I feel bad for lying to my players considering it is not in my nature to lie. But, if I based my rolls off the actual numbers I get. Players would steamroll through the campaign or have a brutal difficulty because they are more "role play" focused. They focus on characters rather than any sort of combat. I do not like punishing them for role-playing more than their battle prowess. It keeps everything interesting and characters are not dispensable or expendable. It also allows my challenges being less about stats and creates mechanics that are unique and they have to play around rather than being stronger.
I enjoy that type of DM. You feel the real risk and weight behind your decisions, you can see the open rolls yourself. The other end of this is one that lies and saves all your characters, which is less rewarding and feels like you’re playing a cheap character. A healthy mix of the two is the best!
Tbh I wish one of my DMs would fudge the rolls more. I feel like we missed a few good story moments because they were so strict about it. Mostly a balance is needed. Let some mean things happen to your party, but if the result won't be FUN then fudge it. I also have a good feel for my party and they never suspect a fudged die roll because the result was just fun.
Jared also already mentioned this but, aside from making sure that your players don't notice you fudging the situation during the game, never tell them you did so AFTER the game. It can be hard to resist the urge sometimes. Everyone is talking about the game and how they narrowly avoided a gruesome death. You know, that if you went all out with the monster they were fighting, they would have died. But they don't. So, if you tell them later on "Yeah, that dragon could have totally destroyed you, but I just didn't use his breath attack to make sure you guys pull a victory", it will destroy their memory of the situation and ruin the story.
I had a party struggling with the high ac of a creature in some crazy looking armor. They were constantly missing. When suddenly a player swings his mace comes down with a critical hit, nat 20. To add to the spice of the awesome blow and help them along, the mace blew off a junk of armor. I gave the players the option to aim for the weak spot at disadvantage but way easier AC. It was a nice way to give them more options when they didn't have much for versatile spells and they were relatively new players so using the environment wasn't coming to mind either unless I pointed it out to them i.e; You're spell flies by the enemy but hits the ceiling knocking down one of the many stalactites, and it smashes the evil dude's campfire. You can always paint an amazing looking picture, no matter what colors and brushes are given to you.
So you preperred an encounter that didn't work for your new players and tried to work around it? They maybe could be overwhelmed and had to retreat to figure out a way to win, or suffer some loses while trying to figure it out then and there which is fun (some pointers could help but not giving away the solution) - or the encounter could be made apropriate and with options to solve it before the game not during play. Also you bend how spells works or was it a spell that could knock down the stalactite?
I prefer "I am the God of this universe and I have determined that the Rule of Cool shall prevail against the pre-existing laws of physics and probability".
"You want the party to win. That's the mark of a good dungeon master." Thank you. I've been saying for years now that a good DM is one who is on the players' side without them ever realizing it.
@@sunorcio3901 a DM that sides too much with the players can make the game boring while a DM that actively tries to kill the players characters makes the game frustrating for the players. Which is why i said a great DM is one who is BOTH with AND against the players.
@@DotHackerBlackWing that's why I say a good DM is on the players' side without them ever knowing it. So that they continue along and have fun without ever having a clue that things are being fudged in their favor
I was DM'ing Curse of Strahd and my party members stumbled into Lady Wachter's secret basement where she was having a meeting with the cabal of cultists she leads. The encounter started out pretty rough for the party because the cultists have some nasty spells, but they slowly whittled down the cultists until things were turning around. Then one of the cultists tried to flee for the exit. None of the players were in range to get an attack of opportunity or even run up and attack him before he would get away. The Fighter's turn comes up and she says "I throw my sword at him!" Very cool ideal. She rolls. Hits. The players around the table cheer. I tell her to roll damage and she does. She's like two HP away from killing him. That's no fun and would dampen the mood and sort of ruin this cool idea. So I just decided that she killed him and it made for an epic moment. When I said that the weapon hit, sticking into his back and making him collapse forward on the stairs the whole table went up in cheers. That's why you fudge the numbers sometimes.
@@dndbasement2370 It's almost like DMing is very flexible and there isn't one right or wrong way huh? Come on man, stop acting as if you're the only one that knows how to DM.
I read the Dungeons Masters guide for D&D 5th Edition and it pretty much says the same thing, except that it's up to the DM's discretion if they even want to make secret rolls or have a system in place that heavily relies a random factor.
You can also mix it up. I do my dm rolls behind a screen, but some of them I make them public to increase the tension and surprise factor. Its a bit tough to do without having the party ask for it later on when you dont want to tho, but if you do it right and just when its good for the game, it can be a good tool/combination.
A friend of mine always joked around saying that if he was ever DM, he'd start the story like this: "Our adventure begins and you are all dead. No saving throw. You die. Game over."
@@joseknavarro "...you all wake up in a dark place, deep underground, resplendent with veins of gemstone and precious minerals glittering in the walls, the distant sound of a running river beyond the stone. An incredibly imposing man in cascading cloth with dark hair steps into the light cast by wall sconces, lit with otherworldly pale flames of bluish-green, and he speaks matter-of-factly and calmly, but with a powerful, resonant tone: "I am Hades. Welcome to Tartarus.""
Rerolling the "potion of waterbreathing deep under a mountain" actually improves immersion: the party isn't exploring in generic circumstances, so it makes sense not to keep strictly to the generic loot table.
Of course it could still be there as future proofing as you can prepare stories ahead of time. Generic player #1: I found an potion of water breathing. Generic player #2: What are we gonna do with that in the mountains? Generic player #1: No idea but it’s mine! 2 sessions later, you find yourself in an under ground cave with only a single way out a long water tunnel. Generic player #2: You still have that water breathing potion from the mountain? Generic player #1: No I kinda forgot I had it and left it somewhere back at the inn. Generic player #2: Damn it!
Which is why you also don't HAVE to use random loot tables. You can just choose for there to be a potion of giant's strength or whatever. You can also make an adventure for the players out of them wanting to sell off things they have no use for or encourage creative use of said items.
@@orbusg8451 maybe the previous adventurer found something else in that chest but to make space in their pack they had to leave behind a potion of water breathing
Officially in my games, all the enemies i throw at my players have their hit dice rolled individually, so while the same type of enemy will have similar hp, it'll be different for each one. Unofficially, i don't do that at all. Each monster has the same hp, and if i feel like this individual should die a little sooner or a little later to help the pacing of the encounter, then i'll make it so. I've had too many a game slow down to a crawl when it was really fun before cause the enemy has so much ac and hp that the players are stuck fighting it for way too long. In some instances I think they could tell, but making sure things flow smoothly is more important i feel.
An alternative to keeping track of individual amounts of HP is to instead have a simple wound-like system for enemies. PC hits an enemy, that's a wound, regardless of how much damage it actually dealt. No more wounds = dead enemy. Very useful for grunts and mob-like enemies to surround another, actually statted, elite enemy.
My friends and I, during our high school and college years, used to role-play a ton but we didn't play DnD. One of us had worked out his own world, races, spells and everything. We didn't use dice. He just told the story; and he was very good. We just decided what we wanted to do. If the decision made was smart, clever or maybe something he had not considered he would often let it happen. What made this guy so good is he was very quick at coming up with really awesome crap off the top of his head. Also helped he had a winamp lib full of epic songs he would play and swap to for the right occasions. So the more clever you were the more likely you would get your way. Looking back on it now I know we were never playing a game though. We were just helping him tell stories to himself. But it was still pretty fun and neat to be a part of.
My DM for 40k dark heresy basically has got his very own houserule. If you come up with a solution to a problem that is so grand, epic, awesome or just cleverly implimented, he will let it pass, no rolls required. This rewards good roleplay and actually engages players to think smart, and not just rely on a good roll.
With the example Jared gives at 5:05 - 6:10 (the one where the partys' climatic plan goes off flawlessly, but the boss survives with 2hp, only to die to the warlocks' dagger), I can think of an alternate way to play that out. Leave the boss alive, but paint the scene so that it's clear to the party that the boss is on their last legs, though descriptive language: "[Boss] goes to stand once more to face you, but as they do so their legs give out, and they fall back to their knees. Blood flows freely from the great wound on their chest, and you hear the distinct clatter of steel on stone as [Boss]' weapon falls to the floor as they use both hands to try and stem the bleeding, to little avail. Their gaze falls upon you, though it now expresses their defiance of you more than their hatred for you; a desperate yet fleeting attempt to cling to life." Afterwards, you can fit in a villains' monologue, a last-ditch desperate attempt to kill the players, have the boss kill themselves (if they're the type to prefer dying to their own hand than be killed by the party), or have the boss be killed by one of the other villains (in the classic "you have failed me" vein)
Right. Massive damage cripples the monster, he's pretty much dead on his feet. Party gets a chance to interact with it before someone just finishes it.
Coup de grace is an actual mechanic in D&D, and warlock walking up and slitting the throat of a "near death" monster seems to be just fine. Or you know, do something like Mortal Kombat's fatality.
Normal Players: I have to take my DM's word on this since their dice rolls are covered. Players on Roll20 with public DM dice rolls: I have the receipts.
A group of friends and I really wanted to steal this magical ring from a merchant that allowed one to slow down from any fall (being the rogue you can imagine the possibilities for shenanigans). We set up this elaborate plan to rob him broad daylight and after my friends succeeded like 6 dice rolls and I had cracked the safe (our wizard made me invisible), all that was left was for me to dive out of his stall without getting caught. Rolled my die, got out of there with the ring. It wasn't until the end of the session that the dm admitted that he allowed it to work even though I hadn't rolled quite high enough. He had liked the plan so much that he didn't want it all to fail at the end for a roll that was 1 point too low. We had suspected as much but goddamn did he make our night.
@@AtelierGod That's when you make it partially fail. So close yet so far, but maybe another skill might keep the merchants attention on you since he doesn't see a person and could assume the wind blew something over? It would have made the wizards prepared gust of wind useful, or the bards bluff or diplomacy. Fudging rolls makes stupid and weak players, make them think and problem solve, you know the main selling point of the game? If they can't, they die.
DragonEye there’s also a difference between different play styles some prefer a harder more difficult play through where everything has to be micro managed or else they die but this I would say is for experienced players not newbies whose just gotten their foot in the water, for such people I would say that a more lose adaptation of the rules which is in fact in the DM’s choice to make and you should remember that it’s for fun, I’d imagine if the difference would’ve been 2 or 3 or more the dm more than likely would’ve done just like you said it should go.
@@dragoneye6229 The difference was literally 1. That and we'd had a streak of 2-3 particularly hard sessions with a lot of costly fails. The whole heist happened at the end of the session and we were kinda down on our luck, it was starting to sap our morale a bit (our rolls had been genuinely, shockingly bad for the past month or so). That moment was a morale booster. Plus, the DM actually did do what you described: I managed to vault the table but knocked it slightly and made it shake. The vendor noticed the open chest and called out that he had been stolen but we'd already planned my escape route and my alibi. Just not to let things end too easily, the invisibility effect wore off when I was still in the middle of the crowded street so I startled people and had to bluff my way out of it (with a somewhat plausible excuse and successful rolls obviously).
I played under one who was like that. Changed the rules on the fly to deliberately put you at a disadvantage. Whole time I played, my entire role was nothing more than the punching bag. Unless you kissed up to him, he made your time a living hell.
Step One: Politely take them aside, explain why their behaviour is disruptive and ask them to stop. Step Two: If step one fails, do not invite them back.
@@DoctorLazers spot on. Most peoe would give them subtle hints in the game, or do things to thier character in game to get them to leave. It doesn't work. We all have to be the better persone and just talk to them and see what is going on.
@@DoctorLazers No. That is stupid. You don't negotiate with terrorists because you are giving them the attention they crave, unruly player = child throwing a fit. You ignore that shit, don't feed their ego. Instead bend his ego to your will and make him submit by being a good GM and tricking him into making things better and worse in every situation. Crafty GM's don't need group think and they don't need an echo chamber.
@@dragoneye6229 Haha, what? No, just be a fucking adult. Ask them to stop. If they don't, ask them to leave. No tricks, no ruses, no manipulation. All you're gonna do is sabotage your own game with that childish nonsense. I've been DMing for 15 years. Honestly, how is being straightforward and just exercising your authority as the DM, "Negotiation," or "Feeding their ego?"
My DM had a magic lamp with a water elemental stuck inside it. My rouge opened it up started to panic and scream her head off, dashing to nearby unalerted enemies and threw the lamp at them and immediately hid. The cultists were completely wiped. Later on he told me the event was supposed to immediately place us into combat, but thought a dragonborn running around with a water spewing lamp to be so funny and memorable he allowed the elemental to just take that...little longer coming out. Instead of being basic combat it became a funny story, built up my character and I felt good that my quick thinking was rewarded.....literally I was given inspiration XD
If you want to fudge AC, a good way is to cause their armor to go down in universe. For example, a heavily armored knight may have his straps cut by the next attack causing his chestplate to come loose, lowering his AC by 4.
When my players steamroll a boss, I always have a „Hah this isn’t even my final form” moment prepared. I don’t use it that often, but one of the most epic bosses I created was literally a segmented boss where its every limb was basically an independent modified creature, and as they killed it, injured, and with many resources exhausted, I had its brain burrow out of its skull, heavily injured but scary. It’s biggest threat was a (a bit fudged) spell that took control of some equally injured and spent npc allies of the party. It was fucking epic having parts of the monster out of reach from melee until its leg has been cut down. And using its gargantuan size. And then at the very end have them fight against npcs they know and love, fortunately the old druidess noticed that the brain was still alive and they took it down without accidentally killing heir friends, but bypassing them to reach the slowly slithering away lump of grey matter was a fun challenge.
I've used this before when the party is gathering information in a pre-gen adventure, and they need to learn key pieces of Plot in order to progress .. Keeps the flow of the story moving at the very least
So there shouldn't be a test if they truly need it or there are other options after a fail. It can be elapsing of time, some consequences or just instead of learning it there could be other ways.
That when you bust out the old “you’re in the underworld, make or way out” cliche. Give them the good warning of “you leave now but if you ever come here again there will be no escape.”
"The hippogriff flies away with you!" Ah yes, then it's a good time for me to use my high charisma and diplomacy skills to cower and beg for my life like the frightened little creature I am!
@@adambriton5394 Probably not too bad. As long as I could keep on my quests, at that point I've got a hippogriff to protecting me! Doesn't help that my main character I play as is a kobold though, with, I'm pretty sure, negatives to grapple, last I checked ^^;
I remember this one time when the DM told us that we found a mimic, we fought it, and I said "Phew, hopefully that was the only mimic in this damn dungeon!", my DM said : "The dungeon laughed."
I know many ttpRPG players get an alergic reaction to this option, but please consider playing with strangers online. DCA compeled me to try this option and now I've been playing for a while on a EU rpg discord with many players and groups in it and it's been great. Wouldn't have a chance irl. I survive without facecam but there are also groups with those. Maybe it's not an irl game, but there are still many feels and great moments.
Krzysztof Kozł I would love to join that discord if possible I’ve got no maybe 1 person around that’ll want to play the game and it’s a bit hard to play with only 2 people and the size of most discords I’ve seen is much more of a deterrent than the fact of playing online.
I'd love to play but I'm an undercover nerd (bald head, pretty mean looking) in a crappy area in Birmingham full of chavs. I have never played but am desperate to do so.
This is the most active D&December ever and I'm super happy I'd love to hear more whacky or crazy or just plain stupid stories. I can't imagine you've run out of them yet, and I would love to hear more! I rarely get to play, and such memorable moments are far between for me, so being able to take part of yours would be amazing. Also, even though I've said this before, I can't stress enough how happy I am you're back. And that you seem happy. Thank you, and I look forward to the next video! :)
Talk about dealing with parties that have a hard time getting hooked into adventures by being too careful or stubborn. That’s always fun, and very important to keep engagement.
fudging dice is an art that takes a lot of experience and a good understanding of dramatic tension to pull off well consistently. the goal of fudging dice should always, in my opinion, be to push the narrative in the most interesting and engaging direction. this can go both ways, either in the players' favor or against them, so long as the end result is a more engaging story.
There was one time where my party absolutely steamrolled a boss by barricading the door he was coming from and using our ready actions to hit him with everything we had from range. After we fired off our attacks he and the one melee fighter rolled badly on initiative so before either of them could do anything, we filled the boss with so many arrows and firebolts that he fell and our fighter didn't get wack him. Before I made the finishing blow I sent my DM a message that she can give the boss more HP so he can do his thing but she refused. She learned a valuable lesson that day, and the next boss fight in the campaign got enough HP to be the threat he needed to be
The most important thing about rolling die as a DM is using your own judgement to feel out what is more fun. Make sure to ask your party what they enjoyed most in the games and use that info to influence your fudges.
It would have been so cool if by the end of the video he was like "everyone does it" and then tilts the camera down and he only has dice with colors on them and no numbers or something. I thought that was why the table was obscured.
I never liked fudging roles. I get why, but i think following the roll forces the dm to be creative. Say the griffon missed. With a three the griffon falls, knocks down a tree or two etc. causing alot of dust to rise and from the dust the player stares at the massive silhouette of the Griffon. Why did the Griffon fail? Was it hurt allready maybe? If so what is big enough to hurt a griffon? Now we have a mystery. Don't fudge the roll, give it meaning. But that's just me. Sometimes even the dm ain't above fate.
Nope. The DM is above "fate". The only time "fate" is "above" the DM is if they let it be. The DM is the one who makes the rules, defines the rules and may change, adhere or ignore them however they wish as long as it makes for a fun campaign.
@@EvilMegaCookie a fun campaign that doesn't relies on lying is a challenge for the dm. I'm just talking for myself but why roll at all if it doesn't matter. Just have a soundboard that makes a rolling dice sound.
Everything I know about D&D is that it is a game and you use dice but these videos make me feel like a D&D super expert even if I never played the game in my life.
Another way of "fudging dice rolls" without really doing so is by having a backup plan just in case the party begin curbstomping the enemy or if they themselves begin being curbstomped. If they begin defeating the enemy without much trouble just have their parent, ally, or lover appear to freak the party out. Or if the party has no chance of success have a NPC appear to either help the party escape or give them time to heal up, and either have them sacrifice themselves or have the party owe them a favor in the future (future quest hint-hint). Just don't have your NPC win the battle. Leave that to your players, unless of course you want to go down the route of your players now being in debt. Your choice, but it's a fun way of not having to fudge dice rolls as much, and this is also a way of escalating the battle and story, which is something Matt Mercer and Chris Perkins often do.
God, I'm so glad Jared is back. It has nothing to do with this video, but every time I watch him I'm reminded of just how much I missed this kind of content.
Hey, you can add a small lake or something into the middle of the mountain, and then hid some weird stuff in it if they want to go looking. Edit: What I'm saying is as long as you can keep it consistent with the other things around you can fudge the story too.
My current DM had us dealing with a group of demons that had a nasty habit of possessing the city folk of Sharn. When we thought we knew what was going on, our Druid tried a Moonbeam spell, thinking the person we had with us wasn't possessed, but instead was under a Disguise Self spell. Since he had no screen, he mentioned out loud to us that "So I have to roll disadvantage if I am using something like that" and rolled two d20s. Our group meta games, and assumed that we had the right target. Turns out that our DM did it to mess with us, and we killed an innocent soul as the demon then laughed, and left, since we did its job for it. He played us hard, and we talked about it for hours after the session. Best DM I've had in years.
I fudge dice a lot for my player's sake. I try my best to take it easy on my players. I play for the sake of a cinematic and fun experience. My players still recall the time I stood up with one of them and said "Show me how you want to fight, and all you have to do is succeed your throw, and you'll do it." He succeeded and did an awesome comeback glory kill
If you like a touch of metagaming, you can do one or two die rolls during a dungeon whenever a player does something, but then not say anything about it (or something really vague, like "you hear a faint breeze in the distance"). Makes the place a bit more tense for them. Obviously something that should be kept to an absolute minimum, as regular rolls out of nowhere starts to break the immersion, but I've had a DM do it to spectacular effect during a incursion into a crypt.
Anybody have tips for me to help engage my players in the role-play mindset? I'm trying to get it to be more than roll the dice hour, but I just can't seem to get it to stick.
In VTM they have a game mechanic called "succeed but at a cost" which I think is an accurate way to drive the story without simple "pass or fail" rolls. If the party doesn't figure out the door puzzle, they still have to get through the door so the game can continue, but then there will be a cost. Maybe one of them is now going to lose a magic item or "something" happens as a cost. The take away from all this is, you are spot on! No one wants to be part of a game where it's just fail succeed rolls. No fun for DM or player. Odds are NOT favorable anyone will have a good time all the way around. Love DnDecember. Rock on!
My local community just goes with "If you die you die, your fault" kind of mentality. Makes each game quite competitive on who that will survive and what not. Even forces GM to play with open screen during combat to make no fudging happening. Slowly growing out of that as it turns out no one has a connection to their character as they just expect it to die..
I’m so glad to hear you talking about D&D again. I always enjoy listening to you’re stories and hearing you’re reasoning behind doing things in a particular way.
i might argue that the best DMs can make a fun story without ever fudging the numbers. dont think about the world as exclusively one outcome per dice roll number, but think of different scenarios for the relative success of a dice roll. as an example, in a scenario that rolls 1d20, you have a scenario planned for a 1, 20, 2-8, 9-15, 16-19 (no modifiers). looking back at the flashy finisher that doesnt kill scenario, take the liberty to say that the destructive attack has weakened the structural integrity of the fight arena, and the ceiling comes crumbling down on the foe, finishing them off by burying them in a pile of rubble. it also can lead to an escape sequence and change the direction of the story. my stance is: dont fudge the numbers, change the environment. the most convincing worlds can accommodate such fluctuations.
@@CoralCopperHead only if talking about the broad strokes. I was arguing the finesse of it. narratively, there is a difference between a monster who should have survived with 1 hp but the players do extra damage out of nowhere, and the same monster actually surviving the hit, but not getting a turn. The ceiling crumbling is only one example. Maybe the monster cant find its footing, maybe the floor gives out, maybe an underling backstabs the monster, or maybe the monster starts begging for its life. The point is that you can get far more scenarios by letting the dice rule all than you can if you give the players or monsters points they didnt roll. It all depends on the DM's ability to improvise, though. It might be ideal to find a creative way to validate the "fudged numbers" than just hiding the numbers that were fudged, but that doesnt mean everyone is capable of it, or that the less creative would overuse a single explanation.
"A DM only rolls the die because of the noise it makes" Gary Gygax. Even during NPC interaction when a player rolls persuasion to see if that tavern bard has any useful info on the new guild master, its good to let the players feel like that information was earned rather than given.
As someone who's never played d and d, I'm loving this from you man! I used to ignore your d and d vids but I was desperate for a new vid of yours and when these cane out I didn't think twice, now I really want to play 😂🤣
DnD, even with zero fudging, is far easier than a CRPG. The reason is obvious. In a CRPG, your chances of success simply need to be higher than 0. You can die, learn from your mistake, try again and win next time using your foreknowledge. In DnD, that doesn't happen. You die and well, the game is over. Even the hardest of challenges in DnD have a reasonably high chance of success.
These videos are criminally under viewed. Keep up the great work I'm really enjoying D&December it's almost nostalgic since you helped get me into D&D!
Unless you count tossing away rolls for treasure results that don't make sense in the scenario, I have never had to fudge die rolls. And, actually, the examples you gave closer to the beginning do not need an alteration either. It all comes down to proper narration. For the example of the awesome epic attack that doesn't quite kill the thing, you don't have to fudge the roll to make it die after all. Just play up how staggered it is after taking that huge attack, it's really not doing well, maybe it's trying to limp away or make some final attack of desperation. For the griffin, it swoops and misses, but this alerts the party and it's coming around for another dive and the party has to prepare. There's always another way without fudging the die rolls. Personally, I like to leave things in the encounter area that can easily turn the tide of the battle in one direction or another depending on whether or not my party is clever enough to notice them. Basically, it rewards the players for being observant or thinking to check the area, or punishes them for playing D&D like a Dragon Quest game. I like to encourage the kind of gameplaying that is just not possible in a computer generated environment and is only possible in table top. Usually though, my players DO notice these things and it winds up making what would have been tough encounters way too easy. They definitely do seem to have fun with it though since they feel clever for working out the way to make the encounter easier on their own.
A good DM will fudge the rolls to keep the party from a string of bad luck, breaking up misses and low damage with an occasional helping hand. A great DM will balance out both sides, sometimes screwing the player, sometimes saving them, anything to keep the game challenging, but fair.
Excuse me, I've never fudged my rolls... it's why I once had to let my party's foxkin completely annihilate our vampress....and a good chunk of the continent....with a giant god turtle....while completely black-out drunk (Don't even get me started on the amount of utter nonsense that led to this even being possible; this foxkin was like a balista bat on steroids XP )
I always give at least slightly dynamic descriptions rather than announcing dice results. Instead of saying, '16, he hits you for. .8 damage' I will say 'You clash blades and he slips your guard delivering a savage slice for 8 damage' this way my players think I'm coming up with a description of what happened and it covers up when I'm _deciding_ what happened and ignoring the dice rolls. "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!"
I once had a DM who hated the very concept of fudging and was really honest about results, making boring fights, uneventful adventures and cheap deaths. But even worse: as a player, he keeps bickering and demanding honesty from other DMs. Even if it goes against character development or even character knowledge, he demands honest results and optimized builds and rolls. It's very annoying, but he sees this as a good thing, he feels better about himself as a DM that way, so it's kinda hard to argue with him. I don't play with him for a long time, so I don't know if he's still the same way.
@Manek Iridius I quit in a very subtle way and he's still bitter about it. But recently 2 of our mutual friends were "dead in the eye" to him. They left and he was very stubborn with his ideals. His only saving grace are his good stories and writing, but it's firstly a game to have fun as a group, which he failed us.
That's genius... I've just started DMing a while ago, and Roll20 sort of robs us from this feature of "fudging roll"s. It's a shame, since everyone can see that roll.. I care a lot about my players fun and ensure if they're having a good time, so I shall treasure this advice!
You guys are right, there's a DM roll feature. I guess due to how long I've been there it must've escaped my mind. Doesn't help my players are *very* inquisitive on die rolls haha
MapTool lets you hide rolls so only the GM can see it with a command. Look up the commands for Roll20 I bet there is one in there. Otherwise make your players smarter and stronger people by forcing them to solve the new problem they created by failing. I didn't know the command myself and I use MapTool so instead failure is not a "It doesn't happen moving on" it's more "It doesn't happen, what do you do to now?" letting them know they have skills, feats, spells, and abilities they might leverage to salvage the situation, which brings problem solving back to D&D.
My friends and I don't play D&D, we use GURPS - but it applies all the same, this is very true. Mostly, when I'm the GM, I use all my hidden rolls more as a... "guideline" - I'm always gonna have the goal of making the game fun and challenging, so I won't let everything be dictated by dice... buuut using those dice as a guideline of sorts is a good thing, introducing that bit of realistic randomness to keep things a bit unpredictable. Beautiful video, Jared. Very fun to listen to.
I believe the most important thing is making sure the players are having fun. Win or lose, regardless. Some players revel in the occasional comical failures or tasks turned into hardship by failed rolls. Sometimes a check can fail by 1-2 points. I love to employ "Success with a cost" for rolls that come close to succeeding. Especially for checks that required multiple rolls. I DO NOT believe you should ever handhold or coddle your players. Just keep the fun going. The best way is just to gauge player involvement as the session is going. If the players are laughing or cracking jokes during moments, or are tense and on the edge of their seats (in a good way), then everyone wins. At the end of the day D&D (and other tabletop RPGs) are about getting together with your friends and having fun telling a collective story.
It's definitely something I miss when it comes to DMing through Fantasy Grounds with all my rolls and results shown. Sometimes a player is just having a bad time of things and the fun is clearly running dry for them, it's about time to do some fudging like "Oh you dodged out of the way of the massive longsword!" or "You manage to trip the guy!" which is harder with a system that shows all the math in the chat box.
It's kind of an unwritten rule that DM's will lie, lol. It's like in a video game that has A.I . that adjusts difficulty according to the player. Imo, 'fair challenge' is a good way to DM. You shouldn't make it too easy...you shouldn't make it too hard. Mix it up a bit and do it just right and be unpredictable. Don't be afraid to kill your players. When you die in a video game, you learn from your mistakes. Allow your players to make mistakes and *pay* for them.
I've been playing tabletop for decades now and I can tell when GMs are doing this. I much prefer that they don't. The only time I think fudging dice is acceptable is when it pushes the game along after it get bogged down on a cumbersome scene. IE if the GM needs you to find a secret door or get some information out of a plot-crucial NPC, a player rolls 1 under what they needed to proceed, you might just wave them through.
Can confirm, have lied to my players. Sometimes the party has spent the whole session on a losing streak and you just need to throw them a bone to avoid mutiny. And sometimes the mod you bought off Dmsguild is completely unbalanced for the party you have and you need to use your secret dice rolls to offset the imbalance. Also, every few minutes a good DM will make a roll that means absolutely nothing. It keeps the players on the edge of their seats and makes you look like more of an all-powerful puppetmaster without the need to fuck with them constantly
I feel bad for lying to my players considering it is not in my nature to lie. But, if I based my rolls off the actual numbers I get. Players would steamroll through the campaign or have a brutal difficulty because they are more "role play" focused. They focus on characters rather than any sort of combat. I do not like punishing them for role-playing more than their battle prowess. It keeps everything interesting and characters are not dispensable or expendable. It also allows my challenges being less about stats and creates mechanics that are unique and they have to play around rather than being stronger.
Grind? There is no grinding in DnD. Players gain XP when you say they do. If they're randomly hunting down enemies to fight for the sole purpose of gaining XP, they should gain nothing. XP rewards story progress and positive behaviour. This is not the kind of behaviour you want to reinforce because it is not roleplay oriented and does not advance the story.
I have been a DM for over 8 Years now (with the same Group). And yes, some of the greatest moments in our campaign have only been possible because I subtlely changed the hitpoints of an enemy or the result of a die. In the end it's all about the fun and the story and if things like that improve the experience, it's all fair game.
Fun video! Somewhat related to this topic: For new DM's that are running premade adventures/modules, you can ABSOLUTELY "fudge" the dungeons in those. I have found that my party doesn't respond well to dungeons that run on for too long. At some point, they get tired of opening doors, checking rooms and fighting. They want something fresh, after about 2 hours of dungeon. I often just flip the rooms around or just straight up change the architecture of the dungeon, to match that. If I notice everyone is getting to that point of being done with this dungeon, I just move to the "Boss Room" to be the next room (of course, it has to make some sense in the world as well). One of the most important things about DM'ing, is reading the table. If you can manage to get a good grasp on your players, and are able to read their reactions during the game and what those reactions truly mean for them, you'll be able to be a great DM!
Kindof off topic, but I remember seeing a video, & I think it was Noah's counter monkey series, where he said 'Give as few solid details as possible. Don't use names, use descriptions, because it keeps players guessing & it keeps them paying attention.'
I fudge the dice rolls at least 2 times per sessions. And I can confirm it makes the game more fun. The other I would suggest is to occasionally roll your dice outside the screen. Maybe 1 or 2 times per session. Only do it though if your party is in a position to survive the worst senerio. This can help you party to trust your rolls. Even if you are lying to them a lot
There's a good amount of theatrics that goes into the mechanics side of Dungeon Mastering. I once DM'd a session with the party exploring a cave system. One of the caverns was empty, but the module suggested I roll a d20 every time the party passed through. The sole purpose of this room was to psych out the players by suggesting something there was about to attack or trap them.
I never fudge a die roll.
...however, I do apply modifiers. Very generously.
If before the roll and it's kinda constant and fair - then it's not bending the rules.
I mean that's basically the same thing in the end.
@@TheKazragore Yes. Yes it is. That's the joke.
aw yes, the + 16 to attack roll for being a realy cool vampire named jeff, my favourite modifier.
That explains how my barbarian character once ate his way out of a gelatineous cube, surviving with 1 hp left..
Mmm mmm mmmm, good eatin'!
Yeeaaaah, I'm sure that's not good for the digestive system
seems legit
That's how black oozes are created...
Honestly, thats "Just Barbarian Things".
my DM is really honest. no wonder we die so often
I feel bad for lying to my players considering it is not in my nature to lie. But, if I based my rolls off the actual numbers I get. Players would steamroll through the campaign or have a brutal difficulty because they are more "role play" focused. They focus on characters rather than any sort of combat. I do not like punishing them for role-playing more than their battle prowess. It keeps everything interesting and characters are not dispensable or expendable. It also allows my challenges being less about stats and creates mechanics that are unique and they have to play around rather than being stronger.
I enjoy that type of DM. You feel the real risk and weight behind your decisions, you can see the open rolls yourself.
The other end of this is one that lies and saves all your characters, which is less rewarding and feels like you’re playing a cheap character.
A healthy mix of the two is the best!
Loved this! This comment actually made me laugh!
Tbh I wish one of my DMs would fudge the rolls more. I feel like we missed a few good story moments because they were so strict about it. Mostly a balance is needed. Let some mean things happen to your party, but if the result won't be FUN then fudge it. I also have a good feel for my party and they never suspect a fudged die roll because the result was just fun.
Jared also already mentioned this but, aside from making sure that your players don't notice you fudging the situation during the game, never tell them you did so AFTER the game. It can be hard to resist the urge sometimes. Everyone is talking about the game and how they narrowly avoided a gruesome death. You know, that if you went all out with the monster they were fighting, they would have died. But they don't. So, if you tell them later on "Yeah, that dragon could have totally destroyed you, but I just didn't use his breath attack to make sure you guys pull a victory", it will destroy their memory of the situation and ruin the story.
Very important advice
It'll also make it very hard to trust a DM like that again, or there can easily be a shadow of doubt anytime they play again
Yep. My players never knew when I went easy on them. I let them have their glory and memories.
I had a party struggling with the high ac of a creature in some crazy looking armor. They were constantly missing. When suddenly a player swings his mace comes down with a critical hit, nat 20.
To add to the spice of the awesome blow and help them along, the mace blew off a junk of armor. I gave the players the option to aim for the weak spot at disadvantage but way easier AC.
It was a nice way to give them more options when they didn't have much for versatile spells and they were relatively new players so using the environment wasn't coming to mind either unless I pointed it out to them i.e; You're spell flies by the enemy but hits the ceiling knocking down one of the many stalactites, and it smashes the evil dude's campfire.
You can always paint an amazing looking picture, no matter what colors and brushes are given to you.
Chronicles of the Outlands or Iron Sworn and retire the DM
If they're new you can also remind them there's ways to attack something around AC. Like hitting their wisdom or constitution scores.
So you preperred an encounter that didn't work for your new players and tried to work around it? They maybe could be overwhelmed and had to retreat to figure out a way to win, or suffer some loses while trying to figure it out then and there which is fun (some pointers could help but not giving away the solution) - or the encounter could be made apropriate and with options to solve it before the game not during play.
Also you bend how spells works or was it a spell that could knock down the stalactite?
"lying" is such a strong word... I prefer "active readjustment of plans and events"
I prefer "I am the God of this universe and I have determined that the Rule of Cool shall prevail against the pre-existing laws of physics and probability".
Causality Tweaking?
Alternative facts.
Active Readjustment of Plans and Events
A ROPE
Could someone do me a solid and spot me a pun for this
Reroll as the story demands.
"You want the party to win. That's the mark of a good dungeon master." Thank you. I've been saying for years now that a good DM is one who is on the players' side without them ever realizing it.
tho i have never DM'd, i have a firm belief that a good DM must be both with and against the players.
i have a firm belief that a dm that is against or with the players is a dm i dislike.
@@sunorcio3901 a DM that sides too much with the players can make the game boring while a DM that actively tries to kill the players characters makes the game frustrating for the players. Which is why i said a great DM is one who is BOTH with AND against the players.
@@DotHackerBlackWing that's why I say a good DM is on the players' side without them ever knowing it. So that they continue along and have fun without ever having a clue that things are being fudged in their favor
Unfortunately, players can derail quests so badly that the DM has no choice but to deliver the consequences.
I was DM'ing Curse of Strahd and my party members stumbled into Lady Wachter's secret basement where she was having a meeting with the cabal of cultists she leads. The encounter started out pretty rough for the party because the cultists have some nasty spells, but they slowly whittled down the cultists until things were turning around. Then one of the cultists tried to flee for the exit. None of the players were in range to get an attack of opportunity or even run up and attack him before he would get away. The Fighter's turn comes up and she says "I throw my sword at him!"
Very cool ideal. She rolls. Hits. The players around the table cheer. I tell her to roll damage and she does. She's like two HP away from killing him. That's no fun and would dampen the mood and sort of ruin this cool idea. So I just decided that she killed him and it made for an epic moment. When I said that the weapon hit, sticking into his back and making him collapse forward on the stairs the whole table went up in cheers. That's why you fudge the numbers sometimes.
Then Lady Wachter slaughtered them because they weren't supposed to meet her with the cultists. GGWP, you sadist!
@@7SGThenkai Oh no, she was there as well. She died in that battle. Strahd was NOT happy.
Or... pin their hand to the door. Doesn't fudge, gruesome, fits curse of strahd well.
@@dndbasement2370 It's almost like DMing is very flexible and there isn't one right or wrong way huh? Come on man, stop acting as if you're the only one that knows how to DM.
if he had actually survived: "That is a wonderful little trick, except once again you are between me and my way out and now, you have no weapon"
I read the Dungeons Masters guide for D&D 5th Edition and it pretty much says the same thing, except that it's up to the DM's discretion if they even want to make secret rolls or have a system in place that heavily relies a random factor.
You can also mix it up. I do my dm rolls behind a screen, but some of them I make them public to increase the tension and surprise factor. Its a bit tough to do without having the party ask for it later on when you dont want to tho, but if you do it right and just when its good for the game, it can be a good tool/combination.
"The games over and nobody wants that" Jared has not had a frustrated DM pull off the ol' rocks fall everyone dies
A friend of mine always joked around saying that if he was ever DM, he'd start the story like this:
"Our adventure begins and you are all dead. No saving throw. You die. Game over."
@@joseknavarro "...you all wake up in a dark place, deep underground, resplendent with veins of gemstone and precious minerals glittering in the walls, the distant sound of a running river beyond the stone. An incredibly imposing man in cascading cloth with dark hair steps into the light cast by wall sconces, lit with otherworldly pale flames of bluish-green, and he speaks matter-of-factly and calmly, but with a powerful, resonant tone: "I am Hades. Welcome to Tartarus.""
Conversely he has had that experience and that's how he knows it's no fun.
cholesterolGamer
Unlimite POWER!
Oh no
I never played DnD but i love watching Jared talk about it.
Bolek Lolek Me too
Same. Although I would really like to play a classic DnD campaign atleast once.
Hey, reading the sourcebooks is fun itself.
Same, man
Same. Hope he keeps doing more of this kind of content. I wouldnt be sad if he was just a D&D channel.
wasn't expecting a sequel video to "You've Been Lied To"
I didn't fudge the dice rolls.
I have the receipts.
This isn't a pro gamer move, this is a pro DM move.
@@Her_Imperious_Condescension ROFL
The "Dnd'ning"
This reply thread is something else lmao
Rerolling the "potion of waterbreathing deep under a mountain" actually improves immersion: the party isn't exploring in generic circumstances, so it makes sense not to keep strictly to the generic loot table.
Of course it could still be there as future proofing as you can prepare stories ahead of time.
Generic player #1: I found an potion of water breathing.
Generic player #2: What are we gonna do with that in the mountains?
Generic player #1: No idea but it’s mine!
2 sessions later, you find yourself in an under ground cave with only a single way out a long water tunnel.
Generic player #2: You still have that water breathing potion from the mountain?
Generic player #1: No I kinda forgot I had it and left it somewhere back at the inn.
Generic player #2: Damn it!
Which is why you also don't HAVE to use random loot tables. You can just choose for there to be a potion of giant's strength or whatever. You can also make an adventure for the players out of them wanting to sell off things they have no use for or encourage creative use of said items.
SolarFlair it better be a fire giants potion so a ballista can be caught midair.
Also, who brings a potion of water breathing where there's no deep body of water for hundreds of miles?
@@orbusg8451 maybe the previous adventurer found something else in that chest but to make space in their pack they had to leave behind a potion of water breathing
"We've been tricked, we've been backstabbed and we've been quite possibly bamboozled!"
Is that RvB reference I spy.
We’ve been Shmeckledorfed!
@@hellhound2350 The probability is high.
@@Meganuke5000 I don't even know what that means and i agree with you!
You’re welcome :)
Officially in my games, all the enemies i throw at my players have their hit dice rolled individually, so while the same type of enemy will have similar hp, it'll be different for each one.
Unofficially, i don't do that at all. Each monster has the same hp, and if i feel like this individual should die a little sooner or a little later to help the pacing of the encounter, then i'll make it so.
I've had too many a game slow down to a crawl when it was really fun before cause the enemy has so much ac and hp that the players are stuck fighting it for way too long. In some instances I think they could tell, but making sure things flow smoothly is more important i feel.
An alternative to keeping track of individual amounts of HP is to instead have a simple wound-like system for enemies. PC hits an enemy, that's a wound, regardless of how much damage it actually dealt. No more wounds = dead enemy. Very useful for grunts and mob-like enemies to surround another, actually statted, elite enemy.
My friends and I, during our high school and college years, used to role-play a ton but we didn't play DnD. One of us had worked out his own world, races, spells and everything. We didn't use dice. He just told the story; and he was very good. We just decided what we wanted to do. If the decision made was smart, clever or maybe something he had not considered he would often let it happen. What made this guy so good is he was very quick at coming up with really awesome crap off the top of his head. Also helped he had a winamp lib full of epic songs he would play and swap to for the right occasions. So the more clever you were the more likely you would get your way.
Looking back on it now I know we were never playing a game though. We were just helping him tell stories to himself. But it was still pretty fun and neat to be a part of.
My DM for 40k dark heresy basically has got his very own houserule. If you come up with a solution to a problem that is so grand, epic, awesome or just cleverly implimented, he will let it pass, no rolls required. This rewards good roleplay and actually engages players to think smart, and not just rely on a good roll.
to think all that mess almost made us all miss DNDecember.
What mess
Rose Berkshire The big, big mess on Twitter from half a year ago
@@WilTheNyanCharmander never happened
DStork the drama actually did happen, Jared was just mostly innocent
Manek Iridius the drama did,In fact, happen
With the example Jared gives at 5:05 - 6:10 (the one where the partys' climatic plan goes off flawlessly, but the boss survives with 2hp, only to die to the warlocks' dagger), I can think of an alternate way to play that out.
Leave the boss alive, but paint the scene so that it's clear to the party that the boss is on their last legs, though descriptive language:
"[Boss] goes to stand once more to face you, but as they do so their legs give out, and they fall back to their knees. Blood flows freely from the great wound on their chest, and you hear the distinct clatter of steel on stone as [Boss]' weapon falls to the floor as they use both hands to try and stem the bleeding, to little avail. Their gaze falls upon you, though it now expresses their defiance of you more than their hatred for you; a desperate yet fleeting attempt to cling to life."
Afterwards, you can fit in a villains' monologue, a last-ditch desperate attempt to kill the players, have the boss kill themselves (if they're the type to prefer dying to their own hand than be killed by the party), or have the boss be killed by one of the other villains (in the classic "you have failed me" vein)
Sounds awesome
Right.
Massive damage cripples the monster, he's pretty much dead on his feet. Party gets a chance to interact with it before someone just finishes it.
Coup de grace is an actual mechanic in D&D, and warlock walking up and slitting the throat of a "near death" monster seems to be just fine. Or you know, do something like Mortal Kombat's fatality.
@@KasumiRINA I am aware that Coup De Grace is a thing in DnD. After all, it was the subject of a previous DnDcember video..
Normal Players: I have to take my DM's word on this since their dice rolls are covered.
Players on Roll20 with public DM dice rolls: I have the receipts.
The DM can still make secret rolls in Roll20, they can also have their own set of dice off site or irl
@@garuelx8627 I am aware. That's why I included the word "public".
The more I watch Jared talk about all the minute details of DnD, the more I want try DnD... Now if only I had friends...
A group of friends and I really wanted to steal this magical ring from a merchant that allowed one to slow down from any fall (being the rogue you can imagine the possibilities for shenanigans). We set up this elaborate plan to rob him broad daylight and after my friends succeeded like 6 dice rolls and I had cracked the safe (our wizard made me invisible), all that was left was for me to dive out of his stall without getting caught. Rolled my die, got out of there with the ring. It wasn't until the end of the session that the dm admitted that he allowed it to work even though I hadn't rolled quite high enough. He had liked the plan so much that he didn't want it all to fail at the end for a roll that was 1 point too low. We had suspected as much but goddamn did he make our night.
That's not just a good DM. That's just a good friend as well
If it’s just 1 point anyone whose not a stuck up the ass DM would allow it as well, it was just 1 point.
@@AtelierGod That's when you make it partially fail. So close yet so far, but maybe another skill might keep the merchants attention on you since he doesn't see a person and could assume the wind blew something over? It would have made the wizards prepared gust of wind useful, or the bards bluff or diplomacy. Fudging rolls makes stupid and weak players, make them think and problem solve, you know the main selling point of the game? If they can't, they die.
DragonEye there’s also a difference between different play styles some prefer a harder more difficult play through where everything has to be micro managed or else they die but this I would say is for experienced players not newbies whose just gotten their foot in the water, for such people I would say that a more lose adaptation of the rules which is in fact in the DM’s choice to make and you should remember that it’s for fun, I’d imagine if the difference would’ve been 2 or 3 or more the dm more than likely would’ve done just like you said it should go.
@@dragoneye6229 The difference was literally 1. That and we'd had a streak of 2-3 particularly hard sessions with a lot of costly fails. The whole heist happened at the end of the session and we were kinda down on our luck, it was starting to sap our morale a bit (our rolls had been genuinely, shockingly bad for the past month or so). That moment was a morale booster. Plus, the DM actually did do what you described: I managed to vault the table but knocked it slightly and made it shake. The vendor noticed the open chest and called out that he had been stolen but we'd already planned my escape route and my alibi. Just not to let things end too easily, the invisibility effect wore off when I was still in the middle of the crowded street so I startled people and had to bluff my way out of it (with a somewhat plausible excuse and successful rolls obviously).
Well, yes, Jared, but what if the DM is a sadist?
"if"
Lol
I played under one who was like that. Changed the rules on the fly to deliberately put you at a disadvantage. Whole time I played, my entire role was nothing more than the punching bag. Unless you kissed up to him, he made your time a living hell.
@@iboulderdash3242 that's the definition of RPG and that's why it's stupid.
Then you have a bad DM and shouldn't play with them.
@@suprememasteroftheuniverse Not if you have a good DM.
Potential Topic: How To Deal With An Unruly Player, Without Ruining The Fun.
Step One: Politely take them aside, explain why their behaviour is disruptive and ask them to stop.
Step Two: If step one fails, do not invite them back.
Kill
Them
@@DoctorLazers spot on. Most peoe would give them subtle hints in the game, or do things to thier character in game to get them to leave. It doesn't work. We all have to be the better persone and just talk to them and see what is going on.
@@DoctorLazers No. That is stupid. You don't negotiate with terrorists because you are giving them the attention they crave, unruly player = child throwing a fit. You ignore that shit, don't feed their ego. Instead bend his ego to your will and make him submit by being a good GM and tricking him into making things better and worse in every situation. Crafty GM's don't need group think and they don't need an echo chamber.
@@dragoneye6229 Haha, what? No, just be a fucking adult. Ask them to stop. If they don't, ask them to leave. No tricks, no ruses, no manipulation. All you're gonna do is sabotage your own game with that childish nonsense. I've been DMing for 15 years.
Honestly, how is being straightforward and just exercising your authority as the DM, "Negotiation," or "Feeding their ego?"
My DM had a magic lamp with a water elemental stuck inside it. My rouge opened it up started to panic and scream her head off, dashing to nearby unalerted enemies and threw the lamp at them and immediately hid. The cultists were completely wiped. Later on he told me the event was supposed to immediately place us into combat, but thought a dragonborn running around with a water spewing lamp to be so funny and memorable he allowed the elemental to just take that...little longer coming out. Instead of being basic combat it became a funny story, built up my character and I felt good that my quick thinking was rewarded.....literally I was given inspiration XD
If you want to fudge AC, a good way is to cause their armor to go down in universe. For example, a heavily armored knight may have his straps cut by the next attack causing his chestplate to come loose, lowering his AC by 4.
When my players steamroll a boss, I always have a „Hah this isn’t even my final form” moment prepared. I don’t use it that often, but one of the most epic bosses I created was literally a segmented boss where its every limb was basically an independent modified creature, and as they killed it, injured, and with many resources exhausted, I had its brain burrow out of its skull, heavily injured but scary. It’s biggest threat was a (a bit fudged) spell that took control of some equally injured and spent npc allies of the party. It was fucking epic having parts of the monster out of reach from melee until its leg has been cut down. And using its gargantuan size. And then at the very end have them fight against npcs they know and love, fortunately the old druidess noticed that the brain was still alive and they took it down without accidentally killing heir friends, but bypassing them to reach the slowly slithering away lump of grey matter was a fun challenge.
That sounds amazing!
Players after watching this: hey, its me... And i was lied to... And so were you....
I mean, is that incorrect xD
Don't tell me that's a meme now...
@@MS-fe3vo I think the point is a meme is being made of it now :D
@@trident042 like "so guys, we did it, we reached a quarter of a million subscribers"
Do you have the receipts?
I've used this before when the party is gathering information in a pre-gen adventure, and they need to learn key pieces of Plot in order to progress .. Keeps the flow of the story moving at the very least
So there shouldn't be a test if they truly need it or there are other options after a fail. It can be elapsing of time, some consequences or just instead of learning it there could be other ways.
“When you do things right, people won’t be sure you’ve done anything at all”
God - Futurama
I don't think my dm lies. He killed the entire party 3 games in and he was really upset cause he said his favorite part was still a while away
He's lying. His favourite part was seeing you all dead.
@@cursedex80 a double Cross?
his favorite part is killing you all a second time
Sometimes even lying cant prevent the inevitable lol I've been in that situation as a DM and it feels bad.
That when you bust out the old “you’re in the underworld, make or way out” cliche. Give them the good warning of “you leave now but if you ever come here again there will be no escape.”
"The hippogriff flies away with you!" Ah yes, then it's a good time for me to use my high charisma and diplomacy skills to cower and beg for my life like the frightened little creature I am!
Hey it could work but if it was me I'd make it so the hippogriff feels pity Nd keeps you as a pet
@@adambriton5394 Probably not too bad. As long as I could keep on my quests, at that point I've got a hippogriff to protecting me!
Doesn't help that my main character I play as is a kobold though, with, I'm pretty sure, negatives to grapple, last I checked ^^;
I remember this one time when the DM told us that we found a mimic, we fought it, and I said "Phew, hopefully that was the only mimic in this damn dungeon!", my DM said : "The dungeon laughed."
Translation: The dungeon is a mimic, and you've already been swallowed.
I watch all these videos then cry about not having a group to play with :(
Holy crap, you don't have friends too??!
I know many ttpRPG players get an alergic reaction to this option, but please consider playing with strangers online. DCA compeled me to try this option and now I've been playing for a while on a EU rpg discord with many players and groups in it and it's been great. Wouldn't have a chance irl. I survive without facecam but there are also groups with those. Maybe it's not an irl game, but there are still many feels and great moments.
As much as I hate not having a group to play with, I feel a little solidarity knowing I'm not alone
Krzysztof Kozł I would love to join that discord if possible I’ve got no maybe 1 person around that’ll want to play the game and it’s a bit hard to play with only 2 people and the size of most discords I’ve seen is much more of a deterrent than the fact of playing online.
I'd love to play but I'm an undercover nerd (bald head, pretty mean looking) in a crappy area in Birmingham full of chavs. I have never played but am desperate to do so.
This is the most active D&December ever and I'm super happy
I'd love to hear more whacky or crazy or just plain stupid stories. I can't imagine you've run out of them yet, and I would love to hear more! I rarely get to play, and such memorable moments are far between for me, so being able to take part of yours would be amazing.
Also, even though I've said this before, I can't stress enough how happy I am you're back. And that you seem happy. Thank you, and I look forward to the next video! :)
Talk about dealing with parties that have a hard time getting hooked into adventures by being too careful or stubborn. That’s always fun, and very important to keep engagement.
the book and dice are nothing but suggestion. it's the players and the DM working together to make a story that matters more.
Jared’s going all out this D&December. I love it!
fudging dice is an art that takes a lot of experience and a good understanding of dramatic tension to pull off well consistently. the goal of fudging dice should always, in my opinion, be to push the narrative in the most interesting and engaging direction. this can go both ways, either in the players' favor or against them, so long as the end result is a more engaging story.
I've def caught my DM fudging rolls but I never called him out cause whenever it happened we REALLY needed the help lol
There was one time where my party absolutely steamrolled a boss by barricading the door he was coming from and using our ready actions to hit him with everything we had from range. After we fired off our attacks he and the one melee fighter rolled badly on initiative so before either of them could do anything, we filled the boss with so many arrows and firebolts that he fell and our fighter didn't get wack him. Before I made the finishing blow I sent my DM a message that she can give the boss more HP so he can do his thing but she refused. She learned a valuable lesson that day, and the next boss fight in the campaign got enough HP to be the threat he needed to be
The most important thing about rolling die as a DM is using your own judgement to feel out what is more fun.
Make sure to ask your party what they enjoyed most in the games and use that info to influence your fudges.
If I may suggest a topic Jared. Unusual characters. Like someone who wants their character to be a child or something like that
Nice :)
It would have been so cool if by the end of the video he was like "everyone does it" and then tilts the camera down and he only has dice with colors on them and no numbers or something.
I thought that was why the table was obscured.
What my friend told me about playing DM is "its not about winning, its about making a good story"
I never liked fudging roles. I get why, but i think following the roll forces the dm to be creative. Say the griffon missed. With a three the griffon falls, knocks down a tree or two etc. causing alot of dust to rise and from the dust the player stares at the massive silhouette of the Griffon. Why did the Griffon fail? Was it hurt allready maybe? If so what is big enough to hurt a griffon? Now we have a mystery. Don't fudge the roll, give it meaning. But that's just me. Sometimes even the dm ain't above fate.
Nope. The DM is above "fate". The only time "fate" is "above" the DM is if they let it be. The DM is the one who makes the rules, defines the rules and may change, adhere or ignore them however they wish as long as it makes for a fun campaign.
@@EvilMegaCookie a fun campaign that doesn't relies on lying is a challenge for the dm. I'm just talking for myself but why roll at all if it doesn't matter. Just have a soundboard that makes a rolling dice sound.
Everything I know about D&D is that it is a game and you use dice but these videos make me feel like a D&D super expert even if I never played the game in my life.
Dont be ridicilous. I would never lie to you.
those double crits were totally rng.
I've watched my brother, as a player, triple crit so at this point I believe any dice roll. Said brother also rolled perfect stats... twice
Another way of "fudging dice rolls" without really doing so is by having a backup plan just in case the party begin curbstomping the enemy or if they themselves begin being curbstomped. If they begin defeating the enemy without much trouble just have their parent, ally, or lover appear to freak the party out. Or if the party has no chance of success have a NPC appear to either help the party escape or give them time to heal up, and either have them sacrifice themselves or have the party owe them a favor in the future (future quest hint-hint). Just don't have your NPC win the battle. Leave that to your players, unless of course you want to go down the route of your players now being in debt. Your choice, but it's a fun way of not having to fudge dice rolls as much, and this is also a way of escalating the battle and story, which is something Matt Mercer and Chris Perkins often do.
You've Been Lied to!
By your GM
God, I'm so glad Jared is back. It has nothing to do with this video, but every time I watch him I'm reminded of just how much I missed this kind of content.
Hey, you can add a small lake or something into the middle of the mountain, and then hid some weird stuff in it if they want to go looking.
Edit: What I'm saying is as long as you can keep it consistent with the other things around you can fudge the story too.
Just throw in an Aboleth into the lake and suddenly the potion makes alot of sense.
My current DM had us dealing with a group of demons that had a nasty habit of possessing the city folk of Sharn.
When we thought we knew what was going on, our Druid tried a Moonbeam spell, thinking the person we had with us wasn't possessed, but instead was under a Disguise Self spell. Since he had no screen, he mentioned out loud to us that "So I have to roll disadvantage if I am using something like that" and rolled two d20s. Our group meta games, and assumed that we had the right target.
Turns out that our DM did it to mess with us, and we killed an innocent soul as the demon then laughed, and left, since we did its job for it. He played us hard, and we talked about it for hours after the session. Best DM I've had in years.
I fudge dice a lot for my player's sake. I try my best to take it easy on my players. I play for the sake of a cinematic and fun experience.
My players still recall the time I stood up with one of them and said "Show me how you want to fight, and all you have to do is succeed your throw, and you'll do it." He succeeded and did an awesome comeback glory kill
If you like a touch of metagaming, you can do one or two die rolls during a dungeon whenever a player does something, but then not say anything about it (or something really vague, like "you hear a faint breeze in the distance"). Makes the place a bit more tense for them. Obviously something that should be kept to an absolute minimum, as regular rolls out of nowhere starts to break the immersion, but I've had a DM do it to spectacular effect during a incursion into a crypt.
Anybody have tips for me to help engage my players in the role-play mindset? I'm trying to get it to be more than roll the dice hour, but I just can't seem to get it to stick.
In VTM they have a game mechanic called "succeed but at a cost" which I think is an accurate way to drive the story without simple "pass or fail" rolls. If the party doesn't figure out the door puzzle, they still have to get through the door so the game can continue, but then there will be a cost. Maybe one of them is now going to lose a magic item or "something" happens as a cost. The take away from all this is, you are spot on! No one wants to be part of a game where it's just fail succeed rolls. No fun for DM or player. Odds are NOT favorable anyone will have a good time all the way around. Love DnDecember. Rock on!
Lying? Roll a bluff check right now
Natural 20
@@simon-patrickjohnson Bet! Pull up the dm screen let me see that die
@@smbz-gcommunityhub Roll persuasion
When there is no peril in the task, there can be no glory in its accomplishment.
My local community just goes with "If you die you die, your fault" kind of mentality. Makes each game quite competitive on who that will survive and what not.
Even forces GM to play with open screen during combat to make no fudging happening.
Slowly growing out of that as it turns out no one has a connection to their character as they just expect it to die..
I’m so glad to hear you talking about D&D again. I always enjoy listening to you’re stories and hearing you’re reasoning behind doing things in a particular way.
We still can't see the 3.
i might argue that the best DMs can make a fun story without ever fudging the numbers. dont think about the world as exclusively one outcome per dice roll number, but think of different scenarios for the relative success of a dice roll. as an example, in a scenario that rolls 1d20, you have a scenario planned for a 1, 20, 2-8, 9-15, 16-19 (no modifiers). looking back at the flashy finisher that doesnt kill scenario, take the liberty to say that the destructive attack has weakened the structural integrity of the fight arena, and the ceiling comes crumbling down on the foe, finishing them off by burying them in a pile of rubble. it also can lead to an escape sequence and change the direction of the story.
my stance is: dont fudge the numbers, change the environment. the most convincing worlds can accommodate such fluctuations.
That sounds like an extremely long-winded way of saying "fudge the numbers."
@@CoralCopperHead only if talking about the broad strokes. I was arguing the finesse of it. narratively, there is a difference between a monster who should have survived with 1 hp but the players do extra damage out of nowhere, and the same monster actually surviving the hit, but not getting a turn. The ceiling crumbling is only one example. Maybe the monster cant find its footing, maybe the floor gives out, maybe an underling backstabs the monster, or maybe the monster starts begging for its life. The point is that you can get far more scenarios by letting the dice rule all than you can if you give the players or monsters points they didnt roll. It all depends on the DM's ability to improvise, though. It might be ideal to find a creative way to validate the "fudged numbers" than just hiding the numbers that were fudged, but that doesnt mean everyone is capable of it, or that the less creative would overuse a single explanation.
I know I've had to fudge some crits more than a few times to make sure characters don't outright die from stuff. Sometimes the dice are just vicious.
That's how D&D was designed my dude
I started my own campaign and I heavily used your videos for tips and tricks! Glad to have you back my dude!
"A DM only rolls the die because of the noise it makes" Gary Gygax. Even during NPC interaction when a player rolls persuasion to see if that tavern bard has any useful info on the new guild master, its good to let the players feel like that information was earned rather than given.
As someone who's never played d and d, I'm loving this from you man! I used to ignore your d and d vids but I was desperate for a new vid of yours and when these cane out I didn't think twice, now I really want to play 😂🤣
Well if I was being lifted away I'd be playing my lute as I meet my death.
You're essentially the parent of the party. Give your players what they need, not what you or they necessarily want
Yes, hello, I would like for Jared to be my DM
DM: *Lies*
*Players catch him*
DM: Damn 1 rolls...
It's the lack of a fudging GM that makes CRPGs as difficult as they are: there is no one to soften the blows.
and thats why I play Baldurs Gate on easy
DnD, even with zero fudging, is far easier than a CRPG. The reason is obvious. In a CRPG, your chances of success simply need to be higher than 0. You can die, learn from your mistake, try again and win next time using your foreknowledge.
In DnD, that doesn't happen. You die and well, the game is over. Even the hardest of challenges in DnD have a reasonably high chance of success.
These videos are criminally under viewed. Keep up the great work I'm really enjoying D&December it's almost nostalgic since you helped get me into D&D!
I always show every die roll to my players, and while the numbers are never fudged, the narrative usually is
Unless you count tossing away rolls for treasure results that don't make sense in the scenario, I have never had to fudge die rolls. And, actually, the examples you gave closer to the beginning do not need an alteration either. It all comes down to proper narration. For the example of the awesome epic attack that doesn't quite kill the thing, you don't have to fudge the roll to make it die after all. Just play up how staggered it is after taking that huge attack, it's really not doing well, maybe it's trying to limp away or make some final attack of desperation.
For the griffin, it swoops and misses, but this alerts the party and it's coming around for another dive and the party has to prepare. There's always another way without fudging the die rolls.
Personally, I like to leave things in the encounter area that can easily turn the tide of the battle in one direction or another depending on whether or not my party is clever enough to notice them. Basically, it rewards the players for being observant or thinking to check the area, or punishes them for playing D&D like a Dragon Quest game. I like to encourage the kind of gameplaying that is just not possible in a computer generated environment and is only possible in table top. Usually though, my players DO notice these things and it winds up making what would have been tough encounters way too easy. They definitely do seem to have fun with it though since they feel clever for working out the way to make the encounter easier on their own.
A good DM will fudge the rolls to keep the party from a string of bad luck, breaking up misses and low damage with an occasional helping hand.
A great DM will balance out both sides, sometimes screwing the player, sometimes saving them, anything to keep the game challenging, but fair.
Excuse me, I've never fudged my rolls... it's why I once had to let my party's foxkin completely annihilate our vampress....and a good chunk of the continent....with a giant god turtle....while completely black-out drunk
(Don't even get me started on the amount of utter nonsense that led to this even being possible; this foxkin was like a balista bat on steroids XP )
STOP TELLING THEM MY SECRETS
ok nate
@@An_Ian You can't tell but I disliked your comment.
Don'tCallMeNate ok nate
@@SweetnSourSybil XD
@@SweetnSourSybil you're right, Nate.
I always give at least slightly dynamic descriptions rather than announcing dice results. Instead of saying, '16, he hits you for. .8 damage' I will say 'You clash blades and he slips your guard delivering a savage slice for 8 damage' this way my players think I'm coming up with a description of what happened and it covers up when I'm _deciding_ what happened and ignoring the dice rolls.
"Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!"
YOU'VE BEEN LIED TO
I once had a DM who hated the very concept of fudging and was really honest about results, making boring fights, uneventful adventures and cheap deaths. But even worse: as a player, he keeps bickering and demanding honesty from other DMs. Even if it goes against character development or even character knowledge, he demands honest results and optimized builds and rolls.
It's very annoying, but he sees this as a good thing, he feels better about himself as a DM that way, so it's kinda hard to argue with him. I don't play with him for a long time, so I don't know if he's still the same way.
@Manek Iridius I quit in a very subtle way and he's still bitter about it. But recently 2 of our mutual friends were "dead in the eye" to him. They left and he was very stubborn with his ideals.
His only saving grace are his good stories and writing, but it's firstly a game to have fun as a group, which he failed us.
That's genius... I've just started DMing a while ago, and Roll20 sort of robs us from this feature of "fudging roll"s. It's a shame, since everyone can see that roll..
I care a lot about my players fun and ensure if they're having a good time, so I shall treasure this advice!
You can roll to yourself when you are a DM, and you can roll only for the DM when you are a player
I believe roll20 have gm rolls nobody can see?
You guys are right, there's a DM roll feature. I guess due to how long I've been there it must've escaped my mind.
Doesn't help my players are *very* inquisitive on die rolls haha
MapTool lets you hide rolls so only the GM can see it with a command. Look up the commands for Roll20 I bet there is one in there. Otherwise make your players smarter and stronger people by forcing them to solve the new problem they created by failing. I didn't know the command myself and I use MapTool so instead failure is not a "It doesn't happen moving on" it's more "It doesn't happen, what do you do to now?" letting them know they have skills, feats, spells, and abilities they might leverage to salvage the situation, which brings problem solving back to D&D.
My friends and I don't play D&D, we use GURPS - but it applies all the same, this is very true. Mostly, when I'm the GM, I use all my hidden rolls more as a... "guideline" - I'm always gonna have the goal of making the game fun and challenging, so I won't let everything be dictated by dice... buuut using those dice as a guideline of sorts is a good thing, introducing that bit of realistic randomness to keep things a bit unpredictable. Beautiful video, Jared. Very fun to listen to.
ProJared uploaded a new video: You've Been Lied To 2
I believe the most important thing is making sure the players are having fun. Win or lose, regardless. Some players revel in the occasional comical failures or tasks turned into hardship by failed rolls. Sometimes a check can fail by 1-2 points. I love to employ "Success with a cost" for rolls that come close to succeeding. Especially for checks that required multiple rolls. I DO NOT believe you should ever handhold or coddle your players. Just keep the fun going. The best way is just to gauge player involvement as the session is going. If the players are laughing or cracking jokes during moments, or are tense and on the edge of their seats (in a good way), then everyone wins. At the end of the day D&D (and other tabletop RPGs) are about getting together with your friends and having fun telling a collective story.
It's definitely something I miss when it comes to DMing through Fantasy Grounds with all my rolls and results shown. Sometimes a player is just having a bad time of things and the fun is clearly running dry for them, it's about time to do some fudging like "Oh you dodged out of the way of the massive longsword!" or "You manage to trip the guy!" which is harder with a system that shows all the math in the chat box.
Tuxedo Mask has swept in and saved more than a few groups.
Love these regular uploads. Welcome back ProJared!!
It's kind of an unwritten rule that DM's will lie, lol.
It's like in a video game that has A.I . that adjusts difficulty according to the player.
Imo, 'fair challenge' is a good way to DM. You shouldn't make it too easy...you shouldn't make it too hard. Mix it up a bit and do it just right and be unpredictable.
Don't be afraid to kill your players. When you die in a video game, you learn from your mistakes.
Allow your players to make mistakes and *pay* for them.
It actually is written, it's call DM fiat
The difference is that in a video game death isn't permanent or at least ending something too time consuming.
@@maxbearington7565
Depends on the video game. (E.g. Minecrafts 'hardcore mode')
Max Hamilton there’s resurrection spells for a reason.
@@AtelierGod Can those be used when an entire Party is dead?
I've been playing tabletop for decades now and I can tell when GMs are doing this. I much prefer that they don't. The only time I think fudging dice is acceptable is when it pushes the game along after it get bogged down on a cumbersome scene. IE if the GM needs you to find a secret door or get some information out of a plot-crucial NPC, a player rolls 1 under what they needed to proceed, you might just wave them through.
Can confirm, have lied to my players. Sometimes the party has spent the whole session on a losing streak and you just need to throw them a bone to avoid mutiny. And sometimes the mod you bought off Dmsguild is completely unbalanced for the party you have and you need to use your secret dice rolls to offset the imbalance.
Also, every few minutes a good DM will make a roll that means absolutely nothing. It keeps the players on the edge of their seats and makes you look like more of an all-powerful puppetmaster without the need to fuck with them constantly
Very happy to see so many D&December videos this year. Keep up the great work!
I’m a terrible DM, I take my dice rolls seriously. Many deaths have happened in the beginning, now my players like to grind to stay safe.
I feel bad for lying to my players considering it is not in my nature to lie. But, if I based my rolls off the actual numbers I get. Players would steamroll through the campaign or have a brutal difficulty because they are more "role play" focused. They focus on characters rather than any sort of combat. I do not like punishing them for role-playing more than their battle prowess. It keeps everything interesting and characters are not dispensable or expendable. It also allows my challenges being less about stats and creates mechanics that are unique and they have to play around rather than being stronger.
Grind? There is no grinding in DnD. Players gain XP when you say they do. If they're randomly hunting down enemies to fight for the sole purpose of gaining XP, they should gain nothing.
XP rewards story progress and positive behaviour. This is not the kind of behaviour you want to reinforce because it is not roleplay oriented and does not advance the story.
I have been a DM for over 8 Years now (with the same Group).
And yes, some of the greatest moments in our campaign have only been possible because I subtlely changed the hitpoints of an enemy or the result of a die.
In the end it's all about the fun and the story and if things like that improve the experience, it's all fair game.
I hope he talks about the Art of Seducing The Dragon some time
Fun video!
Somewhat related to this topic: For new DM's that are running premade adventures/modules, you can ABSOLUTELY "fudge" the dungeons in those. I have found that my party doesn't respond well to dungeons that run on for too long. At some point, they get tired of opening doors, checking rooms and fighting. They want something fresh, after about 2 hours of dungeon. I often just flip the rooms around or just straight up change the architecture of the dungeon, to match that. If I notice everyone is getting to that point of being done with this dungeon, I just move to the "Boss Room" to be the next room (of course, it has to make some sense in the world as well).
One of the most important things about DM'ing, is reading the table. If you can manage to get a good grasp on your players, and are able to read their reactions during the game and what those reactions truly mean for them, you'll be able to be a great DM!
These are such great tips on how to be a wonderful dungeon master. “Make the fun happen” -Pro Jared
Kindof off topic, but I remember seeing a video, & I think it was Noah's counter monkey series, where he said 'Give as few solid details as possible. Don't use names, use descriptions, because it keeps players guessing & it keeps them paying attention.'
I fudge the dice rolls at least 2 times per sessions. And I can confirm it makes the game more fun.
The other I would suggest is to occasionally roll your dice outside the screen. Maybe 1 or 2 times per session. Only do it though if your party is in a position to survive the worst senerio. This can help you party to trust your rolls. Even if you are lying to them a lot
There's a good amount of theatrics that goes into the mechanics side of Dungeon Mastering.
I once DM'd a session with the party exploring a cave system. One of the caverns was empty, but the module suggested I roll a d20 every time the party passed through. The sole purpose of this room was to psych out the players by suggesting something there was about to attack or trap them.
"OK, but if there's any girls there, I want to DO them!"
"Do you have any idea how many rolls I would have to fudge to make that happen?"
Glad you're back doing these videos, Jared