There have been a lot of comments about me leaving home to get gas and that most people get gas on the way home from work. In this case it would have added even more time, and would have made the results worse for the gas car. In fact, this was based on a study that states the average time spent going to refuel is 20 minutes, not 18. Although I did cite 20 minutes in the video. I also used 50 weeks instead of 52, and based on the study below it is 17.33 hours spent getting fuel on average and not 15 hours. You can read the study here: boosterusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Whitepaper_Booster_Geotab.pdf
You should also compare cost to fuel also. We had a Acura MDX before our Rivian. The MDX was ~$425/mo…our Rivian cost ~$47/mo. And we fill-up at home, not a dirty gas station.
If you can charge at home, thats obviously the best. The issue with your test is: most people dont take special trips to a gas station. They usually fill up on the way to their destination.
This only seems odd if you’ve never experienced not needing to fill up on the a regular basis because you charge at home daily. Outside of road trips, EVs win out in my mind.
@@nycplayboy78 It may seem odd to you, but this is a real world scenario that millions of people experience. I have research to support my findings. Do you have any research or studies to support yours? If so, I would love to see them.
@@fulltimefather-parttimehero Nothing wins the soul to an issue better than experience. Since I've had my Model Y, I've discovered I'm even lazier than I thought I was.
Yes, you are identifying the change that needs to occur in the conversion from gas to electric "fueled" vehicles. Electric vehicles will be fueled at home, work, or somewhere where they usually remain stationary for a period of time. Stations that fuel vehicles (gas stations) will fade away as the fueling paradigm changes. However, that change is not occurring fast enough.
This is the big disconnect. EV fueling requires fundamental shift in thinking, and it difficult to do if you have no experience charging an EV. Thanks for sharing!
Except you did pay for the solar system and ev charging station, oh and new batteries for the panels and the car. And that's a pretty pricey battery swap. So in the end you pay as much or more.
@@thedukeofmiddleville can doesn't mean they will, I work in automotive and they seem to last 8-12 years in average. And the solar panels have batteries that need changing every 2-5 years, I've sold batteries to panel users for years and theses are the actual averages not the company advertised life expectancy.
@@LupusRex-hf2rl solar panels don't need batteries, and the average length of car ownership is 8 years, and the standard car last about 12 years, so what is the difference besides saving a lot on gas a maintenance with the EV?
#1 you don’t stand next to an EV, hand on the charger, waiting for the charge to complete. Usually you must do that with an ICE vehicle. #2 EVs are fantastic for people who have a garage and a level two charger. you are right, there is no contest as far as how much time you actually spend “filling up.” Plug-in, go inside and chill. #3. The true beauty of EVs is the need to no liquid, poisonous fuel. Is it possible to fuel them with 100% renewable energy. Thanks for your content, Duke, always interesting!
I wasn't concerned about the car being warm😅. I'm would rather not drive in a freezing car which is why I warm or cool my cars before they get in them. On the other hand, I can warm my Rivian up with the garage doors closed. I fact, its set on a schedule to warm or cool my car based on my departure time. This can be done with an ICE car, but not with the garage doors closed without making any noise. Thanks for sharing because a lot of people don't know you don't need to warm modern engines more than a few seconds before driving.
Interesting way to do the time calculation. If you're at home and plugged in (unless you need to go right back out) we shouldn't be thinking about the time it takes to charge to 100%. Even if it is multiple hours, you're not waiting on the charge to complete.
Some data i found about fueling. How much time does the average person spend at the gas station? Drivers are spending about 8 minutes at the gas station each time they stop for fuel. Vehicles have one-third of a tank of fuel, on average, when drivers stop for gas. A gas station stop adds more than 20 minutes to each trip a vehicle makes for fuel. So this is what happens on a trip. My vehicle goes 10% to 80 in 18 minutes. I do all my shopping and restroom breaks while its charging. Add 2 minutes for starting and ending the charge and its a tie. 20 minutes each. That said i will make one or two more stops on a long, 1000 miles or more, road trip. My experience has been 1 extra stop per 1000 miles. This because I drive the speed limit to maximize range.
What do you mean when you say a driver spends 8 minutes at the gas station but then mention a 20 minute stop? Clearly filling up a gas tank is faster than charging; especially when you consider the limited amount of charging stations would most likely necessitate a longer trip compared to finding the nearest gas station.
@@wolfman9999999 Why would you have to “babysit” the fill? You set it to autofill and go inside if you need to. And again, that’s if you need to. If not you can be in and out in less than 10 minutes easily. You can spin in anyway you want but charging an electric vehicle on the road is definitely not faster than pumping up with gas, especially considering a lot of times a full tank of gas will provide 500+ miles. The convenience of an electric vehicle is being able to charge at home. Outside of that it is definitely not easier or more convenient in any way.
@@wolfman9999999 it’s definitely not illegal in every state and yeah of course you are responsible for your vehicle just like if a Tesla catches fire while charging you are also responsible.
One advantage of EVs is that they can be scheduled to leave at a certain time and when it's sub zero outside the cabin, seats, steering wheel etc. can be pre-heated ready to go, all while inside a locked garage.
Except evs don't do so well in the cold, I live in maine and they are trash in the winter here. I see them more suitable for warmer places that don't flood alot.
That is very convenient, but it adds up over time. The carjackers will be at the EV chargers too one day. Yet, $20 a week is about how much it cost to charge my very inefficient 835hp electric truck at home. Thanks for commenting!
China is going to battery swapping. Takes 5 minutes and has the advantage of never needing to replace the battery which is a huge cost and safety concern.
China is not "going battery swapping" - that system is in place for only 1 EV maker NIO ( licensed to a couple more but not yet in use), NIO loses $1Billion USD per quarter. Battery swapping seem like a good idea until 20 people turn up at the swap station ahead of you (and a 1 hour+ wait) and you realise it's the same as having only 1 pump at the only gas station you can go to and everyone lines up single file to take their turn. 1 EV swap station costs the same as 20 Superchargers. Oh you also pay the equivalent of the cost of the battery in rental fees every 7 years, you can't get a 100% charged battery when you swap and it's luck of the draw how degraded the swapped battery is, sure at 30% they take them out of circualtion but you can get a 29% degraded battery. You also have a limited number of swaps per month so if you are out of luck and reached your limit you are stuck with this battery until next swap.
Whats really needed are standardized replaceable batteries. For example, a Tesla battery is composed of 16 modules. if one cell in any of those modules goes bad, hello $15K reman battery. If a Hyundai has a scratch on the plastic cover, bye bye to your warranty. Hello $60K battery. but if batteries were standardized, a mechanic would be able to replace one of 16 modules. Hyundai wouldnt have a monopoly where they can rob people on batteries...etc. Maybe they could make different size modules. Like we have AA AAA C D.... etc batteries.
My Audi takes 5 minutes fill up the tank once every other week on my way to work or back home. The gas station is a half mile down the road from my job. The wife spends more than five minutes plugging her car in and unplugging it, and looping the cord every day over that same two week span. And of course a road trip is no contest.
Have you timed your stops? And not just the stops but the route deviation? This was all timed. I also timed plugging in my truck, but I edited it out because it was less than 5 seconds (timed). Also 5 minutes to plug in an EV at home is highly unusual. Does it feel like 5 minutes or was it timed?
You saying less then 5 seconds must be the action of plugging it into the port and not everything that leads to that. It shouldn't take longer then a min. Plus chargers in my town have been flooded multiple times, and cold weather here adversely affect the battery and charging stations. Electric is only good in certain senerios and should not be forced on free people.@@thedukeofmiddleville
@@LupusRex-hf2rl Well, this turned political. If you don't want an electric car/truck, that's fine. I don't believe @thedukeofmanville was forcing you to an electric vehicle. He was just providing information that others might now have considered. If, after reviewing that information, you want to stay with your gas car, great! But isn't it great that we have more options now?
@@DiegoMejia86 what was the political part, was it freedom of choice? That's not political, that's just an American right regardless of political side.
Thanks, great video. When I drive my ICE 2014 Chevy Impala. I notice it takes more force (foot power, arm power) to drive. Also, I take my foot of the brake when I'm stopped because I forget that I have to keep the brake pedal depressed when stopped. Also, it takes forever and a lot of road length to stop the Impala whereas in Giselle the Ioniq6, I always stop on a dime because I have brake regen and friction brakes. Also, I used to fill up my Impala every Sunday afternoon with gas to drive 30 miles daily to work M-F (because no gas stations oddly on my commute in Winston-Salem, North Carolina). Sometimes while filling my gas tank, I would want a treat so I'd go into the convenience store to get chips and a soda.
7:50 if the pump's on the wrong side, why not pull through, do a K-turn / 3-point turn / turnabout and then pull back in facing the other way so the pump is on the correct side? That would've taken 30 seconds (maximum) to do safely, and you finally pulled in 90 seconds later so I'm taking that minute off the calculation! At that revised 16'46" (1,006 seconds) at 50 times a year (two weeks not using the car on a fancy vacation, or whatever, same as the video's calculations), that's 838 minutes and 20 seconds... 13 hours, 58 minutes, and 20 seconds spent driving to the pump, filling up, and driving back for The Duke in the year. For many people, they have a station on the way to or from where they're going anyway (shopping, work, weekend fun stuff) but even if they didn't have the smallest of detours (pulling in for gas because the supermarket is across the road so there's that small amount of time crossing that road to get from gas station to supermarket) there's still the amount of time to pull in and fuel up. So for some people they just pull off their route and get straight into the pump. Getting off the road and parked, and then getting back onto the road once you're done and back in the car, let's add a minute (30 seconds for arrival and departure) for that, and 4½ minutes is what the industry says is an average time to refuel. 5½ minutes (330 seconds) times 50 weeks is 275 minutes. 4 hours and 35 minutes a year for the absolute best-case hypothetical scenario of someone that can just pull up with the gas station on their side of the road and manage to get a pump every time (maybe they're an early commuter and never see another car at the station every time), and they're not going in to pay at the counter and be lounging around. As I say, this would be a very small subset of drivers that get to only refuel for 4h35m a year. I've given best-case hypotheticals for an ICE, a dream scenario really, now I'm now going to give an example in a year with a road trip distance I've never done (1,000 miles in a week) for a decent EV. Hyundai IONIQ 5 or Kia EV6 with the 800 volt architecture allowing charge rates up to 240kW (similar in size to your Mazda). That will be the standard pack voltage in new EVs in the very near future. Plugging in at home twice a week for 49 weeks, with a one week of a 1,000 mile road trip (at 3 miles/kWh, that needs 5 charges to get from a low state of charge to 80% as a worst case scenario)? Getting home, it takes 15 additional seconds to plug in when arriving or unplugging when leaving, from a wall-mounted charger - the car is going to sit in the garage anyway! Do that twice a week (30 seconds a time, times two) for 49 weeks: 49 minutes. Now for the road trip. Being sensible and using battery pre-conditioning to make sure the car takes maximum juice, a fast charge takes 20 minutes if you get a stall straight away, and let's say 30 minutes if you have to wait ten minutes for one. And let's split that 50/50 for straight in / needing to wait. An average of 25 minutes a visit for five visits, 125 minutes for that week. 2 hours and 5 minutes. Let's add 10 minutes for each charge as additional travel time because those Electrify America locations are in Walmart parking lots and behind a La Quinta hotel a lot of times. 2 hours and 55 minutes for the road trip week, 49 minutes plugging in and unplugging at home... That's 3 hours and 44 minutes for a reasonably priced EV, and not a best case "the EV chargers were always on route, and always available to boot" scenario. Compared to 4 hours 35 minutes for the "my car may as well be powered by unicorn sweat, my gasoline needs are so quickly met"! And like you say, you're not just twiddling your thumbs - you're doing other stuff when charging at a DC Fast Charger that you'd be doing on a lengthy drive anyway. Going for a pee, buying a coffee, having a stretch. EV WINS!
Not at this gas station.There is no room to turn around. Also, here is the study I used, and the average is "20 minutes across all markets" to refuel a vehicle. This would be well over 16 hours a year, but I went for better case scenario for the gas car. boosterusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Whitepaper_Booster_Geotab.pdf Thanks for sharing your detailed analysis based on data!
You could turn your car before driving through by driving past the pump in front of it and reversing to the pump. Some people are probably not comfortable with it.
@@thedukeofmiddleville ya, in the rare times I used EA it’s been okay. Just expensive compared to Tesla. BTW I took delivery of my Limestone R1T. Been great so far. Many differences but very interesting so far. I like it 👍🏼
This is a good video. I really want a Rivian or even an Alpha Wolf truck - if that ever officially comes to market - but I still don't see how charging is faster than pumping. The Math: Round trip to pump gas = About 18 minutes You stated on a Road trip = 40 Minutes/charge 18m x 50w = 900 minutes 900m / 60m = 15 hours/year 40m x 10stops = 400 minutes 400m / 60m = 6.6 hours / road trip. Charging on one trip is almost half the time of pumping for the whole year. 40m x 50w = 2000m 2000m / 60m = 33 hours a year. 33 hour to charge per year > 15 hours to pump per year. If the average person drive 36mi/day and you get about 4mi/hour charging out of a standard 120v wall socket and you charge overnight then charging still takes longer per year. 1h charging = 4mi 36mi / 4mi = 9 hours charging/night 50 weeks x 7days = 350 days/year 9h x 350d = 3150 hour charging per year 3150h / 60m = 52.5 hours per year charging. 52.5 charging/year vs 15 hours/year pumping gas - clearly pumping gas once a week is still faster than charging overnight every night. Still. this is a good thought provoking video albeit a little misleading if you don't take into account all of the variables.
Thanks for sharing! However, I clearly stated this was a comparison to charging at home (which 90% of EV owners do) to going to a gas station (which 100% of gas car owners do). Therefore, the amount of time my EV truck is charging while I'm sleeping is inconsequential since it does not require any of my time, attention, or effort. The fact is that the average gas car owner will spend a lot more time at the gas station fueling their car. Plus most people don't realize how often they stop on road trips without getting gas to eat or use the bathroom. This is why rest areas exist along the highway. Natural breaks are a perfect time to charge your vehicle on a road trip. Check out some of my road trip videos. Also, the average fuel stop is 20 minutes as I stated in my video please see study below: boosterusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Whitepaper_Booster_Geotab.pdf
Time to fill/charge is only one factor. There are many. For example, filling up my tank does not degrade my $18k motor. Charging stations will degrade the battery. With small amount of maintenance, my gas vehicle will last 20 yrs. NO ev battery will last 20yrs. Im not looking to pay the same cost as a motor, for an battery every 5-10yrs. Thats insane. Stress on the electrical grid ... the list goes on and on and on
Research shows that a properly maintained battery will last 20 years. www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/how-long-do-electric-car-batteries-last#:~:text=Generally%2C%20EV%20car%20batteries%20last,management%20systems%20and%20charging%20restrictions.#:~:text=Generally%2C%20EV%20car%20batteries%20last,management%20systems%20and%20charging%20restrictions.
My inner ICE man claims that he would fill up on the way to work or heading back home, greatly reducing time, but those are the times of heavy traffic and pump use, and besides, I never liked to make a side trip to the gas pumps no matter how short. Now that I’ve started charging at home I never want to go back to pumping gas, like an animal.
I agree. It is an imperfect test, however, its a real world test. I just happened to record and time it. However, if I would have based this on the data the average stop at a gas station is 20 minutes, and that's not counting the drive to or from the gas station as I cited in the video. Remember, gas stations make most of their profits from store sales not gas. So, in reality that is not too far off from EV public charging stops. Thanks for sharing
Even in my 250K person city of Winston-Salem, North Carolina, it so happened that there were no gas stations on my 30 mile commute unless I got off the highway. I had to fill up the Impala every Sunday afternoon making a special trip. I sometimes bought chips and soda at the fill up station to cheer myself up. We love our R1T and Ioniq6. We will be selling the Impala in a few months.
Those who say this isnt realistic.... wrong! Let's say your preparing for a long trip the next day.... like vacation. Many go fill up those vehicles the night before. That is to get a early start. This simulates that.
But charging at home it MUCH slower than filling a gas tank. It's disingenuous to not claim the unattended time your EV is charging in your comparison.
Please explain why would you count the time your car is not being used like while you are sleeping? The average car sits unused 23 hours a day while people are engaged in other activities. This is not true if you have to go to a gas station to fuel your car.
Not at all. I do 99% of my charging at my place of employment as they provide them for us. I'm not standing out there waiting for the car to finish charging before I go inside. I plug in, walk in to work, and work my shift. The car is always at it's programmed stopping point (80%) well before I leave. Same for home. Car is plugged in when we return home for the final time in the day on our Bolt. The time the car spends charging is happening while we are doing other things. The time is about lost time spent getting gas.
I support moving to EV life, but let's consider it from the POV of someone living in a condo. They are less likey to have a charge at home option. In their case, they would be driving to a charging station (not charging at home) which at this time are not be as prevalent as gas stations. 18 minutes round trip from 1/4 to full in gas is more like 30+ minutes in charging. EV life, like getting fit, is a lifestyle change until city planning changes. Shopping plazas usually have parking spaces at the far end of the lot that rarely get used. Place EV chargers there and EV owners will park there and top off while they shop. When this becomes more prevalent, even more people will willingly consider EVs just as a daily driver.
That is why the focus of this video is home charging, not public charging. 90% of EV owners charge at home. Therefore, I don't recommend EVs to people that can't charge at home, work, or while shopping for a host of reasons until the charging infrastructure improves.
@@thedukeofmiddleville that's the problem, not everyone has the ability to charge at home. Some people live in apartment buildings or cities where ev charging stations aren't easily accessible.
@@SuperGuyNYC Very true, and for them, it may not be time for an EV. There are tech solutions being worked on (charging posts, wireless charging, etc) but many places will have no easy charging for years. If someone lives in an apartment near a charging station, but still want an EV, they could act out the old ICE gasing routine at charging time. The times I've charged my Model Y at a supercharger and found myself with time on my hands waiting (not many times), I've used the time to play sudoku or watch (part of) a netflix movie or some youtube stuff on the car's infotainment panel.
@@SuperGuyNYC I agree! That is a major issue the I have addressed on this channel a few times, but based on research cars spend an average of 20 minutes at the gas station. So, charging will be best done while shopping or other routine activities> However, there is the issue of cost disparity, but I covered that in another video.
Theres a car make I dont recognize who CLAIMS to have began production of the worlds first BEV with solid state batteries. As I understand it, SSBs can charge in like what? 90 seconds? As the world is currently going electric many many many companies & labs & universities are all doing all kinds of battery research to find the best battery type & chemical makeup for this brave new world So expect to see lots of new innovations appear in the near future. !
Even solid state batteries aren't going to revolutionize charging speeds. My Ioniq 5 can receive as much as 225kw of power while charging. The charging EVSE must also be able to deliver that kind of power. If it cannot, it will cap at the max available power level the lower powered EVSE can deliver. Infrastructure will also have to update itself if/when SSBs ever do make it to production. I'm becoming jaded enough on the "just a few years away" BS that has permeated SSBs for over a decade now, that I'll believe they are on the market when I can actually drive a car with one in it.
I liked the video, thanks. It was interesting. However, I'm sure you'd agree most drivers stop at the gas station on the way home or on the way to a destination. So, you're comparing the worst case of gas refill time to the best case of electric. That is, using your number of averaging 20 minutes at the station itself, they're shopping or using the washroom, they're not just filling up. In your video, from the time you drove in the driveway of the station until the time you were back on the road was 7 minutes. I'd use that as the average case to refuel. That would be ~6 hours a year (at 1/week). Then compare EV the let's say (guessing) 90% case of using your garage charger - estimate of 10s each and 10% of refills at the EV recharge station time (~15mins?). That would give 1h 45min/year for EV vs 6hrs/year for ICE (obviously using the "guess" of 10% refuel at EV charging stations @15mins). You'd still be saving over 4 hours a year using the EV.
It takes even longer to get to that gas station if l went there directly from work. That drive was the absolute best case for a gas car. I didn't get stopped by any red lights for the first time ever. Question: Would you go to the gas station if you had a gas pump at your house? Even if the price to pump at home was slightly lower or equal to the gas station?
Looks like you need both gas & charging stations at the end of your driveway, lol. Your wife is smart for buying a Mazda. Mine has 400k miles and still going strong.
@@thedukeofmiddleville Perl (my MYLR) has since her arrival at the house been our primary "garbage scow" for toting cans down to the street from the house. Unlike an ICE car, for which such a short time running could be a bad thing (condensation, etc), there is no downside to the EV being run for such a short time. This use was the principle reason for the trailer hitch I added to the car when I bought her.
But filling up at a gas station when you get to the pump only takes 2 or 3 minutes max versus having to wait for your car to charge for a really long time. Unless you pay an electrician $2,000 to put in a special plug. You're going to be waiting a really long time to charge your car if you're at a fast charger for a Tesla takes at least 30 to 45 minutes to do a charge. So how is that faster than filling up with a gas car that doesn't make any sense? And if you charge at home, you're waiting a really long time. Unless you have a special plug put in by an electrician
You missed the point completely. This video is comparing HOME charging to gas stations not public chargers. 90% of EV owners charge at home like I do. I own both gas cars and EVs and it's obvious that you don't. So how can you tell me anything about What it's like to own an EV?
Even on a 220 volt charger to go from 40% to 100% takes about 3 hours. So that's still not faster than a gas station, not by a long shot. You don't have to go out to the gas station, but it still is not faster
In real life there’s reason to make an errand of just buying gas. In real life you buy gas along the way of driving. Who makes a separate trip to a gas station, buys gas, and then goes home? So if you’re going behave inefficiently it’s not the cars fault.
The trip from work to the gas station takes even longer, and the national average is 20 minutes. As I stated, I made it favorable to the gas car. Here is the research if you want to know more: boosterusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Whitepaper_Booster_Geotab.pdf
@@thedukeofmiddleville But the main point is how abnormal making a single dedicated errand for gas only is. I’ve never gone out of my way for routine gas more than a couple of minutes. Rural areas may be different. And rural areas charge points would hard to come by. Home charging is great but only if you have a home. Condo owners may be hard pressed for their own charge points for some time to come.
@@larryscott3982The main point is you would never go to the gas station except for the fact you have to go there to get gas. Therefore, its a deviation from your true destination which cost you time which is eliminated if you can charge at home. I think you are getting caught in details that don't change the outcome, but I understand why.
@@xxxseven3168 Let me see. This winter there was a tragic rash of shortage of charge points for those that live in apartments. Zero temps reduced range. High summer temps reduces range. He spun numbers with a bad example.
My wife would constantly ask me to take her car to the gas station to fill it for her because she didn't like stopping on her way home. As an EV driver it was super annoying. Now we both have EVs and couldn't be happier!
Oooh, look at me, everyone uses their house or apartment as a gas station to charge their car. Hours of a charging is more efficient than 5 minutes at the gas station. I take a road trip, then a flight, then an uber to fuel my car, then come back home with no groceries or nothing cause i send my ev to shop for me.
You made a good point that I didn't touch on in the video. Many people charge their cars while they are shopping, eating, or using the restroom. This is an effective use of time since the stop was going to occur anyway. Thanks for commenting!
@thedukeofmanville I'll give you one thing, you are very slick and stick to your guns, but you're not gonna take snippets from my argument to make bonus points for yours. You ain't Oprah.😂
An interesting but flawed video. People who own ICE cars generally tend to combine fueling their cars with commutes to or from work, running other errands, etc. Very few people just hop in their car for the sole purpose of getting gas and returning home - not including filling the cas can for their mowers and other ICE powered equipment at home. I'm an EV owner and advocate. My Partner and I own a 2020 Chevy Bolt and a 2022 Hyundai Ioniq 5. The real advantage on EV commuting is the being able to charge at home and not mess around with the gas station at all. Still, on those stops, unless you go in and mess around, you're going to be in and out in about 10ish minutes. Yes, I also tell people that my time spent messing with charging is on the order of a minute or maybe two - if the charger at work is initializing slowly. On road trips, especially with the Ioniq 5, it's charging curve easily matches an ICE car stop overall - IF the EVSE at the charging station can supply enough electricity - since we as EV owners have the ability to plug in, ensure the charge is started, and walk away to combine shopping/restroom breaks while the car does it's thing. You cannot separate this in an ICE car, which is where their additional time comes from. A more accurate representation would have come from your timer starting as you pulled in and played musical pumps, filling, then stopping the timer as you pulled away from the pump. It'll still be way longer than pull into garage, plug in, and go inside. It would have been a more realistic comparison due to the combining of fueling with other activities which is the norm for ICE cars.
My 835hp Rivian R1T takes 2 hours to charge for 55% to 70% every night while I'm sleeping while a gas car spend 20 minutes on average to fuel up. I own both gas and electric cars, so I might have more experience and knowledge of fueling times for both.
Grateful, you have no idea how inconvenienced you really are stopping for fuel. The real luxury is going straight home and plugging in. There, it makes no difference if you’re charging for 2 hours or 8 hours. You’re waking up to a full charge every day.
It takes zero time to fill an EV from home and zero extra time on road trips. Get home plug in the car max 5 seconds. Road trips - I do a semi-regular 1200mile round trip Sydney to Melboure - I stop twice each direction no matter what I am driving for late breakfast and early dinner - again I just drive up, plug in and by the time I am finished eating and using the bathroom I have plenty of charge to continue, sero extra time.
It takes 30 to 45 minutes to do a fast charge even on a Tesla and that doesn't fully charge the car. To fill up the gas depending on how big the tank it can be one to two minutes or maybe three for a really big tank. Electric vehicles are a scam. They use slave labor to build the batteries. They wear down the roads more because they waste so much. The tires get eaten up really fast because of the weight and they put so many particles into the atmosphere that pollute the air if they catch on fire it's impossible to put out. Also the insurance is so expensive on them. It cost 30 or 40 thousand dollars just to get a new battery. There's no way that everybody's going to buy into all electric. Good luck getting somebody to want to spend all their time sitting there. Charging on the trip with kids in the car and everything. Electric cars are really a scam and they're worse for the environment than gas cars 50% of the power used to charge electric cars now is coal which is the dirtiest fossil fuel there is. Plus plus they're way more expensive also if it's too hot or too cold you lose a huge amount of charge. Maybe really rich people can afford electric cars but the common man cannot. Can't see why bites administration is still pushing all these electric cars. It's ridiculous.
You are talking about a road trip that may happen once a year maybe. Charging an EV at home takes zero of my time because it happens while I'm sleeping, but how much time do you spend going back and forth to the gas station? Look I don't want most people to get an EV because the common person is not ready for them. There is a learning curve that requires a certain amount of aptitude, adaptability, and mental flexibility, and many lack this. Current EV owners are pioneers and risk takers while most other people are followers. Besides the tech is too complex and if you can't charge at home you will be at a disadvantage. So, I agree you should avoid EVs and stick to gas.
False! Please provide proof that no one drives from home to fill up their cars with gas a come back home. Besides It would have taken even longer to do it on the way home in this case. The facts remain the the average person spends 20 minutes at the gas station not counting the drive. If I would have used this data, it would be far worse for the gas car.
15 hours out of your life wasted per year plus you have to breathe in all those fumes 50 times a year and eventually you're going to be wasting more time at a doctor's office. Duke once again another great expose, the numbers do not lie.
no it doesnt. EV are crap. EV get worse mileage in the cold. Ask people in Chicago who got stranded cause they couldnt charge in the extreme cold how they feel. This video is propaganda
That has to do with charging infrastructure, not the EVs. Ask people in Norway where 82% of new cars sold in 2023 were EVs and who have average cold temperatures similar to Chicago. They have no issues with charging.
Its still crap. The battery weighs 1.5 tons? Charged 1.5 tons. Discharged 1.5 tons. that will never change. Ever seen a lithium mine? EV just make your cars Tail pipe as long as the coal fired plant the electricity is coming from. It is like so many other things, it moves the blame, its optics. They are arguably worse than gasoline environmentally speaking. To the people that own them, the reality is all too real. Bottom line for me: They want MORE money for a car that is essentially a large golf cart/grocery getter. EV should be 15k offer minimum essentials for minimum essential trips because that is what they do.@@gerrylum
The average commute for a car is less than 50 miles a day. And the Ave person road trips once a year. So, EVs are a good use case for 80% of Americans.
@@Machistmo Because Tesla cut thier prices, but that is not true of all EVs. In any case, EV prices are supposed to come down, and will continue to, just like all other technology.
Also increase in gas prices will make EVs better and more appealing. Also, low gas prices will make gas stations full and ur gonna take forever to fuel. Also, EVs lower the demand on gas/oil which reduces inflation cuz high gas prices inflate economy. So EVs are not that bad as people think at all
We have an R1T and Ioniq6. I had not heard that gas prices will go up. I was thinking that OPEC and the US were keeping gas prices artificially low to keep gas/diesel demand high. Thoughts?
@@dianewallace6064 gas prices already went up recently. Also, if they stop using gas from the reserve, gas prices will go up unless the US makes more oil/gas
Actually, gas cars milage is not that high too if it is a high-end car with tons of features (about 250 miles). I had this comment some time ago and not too many people considered it. Rivian gives 300 miles which is better than gas. So something like R2 is gonna be really good if it gives 300 miles
Wrong. My Jeep will do over 500 miles on one tank with it's 25 gallon tank. On a highway trip, it's closer to 600 miles. My Audi will also do over 500 miles a tank easily. Mose ICE cars have big ranges.
There have been a lot of comments about me leaving home to get gas and that most people get gas on the way home from work. In this case it would have added even more time, and would have made the results worse for the gas car. In fact, this was based on a study that states the average time spent going to refuel is 20 minutes, not 18. Although I did cite 20 minutes in the video. I also used 50 weeks instead of 52, and based on the study below it is 17.33 hours spent getting fuel on average and not 15 hours.
You can read the study here: boosterusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Whitepaper_Booster_Geotab.pdf
You should also compare cost to fuel also. We had a Acura MDX before our Rivian. The MDX was ~$425/mo…our Rivian cost ~$47/mo. And we fill-up at home, not a dirty gas station.
If you can charge at home, thats obviously the best. The issue with your test is: most people dont take special trips to a gas station. They usually fill up on the way to their destination.
I agree, however, in my case the time difference is insignificant or even longer due to traffic off the main road. Thanks for commenting!
Yeah TQ I agree with you on this because this video seems odd to say the least.
This only seems odd if you’ve never experienced not needing to fill up on the a regular basis because you charge at home daily. Outside of road trips, EVs win out in my mind.
@@nycplayboy78 It may seem odd to you, but this is a real world scenario that millions of people experience. I have research to support my findings. Do you have any research or studies to support yours? If so, I would love to see them.
@@fulltimefather-parttimehero Nothing wins the soul to an issue better than experience. Since I've had my Model Y, I've discovered I'm even lazier than I thought I was.
Yes, you are identifying the change that needs to occur in the conversion from gas to electric "fueled" vehicles. Electric vehicles will be fueled at home, work, or somewhere where they usually remain stationary for a period of time. Stations that fuel vehicles (gas stations) will fade away as the fueling paradigm changes. However, that change is not occurring fast enough.
This is the big disconnect. EV fueling requires fundamental shift in thinking, and it difficult to do if you have no experience charging an EV.
Thanks for sharing!
I HAVE SOLAR PANELS on my home with an EV charging station. I pay nothing for electricity or gas for my car.
That's the way to go!
Except you did pay for the solar system and ev charging station, oh and new batteries for the panels and the car. And that's a pretty pricey battery swap. So in the end you pay as much or more.
@@LupusRex-hf2rl Solar provides power to the house as well as the car, and EV batteries can last 20 years.
@@thedukeofmiddleville can doesn't mean they will, I work in automotive and they seem to last 8-12 years in average. And the solar panels have batteries that need changing every 2-5 years, I've sold batteries to panel users for years and theses are the actual averages not the company advertised life expectancy.
@@LupusRex-hf2rl solar panels don't need batteries, and the average length of car ownership is 8 years, and the standard car last about 12 years, so what is the difference besides saving a lot on gas a maintenance with the EV?
#1 you don’t stand next to an EV, hand on the charger, waiting for the charge to complete. Usually you must do that with an ICE vehicle. #2 EVs are fantastic for people who have a garage and a level two charger. you are right, there is no contest as far as how much time you actually spend “filling up.” Plug-in, go inside and chill. #3. The true beauty of EVs is the need to no liquid, poisonous fuel. Is it possible to fuel them with 100% renewable energy. Thanks for your content, Duke, always interesting!
Thanks for sharing!
Warming up the car is such a waist. Just start it, put on your seat belt and by then, you're perfectly okay to go. The car will be fine.
I wasn't concerned about the car being warm😅. I'm would rather not drive in a freezing car which is why I warm or cool my cars before they get in them. On the other hand, I can warm my Rivian up with the garage doors closed. I fact, its set on a schedule to warm or cool my car based on my departure time. This can be done with an ICE car, but not with the garage doors closed without making any noise.
Thanks for sharing because a lot of people don't know you don't need to warm modern engines more than a few seconds before driving.
Interesting way to do the time calculation. If you're at home and plugged in (unless you need to go right back out) we shouldn't be thinking about the time it takes to charge to 100%. Even if it is multiple hours, you're not waiting on the charge to complete.
I like that I do not get exposure to benzene in gasoline by going EV.
I love it! no gasoline, no oil change and oil filter, no fuel pump, etc., etc.
💯 👍☝️
wrong a lot of ev's have oil filter
THIS!!!
@@johnm.4141 My 2024 Cadillac Lyriq does not have an oil filter
Some data i found about fueling.
How much time does the average person spend at the gas station?
Drivers are spending about 8 minutes at the gas station each time they stop for fuel. Vehicles have one-third of a tank of fuel, on average, when drivers stop for gas. A gas station stop adds more than 20 minutes to each trip a vehicle makes for fuel.
So this is what happens on a trip.
My vehicle goes 10% to 80 in 18 minutes.
I do all my shopping and restroom breaks while its charging. Add 2 minutes for starting and ending the charge and its a tie. 20 minutes each.
That said i will make one or two more stops on a long, 1000 miles or more, road trip. My experience has been 1 extra stop per 1000 miles. This because I drive the speed limit to maximize range.
What do you mean when you say a driver spends 8 minutes at the gas station but then mention a 20 minute stop?
Clearly filling up a gas tank is faster than charging; especially when you consider the limited amount of charging stations would most likely necessitate a longer trip compared to finding the nearest gas station.
@@aprichmanBecause you cannot separate that time spent at the pump babysitting the fill from the bathroom trip and/or supply purchase after.
@@wolfman9999999 Why would you have to “babysit” the fill? You set it to autofill and go inside if you need to. And again, that’s if you need to. If not you can be in and out in less than 10 minutes easily.
You can spin in anyway you want but charging an electric vehicle on the road is definitely not faster than pumping up with gas, especially considering a lot of times a full tank of gas will provide 500+ miles.
The convenience of an electric vehicle is being able to charge at home. Outside of that it is definitely not easier or more convenient in any way.
@@aprichmanLeaving the pump is illegal in every state. You are responsible for the hazmat cleanup and fire if one should start from your negligence.
@@wolfman9999999 it’s definitely not illegal in every state and yeah of course you are responsible for your vehicle just like if a Tesla catches fire while charging you are also responsible.
One advantage of EVs is that they can be scheduled to leave at a certain time and when it's sub zero outside the cabin, seats, steering wheel etc. can be pre-heated ready to go, all while inside a locked garage.
Except evs don't do so well in the cold, I live in maine and they are trash in the winter here. I see them more suitable for warmer places that don't flood alot.
Warming up a car is 10-15 seconds in outdoor zero temps. In the garage no warmup
I get my fuel delivered by Shell TapUp once a week. Strategic for avoiding gas station carjackers. $20 service charge.
That is very convenient, but it adds up over time. The carjackers will be at the EV chargers too one day. Yet, $20 a week is about how much it cost to charge my very inefficient 835hp electric truck at home.
Thanks for commenting!
China is going to battery swapping. Takes 5 minutes and has the advantage of never needing to replace the battery which is a huge cost and safety concern.
China is not "going battery swapping" - that system is in place for only 1 EV maker NIO ( licensed to a couple more but not yet in use), NIO loses $1Billion USD per quarter.
Battery swapping seem like a good idea until 20 people turn up at the swap station ahead of you (and a 1 hour+ wait) and you realise it's the same as having only 1 pump at the only gas station you can go to and everyone lines up single file to take their turn. 1 EV swap station costs the same as 20 Superchargers.
Oh you also pay the equivalent of the cost of the battery in rental fees every 7 years, you can't get a 100% charged battery when you swap and it's luck of the draw how degraded the swapped battery is, sure at 30% they take them out of circualtion but you can get a 29% degraded battery. You also have a limited number of swaps per month so if you are out of luck and reached your limit you are stuck with this battery until next swap.
Whats really needed are standardized replaceable batteries. For example, a Tesla battery is composed of 16 modules. if one cell in any of those modules goes bad, hello $15K reman battery.
If a Hyundai has a scratch on the plastic cover, bye bye to your warranty. Hello $60K battery.
but if batteries were standardized, a mechanic would be able to replace one of 16 modules. Hyundai wouldnt have a monopoly where they can rob people on batteries...etc.
Maybe they could make different size modules. Like we have AA AAA C D.... etc batteries.
My Audi takes 5 minutes fill up the tank once every other week on my way to work or back home. The gas station is a half mile down the road from my job. The wife spends more than five minutes plugging her car in and unplugging it, and looping the cord every day over that same two week span. And of course a road trip is no contest.
Have you timed your stops? And not just the stops but the route deviation? This was all timed. I also timed plugging in my truck, but I edited it out because it was less than 5 seconds (timed). Also 5 minutes to plug in an EV at home is highly unusual. Does it feel like 5 minutes or was it timed?
You saying less then 5 seconds must be the action of plugging it into the port and not everything that leads to that. It shouldn't take longer then a min. Plus chargers in my town have been flooded multiple times, and cold weather here adversely affect the battery and charging stations. Electric is only good in certain senerios and should not be forced on free people.@@thedukeofmiddleville
@@LupusRex-hf2rl Well, this turned political. If you don't want an electric car/truck, that's fine. I don't believe @thedukeofmanville was forcing you to an electric vehicle. He was just providing information that others might now have considered. If, after reviewing that information, you want to stay with your gas car, great! But isn't it great that we have more options now?
@@thedukeofmiddleville You should time a gas trip to Costco!!! LOL
@@DiegoMejia86 what was the political part, was it freedom of choice? That's not political, that's just an American right regardless of political side.
How cold was it outside? I noticed that you had to stand outside while it was pumping.
I don't believe it was that cold outside. Perhaps around 40 degrees F.
Thanks, great video. When I drive my ICE 2014 Chevy Impala. I notice it takes more force (foot power, arm power) to drive. Also, I take my foot of the brake when I'm stopped because I forget that I have to keep the brake pedal depressed when stopped. Also, it takes forever and a lot of road length to stop the Impala whereas in Giselle the Ioniq6, I always stop on a dime because I have brake regen and friction brakes. Also, I used to fill up my Impala every Sunday afternoon with gas to drive 30 miles daily to work M-F (because no gas stations oddly on my commute in Winston-Salem, North Carolina). Sometimes while filling my gas tank, I would want a treat so I'd go into the convenience store to get chips and a soda.
Thanks for sharing Diane!
@@thedukeofmiddleville My pleasure! I have added lots of comments to "spark" some conversation.
I am glad you like your electric vehicle. I will stick with my ICE vehicle.
Right on!
7:50 if the pump's on the wrong side, why not pull through, do a K-turn / 3-point turn / turnabout and then pull back in facing the other way so the pump is on the correct side? That would've taken 30 seconds (maximum) to do safely, and you finally pulled in 90 seconds later so I'm taking that minute off the calculation!
At that revised 16'46" (1,006 seconds) at 50 times a year (two weeks not using the car on a fancy vacation, or whatever, same as the video's calculations), that's 838 minutes and 20 seconds... 13 hours, 58 minutes, and 20 seconds spent driving to the pump, filling up, and driving back for The Duke in the year.
For many people, they have a station on the way to or from where they're going anyway (shopping, work, weekend fun stuff) but even if they didn't have the smallest of detours (pulling in for gas because the supermarket is across the road so there's that small amount of time crossing that road to get from gas station to supermarket) there's still the amount of time to pull in and fuel up. So for some people they just pull off their route and get straight into the pump. Getting off the road and parked, and then getting back onto the road once you're done and back in the car, let's add a minute (30 seconds for arrival and departure) for that, and 4½ minutes is what the industry says is an average time to refuel. 5½ minutes (330 seconds) times 50 weeks is 275 minutes. 4 hours and 35 minutes a year for the absolute best-case hypothetical scenario of someone that can just pull up with the gas station on their side of the road and manage to get a pump every time (maybe they're an early commuter and never see another car at the station every time), and they're not going in to pay at the counter and be lounging around. As I say, this would be a very small subset of drivers that get to only refuel for 4h35m a year.
I've given best-case hypotheticals for an ICE, a dream scenario really, now I'm now going to give an example in a year with a road trip distance I've never done (1,000 miles in a week) for a decent EV. Hyundai IONIQ 5 or Kia EV6 with the 800 volt architecture allowing charge rates up to 240kW (similar in size to your Mazda). That will be the standard pack voltage in new EVs in the very near future.
Plugging in at home twice a week for 49 weeks, with a one week of a 1,000 mile road trip (at 3 miles/kWh, that needs 5 charges to get from a low state of charge to 80% as a worst case scenario)? Getting home, it takes 15 additional seconds to plug in when arriving or unplugging when leaving, from a wall-mounted charger - the car is going to sit in the garage anyway! Do that twice a week (30 seconds a time, times two) for 49 weeks: 49 minutes. Now for the road trip. Being sensible and using battery pre-conditioning to make sure the car takes maximum juice, a fast charge takes 20 minutes if you get a stall straight away, and let's say 30 minutes if you have to wait ten minutes for one. And let's split that 50/50 for straight in / needing to wait. An average of 25 minutes a visit for five visits, 125 minutes for that week. 2 hours and 5 minutes. Let's add 10 minutes for each charge as additional travel time because those Electrify America locations are in Walmart parking lots and behind a La Quinta hotel a lot of times. 2 hours and 55 minutes for the road trip week, 49 minutes plugging in and unplugging at home...
That's 3 hours and 44 minutes for a reasonably priced EV, and not a best case "the EV chargers were always on route, and always available to boot" scenario. Compared to 4 hours 35 minutes for the "my car may as well be powered by unicorn sweat, my gasoline needs are so quickly met"! And like you say, you're not just twiddling your thumbs - you're doing other stuff when charging at a DC Fast Charger that you'd be doing on a lengthy drive anyway. Going for a pee, buying a coffee, having a stretch.
EV WINS!
Not at this gas station.There is no room to turn around. Also, here is the study I used, and the average is "20 minutes across all markets" to refuel a vehicle. This would be well over 16 hours a year, but I went for better case scenario for the gas car.
boosterusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Whitepaper_Booster_Geotab.pdf
Thanks for sharing your detailed analysis based on data!
You could turn your car before driving through by driving past the pump in front of it and reversing to the pump. Some people are probably not comfortable with it.
Did you go to an Electrify America gas station? Broken, full, expensive 😂
That R1S can’t come any sooner. Can’t wait for the delivery video
🤣😆☝️ l thought about that at the time, but in reality most EA charging stops I have had there may have been one other person there charging.
@@thedukeofmiddleville ya, in the rare times I used EA it’s been okay. Just expensive compared to Tesla.
BTW I took delivery of my Limestone R1T. Been great so far. Many differences but very interesting so far. I like it 👍🏼
@@sherwinm Congratulations 🎊
This is a good video. I really want a Rivian or even an Alpha Wolf truck - if that ever officially comes to market - but I still don't see how charging is faster than pumping.
The Math:
Round trip to pump gas = About 18 minutes
You stated on a Road trip = 40 Minutes/charge
18m x 50w = 900 minutes
900m / 60m = 15 hours/year
40m x 10stops = 400 minutes
400m / 60m = 6.6 hours / road trip.
Charging on one trip is almost half the time of pumping for the whole year.
40m x 50w = 2000m
2000m / 60m = 33 hours a year.
33 hour to charge per year > 15 hours to pump per year.
If the average person drive 36mi/day and you get about 4mi/hour charging out of a standard 120v wall socket and you charge overnight then charging still takes longer per year.
1h charging = 4mi
36mi / 4mi = 9 hours charging/night
50 weeks x 7days = 350 days/year
9h x 350d = 3150 hour charging per year
3150h / 60m = 52.5 hours per year charging.
52.5 charging/year vs 15 hours/year pumping gas - clearly pumping gas once a week is still faster than charging overnight every night.
Still. this is a good thought provoking video albeit a little misleading if you don't take into account all of the variables.
Thanks for sharing! However, I clearly stated this was a comparison to charging at home (which 90% of EV owners do) to going to a gas station (which 100% of gas car owners do). Therefore, the amount of time my EV truck is charging while I'm sleeping is inconsequential since it does not require any of my time, attention, or effort.
The fact is that the average gas car owner will spend a lot more time at the gas station fueling their car. Plus most people don't realize how often they stop on road trips without getting gas to eat or use the bathroom. This is why rest areas exist along the highway. Natural breaks are a perfect time to charge your vehicle on a road trip. Check out some of my road trip videos.
Also, the average fuel stop is 20 minutes as I stated in my video please see study below:
boosterusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Whitepaper_Booster_Geotab.pdf
Time to fill/charge is only one factor. There are many.
For example, filling up my tank does not degrade my $18k motor. Charging stations will degrade the battery.
With small amount of maintenance, my gas vehicle will last 20 yrs. NO ev battery will last 20yrs. Im not looking to pay the same cost as a motor, for an battery every 5-10yrs. Thats insane.
Stress on the electrical grid
... the list goes on and on and on
Research shows that a properly maintained battery will last 20 years.
www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/how-long-do-electric-car-batteries-last#:~:text=Generally%2C%20EV%20car%20batteries%20last,management%20systems%20and%20charging%20restrictions.#:~:text=Generally%2C%20EV%20car%20batteries%20last,management%20systems%20and%20charging%20restrictions.
You are mistaken - LFP batteries can last more than 20 years and more than 1million miles.
Get back to me in 20yrs then, I guess.
My inner ICE man claims that he would fill up on the way to work or heading back home, greatly reducing time, but those are the times of heavy traffic and pump use, and besides, I never liked to make a side trip to the gas pumps no matter how short. Now that I’ve started charging at home I never want to go back to pumping gas, like an animal.
I agree. It is an imperfect test, however, its a real world test. I just happened to record and time it. However, if I would have based this on the data the average stop at a gas station is 20 minutes, and that's not counting the drive to or from the gas station as I cited in the video. Remember, gas stations make most of their profits from store sales not gas. So, in reality that is not too far off from EV public charging stops.
Thanks for sharing
Even in my 250K person city of Winston-Salem, North Carolina, it so happened that there were no gas stations on my 30 mile commute unless I got off the highway. I had to fill up the Impala every Sunday afternoon making a special trip. I sometimes bought chips and soda at the fill up station to cheer myself up. We love our R1T and Ioniq6. We will be selling the Impala in a few months.
Those who say this isnt realistic.... wrong!
Let's say your preparing for a long trip the next day.... like vacation.
Many go fill up those vehicles the night before. That is to get a early start.
This simulates that.
But charging at home it MUCH slower than filling a gas tank. It's disingenuous to not claim the unattended time your EV is charging in your comparison.
Please explain why would you count the time your car is not being used like while you are sleeping? The average car sits unused 23 hours a day while people are engaged in other activities. This is not true if you have to go to a gas station to fuel your car.
Taking into account just plugging in the charger is completely realistic. You plug it in, and forget about it. No mental or physical work about it.
Not at all. I do 99% of my charging at my place of employment as they provide them for us. I'm not standing out there waiting for the car to finish charging before I go inside. I plug in, walk in to work, and work my shift. The car is always at it's programmed stopping point (80%) well before I leave. Same for home. Car is plugged in when we return home for the final time in the day on our Bolt. The time the car spends charging is happening while we are doing other things. The time is about lost time spent getting gas.
I support moving to EV life, but let's consider it from the POV of someone living in a condo. They are less likey to have a charge at home option. In their case, they would be driving to a charging station (not charging at home) which at this time are not be as prevalent as gas stations. 18 minutes round trip from 1/4 to full in gas is more like 30+ minutes in charging.
EV life, like getting fit, is a lifestyle change until city planning changes. Shopping plazas usually have parking spaces at the far end of the lot that rarely get used. Place EV chargers there and EV owners will park there and top off while they shop. When this becomes more prevalent, even more people will willingly consider EVs just as a daily driver.
That is why the focus of this video is home charging, not public charging. 90% of EV owners charge at home. Therefore, I don't recommend EVs to people that can't charge at home, work, or while shopping for a host of reasons until the charging infrastructure improves.
Go ahead and do this same test in your ev. Keep it on a low charge and go to the ev station. Im trying to see something real “quick” 😂
My home is my EV station, so there is no need to go to an EV station except for road trips which are rare.
@@thedukeofmiddleville that's the problem, not everyone has the ability to charge at home. Some people live in apartment buildings or cities where ev charging stations aren't easily accessible.
@@SuperGuyNYC Very true, and for them, it may not be time for an EV. There are tech solutions being worked on (charging posts, wireless charging, etc) but many places will have no easy charging for years. If someone lives in an apartment near a charging station, but still want an EV, they could act out the old ICE gasing routine at charging time. The times I've charged my Model Y at a supercharger and found myself with time on my hands waiting (not many times), I've used the time to play sudoku or watch (part of) a netflix movie or some youtube stuff on the car's infotainment panel.
@@slowercuber7767exactly, get a PS portal and there is no wasted time, lol.
@@SuperGuyNYC I agree! That is a major issue the I have addressed on this channel a few times, but based on research cars spend an average of 20 minutes at the gas station. So, charging will be best done while shopping or other routine activities> However, there is the issue of cost disparity, but I covered that in another video.
Theres a car make I dont recognize who CLAIMS to have began production of the worlds first BEV with
solid state batteries. As I understand it, SSBs can charge in like what? 90 seconds? As the world is
currently going electric many many many companies & labs & universities are all doing all kinds of battery
research to find the best battery type & chemical makeup for this brave new world So expect to see lots
of new innovations appear in the near future.
!
Even solid state batteries aren't going to revolutionize charging speeds. My Ioniq 5 can receive as much as 225kw of power while charging. The charging EVSE must also be able to deliver that kind of power. If it cannot, it will cap at the max available power level the lower powered EVSE can deliver. Infrastructure will also have to update itself if/when SSBs ever do make it to production. I'm becoming jaded enough on the "just a few years away" BS that has permeated SSBs for over a decade now, that I'll believe they are on the market when I can actually drive a car with one in it.
I liked the video, thanks. It was interesting. However, I'm sure you'd agree most drivers stop at the gas station on the way home or on the way to a destination. So, you're comparing the worst case of gas refill time to the best case of electric. That is, using your number of averaging 20 minutes at the station itself, they're shopping or using the washroom, they're not just filling up.
In your video, from the time you drove in the driveway of the station until the time you were back on the road was 7 minutes. I'd use that as the average case to refuel. That would be ~6 hours a year (at 1/week). Then compare EV the let's say (guessing) 90% case of using your garage charger - estimate of 10s each and 10% of refills at the EV recharge station time (~15mins?). That would give 1h 45min/year for EV vs 6hrs/year for ICE (obviously using the "guess" of 10% refuel at EV charging stations @15mins). You'd still be saving over 4 hours a year using the EV.
It takes even longer to get to that gas station if l went there directly from work. That drive was the absolute best case for a gas car. I didn't get stopped by any red lights for the first time ever.
Question: Would you go to the gas station if you had a gas pump at your house? Even if the price to pump at home was slightly lower or equal to the gas station?
You make an excellent point, Duke. Thank you.
Thanks, and you're welcome!
Looks like you need both gas & charging stations at the end of your driveway, lol. Your wife is smart for buying a Mazda. Mine has 400k miles and still going strong.
It is a long walk to take out the trash cans😅 The Mazda CX-9 is a good vehicle as well.
Thanks for commenting@
@@thedukeofmiddleville Perl (my MYLR) has since her arrival at the house been our primary "garbage scow" for toting cans down to the street from the house. Unlike an ICE car, for which such a short time running could be a bad thing (condensation, etc), there is no downside to the EV being run for such a short time. This use was the principle reason for the trailer hitch I added to the car when I bought her.
Duke, don't let the Hatorade get you down. Charge ahead! (I could make these puns forever.)
Haters are good for business😄
@@thedukeofmiddleville Alright, business will boom for 30 years. LOL.
But filling up at a gas station when you get to the pump only takes 2 or 3 minutes max versus having to wait for your car to charge for a really long time. Unless you pay an electrician $2,000 to put in a special plug. You're going to be waiting a really long time to charge your car if you're at a fast charger for a Tesla takes at least 30 to 45 minutes to do a charge. So how is that faster than filling up with a gas car that doesn't make any sense? And if you charge at home, you're waiting a really long time. Unless you have a special plug put in by an electrician
You missed the point completely. This video is comparing HOME charging to gas stations not public chargers. 90% of EV owners charge at home like I do. I own both gas cars and EVs and it's obvious that you don't. So how can you tell me anything about What it's like to own an EV?
Even on a 220 volt charger to go from 40% to 100% takes about 3 hours. So that's still not faster than a gas station, not by a long shot. You don't have to go out to the gas station, but it still is not faster
In real life there’s reason to make an errand of just buying gas. In real life you buy gas along the way of driving.
Who makes a separate trip to a gas station, buys gas, and then goes home? So if you’re going behave inefficiently it’s not the cars fault.
The trip from work to the gas station takes even longer, and the national average is 20 minutes. As I stated, I made it favorable to the gas car.
Here is the research if you want to know more: boosterusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Whitepaper_Booster_Geotab.pdf
@@thedukeofmiddleville
But the main point is how abnormal making a single dedicated errand for gas only is.
I’ve never gone out of my way for routine gas more than a couple of minutes. Rural areas may be different. And rural areas charge points would hard to come by. Home charging is great but only if you have a home. Condo owners may be hard pressed for their own charge points for some time to come.
@@larryscott3982Where else would home charging be? 🤭
@@larryscott3982The main point is you would never go to the gas station except for the fact you have to go there to get gas. Therefore, its a deviation from your true destination which cost you time which is eliminated if you can charge at home. I think you are getting caught in details that don't change the outcome, but I understand why.
@@xxxseven3168
Let me see. This winter there was a tragic rash of shortage of charge points for those that live in apartments.
Zero temps reduced range. High summer temps reduces range. He spun numbers with a bad example.
My wife would constantly ask me to take her car to the gas station to fill it for her because she didn't like stopping on her way home. As an EV driver it was super annoying. Now we both have EVs and couldn't be happier!
Gas stations are getting more dangerous which is one of the main reasons I'm getting my wife an EV.
Thanks for sharing!
Gerry, what EVs do you have? Hubby has an R1T and I have Giselle the Ioniq6.
@@dianewallace6064 We have an R1T and a Model Y, though we'll probably trade the Y for an R2 when they come out.
@@gerrylum Understood. I like the R2 but that teal R3X with orange highlights and the Palomino interior looks so awesome to me.
Oooh, look at me, everyone uses their house or apartment as a gas station to charge their car. Hours of a charging is more efficient than 5 minutes at the gas station. I take a road trip, then a flight, then an uber to fuel my car, then come back home with no groceries or nothing cause i send my ev to shop for me.
You made a good point that I didn't touch on in the video. Many people charge their cars while they are shopping, eating, or using the restroom. This is an effective use of time since the stop was going to occur anyway.
Thanks for commenting!
@thedukeofmanville I'll give you one thing, you are very slick and stick to your guns, but you're not gonna take snippets from my argument to make bonus points for yours. You ain't Oprah.😂
@@mikeg02 I'm much better looking than Oprah IMO😂😂
An interesting but flawed video. People who own ICE cars generally tend to combine fueling their cars with commutes to or from work, running other errands, etc. Very few people just hop in their car for the sole purpose of getting gas and returning home - not including filling the cas can for their mowers and other ICE powered equipment at home. I'm an EV owner and advocate. My Partner and I own a 2020 Chevy Bolt and a 2022 Hyundai Ioniq 5. The real advantage on EV commuting is the being able to charge at home and not mess around with the gas station at all. Still, on those stops, unless you go in and mess around, you're going to be in and out in about 10ish minutes. Yes, I also tell people that my time spent messing with charging is on the order of a minute or maybe two - if the charger at work is initializing slowly. On road trips, especially with the Ioniq 5, it's charging curve easily matches an ICE car stop overall - IF the EVSE at the charging station can supply enough electricity - since we as EV owners have the ability to plug in, ensure the charge is started, and walk away to combine shopping/restroom breaks while the car does it's thing. You cannot separate this in an ICE car, which is where their additional time comes from. A more accurate representation would have come from your timer starting as you pulled in and played musical pumps, filling, then stopping the timer as you pulled away from the pump. It'll still be way longer than pull into garage, plug in, and go inside. It would have been a more realistic comparison due to the combining of fueling with other activities which is the norm for ICE cars.
Have you thought about just installing a fuel pump at home?
Yes, solar panels.
I fill up on my way back from work and the gas station is on the way. So thats 5 mins to fill up vs hours to charge a car 😂
My 835hp Rivian R1T takes 2 hours to charge for 55% to 70% every night while I'm sleeping while a gas car spend 20 minutes on average to fuel up. I own both gas and electric cars, so I might have more experience and knowledge of fueling times for both.
@@thedukeofmiddleville 2 hours for 15 percent vs 20 mins for a full tank of gas
Grateful, you have no idea how inconvenienced you really are stopping for fuel. The real luxury is going straight home and plugging in. There, it makes no difference if you’re charging for 2 hours or 8 hours. You’re waking up to a full charge every day.
Oh well I'll wait till evs have 500 mile range and can charge in 5 mins plus I can fill it up on my way home.
It takes zero time to fill an EV from home and zero extra time on road trips.
Get home plug in the car max 5 seconds.
Road trips - I do a semi-regular 1200mile round trip Sydney to Melboure - I stop twice each direction no matter what I am driving for late breakfast and early dinner - again I just drive up, plug in and by the time I am finished eating and using the bathroom I have plenty of charge to continue, sero extra time.
stop the cap
It takes 30 to 45 minutes to do a fast charge even on a Tesla and that doesn't fully charge the car. To fill up the gas depending on how big the tank it can be one to two minutes or maybe three for a really big tank. Electric vehicles are a scam. They use slave labor to build the batteries. They wear down the roads more because they waste so much. The tires get eaten up really fast because of the weight and they put so many particles into the atmosphere that pollute the air if they catch on fire it's impossible to put out. Also the insurance is so expensive on them. It cost 30 or 40 thousand dollars just to get a new battery. There's no way that everybody's going to buy into all electric. Good luck getting somebody to want to spend all their time sitting there. Charging on the trip with kids in the car and everything. Electric cars are really a scam and they're worse for the environment than gas cars 50% of the power used to charge electric cars now is coal which is the dirtiest fossil fuel there is. Plus plus they're way more expensive also if it's too hot or too cold you lose a huge amount of charge. Maybe really rich people can afford electric cars but the common man cannot. Can't see why bites administration is still pushing all these electric cars. It's ridiculous.
You are talking about a road trip that may happen once a year maybe. Charging an EV at home takes zero of my time because it happens while I'm sleeping, but how much time do you spend going back and forth to the gas station?
Look I don't want most people to get an EV because the common person is not ready for them. There is a learning curve that requires a certain amount of aptitude, adaptability, and mental flexibility, and many lack this. Current EV owners are pioneers and risk takers while most other people are followers. Besides the tech is too complex and if you can't charge at home you will be at a disadvantage. So, I agree you should avoid EVs and stick to gas.
Lets says both cars were on close to e one goes to the gas station and one stays home. The gas car still wins
Okay, but why would an EV be on "E" when its parked at home and charged at anytime? Your home is the gas station with an EV.
@@thedukeofmiddleville gas still wins
No one drives from the there house to the gas station and than back home wtf
False! Please provide proof that no one drives from home to fill up their cars with gas a come back home. Besides It would have taken even longer to do it on the way home in this case. The facts remain the the average person spends 20 minutes at the gas station not counting the drive. If I would have used this data, it would be far worse for the gas car.
15 hours out of your life wasted per year plus you have to breathe in all those fumes 50 times a year and eventually you're going to be wasting more time at a doctor's office. Duke once again another great expose, the numbers do not lie.
Thanks! Yes, tailpipe exhaust causes a lot of health issues such as cancer from benzene exposure.
no it doesnt. EV are crap. EV get worse mileage in the cold. Ask people in Chicago who got stranded cause they couldnt charge in the extreme cold how they feel. This video is propaganda
That has to do with charging infrastructure, not the EVs. Ask people in Norway where 82% of new cars sold in 2023 were EVs and who have average cold temperatures similar to Chicago. They have no issues with charging.
Its still crap. The battery weighs 1.5 tons? Charged 1.5 tons. Discharged 1.5 tons. that will never change. Ever seen a lithium mine? EV just make your cars Tail pipe as long as the coal fired plant the electricity is coming from. It is like so many other things, it moves the blame, its optics. They are arguably worse than gasoline environmentally speaking. To the people that own them, the reality is all too real. Bottom line for me: They want MORE money for a car that is essentially a large golf cart/grocery getter. EV should be 15k offer minimum essentials for minimum essential trips because that is what they do.@@gerrylum
The average commute for a car is less than 50 miles a day. And the Ave person road trips once a year. So, EVs are a good use case for 80% of Americans.
uh huh. why do they lose most of their value before the payments are made? Tesla are the worst investment you can make. @@thedukeofmiddleville
@@Machistmo Because Tesla cut thier prices, but that is not true of all EVs. In any case, EV prices are supposed to come down, and will continue to, just like all other technology.
Also increase in gas prices will make EVs better and more appealing. Also, low gas prices will make gas stations full and ur gonna take forever to fuel. Also, EVs lower the demand on gas/oil which reduces inflation cuz high gas prices inflate economy. So EVs are not that bad as people think at all
All great points! Thanks for commenting!
We have an R1T and Ioniq6. I had not heard that gas prices will go up. I was thinking that OPEC and the US were keeping gas prices artificially low to keep gas/diesel demand high. Thoughts?
@@dianewallace6064 gas prices already went up recently. Also, if they stop using gas from the reserve, gas prices will go up unless the US makes more oil/gas
Actually, gas cars milage is not that high too if it is a high-end car with tons of features (about 250 miles). I had this comment some time ago and not too many people considered it. Rivian gives 300 miles which is better than gas. So something like R2 is gonna be really good if it gives 300 miles
Wrong. My Jeep will do over 500 miles on one tank with it's 25 gallon tank. On a highway trip, it's closer to 600 miles. My Audi will also do over 500 miles a tank easily. Mose ICE cars have big ranges.
@@Japplesnap what Jeep is that?