60 Second Battle: Marshall JMP 2203 vs Marshall JCM800 2204
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- Опубліковано 7 жов 2024
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Gibson SG with Custombuckers
1980 Marshall JMP 2203
1985 Marshall JCM800 2204
All the knobs are at noon for both except gain is maxed and master volumes are set to be equivalent volume. They are both at VERY LOUD settings.
Knobs are MIA on the 2203 but I assure you they are set to noon.
Greenback IR
Man, they both sound great. JMP is my favorite of the 2. You are doing some great recordings man!
Thanks Kurt!
Great comparison! I love the more greasy and wild tones from the 50W 2204. And the dimed pre-amp volume dials out the 1nF treble cap, making the sound fuller. As a side-note, a good mod to do on the regular non-master 1959 (100W) and 1987 (50W) is to shift the 4,7nF treble cap from the bright channel volume pot to the normal channel volume pot. It will make the normal channel much more useful.
I love warm, thick tones but in this style JCM 800 is and will remain undisputed king forever.
That JMP sounds MUCH better to my ears. Not sure if the difference I am hearing is 100w vs 50w or the gen. But I wish Marshall still made the 78-80 JMP.
I have several 70's JMP 50/100w amps. The 100 watters all have a bit more lower mids and sound more robust overall. When comparing same wattage JMPs, it comes down to the plate voltage with the amps with the lower volts sounding more compressed and warmer.
Both sound great. The 2203 has more bottom end, but the 2204 has a great high-end sizzle. Both amps has IT, just a different magic dust on each.
Both sound great! I have two early ‘80s JMP 2203 heads
Blake ya can’t have just one, gotta have both brother 🤘🏻👍🎶🎶🎸
Spoken like a true gearhead!
So subtle. Neither one has it. Win Win. Marshall has our hearts.
Neither one has it..?
Well done as always.
Appreciate that man
JMP= Brutality💪🏻🔥👍🤘🏻
The 2203 for me
Man that JMP sounds HUGE!!
I have a JMP 2203...that thing boosted wit a TS is pure Heaven.
Ya know...I don't know where you find all these great amps that you demo! To me both of them have "IT", but in a different flavor. The JMP has more grunt and the JCM has more splash. I don't if that's due to the wattage difference, the tube differences, the inherent differences in the circuitry or the combination. Personally I prefer the JMP in your demo, but I like the JCM too. The JMP is often forgotten in the Marshall amp timeline and I'm starting to believe that it may be the most versatile.
I prefer the thicker tone of the jmp. Great video.
Blake for President !
Jmp all the way! Way more low end growl! By itself the 2204 I'm sure sounds just as awesome but in the comparison it's a lot brighter and even a bit brittle sounding imo.
Great video. The 2203 sounds better to me. Maybe a tad tighter and beefier.
Great comparison..... Thanks now I want a JMP lol
I like both. Jcm800 by her nature has a slightly more defined sound
I'd agree
Both sound really good - guitar's most likely top notch too.
You know for all extra high end that the 2204 is known for compared to the 2203, there is still a really powerful and present bottom end on the 2204 as well in the clip, not just the 2203.
2203 KILLER
I’ve heard EVH used the 2204 for performing during the 1982-83 “Diver Down” tour, correct me if I’m wrong.
Yeah, I need a JMP.
Contrary to popular belief... a JMP/JCM800 2203/2204 is the EXACT same circuit... the only difference is the head cabinet and chassis style. In 1985 Marshall did change the 2203 filter capacitors in an effort to save money... those 2203's have the horizontal input jacks. Those post-85 2203's are harsher and grainier sounding and not as loud as the earlier vertical input 800's.
You're Exactly right Scott, you definitely know your Marshalls. 👍
So, the horizontal inputs was first introduced in 1985? I think I have seen a 1984 with horizontal inputs, but could be wrong.
Something that still confuses me, is that everyone keeps saying, that the MV 2203 and JCM 800, is the exact same circuit! Maybe except for some really minor changes in the power supply. But it's clearly not what we are hearing, in sound examples like those on this YT channel and others. There is a difference in sound between the JMP and JCM right? So what is it exactly that makes them differ in sound? Is it really only that minor changes in the power supply? Could it be that they changed between 1981-84 as well?
Man! So much conflicting information out there. Especially difficult for me to fully understand, as I have little technically experience, and at the same time not a native speaker... 😄 Any information on that particular subject would be much appreciated... 👍
@@lydfar2392 They started mounting the input jacks directly to the printed circuit board at the same time they screwed with the power filters. Marshall never changed the filtering on the 50w 2204/1987 just the input jacks. The old method of wiring the jacks to the chassis is much more sturdy, as the pc mounted jacks can work loose from the board on amps that are gigged a lot.
@@scottdunn2178 Hi Scott. Thanks for answering my questions. 🙂
That's interesting. I have read the interview in Guitar, with the man who worked at Marshall, at the time and he too confirmed, that the designs in MV 2203 and JCM 800 is exactly the same, only the cabinet and cosmetics changed. Great, so far so good!
Than there's the hole debate on WHEN the JCM 800 stated to sound like it did in this video. The difference to my ears are guite big. Way to big for it, to be the EXACTLY same amp. Something has definitely changed...
So I guess the amp in this video is a post 1985 then, or..?
Another thing I have read several times on multiple forums, is that the design in JCM 2204, didn't change in design al all, throughout all the years. Is that really true or did it change around 1985, as well as the JCM 2203 did?
Just as an example:
For example, if a year 1989 JCM 2204 model, is exactly the same amp, as the JCM 1981... and the 1981, is exactly the same design, as the MV JMP 2203/2204...
Then the JCM 800 2204 and the JMP 2203, should have sounded a lot closer than in this video right..?
Marshall has a reissue of the JCM 800 now, claiming that it's a true representing, of the "real JCM 800" but which one? If it's the original design, than in reality, it is just the MV 2203??
Or do they mean a reissue of one of the bad ones, from post 1985?? 😄
Sorry, that I a bit lost, I'm way too down the rabbit hole by now. 😅
Reason I ask is that I have the opportunity to get a JCM 800 2204, from 1989.
I was looking for a JCM 800 2203, but I don't dare to get a newer JCM 800, after reading all the horror storys, about the faulty one's from that decade.
Prices for early 80's JCM 800, are ridiculously high right now and none available in my local area.
If the JCM 2204 is a much safer choice, than the JCM 2203, I should probably get one of these instead? But I can't seem to find consensus regarding, if Marshall has changed the design, since it's original or not. Do the late 2204 still has the Drake transformers etc...?
I also can't find any confirmation that Marshall designed the JCM 800 on purpose, or it only has to do, too bad choice of components and trying to cutting cost's etc...
Let say that is true... Then the amp design, that has defined modern rock music and most newer metal amplifiers, like the 5150 family and Soldano... All emerged from a crappy amp design and poor marketing strategy?? That is hilarious! 😂😆
Also maybe more correct too claim, that the greatest JCM 800... Is a Master Volume!! 😁
I'm probably way off the rails here, but my quest for the perfect JCM 800, has taken quite a detour by now... Sorry if I have offended anyone, with my terrible lack of knowledge. 😄
All the best!
@@lydfar2392 Man, you're really picking my brain aren't you, kid? 🤣
As far as the 2204;
Same amp JMP/JCM never changed, even the later horizontal input JCM800 until production ended in 1990.
As far as the 2203;
Same circuit 1976 JMP to 1985 JCM800 (vertical inputs).
Sometime in late '85 in an attempt to save $ Marshall changed the power supply by basically using a few less components. They also started mounting the input jacks directly to the PC board... enter the horizontal inputs on both the 2203/2204 JCM800.
You must understand also that Marshall would use different vendors throughout the years for capacitors/resistors/diodes, etc. which will affect the sound of the amps. It's somewhat complicated, but basically Marshall have always used Dagnall output transformers in the 100w and Drake output transformers in the 50w. I can't speak for the newer amps, I'm talking about the traditional Marshalls. I hope that covers everything 👍🎸
I gotta go 800! John Sykes baby!
finally someone who makes sense
Fantastic sound, but i love the JMP, have to get one i think if i found one, thanks for sharing
Great amps. All of the old Marshall are though! Just a matter of taste
NO COPARRISON, THE 2203 HANDS DOWN.
I have a JMP 2203 head, and a JCM 2203. I like the JMP much better. It may have something to do with the JMP having 6550 power tubes as opposed to the EL34 equipped JCM.
🤘🤘
They both sound great, but the JCM sounds a little stiffer.
Correct!
Sounds weaker and thinner imo. JMP ftw !
2203 actually sounds a bit fuller..but both sound great!
Yep - a little fatter vs the leaner, more aggressive 800
I lean more towards the 2204 because of the higher high mid and treble overtones, definitely a good base for classic boosted JCM 800 metal tone with a RAT, Screamer, DS-1 etc. But the 2203 is great too... probably what I'd use for lower gain, maybe even clean tones with the guitar plugged into the LOW jack.
Hey, great work as allways! do you have some IR mixes for share?
Same circuit until after 1983
El jmp es hermoso
The 100 Watt has more balls for sure in the bottom. Also less aggressive top end.
The JMP..But That 800 is the horizontal version... maybe to My ears it sounds a bit raspy
Yea I think you’re on point. That 800 was a great amp, but there was some raspiness to it
Both are nice. The 2203 had more tone (to my ears).
Very similar circuits. You could swap a couple parts and turn one into the other. Pay attention to the diff between Dagnall and Drake OTs.
iplayloud2 I’ve read so many different things about them. Most people agree they sound different but no ones ever told me whats actually different (other than the 100 vs 50 power section of course and different brands of iron). Do you know? Always been curious.
probably not true or 100% accurate but the guy i bought my early 80s JCM 800 combo from said that the early 800 runs WERE JMPs. maybe he meant what iplayloud2 said which is they are almost the same with the exception of a couple parts. mine has a Drake OT.
I know I’m 4 years late but which one do you prefer? I think I like the JCM more, it’s got slightly more grit. Curious what you’re conclusion was. Thanks!
JMP
Not a fair comparison since one is 100watts one is 50 but JMP sounds better to me
Chris Choir True but wanted to do the comparison while I had both. Ideally they’d have been the same wattage but it is what it is
@@blakemansfield2356 you did a good job don't take me the wrong way, but 50watt JCMs breakup earlier
@@chrischoir3594 As you can hear, it's the EQ character that really sounds different. The gain level and "breakup point" seems to the roughly the same from this comparison
JMP just sounds mean. Like a brick wall of tasty low end
Sounds like 2204 has little bit more sag
Sounds like the JCM is a just brighter version of the JMP. I wonder if that's Marshall inexpensive way of releasing a "new" amp.
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26554 Cameron Terrace
JMP 2203 fo me, thanks! More punchier, "brownier" sounding, more defined and all rounded to my ears. JCM also great amp.
The distortion and harmonics sound very similar. The 2203 does sound a bit fuller probably from having 100watt vs 50watt of the 2204.
2203 sounds a little better but i would choose the 2204 for slightly less volume!
JMP sounds fuller and barky.
Jmp
The JMP wins here. Sounds raunchier, thicker and fuller which is kinda unusual since 50 watts overdrives quicker and should sound bigger and more aggressive imo but it sounds thinner and weaker here. That being said, i used to have a JMP 2203 Master Volume head and it roared like a mf
2203 for me. do they both have the cascaded inputs? or don’t or one does?😂
Yes they have the same circuit generally minus whatever parts variances from the different years. But they definitely sound different. The JMPs tend to be a little thicker and slightly fuzzier, 800s a little thinner, tighter, more aggressive. More similar than different though
2204 sounds much better.
Man, both sound totally wicked. So did you run them into a loadbox and through an IR loader? Or Two Notes Torpedo or something similar? Let me know what impulses you are using, I haven't got any good ones of the Greenback and this sounds like something I'd be willing to pay for.
They sound the same tbh
I like the jmp more because i like the way it looks
I prefer 2204. More punch! What's the year of 2204?
I knew this was IR before I even checked. Sounded too good sorry not a fan of IR examples because I don't think they represent what the amp would sound like playing in your house or live in a mix.
2203 more ballsy and a bit scooped in the mids 2204 great mids not that ballsy
Those Marshall Knobs are cheap . Come on man .... Nice Harmonics 💫
Haha you’re not wrong. I eventually got them on there
The JMP sounds better to me. The 2204 has more clarity and high end here but the rounder sound of the JMP just sounds fuller overall. There's something a little hollowed out sounding about the 2204 here.
JMP > JCM
jmp is easily the winner. you cannot fatten the 800.
What gain pedal is that?
Does the horizontal and not the vertical inputs from the 2204 affect the sound of the amp?. I know the 2203 "good ones" are the vertical input ones, is the same with 2204?
Nope. On 2204 there was no change in circuit. Only thing that changed on 50W models was that pots and inputs were changed to pcb mounted ones and the inputs went side by side. Soundwise the horizontal and vertical input ones are the same.
@@bassojasso Yes !, that's what I thought untill I saw this ...
ua-cam.com/video/i-SPCVjXp4k/v-deo.html
is the JMP boosted? or is the gain you get alone with humbuckers and preamp volume at 10?
No boost. Don’t think gain was dimed- gets kinda fuzzy past like 8
@@blakemansfield2356 I see, well it seems to have enough gain already, this is the model from 1980 with master volume isn't it?
@@chojinkid yes 1980 2203. If you play at regular volumes, you’d prob want some extra gain from a boost, but when you crank it loud, it’s just enough as is
@@blakemansfield2356 Definitely, sounds great as is, an attenuator could be a choice
JCM has more jangle.
JMP is thicker
To my ears the 2204 just had that extra something
JMP
Jmp
JMP
JMP