to find a rolling shell for (insert JDM car here) and another 3-4k for motor and trans work. Mind you this is before you fix the flaws in the chassis and interior.
5k for a rolling shell!? Not even that anymore. You'll be lucky to find one for 15k and it probably still has rust.
So true. Building a car takes time, money, and motivation. But having all three at the same time hardly ever happens anymore. When you have time and motivation, you have no money. When you have money and motivation, you have no time. When you have time and money, you have no motivation. With jobs these days pushing their workers harder to go faster and faster, you don't have any strength when you get home. I've worked for shops where the owners encouraged you to do shitty work so the job can be done quicker.
yeah, I'm working a lot and still can't afford to really do much with my cars. Most people I know who street race have barely modded their cars. It's just so expensive. Not to mention any work on your car, you will probably have to do yourself. Paying a shop to do work on your car is almost unthinkable with how pricey it is. The shear expensiveness of this hobby keeps most of the younger generation out of it. And without them, its bound to die off.
I can still build a nice V8 Muscle Flake tho? 🤑
Hector killed the tuning scene. He ran three honda civics all with spoon engines. Harry also tells me he ordered three T66 turbos with N0² and a motec system exhaust. After that everyone apparently just went home.
@@JustSomeExpat so what are you saying? You’re gonna check out everyone’s shit one garage after another? Yeah..because Dom, you know I can’t lose again. He’s a cop. He’s a cop!
For me, the 2000s Tuner scene is and will always be the golden age of Japanese tuner cars.
Gotdamn right
So true
Amen
for me, not just japanese tuners 😁🙏
Eww
The price of cars hasn't helped either. Back in the late 90s/early 00s, you could still find affordable sporty 2-doors.
Toyota/Subaru BRZ GT86/GR86 and that "scion" badged one that should be worth a pretty penny in the coming years.
NOt to mention the government making anything illegal and the costs of insurance.
You can still find affordable cars today, and no doubt the next generation will latch onto those instead of over paying for a 25 year old Honda Civic.
@@chrishuyler3580 Any recommendations?
Hell yea! In 2001, when i was searching for a car you could buy almost mint condition mk4 supra or s2000 or s15 with those sweet sweet engines for 5-10k...It was not cheap but was duable for 20yo me.... Nowdays banged up not running supra will set you at least 20k(+the cost to get it running) so unless your parents are rich or something it is not going to happen for a 20yo dude.
I miss car magazines so much. Always a highlight of my youth at the grocery store
A subject I was actually just reflecting on. Modern cars don't even seem to accommodate the aftermarket, aside from maybe the Toyota 86. Cars of the 90's-2000s seemed to be designed with the aftermarket in mind. You could upgrade your stereo with out replacing half of your dash. Lots of parts were just swap out and plug-n-play. It was easy to showcase your own style and personality in your car. Now everything is stuffed to the gills with bells and whistles, making them waaaay more expensive and leaving nothing to the imagination or able to be customized. Plus its all mainly crossovers and trucks anymore. Great video!!!!!
Yeah, a stereo swap would be an hour job at most back in the 90s as almost every car had the same din size slot for a head unit. Now everything is interconnected with touch screens, infotainment systems and what not.
Cars are becoming more software than hardware. Battery powered is driving that shift. For worse, not better.
For me, the heart of the tuner scene wasn't about having all the horsepower. It was the customization that lured us in. You could literally replace most parts of a car and make it uniquely yours. Car shows were amazing back then. The colors, the creativity, the innovations. Cruising on the highway, 20+ cars deep, headed to the show was half the adventure. As you wandered through the show, you entered different biomes of car culture. You had the lowriders, the track racers, the turbo clan, the bass machines, etc. And within each of those areas you had subsets of the Honda row, the Toyota row, the mini-truck corner, the domestic corner, and even a handful of muscle cars that didn't want to miss out. I am glad I experienced that environment at the perfect time, '99-'05. I have multiple photo albums full of show pictures, and even have a couple of boxes stuffed full of my SuperStreet, SSC, Honda Tuning, and Turbo magazine subscriptions.
Yup
I wouldn't go all out saying the Tuner Scene is dead. It isn't the same as the 90's and early 2000's but it definitely isn't dead. I do agree that a lot of "car guys" are more interested in internet clout though.
Around 2008 I had a 5 speed '95 Civic coupe with a full Wings West kit, underglow, big tach, Greddy exhaust, a B16 swap and Konig wheels and a 2000 Eclipse GT 5 speed with wheels, exhaust and a few other aftermarket bits, and both with full bass-ey stereo systems, and I loved both of them. I was as much into it as a poor 21 year old college student could be. I miss those cars.
UA-cam and social media (or internet) killed the tuner scene by making people antisocial and scared to do anything different. It also inflated the price of cars that used to be affordable builds. Nevertheless, youtube and social media was a double edge sword because it made it easier to gain information for your build. 1 decade or 2 ago, if you didn't know something than you just didn't know.
Right. I still hate the most deep hatred for pretty much everyone because most people comform and don't stand for anything except their slave job and mediocrity.
You want the truth? Money (or lack of it for the young-in’s) killed the game. Young bucks have little to no disposable income, cars are outrageously priced, and the game is stacked against them. It’s sad, I feel for the youngsters who are now priced out.… I made life long friends, incredible memories… it was never about the cars, it was and still is about the people and relationships along the Way.
The tuner scene in the 00’s was so dope. SO MANY good memories at events and with the crew at cruise nights and parking lot meetups on the warm hazy summer and cool fall (boost weather) weekends.
Be well, all. Keep fighting the good fight and turning those wrench’s. ✌🏼
The Truth hurts. With respect to my man here and his video………their is a reason we use to call them GREEDY!!! 22 years ago I was 20, no one I knew back then could afford an HKS Turbo kit.
I’m 28 have a decent job working 80 hours a week. And yeah I don’t really have a lot of disposable income especially since I live in California and rent is stupid expensive. 20 years ago my oldest sister was in her early 20’s and lived a simple and affordable lifestyle here in LA. Not the case anymore for my generation, I still not going to give up and still purchase a sports car tho.
In short: Money. More specificially, the fact that most people dont have alot of it. I'd love to get an import and tune tf out of it, but im having a hard enough time paying bills on a $10 an hour job. So unless I want to sleep in the car, the car is going to have to wait. It sucks, but the bro tax is real.
What city are you in?
Do construction
yeah,same here. I'm making $15.10 at my grocery store here in Cali and it is hell trying to build my 73 celica
@@ArchangelJuicy get out of cali
@@ClumsyCars hard man. Not much $$$ to fall on to move out of here
I couldn't afford a car in the _2000s..._ but I had a *PlayStation* *2* and a bunch of games like:
Need for Speed: Hot Pursuit 2
Auto Modellista
Street Racing Syndicate
Need for Speed Underground 2
Gran Turismo 4
Need for Speed Most Wanted
TOCA Race Driver 3
Midnight Club 3: DUB Edition Remix
Juiced 2: Hot Import Nights
Hector is going to be running 3 Honda Civics with SPOON engines. And on top of that, he just went into Harry's, and he ordered 3 T66 TURBOS, with NOS. And a MOTEC exhaust
Lol this comment never gets old
ah man you just quoted a line from a movie Craig was participating in, that's so original I bet he never saw that comment before, haha le epic comment
The demo that the tuner scene was geared towards got older. Hard to justify spending 3k on a set of 3 piece BBS rims for your 1996 honda civic project car, when you have a mortgage, 1 or 2 kids, and your daily driver needs a full brake job.
True that!
Tuners killed it also the car manufacturers killed it with death of models for more suv and family friendly sedans
Never forget this. I couldn't believe the new eclipse was a suv.
@@lucidrebuilds6129that was a sad time
I was a broke high school student in the early 2000s so my friends and I would just live vicariously through the lucky bastards we'd see in Super Street and Import Tuner with 1000hp Supras, full Veilside RX7s, and ultra modified Eclipses. And yes, FnF had a massive impact on us getting into the tuner scene. Also watched a ton of Techademics videos back then too. Oh and the Need for Speed Underground games as well.. Those years of dreaming were way better than the years we actually had the money to afford cars like the ones we lusted over, which sadly came well after the tuner scene died. It was fun while it lasted though.
Lol I grew up watching best motoring international and such online, so when the tuner scene finally hit here my circle of friends was like wow he was actually onto something. Save for the couple who already had dove into it head first. Was something like 98... and we were building a b16 from the Japanese version of the civic and such. Bored to a 1.8, thing would break hearts and shatter dreams of those Carby v8 loving hicks in my area. Good stuff.
I grew up in the 70s hot rod scene... my first car was a 66 Chevelle SS that I bought for $600... Even adjusting for inflation the costs of cars today are going through the roof, not to mention insurance costs.
@Rays Through Trees, Summer Breeze Big fan Ray
late 2004 , I was watching F+F 1 and 2 when I was putting a rebuilt engine in my 1983 rx-7. I couldn't relate. And internet car sites slamming the ricers. "Why do ricers have wings? Somewhere to put you hands when pushing the car out of traffic".
@Rays Through Trees, Summer Breeze can we be friends
Its pretty simple, all the good older imports got snatched up and ragged out. Meanwhile , automakers were not making affordable fun cars anymore for young folks to be able to buy and modify.
I was in my prime during the tuner-years and got to enjoy it, but i think, we ourselves really contributed largely to the demise of the scene. While the platforms were fairly cheap and plentiful, the parts were anything but cheap - a proper tuner would end up costing 10's of times more than the car itself and this money was spent by people who had it in the first place. These people also broke through to the media spotlight. Those who couldn't really afford it, had to DIY and source cheaper parts, especially more as China started supplying, which meant the legit quality manufacturers took the hurt.
With that, they started scaling back to save business, this in turn made tuning even more expensive and that reduced media coverage, which slowly started withering the popularity.
Almost poetically, we destroyed the thing we built and loved the most.
But, i'm now older, a family man and while i do enjoy the quality of a factory car, i feel it's boring, so i've decided to buy a late 90's beater and build a tuner out of it, just as a memento to keep around.
What killed the tuner scene? Gutting out the middle class where millions are living paycheck to paycheck in a country where costs have gone up and wages have not + college loan debt and fewer jobs & kids living at home played a roll.
Yeah well now wages have gone up and so has inflation... you cant increase minimum wage to $15 and NOT have inflation... its here to stay. So we are still in the same position we were before, instead of .88 cent bread its $1.88 but you are still in the same financial position.
Yep, back in the early 00's my cousin imported an 86, painted and body kit it, added TRD parts, a period sound/entertainment system and Work Wheels while working a stocking job.... I could never with the same job today.
What killed the tuner scene? Laws and prices for beat up cars.
It's pretty simple, the value proposition on higher-end sports cars got better, tuning got more expensive (and more exclusive), and even the cars that you really want to tune on got really expensive. Most of the people that can afford to seriously tune these days probably can already afford a super car, or at least something close to one, and supercars stopped sucking somewhere around 2007.
Also, the endless pursuit to make more horsepower with each generation of a model makes little financial sense to modify a car now, as the engines increased power outputs is very sufficient for speed.
Those magazines brought back so many memories 😭😭
Import Tuner and Super Street were legit my favorites as a kid.
Being in my mid twenties now, I'd say the Tuner scene is still active but it doesn't seem as lively as it was in the 90s and 2000s. It was if it was in your face back in the 2000s due to its popularity. Those were truly the golden years.
Nothing will replace getting a new issue of my favorite car magazine in the mail!!
Or going to you local Barnes and Noble to buy car magazines from countries overseas, especially the ones from the UK that featured topless models
@@グーグル翻訳-k7n wait, topless?
I remember coming home from school seeing my father sitting in the kitchen and the new Honda Tuning Magazine just laying there on the table man those were the days also RIP pops
What killed the tuner/car scene:
- takeovers
- social media clout chasing
- knock off shit
- state reff's "for California"
- dumb drivers/show offs
- boring cars
One more thing - america
@@hybridShinx 🤣😂🤣
I remember summer of 1999, Milpitas In-N-Out and the races in the commercial/indutrial areas of Fremont California in my 1998 Integra Type R. Good times.
I can picture this in my head.. cool man.
I specifically remember this. McCarthy Ranch was THE tuner meetup. I would tag along with my older sister and her ex bf’s crew (Speed-Tech) to the nearby partially-developed dot-com complexes and the straightaways and watch them do a bunch of pulls with rival crews until the cops came to break it all up. Good times. Nowadays most of my sister’s ex’s crew have families and outgrew the lifestyle, but they still keep contact.
I was on the L.A. street racing scene from 1979 til 2010 which PD and Sheriff's would shut everything down and impounded cars and some street bikes, Florence and Main, Johnnie's Pastrami, Greenleaf n Santa Fe the Back Street by LAX and so on, even on Crenshaw,, I miss those days, won a few and lost a few
@@tibitekutan Good times back then, I went to high school with one of the McCarthy kids, his family actually owned that entire ranch area. I never got into it at the level of joining a crew but I remember the first race of the night, it was a stock 98 Type R with optional AC, same as my car. We were going to be the first race and I declined at the last minute because I had a bad feeling, said I would race later but I never raced first. As soon as the race started cops came out of nowhere and started arresting people, nailed the guy in the Type R also. Loved the Bay Area back then, sucks now.
@@SuckerFreeGear That's pretty cool that you sported a Type R! I remember that being the most hyped name in the 90s that tons of people would put the sticker on their own lesser-model Integras (I guess that's the catalyst of where the whole "ricer" stereotype originated from, haha). People with genuine Integra Type Rs were, even at the time, considered true ballers. I myself had a BB2 Prelude Si -- which would normally be prime tuner bait, but I always kept it completely stock. My sister OTOH totally went onto the deep end with performance mods on her ED6 (EF) Civic hatch -- including dropping in an Integra B-series VTEC engine and gutting out the interior.
For me, I pretty much hung out on the sidelines (as I had an unmodified car) while my sister / her bf's crew challenged other racers -- sometimes out of spite of rival crews (including a quarrel one night that almost ended in a fistfight... ahh Wicked Racing). Occasionally we would go up north to Sonoma Raceway whenever they had their drag race events happening, but most of the time they were doing pulls for money on industrial/commercial complexes as you mentioned. So, while I didn't directly participate in it all, I definitely engrossed myself in the culture out of curiosity. And I can safely say the first Fast & Furious captured that vibe pretty well.
Ironically my sister ended up having a kid not long after and quote-unquote "outgrew" the tuner lifestyle and got a typical family sedan. Meanwhile, I now live in Tokyo Japan and do laps around the Tokyo Shutoko expressway system (I'm not joking) with a tiny Honda S660 kei-car that I plan to do performance upgrades on. The car culture here in metropolitan Tokyo, while kinda looking similar to SoCal/NorCal tuner culture to anyone who doesn't know better, is in reality totally different in various ways. I feel absolutely lucky to have been exposed to both.
The prices of 20 year old cars skyrocketing and the massive kid fanbase.
@Dat Boii I think the kids are ruining car culture as a whole. They're making it a race to the bottom where outlandish aesthetics outweigh proper builds because the former garners instant gratification, even if the attention is negative on a day-to-day basis. Non-enthusiasts look at ricers and stance, and decide that this is the bulk of the community and they'd rather not rub shoulders with these types of people. This isn't me just venting on younger people (because most of those people are my age anyway), but rather my hypothesis.
@Dat Boii I would say so. The older drivers are driving up the price of good collectable JDM cars because they can afford nice examples or proper mods, but the younger drivers (of which I am one) are the ones turning their cars into clown cars for internet clout. The other problem is that JDM enthusiasts who can't even drive yet have put certain cars on a pedestal due to the JDM circlejerk and are going to keep tuner cars inaccessible.
@@MrGman636 why you are so pessimistic about it, car culture is rising up and not only is jdm getting popular but so are hotrods and the scene is going so diverse, new cars are coming as well, and there is always gonna be more options for tuner cars other than jdm
@@emilianokro9226 All the meets I go to are JDM and modern muscle. I'm tired of seeing the same cars every time I go to see other enthusiasts, and would really like to see more interesting cars owned by people that aren't boomers.
This is why Hector disappeared. Ps, he never made the NIRA circuit
I could never pronounce his last name
He was trying to go legit, he wuz fixin to turn his life around.
A lot of people grew out of this phase, recession after recession after recession, less worthy automobiles to bother with, now EPA being a culprit.
Then after a few inflation periods, and us tuner guys have other responsibilities now, a lot of us are just priced out.
I feel like you just enlightened an unsolved mystery in my life. I'm 40 now but I remember looking for my first car in the late 90's and in NZ we were the dumping ground for new and used Japanese imports, you could afford any car you liked second hand. Now everyone is in debt up to their eyeballs paying these ludicrous mortgages there is no more left-over income to buy anything. Sad, but glad for the memories.
Don’t forget that getting your modded car to pass emissions in CA is now unpossible.
California really had a way to undoing the possible huh 😂
I ran an ecommerce business in the very early 2000’s selling name brand tuner parts. I closed the business because I couldn’t compete with $25 Chinese taillights and $150 body kits. But mostly it’s the terrible customer base that created the demand. They were the worst customers of any industry.
It’s the economy. After the 2008 recession we stopped seeing these import tuner level of builds. People chose between going fast putting their money into the engine with a beat up shell, or they kept the engine relatively stock and focused on making the car clean. People just didn’t have the money to do both and things just keep getting worse. People aren’t even buying their cars anymore either, everything is being financed or leased and returned
The recession caused it?!?!? lol ok
@@velvetbear7184 yup. You’re even seeing the repeat of that happening now where no one actually owns their sports cars outright, and the people still doing grassroots builds for the most part stopped because for the price of what it used to cost to do an entire build including the price of the car, now all goes towards buying a shell
I'm surprised no one mentioned the lack of exciting new cars. Most if not all of the great JDM/SportComp cars died at the end of the 90s.
I was going to mention that. The Japanese economy peaking in the 90s also contributed to that. Japanese car companies took less risks in the 2000s onwards.
So true. Every word. In 2000s I spent nearly all of my money at speed shops and changed every part I could afford to change. Wrenching, welding, modding etc. Now I avoid even using double stick tape on my dash. I miss old me.
It was the time of my life, me and my friends didn’t even have “fast” cars. Just the car shows and cruising were something I’ll never forget.
From what I seen that killed it.
1: Cheap knock off parts that fell apart easily and looked terrible.
2: People lost interest in going to meets and car shows. This is a recent thing in the last decade.
3: cars are built pretty good with power now and alot of people don't plan to keep these cars forever, so they don't try to make it something of their own.
If you noticed that most cars look alike and all have the same paint jobs from the factory.
4: availability and knowledge to work on cars. I know far too many people who can't check their own oil and will more them likely will never plan or try to modify their car.
Getting proper parts take weeks to months to show up and that alone will turn people away from evem starting.
5: social media and clout chasers.
This might be one of the worst of them all.
These aren't real enthusiasts or even care about their car or what they do to it. Obviously not everyone.
They use this as a means of a business and use your interests to benefit them.
I have seen far too many that use cars as a means to hook watchers and they have no idea anything about cars or even trying to learn.
They're entertainment workers.
The other issue is people that want to get involved with this community. They will see these type of people and turn away because they expect that everyone in the community are just like these same idiots.
6: probably the biggest issues here and their are two.
A: people can't afford it. It's hard enough to pay the bills and get by financially.
B: car culture is dying. From the people I remember having hour long conversations about cars and getting together to build things. I haven't seen that in years and more people are more interested in a car that gets them from A to B with no issues. I feel that video games have replaced it.
True. Spare and tuning parts for car are expensive as fck nowdays. back in 2000 , there was cheaper and more flexable to get those. Now its dead
In South Africa in the early 2000`s the scene was huge, there were at lest 2 big events in Johannesburg every month and smaller events every weekend, there were legal drag racing events all over the place as well as a few illegal ones on Sunday nights, a magazine called Speed & Sound came out and sold out everywhere it was sold, they even had their own Race Team, there were clubs for just about every manufacturer of cars, The Opel Owners Club, VW Club etc etc , sadly the cost of everything there now has all but killed the scene, except for a very wealthy group of people that can afford the crazy prices of cars and the even crazier prices charged to mod them...
I grew up in the 2000's, so I remember a lot of the sites you mentioned. Those were different times. Different vibes and the internet was totally different back then compared to how it is now. I remember looking at pictures of cars on tons of random little sites, a lot of which have probably been lost to time now. That was the best era to grow up in imo.
Mid and late 90’s was the tits for growing up. Then 9/11 happened and everyone got too serious and wound up after that. Facebook just poured gas on the fire of societal hatred.
I miss the old days.. i was there 3000 years ago when Import scene in Northern Ca used to be cool. Too many hooligans, tards, mayhem, at car meets. Cops itching to ruin someones day. I would like to see vin or luda in a miata ;) or del slow maybe when they all become senior citizens on Fast 50 😆
Part of what has really cut the legs off of the car enthusiast scene is just that the kinds of people who would traditionally have supported the lower-budget end of the spectrum can't afford to do anything any more, whereas everybody who traditionally could afford to build a nicer tuner car in installments has instead decided to save up for a higher-end car instead (or spring for a lease, or whatever). Overwhelmingly, young people just don't have the money, or at least have far more urgent things to do with it.
my pops always told me the younger crowd killed the tuner scene because they'll take advantage of the sponsors and not ever payback, weren't responsible. sponsors would then pull out little by little till there was really nothing left to show off / promote these tuner cars.
I was an Automotive photographer back in 2005-2010 here in Australia and got to witness the same thing happening here, albeit on a smaller scale. None of the tuner mags we had back then exist now. I think MotiveDVD is one of the only media companies to survive. We never really had much of a parts shop scene and most parts had to be sourced through tuner shops direct from distributors, so that hasn't changed. The main "parts shops" we have were always for OEM replacement parts, not tuner parts. If anything, those shops now carry a few more "China spec" bullshit mod parts now. The few parts shops we had would almost only ever carry generic parts and maybe a few popular model parts. So really, apart from the disappearance of car mags, and our one "decent" car show, Autosalon, not a whole lot has changed here. Mainly because it has always been shit. Lol. We still have to import our parts from either Japan or the US, it's just faster now and we can get stuff in days instead of months (I waited 3 months for coilovers from Japan back in the day). Personally, the thing I like most about the evolution of the tuner world is some of the technology we have that allows us to make our own parts, like 3D printers, decent inverter welders, and even cheap CNC machines. But you are absolutely right about the fact we are on the cusp of some very big change, with EVs maybe finally getting cheap enough for everyone and all that. The tuner world will never go away, but it will change. Instead of slapping on turbos and bigger injectors, we will be upgrading our battery packs, motor controllers and writing more efficient code. Lol.
👏👏👏👏
Battery powered cars are just a fad. The batteries aren't recyclable and they're produced with rare Earth minerals mined in the Congo through child labour. Hydrogen power is the way forward. Japan and South Korea are already investing heavily in hydrogen infrastructure. By the time America and Europe have gone fully electric, Japan and South Korea will be fully hydrogen-powered and we will have to play a game of catch up.
@@plottwist1733 Hydrogen still uses batteries. Search "hydrogen fuel cell". Hydrogen combustion is waaay too inefficient to be a viable alternative. Also, your Congo Child Labor statement is bullshit. While yes, Child labour is probably a problem somewhere in the world, it is not a problem in the world's largest lithium mine which is 2 hours south of Perth, here in Australia. Those guys earn a packet. Technically its a spodumeme mine though, because that is the mineral that lithium is extracted from, but I'm sure you knew that because you seem really smrt.
@@plottwist1733 Not to mention many Japanese manufacturers are developing synthetic fuels that will be net-zero carbon emissions, possibly even cleaner than pure electric cars long-term. No rare earth minerals involved. I think people have blinders on when it comes to pure electric cars. They only see what's presented in the "golden window" and ignore all the other research going on out there for clean energy. There are so many potential game changers that are being worked on right now, but for some reason, electric is being hyped when our power grid couldn't support a majority-electric car owning public without MAJOR upgrades.
I remember getting so excited to see a new DSport, Import Tuner and Super Street magazine on the shelf, I used to have a huge collection but they kind of disappeared after a bunch of moves, now I've only got maybe 20 total between all 3. I really miss those days, back when Fast and the Furious was new, a little anime called Initial D was getting really popular in the U.S., and a bunch of games like Tokyo Xtreme Racer and NFS Underground were big. There were tons of import car clubs in Arizona at the time, with shows, street racing and hangouts at car washes and stuff like that, what a time to be in my early to mid 20's. I never could afford one of the top tier import cars, but I always wanted one and loved seeing them rip down the streets of Tucson. Man I miss those days, it was an awesome scene.
I would say computerization had a big part to play in it, most cars now are so wired up that the minute you touch them with a wrench the ECU starts throwing a tantrum.
The rising cost to purchase the older 90s Tuner/Performance cars is playing a large part too, 2 years ago I could have brought a JZX100 for $5k now they're upwards of $30k in my country, that money is better spent on a comfortable and reliable car for the majority of people, not to mention these cars are starting to become collectibles so most get kept locked in a garage to gain value.
Age demographic has a big part in it, the tuners of that time now have families to take care of and a 2 door sports car just doesn't cut it and the money spent on nice paint, big turbos and flashy body kits is better spent on their family's.
Rising fuel costs making it super hard to run these cars now let alone making fuel efficiency worse with modifications.
The difficulty of finding these cars in decent condition.
The lack of mods being made available domestically as well, most modifications have to be specially imported from Japan now.
Rising cost of parts has also meant manufacturers are focusing more on reliability than performance because 90% of buyers want reliable cars they don't have to fix every 3 months.
The Crack down and regulation of vehicle modifications by governments and their agency's.
Car culture as a whole is slowly dying out, the cars we know and love are becoming harder to find, manufacturers aren't making those kind of cars now in favor of comfort and reliability/economy, NZ used to have a massive car culture but as time has gone on those involved no longer have the time or money for it, there used to be events every month somewhere in the country now you're lucky if there's one every 6 months.
What killed the tuner scene: F&F making every tuner look like a criminal, and laws making exhausts, tinted windows, performance upgrades, or pretty much any upgrade illegal.
imagine dying for a tinted window
The prices skyrocketed lol. In highschool for me (2010 era), my friends were buying clean well running 240sx's for like 3k as their first cars. Good luck doing that now
Sounds about right. I knew a guy who bought one in 2011, about a year after he graduated high school for what i imagine was close to that price. He still has it and i doubt he'll ever let it go
@@ieatbreakdowns homeboy is sitting on a goldmine at this point lol
I think part of the reason why it died was that there aren't as many people passionate about tuning. A lot of people just want to drive a fast car. You'd be amazed at how little people understand about cars my who are my age. They just want to buy something fast. They like driving but they really lack actually liking cars in general.
It's still alive for me. It's just changed. The "tuners" have matured, I still drive an ls400 on coilovers.....just not a civic with every bolt on I could find. Now I drive to work and places with the wife on weekends instead of school and car meets.
One thing not mentioned was that the Japanese manufacturers stopped making cool tuner cars, at least ones that were affordable to the type of customers that wanted to modify their vehicles.
This video reminds me of my youth. I miss my Electron Blue Pearl 1999 Honda Civic Si with my DC Sports Headers, GReddy Evo Cat-Back Exhaust, AEM Short RAM Air Intake, and 17" RO_JA LT5 wheels.
The tuner scene never died, it evolved just like any other industry. And tbh, people spending their money on performance parts instead of ICE or expensive paint jobs, makes a lot of sense. Track days are more popular now then they used to be as well. In the past, the only genuinely fast standard cars were the exotics that most people couldn't afford. Now you can buy a new car with over 400hp from factory that doesn't cost much.
It has declined, people want Audi's,BMWs etc to prove they are balling, give me JDM over German cars
What's your opinion of what "doesn't cost much " for 400hp?
@@gmain1977 There are more JDM cars on the roads now than 20 years ago.
@@johnmitchell2269 I think you mean KDM cars.
@@johnmitchell2269 yes and even more Audi's and BMWs on finance
Thank you for adding so many of these wonderful photos of these magazines and events and shows and websites. There are so many it makes me giddy. The aesthetics of these is so nostalgic like wow. I miss magazines in particular, the effort involved in making them look good is a lost art. Thank you for putting so much effort into this.
1: People complaints about noise
2: Cost.
I am Japanese.
And I don't like the tendency to collectively call Import Tuner custom styles from the late 1990s to the early 2000s "Ricer" on the Internet these days.
I believe that these are unique developments of the Japanese tuner style.
Sure, some of the wacky Body kits, Face-swap, and Vinyls cars are ugly, but I feel they're far more personal and original than the modern Stance scene.
I also am asian and happen to not give a shit. You gotta have realize that most of that stuff back then was absolute shit.
The term "Rice" comes from cars that are a shit show. And has nothing to do with asians
are ricers Asians who eat a lot of rice??
@@coolflame18 Race Inspired Cosmetic Enhancements=RICE
@@kevinW826 wait really? I seriously believed it was a derogatory use of “rice” as rice eaters.
IMO, the main thing that's killing the tuner scene is the fact that modern sports cars have a lot more performance than the old cars did. Nowadays you can get a car from the factory that handles good, has a lot of straight line acceleration, has good wheels, tyres, and breaks. So there is a much lesser need for any extensive changes by the owner. Most sports cars bone stock can run a low 12s quarter mile. Back in the 90s, to have a 12 second car you'd have to spend a lot of money on mods.
fucking TikTok killed the car scene these past couple years. Seems that social media destroys everything..
agreed the how many look at me mofo's doing it for the gram and posting cringe stuff, I be a millionaire right now lol
Fast and furious killed the tuner world. It used to be about finding the deal that you could tune on the cheap. Then F&F came out and every dweeb out there wanted a Japanese car to tune. Demand caused prices to go up. Supply went down causing prices to go even higher. Now it costs so much to tune a turd, what's the point. Not to mention many of these cars are murdered by kids but hearing them or wrecking them. I've always had a deep interest in JDM because I love the fact that they perform out of engineering that also provides high efficiency.
The tuner scene is still around, at least here in Houston. We still have tuner meets and go on joyrides in Mexico.
"LoOk aT mE, I hAs a (insert basic modern 'sports' car from factory)"
Built K24 turbo swapped CRX - "That's cute"
Tuner for life! Though I have jumped on the supercharged V8 bandwagon in the past couple years, tuners will always be special.
Yep same, went from 240SX to 300ZXTT to G35 SPL track day toy. The parts available for the older cars is nuts, sure they are a few grand more than what they were but they are still reasonable for what they are. People get too hung up on what cars cost before hyper inflation took root. I mean in the '90s a Z32TT had cost over $100k in '24 money, and folks are crying that an objectively better car with the RZ34 costs less than half that these days! This isn't even considering this will probably be the last pure ICE h shift Z ever made. I'm definitely picking one up once the dealer markups calm down a bit.
This was prime time for me cause I started high school in 2001. Still remember going to see f&f and all the tuner cars at the theater.
What you missed was a lot of cars were getting crushed by many states for no other reason then it had a mod not approved by some state agency.
I miss the old tuner scene , the good old days!!!
Well researched video, cheers.
Good old days.
Id love for him to make video specifically explaining how all car enthusiasts are brothers and sisters. I remember a time where it didnt really matter what car you had or what mods you had, it was about enjoying your car and doing what you loved and sharing it with others at car meets. Nowdays its all about 'oh its not low enough' and 'your lancer isn't a real evo' and my favorite 'the louder the better even if its not fast'
Funny you should say that -- I'm writing a script for that video now.
@@craiglieberman awesome 😁😁 also could you look into the Itasha trends happening nowdays! I think you may find it interesting and would like to see your opinions on it. I actually really like the itasha cars because they remind me of a time where flashy decals and bright colors were popular
Here in California the clean air restrictions have been the major destroyer of individuality and created the quest for zero emissions.
Anyone who modified their intake, exhaust or tune will have trouble every two years getting past the smog check.
Some companies make specific California Air Resource Board approved items.
So they must tool up for one state.
Even then you may have to find the stamped marking on the spot to prove to a suspicious officer that those headers are legal.
Many went to illegal smog shops and many cool cars got impounded and crushed.
Then there's the loss of racetracks to houses and commercial development.
Without a legal venue the street was all there was and like the dirt bikers we became outlaws to survive.
Just like the dirt bikes loud exhaust made us unwelcome most anywhere.
Older engines just sounded cool. Besides the exhaust there was stuff going on.
The whoosh of air going into carbs and the throaty gargle of controlled explosions coming past the open throttle plates is absent in fuel injection and noise is all but eliminated.
All new engines have a tight sewing machine quality to them and thus need tailpipe noise to be different from the other sewing machines.
Soon every Civic had a fart can in back if nothing else.
With "tuner" cars setting off car alarms up an down the streets and the reputation as dangerous street racers soon car meets were banned. Cops swoop in on the few legal meets and peek under hoods impounding some kids life work.
Now it's illegal to cruise.
Yes if you fit a certain profile you can't go on certain streets too often. Something like three passes in an hour and you could be a cruiser.
So you can't drive, can't park, can't pass smog for the street and there's nowhere to race.
Just now they made it illegal to change the ignition mapping.
Let's talk about what really killed tuner cars and speed shops.
Preach it my dude!
Hey Craig, you probably get asked this a bit but where can I get a set of those posters behind you in the frames? The Supra & Skyline I mean.
At @art_tunerz on IG
@@craiglieberman thanks for that!
@@craiglieberman sir what do you do for a living?
I was all the big companies pushing it to the mainstream, shops doing poor work, laws and regulations, insurance, and the money pit the cars were to get no return when you sold, if you even managed to find a buyer. Kids realized they could have bought a much better car for what they put into their civics.
Im just starting to watch this video so i may be repeating what craig said
Such a great time. I remember going to nopi in Atlanta back in 2001 with my rx7
Too many people want their cars as an appliance rather than an expression of who they are.
Tbh they have become appliances. In Western Europe there were horse drawn milk floats into the 80's, a car still represented the liberty to roam beyond the borders of your area code, driving was enjoyable and parking plentiful. Nowadays traffic is congested, parking an expensive hassle, taxes the highest and inspections, requirements and cops the strictest they've ever been... while taxi services (Uber) the cheapest and the need to drive a car the lowest (delivery & work from home).
I wouldn't own (more than) one car if I didn't absolutely need it (and want it - bc I don't *need* my classic cars). If I'd have to get a new car I'd lease it (like most people nowadays), further limiting or even prohibiting my options to modify it.
Expressing myself on the way to and from work suddenly isn't important when my slow diesel delivery van costs less than half per mile and I don't care about damage nor suffer from classic car paranoia.
Too many people don't know what they want until you show it to them, and we've mostly been showing grey crossovers.
Here in L.A. it’s become about street takeovers and as far as racing is concerned it’s just about who has the deepest pockets. Now you can goto the dealer and buy a ten or eleven second street car. It’s no longer about pure car knowledge.
I'd say a lot of JDM snobbery in the mid-2000s really started to change the dynamic of the scene a bit. Those kids that used to snatch up any VTEC or DSM they could find started to grow up and work better-paying jobs. Now they could afford to "ship parts overnight from Japan." JDM became super highbrow and the body kits, Neon Lights & USDM Specs of yesteryear were looked down on. Fast forward a few years then it became All About Time attacks and building the ultimate track car. The JDM guys we're now even older and on the precipice of starting families, so they were working pretty great paying jobs. Their weekend hobby was tracking that brand new Evo VIII they could now afford because they work salaray IT jobs. Couple of buddies of theirs that they went to HighSchool with now on shops and they can get the parts and labor for the low low. Fast forward to today and now it's all about how much money you spent on the car off the lot.
I still have a stack of import tuner mags from 02 I flip through now and again. Always reminds me how simple life was lol
Life is too expensive. That's what killed the tuner scene
Don't you wish they'd raise our wages to how high they used to be? At one point in history, wages rose with inflation to offset it, but in the 80s that stopped.
Electric cars can get fucked. A big portion of being a car enthusiast is getting chills when you hear the tone of a good sounding engine. Racing falls in the same area. You get a rush and a certain excitement from hearing the scream of all the cars, boats, motorcycles etc. pushing it to the limit. Gas engines are here to stay for a long while so long as real racing fans have anything to say about it.
Couldnt agree more Lance
Mortgages and insane housing costs have shackled spending
Every trend or "scene" dies when people behind it moved on with their lives. The generation after will always have a different interpretation of things. It happens to everything. Heck even the car companies moved on realizing that it is no longer sustainable for them to continue creating performance vehicles and parts. I think the tuner car scene is still alive albeit different from what it used to be.
In what way is it different
@@smoketj4830 you should look
The main issues were
1- States became hostile towards the Tuner Crowd making it more difficult to modify cars, DoT make regulations for nonsensical reasons allowing harassment from Police for no reason.
2- Car Companies themselves -
- A - Increasingly made the cars overly difficult to work on
- B - Let dealerships do what they wanted like voiding warranties and having terrible hostile business practices towards Tuners.
- C - Increasingly made a Trend of turning beloved cars into Supercars that were overpriced and out of the tuner price range making it a millionaires hobby rather than for normal people that would take a decent car and make it fast, they basically cashed in on the high end hobby.
- D - Created cars with top end engineering never actually talking with people in the scene allowing basic models that could be modified in unique ways.
- E - Building cars majorly half assed(Hyundai Tiburon GT 2003 with obvious clutch and transmission issues) cheaply cashing in creating Sports Compact cars with seriously unideal or half assed engineering from the start or defects, lets not even get into the false advertising of creating a sporty car calling it a GT and then voiding warrantees and such for driving the car as it is advertised.
I get what you are saying but...the Chinese companies easily won because companies like HKS were overpriced to unreasonable levels, its ok for a company to make money but to gouge the shit out of consumers is always a bad practice, you need to stay reasonable especially since most of their parts came from Chinese manufacturers anyways, how else do you think they got the schematics and design and had the tooling? Companies here used 3rd world cheap labor while still charging top dollar for the parts....in other words they fucked themselves..I have absolutely no sympathy, cost $150 to manufacturer including engineering and testing costs for each one through volume of sales and they charge $800+ what in the 9 hells did people think was going to happen? Post Jobs era marketing and gouging ran companies.
this is probably the best post I've read in this thread
Who wants to run against my V8 Muscle Flake? 🤑
Inflated prices. 20k asking price for an RSX-S with 90k miles doesn't help. The car might be nice, stock, and in good condition, but it's not worth 20k. Check the used car market. You won't believe your eyes.
Both the pandemic and the chip shortage have continued to push prices up, too. Most people don’t realize that modding their cars actually lowers its value. And, modern market sites like Craigslist and FB Marketplace have little regulation when it comes to products.
Bought my first car a few years ago, a crappy 93 Civic project from a guy who had little knowledge of what he was doing for $1.2k. Probably shouldn’t have paid over a thousand. Nowadays I see worse cars being put up for $2.5k-$3k. Parents aren’t going to want their kids driving in questionable shitboxes and kids don’t want to fork a bunch of money for something they might not even be able to repair. Sadly, with the attacks on ICEs, the death of coupes, and automotive companies trending towards high safety systems and bells & whistles vs durability and simpler engineering, it looks like it won’t get better.
But the thing is those cars are no longer being made. The light weight, mechanically simple cars are no longer allowed by the government. Government regulation requires new cars to meet certain safety and environmental standards. These regulations automatically get more strict every year. That's why we are seeing so many small displacement turbocharged engines nowadays.
We need to vote our government out in order to get the good cars back.
I seen versions of my truck going for $28k last year. A mid 2000's truck.
The market is way to crazy to get involved and I'm looking for an upgrade and another project vehicle.
I will wait till this all blows over.
I used to get subscriptions to car mags for Christmas and birthday. I loved it, now my phone has every mag ever and more lol. I even got Max power shipped over.
Things have gotten so expensive this is a rich kids hobby these days
I was 18 in 1997, and I remember the tuner days in southern california. I started tuning my own car in 2000, and I still tune my own car. My two cents are the fast and furious movies killed the tuner scene with the introduction of muscle cars and high-end exotic sportcars in their movies. Gone are the days you'd see a civic or eagle talon on the big screen. They started catering to the wealthy and forgot to include the not so well off import tuner. I also believe video games have killed not only the tuner car scene but the entire car community. Back in the day we would go somewhere away from traffic and race our cars. You're all over here killing families in broad daylight just so you can show off how fast your whip is. Man, I miss car meets where you could roll up, catch a bite to eat, and hang out with cool people. Nowadays, it seems to me like everybody wants to street race, and that's it. Some folks won't even get out of their car at car meets! Everybody wants to play "street outlaw" by driving like an a-hole. Also, I think a lot of guy's are growing up without a dad or male figure in their life who could teach them how to properly work on a custom car.
super street and import tuner were my favorite mags to pick up and read as my grandma shopped around the store lol
I miss the day off finding a $300 beater and beefing it up with salvage parts. Those golden days are long gone.
Hector disliked this vid. Legend has it he still goes to Harry's.
Hey Craig, 27-year old here.
Watching this video not only made me remember the good ol' days of car culture, but also made me sad just how right you are about the fall of tuner culture in general. Nowadays, it's all European stuff whose manufacturers are anal about letting people modify them or American muscle cars with barely any aftermarket work done on them. And whenever you do see a tuner nowadays, it's like catching a glimpse of Hailey's Comet (yeah, that rare in my experience). I've been fortunate enough to see cars from that era in my current life now, but it sucks knowing I'll never get the chance to build one of my own.
By the way, saw the original F&F Eclipse in Gatlinburg's Star Cars Museum recently. I was so happy to be standing next to it, because I love cars like that. Games like NFS Underground, Midnight Club, hell even Juiced (specifically the second game with the Hot Import Nights branding) got me to LOVE these cars in addition to classic muscle or lesser-known European brands like TVR and Ascari. I wish I had the chance to be in the prime of that time at my current age. I'd give anything to have it all back.
Thanks Craig. From one generation of car enthusiast to the next.
It's just so fcking sad. Everybody's driving the same lame cars with no sign of individuality. Furthermore modern cars are nothing but a futuristic disaster. Everything has to have big digital screens. It's a shame really
@@joelkohl6543 Yeah, was in Tesla recently... not for me, never will be.
Also one quick mention. The car market is no longer cars it’s SUV’s and Trucks. The trucks get more mods than any car I’ve seen lately and an SUV isn’t getting any mods because it’s just a big rolling turd and you can’t polish a turd
SUVs are fine. CROSSOVERS are garbage. You can do a lot with an suv
Go buys a sedan or sport 2 seater if you wanna save em, the reason we dont get diverse 2 seater or sedans is the market
Fast and the furious 1. Is the main reason the tuner market died. Went opening day. After that couldn't drive my modified 92 prelude. In the same month I was in court 13 times. We became target's, not to mention everyone in there mom/dad's 4 door Chrysler became street racers. Loved the movie though
I was already 18 when the first movie came out. I was already into the scene before that. It was that movie that killed it. It was a cool movie but it brought in dudes that didn’t know anything about cars and became something other than the cars. D-Bags wanting to be cool is what killed it. Started the decline
Love the line, "....car enthusiasts are all brothers and sisters...."
That made my day, that is the heart of being passionate about cars
Tuner scene isn’t dead
It’s just different and growing again.
And at race track events legal
Hector started that wave, with the NIRA Circuit
Access to road racing tracks seems so much more affordable today. Why spend $150 on a muffler that will get you an extra 2hp when you can flog your car around a real race track for the same amount? Back in the 90's there was no affordable way to test the manufacturer claims on products so people just bought it because it was loud and shiny. These days, one person buys it, posts Dyno numbers, and if it doesn't do anything, no one else will buy it.
‘More environmentally friendly.’ Blink twice if you’re in trouble man!
Nice one Craig, thanks for the dedication on this!
Still have my 93 civic fully built from 98-01. JDM B18c swap, original genuine GReddy evolution1 catback exhaust, original genuine Kaminari Aero hood, original genuine ground designs 2000 black widow kit. Painted Rio yellow Pearl (s2000 color) jams bay everything painted. A true Time Machine. And no cheap Chinese parts smh. The people out here buying up all that APC crap now a days kills me
APC!!! I remember that! It injured the scene, and their distribution center was right off the 71 freeway.
I'm 52, and in my prime during all of this. In my opinion, from the outside, what happened was a combination of smart phones, internet, laziness, getting older and having families, greed, and cost.
The late 90's and early 2000's was a great time.
Yeah cost has really done it for me. Car cost is out of the world, then the mods nowadays are nuts. My boss tells me stories about being abke to work part time at Publix and do engine swaps on the weekends with his friends.. now I look up those same engines they used to blow up and replace 4-6 times a year and theyre $10-20K. Add in all the electronics thst cars have and it just makes the DIY tuning scene non-palatable. Combine that finally with the greed of tuners with what they charge for a ECU or TCU rune is ridiculous, lord forbid you want a custom dyno tune 😵.
I use to know a guy who lived in CA and built a 700hp mark 3 supra, and one day he got pulled over by an officer and they impounded the supra because it wasn’t “street legal”. And the worst part is that the court made him take his supra to the junk yard and have it crushed, Yep, just like that. So no wonder the tuner scene is no longer the same, nonsensical rules and regulations killed a lot of fun for a lot of people
Man I miss the 2000s
I used to love reading every single magazine you mentioned in the late 90s. I remember when import tuner was released.
We were warned back then that the Chinese knockoffs would be the death of the industry but nobody listened. I don't even bother with shows and meets anymore. There's too many jackasses doing dumb shit for social media clout. As far as the big circuit shows, unless you're lucky enough to live near one of the few places that they do the annuals meets your only option is Import Faceoff but even those seem to be drawing less and less of a crowd each year. I'm just glad that I was there for the golden years.
Not to mention some cars now days you can’t even change the stereo cause the infotainment system is link to other parts such as alarms, light timers, door locks, remote start and many more. I used to have a Honda that I fixed up but I sold it 🙄
And you no choice but to buy maestro that goes for $100-200 bucks on top of what radio is going on which can easily go $500 to $1000 just by swapping the radio I get you man. I have my Camry running with audio control lc2 to get all my signal