Why don't LiRR and NJ Transit merge to run through trains for an RER/Crossrail type service? May be a video idea for you. Great video here and thanks for clarifying the project. If this could be combined with further Amtrak electrification it could help see electric trains running between NYC and Albany or Springfield MA which would be great.
@SirKenchalot no. the benefits would never come close to the costs, your looking at probably close to a trillion dollars to make both systems compatible
@@lioneljones6484 What are the incompatibilities? Signaling can be made compatible by just putting both systems on the rolling stock and has been done before; dual power has also been done so what's the hold up?
I don't see how Amtrak could ever allow the closure of the Hellgate Line as it would cut off connection to the NEC from Boston with no alternatives? Also the story is incorrect The M8's can be switched to the 25hz Catenary pantographs on the fly, they do it now to switch from the NH to the Shoreline East tracks East of New Haven I believe the main issue is third rail shoes are incompatible with the over rail LIRR system going into Penn Station.
Real talk your channel is fantastic/awesome! When your explain transit scenarios you do it in a very direct and easy way for people to understand! Thanks for not using highly advanced legal or political words,which can confuse the average person! Nonetheless I appreciate your public transportation channel on educating people on the history of public transit and how to use it!I subscribe to your channel! I like Metro North for letting pet dogs on the train!Hopefully your channel grows! 🚆 public transit & Dogs 🐕 for life!
I appreciate the good word! I started this channel because I wanted to talk about something I love (transit), but make it easy for people to understand, so I'm glad to see its doing just that! Thanks for the subscription as well :)
@@DTransit Westchester county is NOT upstate. Second of all, you forgot to mention that Metro-North also has the Harlem Line which will not get access to Penn Station. Go step on a third rail. Idiot.
The M8 third rail shoe can be converted, further (I'm not sure) it may be able to accommodate over and under running 3rd rail on the fly. If this were true they could build over or under running third rail thru the hell gate and up the west side. Or, maybe produce a special M8 that can handle Amtrak's 25kv catenary (in addition to Metro North's catenary req's)and build out the catenary on the west side till merging with the Hudson line where it would then convert to under running 3rd rail.
Is the hudson line connecting to penn station, including 2 new stations? Well, that's very exiting news that i hope the amtrak empire service will be perfect for emu to add a third rail.
I thought that a major argument against through running between Grand Central and Penn Station (which could accomplish everything done by GC Madison and Penn Station Access, and more, at a fraction of the cost) was that Metro North and LIRR equipment is not interoperable. But as I learned in this video, MN equipment will need to be converted to run on Amtrak and LIRR territory. So much for that excuse. In a normal country, MN and LIRR would be merged, equipment standardized, and through running implemented in Manhattan. Imagine if that ball got rolling in 1999, instead of Penn Station Access.
Am I missing something here? What is going to cost $3 billion here? Existing infrastructure is going to be used, and there is no way the Pelham Bay Bridge costs that much to replace.
I believe it is because this factors in - a new rail line added to NEC, electrical capacity down the west side line, 4 new stations, new substations, relocate and reconfigure interlockings, realign caternaries and repair multiple bridges.
I'd be interested in a video on why the Acela is so much slower than comparable high speed services in other countries, and what is being done to make it faster. I was recently blown away to learn that in China, trains can go from Shanghai to Nanjing - about the same distance between NYC and Boston or Washington, DC - in under two hours. That level of service on the NEC would be game changing. What is holding America back?
The Northeast Corridor, the right of way that the Acela runs on, is a system of tracks shared by eight commuter rail operators and four freight rail operators, in addition to Amtrak. There simply isn't enough time and space to operate full speed. There are no plans to change this, because freight rail operation is too structurally and economically important to the Northeast region of the US.
@@ethan8865 I disagree. The problem is the NEC north of New York. Primarily the New Haven line. It's wayyyyyy to slow. That section is what kills the Acelas speed. Amtrak schedules the Acela on the lower section to pass and overtake slower trains. If you want to improve the Acelas Run time. Find a way to reduce it's travel time between New Rochelle and New Haven, then Between New Haven and Providence.
A combination of low quality old tracks with lots of twists cause this, especially in Connecticut. The population density would make building a new straighter right of way nearly impossible
@@noggin6870 Or we just one allow the Acelas to actually tilt along the corridor and upgrade all the tracks to allow an average speed of 70mph. You'll reduce the time from a hour and a half to maybe 45mins. Not great but wayyyy better than the current run time.
I prefer having the Henry Hudson Parkway & Saw Mill River Parkway sent underground & the Hutchinson Line being built for Metro-North Railroad in its right-of-way. These should be the stations on the Hutchinson Line: 🚉 Hartford Central Station 🚉 West Hartford 🚉 New Britain 🚉 Plainville 🚉 Southington 🚉 Waterbury 🚉 Middlebury 🚉 Southbury 🚉 Sandy Hook 🚉 Danbury 🚉 Mill Plain 🚉 State Line 🚉 Brewster 🚉 Croton Falls 🚉 Purdy's 🚉 Goldens Bridge 🚉 Katonah 🚉 Bedford Hills 🚉 Mount Kisco 🚉 Chappaqua 🚉 Pleasantville 🚉 Hawthorne 🚉 Elmsford 🚉 Woodlands 🚉 Chauncey 🚉 Homefield 🚉 Nepperhan 🚉 Lincoln Park 🚉 Riverdale 🚉 Spuyten Duyvil 🚉 Inwood 🚉 Hudson Heights 🚉 Washington Heights 🚉 Hamilton Heights 🚉 Morningside Heights 🚉 Boat Basin 🚉 Grand Central 🚉 Gramercy 🚉 Union Square 🚉 SoHo 🚉 World Trade Center
I also could definitely believe that the Putnam railroad line could definitely be the last stop Sedgwick Avenue and Bruster North Because they is definitely enough room to lay down the Putnam railroad tracks.
@@SomeRamdomAhole This was more of a joke question. There are many practical reasons for this, but it still just seems like an odd thing to be excited for.
Please read oped daily news from july 2023. there needs to be a connection between gct and gcm and Penn station and gateway. we need to get the railroads to work together not build separate infrastructure. the usa needs to get out of the stone age, nobody should be building 8 new terminal tracks at either gcm or gateway, but too late for gcm so we might as well make better use of it. 11 billion for a terminal that moves only 50000 per day is a disgrace. the Elizabeth line moves 600000 and it openned during covid too.
Bring back the Putnam railroad Hudson lines back right along side the Putnam trailer. If Connecticut maybrook has rails and trails together why can the Putnam railroad Hudson lines cant have the same exact thing like Connecticut maybrook has? Instead of them putting a putmam green way on bailey Avenue where the Putnam railroad line used to pass there instead of wasting millions and millions of dollars putting a Greenway over there no body is not going to sit over there where cars and trucks passing by the highways . Leave the vancourtlant park putmam trailer where it starts off and just lay down the train tracks right along side the trailer and make the Putnam railroad be the second stop is Tibbets brook park like they did before. I understand that they wanna start digging the ground and lay down the pipes and sewers above the Putnam railroad tracks so this way they could clean the filthy waters out and shoot the dirty waters down to the Harlem Hudson river.
It's not only the abandoned railroads in New York city. All Abandoned railroads are definitely happing all over the states and countrys. I'm telling you.
Why don't LiRR and NJ Transit merge to run through trains for an RER/Crossrail type service? May be a video idea for you. Great video here and thanks for clarifying the project. If this could be combined with further Amtrak electrification it could help see electric trains running between NYC and Albany or Springfield MA which would be great.
Because the lirr is owned by the state of New York, and njt is owned by the state of New Jersey that's the main reason,
@@lioneljones6484 I figured it would be more political than strategic but would it not be worth figuring out a way to have through trains?
@SirKenchalot no. the benefits would never come close to the costs, your looking at probably close to a trillion dollars to make both systems compatible
@@lioneljones6484 What are the incompatibilities? Signaling can be made compatible by just putting both systems on the rolling stock and has been done before; dual power has also been done so what's the hold up?
@es-zw3mg no just through to Sunnyside, penn central was the first to run wash dc to new haven
This would be so much simpler, and cheaper if we actually had standardization in the US.
Thank You!
This should have done many years ago. Boston still feels the effects of North and South Station being disconnected.
I don't see how Amtrak could ever allow the closure of the Hellgate Line as it would cut off connection to the NEC from Boston with no alternatives? Also the story is incorrect The M8's can be switched to the 25hz Catenary pantographs on the fly, they do it now to switch from the NH to the Shoreline East tracks East of New Haven I believe the main issue is third rail shoes are incompatible with the over rail LIRR system going into Penn Station.
Real talk your channel is fantastic/awesome! When your explain transit scenarios you do it in a very direct and easy way for people to understand! Thanks for not using highly advanced legal or political words,which can confuse the average person! Nonetheless I appreciate your public transportation channel on educating people on the history of public transit and how to use it!I subscribe to your channel! I like Metro North for letting pet dogs on the train!Hopefully your channel grows! 🚆 public transit & Dogs 🐕 for life!
I appreciate the good word! I started this channel because I wanted to talk about something I love (transit), but make it easy for people to understand, so I'm glad to see its doing just that! Thanks for the subscription as well :)
@@DTransit Westchester county is NOT upstate. Second of all, you forgot to mention that Metro-North also has the Harlem Line which will not get access to Penn Station. Go step on a third rail. Idiot.
The M8 third rail shoe can be converted, further (I'm not sure) it may be able to accommodate over and under running 3rd rail on the fly. If this were true they could build over or under running third rail thru the hell gate and up the west side. Or, maybe produce a special M8 that can handle Amtrak's 25kv catenary (in addition to Metro North's catenary req's)and build out the catenary on the west side till merging with the Hudson line where it would then convert to under running 3rd rail.
Is the hudson line connecting to penn station, including 2 new stations? Well, that's very exiting news that i hope the amtrak empire service will be perfect for emu to add a third rail.
Well MTA Metro north railroad will get to do that during Phase 2 of the Penn Station Access project.
I thought that a major argument against through running between Grand Central and Penn Station (which could accomplish everything done by GC Madison and Penn Station Access, and more, at a fraction of the cost) was that Metro North and LIRR equipment is not interoperable. But as I learned in this video, MN equipment will need to be converted to run on Amtrak and LIRR territory. So much for that excuse.
In a normal country, MN and LIRR would be merged, equipment standardized, and through running implemented in Manhattan. Imagine if that ball got rolling in 1999, instead of Penn Station Access.
That operational merger would cost close to 20 billion dollars just for the changes to the 3rd rail system and the conversion of the rail cars
Am I missing something here? What is going to cost $3 billion here? Existing infrastructure is going to be used, and there is no way the Pelham Bay Bridge costs that much to replace.
I believe it is because this factors in - a new rail line added to NEC, electrical capacity down the west side line, 4 new stations, new substations, relocate and reconfigure interlockings, realign caternaries and repair multiple bridges.
I'd be interested in a video on why the Acela is so much slower than comparable high speed services in other countries, and what is being done to make it faster. I was recently blown away to learn that in China, trains can go from Shanghai to Nanjing - about the same distance between NYC and Boston or Washington, DC - in under two hours. That level of service on the NEC would be game changing. What is holding America back?
The Northeast Corridor, the right of way that the Acela runs on, is a system of tracks shared by eight commuter rail operators and four freight rail operators, in addition to Amtrak. There simply isn't enough time and space to operate full speed. There are no plans to change this, because freight rail operation is too structurally and economically important to the Northeast region of the US.
@@ethan8865 I disagree. The problem is the NEC north of New York. Primarily the New Haven line. It's wayyyyyy to slow. That section is what kills the Acelas speed. Amtrak schedules the Acela on the lower section to pass and overtake slower trains. If you want to improve the Acelas Run time. Find a way to reduce it's travel time between New Rochelle and New Haven, then Between New Haven and Providence.
A combination of low quality old tracks with lots of twists cause this, especially in Connecticut. The population density would make building a new straighter right of way nearly impossible
@@thetrainguy1you can't do that without bulldozing several Connecticut towns or doing the insane Long Island Sound tunnel idea.
@@noggin6870 Or we just one allow the Acelas to actually tilt along the corridor and upgrade all the tracks to allow an average speed of 70mph. You'll reduce the time from a hour and a half to maybe 45mins. Not great but wayyyy better than the current run time.
I prefer having the Henry Hudson Parkway & Saw Mill River Parkway sent underground & the Hutchinson Line being built for Metro-North Railroad in its right-of-way.
These should be the stations on the Hutchinson Line:
🚉 Hartford Central Station
🚉 West Hartford
🚉 New Britain
🚉 Plainville
🚉 Southington
🚉 Waterbury
🚉 Middlebury
🚉 Southbury
🚉 Sandy Hook
🚉 Danbury
🚉 Mill Plain
🚉 State Line
🚉 Brewster
🚉 Croton Falls
🚉 Purdy's
🚉 Goldens Bridge
🚉 Katonah
🚉 Bedford Hills
🚉 Mount Kisco
🚉 Chappaqua
🚉 Pleasantville
🚉 Hawthorne
🚉 Elmsford
🚉 Woodlands
🚉 Chauncey
🚉 Homefield
🚉 Nepperhan
🚉 Lincoln Park
🚉 Riverdale
🚉 Spuyten Duyvil
🚉 Inwood
🚉 Hudson Heights
🚉 Washington Heights
🚉 Hamilton Heights
🚉 Morningside Heights
🚉 Boat Basin
🚉 Grand Central
🚉 Gramercy
🚉 Union Square
🚉 SoHo
🚉 World Trade Center
I also could definitely believe that the Putnam railroad line could definitely be the last stop Sedgwick Avenue and Bruster North Because they is definitely enough room to lay down the Putnam railroad tracks.
For God’s sake, is the Lehigh Valley, PA EVER GOING TO GET TRAIN SERVICE??
I want to see New Jersey transit and SEPTA run services to Allentown
Amtrak has a plan to run express routes from newark penn directly to Easton, bethlehem, and allentown by 2035.
I know that people have closer jobs and all, but who honestly would rather go to Penn Station?
You answered your own question….near by jobs and OTHER TRAIN SERVICES THAT DONT TOUCH GRAND CENTRAL brain 🧠 use it.
@@SomeRamdomAhole This was more of a joke question. There are many practical reasons for this, but it still just seems like an odd thing to be excited for.
Have you been to Moynihan or when the renovated parts of Penn? It’s quite nice.
Penn Station gives a closer opportunity for people who want to get to Lower Manhattan and use the city subway to get there.
Nope. It’s not nice. Everyone lies, it’s a death trap. They don’t even have cookies.
Please read oped daily news from july 2023. there needs to be a connection between gct and gcm and Penn station and gateway. we need to get the railroads to work together not build separate infrastructure. the usa needs to get out of the stone age, nobody should be building 8 new terminal tracks at either gcm or gateway, but too late for gcm so we might as well make better use of it. 11 billion for a terminal that moves only 50000 per day is a disgrace. the Elizabeth line moves 600000 and it openned during covid too.
North south rail link better
I can’t believe it’s so hard just to reroute trains. In a normal country, this could be done in a few months
Bring back the Putnam railroad Hudson lines back right along side the Putnam trailer. If Connecticut maybrook has rails and trails together why can the Putnam railroad Hudson lines cant have the same exact thing like Connecticut maybrook has? Instead of them putting a putmam green way on bailey Avenue where the Putnam railroad line used to pass there instead of wasting millions and millions of dollars putting a Greenway over there no body is not going to sit over there where cars and trucks passing by the highways . Leave the vancourtlant park putmam trailer where it starts off and just lay down the train tracks right along side the trailer and make the Putnam railroad be the second stop is Tibbets brook park like they did before. I understand that they wanna start digging the ground and lay down the pipes and sewers above the Putnam railroad tracks so this way they could clean the filthy waters out and shoot the dirty waters down to the Harlem Hudson river.
It's not only the abandoned railroads in New York city. All Abandoned railroads are definitely happing all over the states and countrys. I'm telling you.