Palutena is barely a help most of the time. With some characters like Little Mac or Olimar those are helpful, but with most of them like Mario, Megaman or Daisy...
Imagine making Palutena nair, making it actually work and then still proceeding to experiment with all other multihit aerials. As if the devs wanted them not to work.
@@ir-dan8524 Yeah, and look at the animation. They cling to the ends of her staff rather than having four different strength hitboxes that don't match the length of his bow.
I mean u can kinda just put urself in the right situations and the mutihits will never whiff wutsoever. There are certain rules to them but its not that hard to follow and not rlly restrictive
Johnny Joestar Let me warn you, the following is long as heck, and covers every multi-hit Lucas has. Read at your own sanity’s risk. N-air is ok, but can drop opponents. D-air is definitely a good multi-hit, and being a multi-hit actually makes it way better than it would’ve been if it wasn’t, because you can really drag people to near the blastzone and just kill at 0. Up-Smash doesn’t even feel like a real multi-hit, but I feel the need to mention it because sometimes weird stuff does happen and only the scoop hits. However, I feel like the size of the scoop hitbox is definitely compensation for not working a tiny fraction of time. That thing has nearly the same range as his F-Smash. D-Smash is only supposed to be a multi-hit on shields, but if you get the spacing right, you can connect two of the hits for some pretty sick damage. PK Fire is actually a double-hit. Not much more to say, but it does break Focus Attack’s armor. PK Thunder 1 has increased edgeguarding potential because of it not disappearing on hit, and it also makes it impossible to do the classic Ness edgeguard for all characters except for characters with an absorber or (to a lesser extent) reflector. However, PK Thunder 2 is where the good ends. It does a lot of damage, yeah, but you’ll rarely ever connect it all. Though it is, of course, an attack, it’s first and foremost a recovery option, so you almost always do it straight to the ledge, since it has a weird amount of landing lag and Lucas has a terrible ledge grab range in freefall. Seriously. Many times I’ve tried to get to ledge after recovering, just to fall straight past a ledge so close it looks like Lucas could reasonably just reach out and touch it. It isn’t ok. But anyways, PK Thunder 2 has an annoying tendency to snap to ledge before it does any of the damage it’s supposed to be good for. “Well why not use it onstage?” I don’t know, ask Sakurai why you’re forced to go 3/4 the length Final Destination every time you want to use it! Since PK Thunder 1 cannot go through the stage, you can’t angle PK Thunder 2 up at all, so it must always go straight left or right, and while Ness may be hurt by his shorter PK Thunder 2 length when he’s recovering, it gives him the ability to PK Thunder into somebody whenever he wants to onstage. “Well if it’s this much harder to pull off, it must do some insane knockback, right? Maybe even more than Ness!” No. “Equal to Ness?” Not even close. “60%?” No. “80?” No. “100?!” No. “120?!” Only if you’re lucky. Yeah. 120%. That’s about 80% more than Ness. Just to compare, all of Lucas’ smash attacks kill earlier, and in the case of up and down smash, WAY earlier. Every one of Lucas’ throws except Down Throw kill just one Down-air later than PK Thunder 2 does, and grab is way less situational *and* easier to land than PK Thunder 2. Back-Throw kills around the same percent actually. Lucas really does have a lot of moves that kill near 140, so I’ll just list them all off. F-tilt, Dash Attack, F-air, PK Fire, Up-air, B-air, (onstage, the spike obviously kills way earlier offstage. Also, fun fact: Lucas B-air and the Funny Forward Aerial™️ actually have the same knockback. Wouldn’t be too interesting if it was just the same knockback as somebody else’s meteor, but it’s funny that it’s the same as *the* funny move) and though I’m not fully sure, I think that Up-tilt does too. That’s a lot of stuff that’s all WAY safer and kills near the same percent. Also, I forgot about PK Freeze, which kills at 80%. I really don’t know know why I did this to myself for over an hour, especially since it’s my birthday and I have Melee in all it’s broken glory just waiting for me to play it. Normally I wouldn’t really want people to comment happy birthday, but if you’ve read all of this, I think you deserve to do whatever you want and comment whatever you want too. Cool.
@@intensellylit4100 Not top tier, with characters like Luigi and Game and Watch, but he is still really good. Though his up-air drops 50% of the time and his side b in the air just never kills.
As a Pit main, I already knew all this information but it still hurts. I know the devs see Pit as "well he's fast, had multiple jumps, and has a projectile. he's fine." but man does it suck. I always have to think "will all the hits of nair connect here?" or "is up air really worth trying here?" I wish they just patched multi hits a bit
He's actually not very fast at all. If Pit had good air and ground speed he would actually be a very good character despite some of his lackluster hitboxes, but in reality, he's kinda slow.
@@HONEST-xj4rr Your right, he's not particularly slow on the ground, though not particularly fast either. Air speed is often way more important for mobility though, so I still see him as a slow character overall.
Answer: NO, Up air is a terrible move if Pit is moving downwards so most of the time is better trying Up-Smash or N-air who actually work. When moving upwards should work I guess.
Honestly? The hitboxes actually seem really thematically accurate. Incredibly versatile, fast, and powerful, but obnoxiously inconsistent and unreliable? Sounds like Pit to me.
@@ZzShy That's cool but why does Ridley have such a bad recovery, why does his Down Air (a stall then fall btw), have no landing hitbox, on top of little power, spikes only at the start of the move, and has like 20 frames of endlag.
@@flamingpaper7751 Ridley's dair suuuuucks, its straight up one of the worst moves in the game tbh. And his recovery goes far but it gets destroyed by counters.
Fun fact: Side B doesn’t actually reflect, it just redirects. The projectile still belongs to the opponent, meaning they themselves still can’t hit by it, even if they jump into it. You can also hit it into your teammates in TA off doubles.
Jojo Mama I’ll look at a visualisation of up tilt Edit; the closest thing to a blind spot that I see is that it is vertically weak, but it looks normal on paper
Quick feedback: I would really like to see the moves being used in game after you explained them. It doesnt have to be a real montage with it being shown 20 times, just maybe 1-2 times in game or in training room, so you can see the knockback and angle you are talking about. And of course, its also nice to see what you mean by "the move doesnt work" like you did with fsmash. I really liked seeing HOW it doesnt work and what happens when it doesnt
Honestly, the biggest issue with Pit's hitboxes is not that they are all multihits. Those can easily be fixed, they have fixed quite a number of multihit moves. Is the fact that Pit's hitboxes are actually quite...small and have inconsistent weird properties to them. Like why are they afraid of using multilink hitboxes, why the hitboxes don't cover the whole sword, why is Pit fixed into having these weird "straight" boxes instead of having disjoints like actual swordies... If they could standarize Pit into his actual archetype, fix his multihits and perhaps add some extra flavor to his moves, he could be such a good character...
I fought a dark pit the other day on elite smash around 11.5 mil gsp. this lad not only made me question this entire video but ultimate's entire meta. never in my life. it's been over a week and this pit straight up gave me ptsd
alot of people are saying pit/dark mains are sad now but honestly im not sad. this is more of an "i told you so" moment. oh the many times ive seen these mains as well as myself on twitter saying how awful thes hitboxes are and every time we get told get good. now people are in the comments saying how awful they are and how they feel bad for us when weve been saying since release that this character feels off, like all of his moves either miss or arent consistent.
I was waiting for this one... I suppose Pit's hitboxes aren't necessarily inaccurate for the most part (though a few could stand to be extended to cover his entirely blade), but most of them are just really small and tight. For what is essentially a sword fighter, you see almost none of the usual vertical swipes represented in his hitboxes that you see with most of the others. I feel like F-tilt could stand to hit higher, for example. And Pit really struggled to hit most grounded opponents with aerials, too. It's a bit depressing to see how even actually having swords does not afford him all that much reach. This is also compounded by the fact that Pit is just plain weak. Awfully few of his moves feel like they do the damage and knockback they should, in my opinion.
Another thing to mention is how pit-iful his Down Air spike hitbox is in when connecting with a grounded opponent. I think it is the only spike hitbox in the game where your opponent actually recovers before you do making it almost useless until they are at like 100% when it starts to pop them up and can sometimes combo into fsmash or upsmash. It is literally the only thing I care about them fixing with this character despite most of the other things you brought to attention in this video
@@mordykinz4228 they also have grab ranges the size of micro bacteria and their smash attacks have so little lag that they are either using turbo mode or not
I just want to say that Pit’s dash grab and down air are secretly really good. Up smash is the only move I’d personally want fixed. Up tilt is hot garbage. Thank you for coming to my TED Talk and good night
You're right, the devs tried to balance him but failed horribly maybe the reason why his nair, fair and other attacks don't connect well is because they are trying to "balance" it by making it a good combo tool but also making the multihits inconsistent
I think that Pit is supposed to play in the air, like Sora in SSF2. The thing is Sora's moves are mostly single hits and actually work. It could be so cool to drap your opponent across the stage using multiple jumps and aerials. These hitboxes deny that.
Fair in especial. I understand having nair cover the whole blade can be a bit obnoxious but fair? I also don't see why people are anoyed for Pit having hitboxes that actualy match visuals when there is Joker's Arsene's and Ivysaur's hitboxes are even more obnoxious than Pit's nair with hitboxes matching the visuals. Just to say a few
How about Corrin's hitboxes? With her wacky dragon moves, I'm sure her hitboxes will be quite interesting to see (As well as being one of five people who mained Corrin from beginning of Ultimate, I want to see what I'm working with)
@@TwilightWonderer I'm not saying they are bad, I'm just saying that Corrin's animations are very unique, and I'm curious what hitboxes Nintendo added to these attacks.
People tend to underrate them because the pitboxes don't work "a lot of the time", when it really isn't the case. The clips you see from twitter or wherever here and there happen only a very small amount, really. The ones in the video are a thing, yes. But in an actual match, they work quite well and help with drag downs/combo extenders
@Axis of Resistance Comrade yeah, basically. The f-smash thing is probably due to the second hit being frame 21, so that's kinda slow compared to the move itself, since the first hit is frame 10. I do wish that they didn't make the orbitars shrink and for the side b reflectorbox to hit straight
Cosmetic fact, the pits can be holstering their bow blade thing in three ways. Holding both sides In two hands, holding it in bow fashion, and holding it in an inverted sort of the bow.
Dark Pit would be easily be top-tier if his Sweetspots took priority.. His 2 best moves (bair and dair) just don't work consistently. He might still be high-tier after all the buffs though. He can confirm pretty much anything into Up Air now and has a ton of combos and confirms on drag down aerials. Pit is just inferior unless you can gimp a character with his arrows, but I rarely use Arrows on the Pits in ultimate anyways. Also Pit's Aerial uppercut is too weak and isn't even safe on hit in a lot of situations.
YES! I've been waiting for this for a while. Poor Pit's hitboxes are just so bad. If they fixed them, I'm sure both would rise on the list again. I really like Kid Icarus and have always wanted to use Pit more seriously, but their hitbox inconsistencies are pretty disappointing. Wish they fixed them, because then I'd no doubt use them in bracket.
Would love to see you talk about Mii Brawler's hitboxes. An out there character I know, but there's a lot of really really questionable decisions made by whichever intern programmed their hitboxes that I think are fascinating.
Given my experience with fighting Pit online as a Toon Link main, I never would have imagined Pit's hitboxes are subpar. I can know exactly what a Pit main is going to know and when they're going to do it and still lose out in the exchange because against Toon Link, or at least the rushdown style Toon Link I play, Pit has a few moves that seem to me almost to versatile
I think Sakurai doesn't want to overtune the pits so people don't say he's biased because he directed kid icarus uprising, and probably those characters belong to him now
Pit is definitely one of those characters that I would recommend for newer players to smash as pit kinda does a bit of everything One of the best recoveries with several jumps and a terrific up b A projectile that can be guided (more or less depending on the fighter) A sideb for pretty good kill confirms (high up for pit, edge for dark pit) A good ol’ reflector (fuck you snake mains) And generally has good movement.
His recovery is actually not great considering how linear and predictable is. Especially since up b has no hitbox and also can’t grab the ledge for around 25ish frames. Also Side b has no confirms and is overall pretty mediocre. Edit: also this is coming from a pit main
This almost convinced me to drop out even though I just picked him up but if I get good at this I can show my friend this video to flex on him because I would’ve beaten him with this character with the bad hitboxes
3:08 OBJECTION. Pit's Up tilt has Knockback growth but is a really low one. It has all the tools for being a great combo starter except a functional Up-air to connect with.
I...don't have much issue connecting U-Air. Unless the enemy mashes like crazy the DI, it shouldn't fall off. U-Air can be confirmed into U-Tilt and D-Tilt and be an actual KO Confirm.
@@N12015 Yeah, Falling can be wonky. It's an issue because of the lack of autolink Angles. Hard to drag down an opponent into an Smash attack because of that.
@@MakoShiruba That's an Issue due to the red hitbox having massive knockback, the Purple hitbox having almost no knockback and the other ones sending diagonally instead of horizontally. Autolink aren't necesarily functional on the air, specially since those have not been adjusted to the new physics of ultimate (characters being overall faster and the baloon knockback), but are better than this mess.
One of the ugliest things (that weren't mentioned) are that the orbitals (reflectors) don't actually cover your legs hurt box from projectiles, of you are falling down while a projectile is coming it will always hit you even if the orbitals are up. So what's the point of a reflector that doesn't consistently reflects? If you compare the reflect detection boxes from smash wii u vs ultimate you can see they nerffed them in exchange for speed but like: wHaT
@@tryhardpenguin9636 Maybe it was me 😅 I try to find new uses to them, but still their reflection isn't the best when projectiles are coming from a little below. The reflector is pretty strong and it's capable to reflect a reflected proyectile. Still I hope the reflect detection box is fixed similar to smash wii u:/
Funny part is people would find a way to argue that he has something for every situation even tho it's not the best. A weak argument coming from people using do it all top tiers
I’m wondering why you talk about the move and then show footage unrelated to the move you just talked about afterwards. I was just thinking about it with the down air and thought maybe you didn’t manage to get a spike, but you did later in the video. Why not show examples of the moves against a character in a match after you talk about them instead of having random footage?
That was quite possibly just due to Brawl's much slower speeds than anything actually changing with the character and hitboxes. The faster things move the less reliable multihits get
Mii Gunner’s multihits are practically the exact opposite- They connect quite reliably, and when it doesn’t completely connect, its in your favor. (or not... I could be wrong)
Remember kids, these are the hitboxes of literal god slayers As a pit main im not even mad, im just disappointed that the hitboxes don't work. Im crossing my fingers next patch will have their at least some of the multi hits actually work, becuase as it stands none of them do and its almost like having a good recovery justifies them not having properly functional moves that are so predictable to the point people can make combos out of them.
“Almost makes you take pity on Pitty.” -Hades
That’s why hades is cool
Hades is amazing
Hades best character
Aerith: im gonna steal that
Hades for smash
Poor pit should’ve had palutena’s guidance on how to connect multihits
This comment from when I write this is the most underrated thing iv ever seen.
Pit: [Watching Joker's moves] "Wait, he can connect multi-hits?!"
Palutena: "I think the only one here who can't connect multi-hits is you."
Palutena is barely a help most of the time. With some characters like Little Mac or Olimar those are helpful, but with most of them like Mario, Megaman or Daisy...
Ink Strikes Back yo
Hey JoJo
Imagine making Palutena nair, making it actually work and then still proceeding to experiment with all other multihit aerials.
As if the devs wanted them not to work.
and Pikachu's
It's because they forgot about her. Why else has she not been nerfed. Jk.
Palutena nair is magnetic, absolutely crazy hitboxes
@@H4ri4n yeah and they also kinda forgot about the low tiers in smash bros ultimate(Ganondorf, Little Mac, and Dr.Mario)
@@ir-dan8524 Yeah, and look at the animation. They cling to the ends of her staff rather than having four different strength hitboxes that don't match the length of his bow.
Hes covered the wacky hit boxes of op dlc characters, then brings the disappointments that are my mains
Fellow Pit/DP mains, we hold a moment of silence for their hitboxes
*.*
amen
I don’t think they’re all that bad. Up smash is giving me problems though so amen for that one
...
@@micahrobbins8353 Pit/Pittoo's hitboxes are ok.
Pit mains watching this video: *Sadness*
Yeah it feels kinda sad
I mean u can kinda just put urself in the right situations and the mutihits will never whiff wutsoever. There are certain rules to them but its not that hard to follow and not rlly restrictive
@@animated855 yeah you are correct.
My day be so fine as a pit main then *BOOM* I remember some of my hitboxes are wack and opponents can potentially fall out of them
What do you mean Pit Mains?
“Multi hits generally don’t work”
*Palutena, Pikachu, and Joker laugh in multi hit*
EDIT: WE ARE TALKING ABOUT TOP TIERS PEOPLE!!
Lucas also has awesome multi-hits
Falco too.
Fuck characters that rely on those.
What about Sheik's up air?
@@kerokerocola99 so... screw pit/dark pit?
Johnny Joestar
Let me warn you, the following is long as heck, and covers every multi-hit Lucas has. Read at your own sanity’s risk.
N-air is ok, but can drop opponents. D-air is definitely a good multi-hit, and being a multi-hit actually makes it way better than it would’ve been if it wasn’t, because you can really drag people to near the blastzone and just kill at 0. Up-Smash doesn’t even feel like a real multi-hit, but I feel the need to mention it because sometimes weird stuff does happen and only the scoop hits. However, I feel like the size of the scoop hitbox is definitely compensation for not working a tiny fraction of time. That thing has nearly the same range as his F-Smash. D-Smash is only supposed to be a multi-hit on shields, but if you get the spacing right, you can connect two of the hits for some pretty sick damage. PK Fire is actually a double-hit. Not much more to say, but it does break Focus Attack’s armor. PK Thunder 1 has increased edgeguarding potential because of it not disappearing on hit, and it also makes it impossible to do the classic Ness edgeguard for all characters except for characters with an absorber or (to a lesser extent) reflector. However, PK Thunder 2 is where the good ends. It does a lot of damage, yeah, but you’ll rarely ever connect it all. Though it is, of course, an attack, it’s first and foremost a recovery option, so you almost always do it straight to the ledge, since it has a weird amount of landing lag and Lucas has a terrible ledge grab range in freefall. Seriously. Many times I’ve tried to get to ledge after recovering, just to fall straight past a ledge so close it looks like Lucas could reasonably just reach out and touch it. It isn’t ok. But anyways, PK Thunder 2 has an annoying tendency to snap to ledge before it does any of the damage it’s supposed to be good for. “Well why not use it onstage?” I don’t know, ask Sakurai why you’re forced to go 3/4 the length Final Destination every time you want to use it! Since PK Thunder 1 cannot go through the stage, you can’t angle PK Thunder 2 up at all, so it must always go straight left or right, and while Ness may be hurt by his shorter PK Thunder 2 length when he’s recovering, it gives him the ability to PK Thunder into somebody whenever he wants to onstage. “Well if it’s this much harder to pull off, it must do some insane knockback, right? Maybe even more than Ness!” No. “Equal to Ness?” Not even close. “60%?” No. “80?” No. “100?!” No. “120?!” Only if you’re lucky. Yeah. 120%. That’s about 80% more than Ness. Just to compare, all of Lucas’ smash attacks kill earlier, and in the case of up and down smash, WAY earlier. Every one of Lucas’ throws except Down Throw kill just one Down-air later than PK Thunder 2 does, and grab is way less situational *and* easier to land than PK Thunder 2. Back-Throw kills around the same percent actually. Lucas really does have a lot of moves that kill near 140, so I’ll just list them all off. F-tilt, Dash Attack, F-air, PK Fire, Up-air, B-air, (onstage, the spike obviously kills way earlier offstage. Also, fun fact: Lucas B-air and the Funny Forward Aerial™️ actually have the same knockback. Wouldn’t be too interesting if it was just the same knockback as somebody else’s meteor, but it’s funny that it’s the same as *the* funny move) and though I’m not fully sure, I think that Up-tilt does too. That’s a lot of stuff that’s all WAY safer and kills near the same percent. Also, I forgot about PK Freeze, which kills at 80%.
I really don’t know know why I did this to myself for over an hour, especially since it’s my birthday and I have Melee in all it’s broken glory just waiting for me to play it. Normally I wouldn’t really want people to comment happy birthday, but if you’ve read all of this, I think you deserve to do whatever you want and comment whatever you want too. Cool.
Pit and Dark Pit’s hitboxes give me depression...
Go play SSF2 while he's still top tier lol
@Intenselly LIt
I play him in both games and man, you can just feel how much better he is SSF2
@@intensellylit4100 Not top tier, with characters like Luigi and Game and Watch, but he is still really good. Though his up-air drops 50% of the time and his side b in the air just never kills.
Same ·-·
Me: hits dark pit up air
Opponent: falls out and kills me for hitting my move.
Me: ummmmmmmm
man this feels like as close as we’re going to get to a mockrock rekzius collab, two amazing and criminally underrated smash channels
^
>
,
As a Pit main, I already knew all this information but it still hurts. I know the devs see Pit as "well he's fast, had multiple jumps, and has a projectile. he's fine." but man does it suck. I always have to think "will all the hits of nair connect here?" or "is up air really worth trying here?" I wish they just patched multi hits a bit
They have multiple times, release day Pit/Dark Pit was dark times filled with opponents flying out of their moves constantly
He's actually not very fast at all. If Pit had good air and ground speed he would actually be a very good character despite some of his lackluster hitboxes, but in reality, he's kinda slow.
Brian Muir He’s only slow in the air
@@HONEST-xj4rr Your right, he's not particularly slow on the ground, though not particularly fast either. Air speed is often way more important for mobility though, so I still see him as a slow character overall.
Answer: NO, Up air is a terrible move if Pit is moving downwards so most of the time is better trying Up-Smash or N-air who actually work. When moving upwards should work I guess.
He did it. Pit’s pitiful hitboxes is here. I can die happy now
Good pun
The struggle of fellow pit mains 😔
I feel ya
Indeed...indeed
Yeppers
Ssf2 Pit: You're weak
Ultimate Pit: I'm you
Honestly? The hitboxes actually seem really thematically accurate. Incredibly versatile, fast, and powerful, but obnoxiously inconsistent and unreliable? Sounds like Pit to me.
@@michaelmodernsonicfan5341 did people ask you to exist? No, so why are you here right now?
Honestly pit is super reliable after all of the stuff he goes through
Ridley's ridiculous/radical/rhetorical/neat/whatever hitboxes when
Wtf is a rhetorical hitbox
@@papieverett "Why is this frame data so bad?"
@@flamingpaper7751 its bad because Ridley has so much range that despite being bad theyre still mostly safe when spaced well anyway
@@ZzShy That's cool but why does Ridley have such a bad recovery, why does his Down Air (a stall then fall btw), have no landing hitbox, on top of little power, spikes only at the start of the move, and has like 20 frames of endlag.
@@flamingpaper7751 Ridley's dair suuuuucks, its straight up one of the worst moves in the game tbh. And his recovery goes far but it gets destroyed by counters.
Fun fact: Side B doesn’t actually reflect, it just redirects. The projectile still belongs to the opponent, meaning they themselves still can’t hit by it, even if they jump into it. You can also hit it into your teammates in TA off doubles.
bruh they made pit even worse then it needed to be
Fair doesnt even cover the whole thing
😔
And it was buffed from smash 4 in terms of area covered by almost double radio.
Fernando Vasquez Yeah it was painfully smaller in Sm4sh
Neither does nair.
It finally happened.
The joke is complete
Fun fact:You can actually use Dark Pit/Pit’s Down B to block some opponents from getting to the stage if they recover above the ledge.
MockRock is watching this crying.
I need King K. Rool's Klunky Hitboxes, I need to see his problematic Up Tilt, BAir and FSmash
Pretty Kool Crocodile idk but up tilt seems pretty solid, bair sour spot sucks tho and f smash sucks in general
Conrad Gude-Martinez uptilt has a blindspot
Jojo Mama I’ll look at a visualisation of up tilt
Edit; the closest thing to a blind spot that I see is that it is vertically weak, but it looks normal on paper
f smash is pretty powerful but literally everything else about it sucks
I agree. F smash is way too small, I can tell just by playing against k rool
Quick feedback: I would really like to see the moves being used in game after you explained them. It doesnt have to be a real montage with it being shown 20 times, just maybe 1-2 times in game or in training room, so you can see the knockback and angle you are talking about. And of course, its also nice to see what you mean by "the move doesnt work" like you did with fsmash. I really liked seeing HOW it doesnt work and what happens when it doesnt
Agreed that would be very helpful
(Yes I'm aware it's been two years, I'd still agree with you twenty years from now)
Honestly, the biggest issue with Pit's hitboxes is not that they are all multihits. Those can easily be fixed, they have fixed quite a number of multihit moves. Is the fact that Pit's hitboxes are actually quite...small and have inconsistent weird properties to them. Like why are they afraid of using multilink hitboxes, why the hitboxes don't cover the whole sword, why is Pit fixed into having these weird "straight" boxes instead of having disjoints like actual swordies...
If they could standarize Pit into his actual archetype, fix his multihits and perhaps add some extra flavor to his moves, he could be such a good character...
I guess you could say their hitboxes...
...are the pits.
**laugh track**
if i had to summarize playing pit / dark pit in SSBU, I would say they are "consistently inconsistent"
I fought a dark pit the other day on elite smash around 11.5 mil gsp. this lad not only made me question this entire video but ultimate's entire meta. never in my life. it's been over a week and this pit straight up gave me ptsd
alot of people are saying pit/dark mains are sad now but honestly im not sad. this is more of an "i told you so" moment. oh the many times ive seen these mains as well as myself on twitter saying how awful thes hitboxes are and every time we get told get good. now people are in the comments saying how awful they are and how they feel bad for us when weve been saying since release that this character feels off, like all of his moves either miss or arent consistent.
I was waiting for this one...
I suppose Pit's hitboxes aren't necessarily inaccurate for the most part (though a few could stand to be extended to cover his entirely blade), but most of them are just really small and tight. For what is essentially a sword fighter, you see almost none of the usual vertical swipes represented in his hitboxes that you see with most of the others. I feel like F-tilt could stand to hit higher, for example. And Pit really struggled to hit most grounded opponents with aerials, too. It's a bit depressing to see how even actually having swords does not afford him all that much reach.
This is also compounded by the fact that Pit is just plain weak. Awfully few of his moves feel like they do the damage and knockback they should, in my opinion.
Pit's weak?? 😂😂 careful, that almost made your entire statement invalid. seriously.
@@courdell7426 Elaborate.
Pls just give him back the brawl fair
MetroidPrincess Fr
How is this channel not getting 1k views seconds after uploading
Is it just me or are there random pictures of marth hidden throughout the video?
What? Where?
at 12:54 look at the right of min mins picture
jokes based on how marth’s hitboxes for the tippers are also really bad, similar to pit’s hitboxes
@@Ri-Dye that looks more like shanna than marth
Bowser jr.'s baffling, janky hitboxes
Imagine having too many multihits that dont work. This post was brought to you by the Kid icarus gang.
Another thing to mention is how pit-iful his Down Air spike hitbox is in when connecting with a grounded opponent. I think it is the only spike hitbox in the game where your opponent actually recovers before you do making it almost useless until they are at like 100% when it starts to pop them up and can sometimes combo into fsmash or upsmash. It is literally the only thing I care about them fixing with this character despite most of the other things you brought to attention in this video
The amount of time watching this gave me enough time to learn how to read.
i once won a Quickplay match just by spamming Dark Pit down smash XD
Their smash attacks are deceptively fast and strong.
@@mordykinz4228 they also have grab ranges the size of micro bacteria and their smash attacks have so little lag that they are either using turbo mode or not
best title.
i'm loving how all of your titles are aliterations. Belmont's Bizarre Hitboxes, Byleth's Baffling..., Pit's Pitiful...
I have been waiting for this thank you for covering them!
I just want to say that Pit’s dash grab and down air are secretly really good. Up smash is the only move I’d personally want fixed. Up tilt is hot garbage. Thank you for coming to my TED Talk and good night
My family agrees that pit is balanced in a bad way he's overbalanced.
You're right, the devs tried to balance him but failed horribly maybe the reason why his nair, fair and other attacks don't connect well is because they are trying to "balance" it by making it a good combo tool but also making the multihits inconsistent
In Pit's own words, "Curse you, balanced gameplay!"
They actually fixed all of his hitboxes now.
Dark Pit and Pit now have 2 new kill confirms. 3 in total
Reizius:a character with multiple jumps and a good spike would be broken
Me: laughes in poyo
I think that Pit is supposed to play in the air, like Sora in SSF2. The thing is Sora's moves are mostly single hits and actually work. It could be so cool to drap your opponent across the stage using multiple jumps and aerials. These hitboxes deny that.
Been a while since I've been this sad 😥
yes, multi hits don’t always connect, but could you imagine if they were command grabs?
Honestly, I wanna see Fox's hitboxes. His forward air would be super interesting to talk aboit
Still holding out for the Mii Fighters.
Yall saying pits hitboxes are bad...
*Have* *you* *seen* *robins?*
Look at that ridiculous foward air hitbox sakurai what are you doing
As a pit main, they just needs increase the fair and nair hitboxes to cover the blades. Anything else to me is just extra.
Fair in especial. I understand having nair cover the whole blade can be a bit obnoxious but fair? I also don't see why people are anoyed for Pit having hitboxes that actualy match visuals when there is Joker's Arsene's and Ivysaur's hitboxes are even more obnoxious than Pit's nair with hitboxes matching the visuals. Just to say a few
At long last, a new hitbox video!
How about Corrin's hitboxes? With her wacky dragon moves, I'm sure her hitboxes will be quite interesting to see (As well as being one of five people who mained Corrin from beginning of Ultimate, I want to see what I'm working with)
Corrins moves actually work tho and he/she doesn’t really have any problems. Sometimes Dragon fang shot has its issues.
@@TwilightWonderer I'm not saying they are bad, I'm just saying that Corrin's animations are very unique, and I'm curious what hitboxes Nintendo added to these attacks.
UltimateFrameData.com
I'm excited you finally got around to making this one.
Pit’s Up Smash needs a fix like damn. I miss so many kills.
As a dark pit main, I can safely tell you that their hitboxes are just, not
If the pits had good or decent hitboxes, they'd be top tier
one more thing to put in my box of information i'll never use
People tend to underrate them because the pitboxes don't work "a lot of the time", when it really isn't the case. The clips you see from twitter or wherever here and there happen only a very small amount, really. The ones in the video are a thing, yes. But in an actual match, they work quite well and help with drag downs/combo extenders
@Axis of Resistance Comrade yeah, basically. The f-smash thing is probably due to the second hit being frame 21, so that's kinda slow compared to the move itself, since the first hit is frame 10. I do wish that they didn't make the orbitars shrink and for the side b reflectorbox to hit straight
The pain of a pit main
Yeah I can agree that pivot grabs aren't very useful in this game.
Unless you're Bowser. Whose pivot grab grants him near double range.
As a Pit main I can confirm it do be like this.
Cosmetic fact, the pits can be holstering their bow blade thing in three ways. Holding both sides In two hands, holding it in bow fashion, and holding it in an inverted sort of the bow.
Palutena’s guidance: i sleep.
Rekzius’s guidance: real sh**
Bit of an underselling on the pretty good frame data and kill power the smashes have
'having characters with multiple jumps and good aerials has burned them in the past'
Brawl meta knight: *exists*
Peach’s princess or privileged hit boxes
Dark Pit would be easily be top-tier if his Sweetspots took priority.. His 2 best moves (bair and dair) just don't work consistently.
He might still be high-tier after all the buffs though. He can confirm pretty much anything into Up Air now and has a ton of combos and confirms on drag down aerials.
Pit is just inferior unless you can gimp a character with his arrows, but I rarely use Arrows on the Pits in ultimate anyways. Also Pit's Aerial uppercut is too weak and isn't even safe on hit in a lot of situations.
YES! I've been waiting for this for a while.
Poor Pit's hitboxes are just so bad. If they fixed them, I'm sure both would rise on the list again. I really like Kid Icarus and have always wanted to use Pit more seriously, but their hitbox inconsistencies are pretty disappointing. Wish they fixed them, because then I'd no doubt use them in bracket.
I just realized dark pit has a bow and a half when he dash attacks
Would love to see you talk about Mii Brawler's hitboxes. An out there character I know, but there's a lot of really really questionable decisions made by whichever intern programmed their hitboxes that I think are fascinating.
Out of all these videos I've seen, this one has the most accurate title.
Sakurai doesn't want to show favoritism, but I think he should make his own characters busted
me: *runs offstage and uses neutral air, without fastfalling so as to avoid dropout*
opponent: drops out
me: why have I done this to myself again
For all my time playing Pit, I always thought Up Tilt was 4 hits instead of 2, and now that I've seen it in slow-mo, idk how I ever saw multiple hits.
The main sad part left out is the fact that for a lot of moves, not even the entire blade is covered by a hitbox lmao
Given my experience with fighting Pit online as a Toon Link main, I never would have imagined Pit's hitboxes are subpar. I can know exactly what a Pit main is going to know and when they're going to do it and still lose out in the exchange because against Toon Link, or at least the rushdown style Toon Link I play, Pit has a few moves that seem to me almost to versatile
Honestly, I have been playing both of them (mainly DP) and I basically never have problems.
META KNIGHT on the other hand...
I think Sakurai doesn't want to overtune the pits so people don't say he's biased because he directed kid icarus uprising, and probably those characters belong to him now
Well Palutena is really good in this game so that doesn't really make sense
@@GabrielAidley that's probably to make up for how much she sucked in smash 4
What Nintendo needs to do is give Pit’s Multihits the Mach Tornado treatment.
For some reason. I've had quite a good time with these aerials (Connecting, up air kills... I'm talking about before the Pits buffs)
Pit is definitely one of those characters that I would recommend for newer players to smash as pit kinda does a bit of everything
One of the best recoveries with
several jumps and a terrific up b
A projectile that can be guided (more or less depending on the fighter)
A sideb for pretty good kill confirms (high up for pit, edge for dark pit)
A good ol’ reflector (fuck you snake mains)
And generally has good movement.
His recovery is actually not great considering how linear and predictable is. Especially since up b has no hitbox and also can’t grab the ledge for around 25ish frames. Also Side b has no confirms and is overall pretty mediocre.
Edit: also this is coming from a pit main
This almost convinced me to drop out even though I just picked him up but if I get good at this I can show my friend this video to flex on him because I would’ve beaten him with this character with the bad hitboxes
“Oh what a pitty for pitty”
That fair is 80% as big as it should be, no wonder it never lands when it should
As I guy who thinks the pits are my best fighter even tho I don’t main them. This is hurts
3:08 OBJECTION. Pit's Up tilt has Knockback growth but is a really low one. It has all the tools for being a great combo starter except a functional Up-air to connect with.
I...don't have much issue connecting U-Air. Unless the enemy mashes like crazy the DI, it shouldn't fall off. U-Air can be confirmed into U-Tilt and D-Tilt and be an actual KO Confirm.
@@MakoShiruba Sorry, I forgot that FALLING up air is the one who is not functional, while the rising one is decent enough.
@@N12015 Yeah, Falling can be wonky. It's an issue because of the lack of autolink Angles. Hard to drag down an opponent into an Smash attack because of that.
@@MakoShiruba That's an Issue due to the red hitbox having massive knockback, the Purple hitbox having almost no knockback and the other ones sending diagonally instead of horizontally. Autolink aren't necesarily functional on the air, specially since those have not been adjusted to the new physics of ultimate (characters being overall faster and the baloon knockback), but are better than this mess.
One of the ugliest things (that weren't mentioned) are that the orbitals (reflectors) don't actually cover your legs hurt box from projectiles, of you are falling down while a projectile is coming it will always hit you even if the orbitals are up. So what's the point of a reflector that doesn't consistently reflects?
If you compare the reflect detection boxes from smash wii u vs ultimate you can see they nerffed them in exchange for speed but like: wHaT
I’ve played against a pit main and after a bit I noticed that the orbiters are basically a better shield and a free punish, even if it breaks.
@@tryhardpenguin9636 Maybe it was me 😅
I try to find new uses to them, but still their reflection isn't the best when projectiles are coming from a little below. The reflector is pretty strong and it's capable to reflect a reflected proyectile. Still I hope the reflect detection box is fixed similar to smash wii u:/
If you don’t refer to Dark Pit as Pittoo, you’re playing him wrong
Seeing the size of all of these hit boxes after seeing the dlcs characters I still can't believe how much money influences hitboxes 😅
These characters have to work fairly hard for their kills. They have zero jank in a game where jank wins you games.
Funny part is people would find a way to argue that he has something for every situation even tho it's not the best. A weak argument coming from people using do it all top tiers
Been waiting for this video with this exact title
what a pity watching a cool character have poopooo hitboxes
Oh HECK yeah my mains video!....oh
As a diehard pit main his whole character is “too bad it doesn’t work”
Pit would honestly be kinda insane if his hitboxes were made by the dlc team instead of the interns.
Just imagine Byleth with long lasting aerials and a curving projectile
I’m wondering why you talk about the move and then show footage unrelated to the move you just talked about afterwards. I was just thinking about it with the down air and thought maybe you didn’t manage to get a spike, but you did later in the video. Why not show examples of the moves against a character in a match after you talk about them instead of having random footage?
I remember in Brawl, Pit's hitboxes were actually good and connected well. Then Smash 4 came and ruined everything. =^/
That was quite possibly just due to Brawl's much slower speeds than anything actually changing with the character and hitboxes. The faster things move the less reliable multihits get
@@ElecManEXE No. Have you even looked at Brawl Pit's hitboxes and framedata? Your reply was very bold.
4xzx4 I tried but can't find visualizations of them. But of all I see they seem to work... better
I love pit, but holy crap his hitboxes could be buffed and I don't think anyone would complain
Mii Gunner’s multihits are practically the exact opposite-
They connect quite reliably, and when it doesn’t completely connect, its in your favor. (or not... I could be wrong)
Context for not reliably connecting...
First, drag down aerials.
Second, Upsmash superlaunching jank.
Remember kids, these are the hitboxes of literal god slayers
As a pit main im not even mad, im just disappointed that the hitboxes don't work. Im crossing my fingers next patch will have their at least some of the multi hits actually work, becuase as it stands none of them do and its almost like having a good recovery justifies them not having properly functional moves that are so predictable to the point people can make combos out of them.