The Sad tale of Orpheus. From Opera to Hades. How the Lament of Orpheus Stands the Test of Time.
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- Опубліковано 17 чер 2024
- Not only is Hades an incredible game but the music speaks to us deeply in our souls. It's amazing to me that the Lament of Orpheus has been written time and time again for thousands of years. Wether it's Gluck and Orphée or Berlioz, Offenbach, or @supergiantgames. The tragic story of Orpheus and Euridice lives on. Why does it speak to us as much as it does? Why have we never been able to shake this tragic tale?
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Chapters:
00:00 Intro
00:20 Orpheus has a hard time
01:00 Operatic history
01:03 Che faro senza Euridice - Gluck
01:34 Orpheus in the Underworld - Offenbach
01:50 Why has this story survived the test of time?
02:17 Music pt1
02:38 The Power of Humming
03:05 Music pt2
04:06 Pitching Down/up
04:40 No Full Voice Here
05:04 Music pt3
06:54 Hushed Tones
7:10 Falsetto
07:45 Haunting Evolution
Credits:
Singer: Darren Korb
Developer: Supergiant Games
Composer: Darren Korb
Platforms: Nintendo Switch, PlayStation 4, PlayStation 5, Xbox One, MORE
Awards: BAFTA Games Award for Best Game, MORE
Publishers: Supergiant Games, Private Division, Take-Two Interactive
The craziest thing about this piece is that the singer is also the composer of the score for the game (Darren Korb), who *also* voiced Zagreus AND Skelly. Zagreus has an absurd number of lines in Hades, for those who don't know. In the thousands. Darren Korb is ridiculously talented. You can never go wrong with any pieces from Supergiant Games' games. Bastion, Transistor, Pyre and Hades all have excellent scores. Thanks as always for the insightful analysis and interweaving of opera/musical history into your discussion of the piece.
he somehow keeps outdoing himself. the OSTs are always an absolute delight that i still go back and regularly listen to.
On top of composing, he does most(?) of the live instrumentation, voice over as you pointed out, and he's also the voice director. Crazy amount of talent from Darren at every turn.
Amazing to know. At first it bugged me that Zagreus sounds so pedestrian and bruh like comparing to the somber otherworldly voice of other gods butttt by the end of the story it is not a conspiracy of the high heaven of kin-slaying and manipulation that kept his family apart but lack of communication, misunderstanding and pride that kept his family from speaking their mind and communicate what they want and need. IE a family drama with Greek melodrama. What a wonderful interpretation of familiar tales. Wonderful. And the OST quality is amazing throughout.
I knew same person voiced Zag and Skelly(I honestly thought that Skelly was played by Matt Mercer at some point) but I didn't known he also made music for the game and sang in it!
@@chillax319 matt mercer.. interesting
@@tumultuousv No, no. I was thinking that it could be a Matt Mercer. I was wrong. Skelly is played by a Darren Korb who also voices Zagreus and is composer for the game as John Petrila said.
Now you can see here how Orpheus managed to bring a tear to Hades’s eye and convince the stoic king of the underworld to give him even the smallest chance to bring back his lover.
Some versions of the myth say it was Persephone that was moved to tears, and it was with her help that Stalwart Hades relented and gave Orpheus the deal.
@@seasnaill2589 I like to think they were both present and he actually moved both to tears
Well, I think Hades can relate. Probably made him cry.
they were so clever with how they introduced this song in game. when you finally get him back into the house of hades, he refuses to sing out of grief for a very long time. after a while you just kinda accept that the court jester isnt gonna sing ever again. but then when you build up your friendship with him, one day you die again and come back to the house of hades, only to hear his singing down the hall. it's such a mesmerising moment, and i loved it so much
Oh, but it's not just at some point, it's only after he hears from you that Euridice is doing okay. It's even more powerful in that way.
I had to uninstall mine before I heard him sing because Eurydice just refused to show up. I downloaded a mod that forces all three of them to appear (Sisyphus, Eurydice, and Petroclus) but she still won't show up ):
got literal chills the first time I heard Orpheus' song, same with the first time eurydice appeard. Such an amazing game.
blessed be this game and supergiant
That buffed up as hell Pikachu in the background was not something I'd expect to see today. Yet, here we are.
That falsetto is SO hard for Darren to do, that Live, He was really struggling.
I talked to him about it actually - it’s all about extension. I still dunno how he does it at all.
Given the name of the song (the Lament of Orpheus) and when this song is sung (after Orpheus has already failed to rescue Eurydice), I would say the "don't look back" is actually him voicing his regret. It's as if he's thinking back to when he was trying to leave Hades with Eurydice, and telling his younger self "don't look back".
How did I never think of Hades for this channel? The entire soundtrack is great, let alone the three lyrical ones- this, Good Riddance, and In the Blood
You're forgetting Hymn to Zagreus.
@@MrGhosta5 TRUE I always forget that one somehow
@@brendanrisney2449 just as Zagreus would want you to /j.
(but, for real, that song perfectly captures the uniquely horrifying origins of Dionysus, God of Madness, Part 1/3: there is no way to relay the "accurate" mythology of Persephone to a modern audience without it being Pure Horror. Yes, a lot of her myths are cobbled together from several variant versions with different regional contexts; yes greek theogeny is metaphysical, not physical, and largely used as Metaphor rather than Actual Family Dynamics... but in a modern lens, with our need to centre our protagonists and their lived emotional experience? If Hades' "abduction" of Persephone coincidentally transpired right after her finding her child, the one possibly good thing in the wake of a living nightmare, who was taken from her to be paraded for all to see by their shared father then torn to pieces? Yeah, wanting to live far, far away amongst the dead makes a lot of sense.
(though even that framing, of Persephone going with Hades willingly to escape the scrutiny of Olympus post-Zagreus, gets tainted when you remember that a common feature of the myth has "Hades takes Persephone at the suggestion and authorization of her father, Zeus" detail applied)
The way he sings “drowning, don’t look back” just ends me every time.
I grew up on Greek mythology (as well as those of several other civilizations) so Orpheus was quite familiar to me. It's quite interesting to see his tale carried throughout history through his own craft in such varied ways.
Interesting how the composer wanted to tell the tale of Orpheus, but since the singer is literally Orpheus after the tale, he is both telling the story for people that don't know it and trying to forgive himself for what he did wrong.
Oohh yes Hades! Would love to hear your thoughts on In The Blood as well! Always love when Ashley Barrett and Darren Korb duet for Supergiant games' soundtracks. What a wonderful pair!
In the Blood is so very good
Lyrics:
Hear, oh gods, my desperate plea
To see my love beside me
Sunk below the mortal sea
Her anchor weighs upon me
Fasten her tether unto me
That she may rise to sail free
Don't, don't look back
Close enough that light we can see
My doubt betrays the better of me
Glance to the stern is all it would be
That anguished shade shall haunt me
Ever on
Calm seas
Winds alee
But now the squall's upon us
We're foundering
Drowning
Don't look back
Don't look back
Don't look back
Don't look back
Don't look back
I would love to see your reaction to each of the Good Riddance versions, 1st the Eurydice solo (Ashley Barrett), the 2nd the Orpheus solo, and the 3rd the duet by them both. It's the same song but the way they're sung individually gives off a different feeling that I think you'll appreciate!
1:38 Also I didn't know that that was titled "Orpheus in the Underworld" and I just kept laughing at the irony because it's mostly associated with funny bgms but it's actually about a tragic Greek character ASDKHJ
Something that stands out to me is Orpheus’ references to sailing, calling back to his adventures on the Argo before settling down with Eurydice before her tragic death
I didn’t know that song was called Orpheus in the underworld! I knew it was from Offenbach but didn’t know that name
It’s galop infernal technically or just the can can lmao
I love how you tried to break it down piece by piece at first, and then when we get to the middle, you just gave up and let yourself being washed away by the beauty of it all up until the very end of the song.
Knowing that this reaction is coming from an actual opera singer makes it all the more appreciated !
Great video, man !
Thank you! It’s stunning. I am obsessed with it actually.
The voice actor of Zagreus is the singer who sings this song. He voices Orpheus’ singing voice, Skelly, and Zagreus
In the blood, is another great OST from Hades and I strongly recommend it
[Warning: very long comment ahead lol]
Ohhhh this video made me very, very happy. I love Supergiant Games, and especially their music, and seeing you "react to" but more importantly analyze and respond to this song was just very, very lovely. This song also has a special place in my heart since the last song I really actively worked on with my voice teacher before the pandemic hit was Monteverdi's "Tu se morta," another musical Orpheus interpretation, and I haven't really had a chance to sing much since...
(OH, also! You commented on how the melody is generally leading us upwards over the course of the song, while Orpheus himself is recounting a story about the underworld's depths, but what came to mind for me is that... well, in the story, Orpheus WAS climbing upwards, just like the song. And, just like the song, the most desperate, mournful, heart wrenching part of his journey came at the peak, when he did look back. The song's gradual climb to its high, plaintive climax feels very fitting to me, and I would never have had that observation if I hadn't watched this video
Thank you for writing this! I appreciate reading this :)
You might want to check out the duo version of this one (as well as the live version) and of Good Riddance.
Oh, there was one song that made me cry twice when I played Hades. "Good Riddance"
Not the first version you hear from Eurydice, but the two other versions that you get to hear when you get far enough in their story. I know, much of the emotion comes from the context in the story, but it is still incredible how a single song can make you cry out of sorrow in one situation and out of joy in another.
So much respect for you musical talent just instantly picking up the song to illustrate your points. Wish I could sing. Great video as always!
Aw thank you for saying that
The instrument you hear is saz (also called bağlama) a turkish instrument which is used often in traditional songs. It was also used a lot in hades soundtrack.
When I first heard this song in game, I stopped playing just to hear the full song. I still haven’t forgotten that moment, it was incredible. It sent shivers down my spine. Loved your reaction to this song as well as your other videos!
I also love the Underworld remix, which is the song with more rock instrumentals added to it. There, you get to see more of Darren's awesomness, as unlike most game composers, he comes from a rock background as opposed to a classical background.
I will never forget the first time I heard this song. I stopped in the middle of the House and just stared (Zagreus and me in real life lol) at Orpheus and suddenly I understood why Hades was so mad that he stopped singing. This song is so hauntingly beautiful it almost doesn't sound human. I love it so much.
PS: I know this is a kind of old video but if you (or anyone reading this) hasn't heard the version where he and Ashley Barrett sing this as a duet do yourself a favor: ua-cam.com/video/_FJhBg3THMA/v-deo.html
Ohhhh, Supergiant soundtracks!!! I'm definitely invested! I've never played HADES, but I'm familiar with the soundtrack and this one in particular. Im a greek mythology nerd (my avatar is literally my own depiction of my fave Pantheon goddess, Artemis), and I already knew Orpheus' tale when I heard this one. Which was so much more impactful to me when I heard Darren Korb singing the "don't look back" at the end, like... ughhh so heartbreaking! Both Darren Korb and Ashley Barrett (the female's voice on the background and the main singer in other songs) are so incredibly amazing as musicians, holy crap. Their live performances are _insane_. I feel so lucky to live in a time where I can hear their and other game composers' works.
And on the topic of "humming is so powerful and melancholic", Transistor (another Supergiant game with songs also written and performed by Ashley and Darren) and it's soundtrack's ENTIRE DEAL is about Ashley having songs where she fully sings and whole versions where she JUST hums through it because of the main character's plot. The humming is used as both storytelling and mechanics device. So fascinating!
And Marco, I always forget to mention that I'm curious about your voice acting roles! Can you share or talk about any of them at some point, that would be awesome :D
Roles are limited! I mostly work in education training right now :) I have a commercial on Spotify playing right now too!
I highly recommend "in circles" from their previous game Transistor, also by the same composer.
Yes I requested this one!! LOVE your insight into this, this is one of my favorite tracks ever.
Glad you liked it, Maria! Thanks for the support :)
The saddest thing about this song is that you cannot experience it for the first time again :,)
About the line "Don't look back" - I always interpreted at the way that this is some sort of catatonic state of Orpheus, after his failure of rescuing Eurydice. Like repeating this line is his lament, his artistic cry.
All the Supergiant games are so well-integrated thematically with their soundtracks, they're such a unique experience.
Supergiant always has great music. Bastion and Transistor both have tracks that still give me goosebumps even now, many years later.
I love this song!! Really nice tone from Darren
man you have to hear "in the blood" if you haven't already
I've been waiting for this.
And so of course then I had to go straight to this one. I loved hearing your take on this, especially the comparisons with other takes on the tale in song. You have such amazing insight. I'm glad you've gotten to see more of Darren's singing.
I heard this song so many times, and after your explanation I understood how it works and why it always had so much emotional impact on me.
so happy to see you check out Hades
This is such a great game, with great music. Glad you reacted to one of the songs. :)
One of my favorite from Hades, Darren Korb really knows how to write for the voice imo. I actually use this song to teach about interpretation and the power of background/previous knowledge. Glad to hear your take on it.
There's a lot of reaction videos out there, even a lot of music breakdown videos out there, but so far I haven't found anyone who brings your perspective to it. Good work!
I appreciate that!
This was a really interesting learning experience! Thank you for sharing your thoughts and views on the music and the stories history.
❤️❤️
Now you need to listen to Good Riddance and In the Blood to complete the story!
Hi Marco, I really enjoy your videos and the classical and operatic lens that you use to recognize and translate the emotional implications put into video game tracks. I've casually dabbled with classical stuff and love ranting to my friends with these exact kind of examinations at an amateur level so this channel is so wonderful and rlly speaks to me. Thank you so much!!
Also, I had to comment on this one because I love Turandot a lot haha and also rlly appreciate the captions for the video!! Cheers :))
I keep forgetting to do them because UA-cam eventually adds subtitles!!!! Sorry I’m inconsistent with them. ❤️❤️🙏
Oh my oh my oh my, a Supergiant masterpiece finally, i live all the four games, Hades i recently bought. This song gives me chills, it's amazing like the full game. I recomend check some Transistor songs too, another great game from them.
Such a crazy cool song and an amazing game. Hades can never be recommended enough.
Only recently started playing hades, and of course this video is recommended to me.
Beautiful song done by an exceptional talented singer.
This was up there with A Red Apple Fell From the Sky for songs I was most excited to get to down the playlist when I started travelling down it, love this song lol
This makes me really want to play Hades again! Such a fun game with absolutely beautiful music! 🥹
I love this soundtrack. It is a masterpiece and fits well into a beautiful peace of video game art.
I bought this game a few weeks ago, but I've yet to play it. After hearing that song, not playing seems criminal. A powerful piece of music right there.
I've been playing Hades for about 2 weeks now and everytime this song comes up or I visit Eurydice I always stay and listen at *least* once to this song or Good Riddence
something I adore about the ending of this song is that there's certainly a more optimistic interpretation (that he's basically coaching himself while actively trying to rescue Eurydice, reminding himself of what not to do) but the other interpretation is so much more *haunting.*
When you first see Orpheus singing this song in Hades, he's a broken anxious wreck of a man. His hair is unkempt, he's skeletally thin and gaunt, he has, up to this point, sworn off singing altogether out of his enormous grief. When you view it in this lens, his "don't look back" becomes this wretched, agonizing, desperate plea to his past self, like watching yourself commit the greatest mistake you'll ever make in your life from behind a glass wall, helpless to do anything but BEG him not to look back. He's all alone with all the time and pain in the world and nothing to do but reflect on the moment he lost his entire world, cursing himself for all eternity. It's so utterly tragic and beautiful.
I never knew Orpheus's story about not being unable to look at his love when I played. I just thought it was a musician and their muse. But it makes sense now. It's such a beautiful song.
There is also a badass representation of Orpheus from Saint Seiya, Lyra Orphee whose music could melt the ice of the Lord of the Underworld...The stars stopped shining, the wind stopped blowing, rivers stopped running to listen, quietly, quietly...with his Death Trip Serenade.
Hades has A LOT of great soundtracks, i hope you make more reaction videos for this game 😁
You should watch the "God Riddance" from Hades - there are three versions: solo by Eurydice, solo by Orpheus and combined duet
Did someone request you to do Subtitles? ... You're extremely well spoken, why? o_o
Not everyone speaks English, I respect that. If it makes it easier for them to understand, it makes it easier. but also thank you :D
the music from this game and from bastion really got me
Didnt play the game, but i love so much the Orpheus' story
I studied in a High School where greek and latin were my everyday, i love so much the mythology and its beautiful stories (like the Ovidio's Apollo & Dafne story)
wait. the can-can is originally from an Opera about Orpheus? Now that I didn't know!
Another song from hades that would be cool to do is "Hymn of Zagreus" one of my favorites.
hearing this after encouraging orpheus to sing for so long feels like such a reward X)
More Hades, please and thanks!
freaking love the Hades game interpretation of Orpheus
Not surprised you missed this song as you have to both give Orpheus nector and talk to him quite a few times before he'll start singing again. It's pretty easy to beat the main story before completing any of the quest for the house residents and even after completing the epilogue you'll likely have a few quest left to complete.
Hymn to Zagreus can take a long time to unlock because you have to progress through both Orpheus and Eurydice quest to the point that Zagreus starts boasting to Orpheus about his heroic deeds and then Dionysus has to ask Zagreus to lie to Orpheus about them being related. Dionysus has a couple hundred lines of dialogue and you can only get one per run the first time you get a boon from him. you can equip the overflowing cup to get him in the first room and then just suicide to cycle through his lines faster.
Hades is just full of awesome songs. Would really like to hear your reactions to all the final battle tracks bundled together (God of the dead + the unseen ones).
Coming here from the newer "In the Blood" react..and hearing you comment about the power of humming while so many people there are telling you to check out other Supergiant titles... Well, I'm here for a fun fact for ya!
Transistor has a version of every song in the game of the main character humming it melodically, since she was a singer. She could hum the tracks ingame, so they just went ahead and uploaded every humming version right to UA-cam. Not good for a react by itself, but very cool and relaxing to listen to, esp if you played the game.. Which I can highly recommend. It's very good at conveying feelings, stories and themes through music, context and other characters' dialogues.. as the main character's voice was stolen from her. She's the only one who can't really tell you how she feels.. but you can FEEL how she feels, at times, if you ask me.
Cool!!!
@@MarcoMeatball Apologies for being a bit ranty. I tend to get carried away with stories and songs I'm passionate about.
@@CageNightwind no I enjoyed reading it immensely :) I enjoy humming and I didn’t know they had those tracks on UA-cam!
Definetly one of my favorite songs in a video game. If you haven't already I highly reccomend checking out Transistor's ost as well! (Another supergiant game)
Would love to see you follow this up with a reaction to the Good Riddance solos (duet) from the same game!
One thing I love about Hades is the song Hymn to Zagreus, which happens in game because two people are basically BSing Orpheus and telling him a yarn as a joke, and he turns it into a song as a story. The best part is that its actually part of the various fragmentary myths about Zagreus. What we know about him is verrrry limited, as a god he pre-dates Hades and may well be an aspect of Dionysis or something that was evolved into him as the Greek religion (and the tolerance of the Orphic cult became more acceptable) evolved over the centuries. I'd suggest looking up Overly Sarcastic Productions video about Dionysis to get the run down on what we think happened, and what Supergiant games incorporated into the story of the game.
Please react to Good Riddance and In the Blood ❤️ this game's soundtrack is amazing.
You should take a listen to all of the songs from orpheus and euridice from this game. They all follow this type of style but they all have somthing different. If i had to reccomend two it would be "good riddance" by euridice, there are two verions of this song one sang by euridice and one by orphues and both despite having the same lyrics give off a completely different message. and "hymn to zagreus" by orpheus, which the reason in the game for why orpheus made the song is pretty funny but ended up leading to probably my favourite non battle theme in the game.
If you like Korbs music I highly reccomend his duets from bastion, transistor, pyre and hades. They are some of my favorite pieces of music. Especially bastion's duet
IDK I think it makes sense that orpheus wails out in a higher register because his journey is not at at it's most difficult on the descent but on his climb out of the underworld. Making a deal with hades and finding its entrance is nothing compared to blindly believing that eurydice is there behind him on their way out
this game is a true gem
All you had to do is not look back, Orpheus
The vocals and composition of the song are beautiful. But what I like is the lyrics. Throughout the game, it's hinted multiple times that Orpheus was one of the few mortals to enter the realm of Hades and live to tell the tale. There are many versions of it with minor varying differences, but I believe this is the intended version used in the game:
After his wife Eurydice died of a snakebite, Orpheus ventured into the depths of the underworld, determined to bring her back to life. After charming Cerberus and Charon with his music, he finally came to Hades, who was so moved by his grief and music that he granted Orpheus's request for Eurydice's mortality. However, with that came one stipulation: he was not to look back until he left the underworld.
Just when they saw the light to the surface, uncertainty betrayed poor Orpheus, and when he glanced back to see if Eurydice was still with him, she was gone.
The last thing he did upon his return was compose a mournful song for his late wife. It was so sad that it caused a catastrophe in the world around him: People were struck with depression and nightmares, crops died, dogs went mad, and women miscarried. And so, an angry mob killed him, tore him apart, and threw him in a river.
What makes this so meta is that this is basically that song.
All of Hades' songs are amazing. Good Riddance is just as haunting, and technically has 3 versions, In the Blood sounds kind of victorious, especially with when it plays ingame, and Hymn to Zagreus is a great song, but also utterly hilarious when you know the context. Even then, those are just the ones with vocals, and the boss, battle, and area music is just as good
Hades definitely has a lot of amazing soundtracks
It's the haunting song of a haunted man
Oh man oh man I could listen to this man talk about literally anything Korb has written
OMG you've gotta do In the Blood now
Idk if you know about a musical called hades town, it mixes modern ish style and jazz style ish music, but is essentially the story of Orpheus but I don’t think it includes a version of the lament unfortunately :/
Currently working on an animation using this song based on my (recently dead and came back in the wrong body) dnd character and her best friend just after the death.
LESSGO HADES WOOOO
Also
Day thirty-three of recommending Stay Gold from the Arknights OST
Now I wonder what's about all the curtains in the background.
Are they for sound insulation? Or just to look fancy(-er)?
They’re for sound dampening :)
youve got to listen to in the blood, it's eurydice and orpheus singing !
Yoo HADES! You should check out Pretty much all of the music by Super Giant games. All of them have great vocal tracks in their OSTs.
Hey Marco, do you think you could listen to a really cool vocal piece, and give your opinion on the composition and arrangement of "Omen" from the Bloodborne Soundtrack by FromSoftware? I really enjoyed your analysis in the Lament of Orpheus, and hearing your take on musical composition. I'm trying to learn music compisition as my brother and I are writing music for our TTRPGs. With this bloodborne piece, I want to replicate this theme that they're using, I want to know about what techniques they're using to confer the emotions expressed in this piece. Do I need to give commission?
i would love to see he listening to hades 2 music
Hey Marco, can you analyze "good riddance" from hades at some point? thank you
"I must see her, she is my love, but in doing so I shall lose all but my love for her. Hades commands it so" Such a beautifully tragic tale. Lovers, star-crossed and forlorn, forced to separate by circumstances outside of their control. A circumstantial death inflicting an unbearable torment an poor Orpheus. Pained Orpheus lamenting his love, gentle Eurydice. I love stories.
As a Greek I feel very proud that the stories of our ancestors are still to this day being the foundation of great art like video games and movies. And through them many people try to learn about our mythology and our ancient history which was also the foundation of western civilization.
I had no idea it had this kind of OST. It just looked like a cartoony version of the old Diablo series and I just watched one trailer that didn't include music I think...
do you only react to video game music, or would you be interested in branching out a little more? because if you like stories abt orpheus and eurydice, I'd recommend the musical hadestown, specifically Epic III and Doubt Comes In. Epic III being the song he sings to Hades to motivate him to release his love, and Doubt Comes In being the song where he has to walk out of hell without looking at her. it's ofc better with the full context, since it's a musical, but I imagine you would enjoy the songs a lot on their own, considering your enjoyment of these myths and the different ways they're presented
Yo, you should really try checkin out the Project Wingman live orchestra arrangement. I swear you won't regret it
It’s not a lyre, I thin Darren said it was a kantele when teaching this piece.
So Marco, are you hyped about the announcement of Hades 2 this year ?
Yea! I think so!
A great deal of hades music uses a turkish enstrument called bağlama/saz.
Do you have any thoughts about Hadestown?