This is how the original Eastern Orthodox Church taught atonement on the cross, they never taught penal substantionary death. That was never the Early Churches theology. Their teaching was more based around the healing implements of the cross and the cosmic mystery that takes place, the resurrection and transfiguration on a cosmic scale.
My thoughts on "sacrifice" as a Christian are as follows: Sacrifice is often seen as gross and unnecessary by our "nonreligious" world. However sacrifice is something humanity cannot live without. We sacrifice our time for money, we sacrifice our individual identity for a shared one with a spouse, we sacrifice our comfort for health (or sometimes vice versa), and we sacrifice our money (taxes) for the betterment of our community. Sacrifice is built into how humans operate, so it shouldn't be seen as absurd when God requires sacrifice in order to meet with us. (Sacrifices like the sin offerings, or later on Jesus for for our Redemption.) When someone becomes a Christian they're supposed to sacrifice their freedom of choosing "not God" (sin) and turn it into choosing to follow God and his Commandments (what Jesus did). We Christians do not do a very good job of this. Hardly anyone does. But what some of us have found is that sacrificing our time to read the Bible and follow His Commandments results in consistent betterment of ourselves and community. Just my thoughts on sacrifice.
Isaiah begs to differ: "But he was pierced for our transgressions; he was crushed for our iniquities; upon him was the chastisement that brought us peace, and with his wounds we are healed." Isaiah 53:5 I recommend reading the book Atonement and the Death of Christ by William Lane Craig on the essentiality of the gospel and substitutionary atonement. Oftentimes liberal Christians unnecessarily try and wedge a divide with Penal Substitution and other various theories of atonement when often they ought to be married. There are some erroneous views of penal substitution though. While I can see the tension you bring, this also is inconsistent with the old and new testaments that Christ will come back and judge again. This seems to imply you're teaching there is no hell, no judgement. God is a God not only of love but of wrath as well. “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” -Richard Niebuhr How does the cross unite us? What’s the mechanism? Why the cross?
But you must remember it wasn’t God doing the ‘piercing or the wounding’, it was us! Indeed Christ was murdered by us yet where was God when Christ was on the cross? According to 2Cor. 5:19 He was IN CHRIST! Therefore He gave Himself as a GIFT to us in order to delve into our deepest darkness & clean house. TF Torrance does excellent book expounding on this great descent by Trinity (The mediation of Christ).Also remember Christ was the Last Adam therefore when He died He took all mankind to death with Him. When Christ resurrected we too were born again into new life 1Peter 1:3. So His dying was in no way an angry ‘god’ pouring out wrath on Himself who is God.
@@jcismyallIsaiah literally said it was “Gods will to crush him” Apostle Paul also says that the legal penalty of our sins was canceled at the cross: “And you, who were dead in *your trespasses* and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross.” Colossians 2:13-14 Paul also states that it was your sins he died for not just Adam’s
Both God and Jesus have wrath on sin and that is what those outside of Christ will experience. Both God and Jesus also are united on the "rescue" of Jesus dying on the cross and taking God's wrath on sin on himself. The video suggests a false dichotomy between God and Jesus by proposing a straw man view of the atonement --- that God has wrath on sin and Jesus cared enough to die for that so man could be saved. But Revelation shows the Son's wrath and judgment on sin quite vividly; it is the same as God's wrath seen in the Old Testament on those against God. So yes, man needs to be saved from God's wrath on sin and the only way is through faith in Jesus who died to pay the penalty for those sins.
EXCELLENT! The God Who was IN CHRIST reconciling the COSMOS to Himself! What a LOVING PAPA we have!
Great book, highly recommended!
Thank you for your work on this book, I’m looking forward to reading it for a deeper understanding
This is how the original Eastern Orthodox Church taught atonement on the cross, they never taught penal substantionary death. That was never the Early Churches theology. Their teaching was more based around the healing implements of the cross and the cosmic mystery that takes place, the resurrection and transfiguration on a cosmic scale.
My thoughts on "sacrifice" as a Christian are as follows:
Sacrifice is often seen as gross and unnecessary by our "nonreligious" world. However sacrifice is something humanity cannot live without. We sacrifice our time for money, we sacrifice our individual identity for a shared one with a spouse, we sacrifice our comfort for health (or sometimes vice versa), and we sacrifice our money (taxes) for the betterment of our community. Sacrifice is built into how humans operate, so it shouldn't be seen as absurd when God requires sacrifice in order to meet with us. (Sacrifices like the sin offerings, or later on Jesus for for our Redemption.)
When someone becomes a Christian they're supposed to sacrifice their freedom of choosing "not God" (sin) and turn it into choosing to follow God and his Commandments (what Jesus did). We Christians do not do a very good job of this. Hardly anyone does. But what some of us have found is that sacrificing our time to read the Bible and follow His Commandments results in consistent betterment of ourselves and community.
Just my thoughts on sacrifice.
How about the book of Hebrews?
Hebrews is examined in the book
Isaiah begs to differ:
"But he was pierced for our transgressions; he was crushed for our iniquities; upon him was the chastisement that brought us peace, and with his wounds we are healed." Isaiah 53:5
I recommend reading the book Atonement and the Death of Christ by William Lane Craig on the essentiality of the gospel and substitutionary atonement. Oftentimes liberal Christians unnecessarily try and wedge a divide with Penal Substitution and other various theories of atonement when often they ought to be married. There are some erroneous views of penal substitution though.
While I can see the tension you bring, this also is inconsistent with the old and new testaments that Christ will come back and judge again. This seems to imply you're teaching there is no hell, no judgement. God is a God not only of love but of wrath as well.
“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” -Richard Niebuhr
How does the cross unite us? What’s the mechanism? Why the cross?
Yes and also the book if Hebrews
But you must remember it wasn’t God doing the ‘piercing or the wounding’, it was us! Indeed Christ was murdered by us yet where was God when Christ was on the cross? According to 2Cor. 5:19 He was IN CHRIST! Therefore He gave Himself as a GIFT to us in order to delve into our deepest darkness & clean house. TF Torrance does excellent book expounding on this great descent by Trinity (The mediation of Christ).Also remember Christ was the Last Adam therefore when He died He took all mankind to death with Him. When Christ resurrected we too were born again into new life 1Peter 1:3. So His dying was in no way an angry ‘god’ pouring out wrath on Himself who is God.
@@jcismyallIsaiah literally said it was “Gods will to crush him”
Apostle Paul also says that the legal penalty of our sins was canceled at the cross:
“And you, who were dead in *your trespasses* and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross.”
Colossians 2:13-14
Paul also states that it was your sins he died for not just Adam’s
Both God and Jesus have wrath on sin and that is what those outside of Christ will experience. Both God and Jesus also are united on the "rescue" of Jesus dying on the cross and taking God's wrath on sin on himself. The video suggests a false dichotomy between God and Jesus by proposing a straw man view of the atonement --- that God has wrath on sin and Jesus cared enough to die for that so man could be saved. But Revelation shows the Son's wrath and judgment on sin quite vividly; it is the same as God's wrath seen in the Old Testament on those against God. So yes, man needs to be saved from God's wrath on sin and the only way is through faith in Jesus who died to pay the penalty for those sins.