We know that this topic will bring some heated discussion. But as always, hate speech, racism, and calls for ethnic cleansing or genocide are entirely forbidden. Please read our code of conduct before commenting. community.timeghost.tv/t/rules-of-conduct/4518 We believed that we could only do justice to this long and tangled story, and give you the context you deserve, with a feature length episode. This sort of work is only possible thanks to the Timeghost Army. Join us so that we can ensure that humanity learns from the past and moves to a brighter future where all of us have our fundamental right to life protected. www.patreon.com/TimeGhostHistory
Small Critique: There’s quite a difference between how the mic is picking up each voices. or maybe there’s more eco on one side than the other of the room. Keep up the good work
How can the number of refugees increase due to population growth, not additional wars/ethnical cleansing? Wouldn't that mean that the status of "being a refugee" would be inherited at birth? Seems as an odd concept: are the grand-children of people from East Prussia, who have fled to the current German borders, still refugees? If yes, wouldn't that automatically prolong the conflict of Germany with Poland and Russia about the right of these people to go back to their lands? How far would this inherited refugee status last? Considering America is full of descendants of people who have fled Europe for various reasons ...
Props for trying to take this historical discussion on. Very brave. We need more people willing to talk openly and factually about this topic. Far too many emotions and false narratives out there.
I mean, how can you talk factually though? If you want to get factual, the Palestinians are a radical group of people who would be on par with Nazis or Imperial Japan in ideological fervor. This is a point of pride for them, they are not shy in saying this. Most Palestinians who weren't radical already left. This entire drawn out conflict is a strategy by the Arabs. They knew they couldn't defeat Israel militarily, so they decided to reframe their struggle to Western audiences all while continuing to want the destruction of Israel. Poll after poll shows this. Even the daily lives of their citizens shows this. Look at what Palestinians have focused on and what kind of society they have built. Israel does bad things like every Western liberal democracy does, but it is miles different from an Islamic theocracy or dictatorship like in Gaza. Why are the supposedly objective UA-cam content creators not displaying the culture and mentality of Palestinians? It is the key component to all this, it shows why they are willing to sacrifice everything and are backed by the Arab and Muslim world. It just seems everyone wants to paint them as helpless everyday folk just trying to get along, but that isn't the case. You can't transplant a Western mindset to your average Gazan, they hold very extreme and fanatical views compared to the average Westerner. And sure, criticize Israel, the entire Islamic world does it non stop, so I think we have that covered. But why is no one talking about this?
@@ElectronFieldPulseIsn’t a Jewish State also, by its own admission, theocratic? They both suffer from the same problem: they still live in the past, in the long-extinct history of the supposed ‘holy land’, while the rest of the world has evolved. What is ‘holy land’? What special energy, magic, or entitlement does it confer? Does a ‘holy’ text give anyone the right to dispossess others of food, shelter and water? The answer is obviously NO.
Thank you for always being willing to tackle history. The TimeGhost team is a huge inspiration to me, and I hope that you never let the flack and anger of others turn you away from a topic.
@robertkrump2015 which gospels? You mean only tjose chosen by the Vatican and not those held in its vaults? This whole conflict is based on who's mythical sky fairy is biggest.
I, as an Israeli, appreciate how you explain the conflict without storm into lies and misinformation that only exists in order to create hatred. In the end my generation pay for the sins of the past and the radicals of the present. "If two fish are fighting in a river, a long-legged Englishman has just passed by."
For what it's worth, I personally believe that the entire region has belonged to your people since the Exodus. If I moved there (and I have considered trying), I would not expect to be a citizen or have the vote. I realize of course that, since most of the world hates God, they will not be convinced.
What I understood from this documentary is that the British created this conflict by their empty promises to both Jews and Arabs; then horribly managed it and got out just before it literally exploded into all-out war.
This documentary does not include the worst part: the British also persuaded the Arab side not to make any kind of peace at the end of this war. Making a very normal post colonial war into an ever lasting conflict.
I'm an Arab and this is really the most comprehensive summary of the events, i really wish this can be translated to Arabic. Keep up with the good work
@@overtonpendulum2071 well .... killing the real americans. And destroying their culture. The otomans share more in common with them. They didnt destroy their culture and mix better. No like the british and you know who. And if you think ottomans dont bring some improve nothing you are blind
@overtonpendulum2071 The British brought the civilization to the Europeans who were colonizing America's land after killing and eradicating the indigenous, so in the end the Europeans countries in general are used to kill and steal lands from weak nations and pretend bringing peace and civilization and even pretending that they are the original people of their colonized lands, besides they taught it to others so that's why we are watching genocides in Palestine
No kidding. Having watched this video it really feels like everyone involved was a dick and people alive today are paying the price (while also being dicks sometimes, too).
Sebastian is great! My hope is that our generation can pave a path to peace through reconciliation and understanding. Our children should not suffer for the sins of the past.
This was a fantastic replay of history. My favorite part is Sparty's butchering of the word "ha'atzmauet" at 1:04:30 which was hilarious. It's a tough word for a non hebrew speaker, don't feel bad, i got a good chuckle!
Maybe I shouldn't be picking nits, but something Sebastian said around 15:00 grated on me. "Ahad Ha'Am" is a single-phrase pen name that sort of means "One of the people". "Ha'Am" is not a family name. Calling him "Ha'Am" is like calling the Sundance Kid "Kid".
Your Great War documentary was heart-wrenching. The blatant disregard for human life and suffering displayed by all decision makers was vomit-inducing. Sacrificing tens of thousand of soldiers just to keep one's warm chair in the parliament and all that. This - for me - thorough presentation of the events that led to the yet another ethnic cleansing effort (under the guise of defending oneself, of denazifying and demilitarizing... huh... almost as if I'm talking about another conflict in another country) just adds more bile. Towards politicians in general, towards self-serving, cruel asshats in particular. Same disgusting attitude, same lies, same cruelty, but with fancier equipment. 1096 - 2023. Almost a millenia of events, a millenia a mistakes no one seams to want to learn anything from. Or, at least, no one from those that decide our fate...
Very well done on the ending. I think we need to remember that life isn't a zero-sum game, and also remember that someone out there can be drowning while you're dying of thirst.
Constantinople fell on May 29 not 19, and the Eastern Roman (Byzantine) emperor that asked Pope for help to deal with the Seljuks was Alexios II not Alexander. Alexios and Alexander are two different names.
At around 50:00 onwards, possibly a bit more emphasis should have been shown to the Peel proposal of 1937.-38. with showing the map the Arab High Commission declined (where they got much more land than in the 1947. UN proposal), but also to state that the Zionists didn't accept it either (they at least quarreled over it, in order to get a separate state, but were unhappy with the amount of territory and Jerusalem). Had the Arabs taken that 1937. partition, many things might have been different. Or at least the 1947. partition, anything would have been better than what actually devolved for them. Kudos for mentioning the Lehi - Nazi connection, quite rarely seen in history videos, although could have continued on the Lehi after 1948. not being seen as a terrorist group (which it was) but from them a number of politicians arose, i.e. Shamir as Prime Minister. Also, from Irgun, another terrorist group, same thing happened later, Begin owuld arrive to the political scene.
It doesn't go back to 1096, it goes back to 635 or 638 when the umayyad caliphate took Jerusalem from the byzantines. And even during the time of the crusades the majority of the people that lived in what was called The holy Land were still Eastern Orthodox and Armenian Christians being ruled over by Muslim overlords.
The Crusades were a relatively brief interval of counterattack against the much larger tide of 1100 years of unending Muslim assaults on Christian (along with all other non-Muslims) countries. The people endlessly whinging about the Crusades never want to talk about how the Levant, North Africa, Iberia, Asia Minor, and the Balkans became Muslim-ruled to begin with. And then let's talk about India...
The crusades are notable for when Western European powers first fought in the levant. Its not when Christians first fought Muslims (600's), not when West Europeans first fought in the middle east (romans recruits), nor the proper beginning of the current snarl of disputes (Napoleon in Egypt).
@@derrickthewhite1 yes but the crusades were caused directly by the jihad's centuries earlier, people bring up Rome but they have nothing to do with it because they were not people trying to conquer a holy land like the Muslims and the Christians were. The Muslims themselves were foreigners who pushed into foreign Christian lands that they took for themselves and they believed that Jerusalem was a holy place just like Christians and it was part of their holy war their Jihad to convert the world. The sectarian violence started with that not with the crusades centuries later that were a response to it.
Actually it goes back to the days of Abraham, many hundreds BC. The Jewish scriptures have clear and specific land grants giving them the entire region. Whether you believe it or not, their claim is older and more specific.
@@penultimateh766 they weren't really Muslims back then though, lol But I get what you mean but by a pure approvable historical sense it really goes back to the 7th Century with Islam conquering outside of Arabia I'm just afraid that they won't admit that because they're afraid of being canceled by a billion Muslims since Christians are more open to being criticized by their history while Muslims at least the children won't even budge an inch or take a joke like all those people killed in Paris just for making dumb cartoons of the prophet when you don't see Christians going around killing people from dumb depictions of Jesus
Thank you Spartacus and Sebastian, as an Israeli I've been watching your videos about WW2 for years and finally you've done about my country and you guys clearly done your research and the result is a great documentary as always. I hope you didn't start WW3 talking about this topic though lol
Like everywhere else they have been outside Europe: Ruanda, India-Pakistan, South Africa, English speaking west Africa, las Islas Malvinas, and the land of Israel/mandate of Palestine is not the only mess they left in the middle east. The Hashemites would not have lost the holy places to the Sauds if the British would have kept their obligations to them. Just imagine the things that were already signed in 1920 and now look like fantasy: A united Arab kingdom that contains the whole middle east with a little sorry slab of land within this kingdom where the Jews have an independent autonomous rule, being the kernel of the Arab kingdom's science, engineering and economy, supplying technology for the Arab farmers so they can increase their production while reducing their labor, so they can go acquire education for themselves and thus boosting the living standard all over the region. But... after orchestrating all the agreements that would enable this utopic future, the British decided that they have a better plan for the area. A plan that they were regretting for 30 years and the peoples that were left in their ruins still regret after more than a hundred years.
Well, yes and no - religious strife was not as organized as after the crusades, although arguably one could begin with Mohammed trying to unite the religions, and his successor Abu Bakkr deciding not to some 450 years earlier. However, that doesn't concern Jerusalem so much. For Jerusalem to be the relevant place we have to go back further, and the historiography gets sketchy at best, or should I say confused as the record is largely religious texts...
@@vituperativedetritus3628 😂😂😂 if you think I have a hard time coping with this little academic discussion here… well you’re not aware of my job. Look at my videos and read the comments… and that’s just the tip of the iceberg, and even then… you won’t find the deleted harassment and death threats that come as an extra bonus with my job… I can assure you, I have no issue coping little man.
@@spartacus-olsson Why are the Crusades relevant? They ended more than 400 years before Zionism came along, and I'm not aware of much evidence that they played much role in anyone's thinking until the relatively modern (1990s?) notion of a clash of civilizations came along. One thing I wish your presentation spent more time on was the nature of and state of affairs within the Ottoman Empire, which shared a religious identity with most of its Asian subjects but otherwise was a colonial empire not too different from the British, French, or Russian ones. As I've said in other comments, trade of one foreign imperial ruler for another was hardly a novel concept in 1919 in the former Ottoman Empire or anywhere else, it was the norm for much of the world since the 15th century or so. The right of national self-determination was the novel and untried idea.
Just camera could focus more on active speaker. Here often showed Sparty while Samuel talked. Also both him and Indy heavly gesticulate why they're not the one speaking. For me it's distracting.
Awesomely thoughtful presentation with amazing objectivity and ethical understanding. Just found your channel, and it’s pretty easy for me to consider sticking around. Thank you for sharing! Love the ending.🙂💚✨⚡️
The 1900s took Britain on a journey. In the beginning it was the dominant world power with France second. After WWI League of Nations was created by Woodrow Wilson but the USA was not a member. The rising power was Germany leading to WWII. Then United Nations replaced Germany, USA and League of Nations which changed UK position.
@@TimeGhost ever thought about upploading your episodes as audio podcast on spotify? I do enjoy listing while doing work but it gobbles up my data in no time Once more. You guys do great work.
@@TimeGhost every now and then i go back to this and copy the link whenever i I see uneducated stupid feelings about this conflict. Today i past it into a comment tread on reddit who blame palestines for beeing foul uncultured barbarians But honestly, some of those treads are written in such bad grammar for my nativ language. Just feels odd.... Even if the idiots themself dont care about this amazing work you have. Maybe a random from the comments got the time to watch. Have you guys ever thought about aproaching NRK or BBC?
Hey @spartacus-olsson and team, I really appreciate the effort you put into making this video. Can we have a list of the sources ? I really want to take the time to read up on this subject.
Brilliant. Absolutely brilliant. Very balanced and thorough, covering critical aspects, interactions and behind the scenes maneuvering that other histories of this topic simply don’t cover and typically don’t even mention. Thank you.
Besides them, many Arab sources confirm the fact that the Holy Land was still Jewish by population and culture in spite of the Diaspora: ·In 985 c.e. the Arab writer Muqaddasi complained that in Jerusalem the large majority of the population were Jewish, and said that "the mosque is empty of worshippers..." . ·Ibn Khaldun, one of the most creditable Arab historians, in 1377 c.e. wrote: "Jewish sovereignty in the Land of Israel extended over 1400 years... It was the Jews who implanted the culture and customs of the permanent settlement". After 300 years of Arab rule in the Holy Land, Ibn Khaldun attested that Jewish culture and traditions were still dominant. By that time there was still no evidence of "Palestinian" roots or culture . ·The historian James Parker wrote: "During the first century after the Arab conquest [670-740 c.e.], the caliph and governors of Syria and the [Holy] Land ruled entirely over Christian and Jewish subjects. Apart from the Bedouin in the earliest days, the only Arabs west of the Jordan were the garrisons". Even though the Arabs ruled the Land from 640 c.e. to 1099 c.e., they never became the majority of the population. Most of the inhabitants were Christians (Assyrian and Armenian) and Jews.
Hi, long time fan of your documentaries ever since the great war! Just wondering why at 11:38 you consider that no nation state existed before Greece and Belgium in 1830, as I was under the impression most historians consider post-revolutionary France to be the first nation state?
Damn, what skin care regime is Indy on? He looks ten years younger, at least. (I jest.) I appreciate you covering this topic in detail, and respect for giving a spotlight to the person who did the research.
The League Of Nations was a toothless organisation , because there is no way to overcome National Interest and the most powerful nations dominating proceedings . I think there was a strong anti sematic feeling in England ; USA ect , though not to the German extent .
THANK YOU , for providing a complete view of the issues from the beginning to the end. My admiration for for taking a neutral role in the various issues as they developed . And mostly for the closing statements that allow for a consideration of how this can only end when there must be a NEW beginning , is my suffering more than your suffering ? The complexities of siding with one specific event or agreement does not bring a peaceful conclusion to the problem . I'm in fear that this will never end and the consequences will mount in further death tolls . Its also obvious that International intervention has done nothing to resolve the issue but only temporary suffering for which there will be no, NEW beginning .
This video is a very valuable and impartial summary of the history of the land of Canaan over the past century and a half. It is unfortunate that the discussion of this history is made unnecessarily difficult by those commentators who would ask what I categorise as the "unanswerable question" or the "have you stopped beating your wife?" type of question. In this case the questioner asks "isn't the slogan From the River to the Sea a call for genocide?" No matter what the answer, the questioner expects to say: "Ha! gotcha!"
Exactly. Like "doesn't Israel have a right to defend itself"? It's like siblings on a car trip sticking their fingers right next to each other's eyes and screaming, I'm not touching you!" until the inevitable conflict.
I wonder if UA-cam's habit of demonetizing history channels that aren't afraid of covering the gruesome realities of war played a factor in this channel being abandoned.
Dear Timeghost, I'm sick and tired of the censorship of your channel. I honestly didn't even say anything wrong or insulting yet most of my comments had been deleted. You need to respect opposing views, even if they are from your perspective insulting. When I replied to that guy who said he is in active duty for the IDF and fully supported the military operation against Palestinians with "How does it feel like to be part of a criminal organization", you have to understand what I went through and what I saw and what I felt. It has nothing to do with being "emotional", for me who is going through all of this, this is just reality. It's not an insult, its an observation. If I said the same thing about a former Wehrmacht soldier, would you have deleted my comment? And when I said to another guy who said he doesn't believe in a 2 state solution anymore that they are lying, they never believed in one - again, this is just the reality I'm observing! Most of the Israelis don't want a Palestinian state. There are numerous statistics which prove that + they have only voted right wing anti Palestinian politicians since their entire existence! This is just a few examples. You deleted like 8 comments I made. You have to learn to accept opposing views, even if they are insulting. I mean of course from your comfortable couch it's always easy to tell people what to do, but this not the world we live in.
For those reading this commnet I would like to note that this comment is still here and the claim that there were others were deteled is impossible to prove. It is therefore my assumption that someone is looking for victimhood to promote your view.
@@erikthomsen4768 "is impossible to prove" What? So if those comments weren't deleted, then where did they go? How am I supposed to prove it when they're no longer there? I'm so confused
@@seeyouchumpour moderation is strictly based on our code of conduct linked in the pinned comment. I can’t say if you broke that or not, you’d have to ask our moderators. Nevertheless, we don’t hide comments based on differing opinions. You should also consider that we might not have hidden it at all… UA-cam moderates all comments, and we have no influence over that…
The British appointed Hajj Amin al Husseini to a post that had previously been much less influential, why they didn't replace him is unclear to me. The way the British left was shameful.
How do you judge the actions of the Irgun led by Menachem Begin, for example hanging 2 British army sergeants after Britain refused to exchange them for Irgun fighters?
This is some of the best content ive seen on this subject sadly i do not think the powers that be want an unbias documentry. Im positive this video will be demonetized aswell as this channel but thank you so much for this. You guys have done the world a service with this video.
I think that it's pretty unbiased and factual, apart from the claim that Israelis "ethnically cleansed" the Arabs out of Israel, when the vast majority of them fleed on their own accord and were simply not let back. The ones that were expelled came from communities that refused to surrender, aka wanted all Jews dead/gone themselves, aka people who posed a danger to the Jewish nation. Like he said, over 100k Arabs stayed, and they were let to stay because they didn't want to fight and preferred to live alongside Jews. The Palestinians who attacked the new nation chose war and lost their homes fair and square. Whether they accept the defeat or not is a different problem and the reason the dispute is still ongoing to this day.
The remark around 11:32 about Belgium & Greece in 1830 being the first nation states surprised me, but it makes sense that definitions and ideas around nationhood can get so strange. To clarify it after looking into it, the reason why nation states are considered a relatively modern invention is because beforehand, the world's powers were *multiethnic empires.* Certain ethnicities would be dominant when it came to control of those states, but there wasn't really a cohesive national identity associated alongside the state or used to justify its existence, as is the case today. Spartacus' opinion about the first nation state doesn't seem to be mainstream _(as far as I can tell, mainstream historians are most likely to pick post revolution France as the first, and I saw a claim that Belgium doesn't count as a nation state due to the Flemish/French/German split)_ so I'd be interested to hear his more detailed opinion on the subject!
Also it has to be added that most arabs by far fled on their own or by orders of neighbouring arab countries while Israel issued messages to stay in the land and be citizens of the reborn nation of Israel
"Reborn". Stop it. A bunch of warmongers believe an ancient fairy tale, and this has led millions to die needlessly over nothing. To you that's glorious rebirth. Just stop it. No human has any "right" to any land. It is all taken and maintained by force. Nothing else.
That's a long disproven myth. Haganah reports indicate the majority fled due to orders from NCOs in the local areas or fear from massacres after a couple of incidents of mass murder. Benny Morris started propagating the myth but he's long been discredited
I love the comprehensiveness, objectivity and nuance with which this was undertaken. This conflict is complicated to the Nth degree and appropriated by so many for personal causes. Thank you for the time taken here to do justice to the idea of telling the whole truth.
I really don't think this Palestine Israel issue is that complicated, is so simple that it can be solved with a snap of a finger, if their is a real will for a resolution by the Israilis politician. "It's as simple as live and let live"
Besides them, many Arab sources confirm the fact that the Holy Land was still Jewish by population and culture in spite of the Diaspora: ·In 985 c.e. the Arab writer Muqaddasi complained that in Jerusalem the large majority of the population were Jewish, and said that "the mosque is empty of worshippers..." . ·Ibn Khaldun, one of the most creditable Arab historians, in 1377 c.e. wrote: "Jewish sovereignty in the Land of Israel extended over 1400 years... It was the Jews who implanted the culture and customs of the permanent settlement". After 300 years of Arab rule in the Holy Land, Ibn Khaldun attested that Jewish culture and traditions were still dominant. By that time there was still no evidence of "Palestinian" roots or culture . ·The historian James Parker wrote: "During the first century after the Arab conquest [670-740 c.e.], the caliph and governors of Syria and the [Holy] Land ruled entirely over Christian and Jewish subjects. Apart from the Bedouin in the earliest days, the only Arabs west of the Jordan were the garrisons". Even though the Arabs ruled the Land from 640 c.e. to 1099 c.e., they never became the majority of the population. Most of the inhabitants were Christians (Assyrian and Armenian) and Jews.
Sebastian is a nice addition to the team. I do wish he was a bit louder/the two mics were at an equal level. I had a bit of hard time hearing him. Their way of speaking is very similar, so it felt a bit like "Sparty, the Next Generation" (not a bad thing at all) :) .
There are always at least two reasons for everything: The first, religion. The second, and real reason in the case of the Crusades, was of course money and power.
Religion is just an excuse to justify the money and power. Writing things down seems to give beliefs and concepts some magical energy. I don’t subscribe to that philosophy but so many of our fellow humans are willing to die for the written word.
So what do we learn about the middle east? It's all simple the fault of the french and british..... Okay, its far more complicated, but if you look at how often the british or french government was at the begining of some international desaster, one might wonder about this "its all the US and Jews fault" formula....
Well… sometimes I write scripts that Indy presents, sometimes Indy writes scripts that I present, sometimes other team members write scripts that we present… no matter what we look at it together. Not only that, we’re pretty much the Borg on these issues - one mind different bodies. You can rest assured that for a topic so complex and controversial as this, we will have discussed it, as is also the case for this video.
Excellent work! I already had some (not even close to full, though) knowledge of key events that led to the current situation but it has never been presented in a proper timeline, outlining so vividly the tragedy of two peoples, the failure at large of the so-called "international community" and the continuing curse of the world-wide consequences of colonialism. My compliments to the entire team! Thank you good sirs!
Who knew a land home to the three most powerful and popular religions that preach love, acceptance, and forgiveness has been battleground for hundreds of wars, invasions, persecutions, oppressions, terrorism, ethnic cleansing and violence which continues today
Starting before the crusades is not a good idea from keeping the historiographical perspective free of wild speculation. Religious strife was not as organized before as after the crusades, although arguably one could begin with Mohammed trying to unite the religions, and his successor Abu Bakkr deciding not to, some 450 years earlier. However, that doesn't concern Jerusalem, or for that matter the Levant so much. For Jerusalem to be the relevant place we have to go back further, and the historiography gets sketchy at best, or should I say confused as the record is largely religious texts. Your claim about Judea being destroyed by the Romans is for instance not verifiable as far too few texts, and no official documents exist to support it firmly. We simply don't know what is post construction, religious agitation, or actual events. From around 1098 on we have fairly solid records from both sides, and as far as we can tell, this is the pivoting moment when religious strife goes from tribal to geopolitical. It may also have been that way for a while under the Romans, and before that under the Greek and Egyptians... but we just don't know.
@@davidrudd9846 that Mr Rudd is not the area of historiography, but archeology. Like I said; we have no reliable records from that time to verify the narrative. The best we can do is to look at the highly unreliable records we have, and try to find grains of accuracy in them by searching though the archeological record. So far (and probably forever) the archeological record only lets us glean a sliver of the story.
Oh.. we do have one more novel science at our disposal: paleo-genetics. So far the findings in that area support the diaspora stories, but only in part, and seem to indicate that a very, very large part is not based on facts. Roughly, we know for certain about as much as we said in the video… lots of suffering, and people driven out of their homelands, only to face further persecution. That’s it, nothing more. The rest is conjecture and perhaps even mythology.
I thoroughly enjoyed the video, and even laughed at some of the absurd attempts at pronunciations 😂 One thing I would add, at 1:12:47 to 1:13:03, you state a fact about the 'longest unresolved refugee crisis', and I feel you missed an opportunity to have provided more context - specifically the differentiation between UNWRA and UNHCR, and their roles in the prolonging of the refugee crisis and difference in status. This is a huge cornerstone of the modern side of the conflict and it would be great if you touched on it with any future video you may have planned.
Loved getting to see more of the Time Ghost team. I think slightly more volume on Sebastian's microphone would have been helpful though. Excellent video though. I'm off to share it with my friends who keep posting propoganda about wars they refuse to educate themselves on.
@@realoneabdullahi1455 As you can see it is really simple. You promise contradicting promises to all local factions, so they do the hard work in order to gain it for you, and then when they succeed you throw them to the lions and unleash them one against the other.
Why? People already knew this! Even we Africans so? It funny how some of you lots are afraid of people knowing what your European countries had done to poor countries! It a shameful thing! And you lots should be able to help fight against it ! By supporting the right policies against poor countries! Ps I live in the uk! Too!😂
We know that this topic will bring some heated discussion. But as always, hate speech, racism, and calls for ethnic cleansing or genocide are entirely forbidden.
Please read our code of conduct before commenting. community.timeghost.tv/t/rules-of-conduct/4518
We believed that we could only do justice to this long and tangled story, and give you the context you deserve, with a feature length episode. This sort of work is only possible thanks to the Timeghost Army. Join us so that we can ensure that humanity learns from the past and moves to a brighter future where all of us have our fundamental right to life protected.
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Small Critique: There’s quite a difference between how the mic is picking up each voices. or maybe there’s more eco on one side than the other of the room. Keep up the good work
Unhappy at your censoring of responses, do you believe in freedom of speech or are you part and parcel of the cancellation culture?
Unimpressed - unsubscribed. I will suggest the same to others. Deeply disappointed.
It is nice to see you covering stories from both sides just like you did when Russia invaded Ukraine. Oh wait ...
How can the number of refugees increase due to population growth, not additional wars/ethnical cleansing? Wouldn't that mean that the status of "being a refugee" would be inherited at birth? Seems as an odd concept: are the grand-children of people from East Prussia, who have fled to the current German borders, still refugees? If yes, wouldn't that automatically prolong the conflict of Germany with Poland and Russia about the right of these people to go back to their lands?
How far would this inherited refugee status last? Considering America is full of descendants of people who have fled Europe for various reasons ...
Props for trying to take this historical discussion on. Very brave. We need more people willing to talk openly and factually about this topic. Far too many emotions and false narratives out there.
It’s almost impossible to find something to watch or read as fairly dealt with as this video.
Thank you for watching.
@@TimeGhost what do you think of how Apospate Profet and David Wood have done their "historical research"?
I mean, how can you talk factually though? If you want to get factual, the Palestinians are a radical group of people who would be on par with Nazis or Imperial Japan in ideological fervor. This is a point of pride for them, they are not shy in saying this. Most Palestinians who weren't radical already left.
This entire drawn out conflict is a strategy by the Arabs. They knew they couldn't defeat Israel militarily, so they decided to reframe their struggle to Western audiences all while continuing to want the destruction of Israel. Poll after poll shows this. Even the daily lives of their citizens shows this. Look at what Palestinians have focused on and what kind of society they have built.
Israel does bad things like every Western liberal democracy does, but it is miles different from an Islamic theocracy or dictatorship like in Gaza. Why are the supposedly objective UA-cam content creators not displaying the culture and mentality of Palestinians? It is the key component to all this, it shows why they are willing to sacrifice everything and are backed by the Arab and Muslim world. It just seems everyone wants to paint them as helpless everyday folk just trying to get along, but that isn't the case. You can't transplant a Western mindset to your average Gazan, they hold very extreme and fanatical views compared to the average Westerner.
And sure, criticize Israel, the entire Islamic world does it non stop, so I think we have that covered. But why is no one talking about this?
@@ElectronFieldPulseIsn’t a Jewish State also, by its own admission, theocratic? They both suffer from the same problem: they still live in the past, in the long-extinct history of the supposed ‘holy land’, while the rest of the world has evolved. What is ‘holy land’? What special energy, magic, or entitlement does it confer? Does a ‘holy’ text give anyone the right to dispossess others of food, shelter and water? The answer is obviously NO.
Best of luck moderating the comments
Could not have put it better myself lmao
@@emmisysquire9684It's not an original comment though
Thank you, and as always, thanks for watching.
@@balabanasiretiwho claimed it was though (;
They don't have to do anything. The UA-cam algorithim will do it for them.
Thank you for always being willing to tackle history. The TimeGhost team is a huge inspiration to me, and I hope that you never let the flack and anger of others turn you away from a topic.
Thanks for the encouraging words, they are much appreciated by everyone here.
All I can say to you friend is read the gospel, The truth is in there
@@robertkrump2015the better truth is who assembled that bible, and when.
@robertkrump2015 which gospels? You mean only tjose chosen by the Vatican and not those held in its vaults?
This whole conflict is based on who's mythical sky fairy is biggest.
@@benjaminhenderson5025then why don't you find out?
Timeghost took a few years break before returning with an absolute banger of a video
A few years break? They upload multiple times a week over on their World War II channel!
Appreciate the kind words, glad you enjoyed it.
ua-cam.com/video/ZXfuqUhzESg/v-deo.htmlsi=Q__rJzGlBjimOmty
Brilliant job on this. History rather than opinion. It makes me even prouder to be a member of the time ghost army.
Thank you for the comment and thanks for being a member of the TimeGhost army.
I, as an Israeli, appreciate how you explain the conflict without storm into lies and misinformation that only exists in order to create hatred. In the end my generation pay for the sins of the past and the radicals of the present. "If two fish are fighting in a river, a long-legged Englishman has just passed by."
That's how you run an Empire.
@@julianshepherd2038where is the empire now ..
For what it's worth, I personally believe that the entire region has belonged to your people since the Exodus. If I moved there (and I have considered trying), I would not expect to be a citizen or have the vote. I realize of course that, since most of the world hates God, they will not be convinced.
@@mfettodoing just fine
@@daddyal2825Really?? when hunger and homelessness is currently ruining the miserable lives of the majority of your people?.. 🤣😂
Thank you for taking the courageous decision to do this episode
What I understood from this documentary is that the British created this conflict by their empty promises to both Jews and Arabs; then horribly managed it and got out just before it literally exploded into all-out war.
Accurate
This documentary does not include the worst part: the British also persuaded the Arab side not to make any kind of peace at the end of this war. Making a very normal post colonial war into an ever lasting conflict.
I'm an Arab and this is really the most comprehensive summary of the events, i really wish this can be translated to Arabic.
Keep up with the good work
It's always amusing to me that you Arabs never whine about Ottoman colonialism.
@@overtonpendulum2071 you whine about british colonialism in america?
@@albertofrankdiaz6664 The British brought civilization to America.
@@overtonpendulum2071 well .... killing the real americans. And destroying their culture.
The otomans share more in common with them. They didnt destroy their culture and mix better. No like the british and you know who.
And if you think ottomans dont bring some improve nothing you are blind
@overtonpendulum2071 The British brought the civilization to the Europeans who were colonizing America's land after killing and eradicating the indigenous, so in the end the Europeans countries in general are used to kill and steal lands from weak nations and pretend bringing peace and civilization and even pretending that they are the original people of their colonized lands, besides they taught it to others so that's why we are watching genocides in Palestine
leaving this comment section open? I too like to live dangerously
No kidding. Having watched this video it really feels like everyone involved was a dick and people alive today are paying the price (while also being dicks sometimes, too).
Please continue with this subject. Review the events of 1956, 1967, 1972, etc.
We already covered 56 and may return for the others… we shall see:
The Suez Crisis
ua-cam.com/play/PLrG5J-K5AYAWTs_FBEJJNPV_UV_aL548Z.html
ua-cam.com/video/ZXfuqUhzESg/v-deo.htmlsi=Q__rJzGlBjimOmty
I just love Sebastian as a addition to the team, keep up the great work!
Sebastian is great! My hope is that our generation can pave a path to peace through reconciliation and understanding. Our children should not suffer for the sins of the past.
This was a fantastic replay of history. My favorite part is Sparty's butchering of the word "ha'atzmauet" at 1:04:30 which was hilarious. It's a tough word for a non hebrew speaker, don't feel bad, i got a good chuckle!
I’m always glad to entertain… even when it makes me look like an ass 😉
The same with the Arabic and “al-Nakba” just before that, the glottal KH was rather unnecessary it’s a simple K 😅
Lol I always find how foreigners pronounce our words funny, but this was on another level! 😂
@@spartacus-olssonYou can't be expected to know foreign and vague expressions.
You were close enough that we knew what you were saying.
Maybe I shouldn't be picking nits, but something Sebastian said around 15:00 grated on me. "Ahad Ha'Am" is a single-phrase pen name that sort of means "One of the people". "Ha'Am" is not a family name. Calling him "Ha'Am" is like calling the Sundance Kid "Kid".
Hey thanks for pointing that out! There’s always more to know!
Your Great War documentary was heart-wrenching. The blatant disregard for human life and suffering displayed by all decision makers was vomit-inducing. Sacrificing tens of thousand of soldiers just to keep one's warm chair in the parliament and all that.
This - for me - thorough presentation of the events that led to the yet another ethnic cleansing effort (under the guise of defending oneself, of denazifying and demilitarizing... huh... almost as if I'm talking about another conflict in another country) just adds more bile. Towards politicians in general, towards self-serving, cruel asshats in particular. Same disgusting attitude, same lies, same cruelty, but with fancier equipment. 1096 - 2023. Almost a millenia of events, a millenia a mistakes no one seams to want to learn anything from. Or, at least, no one from those that decide our fate...
Very well done on the ending. I think we need to remember that life isn't a zero-sum game, and also remember that someone out there can be drowning while you're dying of thirst.
"remember that someone out there can be drowning while you're dying of thirst.", very well put!
Constantinople fell on May 29 not 19, and the Eastern Roman (Byzantine) emperor that asked Pope for help to deal with the Seljuks was Alexios II not Alexander. Alexios and Alexander are two different names.
that video is a nice piece of work , and tith sources attached! What more could we want? Thanks !
At around 50:00 onwards, possibly a bit more emphasis should have been shown to the Peel proposal of 1937.-38. with showing the map the Arab High Commission declined (where they got much more land than in the 1947. UN proposal), but also to state that the Zionists didn't accept it either (they at least quarreled over it, in order to get a separate state, but were unhappy with the amount of territory and Jerusalem).
Had the Arabs taken that 1937. partition, many things might have been different. Or at least the 1947. partition, anything would have been better than what actually devolved for them.
Kudos for mentioning the Lehi - Nazi connection, quite rarely seen in history videos, although could have continued on the Lehi after 1948. not being seen as a terrorist group (which it was) but from them a number of politicians arose, i.e. Shamir as Prime Minister. Also, from Irgun, another terrorist group, same thing happened later, Begin owuld arrive to the political scene.
Merry Christmas and happy new year to time ghosts and those who support these riveting episodes !
It doesn't go back to 1096, it goes back to 635 or 638 when the umayyad caliphate took Jerusalem from the byzantines. And even during the time of the crusades the majority of the people that lived in what was called The holy Land were still Eastern Orthodox and Armenian Christians being ruled over by Muslim overlords.
The Crusades were a relatively brief interval of counterattack against the much larger tide of 1100 years of unending Muslim assaults on Christian (along with all other non-Muslims) countries. The people endlessly whinging about the Crusades never want to talk about how the Levant, North Africa, Iberia, Asia Minor, and the Balkans became Muslim-ruled to begin with. And then let's talk about India...
The crusades are notable for when Western European powers first fought in the levant. Its not when Christians first fought Muslims (600's), not when West Europeans first fought in the middle east (romans recruits), nor the proper beginning of the current snarl of disputes (Napoleon in Egypt).
@@derrickthewhite1 yes but the crusades were caused directly by the jihad's centuries earlier, people bring up Rome but they have nothing to do with it because they were not people trying to conquer a holy land like the Muslims and the Christians were. The Muslims themselves were foreigners who pushed into foreign Christian lands that they took for themselves and they believed that Jerusalem was a holy place just like Christians and it was part of their holy war their Jihad to convert the world. The sectarian violence started with that not with the crusades centuries later that were a response to it.
Actually it goes back to the days of Abraham, many hundreds BC. The Jewish scriptures have clear and specific land grants giving them the entire region. Whether you believe it or not, their claim is older and more specific.
@@penultimateh766 they weren't really Muslims back then though, lol
But I get what you mean but by a pure approvable historical sense it really goes back to the 7th Century with Islam conquering outside of Arabia
I'm just afraid that they won't admit that because they're afraid of being canceled by a billion Muslims since Christians are more open to being criticized by their history while Muslims at least the children won't even budge an inch or take a joke like all those people killed in Paris just for making dumb cartoons of the prophet when you don't see Christians going around killing people from dumb depictions of Jesus
Thank you Spartacus and Sebastian, as an Israeli I've been watching your videos about WW2 for years and finally you've done about my country and you guys clearly done your research and the result is a great documentary as always.
I hope you didn't start WW3 talking about this topic though lol
Short answer so you dont have to go thru an 80 minute video: yes.
Like everywhere else they have been outside Europe: Ruanda, India-Pakistan, South Africa, English speaking west Africa, las Islas Malvinas, and the land of Israel/mandate of Palestine is not the only mess they left in the middle east. The Hashemites would not have lost the holy places to the Sauds if the British would have kept their obligations to them.
Just imagine the things that were already signed in 1920 and now look like fantasy:
A united Arab kingdom that contains the whole middle east with a little sorry slab of land within this kingdom where the Jews have an independent autonomous rule, being the kernel of the Arab kingdom's science, engineering and economy, supplying technology for the Arab farmers so they can increase their production while reducing their labor, so they can go acquire education for themselves and thus boosting the living standard all over the region.
But... after orchestrating all the agreements that would enable this utopic future, the British decided that they have a better plan for the area. A plan that they were regretting for 30 years and the peoples that were left in their ruins still regret after more than a hundred years.
@@ItaiH6 Rwanda too???
Religious strife in the Levant did not begin with the Crusades, starting there is at best a bit misleading and at worst eurocentric and/or dishonest.
Well, yes and no - religious strife was not as organized as after the crusades, although arguably one could begin with Mohammed trying to unite the religions, and his successor Abu Bakkr deciding not to some 450 years earlier. However, that doesn't concern Jerusalem so much. For Jerusalem to be the relevant place we have to go back further, and the historiography gets sketchy at best, or should I say confused as the record is largely religious texts...
@@vituperativedetritus3628 😂😂😂 if you think I have a hard time coping with this little academic discussion here… well you’re not aware of my job. Look at my videos and read the comments… and that’s just the tip of the iceberg, and even then… you won’t find the deleted harassment and death threats that come as an extra bonus with my job… I can assure you, I have no issue coping little man.
@@spartacus-olsson Why are the Crusades relevant? They ended more than 400 years before Zionism came along, and I'm not aware of much evidence that they played much role in anyone's thinking until the relatively modern (1990s?) notion of a clash of civilizations came along.
One thing I wish your presentation spent more time on was the nature of and state of affairs within the Ottoman Empire, which shared a religious identity with most of its Asian subjects but otherwise was a colonial empire not too different from the British, French, or Russian ones. As I've said in other comments, trade of one foreign imperial ruler for another was hardly a novel concept in 1919 in the former Ottoman Empire or anywhere else, it was the norm for much of the world since the 15th century or so. The right of national self-determination was the novel and untried idea.
Sebastian is a fantastic addition. Spartacus was fantastic too, as always
Just camera could focus more on active speaker. Here often showed Sparty while Samuel talked. Also both him and Indy heavly gesticulate why they're not the one speaking. For me it's distracting.
Sebastian has been a great addition to the team, I'll pass along the kind words too him. Thank you!
- Jake
Best, most methodical summary I've come across yet
This video is yet further proof, that this is the best history related channel on youtube.
Thanks for the high praise!
Awesomely thoughtful presentation with amazing objectivity and ethical understanding. Just found your channel, and it’s pretty easy for me to consider sticking around. Thank you for sharing! Love the ending.🙂💚✨⚡️
I think so far the best unbiased explanation.
Not seen anywhere else.
I am just happy another video whatever on is posted on this channel again
The 1900s took Britain on a journey. In the beginning it was the dominant world power with France second. After WWI League of Nations was created by Woodrow Wilson but the USA was not a member. The rising power was Germany leading to WWII. Then United Nations replaced Germany, USA and League of Nations which changed UK position.
As always good work.
Learned something new and i was supprised that 1 hour was there and gon while listing from the beginning
This was a big one, glad you enjoyed and thanks for watching.
@@TimeGhost ever thought about upploading your episodes as audio podcast on spotify?
I do enjoy listing while doing work but it gobbles up my data in no time
Once more.
You guys do great work.
@@TimeGhost every now and then i go back to this and copy the link whenever i
I see uneducated stupid feelings about this conflict.
Today i past it into a comment tread on reddit who blame palestines for beeing foul uncultured barbarians
But honestly, some of those treads are written in such bad grammar for my nativ language.
Just feels odd....
Even if the idiots themself dont care about this amazing work you have.
Maybe a random from the comments got the time to watch.
Have you guys ever thought about aproaching NRK or BBC?
Fair play that is as fair and balanced documentary I have seen on the subject,
Hey @spartacus-olsson and team, I really appreciate the effort you put into making this video. Can we have a list of the sources ? I really want to take the time to read up on this subject.
You can find a list of our sources in the video description. Hope that helps!
Eh … my colleague is mistaken, those are only image sources. Sebastian is compiling the source list, and we’ll share it with you here.
This is a masterpiece. Congratulations
Brilliant. Absolutely brilliant. Very balanced and thorough, covering critical aspects, interactions and behind the scenes maneuvering that other histories of this topic simply don’t cover and typically don’t even mention. Thank you.
You should create serial about Israeli Arab conflict, year by year, 1948-2024. Very interesting and complex events
A lot happened in 1947
Brilliant Analysis and Insights in the Great Tradition of Time Ghost!!!!
Welcome to the TG family Sebastian, a welcome addition no doubt.
Most indeed, thanks for watching.
It will be cool that you guys make a documentary series about this ongoing conflict
Good video, I learned a lot
Glad to hear that, thanks for watching.
This is a fantastic work! Thank you!
Thank you for this video.
And thank you for watching.
your closing line are the best
Great video, and an important one.
Thank you for watching.
Excellent historical review
An invaluable summary of the recent history of the holy land. It's a tragedy.
Great work, I really appreciate it.
Besides them, many Arab sources confirm the fact that the Holy Land was still Jewish by population and culture in spite of the Diaspora:
·In 985 c.e. the Arab writer Muqaddasi complained that in Jerusalem the large majority of the population were Jewish, and said that "the mosque is empty of worshippers..." .
·Ibn Khaldun, one of the most creditable Arab historians, in 1377 c.e. wrote:
"Jewish sovereignty in the Land of Israel extended over 1400 years... It was the Jews who implanted the culture and customs of the permanent settlement".
After 300 years of Arab rule in the Holy Land, Ibn Khaldun attested that Jewish culture and traditions were still dominant. By that time there was still no evidence of "Palestinian" roots or culture .
·The historian James Parker wrote: "During the first century after the Arab conquest [670-740 c.e.], the caliph and governors of Syria and the [Holy] Land ruled entirely over Christian and Jewish subjects. Apart from the Bedouin in the earliest days, the only Arabs west of the Jordan were the garrisons".
Even though the Arabs ruled the Land from 640 c.e. to 1099 c.e., they never became the majority of the population. Most of the inhabitants were Christians (Assyrian and Armenian) and Jews.
I'm saving this presentation and will use it as a reference point as I learn more about the topic.
Thank you for teaching me something new, love you guys and all your work.
Brilliant video...deserves millions of views
super informative and well written !! Love the new face ! 🫶🏻🫶🏻
I'll be sure to let him know, thank you for watching.
- Jake
Brilliant video !
Hi, long time fan of your documentaries ever since the great war! Just wondering why at 11:38 you consider that no nation state existed before Greece and Belgium in 1830, as I was under the impression most historians consider post-revolutionary France to be the first nation state?
brilliant absolutely brilliant historically accurate much detailed documentary, thank you for providing this for free on youtube
The shadow of the Englishman’s perfidity casts as long today as it did 200 years ago. Thank you for covering, TGH
Happy to watched this: takes patience but so important to anyone who wants to enrich their knowledge on the subject. Thanks
Thank you that was just about the most balanced explanation
One of the best coverages of the history I've seen.
Damn, what skin care regime is Indy on? He looks ten years younger, at least. (I jest.)
I appreciate you covering this topic in detail, and respect for giving a spotlight to the person who did the research.
The pages of history books keeps him forever young.
Sebastian has been a great addition to the team, so it's well deserved. Thank you for watching.
Any chance of a follow up of 1950 to 2023?
The League Of Nations was a toothless organisation , because there is no way to overcome National Interest and the most powerful nations dominating proceedings . I think there was a strong anti sematic feeling in England ; USA ect , though not to the German extent .
Excellent and impartial
Love your information on the Palestinian land .Well done video . Thanks again
Thanks so much for this! So much to absorb here, will need to watch several times to fully grasp all the issues.
Thanks sparty and sebastian. Yall did a fine job. Ive been watching time ghost since june 44 of the war this past year and im hooked!🪝
Imagine how different the world would be if humans hadn’t created religion.
Humans would fight over land, resources etc...
THANK YOU , for providing a complete view of the issues from the beginning to the end. My admiration for for taking a neutral role in the various issues as they developed . And mostly for the closing statements that allow for a consideration of how this can only end when there must be a NEW beginning , is my suffering more than your suffering ? The complexities of siding with one specific event or agreement does not bring a peaceful conclusion to the problem . I'm in fear that this will never end and the consequences will mount in further death tolls . Its also obvious that International intervention has done nothing to resolve the issue but only temporary suffering for which there will be no, NEW beginning .
This video is a very valuable and impartial summary of the history of the land of Canaan over the past century and a half.
It is unfortunate that the discussion of this history is made unnecessarily difficult by those commentators who would ask what I categorise as the "unanswerable question" or the "have you stopped beating your wife?" type of question. In this case the questioner asks "isn't the slogan From the River to the Sea a call for genocide?" No matter what the answer, the questioner expects to say: "Ha! gotcha!"
Exactly. Like "doesn't Israel have a right to defend itself"? It's like siblings on a car trip sticking their fingers right next to each other's eyes and screaming, I'm not touching you!" until the inevitable conflict.
@@KevinJDildonik Bronią się ludzie u siebie w kraju a nie mordując dzieci w innym kraju! Nazistowska świnio !!!
Why did this channel die out? I see this video was almost a year ago…I get that, but why no new videos ??
I wonder if UA-cam's habit of demonetizing history channels that aren't afraid of covering the gruesome realities of war played a factor in this channel being abandoned.
Dear Timeghost,
I'm sick and tired of the censorship of your channel. I honestly didn't even say anything wrong or insulting yet most of my comments had been deleted. You need to respect opposing views, even if they are from your perspective insulting. When I replied to that guy who said he is in active duty for the IDF and fully supported the military operation against Palestinians with "How does it feel like to be part of a criminal organization", you have to understand what I went through and what I saw and what I felt. It has nothing to do with being "emotional", for me who is going through all of this, this is just reality. It's not an insult, its an observation. If I said the same thing about a former Wehrmacht soldier, would you have deleted my comment? And when I said to another guy who said he doesn't believe in a 2 state solution anymore that they are lying, they never believed in one - again, this is just the reality I'm observing! Most of the Israelis don't want a Palestinian state. There are numerous statistics which prove that + they have only voted right wing anti Palestinian politicians since their entire existence! This is just a few examples. You deleted like 8 comments I made. You have to learn to accept opposing views, even if they are insulting. I mean of course from your comfortable couch it's always easy to tell people what to do, but this not the world we live in.
For those reading this commnet I would like to note that this comment is still here and the claim that there were others were deteled is impossible to prove. It is therefore my assumption that someone is looking for victimhood to promote your view.
@@erikthomsen4768 "is impossible to prove"
What? So if those comments weren't deleted, then where did they go? How am I supposed to prove it when they're no longer there? I'm so confused
@@seeyouchumpour moderation is strictly based on our code of conduct linked in the pinned comment. I can’t say if you broke that or not, you’d have to ask our moderators. Nevertheless, we don’t hide comments based on differing opinions. You should also consider that we might not have hidden it at all… UA-cam moderates all comments, and we have no influence over that…
@@seeyouchump
Not only confused, but from the samples you provided also factually wrong.
@@naomiharbour7841 Go on then, enlighten me.
Thank you for the long lesson.
Appreciate you watching.
The British appointed Hajj Amin al Husseini to a post that had previously been much less influential, why they didn't replace him is unclear to me. The way the British left was shameful.
How do you judge the actions of the Irgun led by Menachem Begin, for example hanging 2 British army sergeants after Britain refused to exchange them for Irgun fighters?
took 8months for this to appear in my suggestions feed
This is some of the best content ive seen on this subject sadly i do not think the powers that be want an unbias documentry. Im positive this video will be demonetized aswell as this channel but thank you so much for this. You guys have done the world a service with this video.
I think that it's pretty unbiased and factual, apart from the claim that Israelis "ethnically cleansed" the Arabs out of Israel, when the vast majority of them fleed on their own accord and were simply not let back. The ones that were expelled came from communities that refused to surrender, aka wanted all Jews dead/gone themselves, aka people who posed a danger to the Jewish nation. Like he said, over 100k Arabs stayed, and they were let to stay because they didn't want to fight and preferred to live alongside Jews.
The Palestinians who attacked the new nation chose war and lost their homes fair and square. Whether they accept the defeat or not is a different problem and the reason the dispute is still ongoing to this day.
Don’t put negative energy out there
The remark around 11:32 about Belgium & Greece in 1830 being the first nation states surprised me, but it makes sense that definitions and ideas around nationhood can get so strange. To clarify it after looking into it, the reason why nation states are considered a relatively modern invention is because beforehand, the world's powers were *multiethnic empires.* Certain ethnicities would be dominant when it came to control of those states, but there wasn't really a cohesive national identity associated alongside the state or used to justify its existence, as is the case today.
Spartacus' opinion about the first nation state doesn't seem to be mainstream _(as far as I can tell, mainstream historians are most likely to pick post revolution France as the first, and I saw a claim that Belgium doesn't count as a nation state due to the Flemish/French/German split)_ so I'd be interested to hear his more detailed opinion on the subject!
Also it has to be added that most arabs by far fled on their own or by orders of neighbouring arab countries while Israel issued messages to stay in the land and be citizens of the reborn nation of Israel
"Reborn". Stop it. A bunch of warmongers believe an ancient fairy tale, and this has led millions to die needlessly over nothing. To you that's glorious rebirth. Just stop it. No human has any "right" to any land. It is all taken and maintained by force. Nothing else.
That's a long disproven myth. Haganah reports indicate the majority fled due to orders from NCOs in the local areas or fear from massacres after a couple of incidents of mass murder. Benny Morris started propagating the myth but he's long been discredited
Great subject matter.
I love the comprehensiveness, objectivity and nuance with which this was undertaken. This conflict is complicated to the Nth degree and appropriated by so many for personal causes. Thank you for the time taken here to do justice to the idea of telling the whole truth.
I really don't think this Palestine Israel issue is that complicated, is so simple that it can be solved with a snap of a finger, if their is a real will for a resolution by the Israilis politician. "It's as simple as live and let live"
Besides them, many Arab sources confirm the fact that the Holy Land was still Jewish by population and culture in spite of the Diaspora:
·In 985 c.e. the Arab writer Muqaddasi complained that in Jerusalem the large majority of the population were Jewish, and said that "the mosque is empty of worshippers..." .
·Ibn Khaldun, one of the most creditable Arab historians, in 1377 c.e. wrote:
"Jewish sovereignty in the Land of Israel extended over 1400 years... It was the Jews who implanted the culture and customs of the permanent settlement".
After 300 years of Arab rule in the Holy Land, Ibn Khaldun attested that Jewish culture and traditions were still dominant. By that time there was still no evidence of "Palestinian" roots or culture .
·The historian James Parker wrote: "During the first century after the Arab conquest [670-740 c.e.], the caliph and governors of Syria and the [Holy] Land ruled entirely over Christian and Jewish subjects. Apart from the Bedouin in the earliest days, the only Arabs west of the Jordan were the garrisons".
Even though the Arabs ruled the Land from 640 c.e. to 1099 c.e., they never became the majority of the population. Most of the inhabitants were Christians (Assyrian and Armenian) and Jews.
Sebastian is a nice addition to the team. I do wish he was a bit louder/the two mics were at an equal level. I had a bit of hard time hearing him. Their way of speaking is very similar, so it felt a bit like "Sparty, the Next Generation" (not a bad thing at all) :) .
There are always at least two reasons for everything: The first, religion. The second, and real reason in the case of the Crusades, was of course money and power.
Religion is just an excuse to justify the money and power. Writing things down seems to give beliefs and concepts some magical energy. I don’t subscribe to that philosophy but so many of our fellow humans are willing to die for the written word.
This conflict is more about nationalism than religion
So what do we learn about the middle east? It's all simple the fault of the french and british.....
Okay, its far more complicated, but if you look at how often the british or french government was at the begining of some international desaster, one might wonder about this "its all the US and Jews fault" formula....
The more I learn, the less I hope.
I learned something new, thank you!
I'm a little anxious about learning something without Indy ... I often ask myself "What would Indy do?" And other such questions
Well… sometimes I write scripts that Indy presents, sometimes Indy writes scripts that I present, sometimes other team members write scripts that we present… no matter what we look at it together. Not only that, we’re pretty much the Borg on these issues - one mind different bodies. You can rest assured that for a topic so complex and controversial as this, we will have discussed it, as is also the case for this video.
Did you ever learn anything before?
I think I have the same backround wall for my livestreams now :) I mean the one on the right with the books
Excellent work! I already had some (not even close to full, though) knowledge of key events that led to the current situation but it has never been presented in a proper timeline, outlining so vividly the tragedy of two peoples, the failure at large of the so-called "international community" and the continuing curse of the world-wide consequences of colonialism. My compliments to the entire team! Thank you good sirs!
good video. good job
Thanks for tuning in!
Who knew a land home to the three most powerful and popular religions that preach love, acceptance, and forgiveness has been battleground for hundreds of wars, invasions, persecutions, oppressions, terrorism, ethnic cleansing and violence which continues today
It's horrible and embarrassing.
Says something about religion in general and how corrupt people have used it through the eons...
Very informative, thank you!
Thank you for watching.
Do the Romans share blame for the destruction of Judea ? I don't believe you went back in time far enough by leaving out Rome
Starting before the crusades is not a good idea from keeping the historiographical perspective free of wild speculation. Religious strife was not as organized before as after the crusades, although arguably one could begin with Mohammed trying to unite the religions, and his successor Abu Bakkr deciding not to, some 450 years earlier. However, that doesn't concern Jerusalem, or for that matter the Levant so much. For Jerusalem to be the relevant place we have to go back further, and the historiography gets sketchy at best, or should I say confused as the record is largely religious texts. Your claim about Judea being destroyed by the Romans is for instance not verifiable as far too few texts, and no official documents exist to support it firmly. We simply don't know what is post construction, religious agitation, or actual events. From around 1098 on we have fairly solid records from both sides, and as far as we can tell, this is the pivoting moment when religious strife goes from tribal to geopolitical. It may also have been that way for a while under the Romans, and before that under the Greek and Egyptians... but we just don't know.
@@davidrudd9846 that Mr Rudd is not the area of historiography, but archeology. Like I said; we have no reliable records from that time to verify the narrative. The best we can do is to look at the highly unreliable records we have, and try to find grains of accuracy in them by searching though the archeological record. So far (and probably forever) the archeological record only lets us glean a sliver of the story.
Oh.. we do have one more novel science at our disposal: paleo-genetics. So far the findings in that area support the diaspora stories, but only in part, and seem to indicate that a very, very large part is not based on facts. Roughly, we know for certain about as much as we said in the video… lots of suffering, and people driven out of their homelands, only to face further persecution. That’s it, nothing more. The rest is conjecture and perhaps even mythology.
Yes, the British government did!
I thoroughly enjoyed the video, and even laughed at some of the absurd attempts at pronunciations 😂
One thing I would add, at 1:12:47 to 1:13:03, you state a fact about the 'longest unresolved refugee crisis', and I feel you missed an opportunity to have provided more context - specifically the differentiation between UNWRA and UNHCR, and their roles in the prolonging of the refugee crisis and difference in status. This is a huge cornerstone of the modern side of the conflict and it would be great if you touched on it with any future video you may have planned.
Excellent. Like any truth. Blessings and Shalom 😊🕊️
Loved getting to see more of the Time Ghost team. I think slightly more volume on Sebastian's microphone would have been helpful though.
Excellent video though. I'm off to share it with my friends who keep posting propoganda about wars they refuse to educate themselves on.
How can you give what you don't have.
@@realoneabdullahi1455
As you can see it is really simple.
You promise contradicting promises to all local factions, so they do the hard work in order to gain it for you, and then when they succeed you throw them to the lions and unleash them one against the other.
Boy that was Deep. Great Documentary.
Spartacus Jr.
This may be a result of summarizing, but the empasis on the diversity in the region seems to not lead anywhere.
I have a feeling you may end up needing to close down the comments.
The lack of proper unbiased History being taught is the issue.
@@samsmith2635 But this is the internet, and this topic is one of the most hot-button issues in the world right now and for several decades.
@@HalfLifeExpert1 good
@@samsmith2635 Whose bias do you regard as "unbiased"?
Why? People already knew this! Even we Africans so? It funny how some of you lots are afraid of people knowing what your European countries had done to poor countries!
It a shameful thing! And you lots should be able to help fight against it !
By supporting the right policies against poor countries!
Ps I live in the uk! Too!😂