While rehearsals I'm using a bass cab of course. For my tone, I take a Darkglass X Ultra. On recordings, I only use a DI signal and the Neural DSP Parallax plugin.
I usually cut DI tracks of the bass and the amp itself and use IR's later on the amp track. I never tried to use an IR of a guitar cab or blend one in, but it seems like I should give it a try.
I hear you are working on a guitar course. That's all fine and good. What the world really needs though is "Kristian Kohles German for metal producers course". "Learn to use expressions like "dängeldängel", "brutzelbrutzel" and "das muss drücken im Gesicht, sonst taugt das nichts" correctly and comprehensively"
Warren! What does your bass setup typically look like? I was DI-only for a long time but in the last 6 months - since I've moved into my small-commercial-sized space - using a bass amp has been GREAT. I answered the "what's your bass tracking rig" under Kristian's post above. It can get...complicated!
@@edryba4867 Thankfully my apartment is ultra soundproof and sound treated since it doubles as my studio so no more cranky neighbors for me, I can have even a sunn amp in full blast through a 4x12.
MAN! THAT’S LOUD! I remember problems like that. It’s why my wife and I begged, borrowed and stole to get enough cash to put a down payment on an actual house - with a concrete-filled, steel-reinforced cinder-block wall that goes almost all the way around the property. You have to get up to RIDICULOUS LEVELS (I’m talking ear- bleed territory) for the bass to bug the neighbors with a setup like that if you’ve done it correctly. It’s kinda like living in a blockhouse at the Kennedy Space Center at Cape Canaveral!
Speakers are waaaaay different. Bass speaker cones are a lot stiffer and the suspension is much stronger. Their xmax (i.e. max excursion) is way higher too. The horn is usually a compression driver, as I understand it. As far as bass reflex ports... Some are some aren't.
A cool experiment that all engineers should do at least once is play white noise through their rig at low volume, then put on some headphones, hold the mic, and move it around the speaker to hear what the speaker is actually doing. Its a big eye opener. Or ear opener!
Here's a question nobody seems to be able to answer: Why are there so few 12'' speakers for bass??? Seems like the industry standard is only focused on 10'' and 15'' speakers.
Hey brotha. I think that might just be in your head because I actually had a harder time trying to think of companies that don’t offer 12’s in some way lol. The ones that do for example: Warwick Aguilar Mesa Boogie SWR Gallien Krueger Ampeg Ashdown Genzler(Genz Benz) Markbass Barefaced EA Epifani TC Electronic Trace Elliot Bag-End Darkglass Electronics Peavey Hartke
Gallien Krueger has had 2x12 bass cabs for at least 10 years lol I’ve been playing their 2x12 or 4x10 neos throughout my career. Fifteen is a little too much bass for my situation in g#-a#
bass speakers feel "stiff". which makes for a really punchy low end that has fortitude. guitar speakers feel "soft", which makes them SO much better for distortion. my usual setup for a distorted bass is a low passed DI out of a clean-ish bass amp, mixed with an overdriven mid and high track through a bass cab and a guitar cab. low end on a dial. high end on a dial. 2 different flavors of overdrive on a dial. personally i like an SVT 8x10 and an orange 4x12.
Please Kristian "IR Master" Kohle! I would love to get those IRs but one already with the three mics blended. Would be that possible? Danke! Grüße aus Dresden!
But would you run guitar through the bass cab? I am thinking about an ampeg 2x10 for my tiny terror and run bass and guitar through it, with a DI as well. Or an Ampeg 1x12 and use tiny terror for both, with DI.
@Kohlekeller Studio In the comment section of one of your more recent videos someone asked whether they can use bass guitar on a guitar speaker. Mr. Ignazio (well respected expert from Jensen Speakers, that video with him was absolutely awesome!) replied approx as follows: please DON'T do that !, unless you are playing really quiet. Guitar speakers are designed for mid-range and suspension is paper (extension of the cone) and quite stiff. Bass speakers are designed very differently, suspension is made of rubber or fabric to handle much larger cone excursion, low frequencies need. You will damage or wear out the paper of the guitar speaker quickly. I understand the point of shaping the sound via guitar speaker, but perhaps you should add such disclaimer to the video before advising using guitar speaker (and perhaps consider using some more expandable guitar cabinet before prematurely destroying your precious y2002 mesa V30s;-)) Cheers.
@@KohleAudioKult Hi, thanks for response and sharing that experience and speakers still going strong :). For sure the bass sounds like from the 70s band (it's logical in the early days, there wasn't much difference between bass/guitar amps and bass wasn't hifi-like today). I think we are not in disagreement, but the devil, as usual, is in detail, called loudness/volume and what does it mean "do not overpower". I still think it should be important part of discussion if using a guitar speaker (if we care about it's long life). Logically (to me at least) the frequency doesn't matter (bass or guitar), but for the same perceived loudness of bass, one have to put more power to it (signal with higher amplitude to move more air) than the guitar mids and that means that the cone has to go further forward and back than when usual guitar volume. Thus premature wear (and tear). In very low volume (bass), much less then normal guitar, where the cone doesn't travel more far than what it would travel with guitar, I don't see a problem too. But if we want to hear some punch from the bass (I guess we want ;-) it's easy to get excited and overpower the speaker (human ears are sensitive to mids, much less to lows), the cone may travel level of magnitude further (centimeters vs of mms) than what it was designed for at the same perceived loudness. I'd also speculate, that if you use it mostly for distorted sound, I feel like the distortion/overdrive/tubescreemers take some lower freq away + compression, so it may actually be safer vs the clean/full bass sound at the same volume. In a distant past, my brother stupidly killed a guitar speaker by miking his drum, it wasn't even very loud, but I think it was a coil saying buy bye, don't remember, but the bass can punch and kick the same as well, especially if you slap, while guitar signal is much less dynamic (compressed by distortion etc). So yeah, I would not worry too much, if quiet, more quiet the better (which is less fun, but may be ok for recording).
I'm Actually very thankful as a aficionado home studio that you take time in actually giving tips in a mix with the bass, wich has helped me alot in my mixes.
I was jamming through my 5150 and 4/12 cab with my bass but I don’t crank it up mad loud like I would with my guitars. Do you think it’s okay to play at quiet volumes ?
I was jamming through my 5150 and 4/12 cab with my bass but I don’t crank it up mad loud like I would with my guitars. Do you think it’s okay to play at quiet volumes ?
I'm quite surprised the SM7b was so light on the lows. I always thought it was a dark sounding mic, now it know it's more of a a mid sounding mic. I wonder if the RE30 from Electrovoice might make a better dynamic mic for bass instruments?
Question... I have a 1x15 Bass Combo that has a 8 ohm ext. Cab option. I play my guitar and bass through this combo. If I were to hook up an extension 2x12 (with guitar speakers) cab for when I play guitar - all should be fine. BUT If I play bass in this configuration... will the bass eventually kill the 2x12 if I play at jam volumes for a period of time... or will the bass combo 1x15 take most of the load and the 2x12 guitar speakers will just be "extra" definition and not be pushed to death?
I was hoping you would put a bass speaker in a guitar cab and a guitar speaker in a bass cab and show how it sounds, but I guess not :( The only other issue I had is the 2 cabs you chose; you got the metal recording standard, a mesa 4x12, but for the bass cab you got a value oriented 4x10, with who knows what speakers are inside there. I understand the video is based around the principle, but I was hoping to see the guitar 4x12 compared with a Mesa Powerhouse 4x12 bass cab, even a 2x12 bass cab would've worked.
What if you have a ported guitar cab and use it with a bass guitar? My Port City Os Wave cab puts out some extended bass. Have you ever tried comparing one to a 4x12?
Keyboard cabs often have similar extended range (for hopefully obvious reasons). For bass, I use a Carvin KB1015 cab (I own but don't use the amp for bass). It has 1x15 and 2x10 with separate inputs, so I can use my GED-2112 and route the deep (mostly clean) channel into the 1x15 and the distorted tone into the 10s. I can then mic the 1x15 with a ribbon and one of the 10s with a dynamic. This is great for mixing since I can compress the two differently (more comp on the low end for consistency and less on the top for some dynamics). I can also automate bass fills on just the distorted channel.
i thought guitar cabs were more bassy if they are closed back as opposed to open?? so how is it that bass speakers are more bassy when having open holes???
A vented cab needs a lot of math to work. An open speaker will simply let the bass escape and move around the cab to cancel out with the direct signal. Very good question.
The best bass tone I got in a rehearsal was when I used a Warwick 410 and a random (I think it was a cheapo Laney) 412 guitar cab. The lows were clear and solid I put the guitar cab on ear-level to make sure I would get the cutting mids. The drummer was surprised on how good the bass sounded (yeah , the drummer , imagine that) and the poor guitar player kept feedling with knobs in order to make his tone dominate the mix as in previous rehearsals. The extra guitar cab mysteriously vanished the next day XD Anyway, waiting for those bass videos and soul sold in 3 , 2 , 1 ....
I'm quite a fan of using Bass Professor II, particularly when there are resonant frequencies. My favourite bass cab is actually the George Lynch Genz Benz 2x12. The 4 bass ports work wonders.
True but I hardly see any videos compare the two in the same video with a distorted guitar metal tone. Anyway it's just a suggestion, but this video is great and very helping thank you!
Best bass tone i ve ever had with a cab is thru my ampeg 410 he with the tweeter off and a 115e on thr bottom. The 410 have all the tone and punch due to the sealed cab and "small" speaker, so the speaker have a small group delay, and on top of that can add some very subtle low sub that the vented 15 don t produce at all. But the 15 add that roundness on the low that the 410 lack.
Hey Fab, I realize I'm 1yr. late, but did you bypass/eliminate x-over from the overall circuit in the 4x10? I did same as you with a GK Neo4x10, but lots of upper-mids were simply GONE, until I rewired the 10s full range. Cone grit/dist. kicks horn grit's wimp-ass all f'kin day! It's full-tilt FTW!
I would love to have those IRs. I was actually thinking if I should try to make myself three. Unfortunately I don't have the best mics for that I'm afraid.
I use both in my stereo rig. I use a power cab + for high end and an old bass crate for my low end and high ( believe it or not)and clean tones. I have eq's on both paths ( personally I think they are indispensable)The guitar amp just does distortion and effects better, and that incredible mid tone i just can't get on a bass speaker. Together they cover my overall sound so well. so well I couldnt imagine playing with only one amp anymore. ☆ I play my bass and guitar threw same amps. Thanks for the tips on the mics. I have been having trouble finding a mic I like for bass
Hi Kristian, great video, do you filter your D.I.( below 80 hz) when you reamp the bass into the guitar speaker? Have a weiss and greetings from Italy.....
I personally dislike any "What's better and when" because the answer is - do whatever the hell you want. It's music, no rules at all. Do what you want. Take a guitar cab, and a bass cab and mic them both. Take a fucked up trash speaker, mic that. Mix them all together fuck it.
Bass cab IRs??....from Kristian "Dark Lord of Dangle" Kohle???....yes, PLEASE!! Already sold my soul to you, sir...I've proof of purchase if needed.😋 Thanks for another great, informative vid!!
I love metal. But never pay attention that much to bass in metal bcs the bass line is just like straight picking or copying guitar rhythm. I like Bass in jazz, or funk. Groovier, tastier bass line and you can't hear it easily. Since i love metal and started to go to mixing, I'm having trouble mixing bass for metal, the tone and distortion bass for me it sounded like ass lmao. For me since i love jazz bass tone which has a lot of low end. I tried it on metal track and it doesn't work well. But this video shows that metal bass should have more mids and highs gotta try that. Thank you so much
I'm SURE you had a video (or series) on your channel explaining different kinds of amps... Orange, Diezels, Rectifiers, etc, with great sound. But I cannot find the video! Where did it go? EDIT: Found it! It was on Produce Like a Pro.
I had a Crate 4x12 bass cab that I used for guitar. I tried all kinds of speakers in it, I LOVED it with K100s. I used it with a Windsor head boosted up front with a Seymour Duncan Twin Tube Classic, set totally clean but with the output volume pegged, which pushes the front end of the amp like 4 times as much as any 9 volt box. I'd set everything on the amp at about halfway and flip the pedal on and get tight high gain that still sounded kinda vintagey, and that bass 4x12 with the K100s in it kicked serious ass. I think it was just sealed and not ported. The inside was very well insulated, and it was definitely heavier than a guitar cab. It was also smaller in height and width than the Mesa oversize (guitar) cab my bass player had. It was actually good. If I found another 4x12 or 2x12 bass cab, unloaded or otherwise, for cheap, I'd grab it up. It's something about how they make the baffle and how they insulate the inside that makes it unique for guitar tone. Seriously, try putting Vintage 30s in a non-ported bass cab and A/B it with the same Vintage 30s in whatever cab they were in before. It's a cool sound.
Very informative. I kind of do this inside my Helix. I do the split and grit method. Split crossover around 300hz. Low end being fucking squashed then mixing back into the amp and cab. The high end runs through the b7k model before heading to the head and cab. Thinking about keeping the signals separate now though. I'll definitely try it with the highs going through a guitar cab and the lows through my ampeg 8x10 IR.
Great informative video Kristian \m/-_-\m/ I have two questions if you could help me. 1) What if I match a bass head 500 W 4 ohms with a bass cabinet 500W 8 ohms? 2) What bass cab would you suggest for death metal ( B standard tuning) 2x10 or 1x15? Just for practice in a small studio with my band. Thanks in advanced! \m/
I have a Randall xl with v30's, you should try one. I also have a Kustom cab with celestion 65's, a avatar that I'm loading with the DV-77 speakers, and then you're nemisis, a Marshall 1960b loaded with the 12gt75, Lol, and then multiple mics. 🤘😈🤘
I don't know the answer but I do know that my Orange GRO50 played through my Acoustic 2-15 bass cabinet sounds pretty FN good. It covers a bar gig with no mic.
I had a random question i cabt seem to get an answer from anyone on my Facebook or forums . I'm trying to build a small "rig of doom" to play some bluesy doomy metal (sorta Sabbath ) anyway one of the cabs I'm considering is a orange 2x10 bass cab , my question is should I switch the 10's from bass speakers to guitar speakers ? It being a bass cab and tuned differently is it going to make me sound muddy? Ive been tunning in drop D or C# (if that matters) Also found a small (really cool) vintage Gibson 2x10 extension and was thinking possibly some 10 inch canibus rex speakers. .....or should I just bite the bullet and just buy a 2x12
Well, it's hard to tell remotely. What you need to know that bass speakers sound a lot more harsh (have more highs) than your typical guitar speaker. So I would go for guitar speakers. But again: You have to try, I don't know your taste
What are you guys using for your bass tones? Guitar or Bass cabinets?
While rehearsals I'm using a bass cab of course. For my tone, I take a Darkglass X Ultra. On recordings, I only use a DI signal and the Neural DSP Parallax plugin.
I really like the Aurosa DSP Mammoth and the Neural DSP Darkglass! I used to blend the D.I with a guitar amp.
I use the neural DSP darkglass plugin. I'm a guitar player, so my bass tone knowledge is pretty limited. This video was cool!
I usually cut DI tracks of the bass and the amp itself and use IR's later on the amp track. I never tried to use an IR of a guitar cab or blend one in, but it seems like I should give it a try.
I use an Ampeg 8x10, 2 Peavey and a Ranger 2x15 with different speakers.. The 15s have some *great* mids.
I hear you are working on a guitar course. That's all fine and good. What the world really needs though is "Kristian Kohles German for metal producers course".
"Learn to use expressions like "dängeldängel", "brutzelbrutzel" and "das muss drücken im Gesicht, sonst taugt das nichts" correctly and comprehensively"
Haha!
Great video Kristian! You Rock my friend!
Warren! What does your bass setup typically look like?
I was DI-only for a long time but in the last 6 months - since I've moved into my small-commercial-sized space - using a bass amp has been GREAT. I answered the "what's your bass tracking rig" under Kristian's post above. It can get...complicated!
@@DontWorryImAPilot You seem like a great guy too.
Guitar cab: Eviction notice
Bass cab: Neighbors throw bricks through the window
🤣
ONLY IF YOU’RE DOING IT RIGHT!!!
@@edryba4867 Thankfully my apartment is ultra soundproof and sound treated since it doubles as my studio so no more cranky neighbors for me, I can have even a sunn amp in full blast through a 4x12.
MAN! THAT’S LOUD! I remember problems like that. It’s why my wife and I begged, borrowed and stole to get enough cash to put a down payment on an actual house - with a concrete-filled, steel-reinforced cinder-block wall that goes almost all the way around the property. You have to get up to RIDICULOUS LEVELS (I’m talking ear- bleed territory) for the bass to bug the neighbors with a setup like that if you’ve done it correctly. It’s kinda like living in a blockhouse at the Kennedy Space Center at Cape Canaveral!
Dude, please do the IR's! I really need some good bass IR's in my life.
I thought it was not special enough or maybe too close to the Bugera tone. don't you think?
Don't wanna annoy people with too many products.
@@KohleAudioKult It's not annoying at all, your products are all fantastic
Tweeters in bass cabs: "if you do too much, it sounds like Korn" lmao
Or maybe more like: "If you do too much, it smells like fried tweeters"?
Speakers are waaaaay different. Bass speaker cones are a lot stiffer and the suspension is much stronger. Their xmax (i.e. max excursion) is way higher too. The horn is usually a compression driver, as I understand it. As far as bass reflex ports... Some are some aren't.
A cool experiment that all engineers should do at least once is play white noise through their rig at low volume, then put on some headphones, hold the mic, and move it around the speaker to hear what the speaker is actually doing. Its a big eye opener. Or ear opener!
I'm just gonna say that I'll be waiting for those IRs
What are your thoughts on running a high gain guitar head through a bass cab for a metal guitar tone, something like an Ampeg SVT-410HE cab?
Here's a question nobody seems to be able to answer: Why are there so few 12'' speakers for bass??? Seems like the industry standard is only focused on 10'' and 15'' speakers.
Hey brotha. I think that might just be in your head because I actually had a harder time trying to think of companies that don’t offer 12’s in some way lol. The ones that do for example:
Warwick
Aguilar
Mesa Boogie
SWR
Gallien Krueger
Ampeg
Ashdown
Genzler(Genz Benz)
Markbass
Barefaced
EA
Epifani
TC Electronic
Trace Elliot
Bag-End
Darkglass Electronics
Peavey
Hartke
@@DougieD_Funk yeah 1x12 are common but i never saw 2x12 or 4x12 for bass
@@olorb2618 The only 2x12 bass cabs I know of are the MarkBass New Yorks
Gallien Krueger has had 2x12 bass cabs for at least 10 years lol I’ve been playing their 2x12 or 4x10 neos throughout my career. Fifteen is a little too much bass for my situation in g#-a#
@@olorb2618 Old Trace Elliot had a 4x12 bass cab, v-type series.
Already sold my soul, but I can sell you my grandma, she's a sweetie. She's definitely worth at least a couple bass IRs.
My favorite comment so far! Thumbs up to you and your granny!
@@KohleAudioKult
P
bass speakers feel "stiff". which makes for a really punchy low end that has fortitude. guitar speakers feel "soft", which makes them SO much better for distortion.
my usual setup for a distorted bass is a low passed DI out of a clean-ish bass amp, mixed with an overdriven mid and high track through a bass cab and a guitar cab. low end on a dial. high end on a dial. 2 different flavors of overdrive on a dial. personally i like an SVT 8x10 and an orange 4x12.
Because the guitar speaker is being used at the limit of its excursion.
I would have liked to heard the two cabs blended
Please Kristian "IR Master" Kohle! I would love to get those IRs but one already with the three mics blended. Would be that possible? Danke! Grüße aus Dresden!
Aber das macht ja nur halb so viel Spaß!
But yeah, I could also add a blended version. It's just very dependend on your amps settings
2:53 No offense, but your bass is WAY to buzzy. You need to get it set up properly.
But would you run guitar through the bass cab? I am thinking about an ampeg 2x10 for my tiny terror and run bass and guitar through it, with a DI as well. Or an Ampeg 1x12 and use tiny terror for both, with DI.
man I am interested in these ir’s for sure. Really love your vid I’ve sold my soul to the devil.
Love these videos! Thanks
That VT pedal is great. I have one. It works pretty well on its own, even without an amp sometimes. Oh yah, more IR's are always welcome!
@Kohlekeller Studio In the comment section of one of your more recent videos someone asked whether they can use bass guitar on a guitar speaker. Mr. Ignazio (well respected expert from Jensen Speakers, that video with him was absolutely awesome!) replied approx as follows: please DON'T do that !, unless you are playing really quiet. Guitar speakers are designed for mid-range and suspension is paper (extension of the cone) and quite stiff. Bass speakers are designed very differently, suspension is made of rubber or fabric to handle much larger cone excursion, low frequencies need. You will damage or wear out the paper of the guitar speaker quickly.
I understand the point of shaping the sound via guitar speaker, but perhaps you should add such disclaimer to the video before advising using guitar speaker (and perhaps consider using some more expandable guitar cabinet before prematurely destroying your precious y2002 mesa V30s;-)) Cheers.
Hey!
I'm using guitar seakers for bass all the time. No problems at all.
Just make sure the amp doesn't overpower the speaker(s).
@@KohleAudioKult
Hi, thanks for response and sharing that experience and speakers still going strong :). For sure the bass sounds like from the 70s band (it's logical in the early days, there wasn't much difference between bass/guitar amps and bass wasn't hifi-like today). I think we are not in disagreement, but the devil, as usual, is in detail, called loudness/volume and what does it mean "do not overpower". I still think it should be important part of discussion if using a guitar speaker (if we care about it's long life). Logically (to me at least) the frequency doesn't matter (bass or guitar), but for the same perceived loudness of bass, one have to put more power to it (signal with higher amplitude to move more air) than the guitar mids and that means that the cone has to go further forward and back than when usual guitar volume. Thus premature wear (and tear). In very low volume (bass), much less then normal guitar, where the cone doesn't travel more far than what it would travel with guitar, I don't see a problem too. But if we want to hear some punch from the bass (I guess we want ;-) it's easy to get excited and overpower the speaker (human ears are sensitive to mids, much less to lows), the cone may travel level of magnitude further (centimeters vs of mms) than what it was designed for at the same perceived loudness.
I'd also speculate, that if you use it mostly for distorted sound, I feel like the distortion/overdrive/tubescreemers take some lower freq away + compression, so it may actually be safer vs the clean/full bass sound at the same volume.
In a distant past, my brother stupidly killed a guitar speaker by miking his drum, it wasn't even very loud, but I think it was a coil saying buy bye, don't remember, but the bass can punch and kick the same as well, especially if you slap, while guitar signal is much less dynamic (compressed by distortion etc).
So yeah, I would not worry too much, if quiet, more quiet the better (which is less fun, but may be ok for recording).
Please do the IR pack. I'm tracking bass for a dream pop group with a friend, and hardcore solo stuff. I could use a huge variety of IRs
Thanks!) Very usefull :)
Yesssss! I needed some dängle in my life
I'm Actually very thankful as a aficionado home studio that you take time in actually giving tips in a mix with the bass, wich has helped me alot in my mixes.
I was jamming through my 5150 and 4/12 cab with my bass but I don’t crank it up mad loud like I would with my guitars. Do you think it’s okay to play at quiet volumes ?
I was jamming through my 5150 and 4/12 cab with my bass but I don’t crank it up mad loud like I would with my guitars. Do you think it’s okay to play at quiet volumes ?
I'm quite surprised the SM7b was so light on the lows. I always thought it was a dark sounding mic, now it know it's more of a a mid sounding mic.
I wonder if the RE30 from Electrovoice might make a better dynamic mic for bass instruments?
Question... I have a 1x15 Bass Combo that has a 8 ohm ext. Cab option. I play my guitar and bass through this combo. If I were to hook up an extension 2x12 (with guitar speakers) cab for when I play guitar - all should be fine.
BUT If I play bass in this configuration... will the bass eventually kill the 2x12 if I play at jam volumes for a period of time... or will the bass combo 1x15 take most of the load and the 2x12 guitar speakers will just be "extra" definition and not be pushed to death?
By far the best channel for learning about recording metal!
But I kinda like when Glenn Fricker yells at me on the SpectreDigital channel (SMG Studios).
You really know your stuff! And I do NOT mean to criticize, but it’s NOT TC Electronics. It’s “TC Electronic”. SINGULAR.
Yo give us your dope ass IR's
I was hoping you would put a bass speaker in a guitar cab and a guitar speaker in a bass cab and show how it sounds, but I guess not :(
The only other issue I had is the 2 cabs you chose; you got the metal recording standard, a mesa 4x12, but for the bass cab you got a value oriented 4x10, with who knows what speakers are inside there. I understand the video is based around the principle, but I was hoping to see the guitar 4x12 compared with a Mesa Powerhouse 4x12 bass cab, even a 2x12 bass cab would've worked.
My favourite 'guitar' cab is this old Traynor 2x15 Bass cab I've had for years. Too bad it's so fucking heavy.
If I vent my Marshall cab 1960A, would I get more low end in my distorted electric guitar sound?
What we learned:
For bass tones use a bass cab.
That helps!
BTW K5 is an interesting bass guitar. Just kill all the mids on both bass and amp, do not touch the rest. BAM! You have KoRn sound
What if you have a ported guitar cab and use it with a bass guitar? My Port City Os Wave cab puts out some extended bass. Have you ever tried comparing one to a 4x12?
If only you’d play with your fingers on five string bass and adjust the height of your 2nd string then difference could be more interesting.,)
of course we are interested in bass IRs. It's never enough)
Keyboard cabs often have similar extended range (for hopefully obvious reasons). For bass, I use a Carvin KB1015 cab (I own but don't use the amp for bass). It has 1x15 and 2x10 with separate inputs, so I can use my GED-2112 and route the deep (mostly clean) channel into the 1x15 and the distorted tone into the 10s. I can then mic the 1x15 with a ribbon and one of the 10s with a dynamic. This is great for mixing since I can compress the two differently (more comp on the low end for consistency and less on the top for some dynamics). I can also automate bass fills on just the distorted channel.
That sounds like a smart setup!
Most people call it "porting" not "vented". Ported speaker design is a thing. Vented bathroom without windows is a thing.
i thought guitar cabs were more bassy if they are closed back as opposed to open??
so how is it that bass speakers are more bassy when having open holes???
A vented cab needs a lot of math to work.
An open speaker will simply let the bass escape and move around the cab to cancel out with the direct signal.
Very good question.
@@KohleAudioKult
okay awesome thanks for the reply!
Cool that you used the Hiwatt for some nice Bass Tones! Love to get my Handy on these IRs, as well! :-) Great Video!
Now i wonder about how would it sound with a guitar plugged in that TC electronics cab through that Hiwatt 200...
I absolutely love your videos, not only do they help me to learn new things, they also always lift my mood
The best bass tone I got in a rehearsal was when I used a Warwick 410 and a random (I think it was a cheapo Laney) 412 guitar cab. The lows were clear and solid I put the guitar cab on ear-level to make sure I would get the cutting mids. The drummer was surprised on how good the bass sounded (yeah , the drummer , imagine that) and the poor guitar player kept feedling with knobs in order to make his tone dominate the mix as in previous rehearsals. The extra guitar cab mysteriously vanished the next day XD
Anyway, waiting for those bass videos and soul sold in 3 , 2 , 1 ....
Haha! Great story.
FEEDLING????? Was the guit player making people EAT the knobs or what?
I'm quite a fan of using Bass Professor II, particularly when there are resonant frequencies. My favourite bass cab is actually the George Lynch Genz Benz 2x12. The 4 bass ports work wonders.
Great video, I'm really looking forward to those IRs. =)
Of corse, wveybody wants sam ir. Danke
I have a fender rumble with a tweeter and mics of the same ilk, I might go looking for the Klank!
Why reamping ? Why don't use both with 2 amps and Y switch ?
How about a part 2 using an electric guitar on both cabs?
I might try that. But usually guitars sound too harsh through bass cabs.
True but I hardly see any videos compare the two in the same video with a distorted guitar metal tone. Anyway it's just a suggestion, but this video is great and very helping thank you!
Did those IRs ever get posted? Guess its been a while so I don't remember
Lol nothing fancy it’s $1000 microphone
One of the most informative yet. I'd love those IRs, if they turn out.
Thank you, as always, for all you do!
As I don't have place nor money for cabs or amps I'll swallow any of ur IRs like a pelican
11:30 sounds great. Can't believe this dude plays bass so well too.
You can also use microphone on bass reflex hole of cab. Same like on kick drum. To gather low end punch.
Best bass tone i ve ever had with a cab is thru my ampeg 410 he with the tweeter off and a 115e on thr bottom. The 410 have all the tone and punch due to the sealed cab and "small" speaker, so the speaker have a small group delay, and on top of that can add some very subtle low sub that the vented 15 don t produce at all. But the 15 add that roundness on the low that the 410 lack.
Hey Fab, I realize I'm 1yr. late, but did you bypass/eliminate x-over from the overall circuit in the 4x10? I did same as you with a GK Neo4x10, but lots of upper-mids were simply GONE, until I rewired the 10s full range. Cone grit/dist. kicks horn grit's wimp-ass all f'kin day! It's full-tilt FTW!
Bass through a guitar cab sounds good (usually). But guitar through a bass sounds like ass.
I would love to have those IRs. I was actually thinking if I should try to make myself three. Unfortunately I don't have the best mics for that I'm afraid.
What brand and model of Speakers the tc Electronic has?
I use both in my stereo rig. I use a power cab + for high end and an old bass crate for my low end and high ( believe it or not)and clean tones. I have eq's on both paths ( personally I think they are indispensable)The guitar amp just does distortion and effects better, and that incredible mid tone i just can't get on a bass speaker. Together they cover my overall sound so well. so well I couldnt imagine playing with only one amp anymore. ☆ I play my bass and guitar threw same amps.
Thanks for the tips on the mics. I have been having trouble finding a mic I like for bass
Sounds like an amazing rig! Thanks!
Hi Kristian, great video, do you filter your D.I.( below 80 hz) when you reamp the bass into the guitar speaker? Have a weiss and greetings from Italy.....
I sometimes even filter way higher. that makes the distortion tighter. But not in this video
Selling my soul to the devil seems like a great idea and free IRs on top? That's a no brainer!
Fret buzz makes me nuts
lol you poor :D
Yes please give us these IR's!
You left out using an actual Bass head. Thats a night and day difference
I personally dislike any "What's better and when" because the answer is - do whatever the hell you want. It's music, no rules at all. Do what you want. Take a guitar cab, and a bass cab and mic them both. Take a fucked up trash speaker, mic that. Mix them all together fuck it.
I have pretty much the same attitude. I’m trying to inspire people to find their own, unique tones.
Sorry if that didn’t come across.
Those IRs would be great!
Has anyone tried Jensen P15N for bass?
Bass cab IRs??....from Kristian "Dark Lord of Dangle" Kohle???....yes, PLEASE!! Already sold my soul to you, sir...I've proof of purchase if needed.😋 Thanks for another great, informative vid!!
I love metal. But never pay attention that much to bass in metal bcs the bass line is just like straight picking or copying guitar rhythm. I like Bass in jazz, or funk. Groovier, tastier bass line and you can't hear it easily.
Since i love metal and started to go to mixing, I'm having trouble mixing bass for metal, the tone and distortion bass for me it sounded like ass lmao. For me since i love jazz bass tone which has a lot of low end.
I tried it on metal track and it doesn't work well.
But this video shows that metal bass should have more mids and highs gotta try that. Thank you so much
Oh yeah, it's all about the "dängle" in the mids. you may wanna watch my other bass videos. That will help you!
I'm SURE you had a video (or series) on your channel explaining different kinds of amps... Orange, Diezels, Rectifiers, etc, with great sound. But I cannot find the video! Where did it go? EDIT: Found it! It was on Produce Like a Pro.
Toooo much treble!!! Dont hear much "low end"
I'm going to combine the Orange super crush 100w with my 4x12 bass cab I'm wondering now.
The video and the info is amazing, Thanks.
Is guitar amp head is safe to use a bass cabinets speakers?
I am definitely interested in some bass IRs!!! I liked the tones beginning @15:29 the best.
Hello. Isn't there a risk of damaging guitar speaker?
Very nice video, thank you.
You just should not overload a speaker with a too powerful amp. That's all you have to keep in mind.
I had a Crate 4x12 bass cab that I used for guitar. I tried all kinds of speakers in it, I LOVED it with K100s. I used it with a Windsor head boosted up front with a Seymour Duncan Twin Tube Classic, set totally clean but with the output volume pegged, which pushes the front end of the amp like 4 times as much as any 9 volt box. I'd set everything on the amp at about halfway and flip the pedal on and get tight high gain that still sounded kinda vintagey, and that bass 4x12 with the K100s in it kicked serious ass. I think it was just sealed and not ported. The inside was very well insulated, and it was definitely heavier than a guitar cab. It was also smaller in height and width than the Mesa oversize (guitar) cab my bass player had. It was actually good. If I found another 4x12 or 2x12 bass cab, unloaded or otherwise, for cheap, I'd grab it up. It's something about how they make the baffle and how they insulate the inside that makes it unique for guitar tone. Seriously, try putting Vintage 30s in a non-ported bass cab and A/B it with the same Vintage 30s in whatever cab they were in before. It's a cool sound.
They should be more common they sound heaps better
"EQ is everything" -Eddie Kramer
came to learn about bass recording. stayed for bass faces!
Do you wear your cellphone under your beanie? :)
Hey just wondering do you think mixing a guitar and bass cab for rehearsals would be a killer tone too?
Sure! Why not? Start experimenting!
11:00 Isn't the SansAmp BDDI also some sort of a SVT in a box tho?
Yes, but the VT has more bassgrowl and more character if you ask me.
Hi, are you traing a orange amp with a bass cab?
Very informative. I kind of do this inside my Helix. I do the split and grit method. Split crossover around 300hz. Low end being fucking squashed then mixing back into the amp and cab. The high end runs through the b7k model before heading to the head and cab. Thinking about keeping the signals separate now though. I'll definitely try it with the highs going through a guitar cab and the lows through my ampeg 8x10 IR.
Chris O’Dowd Love your videos lol
I can watch these type of comparison videos all day. Just experimenting with heads and cabs. It’s fun.
Thanks! There will be a lot more for sure!
bass cabinets are better for guitar IF you downtune around C standard or B standard with fuzz - your local stoner doom guy
You don't really want the harsh top end of a bass speaker. Even if you tune down (like I do)
Another great video, Kohle!
Great informative video Kristian \m/-_-\m/
I have two questions if you could help me.
1) What if I match a bass head 500 W 4 ohms with a bass cabinet 500W 8 ohms?
2) What bass cab would you suggest for death metal ( B standard tuning) 2x10 or 1x15? Just for practice in a small studio with my band.
Thanks in advanced! \m/
Hi, are t¿you trainging a orange guitar amp with a bass cab?...;), great chanel
Thanks! I got some cool Orange bass content coming soon!
I have a Randall xl with v30's, you should try one. I also have a Kustom cab with celestion 65's, a avatar that I'm loading with the DV-77 speakers, and then you're nemisis, a Marshall 1960b loaded with the 12gt75, Lol, and then multiple mics.
🤘😈🤘
Sounds like a fun setup!
I heard they are finally shipping the DV77! Awesome!
@@KohleAudioKult I've been patiently waiting..
This is a pretty awesome vídeo.
I don't know the answer but I do know that my Orange GRO50 played through my Acoustic 2-15 bass cabinet sounds pretty FN good. It covers a bar gig with no mic.
I had a random question i cabt seem to get an answer from anyone on my Facebook or forums .
I'm trying to build a small "rig of doom" to play some bluesy doomy metal (sorta Sabbath ) anyway one of the cabs I'm considering is a orange 2x10 bass cab , my question is should I switch the 10's from bass speakers to guitar speakers ?
It being a bass cab and tuned differently is it going to make me sound muddy?
Ive been tunning in drop D or C# (if that matters)
Also found a small (really cool) vintage Gibson 2x10 extension and was thinking possibly some 10 inch canibus rex speakers.
.....or should I just bite the bullet and just buy a 2x12
Well, it's hard to tell remotely.
What you need to know that bass speakers sound a lot more harsh (have more highs) than your typical guitar speaker. So I would go for guitar speakers.
But again: You have to try, I don't know your taste
Think sleep , kyuss. Red fang ect .
Same-same, but different.