The Interesting History of World Touring Cars
Вставка
- Опубліковано 20 гру 2022
- WTCC/WTCR may be coming to a close. However, I thought it was worth going back to the formation of this series, to remise on what has been an intriguing ride for the global touring car division.
- Авто та транспорт
I loved the early WTCC cars, such a great roster! That said, one of the main problems I had with this series, particularly in its final years, is the dreadful calendar. Sure the Nordschleife is great and Macau is... unique, but most of the schedule seemed to be a selection of tracks based on how hard it was to overtake in them, to the point of needing joker laps. The European TCR races have been consistently more exciting for years now, and I think the tracks have a lot to do. Also the NGTC cars look and race so much better than TCR imo...
I think the early years of WTCC were the best and most exciting in my opinion. I just think that the series wasn't proactive enough on social media to try and build a bigger audience. Or at least make people aware of the Championship. It also didn't help that some of the Championships were dominated by a particular team or manufacturer for certain periods.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 The WTCC or the aftermath, is for me the stereotype for a championship where a company only enters the series to dominate for a couple of years. During that time they advertise their product, since they got drivers and manufacture championship. After that they just withdraw of it to leave it behind.
I think the original WTCC will be remembered, it was a Golden Era because of the memorable moments. Nostalgia is big with this one, after 2010 though, it fell apart, 2005-2010 was a Golden time for me and I am sure, many others. I feel like it just needed one outstanding year which I suppose 2006 but maybe it needed, a little more. It's most remembered for that Safety Car crash in 2010. I do think, at its peak it was great to watch. The Strangest one for me was the lack of dedication Peugeot showed in 2005 and 2006, they barely showed up and gave up in 2006, Poor Jens Edman was left fighting in the independent with a dealer team. They actually could have done something and do well, utter madness. Not to mention, the big drivers that competed and big shock wins, OGs remember Tom Coronel in his Seat. I believe if they stuck to the roots and not overthink it, it would still be here.
I agree in that the early years were the best years. I did see some Peugeot's in some of the races and thought why they didn't feature much.
Usually the World Championship level of a discipline is the most-watched and the most popular while domestic series are less known outside of their home countries, but for Touring Cars it seems to be the other way round, with the BTCC, DTM and Supercars especially I think being more well known than the WTCC/WTCR, and I've never understood why that is. The quality of the racing maybe, broadcasting and marketing perhaps, possibly not getting much of an international reach compared to the three major domestic touring car championships (and I know it's GTs now but I'm still counting DTM)?
That qualifying rule is an interesting one, it's like a team time trial in cycling, never heard of that being used in circuit racing before. And racing around the Nordschleife in a touring car sounds like a blast.
I think the Championship could've been more proactive in trying to get it's name out more into the public space. Especially, as social media's become more and more important in marketing for motorsport. The qualifying format was definitely interesting. I like how they thought of trying something new and different. Also the Nurburgring races were brilliant to watch. Just seeing the cars go round that track in a race environment, is well worth the watch.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 I found the 2019 Nordschleife races on UA-cam recently. Quite a fun watch (the slipstreaming battle between Vervisch, Girolami and Huff down the back straight during Race 1 was great) but three laps is too short! I know that those made up the usual 50km or so distance but wouldn't it have hurt to give them another lap or two?
I feel like the marketing potential of the series was perhaps limited by it being a Eurosport project.
Tyres, because they wouldn't last. And tyre changes are not fun with touring cars. And also, those races were not fun. Everyone was driving cautiously for 6 minutes to have some action on the straights, just crashes have happened elsewhere.
the btcc has been a joke amateur series since 2000
Biggest impact of WTCC to me (admittedly as an Indycar fan I'm slightly biased) was giving Alex Zanardi his major motorsports run after losing his legs in 2001 - he did a couple of ETCC races in 2003; the full ETCC in 2004 and then the WTCC in 2005-09 and while he was never a title contender he got four wins in his five WTCC seasons which is impressive considering his obvious handicap. The earlier years were probbably more significant - like everything when costs went up and the one manufacturer who could pay dominated then it all went down the tubes a bit and TCR was always the more sensible option.
It may well be that a World Touring Car series just isn't viable - failed in the 80s with the original WTCC and in the 90s with ITC (admittedly both had Bernie involvement and part of that might have been him protecting F1) and while the WTCC didn't fail it also was never really a massive thing globally: although being from the UK and comparing it to the success of the BTCC domestically during that period might make me biased.
I completely forgot about Zanardi, I really should've included his tenure in the Championship as they were some remarkable moments in this series. It's difficult to try and not make a comparison to the BTCC considering the similarities. However, I tried my best to make sure that my sole focus was on WTCC.
As an American auto racing fan, I've always been interested in Touring Cars because racing souped-up versions of normal cars is compelling. That said, there never seemed to be a lot of coverage of the events here.
I think in some ways, that was one of the reasons the World Touring Car Championship never took off. In the UK at least, it was on Eurosport only, throughout the category's lifespan. That doesn't surprise me given how it was Eurosport Events that was the series' promotor. However, that channel doesn't have a huge viewer base (in the UK at least), so the series didn't ever really have a chance to boom. Even with some great drivers from the UK competing, like Andy Priaulx, Rob Huff etc. They never really had a big social media presence either, albeit they did live stream some practice sessions this year, which was a step in the right direction.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 Having a big social media presence and making the races and their drivers accessible online (and in person as well) are keys to success nowadays.
@@geekysteved Certainly, in the current age of racing, having a presence in the social media-verse is key.
@@geekystevedcan you not get BTCC in US?
@@christycullen2355 I think we only get highlights on a more obscure tv channel. That’s it.
the early years were good, when Alfa, BMW and then Chevrolet and SEAT giving proper manufacturer support. There was real attitude on track, as well as real talent. Closest it got to BTCCs heyday.
The problem I think was, manufacturers simply don't want to invest a ton in touring cars. Especially not manufacturers of mostly urban/city small cars. That Lacetti isn't gonna sell because of its performance, but it might because of its practicality and economy. Even DTM, where brands like Audi, MB and BMW have a sporting image to care for, has always had issues.
Another huge issue for WTCC were the tracks. The large GP tracks simply aren't suited for TCs, especially the ones with massive runoff areas. A huge part of BTCC and V8S success has come from their tracklist.
I certainly agree with you on the points you've made. The tracks were a problem on the most part (some exceptions of course). Also I think the slogan of "win on Sunday, sell on Monday" has become less prevalent as the years have gone on, which is usually a big draw for touring car racing, for manufacturers. The early years were the best years in my opinion also.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 "Win on sunday, sell on monday" only works when you can buy car that is closely related to race version. I can see people buying Leon Cupra, 320i or 156 due to its' successes on track. I can't see same appeal for C-Elysse or Lacetti that didn't offer single interesting performance trim or even engine choice.
IMO that's why touring car and rally championships grew so much during group A era. You watched EVO, WRX, M3 or 190E pushed to their edge on track and they were all waiting for you at the dealerships nearby.
i pretty much only knew of the WTCC thanks to simbin's excellent race 07 game. but aside from that its been barely mentioned, and, crucially, barely advertised or shown on tv
I used to own that game as well. Was a fantastic game I have to say.
Same
As nice as that series was, as an American the two biggest things I remember about WTCC/WTCR was “whoever designed that corner needs to be taken into a dark room and beaten”, Tiago Montiero’s crash into an ambulance, and that big crash at that one street track circa 2017 or 18
It had the odd moment which made the rounds on social media. However, it sadly was just "the odd moment". Also I believe you meant Tom Coronel in the ambulance crash, not Tiago Monteiro, although I could be wrong.
I liked it during its initial run of the "slow" S2000 cars. TC1 and Citroens dominance along with the increased development costs for the cars destroyed it in the end. Also the old appeal of touring car racing "win on sunday, sell on monday" might not work anymore.
The original S2000 cars were when the WTCC was at it's best in my opinion. For me it was certainly the best era from a racing standpoint. It has been a long time since we had the "win on Sunday, sell on Monday" approach be used. I think TCR cars are not too dissimilar in appearance to the hot hatch version of their respective cars. However, it's not a road that manufacturers have actively tried going down in terms of marketing.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 The only recent example of "win on Sunday, sell on Monday" I can think of is Toyota making GR Yarises and GR Corollas after their success in rallying.
@@TrolledBy That is a good modern example of one of those things.
This must have been a difficult video to make without adding too much comparison with the superior BTCC
the btcc that hasnt been remotely worth watching for well more than 20 years? for all the issues you could have with it, the 2000s-2010s wtcc at least generally had a field where the amount of actually talented drivers couldnt be easily counted entirely on the fingers of one hand
@@jemimallah2591 didn't watch btcc during the 2010s LOL?
Group A was before my time and I was only a few years old for the heyday of Super Tourers. As a lover of motorsports history they both seemed to hit on a magic formula, cars that look darn close to what you find in the showroom, common rules across continents, and crown jewel events. Throughout the late 80s and most of the 90s Macau, Bathurst, and the Spa 24 drew teams from regional series or one-off entries for big names (or fun, like the 806 racing van).
I hope TCR can somewhat fill the void, especially because they're relatively cheap in the grand scheme of racing. Also, it pains me to say it but I feel like GT3 has somewhat replaced Touring Cars as far as international appeal goes. You can theoretically race the same car at the Daytona 24, Bathurst, Spa 24, Nurburgring 24, Sebring, Petit Le Mans, plenty of national series, and soon Le Mans (with some upgrades).
TCR is a bit like touring cars version of GT3. It's a universal kit that can be used in multiple different categories, is still pretty fast and is quite cost effective.
god, i remember Lopez winning BOTH RACES at almost EVERY EVENT. He is my idol. THE BEST ⭐⭐⭐
He was incredible in the WTCC. An amazing talent.
I mean... "almost every event" was 2 times in 4 years and the second time in the nurburgring the competition direcly behind him failed to even start the race...
Dont get me wrong his level of preformance was almost always unbeatable but not as much as tou remenber...
I came across your channel very recently, and I have to say, it's fantastic. Love the content you are putting and it's definitely quality.
Really like your Street track failure series, can't wait to see what other tracks you have in the pipeline!
Thanks for the high praise, that's very kind of you to say so. I definitely plan on more videos like this in the future, hopefully with more real life racing content to come next year and obviously I hope the quality can remain at least the same, if not higher into the future. Ultimately, I have a huge amount of passion for motorsport and I thought I'd do my best to show that as much as possible. More street track episodes are on the way. The next one hopefully (all going well), will be released on Christmas Eve.
As a NASCAR fan, I've always been interested in the touring car format, so I chose to watch touring car highlights whenever I could this year. The highlights are honestly pretty bad, and even the cool moments I've seen don't hold up that well when compared to BTCC or Supercars. And when your "world" tournament doesn't even outmatch regional tournaments, something's up.
I think since the move to TCR cars, the racing had improved. However, compared to those Championships, I agree in that World Touring Cars did fall behind in the quality of racing product compared to those Championships. I did like some of the new rules they implemented, I think it brought unique elements to the weekend.
Here in brazil we have the stock car pro series, but i think they are more touring than stock cars, in argentina they have the tursimo carretera which i think its stock car too, they have the tc 2000 too
I'm very much aware of the Brazilian Stockcar Series, looks fantastic. Less familiar with the TC2000 and Tursimo Carretera Championships.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 yeah, they are the biggest motorsport category in argentina, the turismo carretera have very "strange" looking cars, but their sound its amazing, the tc 2000 its more normal looking touring cars
@@kanizmajorys2572 I've seen it occasionally but I really need to do some research on the car specifications etc.
I loved it as a student. Watched the short, entertaining races between study sessions on sundays
Sounds like a great way to take your mind off of the studies for a bit of time.
It's a great series in concept, and messing around with the WTCC cars in something like Forza Motorsport 7 was always fun.
The problems that kept the series from taking off in it's actual application were:
A) Massive aero changes will lead to runaway costs and if you're not the top dog in the park this will **always** financially hurt long-term.
B) Most of the circuits are some of the worst showcases of European Track design, as if they were specifically designed to not enable clean overtaking and preserve frontrunners in their qualified positions. Wouldn't be an issue if the series went in hard on rubbing is racing but the FIA generally isn't very onboard with that.
C) Touring Cars are almost always a regional competition that at their heart are closer to the local and national racing culture. If I'm european I can just care about DTM, BTCC, or just general Euro Touring cars. If I'm in China there is the China Touring Car Championship, Brazil has Stock Car Brasil/Pro Series. And America has Trans Am/TA2.
and most importantly
D) They put their trust in Goodyear
Also on a more personal level the gimmickry is a massive turn off. I followed the series through Tom Coronel's youtube channel as a privateer, but between the bizarre qualifying, car fragility, and joker lap stuff it was impossible for me to really develop any serious interest.
Running any racing series as Nurburgring and Macau is a gigantic win and any series that does that deserves full props for doing so.
I agree with a lot of what you're saying here. I'd say personally that whilst I quite liked some of the more interesting rule changes, I can see why it would be hard to follow.
I'm sad that WTCC/R is gone, I like touring cars more than open wheel, but I'm not surprised. Even I'd been disengaged recently, and I actively seek it out, I can't imagine how far out-of-mind it had to have been for someone who watches Formula 1 or NASCAR almost exclusively. I think they had a lot of hope in eTCR but it was just...not exciting.
I think the eTCR series is an interesting idea. I just think the car count is far too small at the moment, even with the unique racing format that was thought of. I'm disappointed it's gone in it's current format. I think a World Touring Car Championship can work, it just needs to be more active social media wise to have a sustained future.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 The idea is very interesting, and the cars are very powerful. I didn't love the execution though.
I remain convinced "world touring cars" is a flawed concept. Touring car racing is grounded in local car markets, and local car markets tend to be, well, local. There's no emotional investment when the cars out on track don't match the ones in the car park, and any kind of world tour basically guarantees that's what will happen. So I maintain the natural state of touring car racing is fragmentation: Australia has V8 Supercars, Germany has DTM, Japan has Super GT, Brasil has Stock Car Brasil, the U.S. has NASCAR and Europe has Super 2000/Diesel 2000 (or had, at least). There might be the occasional dip, but that's the natural state of touring car racing IMHO.
I agree in that the old way of race on Sunday, sell on Monday, is not a common thing with Touring Cars these days. I think a World Touring Car Series can work, it just needs to be more widely available to access to not stifle any growth the series could have.
A common set of rules (like TCR) make sense, so that you can organize a world cup at the end of the year with a few races. That's the way to go IMO.
Well, TCR has been working well in South America, with cars that by the most part aren't sold in the region. But it's the global spec that allows teams to race the same car anywhere, plus the recent introduction of the Toyota Corolla built in Argentina makes it more attainable.
As a big fan of Touring Car racing, the TC1 was the specification that brought down the WTCC. If I were one of the WTCC/WTCR figureheads and seeing how good the BTCC I'd probably be looking at my mates in the FIA asking "Why can't we do it like the BTCC?"
As entertaining as championships running TCR cars can be, the NGTC regs are the way to go in the discipline. The fact it's still growing strong for over a decade (Now in the hybrid era) should be recognised on a worldwide scale
@@shadowlancerracing I think it was around that time the WTCC began to struggle. Although, I feel if the Citroen's weren't all conquering, then it might've been a different story. The BTCC's NGTC regulations have worked brilliantly in recent times. Manufacturer diversity, all cars in with a shout at winning (unless the machinery was really old) and now compatible with hybrid. They've done a great job with that.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 Definetely. Also the V8s in Australia are still huge over there. The fact two national Touring Car championships are far more successful than the world championship pure and simply says a lot.
@@shadowlancerracing The V8's are still massive over in Australia. To be honest I think that series has huge global appeal as well.
In the early 90s the FIA and mainland European touring car series did exactly that by copying BTCC's 2.0L format, later known as Super Touring. It's strange they haven't repeated that trick.
this , besides Le Mans, is the first type of racing that I ever watched and it’s been a “launch pad” into the world of motorsports for me
WTCC and TCR always great racing in my eyes Raceroom does a great job of these cars love them
awsome video BTW
I'm glad you enjoyed the video. WTCC and WTCR definitely had moments, really good moments in fact. Just in my view not consistently enough to get any bigger popularity wise.
Interesting to hear that this series is seemingly bout to fade even in people's memories if you consider that not too many years ago I wrote a statistinc that then WTCC was watched by as many people as F1, around 500 million. I also agree that what would make touring car racing entertaining is heavy contact battles, overtakes and I would lo add to the picture that with touring cars you can race on historical, big ball circuits like Nordschleife, Macau.
That viewing figure surprises me. Although, I guess as a World Championship, I can understand why it would be watched by many people globally.
If I remember WTCC for anything, well, it's for the crashfest it sometimes was. I mean hell, WTCC that gave us the "the guy who designed this first corner should be taken in a dark room and beaten" quote, and was WTCC that had the last full on road block in a while in Portugal. But if I'll remember it for one thing and one thing only, it's the safety car crashing out Franz Engstler at Pau while he was leading the race. That was peak WTCC. Pure chaos that also made for good entertainment.
WTCC/WTCR had it's moments for sure. I think you mean when the track was blocked in 2018 in Portugal. That was the WTCR series.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 Ah, thats probably true, I kinda count them as the same thing even though the cars were a bit different in the TCR class. To be honest, by that point I barely watched it anymore, but in the late 00's/ early 10's I watched quite a bit, it was good fun for a while.
Wtcc 2007-2010 was my favorite racing comeption.
Too many great drivers
Tom Coronel my favorite
Yvan Muller
Augusto Farfus
Andy Priaulx
Richard Rydel
Jorg Muller
Zanardi
Gabrielle Tarquini
Stefano D'aste
Thiago Monteiro
Jordi Gene
Thompson
Rob Huff
Great memories, great cars Lada Priora, Seat Leon, Chevy Lacetti and Cruze, Bmw 320si, Alfa 157
Marrakech races and Farfus accident in Pau, Macau races and Priaulx accident with the safety car
Great memories, o sorry i forgot about Alan Menu he was class as well in Wtcc as he was in Btcc
I must be a die hard fan of wtcc because i do remenber most of the races,
My top are:
2014 race 2 of paul ricard
2015 race 1 of motegui
2017 race 1 and 2 of russia
2019 Qatar
And the
2014 shangai race 2
Great to have seen peak WTCC in the late 00s. FWD diesel powered Seats taking on RWD petrol BMWs. Performance edge went either way on each track. After that dominance by Chevrolet and lost interest. Saw flashes of the Citroën racing a model not available here.
WTCC was part of that moment around 2014/2015 that drew me into racing. I'm a fan of beefed up but recognizable production chassis racing ever since, I love the way these cars looked.
What others have said before is true. As consumers and manufacturers shift towards other interests, the "win on Sunday, sell on Monday" idea is far less compelling, there's no strong reason for factory efforts based on everyday commuters that have little sporting aspirational value. Therefore, TCR customer racing is the best way to go right now.
I was watching "early" WTCC on Eurosport. While Chevrolet was winning overall championships, BMW was still the car of choice for privateers and there was still a lot of on-track battles between drivers in different cars. Updating rules to increase pace almost never ends up well and it backfired terribly. Citroen won everything but nobody cared. Almost no manufacturers commited to the formula and cars while being more agressive looking, seemed more fragile and it looked like they weren't able to race as closely as before.
TCR was great idea badly executed (although refusing to homologate RWD cars was very dumb choice). Strong ties to road cars were promising but huge (for touring car standards) aero packages and rising costs killed series before it got chance to take off. BTCC couldn't choose better when going for NGTC regulations, getting close racing, great looking cars, low running cost and interest of privateer and factory teams alike in one package. As much as I dislike how many mechanical parts are different compared to road cars, they are all shared between cars which makes lowers a cost and decreases performance differences between cars.
I just hope we will see road based touring cars become popular again, in the best scenario with DTM coming back to its' touring car roots.
It would be great to see DTM return in some form or another to a touring style of car. I agree with the points you've made as well. I still think TCR though is doing pretty well all things considered.
This video shows how the FIA literally don't know how to run a touring car series. The reason there was no door to door action for long periods of time? Because the Series bosses insisted on penalising ANY contact between the cars.
It makes sense to have several national / regional championships, a world tour and then a world cup at the end of the year. There was also a world cup from 1993 to 1995.
Tom Coronel got me into WTCC and i enjoyed watching it. Tarquini and Priaulx were my favourites
To me, WTCC always been BTCC’s more grown up, less interesting brother. I hope it survives and can get back to healthy grid sizes again.
It still survives, it just won't be in the same format. Although, it would be great to see it get back to healthy grid sizes.
I always enjoyed WTCC in the earlier days. Even bought a few of the review DVDs. I lost interested when the TC1 cars appeared with Citroen mopping up left right and centre. It also became difficult to follow a full season on Eurosport due to the random showings of the racing.
Manufacturer dominance and awkward TV arrangements held this series back in my opinion.
TCR was created as a "cup for single-brand cups" with the Supercopa SEAT León as the baseline, they wanted single-brand cups to do their own thing and then have some sort of "all-stars event" a couple of times per year, they also wanted the cars to go from sprint to endurance racing with no major effort - In the original batch of TCR cars there were a number of single-brand cup cars like the Peugeot 308 plus the Audi TT was also considered
TCR was doomed by how not-so-cheap the cars are when compared to GT3 cars plus the lack of glamour. This is also the problem GT4 has had from the start. Both GT4 and TCR have a bad cost/glamour ratio when compared to GT3, this is why we see 50-car GT3 endurance races but nothing even remotely close has happened with GT4 or TCR.
I agree in that GT cars in general are more glamorous than touring cars and have a greater appeal in that respect. However, I wouldn't say Championships like BTCC, Stockcar Brazil or V8 Supercars are glamorous, yet those Championships have fared much better than WTCC/WTCR ever did. The regional TCR Championships are also doing fairly well too.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 - Those series are 3 very different things:
· BTCC appeals to the local market, mostly focusing on brands with a big presence in England (that's why Vauxhall is there but Opel rarely races anywhere else)
· Stockcar Brazil and V8 Supercars are technically failures as they've never been able to keep more than 2 brands for long. Also, both series offer a lot more power and now V8SC has increased the downforce to almost DTM-esque levels. I like V8SC (mostly 1998 to like 2008) but, if only Ford and Chevrolet/Holden care, you can't call it a success
TCR failed to meet expectations. They wanted to be the "other big class" at the Nurburgring 24h, they wanted to have TCR-only endurance races with huge grids and they also wanted to have a very solid World-class series. They've achieved none of that. I like the concept, I really do, being following from the start, but it's a complete failure.
@@DiegoRuiz1991 I see where your coming from with TCR. I just personally think that, as a formula, it's managed to gain at least a foothold around the world in several different continents. It hasn't blown up per say. However, the new formula worked well enough for WTCC to adopt the TCR rules package over the prior TC1 cars. I think those categories have obviously had success locally, but at the same time V8 Supercars has got a global appeal, albeit it does only have two manufacturers like you say.
glad to know i wasn't the only one to know that the series was dead and slowly dying. I tried to get into it soo many times but I just couldn't. I'd say the only way you'd be able to remember this series is if you play that race 07 game on xbox 360 or pc
Oh that's a good reminder for me. I used to play that game loads on PC. The Simbin games in general for that era were really good I thought.
I remember TC1 was very bad because of citroen's dominance, but the first international TCR championship was great.
Then when the FIA and EUROSPORT took over the series it decreased a bit in quality.
As I am Spanish it was a little bit difficult to watch BTCC but this year i am watching it and i thinkthat it's amazing.
Great memories of WTCC until 2014. With TC1, it became a much more expensive, and thus an exclusive and sterile series. Yes, WTCR got a bit of the fun back to it, but still it was badly marketed. I'd love to see today's "affordable" cars having only a rollcage fitted, and banging wheels on lesser known tracks around the world.
I think I was at the Silverstone round of that first season with the battle between Alfa and BMW. Remember it being ETC the year before. Pretty sure it was regularly a support race for GT and endurance racing.
The Silverstone races seemed really entertaining when watching the videos of the races back.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 That was a great era for race weekends in the UK, regulary have GT's, ETC/WTC or even BTCC and various single seater series including F3000 on occasion, all at the same event. Paddock usually open too.
If you can, have a look at the Silverstone 24hr, a really interesting race that was pretty short lived and went quite under the radar but was one of the best trackside experiences I've had. The quickest Smart Forfour and the loudest Honda Jazz in the world sharing the track with Mosler's and Ferrari's for 24 hrs. Really cool. Also it's the last time I saw one of the Oreca built Viper's being used in action so there's that.
The days of Priaulx, Farfus and even Turkington in the BMW were the days. BTCC, WTCC, F1 & A1 all making for great weekends of racing. The current ear of racing has really nose-dived even in the BTCC, sadly.
The only reason WTCC will always be memorable to me, is cuz of memories playing a WTCC game on PS1 as a kid.
Would that be the TOCA Race Driver game, or was it something completely different?
Exactly that 🤣
Late 00's WTCC was the best IMO, even though we had the Seat TDI shenanigans. But unfortunately, Eurosport couldn't capitalize on what they've had, so one manufacturer after another left, with BMW leaving hurting the most IMO.
TCR is decent, but doesn't quite do it for me, though this may be because I somewhat lost interest in racing. Quiet, small turbo engines don't do it for me, plus I can't be bothered watching a billion GT3 series.
Maybe we'll see more widespread use of E-Fuel that allow for series with loud, high-revving naturally aspirated engines again. But most car manufacturers don't even build models anymore that would make good touring cars.
But good video on the subject, though I'd like to see a more in-depth look at the WTCC, maybe on particular seasons. Something you may do in the future perhaps. But good work nonetheless.
I agree in that the first years were the best years for the WTCC. I think the series struggled when it came to cost control and then manufacturers dominated. TCR has done well, particularly at being fairly popular in loads of locations around the world and at the same time, being a universal touring car package that can work in countless Championships. I'm glad you liked the video, more will hopefully be on the way of similar (or I hope better) quality. I can definitely look at doing a full season of WTCC and doing a review of it. I'd certainly be interested in doing it for a future video.
My only biggest memory of WTCC era was when John Cleland planned a kidnapping and torturing of Oschersleben's track designer live on TV and Martin Haven simply agreeing in silence 😂
question, why are touring car races so short? or am I being fooled by the number of laps?
No, you're not being fooled, the race distances are quite short. I think it's because touring car racing (being a motorsport discipline that is a bit more used to close quarters racing) likes to have shorter races so that it gives the drivers a sense of urgency to try and make moves and push as hard as possible throughout the race, without worrying about tires or fuel consumption. WTCR/TCR races last around 25 to 35 minutes.
Laughs in Bathurst 1000
There are no pitstops and each round have atleast 2 races on the same track
Kinda hard to gauge it as it (and TC as a whole) is basically non-existent here in the States, though TCR does now exist here, but without a television deal
TCR seems to have found a solid home in the US via the Michelin Pilot Challenge. Other than the WTCC visiting Sonoma for a few seasons, it's presence in the US hasn't been all that high though I agree.
Could someone elaborate on the 'tire issues' referred to at 8:59 which cause Lynk and Co to withdraw?
Lynk & Co were suffering with tire failures for what may have been down to the car's heavy weight, which was due to Balance of Performance reasons.
I want this for the S5000s/Tasman Series/Formula Holden/Formula Ford/Formula BMW (Australian series) and maybe Aussie Racing Cars
I can't guarantee I'll do a video on all of these. However, maybe one or two of the ones you've mentioned perhaps.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 it's one series, it's just changed name multiple times. There's the one with all the names now known as S5000s Tasman Series and there is Aussie Racing Cars
@@mrdiamond365_ Ah ok. I'll do some research on that one.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 you could even do the history of the International Supercars Series (V8 Supercars went overseas to COTA, Bahrain Yas Marina, Shanghai and technically Pukhekhoe/Hampton Downs) or Auscar (Australian Stock Cars at Calder Park and Bathurst in the 70s when NASCAR went to thr Thunderdome)
Hey TyeDye, I was just wondering what did you thought about the FIA coming in and taking contact and track limits more seriously and also the non working BoP system and politics behind it. Cuz I think it was the real downfall of a world touring car scene. And also DTM is facing the same problem, teams are pulling out despite changing to the GT3 category because sprint races and crashes have too much cost. How do you view touring cars as a whole? Apart from being being in love with BTCC
I think touring cars as a whole is doing pretty well. I'd like to see DTM return to it's touring style of car. For me the FIA's approach to contact and track limits was not the main issue with WTCC/WTCR. Personally, it was a multitude of factors that led to the series' decline.
I did enjoy watching the series back in the 2000s with my Eurosport subscription. But, as you said, the racing was a bit of a hit-and-miss: you might get 15 laps of pure adrenaline or a nice nap on the couch.
Honestly, WTCC was just going downhill year on year, especially if you have a constructor that dominated the whole scene. That TCR came up was the downfall of the Super 2000, but even then Discovery just found the way to make it less accessible then the original TCR World Series. I hope this new path TCR will take gets them back up, but not sure if there are going to be a lot of teams/drivers that fly around the world just for one race and go to the next country/continent. We'll see
I think the new World Tour will be scheduled in a way that means teams will be competing in no fewer than two races in a certain continent.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 possibly. It has the feeling of Intercontinental GT Challenge at the moment, but having races with multiple hours versus touring car races that takes for maximum 30 min is something else. Also not to forget their World Tour event at the end of the year. Like I said, hopefully it gets back to the old TCR International Series days, but we'll see.
PS: love the content by the way, watched the failed street tracks. Please tell me you have the Valencia Street Circuit on that list of yours.
@@thomassmets8303 Would be great to see global touring car racing have a sustained period of success. Glad you're enjoying the videos! Valencia is on my list of tracks yes.
Poor track choices didn’t help it to many street circuits
Used to watch ETCC and WTCC during the Super Touring and S2000 era, but it came too late, after the glorious 90s boom of BTCC-style supertourers was long gone. Problem was that when the cost became excessive as it always does, the main teams, BMW, Seat and Alfa Romeo, moved out and there were no new cars to revive interest. FIA's TC1 rules of 2014 only made matters worse, creating a set of rules that meant manufacturers had to build expensive specialised cars that could only race in WTCC and nowhere else - and they were pretty unexciting to boot, unless a Chinese market only Citroen or a bloody Lada is your thing. I lost interest at the time for good. TCR was another failed attempt, pity as in 2017 or 18 it looked so promising.
Costs were a big problem it seems, independent teams never really got much of a look in. It was mainly about big manufacturers and then the racing started to suffer because of it. You can't blame the manufacturers though for doing it. If they can spend money on improving the touring car and thus getting positive headlines about your company winning races, then they have every right to jump at the chance at doing it.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742I know, alas, it happens in all forms of motorsport. Well, it is up to the authorities to make an effective set of rules that keeps cost as low as possible and allows independent teams to participate as well, instead of basing a whole series solely on manufacturers' entries. Of course this rarely happens, so....
9:20 what track is that?
The track is called Anneau du Rhin, in France.
Ah end of an era. I enjoyed throughout but that being said a lot of races were drab compare to Btcc or super cars. The tcr regs I thought would be second coming of super touring after the first seasons grid but sadly burnt out. Euro tcr on other hand has been amazing to watch this year
I also really enjoyed European TCR in 2022. Hopefully, the World Tour can reenergise global touring car racing in some capacity.
European TCR will continue to be on UA-cam in 2023, right?
Tbh the true neckbreaker was the FIA blindly either building regulations for a manufacturer to come in bias the BoP so much towards someone that everyone else kinda lost interest. TC1 failed because of Citroen, WTCR failed because of Lynk. End of the story.
europe's nascar. beautiful. get them on an oval short track
Considering the series raced on the Nurburgring, sometimes did joker laps, along with a cycling style qualifying session, racing on a short oval I imagine wouldn't be completely impossible (albeit I don't think it would work unfortunately).
I think wtcr failed entertainment wise because of the circuits. They're much slower than F1 or GT cars. The btcc used brilliant short versions of circuits such as Knockhill and Brands Indy. It keeps the racing closer than longer circuits like Slovakiaring and boring circuits like villa real. I look forward to you doing a follow tcr video
I think track selection was an issue on the most part. Tracks like the Nurburgring and Macau were good choices in my view.
@@tydyeracinggaming4742 they're good circuits but not necessarily geared up for touring car racing. Macau is challenging but too narrow and the nordscheiffe is awesome but they did 3 laps and each one takes about a week to complete.
If the rule is you can't go back to the "previous" car then why not change one race then change to a third car the next race making the second car the "previous" car just to go back to the original. May not of worked but...
The downfall of touring car racing in general is really sad to see. I mean yes, TCR series around the world have very healthy grid numbers, but for me it seems that aside from few motorsport fanatics touring car they are failing to catch average viewer's imagination as the used to in the 90's and early 2000's. Look at the drivers for example. Names like Alain Menu, Yvan Muller, Gabriele Tarquini, Jason Plato, James Thompson, Fabrizio Giovanardi, Gianni Morbidelli, Rickard Rydell, and others, were massive, highly respected. Now, who the hell knows guys like Yann Ehrlacher, Mikel Azcona or Santiago Urrutia. They are damn good drivers, but even in wide motorsport world they feel a bit anonymus.
What's the reason behind it? My guess would be the rise of sportscar racing worldwide. After demise of original World Sportscar Championship manufacturers had to look elsewhere to make a name for themselves and touring cars seemed like a perfect fit. Reasonably cheap, spectacular and getting more and more coverage on television. As I was born in the year 2000, unfortunately I only witnessed final years of the touring car heyday in late 2000's, but Eurosport's WTCC quickly went on to become my favourite series to watch, maybe even more than F1. Was so fun to watch, BMWs agains SEATs and Chevrolet also gaining momentum with introduction of Cruze, I loved it. And then came this stupid 1.6 Turbo era, which worked absolute opposite to what it was supposed to (no new manufacturers until Honda and Lada in 2013), later TC1 regs which were made to suit Citroën (so much was need for any interested manufacturer), that washed off all the magic, races became mostly dull and predictable. Meanwhile endurance racing regrouped itself and we see the results now with Hypercars, GT3s, LMP2/3 categories blooming.
It's nice to see BTCC still going rather strong, but let's be honest it's only a regional thing now with lack of broadcast outside of UK. TCR World Tour is a good concept, but it lacks any kind of promotion so I give it two, maybe three years and it will also die.
And it all could have been so different. 2018 WTCR season was really promising and 2019 was a banger (I urge you all to watch 2019 Sepang finale, all three races were phenomenal with intense championship battle). It's easy to say that pandemic killed all the momentum that had been gained until this moment, but there were signals that it all might come to an end fairly quickly with Peugeot, Volkswagen and Alfa pulling the plug even before it. Discovery also seemed to lose interest in promoting the series, with abysmal calendar replacement choices for cancelled Asian rounds (how they came on with tracks like Pau-Arnos or Anneau du Rhin is beyond me). It's a crying shame. Let's hope that even with ICE slowly fading out touring cars will get their moment in the sun, whether it will be electric, hydrogen or something else, it doesn't really matter (at least for me), I just want them touring cars to be a big thing again.
Please add the vila real internacional circuit to your fail strett circuits list
I can garantee that this track wont return in 2023 (maybe for nacional).
It might feature in this series. I usually don't add tracks that are still in use, but exceptions are possible.
8:24 wat doet hij daar nou weer
TC1 regulation was a _GIGANTIC_ mistake. Thanks, Citroen. Thanks for absolutely nothing at all.
the world touring car thing was always the wrong way to go about things and after s2000 it was always the wrong cars and costing too much, just a series that was too expensive and mismanaged
I wouldn't say it was mismanaged but I agree in that the series got more and more expensive, particularly with the TC1 category of car.
Now even the electric version of tcr is boring !!! With knockout formats for racing !
Can any1 save touring car racing ???
>Nurburgring
>"Most Daunting piece of tarmac on planet earth"
This guy knows nothing about **Motorsports** does he?
Sounds like you're the ignorant one 😂😂😂
nothing but euro Hatchback milk bottle engines shooting round with mostly euro track. not much of a WORLD series is it
And yet in the 80's and 90's same formula but executed well, proved to be the most popular motorsport worldwide with group A DTM and Supertouring STW/BTCC.