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Nema 23 IHSV57 Integrated Servo motors on Bf20
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- Опубліковано 16 лют 2018
- Mach4
Velocity=X,Y,Z 6500
Acc.= 1200
Steps X, Y=1000 Z= 800
Velocity A-Axis 30000
Acc.=20000
Steps 277.77
With my Leadshine 2 nm Closed Loop steppers the Velocity was 3500 on X and Y axis.
Z-Axis was 3000 but with an air spring asistance.
The air spring is not necessary anymore, the JMC motors are having much more power.
You can even go higher with the velocity with these JMC Motors, but in my opinion this makes no sense.
Usually you do not have any series production and thus you slow down the feed to avoid collisions in the beginning.
To find out the right settings was a little bit time consuming, especially if you have no glue about all these Servo related parameters before.
The Documentation and the given Tool are also not really helpfull.
But at the end i am very happy with these motors.
Right now i am using one 480W 48V 10A Power Supply for all 4 Axis and it seems to be enough.
Thanks to Sebastian, he gave me the inspire.
• Servos für 133 Euro? m...
There are also a German forum article exist where you can find some usefull informations.
cncwerk.de/forum/viewtopic.ph...
I also created a cable protection box for 3d printing.
You can download it here.
www.thingiverse.com/thing:279...
![[CNC-Mill] Ep02 - JMC iHSV57 Wiring](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/68DOefS1CSM/mqdefault.jpg)
Wow super fast. Great work :)
Thanks
Hello Gerhard, impresive movement you have there and I would like to do the same. My mill is the HBM bf28, another version of the bf20, pm25mv, wm16b etc. Where can I see more information on the build, thanks subscribed and watching your other videos
May I ask what power supply you are using? I just hooked up one of these motors (bench mounted, not on mill yet), with a 48V, 9.8 Amp, switching power supply from brand Mean Well. It works great in general. Only issue is if I have the acceleration higher than 15 inch/s/s in UC-CNC program, the power supply makes a clicking noise. It actually only makes the noise when I release my finger from the jog button. I could job for 1 minute straight, and no noise. But as soon as I release the jog key, it clicks. Its almost like the power supply is resetting. My coworker suggested it might be back emf from the servo. At less than 15 units/s/s acceleration, there is no clicking noise. This is with the motor spinning at 3000 RPM, mounted on a bench.
Hi Gerhard, excellent work. What is the highest acceleration you could achieve with these 180w motors?
Hello Gerhard, I have the same machine and I am using Mach3 and smoothstepper. Now waiting the 200w JMC servo to come. I was wondering if you connect the enable pins as well to the BOB or just a normal stepper you only use step and dir? Thanks a lot!
Thanks for the video, just ordered mine! Can you run these in Step/direction? I'm wondering if I can use mine with GRBL. Also is the Z also a 180w, what reduction/ratio?
Yes there is a reduction on all axis 15 to 30 teeth
with motors that big do you need belts and pulleys. can you explain if its for torque or speed that you need.
I would like to see more of your build.
Belts an Pulleys are left from my previous stepper motors. I think you can drive the machine in this size without.
But i really don't like this direct mounting. With this belt housings you can integrate the motors better in to machine.
For example the Y Axis motor is along side the base. Not really visible, no extra space in to the front.
Also the machine is fast enough even with the down gear.
Most of time i am not using full rapid speed. I have no serial production, like most any other peoples with this kind of machines.
So speed is more or less senseless.
Hi, thank you for the video and also for the download link for the dust cover. I printed out the dust cover, and it does not fit onto my servo motor. I don't know if mine are different than yours. Mine is revision 6.03, and I believe yours are revision 5.x. I don't know if JMC made any changes to the physical size. I measured your CAD, and it is 67.6 mm from the inside wall front to the inside wall back. My 3D printed parts measured very close to that, at 67.4 mm.. My physical JMC servo measures 68.5 mm in the same place. I could not get the 3D part to "stretch" over the servo electronics. Just letting you know. I have no idea if anyone else printed them and tried them. Thanks for the idea anyway. I will use your design as a starting point, and modify it to fit my servos.
Hi Nick, dont know if there a difference on versions. But i can give you the Solidworks files if it helps.
@@gerhardschroder7827 Not necessary. I can use your design for inspiration and make a new one, depending on how I do the cabling. Thanks!
Hello Gerhard. Thumbs up - it's really nice job done on your BF20! I am just about to begin with my BF20 (clone) conversion to ballscrews and CNC. I was searching the internet about size of motors I should go for and found your video. I find these cheap servo motors really good value(performance) for the money. Can I ask if you are still running the machine on original setup (I guess you had to scrap it?) or did you replace it with linear rails on your XY table? Also I like the idea to run it via pulleys and timing belt. Is it 1:1 ratio? I still can't believe that only 0,5Nm servo can achieve such performance :-) I saw LOTS of such conversions but they usually go with massive 4Nm steppers no XY and even bigger Nema 34 on Z. And last question is - are you using Pokeys on your BF20 too? How do you like it?
Thanks! Jan
Hello Jan,
i have no linear rails on my machine.
I have spent many months to scrape up all the dovetails and an the table within of a 0,01 mm. Also the Angles.
Honestly, if you really have the plan to create some acurate parts you have to rework the machine. Otherwise you can not adjust the dove tails to get it nearly play free. It will stuck on all corners and edges if you try this. :-)
On the Z tower i had more then 0.4mm inacuracy within the dove tails.
I also saw that people converted the machine using linear rails.
I thing that is pointless. The stiffnes of that machine is much to less. Even when you use that support structure i use.
I would reather creating a new machine from concrete like this german guy.
ua-cam.com/channels/P_zryLiphD1PNDt4DP3XWA.html
I also wanted to build a new machine like him. But my plan was to create the tower and the base from 12mm steel. Welded togheter and fill up with concrete or resin.
The casting method this guy is using is not so time and money consuming.
I will wait the result when he is finished.
My pulleys have a ratio of 2:1. On my Z axis i have enough power. Before i must use an air spring with the 2nm closed loop system.
I use a Smoothstepper for the mill. But on my lathe i am using the Pokeys cnc board.
It's workin perfect.
I use my lathe still conventional with two encoders. There is not noticable time lag while turning.
If i have time, i going to introduce that machine also.
Hi Gerhard,
thanks for your answer. Of course I am fully aware of limits of this machine. I'm not really planning to run some series on this machine. I bought it for hobby purposes only. Soft materials and aluminium. I'm planning to stay on dovetails as I find it crazy milling those off and replace with rails. This construction is not still rigid enough so it's not just worth it. Especially connection between crosstable and the tower is very wild :-). I wish I could scrape on my own. I've never done it before and unfortunately I don't know anybody is really able to scrape properly and show me how to do it. It's a masterpiece work and there is not much ppl who can do that anymore. Using steal construction filled with either concrete or epoxy might be a way too. I was thinking about it as well. Actually even simple sand might be quite effective. It will consume vibrations very well. It just requires closed construction. And also welded construction requires heat treatment to release the stress so it's not an easy one :-) So thanks for your info re timing pulley ratio. I'll follow your recommendation. Btw is this ok even for Z axis? And when we talk about Z axis 0,4 play is quite a lot! Is it left/right play or up/down? I'm pretty sure that by default milling head is only fixed by one M10 screw. It can easily accommodate 3xM12 screw. In the other hand if you already fixed that you might need to cut smaller chips because if you go too hard then the Z dovetails tends to bend :-/
Have a great Easter!
Jan
Hello Jan,
i will give you an easter surprise.
www.dropbox.com/s/wriavl9nsb8l5cz/Bf20Fr%C3%A4se_32.exe?dl=0
This is a self running 3 d model of my machine.
Is not the current status with the new motors, but i think it will help you to build up your machine.
Unfortunately i did not activate the measurement functionality when i saved this model. But my current model is a bit confused and at the moment i have not the time to get it fitt. To many projects i have.
Ratio > I have on all axis the same gear ratio. 15 to 30 tooth.
Haha thank you so much. Is it the model you presented in one of your vids? Can't wait to download it. I think it will help me to figure out lots of details about the machine. I'm about to start with the project soon :-) Thanks for valuable inspiration. Jan
Ok enjoy.
This is a self running edrawings file.
Good day Gerhard, Where did you buy harmobics drive? Do you have a link and price? Im also thinking to upgrade my steppers on JMC servos. Thank you.
Hello, i have gotten these Harmonic drives from Ebay years ago.
So far i remember i paid 150€ per piece.
+Gerhard “GerdS” Schröder Cool, was it used or new? Are you happy with performance? Thank you.
These are used drives, and the performance i great.
No play anymore.
Bofore i used a 150 Vertex Round table, but i was not reallxy happy wit this solution. I tried to make this table play free, but with higher speed and long work time the table begun to stuck. (temperature)
If you are interested of my construction, i can send you a link to a self running edrawings file.
+Gerhard “GerdS” Schröder Thank you, yes you can send me a link to: mario.mlinaric@gmail.com
Does that low torque motor actually work for milling? Video cutting any parts? Or just moving the table? 180w is something like .57nm or 80oz torque. That’s seriously very low torque for a vertical milling machine during cutting and more so a servo made for a 3D printer. I’m blown away it lifts and holds your Z axis. By the way I’ve seen those integrated servos for $75 online plus $25 shipping.
Hello Glenn, absolute satisfied with the power of these motors.
My previous 2nm closed Loop stepper did a much more better job then the 3nm normal stepper motors i had in the beginning.
I did videos of some parts after the conversion. I will take a look if it worth to upload.
Gerhard Schröder ..,interesting I just watched another video and these servos were cutting at high speeds on a mill. ua-cam.com/video/w1t0W9u9II4/v-deo.html
Then another where gentleman couldn’t get a solid circle on a small router. Must be in the servo tuning. Did you spend much time tuning them? I have on order for a 3D printer but I’d definitely consider trying on a router after getting feedback.
Did eat some time to tune the servos. But only of my little knowledges in PID Servo controller stuff.
A lot of investigating and trying out. But i found a good setting for this machine without big contouring error.
Another?? Did you have to buy external drivers for the can bus on those servos? Or did you connect like a stepper and run direct to motion board? I’m being told I need $65 can bus drivers for each servo.
Just connect the Servos to the BOB
To confirm these are the 180w models?
Yes
Gerhard Schröder I’ve been looking all over online for software and procedure to tune the drivers. How did you manage to change driver settings?
Is this the right link? www.jmcdriver.com/service.php?cid=149
Hallo Gerhard. Nice idea. I just wonder. I am retrofitting a small mill. If I use stepper motors they need to be 6.4Nm minimum. Q. Is this JMC 180W servo strong enough for this mill, or do I need the JMC 400W servo. 2th Q What do I need to let it work. Power supply and BOB? Or something else to get the information from the PC to the servo. Can't find any information about this.
Hello Jan, i think they are to little for a mill bigger then these BF20 to 30 mill.
You could use a higher reduction, but i would not recommend it.
@@gerhardschroder7827 What about the 400W motor?
It depends of the machine size.
Whats the name of the machine ?
@@gerhardschroder7827 It is a small mill, but cast iron and 1,7 m high, weight about 500 Kgr. Make is Belgium name Jaspar. Z axes is moving tabel up and down and is about 40 Kgr. It is more solid than the BF 20, 30. X=400, Y=200, Z=200
I would ask somebody who build up a machine with these 400 W Servos allready.
For example Sebastian End
ua-cam.com/channels/P_zryLiphD1PNDt4DP3XWA.html
It's in German, but so far i know he is also able to answere you in english.
Hi! It looks like the retrofit conversion is based on einfach-cnc.de/bf20-version-2/. I have the same too. I was looking in replacing the stepper motors (Nema24) with these JMC Servo. THe IHSV57 are Nema23 and therefore have 47.14mm space between mouonting holes. While the Nema24 used in the German kit have 50mm pattern. I see JMC also sells the 200w model which are Nema 24 with 50mm hole pattern. How did you mount he JMC IHSV57 on this motor mount? Did you machined again the back plate? Thanks.
Yes it is based on this Einfach CNC machine.
I did the mounting plates new for the JMC motors. But i would recommend to change this mounting plates in this manner, that you are able to adjust the tention of the belt.
Either via slotet holes or pressure roller.
@@gerhardschroder7827 Thanks for the quick reply! Yes I was also suprised of the lack of pretension for the belt. it's done well but you will always introduce a bit of backlash if you do not have it well tensioned. WOuld you still recomand the 180W version over the 200W ones? 180W are easier to find everywhere, while the 200W are not even on the JMC weebsite anymore. No idea why. Maybe too similar to justify 2 models for them. Thanks for the info.
@@gerhardschroder7827 ah last thing. I have a 48V 15A power supply now. Do you think would that be OK for the Jmc servo or better to grab a 20A one? Thanks
@@Ale_Lab When you have a reduction, then the 180W is absolute OK. Without the reduction the torque is to less in slow movements.
And i also never use the full rapid speed of the machine. Usually i only machining single parts and slow down to 1/4 speed.
Is to dangerous when you have a bad g-code.
@@Ale_Lab Can not say. I have not in mind, the machine is not in my house right now.
But i would use the bigger one.
wow Gerhard, what a great work you have done!!! I want one!!! I bouht these motors but now i realise that I have no clue how to setup them... did you use sofware to tune them? Do you have some source how did you setup them... that would really help... thanks!!
Hello Ricardo, there is a German forum article exist where you can find many informations and a self written tool (page 38) to parametrise the motors. I think with the help of google is not a problem to understand.
On the page 46 i published some screenshots of my experiences with the settings.
On the first page you can find the vendor tool for parametrise .
Hope that helps.
Oh i missed the link.
cncwerk.de/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=806&sid=a916064182b9ddb76fb3b658706ae0e9
But you could also find in my description of the video.
too dangerous !?!?!? PSSSSH its perfect