The book of Revelation is for past, present and the future. Revelation 7. This war in heaven happened when Lucifer decided he no longer wanted to remain in the world that was created and given to him to lord over. He used to be the cherub that covers, which means he was the closest to the presence of God. He basked in the worship of all angels and beings in heaven, when they sing to and worship God, and now he was placed far away from all these. His heart was lifted above God, and thought that he could remove God from mount Zion, and take over the control of the heathens and earth. (I believe that God in Christ Jesus, has a look similar to a baby, a helpless creature, and thought he could do better, being the best of all God's creation. That is why I believe that the kings of the East, as wise as they were, were willing to bow down to Jesus Christ, even as a baby, because He is the Promised Seed, by whom they were going to access their inheritance in Father Abraham Genesis 25:6). He deceived a third of the angels to ally with him to get God down from Mount Zion, and must have promised them something to get them to comply. Thus, God raised up Michael, whom I believe was the smallest of the creatures, and gave Him the name "Who is like unto God"? ( Imagine how satan felt each time he had to call Him that! It made him so small, having to deal with a lesser angel with a mighty name that reminded him of who he could never be!) Revelation 12: 7 the war began and satan and his angels were defeated and cast down as lightning, to the earth Luke 4:18-19, while Jesus looked on! The earth was broken up by their fall, and became void, and waters covered it, while the Holy Spirit, the third member of the Godhead, hovers over it, waiting for God to make a decision on how to best avenge Himself! He decided to make a man out of the dust of the earth, qnd fill him with all of Himself, so He created Adam, who possessed everything satan ever wanted and could never have, and all this is a body of clay? So, he was determined to get him to rebel against God, so this glorious body would be destroyed. But he was blindsided, because God repackaged this fallen man, and began a plan of salvation for him instead. So man was finally ransomed from this flesh that satan has been buffeting right from the beginning of time, until the cross; redeemed and restored him to glory, and eventually reconcil him back to God! That was why Satan struggled to get king David off of his throne, through Absalom. He managed to sit in it very briefly, as he was advised by a common enemy of David, Ahitophel, but David's ally, Hushai, got him go out in Battle, against him, where even the oak tree fought for David and caught his hair, his mule walked away from under him, thus, leaving him hanging between heaven and earth (so, satan avenged him by crucifying Jesus Christ on the cross). He was buried in the sides of the pit, instead of reigning on the sides of the north. 2 Samuel 18:17; Isaiah 14:15, 1-32; Ezekiel 28: 1-19; Ezekiel 32:23; Psalm 48:2 He tried to get this present day mount Zion. This is the reason why there has to be a new heaven and a new earth, and also, a new Jerusalem, since the present one was, is being, and continues to be defiled. Finally, the glorified man in the body of Jesus Christ, will have the grace to sit with Christ in God, in the heavenly places, far above all principalities, and powers and might, and dominion, and sovereignty, and every name that is name, not just in this world, but also, in the world to come! Hallelujah! It's always been about Mount Zion!
Thanks for engaging! So yea, I would argue that much of that origin story for satan and the fall of angels comes, not from scripture, but from John Milton's epic poem, "Paradise Lost" from the 1600s. It is truly an incredible piece of work, and has shaped the Western imagination for almost 500 years now. But the notion of a pre-human rebellion of Satan and a subsequent battle for the cosmos before Genesis 1 is not found in the Bible. The only time I see satan's fall and a war in heaven is due to Jesus' ministry, death, and resurrection. I fully acknowledge that this will make people object. I fully believed in that other story for many years myself! I'd be happy to answer yours or anyone else's questions about all this, but that the gist of where I went in this video.
@@ronkebarber6238 Yes, I'm quite familiar with all those references. The two main ones people use to discuss this idea of a pre-creation fall of Satan are Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28. Here's my problem: Ezekiel 28:2 and 28:12 both say that this oracle is for the prince and king of Tyre... It's using mythical language, but referring to an earthly king and kingdom and specifically talking about the king's pride and the coming fall of Tyre - which in Ezekiel's day was one of the wicked empires in the ancient world. Same thing happens in Isaiah 14... many think it's about Satan, but 14:4 specifically refers to the king of Babylon. It's actually Isaiah 14:12 where we get the name "Lucifer" ("morning star" in latin, translated "Lucifer in the King James Version)... but that's not a proper name in scripture, and this whole oracle is actually about the human ruler of Babylon 😊 Milton's poem, Paradise Lost, is truly a work of genius, and worth reading. But he got it wrong when he created a mythical story of satan trying to usurp God's throne before the world began. I take Revelation 12:11 as very important. The way this war was won was through the blood of the lamb... this situates Rev. 12 at or after the time of Jesus' death and resurrection, not in a pre-creation time period.
@@TylerAllred858 I know what you mean. Actually, I believe that since there are two powers in this world, God's- through man, and Satan's, also through man, it makes sense that Lucifer, who later became Satan, is always behind evil kings, as God is always also behind good kings. The book of Revelation is written in the past, present and future. We just have to match each event as it unfolds. The war in heaven actually happened before the creation of man, which was God's response to the pride of Satan and also when the animal was slain in Eden, to clothe naked Adam and Eve. It can also be present, at the time of Jesus's crucifixion, when Jesus shed His blood for the redemption of fallen man. This blood is now perpetuated on the mercy Seat for the future. This is the Power of the believers to overcome any and all evil and wicked battles. Whichever book you quote - religious or secular, all will be opened on that day, Revelation 20:12, also the book of life will be opened, and those that believe in any of them, will be judged out of them, because all their subject matters evolve from the scriptures. So, why not invest in the study of the Bible? Scriptures interpret scriptures- if you can make time for it.
You have an open mind to understanding the Bible!!!!!
The book of Revelation is for past, present and the future. Revelation 7.
This war in heaven happened when Lucifer decided he no longer wanted to remain in the world that was created and given to him to lord over.
He used to be the cherub that covers, which means he was the closest to the presence of God. He basked in the worship of all angels and beings in heaven, when they sing to and worship God, and now he was placed far away from all these. His heart was lifted above God, and thought that he could remove God from mount Zion, and take over the control of the heathens and earth. (I believe that God in Christ Jesus, has a look similar to a baby, a helpless creature, and thought he could do better, being the best of all God's creation. That is why I believe that the kings of the East, as wise as they were, were willing to bow down to Jesus Christ, even as a baby, because He is the Promised Seed, by whom they were going to access their inheritance in Father Abraham Genesis 25:6).
He deceived a third of the angels to ally with him to get God down from Mount Zion, and must have promised them something to get them to comply.
Thus, God raised up Michael, whom I believe was the smallest of the creatures, and gave Him the name "Who is like unto God"? ( Imagine how satan felt each time he had to call Him that! It made him so small, having to deal with a lesser angel with a mighty name that reminded him of who he could never be!)
Revelation 12: 7 the war began and satan and his angels were defeated and cast down as lightning, to the earth Luke 4:18-19, while Jesus looked on!
The earth was broken up by their fall, and became void, and waters covered it, while the Holy Spirit, the third member of the Godhead, hovers over it, waiting for God to make a decision on how to best avenge Himself!
He decided to make a man out of the dust of the earth, qnd fill him with all of Himself, so He created Adam, who possessed everything satan ever wanted and could never have, and all this is a body of clay? So, he was determined to get him to rebel against God, so this glorious body would be destroyed. But he was blindsided, because God repackaged this fallen man, and began a plan of salvation for him instead. So man was finally ransomed from this flesh that satan has been buffeting right from the beginning of time, until the cross; redeemed and restored him to glory, and eventually reconcil him back to God!
That was why Satan struggled to get king David off of his throne, through Absalom. He managed to sit in it very briefly, as he was advised by a common enemy of David, Ahitophel, but David's ally, Hushai, got him go out in Battle, against him, where even the oak tree fought for David and caught his hair, his mule walked away from under him, thus, leaving him hanging between heaven and earth (so, satan avenged him by crucifying Jesus Christ on the cross). He was buried in the sides of the pit, instead of reigning on the sides of the north. 2 Samuel 18:17; Isaiah 14:15, 1-32; Ezekiel 28: 1-19; Ezekiel 32:23; Psalm 48:2
He tried to get this present day mount Zion.
This is the reason why there has to be a new heaven and a new earth, and also, a new Jerusalem, since the present one was, is being, and continues to be defiled.
Finally, the glorified man in the body of Jesus Christ, will have the grace to sit with Christ in God, in the heavenly places, far above all principalities, and powers and might, and dominion, and sovereignty, and every name that is name, not just in this world, but also, in the world to come! Hallelujah!
It's always been about Mount Zion!
Thanks for engaging! So yea, I would argue that much of that origin story for satan and the fall of angels comes, not from scripture, but from John Milton's epic poem, "Paradise Lost" from the 1600s. It is truly an incredible piece of work, and has shaped the Western imagination for almost 500 years now. But the notion of a pre-human rebellion of Satan and a subsequent battle for the cosmos before Genesis 1 is not found in the Bible. The only time I see satan's fall and a war in heaven is due to Jesus' ministry, death, and resurrection.
I fully acknowledge that this will make people object. I fully believed in that other story for many years myself! I'd be happy to answer yours or anyone else's questions about all this, but that the gist of where I went in this video.
@@TylerAllred858 check the scriptural references.
@@ronkebarber6238 Yes, I'm quite familiar with all those references. The two main ones people use to discuss this idea of a pre-creation fall of Satan are Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28. Here's my problem: Ezekiel 28:2 and 28:12 both say that this oracle is for the prince and king of Tyre... It's using mythical language, but referring to an earthly king and kingdom and specifically talking about the king's pride and the coming fall of Tyre - which in Ezekiel's day was one of the wicked empires in the ancient world.
Same thing happens in Isaiah 14... many think it's about Satan, but 14:4 specifically refers to the king of Babylon. It's actually Isaiah 14:12 where we get the name "Lucifer" ("morning star" in latin, translated "Lucifer in the King James Version)... but that's not a proper name in scripture, and this whole oracle is actually about the human ruler of Babylon 😊 Milton's poem, Paradise Lost, is truly a work of genius, and worth reading. But he got it wrong when he created a mythical story of satan trying to usurp God's throne before the world began.
I take Revelation 12:11 as very important. The way this war was won was through the blood of the lamb... this situates Rev. 12 at or after the time of Jesus' death and resurrection, not in a pre-creation time period.
@@TylerAllred858 I know what you mean. Actually, I believe that since there are two powers in this world, God's- through man, and Satan's, also through man, it makes sense that Lucifer, who later became Satan, is always behind evil kings, as God is always also behind good kings.
The book of Revelation is written in the past, present and future. We just have to match each event as it unfolds. The war in heaven actually happened before the creation of man, which was God's response to the pride of Satan and also when the animal was slain in Eden, to clothe naked Adam and Eve. It can also be present, at the time of Jesus's crucifixion, when Jesus shed His blood for the redemption of fallen man. This blood is now perpetuated on the mercy Seat for the future. This is the Power of the believers to overcome any and all evil and wicked battles.
Whichever book you quote - religious or secular, all will be opened on that day, Revelation 20:12, also the book of life will be opened, and those that believe in any of them, will be judged out of them, because all their subject matters evolve from the scriptures. So, why not invest in the study of the Bible? Scriptures interpret scriptures- if you can make time for it.