Can your FDM 3D Prints Compete with a Resin?
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- Опубліковано 9 тра 2023
- We all know Resin 3D Prints are amazing but don't sleep on the capabilities of your FDM 3D Printers!
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#3DPrinting #miniatures #Resin - Наука та технологія
The problem with it is more when you go to paint them. The layer lines become a lot more evident when you start painting them and sanding doesn't work well on those small detailed pieces. Especially when you do multiple layers of paint or a wash.
There's a video where someone uses resin and a brush to gloss over the print to give it a more solid look
A couple of thin coats of Mod Podge does a great job of filling layer lines without losing detail.
2 layers of primer before painting makes a world of difference
Everyone who's ever done any sort of painting on a professional level will tell you the same thing. Plastic, walls, or canvas; always put down at least two layers of primer before your base coat.
Uh oh my mini figure have layers. Mom I need sls printer! Not I'm not a looser!
Man, what I wouldn't give to ditch resin printing. I reckon a dual nozzle setup to use a different material for supports would make the FDM prints a lot cleaner.
I see what this guy was able to do in the video but I can say in our real world examples it did not come out the same way at all. There was a very noticeable difference between the two. One is perfect and I do mean perfect. Like he has support issues on the resin one that I would question what size supports he is using and flairs on it. That is very very very rare for me. I stated this in another comment but man there is a difference and our group instantly can tell between the two for our 27 and 32mm prints.
I print at 0.25 mm line width using a 0.4 mm nozzle. Layer height set to adaptive, between 0.1 and 0.2 mm. Minis come out quite crisp!
Which 3d printer u got?
Both my Ender 3 V2 and CraftBot XL (the original one) can do it quite well. Not as clean as resin, but very satisfactory to me and my DnD group. And ofc without the hassle of printing with resin.
Thanks for diving so deep in the comparisons here! FDM 3D printers have come a LONG way towards printing detailed miniatures!
For FDM printing I have been using Variable Layer Height feature more lately. It really helps the postprocessing by reducing the layer lines and adds a little more detail where you need it. For example most helmets I will start the print with a 0.28mm layer height but the areas where layer lines are prone to occur, like the top of the helmet for example, I can set it to print a 0.12mm (or less) layer height. You can add this function as many times as you need. So you can get a good balance of quality and speed where you need it.
Sounds interesting, I've to try it. Thanks for the tip!
All these videos has been helping me with my new Elegoo Jupiter! ❤
That mini is sick. One of the new Loot Studios ones. My bro and I have been testing this as well. I am bigger into resin and he is more FDM. They come out decent
..supports are definitely tougher to remove. Great vid! Very fun experiment 🥼
I only have a resin printer. It's only 2K mono and i really love the detail. I've got a couple of larger project planned for which an FDM printer would make sense, but I'll make do. With no experience, it just seems like FDM printing has many more pitfalls. With a cleaning and curing machine (and a garage) resin printing isn't too smelly.
I've printed a couple of models with 0.2 nozzle with a 0.1 layer height and you almost don't see any layer lines. Takes more time but so worth it!
What printer u got?
@@syedehteshamhaider ender 3 V2
im printing .12 layers with .4 nozzle so this comment makes me want to get a new .2 nozzle!
I would love to see this same thing but with the .4 and .2 on your bambu x1 carbon.
Curious to see if the encasing for more heat control and the core xy set up does any better than bed slinger.
It was nice that you did not fdm bash like SO MANY resin snobs. Printing 100 to 450mm figures with 0.4 nozzles can produce great results. If you have something small like a head, try as small as 0.06 layers. My photon S defaulted to 0.05!!!!
All information that adds value to what we do is important. Thanks for sharing it with all of us 😀
Going smaller(0.15mm or even 0.1mm nozzle) with lower temps will make the prints much crisper, the print times will be stupid though so at that point, it's just easier to go the SLA route
Great great video! A question, though. How viable would combining fdm and sla for a single miniature? Say a model has some finely detailed decorative portions, as well as some larger scenery or display stands. Do you know how to make the two mediums play well together? I seem to always have some scaling issues between my saturn s and neptune 2s
Great comparison - thanks UJ!
I've been playing with tiny, detailed FDM prints for a while. It's fun because it doesn't take long. But when I get down to .08 and .04 layer heights, print failures become very frequent. Often the supports get tangled with the nozzle, or a thin part just snaps during printing. I think tiny prints tax the tolerances of my cheap printer.
Printing supports with a different filament makes removable a lot easier.
Thanks for testing this for all of us! I've never tried going down to the 0.2mm nozzle, I'm pretty surprised at how good it looks! One of the things that keeps me in FDM-land though is the fear of the mess with resins ...
Yeah, I don’t have the spacial setup for resin and I have pets.
Great video! I'd love to also see a comparison between LCD and DLP resin printers. :)
@Uncle Jessy two questions. why do you heat the nosle before removing it? and what filament did you use in the Neptune?
the problem with Prusa's organic support is that it uses as much material as regular support, missing out on some of the biggest advantage of tree supports, material savings and in turn print speed. I agree Prusa's is easier to remove, but I'd trade a couple of minutes of cleaning up VS hours of print time
thx for the great info. Im thinking about getting a 3d Printer like the X1 Carbon and printing miniatures and toys for my kids.
This video was very helpfull
I have a mars 3 as well - and I'm loving the printer.
Those are some sweet FDM prints!
Some resin printers use a laser light for exposing layers, and with them, the print time is based on same things as on FDM printers.
Can you do a comparison for terrain? I think fdm might take the win there
If you use models with lesser details they get even closer to Resin. I printed my Minis from Adventures of Aros in Resin and PLA and there are models that you cant say for sure if they are resin or pla. I still use Cura 4.0 with Siepies profile and I get absolute stunning results. So if you are into Chibi and stylized stuff with lesser Details. FDM can do it! I design for PLA because SLA can do it anyway.
what if the figures aren't that small, like regular anime figure. Can I see samples of the work you mention? I'm trying to stay away from resin.
The not having a large difference between the .4 & .2 setting might come down to most settings have a min time per layer. Large nozzle has to add more delay towards the top of the model, where the smaller nozzle doesn’t run into that min layer time delay. At least that would be my guess without looking at settings or what the slicer says for the two nozzles.
If he used 0.08 layers, only wall count really changed.
With prusas volumetric flow setting, 0.2 nozzle probably printed faster with half the material used for the same layer height.
Plus min layer time as you mentioned
I've printed at .04 layers with a .2 nozzle with amazing results. Dual nozzle machine that can handle dissolving fdm filament would be an interesting test.
I think the FDM could get closer if it had elements broken off and printed so the scarring was on the unseen side. I think the contest would have bene even closer, but would have required assembly. Just a thought. Cool to see )
Yeah, something like printing minis on sprues.
I use a FDM printer and this is what I do, I load my models in Microsoft 3D builder and use the split tool to cut them in half and use the inside as the baseplate connection side. Anywhere a support touches it scars the quality, so you just gotta do it in a way that minimizes supports and it also reduces waste
Really promising. A quick noob question though. How do you clean and sand areas of a print that has texture, say for example a leather texture, without losing all the details???
great work man! what's best settings for printing in 0,08mm?? what's the miniature's height ?? always 32mm? i have a creality ender 3 v3 se and i need to create a profile. tnx for the infos
What material was used for the FDM printing in the video? For FDM printing miniatures which material works best?
I find PrusaSlicer's integration of tree supports really bad - it will build supports intersecting adjacent objects, and knock chunks / off during print. The implementation in cura Xmas alpha, on the other hand just works and comes off prints really nicely. It's wierd given it's the same code.
How is the detail in comparison if you print them larger?
Hello Uncle Jessy. I have an unusual question for you. I bought this Elegoo printer after watching your first review on the printer and I can't for the life of me figure out what the heck I'm doing wrong with it. I'm getting poor bed adhesion,," fixing with hairspray, LOL" and wicked bad layer shifting without the print moving on the plate. I was wondering if maybe you could do a video on the difference between printing with a bowden system VS a direct drive system? This printer print quality blows my Anycubics out of the water when I can get it to work, but that's only maybe 25% of the time and on smaller prints. I would appreciate any knowledge you can share on this new Elegoo Neptune 3 Pro. Thank you so much for all your hard work and wonderful videos.
Which Neptune printer do you have that you’re having issues with?
My best guess is that you need a little more squish for the leveling. If it’s the pro I would lower the z offset 1 or 2 mm and see how it goes
I would love to see some FDM prints on an idex with using PVA as full supports vs just using it as an interface and also on an idex using PETG to support PLA prints 0.00mm support interface distance and 100% support interface density. It may not be resin detail, but the overhangs should look pristine.
The print speed probably has something to do with the max volumetric speed setting (flow).
The only thing you have to do is flash the filament print with a small torch and it’ll look perfect.
i like that the resin ones look less shiny the layer lines really pick up the glare
I have been experimenting with printing on a Bambu p1p with the .2mm nozzle and varying layer heights from .04mm to .01mm . I am seeing a lot of broken tree supports so far which is my primary cause of frustration.
Make sure to clean your print surface with warm soapy warm and double check you have the correct settings in your slicer. I was knocking over tree supports because the the printbed was oily and I'd changed the printbed settings in my slicer from textured PEI to glass without realising.
(Please excuse this newbie question) Does increasing the nozzle heat help at all?
Shoutout to brite minis for making excellent fdm-friendly minis. FDM struggles with those far away, skinny, and extreme angle parts like swords held laterally.
Still waiting for my 0.25mm nozzle, it went out of stock right after I ordered it. I really want to print my Jurassic Park diorama from Gamebody.
Can TPU be printed with the smaller nozzle and yield the same level of detail?
How did you do the timelapse of the resin print?
What neptune I should buy to replicate such small details ?
Got a pet and nieces who come over regularly. I don't feel comfortable with a resin printer XD. FDM I hear can do well enough for nice-looking (not too detailed) mini's and larger-scale models. FDM sounds more versatile.
I want to know if Elegoo Neptune 4 Pro have better quality for minis or is the same than Neptune 3?
Why use the same layer height on both the 0.4mm and 0.2mm nozzle? The benefit of the smaller nozzle is being able to drop your layer height to get more detail.
I was hoping for a comparison between .4 and .2 but with even smaller layer height for the .2
I am a 3d printing novice and haven't started on resin printing yet. To anyone who could answer this question, I would appreciate it: Fillament prints tend to shrink a fraction after cooling. Does that happen with resin prints as well?
Thx for the info.
As far as I know the resin does not shrink
resin typically shrinks when UV curing, depending on how long it cured and type of resin, typically between 4-6% shrink rate, engineered resins do 1-2%.
I am looking to buy an FDM printer real soon but this is for stuff like functional parts, helmets & armour. There is no comparison between models printed in resin and on an FDM. If you haven't seen what kind of quality difference is with your own eyes then I would highly recommend you do so some way or another. It's night and day.
A fairer comparison might be giving each mini a cost is primer water printing and cleanup.
It's really cool.
I am trying to make 12 to 18 inch figures. Can u tell me what's a printer that can do this?
very impressive and at the right time. I am trying to print LEO coins to pass out to law enforcement that I come across as a thank you. Some parts of St. Michael are difficult to get the detail correctly and I have been pondering the use of .02mm. That question is over. Going to order some .02 nozzles. Thank you once again @unclejessy for your amazing vidoes.
Hi, Are those resin burns on your face from a resin printed mask??
the thing is that I work in an architectural office and I need to print wide and large models
the issue with the FDM printer is that every time I print a big model house it starts blocking the hotend at the end, and the smaller the hotend size the longer it takes.. I use 0.4 for houses and 0.6 for terrains and it lasts 2 days to print just one model.. If I get a larger hotend the quality is just bad
So I am planing to get Anycubic Photon M3 Max 7K or should I go with Phrozen Sonik Mega 8K?
forgot to mention it takes 2 days just to print one floor of the house scaled 1:100
the whole house took a week to print
3:54 the hair looks better on FDM than resin! 🙂
Got any updated settings to elegoo Jupiter
It’s official nozzle 0,2 mm? Where to buy it?
Very cool
@ 3:24...are you...handling an uncured resin print with your bare hands? Just curious.
If you leave the mini sit in fairly warm water, those supports will practically fall off of the resin print
Does anyone know when Prusa 26 is supposed to go stable?
Take a shot everytime I say “fine detail” 😂 - also my support removal is 🤮
6:50 elegoo NEPTUNE 3 pro, can't believe I spotted an error lol
btw great video like always
Does anyone know what the white thing in his eyelash is?
I like my miniatures not so mini. I use my minis for display only so printing in either fdm or resin works for me. I'd rather resin because it's quicker. Just support and start print.
i havent watched the video yet but no need my answer is no.. simple 😅 SLA has the highest quality no doubt
Hi, I don't know if you read new comments but what infill % did you use?
Fdm prints I will usually do 8% for most things. 20% if I want it really durable
Resin prints I will hollow & just have internal supports auto generated. Hope that helps 🤘
It does help, thank you!@@UncleJessy
Good comparrison
need help. mars 3 pro or saturn s 4k.
yeah they look pretty close when you use a grey filament that somewhat cancels high contrast. I really wish he could have put a base coat layer of paint on them that would have revealed all the layer lines on the fdm print.
What happened to your Saturn 2 8K?
So i was told if you dip your fdm print in acetone the lines disappear just curious if its true
sort of but by that point you are dealing with dangerous fluids and fumes so you might as well do resin at that point.
Oh a second comment from me. I don't print at .05mm but print at .03mm. That is the default for the Saturn.
My main printer is heavily modified, panels isolated fdm Ender 5 Plus. Custom AC powered bed, high end Dragon ceramic all metal hotend, carbide 0.6 mm nozzle, changed fans etc. Klipper firmware
I like it. However, I use FDM mostly for functional parts, mostly printing CF nylon (luvocom cf-15) and some ABS, ASA and CF PETG.
For my father, who is train diorama model maker, I use solely Elegoo Saturn S.
Yes, resin is messy. It’s toxic. It smells. But detail is amazing. Yep, I hate it each time I have to print with it. With FDM and my tuned profiles, I just put correct filament, set profile, slice and print.
With resin, even preparation takes a lot of time. Proper supports mostly.
on the other hand, printing clear transparent parts is impossible on FDM. ON resin, print it, clean, remove supports, spray some acrylic transparent finish and done
Each has it’s place. No resin can print such sturdy parts as cf nylon ones are. No FDm can print as fast and at such detail as resin.
hi, can ı make body human multi color figure or miniature with resin printer ?
Its doable but I found it way harder to get good results than printing with resin. Ofc its no competition really but its a challenge to hone your fdm skills lol.
I wouldn't want to deal with resin if you could make absolutely perfect prints with it. Maybe it has an industrial use.
In short...no. FDM can't compare to the details that resin gives, however try walking around with a full resin cosplay suit at a con compared to an FDM suit. There's your difference!
FDM actually works great for most of the pieces of a cosplay suit, anything big can be made perfect with sanding and spray bondo. I would rather use FDM for most big things on a cosplay suit because of the much higher strength. Ideally you can print the detailed part in resin and attach them to the large pieces.
It can compare, just don't print it incredibly unnecessarily small.
well electric bill wise?
I've painted around 2 armies from FDM printers. Roughly 100 units.
Make sure to base coat twice. You'll forget they aren't resin after a while.
I think they look fine. And for the price it's hard to argue.
what kind of paint and primer did you use? also did you print mini's designed for fdm or SLA?
@@TheBlackarcher9 I used rustoleom, tan.
The models we from cults.3d a patron designer. Medieval units.
Don't know honestly about to which they were designed for.
Remove the support in warm water after cleanig with IPA. It will easy popp of.
I am so greatfull that my friend has a really professional "ultimaker" FDM printer, with a 0.01 nozzle! hes willing to print me anything i want. But ofcause if its a big thing, i gotta pay a little. but still.. its a luxury!! Tho it can take quite a bloody long while sometimes.... Im waiting for a dragon right now that isnt even thaaat large. The size of my hand roughly, maybe a little larger. (that i gotta pay a little for) And its taking 15 hours :/ but its soon done! :)
The best way I found to take resin supports off, is to soak it in my isopropyl alcohol for about 15 minutes and they slide right off
A smaller nozzle is literally increasing the resolution of the output of the 3Dprinter
always wanted to get ma resin printer... but now i want a bambu LOL .. i think i will get me the bambu and if i ever need more details or speed i will get me a cheap used sla printer+cure wash station...
I'm looking to get into 3D printing, but it seems like there is a LOT of cope going on when talking about FDM doing minis compared to Resin...
FDMs may not be able to compete for details, but it DOMINATES for flexibility and capabilities in just about every other area of 3D Printing. BUT that doesn't mean one is better than the other. It means that one is the BEST for THAT job whereas the other is best for ANOTHER job.
I love all my 3D Printers and Lasers. Great tools to keep things going.
I've been getting better results with my tree supports by giving them a 5% infill.
I have been looking at getting a printer and this video has convinced me that they are not for me.
why dont you dunk your FDA in some acetone for 2-3 seconds?
Super pro tip: run your resin prints under very hot water for 10 seconds and then take the supports off while it's hot.
They fall off
Works with fdm too, just not as well
Resin destroyed the competition, FDM even had broken pieces, provided it was an error on your part when removing the supports
my fingernail will always know the difference
“Looks clean!”
(Looks like it went through a wood chipper)
Yeah. Chrisp result with 0.05mm layer. Of course.
Once I had enough YT revenue I'd rent a Carbon cell and focus more on the impossible possibilities of printing using CLIP type technologies...