Losing so many ships in the war and later to the free navy conflict might turn out to be a good thing for the UN. As stated, the UNN has fallen into complete stagnancy for decades to maintain the high number of ships. With most of the ships gone, the UNN can grab this opportunity to finally properly modernize their navy since all the funding to repair and maintain their massive navy can be redirected to the efforts. Maybe not until MCRN standards but at least it comes out as a better-equipped force. But the UNN would have lost most of it's experienced personnel and crew with all those ships blowing up in space or the corruption in the UN would hamstrung any modernization efforts like what they did with the Leonidas class. Plus, Marco just have to throw some rocks at earth, devastating the economy and everything else lol. Will the UN be able to recover from this? These are just my thoughts, what are all of your opinions? I would like to hear it :)
@@felixleong61 the UN does not recover from this for a good 30 years. Mars doesn't recover either from the events of the show in that same period. The inner planets were permanently damaged and never really recovered entirely even still.
The UNN should have concentrated the majority of its outer forces into a single battlefleet, fully maximizing on its numbers to counter the individually superior but numerically inferior MCRN forces, leaving only light forces to police, show the flag, and during war to raid the MCRN shipping and bases. A little strategy from Alfred Thayer Mahan
If you follow the show the MCRN captain prior to the mutiny says that they were soundly beaten in the Saturn system and that Admiral Souther used his numerically superior numbers to do so. She also expected that they would be defeated over Callisto as well as she noted the superior numbers bearing down on them. So Souther apparently offset the tech advantage with more hulls wherever he could. So if not for the mutiny and UNN being crippled by own betrayal even the MCRN expected to be forced to regroup over Mars because Souther was a capable admiral.
@@mangalores-x_x tbf the Saturn campaign cost earth there 5-1 advantage down to 3-1. If mars could stall earth the numbers would be equalised and that's game over for earth. Earth was, since the beginning of the show, playing against time. Sadavir and his crew knew Mars would overtake earth in the near future. Hell, if CMDR Duarte's plan was adopted they could have done so already. This is why there are rogue elements in the earth government that want to start the war with mars at any cost, it's their last chance to win.
Mars specifically developed stealth tech to counter that. By having stealth ships, they force earth to spread their forces across the entire system in order to be able to defend against attacks everywhere. Mars knows where all of earth's ships are, earth does not know where Mars' ships are. This prevents them from creating a doomstack and just overrunning Callisto, as they have to keep ships defending every rock from earth to titan.
This was a truly a fascinating in-depth video which I quite enjoyed. It was intresting to see the ratio of ships which each side had and the strategic state of the background fighting.
the simple loss of a 5 to 1 advantage to 3 to 1 advantage implies you lost 2/5 of your ships if the enemy lost none. That is a 40% loss rate to begin with. If you guess that the MCRN lost a third of its fleet you are looking at truly massive losses.
That is a highly unlikely loss rate. The MCRN might field newer, more technologically advanced vessels, but basically everything in the expanse serves as a missile bus. A 5 to 1 numerical advantage means that the MCRN’s point defense technology would have to be five times as effective as Earth’s to break even in an exchange of missile fire. The Donnager and Shiroco classes simply don’t carry 5x as many missiles as the UNN. A Donnager might be more advanced than a Truman....but it won’t defeat Two or even Three of them coming after it at once. The MCRN attempted to offset the numerical disadvantage by packing Morigan class destroyers into the Donnager. That gives them a greater first strike capability, and picket destroyers are a fantastic way of lessening missile barrages against the main capital ship.....But the Morigan class has a glaring weakness in it’s own defenses, it lacks a ventral PDC cannon, and is too small to carry much endurance. The MCR found a way to field more numbers, but their quantity was not up to the quality of the UNN vessels.
@@Matt-yg8ub the Donnagers can carry 6 of the rocinante type Corvettes or 12 morrigans (and presumably some combination of the two). Also 1 donnager could probably take on 2-3 Truman's. Definitely 2. The foehammer railguns are titanic and make the Truman class ones look like kids toys.
@@Matt-yg8ub I'm not sure that's a fair assessment. We see it destroyed on screen BECAUSE of its power. It's a shock factor ship. It's the worf effect or whatever it's called. A character or thing known to be powerful is defeated or destroyed to build up the threat level of a villain. Every time we see a donnager destroyed it's in entirely assymetric circumstances.
@@will2brown50 That’s the problem…Every time we see a Donnager on screen, it gets destroyed. Donnagers we’re heavily hyped and considered invincible…..in the era BEFORE the UNN /MCRN war. However, following that conflict we also see the MCRN decommissioning some of those presumably brand new ships. Admiral Currano Basically highlighted at the MCRN took significantly greater losses in the war than they expected, in part because the UNN did not under perform like they expected them to… And in part because their own fleet vessels did not live up to their overhyped expectations.
Noice! There are so many great parts to the expanse that can be easily missed and this looks like a great overview of how complex and catastrophic combat in space could be
I would love to see battle analysis of major fleet engagements. Maybe in season 5 a Mars, earth or joint fleet will attack a free navy fleet. If not now then in season 6.
@@spark5558 pipe down sparky.. that was earth's broadcast.. why would they even show the losses they are hsving?? until agatha king rerouted unn was left with around 50 to mcrn's 25.. shared by expanse team.. that doesn't look 5:1 does it?? well.. who looks like winning?
I know technically in the series it hasnt happened yet but has there been any art made of the laconians empire or the battle of pallas station from the later books?
I use adobe suite. Illustrator to make the icons and sprites, After Effects for anything complex and animated, and Premiere to put it all together. Audio is literally just my phone with a laniard mic using the built-in voice recording app. All post processing of the audio is done in Premiere itself.
Luna is a Roman deity, an embodiment of the moon. Technically the moon was always called Luna and the Sun was always called Sol. This just means that the Russian language uses the original Latin name. It does not directly translate to moon. It's a name like Jupiter or Neptune, etc.
I also suspect that it differentiates it from the many other moons in the System/Galaxy. Any of them could be called 'moon' completely accurately, because they are moons, but none are 'The Moon'. Remember that many sci fi lores are trying to show a perspective that isn't from down in this gravity well, perspectives where 'The Moon' is just another barren rock in a system (or Galaxy) of barren rocks.
UNN at Ganymede: "I'm gonna whoop Mars's ass for this!"
UNN at Io: *_"I'M GONNA WHOOP MY OWN ASS FOR THIS!!!"_*
MCRN has left chat
Just remember, the Ganymede battle was a lost for the UNN, the Io Campaign saw the UNN take severe losses (-:
Losing so many ships in the war and later to the free navy conflict might turn out to be a good thing for the UN. As stated, the UNN has fallen into complete stagnancy for decades to maintain the high number of ships. With most of the ships gone, the UNN can grab this opportunity to finally properly modernize their navy since all the funding to repair and maintain their massive navy can be redirected to the efforts. Maybe not until MCRN standards but at least it comes out as a better-equipped force.
But the UNN would have lost most of it's experienced personnel and crew with all those ships blowing up in space or the corruption in the UN would hamstrung any modernization efforts like what they did with the Leonidas class. Plus, Marco just have to throw some rocks at earth, devastating the economy and everything else lol. Will the UN be able to recover from this?
These are just my thoughts, what are all of your opinions? I would like to hear it :)
@@felixleong61 the UN does not recover from this for a good 30 years. Mars doesn't recover either from the events of the show in that same period. The inner planets were permanently damaged and never really recovered entirely even still.
That MCRN flag is wrong...here, let me fix it..
*triggered duster noises, and Bobbie when she first saw the Amos version of the flag noises*
What you think that’s funny do ya?
The UNN should have concentrated the majority of its outer forces into a single battlefleet, fully maximizing on its numbers to counter the individually superior but numerically inferior MCRN forces, leaving only light forces to police, show the flag, and during war to raid the MCRN shipping and bases. A little strategy from Alfred Thayer Mahan
If you follow the show the MCRN captain prior to the mutiny says that they were soundly beaten in the Saturn system and that Admiral Souther used his numerically superior numbers to do so. She also expected that they would be defeated over Callisto as well as she noted the superior numbers bearing down on them. So Souther apparently offset the tech advantage with more hulls wherever he could. So if not for the mutiny and UNN being crippled by own betrayal even the MCRN expected to be forced to regroup over Mars because Souther was a capable admiral.
@@mangalores-x_x tbf the Saturn campaign cost earth there 5-1 advantage down to 3-1. If mars could stall earth the numbers would be equalised and that's game over for earth. Earth was, since the beginning of the show, playing against time. Sadavir and his crew knew Mars would overtake earth in the near future. Hell, if CMDR Duarte's plan was adopted they could have done so already. This is why there are rogue elements in the earth government that want to start the war with mars at any cost, it's their last chance to win.
Mars specifically developed stealth tech to counter that. By having stealth ships, they force earth to spread their forces across the entire system in order to be able to defend against attacks everywhere. Mars knows where all of earth's ships are, earth does not know where Mars' ships are. This prevents them from creating a doomstack and just overrunning Callisto, as they have to keep ships defending every rock from earth to titan.
@@will2brown50 saving the military instead of the country
That’s a pretty bad idea as the stealth ships would run out of steam quickly
@@reentrysfs6317 explain what you mean
I love the Mars faction and their ships.
Get the fuck out.
Expecting a comment war between UN and MCRN citizens here.
I love all ship designs in the expanse
@Kato Ho Ten Soeng I agree. The Martians uses new, advanced ships while the UN uses old but reliable ships.
@Kato Ho Ten Soeng more like utilitarian
This was a truly a fascinating in-depth video which I quite enjoyed. It was intresting to see the ratio of ships which each side had and the strategic state of the background fighting.
the simple loss of a 5 to 1 advantage to 3 to 1 advantage implies you lost 2/5 of your ships if the enemy lost none. That is a 40% loss rate to begin with. If you guess that the MCRN lost a third of its fleet you are looking at truly massive losses.
That is a highly unlikely loss rate. The MCRN might field newer, more technologically advanced vessels, but basically everything in the expanse serves as a missile bus. A 5 to 1 numerical advantage means that the MCRN’s point defense technology would have to be five times as effective as Earth’s to break even in an exchange of missile fire. The Donnager and Shiroco classes simply don’t carry 5x as many missiles as the UNN. A Donnager might be more advanced than a Truman....but it won’t defeat Two or even Three of them coming after it at once.
The MCRN attempted to offset the numerical disadvantage by packing Morigan class destroyers into the Donnager. That gives them a greater first strike capability, and picket destroyers are a fantastic way of lessening missile barrages against the main capital ship.....But the Morigan class has a glaring weakness in it’s own defenses, it lacks a ventral PDC cannon, and is too small to carry much endurance.
The MCR found a way to field more numbers, but their quantity was not up to the quality of the UNN vessels.
@@Matt-yg8ub the Donnagers can carry 6 of the rocinante type Corvettes or 12 morrigans (and presumably some combination of the two). Also 1 donnager could probably take on 2-3 Truman's. Definitely 2. The foehammer railguns are titanic and make the Truman class ones look like kids toys.
@@will2brown50 On paper the Donnager class is a beast, in practice however it is far far less effective.
@@Matt-yg8ub I'm not sure that's a fair assessment. We see it destroyed on screen BECAUSE of its power. It's a shock factor ship. It's the worf effect or whatever it's called. A character or thing known to be powerful is defeated or destroyed to build up the threat level of a villain. Every time we see a donnager destroyed it's in entirely assymetric circumstances.
@@will2brown50 That’s the problem…Every time we see a Donnager on screen, it gets destroyed. Donnagers we’re heavily hyped and considered invincible…..in the era BEFORE the UNN /MCRN war. However, following that conflict we also see the MCRN decommissioning some of those presumably brand new ships. Admiral Currano Basically highlighted at the MCRN took significantly greater losses in the war than they expected, in part because the UNN did not under perform like they expected them to… And in part because their own fleet vessels did not live up to their overhyped expectations.
I'd love to see you do a tactical review on some of the battles/engagements of the show (Attacking the Donnager, Boarding Thoth station etc).
Thank you so much for the support! Battle for Thoth Station is definitely on my radar for the next Expanse tactical / strategic review.
I have been waiting for someone to do videos like this!
GLORY TO TERRA
@Kato Ho Ten Soeng burn them dusters
Blood for the blood god?......
No? Okay.
Great work. Thanks for taking the time to put this together.
Noice! There are so many great parts to the expanse that can be easily missed and this looks like a great overview of how complex and catastrophic combat in space could be
Room for side stories in the Expanse
Earth must come first, Earth should always come first, Earth will always come first.
Earth cringe
In books, the war started much earlier during the first book. Ganymede just reignited of hostilities after Eros
so cool, could watch these all day]
I would love to see battle analysis of major fleet engagements. Maybe in season 5 a Mars, earth or joint fleet will attack a free navy fleet. If not now then in season 6.
Great video.
You forgot the MCRN's capture of Ceres.
Seems like the show did as well because I don't recall any of that
@@wurzel9671 Listen to background info you'll pickup if you listen carefully also The UN beat Mars at Saturn
@@spark5558 pipe down sparky.. that was earth's broadcast.. why would they even show the losses they are hsving?? until agatha king rerouted unn was left with around 50 to mcrn's 25.. shared by expanse team.. that doesn't look 5:1 does it?? well.. who looks like winning?
I know technically in the series it hasnt happened yet but has there been any art made of the laconians empire or the battle of pallas station from the later books?
By battle of Pallas station do you mean the spaghettification of Pallas.
Can you do Star Trek? Specifically the Dominion War from Deep Space Nine.
LOVE The Expanse!!!! Dusters!
What editor do you use?
I use adobe suite. Illustrator to make the icons and sprites, After Effects for anything complex and animated, and Premiere to put it all together. Audio is literally just my phone with a laniard mic using the built-in voice recording app. All post processing of the audio is done in Premiere itself.
@@FirstPassOfficial thanks
1:05 what is this martian flag ?
the real one is here --> www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/c14f38/since_all_my_fanart_of_the_expanse_got_claimed/
great video btw
Woops my mistake XD I’ll have to slip that into a future video as an easter egg, maybe “What if the UN-MCR War Continued?” ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
One year War Gundam XD
Earth must come first.
Tywin Lannister mars aeternum
Great video, man. Just slow down a bit when you speak, I noticed you slurred some words. Just friendly advice:D
War of the worlds.
Nice
This was a long and stupid mainly because the un ships fired on each other for no reason
For the Mars！
Luna literally means "moon" in russian just fyi. Not sure why a lot of sci fi lores name the moon "Luna"
Luna is a Roman deity, an embodiment of the moon. Technically the moon was always called Luna and the Sun was always called Sol. This just means that the Russian language uses the original Latin name. It does not directly translate to moon. It's a name like Jupiter or Neptune, etc.
I also suspect that it differentiates it from the many other moons in the System/Galaxy. Any of them could be called 'moon' completely accurately, because they are moons, but none are 'The Moon'.
Remember that many sci fi lores are trying to show a perspective that isn't from down in this gravity well, perspectives where 'The Moon' is just another barren rock in a system (or Galaxy) of barren rocks.
@@reanetsemoleleki8219 In spanish it does translate directly, the sun is el sol and the moon is la luna
Sounds like a computer talking.
Admittedly, my early videos have shitty audio quality.
Slow down and enunciate