The best video guide on internet for Flight Assist Off on ELITE DANGEROUS, thanks for the explications with the pictures of axes etc. I wish they put some HUD VECTOR sensor on the ships but this tutorial give all the tips to learn at the moment, Thank's again, I wish some french pilots do the same video for the others, or ELITE to link this video for the elite pilots :D
+Christopher Dijoux Indeed.. a proper Vector HUD has been a topical debate throughout Elite's creative process, back in Alpha we did have ticker-tape gauges/guides around the fov as to what your ship was doing on each 6dof axis, but for whatever reason decided just the space dust was sufficient (I believe the reasons were to create a clutter free field of view). Then the space dust was scaled back in intensity so it was much harder to see, but at least there is just enough.. just.. to be able to see one's trajectory and orientation as it is now in the current game. Perhaps one day Frontier will give those who use fa off a hud that only appears when it's used, so those that don't want to see it don't have to. Perhaps once you've learnt and are confident in piloting with fa off you could do an fa off "a la francais" yourself ;-)
Just wanted to say thank you for doing these videos. I watched Part 1 and I'm just starting Part 2 now. Very informative and thorough; I'm sure I'll be reviewing this over and over again. The controller mapping for XBox One is a challenge, because I can't map thrusters, pitch, yaw, and roll on the same controller. Something has to give.
Thanks for taking the time to make these guides. I was dissatisfied with the controls and didn't realise it was because of Flight Assist. After finding out that it was FA causing my woes a pre-made tutorial on how to learn piloting without it would save me a lot of time.
The exercises involving staying in line with the station had me puzzled at first, then I realized at the end it was to prepare you for countering based on space dust and it all clicked lol. I just started with the space dust but I totally see the point of those exercises now.
Thanks for starting from the basics with part 1 rather than assuming we've consulted a different video. As a complete beginner,I find your part 1 far more informative accessible than the other video you referenced in that video.
Just wow - been playing for a few months and having moved up to larger less maneuverable ships (using FAOn) these tutorials are invaluable. Very detailed, very thorough, love the "lesson" approach. Great job!!!!
+Mark Vernon Thanks Mark, splitting this all up in many an exercise was imperative or we'd have gotten lost very quickly. Appreciate you stopping by to say those kind words, I'm glad you found something useful. :)
Hey Bro, i want to thank you for the tutorial. After many months of playing Elite, i decided to give flight assist off a go, and let me tell you just flying around learning how to control the ship was a blast. It feels like a brand new game to me now, i even went back to flying a sidewinder because it is so much fun now. After watching your tutorial made me understand how to control your ship and always keep an eye on the vector. I am proud pilot now, this is the most challenging task i ever done since graduation boot camp. keep it coming.
ej j Hey mate, the primary reaon for making these guides was to try and encourage the fa On pilot who may have perhaps tried fa off briefly, and naturally after these first attempts it really feels like you may never really get a grasp of piloting with no flight assists, but yes, as I eluded in these guides it's possibly not a stretch to be able to learn even after playing for so long with flight assist On. On the whole it's not that much harder to accomplish, it's simply a different way of piloting. Anyway, I'm glad to hear someone else has found these guides beneficial, and for you to post you have been having some success and found these lessons useful, I am very pleased to hear this and makes the time I put in to it all the more rewarding, so thank you for letting me know, these messages like your own makes it all the more worth while for myself and hopefully you too which it sounds like it has from your accomplishments. So cheers, and well done, and keep me updated on your progress in future. Glad to be of help ej j! _Edit: Part 3 is nearly done with more advanced manouvres and other tips to get the most out of combat_
As always colossal work here, mate! I am still learning a lot from felling how the ship is drifting in the space and always i got huge impact on my skills when i passed through the gate into the station on a high speed. You need quickly find your landing pad, take control of your ship, directed it and stop it exactly where it should be in the limit of space around you. Also especially with digital controls your get a lot of information how sensitive you control are. So this is really tough exercise, its always really dangerous, but its help a lot!
How's it going fella? Station itself is a really good location, especially now we have a tutorial docking lesson, to dock is perhaps quite high up on the learning flight assist off scale, seeing as you have to be so accurate. I did consider this but as far as an actual guide though for open space it's not that much use because of this very fact the vector hud (space dust) disappears once you get close to the station, so anything you learn will be hard to translate to when you are only in open space with only the dust. Good practice for someone at your level already, but remember what you learn will only ever really be useful around a station where there is a fixed point reference because you're not using the dust to do it, not necessarliy in open space with only the dust. You are right about how sensitive any digital control really is, all the more reason to fly with no assists for anyone who has only digital thruster controls because quick digital controls don't have much effect on a falling/drifting ship. Thanks for your comments Falkrum :)
LOOK INVERTED Things going fine, thanks! Some cool stuff coming into the game, so i testing Vulture right now and this ships is real beast! I am trying to upload new video with some gameplay and mystery stuff comes with 1.2 Beta3. It should come soon!
Falkrum7 I have access to the beta myself but have yet to try at all as yet, been too busy doing this guide amongst other stuff. Perhaps I'll have a go at it now. In the mean time though I look forward to seeing what you post about it yourself, I'll keep an eye out :)
A huge compliment for your extensive FA-off lessons. Today I practiced flying around the habitat ring of Knights Dock in Lugh and what a cool experience that was!! I never thought I'd ever be an FA-off pilot, but with this guide and a lot of practice, I might become one. I started of slowly spinning around the habitat, much slower than the it's own rotation, but in while I picked up the pace, while in the end, I managed to reach the max speed of my practice sidewinder, almost scratching the side of the habitat. Working the joystick still need a lot of practice, but for me there is no race to elite. It's the road. So I will keep practicing until I can dock my Cobra and Vulture with FA-off as easy as it is with FA-on. Thanks LI for helping us to enjoy this game even more :)
You are truly and wholeheartedly welcome. There really is a certain satisfaction when it does start to 'click', the point at which you think I would never have got this far, so I am very pleased to hear to have made progress and these lessons have contributed to this. To be honest if you've managed this initial first step to get the ship to.. more or less go where you want it to go, other manouvres are much more likely to fall in to place now, practice makes perfect of course, but you've done the really hard part now and from now on it should start to get easier. Glad to be of help, part 3 on the way very soon, but these messages such as your own make it all the worth while for me, so thank you for your comments Rutger, don't hesitate to ask me anything further. :)
Well I finally felt confident enough about my flying to start hunting with FA-off. Moved to a NAV beacon and did all my flying with FA-off. One time I even managed to fly circles around my opponent. For now I think I will do the circle around the habitat or docking bay trainig for while as a warm up exercise before every hunt, but I'm really getting into this :)
Rutger Olthuis Yeah, it's addictive that's for sure. I liked the game before I learnt to pilot with no assists, but now I can't get enough of it, it never gets dull, always a challenge and so _very_ rewarding. Glad to hear it mate :)
Hi CMDR Lancer. This was well worth the wait. You explain it very very well, and I particularly like the exercise. I appreciate that you taking the time to share your knowledge. Eager to see Part 3.
Thanks mate, I'm not sure at what level you are at or anyone else for that matter, the main exersises here to bring a falling ship under control are crucial to get proficient at, before we move on to using the technique of choosing to leave one of the three thrusters aside to effect our momentum in a particular direction on purpose and intentionally, which is going to be in part 3 amongst other stuff. I expect most fairly experienced fa off pilots have been quite bored so far so will hopefully find Part 3 more useful, I simply decided not to skip anything if I was to do this series properly. I expect part 3 won't take three weeks either do to this time, was the amount of editing in this part 2 that was ridiculous, the footage was collected in a matter of hours ;).
So basically what you're saying, in a nutshell, is check the direction of the space dust, compensate with thrusters in the opposite direction and keep an eye on the velocity to reach a near zero value for successfully stopping. The boost flip is often used to keep a hostile in sight which is a pretty important move. A lot to take in. Thanks for this. Extremely informative.
If you want to continue your current momentum then you would apply the opposite of the space dust (you got a bit confused or I'm simply misunderstanding what you've said). So to clarify: Remember.... the most important thruster inputs when piloting with assist off are counters (as in trying to slow the ship down, you'll not have any issue speeding up), so... notice the direction the dust itself is travelling (which is opposite to your ship) and match the direction of this space dust with the same direction thrusters to counter your speed. Like I say, remember.. the space dust itself is travelling the opposite direction as your ship is, (to give you the feeling of momentum), but by noticing this direction of the dust across your FOV is a quick way to realise which thrusters you need to bring the ship under control, by matching this _dust's_ direction with the same direction thrusters.
LOOK INVERTED Yes, of course. You're right (I was pretty tired when I typed that). But I've slept now and I see my mistake. Dust travelling up and to the right, means I'm travelling down and to the left so in order to stop I thrust in the direction the space dust is going (up and to the right). Most of the time when I battle with assist off my hands are acting as if it's on, meaning I accumulate a lot of velocity in a certain direction without compensating which in turn means I go spinning in all the wrong ways. I've got a long way to go before I can do this by intuition. Practice makes perfect :)
The Highlander Practice makes perfect, indeed it does! At first it seems very hard simply because of having to break the habits we've learnt from piloting with assist on, like you say, you're not compensating because you've never had to before. It's simply a different way of piloting, if we'd all started with assist off in the first place I believe we all could have learnt it much quicker, it's simply these bad lazy habits we've got to get out of our systems first. A bit harsh to say lazy but you know what I mean, there is frankly not that much to do with assist on in my opinion, which is one of the main reasons I find it so rewarding and addictive to fly with assist off, and you will too once it clicks. You won't regret putting in the time to learn in the first place, once you reap the rewards you'll perceive the game in a completely different light. There is something really compelling and satisfying about piloting a ship in a flowing, drifting, falling manner, it is of course what space flight should be/is like. Have fun and good luck, don't hesitate to ask me anything further and let me know how you get on :)
LOOK INVERTED Flying "free" (to put a word on it) is something I'm sure I can do. Just have to make it intuitive for myself. But here's a question...do you have rotational assistance on or off?
The Highlander Free indeed, good description. You are talking of Rotational Correction yes? This is purely for docking when you are flying with Assist On, so your ship matches the rotation of the station you are approaching. Rotational Correction is always off with Flight Assist Off (it doesn't let you change it in functions whilst switched to FA off because it's not applicable in the assist off mode). Try turning it off with Assist On when approaching a station and you'll see what it does. Edit: I should say try turning it off and back on again and your ship will start rotating with roll if you are perfectly aligned to the station entrance (i.e: axis), but if not aligned and off to one side a bit, the ship's thrusters will start to fire to keep the whole ship's translation aligned and moving/rotating at the same speed as the station. You obviously don't need any of this with assist off.
Thank you for the supreme effort you have gone through with these tutorial videos. I really appreciate the level of detail and clarity that you have gone into. I have wanted to try to learn FA Off for a while now and am definitely going to give these techniques a go. I am thinking of streaming my learning over the coming days/weeks/months (should result in some spectacular cock-up highlights). Many thanks once again, awesome work.
Cmdr Embryo you are more than welcome. I'm very glad to hear you think you'll find these guides useful, I'd be interested to watch your progress on which ever stream platform you are using. Twitch or something of the like? Let me know your stream channel's name/ID if you fancy an extra viewer :) (send me it privately if you prefer). Thanks for your kind words, messages like yours make all the hard work worth while!
You are welcome to watch me, my Twitch channel is Cmdr_Embryo. The FA Off learning is going to take a back seat while I am exploring at the mo. Not sure how long I will be out for. I hope to progress through the explorer rank some way. Anyhow, hope to see you in the channel chat make sure you say hi.
Cmdr Embryo Perhaps I'll drop by when you least expect it, what sort of time code are you likely to be on. I'm in the uk if you hadn't guessed (so you or I can work it out if you're situated elsewhere)
Hey inverted, thank you for this, seriously, I believe I had the advantage of coming into this game a a few days ago & instantly looked for dogfighting & flight tips & found your videos so I learned right off the bat how to fly with your instructions, a blank slate so to speak, if you ever get the chance look up InnocentzX on Xbox one, uploaded a few videos which I believe were ok(looked cool at least) you've made this game so much more enjoyable for me so thank you again.
+LandD Thanks for stopping by mate and for your compliments, and I am very glad to hear you found these guides useful, you are in the position many would wish to be, learning without having to break many an fa on bad habit so to speak. I did a quick search for your channel but it produced no results on here, perhaps xbox one has a separate youtube? Either that or give me a link, I'd like to have a look :).
I cannot fathom how much work you put into this guide, I really wish I was playing the game so I could appreciate the video fully, hopefully I'll be able to fix this mistake in a few months time. Looking very much forward to your next interstellar escapade.
Hey Hjerrick, t'was the amount of editing that took a long time, the fottage itself didn't take very long to collect, but still, yes, to be honest I didn't think there was going to be _as_ much work as there was in the end. My workflow is increased now with getting used to the editing software as well so that helps. The guide will always be here when you do eventually manage to sort your dilemma. Part 3 in kinda done, sort of, then I'll be back to interstellar escapades. :) Thanks Hjerrick
LOOK INVERTED Weeell, it's not as bad as all that, I've just spent way too much time and money on real world escapades round our fair continent these past few months. Although, I guess GB isn't really attached to europe is it? In that case I suppose it's my fair continent. Either way, I'll be slowing down soon and that's when I'll be able to justify spending money on a proper computer.
Hjerrick Sounds interesting actually, you are a traveller and adventurer ay, I'd be lying to say I've never wondered what the actual reasons were as to what was holding you back! I have been to 'main land' europe a few times when I was heavily in to cycling, Spain, France, Italy, but never up north to Scandanavia where you are, too bloomin cold ;). I get the main issue now, it's simply not just the cost of a game alone, building a pc can get quite expensive, that said, these days the cost of an effective rig good enough to play Elite for instance, shouldn't cost too much nowadays. Still you're talking hundreds of pounds (sterling), which could get you to travel to another country and back again. You are probably still quite young, I expect the older you get anyway will naturally 'slow' you down :)
LOOK INVERTED Hah, yeah :) I definitely prefer cycling in sunny, mountainous, southern france compared to the cold, windy, swathes of nothingness here in Denmark. Hey, I have a dumb question that I've never bothered to look up the answer to, and now that I've got you here... What does sterling mean? Are there different kinds of money related pounds you could be referring to? And what do you mean "quite young"? :O I've been allowed to drink in (almost) every country I've been to! I guess I'd be less prone to outbursts like these had I been just a bit older, eh?
Hjerrick Hehe, "outbursts", you've got a way with words ;) Er I'm not quite sure why I wrote "sterling", as if it were a slightly different variation of the pound. So no, there aren't any other type of pounds other than 'pounds sterling'. That is I believe the full and correct description for pounds, I'm presuming it's added after pounds and written this way since the currency _coinage_ used to be made out of sterling silver? Pfft, not sure! And quite young, I would suggest you are early twenties? I'm an old git in my early forties, but I must be slightly over in my estimation of early twenties for you if you suggest you are not getting served 'the toxic' in particular countries, unless some have a particularly high age limit? Never bought alcohol on my cycling trips, doesn't really go well with a 100 mile cycling leg the next day ;)
Way late to the party here....There's an old space sim Independence War that made great use on classic physics, and your video really helped me remember how to make those moves again. That being said, the ships in that old game were all very large and used turrets extensively.Great exersizes to get muscle memory started!
not sure if it just wasn't common knowledge or if you intentionally excluded it but the lesson at 11:01 is also applicable to using the cargo scoop as a boost limiter, because it limits speed but not rotation rate and, assuming you release the cargo scoop soon enough, still gives you a great deal of momentum at the end of the rotation
Great guide! Helps a lot. I still suck at combat with FA off, but better than I was at first anyway. =) After having the basics somewhat in hand, I noticed that one good way to practice might also be the first combat mission in the training. BUT note, WITHOUT engaging the enemy straight ahead. He will keep flying around (rather slowly though), changing direction once a while. So I thought it was quite good to practice flying around him with FA off and keeping a certain distace to him. =) Thanks for your efforts again.. fly da.. safe ;)
Certainly, nothing wrong with having a target that moves to make you fly in a certain direction, tutorials are a good place to start. What ever you try it's all about bringing the ship under control with all three thrusters, then once you've managed to do this you can choose to leave one of the three aside to fly where ever you want intentionally. Good luck & Fly.. reckless, sorry safe, safe.
A bit late, but rather than looking at the dust and trying to guess, It's better to gauge whether the dust is traveling parallel to the station, and adjust your thrust accordingly. You can then make continuous adjustments while watching both and cease when you have achieved the desired vector. (Old Freelancer trick.) This is a closer approximation to how adjustments are made in combat situations, and allows for a more accurate and real time assessment of whether your thrust manipulation is correct. This is from a digital input perspective only. I've not used analog thrusters.
+Austin Smith Never too late Austin :). Indeed, you hit the nail on the head, that is really the main reason I used a station such as this as a reference to help you gauge both until you get used to only the dust on its own.
Now you did it... The server will be flooded with awesome pilots :D. Regardless of the video being very long, it is informative, cut down to the necessary and easy to understand. All the lessons are nicely set up and the information divided into nice logical packages. Well, considering the length, the impatient player will not make it to the end... so some of the secrets will remain safe :D. Very well done tutorial, Sir! Be seeing you in space, commander. (sooner than later :) )
Hi Frank, yeah I thought it best to create links in the description too for easy quick jumping to certain exercises. Thanks for your kind words, on a side note I've tried to start a discussion on this page about the 6DoF control dilemma and mentioned you, hope you don't mind. It seems no one has either read it yet or has anything to say at present anyway, but thought it would be interesting to see other's take on this 'no controller at present designed for a space sim' issue. Oh yeah loving your Kerbal Sidewinder, that gave me quite a chuckle. I'll be replying to you properly in due time, got a bit more time on my hands now this guide is done :)
I doff my visor to you sir. Thank you for such a thorough and interesting video. This time you have surpassed my expectations of understanding this mechanic. I think I will practice on asteroids in the tutorials rather than messing up playing on line. Cheers. I'm now going back to watch more thoroughly without skipping (long video so I grazed it)
Appreciate your kind words Avago, don't forget one can still do all these exercises in Solo Mode so as _not_ to look rather odd flying up and down a station's axis for hours on end ;). Asteroid field is of course a useful practice arena, couldn't agree more, I tried to think of scenarios like these exercises amongst an asteroid field but was harder to gauge one's success at pulling them off compared with using a station, found it to be a more accurate reference. Let me know how you get on!
I have been doing the exercises you have outlined and I am catching on fairly quickly...I still have a long way to go before I am combat ready. I want to comment that I am using a Saitek X-55 H.O.TA.S and I was having great difficulty keeping the ship stable. It turns out that tension spring in my joystick allowed a very miniscule amount of play in the stick. To compensate for this, I added very slight deadzones to the yaw, pitch, and roll axis. After introducing this change I rapidly improved leaps and bounds. I am mentioning this because I know that you discourage the use of deadzones for the axis... however they may help would be pilots who have setups where there is a physical issue with the control inputs. I cannot thank you enough for your guide.
Joseph Allen Thanks for your comments Joseph, how's it going? I have done exactly the same thing on my own stick actually. Deadzones are best avoided even at the best of times but not to use them for the function they are created/intended for, to remove any small traces of input that are perhaps being applied when your hand isn't on the stick. Sometimes people think deadzones help with sensitivity which of course they don't, which is why I said what I said for this game and the sensitive ship rotation and quite frankly it's best to recommend no one to use deadzones under "most" circumstnces. They'll figure out the precise reason for when to use them for the reasons we have ourselves. It's good to hear you are making progress, you make a valid point and perhaps I should have covered this in the guide somewhere.. the very fact one's stick should be set up properly in the first place with no traces of input being applied will most certainly make anyone's progress in learning much more productive. Perhaps they'll read your comment and mine and think about checking their joystick. So thanks to you too and good luck with your own progress, it's certainly a lot of fun isn't it? :)
Look Inverted I am progressing... I just need to master countering and maintaining control under pressure. Repetition will make everything more natural for me, for now it is very procedural and robotic. Do you suggest flying solely in FA Off to learn? Total immersion? 4pips to shields (I will be crashing like Launchpad McQuack) Eventually my goal is to switch seamlessly between both.
Joseph Allen Piloting with no flight assistance (no key mapped to turning it back on at all) was exactly how I did it myself, I forced myself with crashing many a time in learning the quickest in some respects. Even now I haven't the flight assist toggle mapped anywhere (only mapped it somewhere for these guides), but I am still learning new things even now and so having to "make do" is the quickest way to learn in my opinion, but that said it is highly addictive and I'm having such a great time.
Awesome Video! I am using an xbox controller and cannot figure out how to incorporate yaw into my bindings. So far I've done as you've instructed with the thrusters (left stick+ Rb+LB) / pitch/roll (right stick) but haven't quite figured how to utilize yaw. I'm curious of your bindings, do you have them posted anywhere? Any tips would be most useful. Thanks again!
LOOK INVERTED SWEET LORDY-LAWKS SIR! Flippin' eck, I'm only 2 minutes in and the level of detail and thoroughness to which you you have gone to is brilliant. Lovin' the contents list at the beginning, great stuff. As for your previous video and peoples comments, where on earth are you meant to begin, but at the beginning, sheesh. Looking forward to the rest of the vid but just thought I'd post to say, good job so far fella! :-)
Spiggs Hi mate, how's things? Appreciate your kind words, this part 2 did take quite a bit longer than the previous, not only because of its length, the footage itself was captured in a few hours but my god the amount of editing ;), oh yeah and perhaps I should say, no one directly commented about the previous being a tad obvious, it was simply me covering all bases just in case anyone "thought" it was patronising, I expect some perhaps did because it was quite a simple guide that most would have understood for the experienced player, just not the novice, but still thought it best to start at the beginning like you say. Thanks again Spiggs, chapter links in the 'show more' description for each subject for when/if you wanna come back to a certain lesson. :)
The way I look at is, flight assit on utilizes wing flaps, rudder. Not very realistic in deep space due to lack of resistence. Flight assit off, utilizes various thrusters, realistic in deep space due to same reason, no resistence in space.
Question: I don't usually fly fully FA off because I still need to learn some of the skills (thank you) and my joystick seems hyper sensitive... but I often use thrusters UP and DOWN while flying in FA ON to stick on the tail of a target and that seems to work well. If I am continually holding a down thruster on while in FA ON... will I only be getting down thrust or also forward thrust? When I do this I am essentially tailing them in a turn bu also thrusting down so I am continually pushing myself behind them and keeping my guns pointed at them.
+dregerclock As long as you've centered or zeroed your main forwards/backwards thrust whilst doing this thrust down then yes, all your ship will be doing is translating downwards no matter how your ship is orientated, for you to then apply a slight forwards or backwards main throttle axis to keep at a specific distance from your target you are vertically strafing (with fa On of course). With fa Off it's a bit different and you have to keep an eye on your throttle display to check if you're travelling slightly forwards or backwards, depending on your orientation, one can never really translate exactly in any vector/direction so the throttle display will at least tell you what is required (though one can gauge a lot of this by the target/hostile you're strafing, but it's good to keep an eye on your throttle display regularly, much like a habit of using a rear-view mirror when driving).
+Look Inverted Thanks... yeah, what i am doing seems to work great against Condas and other ships... Clippers can sometimes turn around on me still... and Fed assault ships seem to be close to be able to shake me ... i think some FA off would help me getting and staying behind them.
Petr Zubets Hey Petr, thanks for the compliments. The powersliding is pretty much happening all the time when piloting with no flight assistance, simply because when piloting like this, one has a tendency to turn (orientate) your craft to face your enemy/contact, thus you aren't facing your current ship's vector anymore. So in essence once you've done this "turning" and you apply any thruster lateral/vertical or even forwards/backwards thrust you are basically powersliding. It happens all the time quite frankly when piloting with no flight assistance, but this exercise in this that's entitled "powersliding" is an exercise to help you practice this technique with the station as a reference to powerslide around. Once you've done this quite a few times you'll exercise the same technique when in combat and will be powersliding everywhere. Your question as to how do you do it, explaining the exact inputs in text isn't really possible, I suggest you find an orbis type station with a habitable ring and see which thrusters you need to continue *_or_* counter your "slide" around this large circular reference point. Which thrusters will depend on which way you are orientated in relation to this habitable ring. Give it a go and you'll soon see which thrusters are needed to accelerate and speed up your momentum or counter this momentum and slow down.
+:P Would that be the Display Hardware Cursor option set to off by any chance? If it is this that you are refering to, you may find it a bit odd when clicking on buttons etc when in the station menu and whatnot, it will appear to be slightly missaligned. Nothing you can't get used to but just thought I'd warn you of the drawback of turning this option off. Glad to hear you're finding it much improved without the cursor constantly catching your eye, I haven't ever played with keyboard + mouse but I'd expect it would be very irritating.
What I meant was that I turned on cursor auto center which made the arrow to control the turning reset in the middle immediately after let go of the mouse which makes turning a lot easier to do almost like a first person shooter. Now I can use fixed weapons in FA off mode
:P Ar right, forgive me, yes that makes sense, there's also the relative mouse mode, perhaps this is something to do with it as well. As you've guessed I'm a novice concerning mouse controls and what's available, your help has been most welcome, cheers :)
Hi, quick question. I have unabled yaw on roll, yaw axis is RZ, roll X on my Thrustmaster, but my ship keeps yawing at the moment i try to start the roll movement. Any hints?
I'm on PC & have been flying with a combination of mostly XBox Controller & keyboard with FA on. Is there a recommended controller / keyboard layout that works well for FA Off?
Hmm, depends on how I'm understanding what you're using. I gather the 'keyboard and mouse users' feel they've the advantage in the natural precision of the mouse itself, not the keyboard which is of course just a load of digital buttons - if I'm understanding you correctly you're using a controller in place of the mouse? Not sure how this works in relation to a twitchy ship's rotation when flying with FA Off (one of the hardest aspects to get used to, and with mouse users they've a 'Sensitivity' option in-game. All HOTAS users, inc gamepad controllers, don't have this option).
@@LOOKINVERTED I definitely don't use mouse - it's too unintuitive for me. Joysticks are what I need. Mouse just seems wrong. Right for FPS games and RPGs, but not for flying.
@@Skiamakhos To be honest I couldn't agree more, tried the mouse and keyboard combo out simply due to curiosity and much preferred my hotas, and I'm pretty sure there are hidden advantages whilst using a proper flightstick considering it's the industrial standard. Not sure how or why you've ended up with a keyboard in one hand and a gamepad in the other, can tell you now there are better controller combos out for Elite specifically so perhaps try changing your setup. It will undoubtedly feel very weird at first but over time you'll be fine. Good luck anyway, you wouldn't regret purchasing a hotas either if you're into sims.
@@LOOKINVERTED it's mostly because there just aren't enough buttons on a gamepad to take care of everything. Most things, but not all. I reckon you're right, entry level HOTAS would be the thing.
@@Skiamakhos That too, buttons are prob a good reason for using a keyboard too. Button assignment is one of the most complex and time-consuming challenges to make the whole experience as intuitive as possible. When I went from my Hotas' hands-on-throttle to a gamepad (for reasons I alluded to in part 1 of this guide) I sacrificed many a convenient button on the throttle for my gamepad instead but it was my only option but thankfully there's plenty on my hotas' stick itself that I found that most assigned with no problem. Any remaining I left to the keyboard placed infront of my monitor & setup as a backup emergency area for those rarely used functions. Perhaps keep this in mind when you decide on which hotas to purchase and find one with plenty of buttons unless you're fine with using the keyboard too for these less-used functions (which is fine like I say, just not for frequently used ones - you don't want to be taking your hands off the stick and throttle constantly).
This is really hard and frustrating but i start to get the hang of it.. even though i feel it's quite hard to manage the forward/backward speed with a throttle (which doesn't zero in) and my vertical and lateral thrusters with a digital hat sick. however one of the main questions i have doesn't concern the controls but how you setup your head look. do you have a dedicated stick or use a toggle button or something fancy like a IRTracker?
***** Hey Stefan. Yeah at first it is hard, there's no denying that, was exactly how I felt when I learnt but once it clicked, in a rudamentary manner, I got so addicted with the floating, falling feeling so didn't mind all the practice thereafter. I agree that digital thrusters aren't ideal for fine control, but considering when each counter thruster is applied it is normally needed to be pressed for a sustained period whether you are using digital or analogue controls. The issue with digital controls usually rears its head when needing these varied amounts of thrust to counter a secondary lessor axis. "Learning Flight Assist Off - Part 3" (next upload in series) actually demonstrates a useful exercise aligning up with a station entrance where the varied thrust that is needed is forwards (and/or backwards thrust, but usually forwards if using what I refered to as the main premise), so this varied forward thrust which on a hotas is your normal analogue throttle control. So... what I'm trying to say is in the end, as long as you always roll until your target tracks upwards or flies over your head (the main premise) this varied thrust can be achieved, and the only real time to use, on a regular basis, your digital POV/HAT is used for vertical thrust which on the whole always needs to be a full digital input anyway. I hope I haven't confused you too much, guide 3/part 2 explains it in more detail. As far as my head movement, you guessed it, I use TrackIR with a baseball cap infra red reference clip. I love the game with this, I've tried to play the game again once without it and it felt so restricted as if looking through a fixed window. Of course it's yet _more money_ and the TrackIR is very expensive to be honest as much as it _is_ good, but if you're interested in using such a device on a budget check out edtracker.org.uk/ made by a few devoted E:D backers who decided the trackIR was too expensive, I probably would have bought one if I hadn't already bought my TrackIR, but I've heard good things about it and it's a fraction of the cost. Apologies for the long reply :)
LOOK INVERTED A long post that has a lot of useful information in it never needs an apology ;-) you explained how to use the digital inputs quite well actually. I doubt i'm ever gonna be able to break down a multi-axial vector to 0 in a reasonable time but i usually get it down to 20... My problem is that i unconciously move the flightstick and/or throttle so i make it harder for myself. But hey, practise makes perfect and i didn't have enought of that ^^ I'm asking about the head look because i think the sideways-movement will become a lot safer when it's easyer to see where you're going. ;) But i just noticed i'm about to get off topic on one more of your videos here. So i'll just go to the fontier forums and ask my other questions about headtracking there. =) Thanks a lot your videos really help =)
***** Totally agree, you hit the nail on the head. As an example if you notice in this guide on various occasions I look left or right to see the angle of the space dust more clearly, that is generally what I'm doing, I'm not turning my head just for fun. So for sure being able to look where and when you want aids your intended control inputs, not to mention the added benefit of keeping track of a hostile without even needing to use your radar on the whole very much, I barely do use the radar myself only when I've lost track of him, so ideally always trying to keep track of the target visually. The tricky part at first is the confusion of which thrusters you need when looking in a completely different direction to your normal facing straight ahead, but before long this becomes second nature. I haven't even mentioned the increased immersion and enjoyment one gets out of the game as well, so if you do intend to buy one, what ever variant, you won't regret purchasing one, even if you buy the full bells and whistles TrackIR :) Forum thread does have a wonderment of threads concerning this subject for your research, but don't hesitate to ask me anything further, as long as it's E:D related I don't really care what page it's on, it's all relevant!
What if i use just keyboard and mouse? These manoeuvres are next to impossible, right? (I'm asking becase I can't try it myself for next 40 days as I am away from my gaming computer :D )
Morpheus2403 Not necessarily. I'm not going to say anything other than a proper hotas set up is less than ideal, however that said, with one of the main principles of the control inputs when piloting with no flight assistance _sometimes_ are mainly about how *long* you hold each thruster, not necessarily how *much* of a thruster input, so.. one can still use a keyboard with these digital controls and manouevre the ship with relative success, like I say, as long as you concentrate on your 'duration' of control inputs. To be fair as well, controlling the ship's orientation/rotation with a mouse, with the extensive power curve adjusters and sensitivity sliders you get with the mouse, some might say this is actually easier to control than using a joystick which has none of these aids. I have covered a chapter for this concerning the technique behind digital control _Chapter 12_ (because some hotas' only have digital pov/hats which is the only control option to use for lateral and vertical thrusters, so thought it best to cover this technique if you only have these digital controls for thrusters) so with keyboard you haven't any more of a disadvantage. Of course ideally I would recommend everyone to use an analogue control setup, clearly these will give us the fine adjustment that is sometimes needed, but this is not to say with digital controls it is impossible. Like I say, check out chapter 12 in this guide, and apologies for the long reply ;)
Morpheus2403 Just a quick note to perhaps guide you in the right direction concerning keyboard mapping/bindings. From previous discussions about this with a few players I've talked to, about how/where to actually map *all* the thrusters to which keys? One would normally map forwards/backwards thrust to "W" & "S", then "A" & "D" for lateral thrust. But this of course leaves which for vertical thrust? This doesn't really work so many of my keyboard & mouse friends map WASD for vertical and lateral thrust, _(and perhaps "Q" & "E" for ship roll, then you don't have to use the roll on yaw option for your mouse, just have the mouse pitching and yawing with these Q and E for Roll)_ but this is optional. However we haven't mapped your main forward backward throttle axis anywhere yet, so one ideally needs a mouse with a couple of extra buttons on it (usually on the side perhaps) to map your forward/backwards thrust on it. This is the only acceptable method so as to get all your thrusters mapped to keys, and also that are in a configuration that you could perhaps get used to (like I say, most if not all my key/mouse friends have it set like this). Hope this helps a bit. I suggest all this because when mapping forwards/backwards & lateral thrust to emulate a first person shooter (WASD) which is the natural reaction, vertical thrust obviously wants to be on the same keys (W,S) or you simply have to leave vertical to somewhere else, but where. So ideally you need a mouse with a couple of extra buttons on it to have your main throttle axis somewhere where it will feel intuitive to use, and like I say, WASD for your translation thrusters. Hope I haven't battered your head in too much ;)
:P Haha, I've done it in a Type-7 (quite easy actually, did it in my most recent "a 'little' thanks to subscribers" post) but for sure a Type-9 monster is no doubt a completely different level of cumbersome :)
+vedasisme The good thing with the mouse specifically is you get sensitivity and power curve adjusters, something the joystick user doesn't get (so if you can manage ship flight with keyboard&mouse you'll have a noticeable advantage in ship rotation/orientation), but these exercises in this part 2 guide concerning digital thruster controls of course relate to the keyboard user as well as the hotas with a digital hat for thrusters. Your main issue is finding enough keys for ALL thrusters that feels intuitive to use. WASD used for your vertical/lateral but where do you then put your forward/backward thrust? R & F perhaps or I have heard of someone using a couple of buttons on their mouse. Once you find a good layout you like with all thrusters to hand and have got used to it, you'll do well with flight assist off with k&m. You should check out this guy: ua-cam.com/users/skafsgaardhjorthfeatured He's a couple of vids helping out the aspriring fa off pilot (not to mention many other vids) from the perspective of keyboard + mouse and fa off, he's an excellent pilot - you should check out his channel, perhaps this will help as well.
Thank you for the tips, I've already been applying some FA-off tactics to great effect in the training battles. I'll have to experiment with the power curve adjusters, that sounds like it will be just the thing I need, and I'll check out the link immediately. Thank you again!
vedasisme Only one - by increasing the Gamma setting in Graphics options. This does work but obviously the rest of the graphics are messed up too, I've heard of a few cmdrs doing this initially just while they're learning, then gradually reduce it bit by bit back to normal.
Igor Vlasiuk Forgive me Igor, I'm not entirely sure what you are trying to find out. Are you asking me if I know where there is another station similar to Peterson Dock like the one I used? Or in which instance will these training scenarios translate and be useful for when you haven't a station as reference perhaps? Sorry I'm not sure what you are asking me, please clarify and rephrase.
LOOK INVERTED I want to learn flight assist-off techniques. And actually want to practice with Peterson Dock station (or similar doesn't matter. 2-3 axes exercises). But can't find such station on training scenarios. So I need to find such station directly in game (its not useful for trainings because you need undock). So maybe some training scenario already has similar station for fast entering to training?
Igor Vlasiuk Ah right sorry, my bad, E:D's own training scenarios. I'm pretty sure the only station type that appears in these is the Coriolis type, which is presumably why you are asking, so yeah you'll simply have to find one of these Orbis types in the game universe itself. Keep in mind there is still private play if you don't want to appear rather odd flying up and down a station's axis in open play. I can understand your rebuy costs would soon disappear if you keep having to rebuy your ship, but if you stick to the tips I suggest in this guide, making sure you're at least a certain distance from the station and keeping any remaining 'pips' to shields to bolster them, you'll be ok, it would be very doubtful if you crashed and burned completely in one go. I did at first try to create exercises using just these training scenarios for the very reason probably why you are asking, like you say so you can just jump in and start training when you feel like it, not having to keep finding a station in the real game to practice on, but nothing much was really very useful. Sorry it is what it is, not sure what your finances are like but one could buy just a boggo standard Sidewinder (what are they 30k?) at each Orbis station you find and keep it there so you know where to go each time and practice more or less when you want at little financial risk. Apologies for the long reply, I don't know when to stop typing sometimes!
Fatih Soykan Hi Fatih, my control setup is rather unorthodox (explained in more detail on my discussion page), but basically I use a x55 Rhino joystick and an xbox pad in my left hand for thrusters. x55 hand on throttle only has a digital hat so find the gamepad's analogue joystick and analogue trigger much better as a control setup (leaving only thrust down on Lb as the only digital input). As I'm sure you are aware, analogue controls are far superior. What do you use yourself or have you not dived in yet and bought one?
Look Inverted i'm using logitech 3d extreme pro and keyboard (: and yes i'm newbie but you have amazing rotation controls in assist off. Really impressive.
Fatih Soykan Appreciate your kind words :) Interesting set up you have there, I'm presuming you use the keyboard for thrusters yes, although I have a question.... How do you have the translation thrusters set up, WASD for vertical & lateral with your main throttle axis somewhere else? I've always wondered how keyboard users set this up because you are an axis down, either mapping W & S for vertical as I say, or having your main forward/backwards throttle on W & S similar to a fps, but then where do you map the vertical? Hope I haven't battered your head in too much but I'm very interested to hear how you've mapped all three axes :)
Look Inverted First of all congrats for your videos and thank you. Extremely well done and with useful content for noobs like me :D. I've limited myself to switch from FA ON and OFF in combat but after watching I'll try all time FA OFF. Btw I tried that mix of logitech 3d xtreme pro and keyboard (WASD as a FPS and adding Q&E for vertical thrusters) it kinda works but I didn't like it, however I never thought of using a gamepad like you do! I will start using my ps3 gamepad and see how it goes. Cheers
***** Thanks Wolfgang, appreciate your compliments. As far as the gamepad for thrusters I doubt I'll ever go back to a hands on throttle, let's keep in mind these have been designed for atmospheric flight, not space flight. As things stand there isn't such a controller for a 6dof space sim but for sure the gamepad I'm using works well enough for me considering it uses analogue inputs for all but one thruster (down which is rarely used quite honestly with the roll until the target is above you technique). Glad to be of help, let me know how you get on :)
![Elite: Dangerous - Learning [combat with] Flight Assist Off (Part 3)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/VLYOHn6aLpQ/mqdefault.jpg)
![Elite: Dangerous - Learning [combat with] Flight Assist Off (Part 3)](/img/tr.png)
These videos alongside Moxen Wolf's are the best guides I've seen for learning this flight mode. Thank you for making them.
The best video guide on internet for Flight Assist Off on ELITE DANGEROUS, thanks for the explications with the pictures of axes etc.
I wish they put some HUD VECTOR sensor on the ships but this tutorial give all the tips to learn at the moment, Thank's again, I wish some french pilots do the same video for the others, or ELITE to link this video for the elite pilots :D
+Christopher Dijoux
Indeed.. a proper Vector HUD has been a topical debate throughout Elite's creative process, back in Alpha we did have ticker-tape gauges/guides around the fov as to what your ship was doing on each 6dof axis, but for whatever reason decided just the space dust was sufficient (I believe the reasons were to create a clutter free field of view). Then the space dust was scaled back in intensity so it was much harder to see, but at least there is just enough.. just.. to be able to see one's trajectory and orientation as it is now in the current game. Perhaps one day Frontier will give those who use fa off a hud that only appears when it's used, so those that don't want to see it don't have to.
Perhaps once you've learnt and are confident in piloting with fa off you could do an fa off "a la francais" yourself ;-)
Just wanted to say thank you for doing these videos. I watched Part 1 and I'm just starting Part 2 now. Very informative and thorough; I'm sure I'll be reviewing this over and over again. The controller mapping for XBox One is a challenge, because I can't map thrusters, pitch, yaw, and roll on the same controller. Something has to give.
Thanks for taking the time to make these guides. I was dissatisfied with the controls and didn't realise it was because of Flight Assist. After finding out that it was FA causing my woes a pre-made tutorial on how to learn piloting without it would save me a lot of time.
The exercises involving staying in line with the station had me puzzled at first, then I realized at the end it was to prepare you for countering based on space dust and it all clicked lol. I just started with the space dust but I totally see the point of those exercises now.
Thanks for starting from the basics with part 1 rather than assuming we've consulted a different video. As a complete beginner,I find your part 1 far more informative accessible than the other video you referenced in that video.
Just wow - been playing for a few months and having moved up to larger less maneuverable ships (using FAOn) these tutorials are invaluable. Very detailed, very thorough, love the "lesson" approach. Great job!!!!
+Mark Vernon
Thanks Mark, splitting this all up in many an exercise was imperative or we'd have gotten lost very quickly. Appreciate you stopping by to say those kind words, I'm glad you found something useful. :)
Hey Bro, i want to thank you for the tutorial. After many months of playing Elite, i decided to give flight assist off a go, and let me tell you just flying around learning how to control the ship was a blast. It feels like a brand new game to me now, i even went back to flying a sidewinder because it is so much fun now. After watching your tutorial made me understand how to control your ship and always keep an eye on the vector. I am proud pilot now, this is the most challenging task i ever done since graduation boot camp. keep it coming.
ej j
Hey mate, the primary reaon for making these guides was to try and encourage the fa On pilot who may have perhaps tried fa off briefly, and naturally after these first attempts it really feels like you may never really get a grasp of piloting with no flight assists, but yes, as I eluded in these guides it's possibly not a stretch to be able to learn even after playing for so long with flight assist On. On the whole it's not that much harder to accomplish, it's simply a different way of piloting.
Anyway, I'm glad to hear someone else has found these guides beneficial, and for you to post you have been having some success and found these lessons useful, I am very pleased to hear this and makes the time I put in to it all the more rewarding, so thank you for letting me know, these messages like your own makes it all the more worth while for myself and hopefully you too which it sounds like it has from your accomplishments. So cheers, and well done, and keep me updated on your progress in future. Glad to be of help ej j! _Edit: Part 3 is nearly done with more advanced manouvres and other tips to get the most out of combat_
As always colossal work here, mate! I am still learning a lot from felling how the ship is drifting in the space and always i got huge impact on my skills when i passed through the gate into the station on a high speed. You need quickly find your landing pad, take control of your ship, directed it and stop it exactly where it should be in the limit of space around you. Also especially with digital controls your get a lot of information how sensitive you control are. So this is really tough exercise, its always really dangerous, but its help a lot!
How's it going fella? Station itself is a really good location, especially now we have a tutorial docking lesson, to dock is perhaps quite high up on the learning flight assist off scale, seeing as you have to be so accurate. I did consider this but as far as an actual guide though for open space it's not that much use because of this very fact the vector hud (space dust) disappears once you get close to the station, so anything you learn will be hard to translate to when you are only in open space with only the dust. Good practice for someone at your level already, but remember what you learn will only ever really be useful around a station where there is a fixed point reference because you're not using the dust to do it, not necessarliy in open space with only the dust. You are right about how sensitive any digital control really is, all the more reason to fly with no assists for anyone who has only digital thruster controls because quick digital controls don't have much effect on a falling/drifting ship.
Thanks for your comments Falkrum :)
LOOK INVERTED Things going fine, thanks! Some cool stuff coming into the game, so i testing Vulture right now and this ships is real beast! I am trying to upload new video with some gameplay and mystery stuff comes with 1.2 Beta3. It should come soon!
Falkrum7
I have access to the beta myself but have yet to try at all as yet, been too busy doing this guide amongst other stuff. Perhaps I'll have a go at it now. In the mean time though I look forward to seeing what you post about it yourself, I'll keep an eye out :)
A huge compliment for your extensive FA-off lessons. Today I practiced flying around the habitat ring of Knights Dock in Lugh and what a cool experience that was!! I never thought I'd ever be an FA-off pilot, but with this guide and a lot of practice, I might become one. I started of slowly spinning around the habitat, much slower than the it's own rotation, but in while I picked up the pace, while in the end, I managed to reach the max speed of my practice sidewinder, almost scratching the side of the habitat.
Working the joystick still need a lot of practice, but for me there is no race to elite. It's the road. So I will keep practicing until I can dock my Cobra and Vulture with FA-off as easy as it is with FA-on.
Thanks LI for helping us to enjoy this game even more :)
You are truly and wholeheartedly welcome. There really is a certain satisfaction when it does start to 'click', the point at which you think I would never have got this far, so I am very pleased to hear to have made progress and these lessons have contributed to this. To be honest if you've managed this initial first step to get the ship to.. more or less go where you want it to go, other manouvres are much more likely to fall in to place now, practice makes perfect of course, but you've done the really hard part now and from now on it should start to get easier. Glad to be of help, part 3 on the way very soon, but these messages such as your own make it all the worth while for me, so thank you for your comments Rutger, don't hesitate to ask me anything further. :)
Well I finally felt confident enough about my flying to start hunting with FA-off. Moved to a NAV beacon and did all my flying with FA-off.
One time I even managed to fly circles around my opponent.
For now I think I will do the circle around the habitat or docking bay trainig for while as a warm up exercise before every hunt, but I'm really getting into this :)
Rutger Olthuis
Yeah, it's addictive that's for sure. I liked the game before I learnt to pilot with no assists, but now I can't get enough of it, it never gets dull, always a challenge and so _very_ rewarding. Glad to hear it mate :)
Hi CMDR Lancer. This was well worth the wait. You explain it very very well, and I particularly like the exercise. I appreciate that you taking the time to share your knowledge. Eager to see Part 3.
Thanks mate, I'm not sure at what level you are at or anyone else for that matter, the main exersises here to bring a falling ship under control are crucial to get proficient at, before we move on to using the technique of choosing to leave one of the three thrusters aside to effect our momentum in a particular direction on purpose and intentionally, which is going to be in part 3 amongst other stuff. I expect most fairly experienced fa off pilots have been quite bored so far so will hopefully find Part 3 more useful, I simply decided not to skip anything if I was to do this series properly.
I expect part 3 won't take three weeks either do to this time, was the amount of editing in this part 2 that was ridiculous, the footage was collected in a matter of hours ;).
So basically what you're saying, in a nutshell, is check the direction of the space dust, compensate with thrusters in the opposite direction and keep an eye on the velocity to reach a near zero value for successfully stopping.
The boost flip is often used to keep a hostile in sight which is a pretty important move.
A lot to take in. Thanks for this. Extremely informative.
If you want to continue your current momentum then you would apply the opposite of the space dust (you got a bit confused or I'm simply misunderstanding what you've said). So to clarify: Remember.... the most important thruster inputs when piloting with assist off are counters (as in trying to slow the ship down, you'll not have any issue speeding up), so... notice the direction the dust itself is travelling (which is opposite to your ship) and match the direction of this space dust with the same direction thrusters to counter your speed.
Like I say, remember.. the space dust itself is travelling the opposite direction as your ship is, (to give you the feeling of momentum), but by noticing this direction of the dust across your FOV is a quick way to realise which thrusters you need to bring the ship under control, by matching this _dust's_ direction with the same direction thrusters.
LOOK INVERTED Yes, of course. You're right (I was pretty tired when I typed that). But I've slept now and I see my mistake. Dust travelling up and to the right, means I'm travelling down and to the left so in order to stop I thrust in the direction the space dust is going (up and to the right).
Most of the time when I battle with assist off my hands are acting as if it's on, meaning I accumulate a lot of velocity in a certain direction without compensating which in turn means I go spinning in all the wrong ways. I've got a long way to go before I can do this by intuition. Practice makes perfect :)
The Highlander
Practice makes perfect, indeed it does! At first it seems very hard simply because of having to break the habits we've learnt from piloting with assist on, like you say, you're not compensating because you've never had to before. It's simply a different way of piloting, if we'd all started with assist off in the first place I believe we all could have learnt it much quicker, it's simply these bad lazy habits we've got to get out of our systems first. A bit harsh to say lazy but you know what I mean, there is frankly not that much to do with assist on in my opinion, which is one of the main reasons I find it so rewarding and addictive to fly with assist off, and you will too once it clicks. You won't regret putting in the time to learn in the first place, once you reap the rewards you'll perceive the game in a completely different light. There is something really compelling and satisfying about piloting a ship in a flowing, drifting, falling manner, it is of course what space flight should be/is like.
Have fun and good luck, don't hesitate to ask me anything further and let me know how you get on :)
LOOK INVERTED Flying "free" (to put a word on it) is something I'm sure I can do. Just have to make it intuitive for myself. But here's a question...do you have rotational assistance on or off?
The Highlander
Free indeed, good description. You are talking of Rotational Correction yes? This is purely for docking when you are flying with Assist On, so your ship matches the rotation of the station you are approaching. Rotational Correction is always off with Flight Assist Off (it doesn't let you change it in functions whilst switched to FA off because it's not applicable in the assist off mode). Try turning it off with Assist On when approaching a station and you'll see what it does.
Edit: I should say try turning it off and back on again and your ship will start rotating with roll if you are perfectly aligned to the station entrance (i.e: axis), but if not aligned and off to one side a bit, the ship's thrusters will start to fire to keep the whole ship's translation aligned and moving/rotating at the same speed as the station.
You obviously don't need any of this with assist off.
Thank you for the supreme effort you have gone through with these tutorial videos. I really appreciate the level of detail and clarity that you have gone into. I have wanted to try to learn FA Off for a while now and am definitely going to give these techniques a go. I am thinking of streaming my learning over the coming days/weeks/months (should result in some spectacular cock-up highlights).
Many thanks once again, awesome work.
Cmdr Embryo you are more than welcome. I'm very glad to hear you think you'll find these guides useful, I'd be interested to watch your progress on which ever stream platform you are using. Twitch or something of the like? Let me know your stream channel's name/ID if you fancy an extra viewer :) (send me it privately if you prefer). Thanks for your kind words, messages like yours make all the hard work worth while!
You are welcome to watch me, my Twitch channel is Cmdr_Embryo. The FA Off learning is going to take a back seat while I am exploring at the mo. Not sure how long I will be out for. I hope to progress through the explorer rank some way. Anyhow, hope to see you in the channel chat make sure you say hi.
Cmdr Embryo
Perhaps I'll drop by when you least expect it, what sort of time code are you likely to be on. I'm in the uk if you hadn't guessed (so you or I can work it out if you're situated elsewhere)
UK too, I try and schedule my streams 9pm onwards Mon, Tues, Thurs, Fri.
Hey inverted, thank you for this, seriously, I believe I had the advantage of coming into this game a a few days ago & instantly looked for dogfighting & flight tips & found your videos so I learned right off the bat how to fly with your instructions, a blank slate so to speak, if you ever get the chance look up InnocentzX on Xbox one, uploaded a few videos which I believe were ok(looked cool at least) you've made this game so much more enjoyable for me so thank you again.
+LandD
Thanks for stopping by mate and for your compliments, and I am very glad to hear you found these guides useful, you are in the position many would wish to be, learning without having to break many an fa on bad habit so to speak. I did a quick search for your channel but it produced no results on here, perhaps xbox one has a separate youtube? Either that or give me a link, I'd like to have a look :).
I cannot fathom how much work you put into this guide, I really wish I was playing the game so I could appreciate the video fully, hopefully I'll be able to fix this mistake in a few months time. Looking very much forward to your next interstellar escapade.
Hey Hjerrick, t'was the amount of editing that took a long time, the fottage itself didn't take very long to collect, but still, yes, to be honest I didn't think there was going to be _as_ much work as there was in the end. My workflow is increased now with getting used to the editing software as well so that helps. The guide will always be here when you do eventually manage to sort your dilemma. Part 3 in kinda done, sort of, then I'll be back to interstellar escapades. :) Thanks Hjerrick
LOOK INVERTED Weeell, it's not as bad as all that, I've just spent way too much time and money on real world escapades round our fair continent these past few months. Although, I guess GB isn't really attached to europe is it? In that case I suppose it's my fair continent.
Either way, I'll be slowing down soon and that's when I'll be able to justify spending money on a proper computer.
Hjerrick
Sounds interesting actually, you are a traveller and adventurer ay, I'd be lying to say I've never wondered what the actual reasons were as to what was holding you back! I have been to 'main land' europe a few times when I was heavily in to cycling, Spain, France, Italy, but never up north to Scandanavia where you are, too bloomin cold ;). I get the main issue now, it's simply not just the cost of a game alone, building a pc can get quite expensive, that said, these days the cost of an effective rig good enough to play Elite for instance, shouldn't cost too much nowadays. Still you're talking hundreds of pounds (sterling), which could get you to travel to another country and back again. You are probably still quite young, I expect the older you get anyway will naturally 'slow' you down :)
LOOK INVERTED Hah, yeah :) I definitely prefer cycling in sunny, mountainous, southern france compared to the cold, windy, swathes of nothingness here in Denmark.
Hey, I have a dumb question that I've never bothered to look up the answer to, and now that I've got you here...
What does sterling mean? Are there different kinds of money related pounds you could be referring to?
And what do you mean "quite young"? :O I've been allowed to drink in (almost) every country I've been to!
I guess I'd be less prone to outbursts like these had I been just a bit older, eh?
Hjerrick
Hehe, "outbursts", you've got a way with words ;)
Er I'm not quite sure why I wrote "sterling", as if it were a slightly different variation of the pound. So no, there aren't any other type of pounds other than 'pounds sterling'. That is I believe the full and correct description for pounds, I'm presuming it's added after pounds and written this way since the currency _coinage_ used to be made out of sterling silver? Pfft, not sure!
And quite young, I would suggest you are early twenties? I'm an old git in my early forties, but I must be slightly over in my estimation of early twenties for you if you suggest you are not getting served 'the toxic' in particular countries, unless some have a particularly high age limit? Never bought alcohol on my cycling trips, doesn't really go well with a 100 mile cycling leg the next day ;)
Way late to the party here....There's an old space sim Independence War that made great use on classic physics, and your video really helped me remember how to make those moves again. That being said, the ships in that old game were all very large and used turrets extensively.Great exersizes to get muscle memory started!
not sure if it just wasn't common knowledge or if you intentionally excluded it but the lesson at 11:01 is also applicable to using the cargo scoop as a boost limiter, because it limits speed but not rotation rate and, assuming you release the cargo scoop soon enough, still gives you a great deal of momentum at the end of the rotation
Great guide! Helps a lot.
I still suck at combat with FA off, but better than I was at first anyway. =)
After having the basics somewhat in hand, I noticed that one good way to practice might also be the first combat mission in the training. BUT note, WITHOUT engaging the enemy straight ahead. He will keep flying around (rather slowly though), changing direction once a while. So I thought it was quite good to practice flying around him with FA off and keeping a certain distace to him. =)
Thanks for your efforts again.. fly da.. safe ;)
Certainly, nothing wrong with having a target that moves to make you fly in a certain direction, tutorials are a good place to start. What ever you try it's all about bringing the ship under control with all three thrusters, then once you've managed to do this you can choose to leave one of the three aside to fly where ever you want intentionally. Good luck & Fly.. reckless, sorry safe, safe.
A bit late, but rather than looking at the dust and trying to guess, It's better to gauge whether the dust is traveling parallel to the station, and adjust your thrust accordingly. You can then make continuous adjustments while watching both and cease when you have achieved the desired vector. (Old Freelancer trick.) This is a closer approximation to how adjustments are made in combat situations, and allows for a more accurate and real time assessment of whether your thrust manipulation is correct. This is from a digital input perspective only. I've not used analog thrusters.
+Austin Smith
Never too late Austin :). Indeed, you hit the nail on the head, that is really the main reason I used a station such as this as a reference to help you gauge both until you get used to only the dust on its own.
Now you did it... The server will be flooded with awesome pilots :D.
Regardless of the video being very long, it is informative, cut down to the necessary and easy to understand. All the lessons are nicely set up and the information divided into nice logical packages.
Well, considering the length, the impatient player will not make it to the end... so some of the secrets will remain safe :D. Very well done tutorial, Sir!
Be seeing you in space, commander. (sooner than later :) )
Hi Frank, yeah I thought it best to create links in the description too for easy quick jumping to certain exercises. Thanks for your kind words, on a side note I've tried to start a discussion on this page about the 6DoF control dilemma and mentioned you, hope you don't mind. It seems no one has either read it yet or has anything to say at present anyway, but thought it would be interesting to see other's take on this 'no controller at present designed for a space sim' issue.
Oh yeah loving your Kerbal Sidewinder, that gave me quite a chuckle. I'll be replying to you properly in due time, got a bit more time on my hands now this guide is done :)
I doff my visor to you sir. Thank you for such a thorough and interesting video. This time you have surpassed my expectations of understanding this mechanic. I think I will practice on asteroids in the tutorials rather than messing up playing on line. Cheers. I'm now going back to watch more thoroughly without skipping (long video so I grazed it)
Appreciate your kind words Avago, don't forget one can still do all these exercises in Solo Mode so as _not_ to look rather odd flying up and down a station's axis for hours on end ;). Asteroid field is of course a useful practice arena, couldn't agree more, I tried to think of scenarios like these exercises amongst an asteroid field but was harder to gauge one's success at pulling them off compared with using a station, found it to be a more accurate reference. Let me know how you get on!
will do cheers!
I have been doing the exercises you have outlined and I am catching on fairly quickly...I still have a long way to go before I am combat ready. I want to comment that I am using a Saitek X-55 H.O.TA.S and I was having great difficulty keeping the ship stable. It turns out that tension spring in my joystick allowed a very miniscule amount of play in the stick. To compensate for this, I added very slight deadzones to the yaw, pitch, and roll axis.
After introducing this change I rapidly improved leaps and bounds. I am mentioning this because I know that you discourage the use of deadzones for the axis... however they may help would be pilots who have setups where there is a physical issue with the control inputs.
I cannot thank you enough for your guide.
Joseph Allen Thanks for your comments Joseph, how's it going? I have done exactly the same thing on my own stick actually. Deadzones are best avoided even at the best of times but not to use them for the function they are created/intended for, to remove any small traces of input that are perhaps being applied when your hand isn't on the stick. Sometimes people think deadzones help with sensitivity which of course they don't, which is why I said what I said for this game and the sensitive ship rotation and quite frankly it's best to recommend no one to use deadzones under "most" circumstnces. They'll figure out the precise reason for when to use them for the reasons we have ourselves.
It's good to hear you are making progress, you make a valid point and perhaps I should have covered this in the guide somewhere.. the very fact one's stick should be set up properly in the first place with no traces of input being applied will most certainly make anyone's progress in learning much more productive. Perhaps they'll read your comment and mine and think about checking their joystick. So thanks to you too and good luck with your own progress, it's certainly a lot of fun isn't it? :)
Look Inverted I am progressing... I just need to master countering and maintaining control under pressure. Repetition will make everything more natural for me, for now it is very procedural and robotic. Do you suggest flying solely in FA Off to learn? Total immersion? 4pips to shields (I will be crashing like Launchpad McQuack) Eventually my goal is to switch seamlessly between both.
Joseph Allen
Piloting with no flight assistance (no key mapped to turning it back on at all) was exactly how I did it myself, I forced myself with crashing many a time in learning the quickest in some respects. Even now I haven't the flight assist toggle mapped anywhere (only mapped it somewhere for these guides), but I am still learning new things even now and so having to "make do" is the quickest way to learn in my opinion, but that said it is highly addictive and I'm having such a great time.
Awesome Video! I am using an xbox controller and cannot figure out how to incorporate yaw into my bindings. So far I've done as you've instructed with the thrusters (left stick+ Rb+LB) / pitch/roll (right stick) but haven't quite figured how to utilize yaw. I'm curious of your bindings, do you have them posted anywhere? Any tips would be most useful. Thanks again!
Elite: Dangerous - Learning Flight Assist Off (Part 2)
#EliteDangerous #Frontier #Learning
#FlightAssistOff
LOOK INVERTED SWEET LORDY-LAWKS SIR!
Flippin' eck, I'm only 2 minutes in and the level of detail and thoroughness to which you you have gone to is brilliant. Lovin' the contents list at the beginning, great stuff. As for your previous video and peoples comments, where on earth are you meant to begin, but at the beginning, sheesh.
Looking forward to the rest of the vid but just thought I'd post to say, good job so far fella! :-)
Spiggs
Hi mate, how's things? Appreciate your kind words, this part 2 did take quite a bit longer than the previous, not only because of its length, the footage itself was captured in a few hours but my god the amount of editing ;), oh yeah and perhaps I should say, no one directly commented about the previous being a tad obvious, it was simply me covering all bases just in case anyone "thought" it was patronising, I expect some perhaps did because it was quite a simple guide that most would have understood for the experienced player, just not the novice, but still thought it best to start at the beginning like you say.
Thanks again Spiggs, chapter links in the 'show more' description for each subject for when/if you wanna come back to a certain lesson. :)
The way I look at is, flight assit on utilizes wing flaps, rudder. Not very realistic in deep space due to lack of resistence. Flight assit off, utilizes various thrusters, realistic in deep space due to same reason, no resistence in space.
Question: I don't usually fly fully FA off because I still need to learn some of the skills (thank you) and my joystick seems hyper sensitive... but I often use thrusters UP and DOWN while flying in FA ON to stick on the tail of a target and that seems to work well. If I am continually holding a down thruster on while in FA ON... will I only be getting down thrust or also forward thrust? When I do this I am essentially tailing them in a turn bu also thrusting down so I am continually pushing myself behind them and keeping my guns pointed at them.
+dregerclock
As long as you've centered or zeroed your main forwards/backwards thrust whilst doing this thrust down then yes, all your ship will be doing is translating downwards no matter how your ship is orientated, for you to then apply a slight forwards or backwards main throttle axis to keep at a specific distance from your target you are vertically strafing (with fa On of course). With fa Off it's a bit different and you have to keep an eye on your throttle display to check if you're travelling slightly forwards or backwards, depending on your orientation, one can never really translate exactly in any vector/direction so the throttle display will at least tell you what is required (though one can gauge a lot of this by the target/hostile you're strafing, but it's good to keep an eye on your throttle display regularly, much like a habit of using a rear-view mirror when driving).
+Look Inverted Thanks... yeah, what i am doing seems to work great against Condas and other ships... Clippers can sometimes turn around on me still... and Fed assault ships seem to be close to be able to shake me ... i think some FA off would help me getting and staying behind them.
Very good guide, thank you. But I still really don't get powersliding. How do you do that?
Petr Zubets Hey Petr, thanks for the compliments. The powersliding is pretty much happening all the time when piloting with no flight assistance, simply because when piloting like this, one has a tendency to turn (orientate) your craft to face your enemy/contact, thus you aren't facing your current ship's vector anymore. So in essence once you've done this "turning" and you apply any thruster lateral/vertical or even forwards/backwards thrust you are basically powersliding.
It happens all the time quite frankly when piloting with no flight assistance, but this exercise in this that's entitled "powersliding" is an exercise to help you practice this technique with the station as a reference to powerslide around. Once you've done this quite a few times you'll exercise the same technique when in combat and will be powersliding everywhere.
Your question as to how do you do it, explaining the exact inputs in text isn't really possible, I suggest you find an orbis type station with a habitable ring and see which thrusters you need to continue *_or_* counter your "slide" around this large circular reference point. Which thrusters will depend on which way you are orientated in relation to this habitable ring. Give it a go and you'll soon see which thrusters are needed to accelerate and speed up your momentum or counter this momentum and slow down.
I just found out a way to turn off that damn mouse cursor continuous turning so now I can play FA with the keyboard like a competent person
+:P
Would that be the Display Hardware Cursor option set to off by any chance? If it is this that you are refering to, you may find it a bit odd when clicking on buttons etc when in the station menu and whatnot, it will appear to be slightly missaligned. Nothing you can't get used to but just thought I'd warn you of the drawback of turning this option off.
Glad to hear you're finding it much improved without the cursor constantly catching your eye, I haven't ever played with keyboard + mouse but I'd expect it would be very irritating.
What I meant was that I turned on cursor auto center which made the arrow to control the turning reset in the middle immediately after let go of the mouse which makes turning a lot easier to do almost like a first person shooter. Now I can use fixed weapons in FA off mode
:P
Ar right, forgive me, yes that makes sense, there's also the relative mouse mode, perhaps this is something to do with it as well. As you've guessed I'm a novice concerning mouse controls and what's available, your help has been most welcome, cheers :)
yay i'm helpful
:P
Indeed you are, no doubting that :)
Hi, quick question. I have unabled yaw on roll, yaw axis is RZ, roll X on my Thrustmaster, but my ship keeps yawing at the moment i try to start the roll movement. Any hints?
Regarding the footage at the begining of this tutorial, how did you capture it without the cockpit in view?
Joseph Allen Flying a Sidewinder, looking up through the canopy glass.
I'm on PC & have been flying with a combination of mostly XBox Controller & keyboard with FA on. Is there a recommended controller / keyboard layout that works well for FA Off?
Hmm, depends on how I'm understanding what you're using. I gather the 'keyboard and mouse users' feel they've the advantage in the natural precision of the mouse itself, not the keyboard which is of course just a load of digital buttons - if I'm understanding you correctly you're using a controller in place of the mouse? Not sure how this works in relation to a twitchy ship's rotation when flying with FA Off (one of the hardest aspects to get used to, and with mouse users they've a 'Sensitivity' option in-game. All HOTAS users, inc gamepad controllers, don't have this option).
@@LOOKINVERTED I definitely don't use mouse - it's too unintuitive for me. Joysticks are what I need. Mouse just seems wrong. Right for FPS games and RPGs, but not for flying.
@@Skiamakhos To be honest I couldn't agree more, tried the mouse and keyboard combo out simply due to curiosity and much preferred my hotas, and I'm pretty sure there are hidden advantages whilst using a proper flightstick considering it's the industrial standard.
Not sure how or why you've ended up with a keyboard in one hand and a gamepad in the other, can tell you now there are better controller combos out for Elite specifically so perhaps try changing your setup. It will undoubtedly feel very weird at first but over time you'll be fine.
Good luck anyway, you wouldn't regret purchasing a hotas either if you're into sims.
@@LOOKINVERTED it's mostly because there just aren't enough buttons on a gamepad to take care of everything. Most things, but not all. I reckon you're right, entry level HOTAS would be the thing.
@@Skiamakhos That too, buttons are prob a good reason for using a keyboard too.
Button assignment is one of the most complex and time-consuming challenges to make the whole experience as intuitive as possible. When I went from my Hotas' hands-on-throttle to a gamepad (for reasons I alluded to in part 1 of this guide) I sacrificed many a convenient button on the throttle for my gamepad instead but it was my only option but thankfully there's plenty on my hotas' stick itself that I found that most assigned with no problem. Any remaining I left to the keyboard placed infront of my monitor & setup as a backup emergency area for those rarely used functions.
Perhaps keep this in mind when you decide on which hotas to purchase and find one with plenty of buttons unless you're fine with using the keyboard too for these less-used functions (which is fine like I say, just not for frequently used ones - you don't want to be taking your hands off the stick and throttle constantly).
This is really hard and frustrating but i start to get the hang of it.. even though i feel it's quite hard to manage the forward/backward speed with a throttle (which doesn't zero in) and my vertical and lateral thrusters with a digital hat sick.
however one of the main questions i have doesn't concern the controls but how you setup your head look. do you have a dedicated stick or use a toggle button or something fancy like a IRTracker?
***** Hey Stefan. Yeah at first it is hard, there's no denying that, was exactly how I felt when I learnt but once it clicked, in a rudamentary manner, I got so addicted with the floating, falling feeling so didn't mind all the practice thereafter. I agree that digital thrusters aren't ideal for fine control, but considering when each counter thruster is applied it is normally needed to be pressed for a sustained period whether you are using digital or analogue controls.
The issue with digital controls usually rears its head when needing these varied amounts of thrust to counter a secondary lessor axis. "Learning Flight Assist Off - Part 3" (next upload in series) actually demonstrates a useful exercise aligning up with a station entrance where the varied thrust that is needed is forwards (and/or backwards thrust, but usually forwards if using what I refered to as the main premise), so this varied forward thrust which on a hotas is your normal analogue throttle control. So... what I'm trying to say is in the end, as long as you always roll until your target tracks upwards or flies over your head (the main premise) this varied thrust can be achieved, and the only real time to use, on a regular basis, your digital POV/HAT is used for vertical thrust which on the whole always needs to be a full digital input anyway. I hope I haven't confused you too much, guide 3/part 2 explains it in more detail.
As far as my head movement, you guessed it, I use TrackIR with a baseball cap infra red reference clip. I love the game with this, I've tried to play the game again once without it and it felt so restricted as if looking through a fixed window. Of course it's yet _more money_ and the TrackIR is very expensive to be honest as much as it _is_ good, but if you're interested in using such a device on a budget check out edtracker.org.uk/ made by a few devoted E:D backers who decided the trackIR was too expensive, I probably would have bought one if I hadn't already bought my TrackIR, but I've heard good things about it and it's a fraction of the cost.
Apologies for the long reply :)
LOOK INVERTED A long post that has a lot of useful information in it never needs an apology ;-)
you explained how to use the digital inputs quite well actually. I doubt i'm ever gonna be able to break down a multi-axial vector to 0 in a reasonable time but i usually get it down to 20... My problem is that i unconciously move the flightstick and/or throttle so i make it harder for myself. But hey, practise makes perfect and i didn't have enought of that ^^
I'm asking about the head look because i think the sideways-movement will become a lot safer when it's easyer to see where you're going. ;) But i just noticed i'm about to get off topic on one more of your videos here. So i'll just go to the fontier forums and ask my other questions about headtracking there. =) Thanks a lot your videos really help =)
*****
Totally agree, you hit the nail on the head. As an example if you notice in this guide on various occasions I look left or right to see the angle of the space dust more clearly, that is generally what I'm doing, I'm not turning my head just for fun. So for sure being able to look where and when you want aids your intended control inputs, not to mention the added benefit of keeping track of a hostile without even needing to use your radar on the whole very much, I barely do use the radar myself only when I've lost track of him, so ideally always trying to keep track of the target visually. The tricky part at first is the confusion of which thrusters you need when looking in a completely different direction to your normal facing straight ahead, but before long this becomes second nature.
I haven't even mentioned the increased immersion and enjoyment one gets out of the game as well, so if you do intend to buy one, what ever variant, you won't regret purchasing one, even if you buy the full bells and whistles TrackIR :) Forum thread does have a wonderment of threads concerning this subject for your research, but don't hesitate to ask me anything further, as long as it's E:D related I don't really care what page it's on, it's all relevant!
Thank you
FA off thrusters seem to respond very slowly in ps4.
What if i use just keyboard and mouse? These manoeuvres are next to impossible, right? (I'm asking becase I can't try it myself for next 40 days as I am away from my gaming computer :D )
Morpheus2403
Not necessarily. I'm not going to say anything other than a proper hotas set up is less than ideal, however that said, with one of the main principles of the control inputs when piloting with no flight assistance _sometimes_ are mainly about how *long* you hold each thruster, not necessarily how *much* of a thruster input, so.. one can still use a keyboard with these digital controls and manouevre the ship with relative success, like I say, as long as you concentrate on your 'duration' of control inputs.
To be fair as well, controlling the ship's orientation/rotation with a mouse, with the extensive power curve adjusters and sensitivity sliders you get with the mouse, some might say this is actually easier to control than using a joystick which has none of these aids. I have covered a chapter for this concerning the technique behind digital control _Chapter 12_ (because some hotas' only have digital pov/hats which is the only control option to use for lateral and vertical thrusters, so thought it best to cover this technique if you only have these digital controls for thrusters) so with keyboard you haven't any more of a disadvantage.
Of course ideally I would recommend everyone to use an analogue control setup, clearly these will give us the fine adjustment that is sometimes needed, but this is not to say with digital controls it is impossible. Like I say, check out chapter 12 in this guide, and apologies for the long reply ;)
Morpheus2403
Just a quick note to perhaps guide you in the right direction concerning keyboard mapping/bindings. From previous discussions about this with a few players I've talked to, about how/where to actually map *all* the thrusters to which keys? One would normally map forwards/backwards thrust to "W" & "S", then "A" & "D" for lateral thrust. But this of course leaves which for vertical thrust? This doesn't really work so many of my keyboard & mouse friends map WASD for vertical and lateral thrust, _(and perhaps "Q" & "E" for ship roll, then you don't have to use the roll on yaw option for your mouse, just have the mouse pitching and yawing with these Q and E for Roll)_ but this is optional. However we haven't mapped your main forward backward throttle axis anywhere yet, so one ideally needs a mouse with a couple of extra buttons on it (usually on the side perhaps) to map your forward/backwards thrust on it. This is the only acceptable method so as to get all your thrusters mapped to keys, and also that are in a configuration that you could perhaps get used to (like I say, most if not all my key/mouse friends have it set like this).
Hope this helps a bit. I suggest all this because when mapping forwards/backwards & lateral thrust to emulate a first person shooter (WASD) which is the natural reaction, vertical thrust obviously wants to be on the same keys (W,S) or you simply have to leave vertical to somewhere else, but where. So ideally you need a mouse with a couple of extra buttons on it to have your main throttle axis somewhere where it will feel intuitive to use, and like I say, WASD for your translation thrusters. Hope I haven't battered your head in too much ;)
Wow, you should officially open a flight school
Imagine trying to dock with FA off in a type 9 XD
:P Haha, I've done it in a Type-7 (quite easy actually, did it in my most recent "a 'little' thanks to subscribers" post) but for sure a Type-9 monster is no doubt a completely different level of cumbersome :)
Are there any techniques you would recommend for a mouse&keyboard player?
+vedasisme
The good thing with the mouse specifically is you get sensitivity and power curve adjusters, something the joystick user doesn't get (so if you can manage ship flight with keyboard&mouse you'll have a noticeable advantage in ship rotation/orientation), but these exercises in this part 2 guide concerning digital thruster controls of course relate to the keyboard user as well as the hotas with a digital hat for thrusters.
Your main issue is finding enough keys for ALL thrusters that feels intuitive to use. WASD used for your vertical/lateral but where do you then put your forward/backward thrust? R & F perhaps or I have heard of someone using a couple of buttons on their mouse. Once you find a good layout you like with all thrusters to hand and have got used to it, you'll do well with flight assist off with k&m.
You should check out this guy: ua-cam.com/users/skafsgaardhjorthfeatured
He's a couple of vids helping out the aspriring fa off pilot (not to mention many other vids) from the perspective of keyboard + mouse and fa off, he's an excellent pilot - you should check out his channel, perhaps this will help as well.
Thank you for the tips, I've already been applying some FA-off tactics to great effect in the training battles. I'll have to experiment with the power curve adjusters, that sounds like it will be just the thing I need, and I'll check out the link immediately. Thank you again!
One more thing -- is there some way to increase the visibility of the space dust?
vedasisme
Only one - by increasing the Gamma setting in Graphics options. This does work but obviously the rest of the graphics are messed up too, I've heard of a few cmdrs doing this initially just while they're learning, then gradually reduce it bit by bit back to normal.
Which training scenario has station similar to Peterson Dock?
Igor Vlasiuk
Forgive me Igor, I'm not entirely sure what you are trying to find out.
Are you asking me if I know where there is another station similar to Peterson Dock like the one I used? Or in which instance will these training scenarios translate and be useful for when you haven't a station as reference perhaps? Sorry I'm not sure what you are asking me, please clarify and rephrase.
LOOK INVERTED I want to learn flight assist-off techniques. And actually want to practice with Peterson Dock station (or similar doesn't matter. 2-3 axes exercises). But can't find such station on training scenarios. So I need to find such station directly in game (its not useful for trainings because you need undock). So maybe some training scenario already has similar station for fast entering to training?
Igor Vlasiuk
Ah right sorry, my bad, E:D's own training scenarios. I'm pretty sure the only station type that appears in these is the Coriolis type, which is presumably why you are asking, so yeah you'll simply have to find one of these Orbis types in the game universe itself.
Keep in mind there is still private play if you don't want to appear rather odd flying up and down a station's axis in open play. I can understand your rebuy costs would soon disappear if you keep having to rebuy your ship, but if you stick to the tips I suggest in this guide, making sure you're at least a certain distance from the station and keeping any remaining 'pips' to shields to bolster them, you'll be ok, it would be very doubtful if you crashed and burned completely in one go.
I did at first try to create exercises using just these training scenarios for the very reason probably why you are asking, like you say so you can just jump in and start training when you feel like it, not having to keep finding a station in the real game to practice on, but nothing much was really very useful. Sorry it is what it is, not sure what your finances are like but one could buy just a boggo standard Sidewinder (what are they 30k?) at each Orbis station you find and keep it there so you know where to go each time and practice more or less when you want at little financial risk. Apologies for the long reply, I don't know when to stop typing sometimes!
LOOK INVERTED Thank you for reply. And thanks for great tutorials.
Igor Vlasiuk
You're welcome, and good luck!
what is your joystick?
Fatih Soykan Hi Fatih, my control setup is rather unorthodox (explained in more detail on my discussion page), but basically I use a x55 Rhino joystick and an xbox pad in my left hand for thrusters. x55 hand on throttle only has a digital hat so find the gamepad's analogue joystick and analogue trigger much better as a control setup (leaving only thrust down on Lb as the only digital input). As I'm sure you are aware, analogue controls are far superior. What do you use yourself or have you not dived in yet and bought one?
Look Inverted i'm using logitech 3d extreme pro and keyboard (: and yes i'm newbie but you have amazing rotation controls in assist off. Really impressive.
Fatih Soykan
Appreciate your kind words :) Interesting set up you have there, I'm presuming you use the keyboard for thrusters yes, although I have a question.... How do you have the translation thrusters set up, WASD for vertical & lateral with your main throttle axis somewhere else? I've always wondered how keyboard users set this up because you are an axis down, either mapping W & S for vertical as I say, or having your main forward/backwards throttle on W & S similar to a fps, but then where do you map the vertical? Hope I haven't battered your head in too much but I'm very interested to hear how you've mapped all three axes :)
Look Inverted First of all congrats for your videos and thank you. Extremely well done and with useful content for noobs like me :D. I've limited myself to switch from FA ON and OFF in combat but after watching I'll try all time FA OFF. Btw I tried that mix of logitech 3d xtreme pro and keyboard (WASD as a FPS and adding Q&E for vertical thrusters) it kinda works but I didn't like it, however I never thought of using a gamepad like you do! I will start using my ps3 gamepad and see how it goes. Cheers
*****
Thanks Wolfgang, appreciate your compliments. As far as the gamepad for thrusters I doubt I'll ever go back to a hands on throttle, let's keep in mind these have been designed for atmospheric flight, not space flight. As things stand there isn't such a controller for a 6dof space sim but for sure the gamepad I'm using works well enough for me considering it uses analogue inputs for all but one thruster (down which is rarely used quite honestly with the roll until the target is above you technique). Glad to be of help, let me know how you get on :)