Fedora Silverblue: is this the FUTURE of Linux? - Project of the Month
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- Опубліковано 15 чер 2024
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This time, we're going to take a look at Fedora, but not the mainline release, its flatpak and ostree based spinoff called Silverblue. It's an interesting distro, not in terms of desktop experience, but in terms of its internal workings, which are different from about all other distros. let's take a look !
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Silverblue is what was previously called Fedora Atomic workstation. It's waht they call an immutable OS, as in: you can't touch the system files. It is delivered using images built with rpm-ostree. This tool allows people to make bootable, read-only OS images and manage them just like they would their code repository, by committing their changes and pushing out updates, instead of relying on regular packages. This bootable image can be combined with packaging systems to add stuff to it, but the base image is immutable and can't be changed by the user, which limits greatly the risk of breaking stuff.
Silverblue allows you to focus on your work and not on the OS: if there's an update, you just reboot to the new image, and you're good to go. If the new image doesn't work for you? You just revert to the older one and keep on working. No dependencies to solve, or packages to downgrade, you just restore the previous version.
If you want to move to a development release to test some new stuff, you also can, and you can switch back to your production system anytime you want. It's really secure, stable, and make the whole OS basically indestructible.
From the outside, there is no real difference from the regular current release of Fedora: it's a gnome based distro, which looks like vanilla gnome. The main difference is that you won't get the DNF package manager by default. Silverblue uses Flatpak to install graphical applications. For now, the base system includes all the default apps in the system image, but these will be transfered to flatpaks to make the system image as small as possible and ensure speedy updates.
You can, however, install your good old packages using rpm-ostree, but it's not really recommended: these packages will be added to the system image, and this image will need to be rebuilt at every update, which will take time, and can basically negate the advantages of ostree by introducing conflicts and issues.
Your system always keeps the current system image you're using, and the previous one, but if you want to pin other images, you can, so you can restart to any version of your system that you'd like!
There's an interesting side effect to this "immutable" model: if the most popular distro agreed on a similar base, and just shipped the rest of their software and differenciating elements as flatpaks or layered packages, Linux could have a stable, identical target for developers. his could bring more third party developers on board, as it would make the OS a lot easier to support. Of course, this is pure conjecture, since Silverblue is based on rpm-ostree, so debian based distros wouldn't be able to jump on the bandwagon anyway without some serious restructuring.
The most obvious one is the package installation: if you need something other than an application, and isn't provided in the base system image, you'll need to add a package. Fonts, for example, are installed using RPMS. This means that you'll have to use the rpm-ostree command to add the package to the base system, rebuilt the image, and reboot to that new image to benefit from the fonts, since the system image isn't writable: you can't add stuff to it while it's running.
You'll also have an issue if you want to run Chrome: as it's not available as a flatpak, and you can't install it as a layered package on top of the iamge, since it writes stuff in non standard directories. You'll have to use Firefox, or Chromium on Silverblue for now. That's not an issue for me, as I dislike Chrome, and use Firefox, but other users might not have the same experience.
Developers might also be faced with an issue: if they want to mess around with their system files, they'll hit a roadblock, since the filesystem is read only ond immutable. THat's why the silverblue team added toolboxes. A toolbox is basically a container where you can run a regular OS and tweak it as you like. For example, you could create t toolbox running the latest fedora workstation, and iteract with that system to change it and modify what you need to change, all while running Silverblue on your machine for maximum stability and security. - Наука та технологія
Wow it looks like Fedora is attacking Windows where it's weakest, UPDATES!
OMG really? They're attacking Windows where they're weakest. So they're attacking Vista and early Windows 7?
Because every distro of Linux spends more time updating and having update problems than Windows since Window 8.
But you wouldn't know that as everyone who uses updates to fangirl for Linux and have a go at Windows doesn't know anything about Windows and probably hasn't used it for over 10 years.
@@MaffeyZilog wtf are you talking about?
@@chilldude1337 I keep looking through my comment for any grammatical errors or lack of cohesion.
But it's really self explanatory and written without ambiguity whatsoever.
So, mate, you're going to have to be a tad more specific as to the 'wtf' I'm taking about if you want an answer, as it's certainly you who has failed to understand a well written and easy to comprehend comment.
Point out the specifics and I'll try and answer as succinct and specific (that means I'll answer the question if you ask a question about a part that you didn't understand).
I look forward to a proper question.
@@MaffeyZilog maybe you could have been more specific
Lol. Keep dreaming like y'all have been doing for the last 30 years. Windows is going to be the PC OS for the masses like it has always been. You can live your 1% market share neck beard incel life like before.
This sounds delicious for businesses. This could hurt windows in the long run.
Absolutely fantastic for companies, yeah!
It does in the sense it will definitely be more stable, secure and helpful if something does really go bad, you can just boot the previous image. The main hurdle will always be employees and programs like office.
Definitely for POS or any other frontend system. For some offices though it's too restrictive. My company lets users install software directly from a curated software center on the fly, as users' roles are too dynamic to keep everyone on the same fixed image
@@hyperspeed1313 You shouldn't have any issues if you have a couple of experienced sysadmins.
As long as there is no office nothing will hurt windows.
What I see also as a probable use case is some older laptop that everyone in the household is just using for watching youtube videos, streaming and browsing the web a bit.
That would be a solid use case
It sounds perfect for my grandma.
Definitely sounds great for front line machines....factory assembly lines, airport gate agents, POS, etc
going back to your old videos makes me realise how much you've improved! keep going!
Oh yeah, I refuse to re-watch these, they make me cringe 😅
Silverblue will be a Red Hat's perfect product to offer solutions for companies in the future!
Ugly distro, Linux is superior to Windows because open files can be overwritten on disk. That is the reason it can update itself without rebooting.
Terrible as a server, as every update requires a reboot.
@@maynnemillares One of SilverBlue's long term goals is to update without needing as many reboots as it currently does. If they can get it working, then it will be a rock-solid workstation. IIRC, Fedora CoreOS is meant to be the future implementation of servers.
@@hermanwooster8944
Tell me what he is talking about ?
@@maynnemillares Kernel updates aren't actually used until reboot so I don't know what the fuck you're talking about.
Thank you! I'm new to linux and heard about "Layered Packages", "Toolbox" and easy rollback of kernel versions. I wanted to know that its all about and this video cleared up a lot for me. I now have a good image of what these things are and in what context they're used. Again: Thank you!
Ubuntu has this concept long back on iot based os images. The concept did not clicked at that time.
Yep, they have a history of releasing stuff too early
"clicked" i see what you did there
@@TheLinuxEXP They should have designed basic security into SNAPS before unleashing the potential disaster on the world.
@@TheLinuxEXP Canonical also have a habit of releasing premature software (eg Snap).
@@pixelPlex Because they don't keep dreaming. Flutter apps coming to Ubuntu..
I love Silverblue, it's my main OS since about 2 years. ❤️
I do all my development on it via Flatpak SDKs, play via Steam, GOG to Flatpak converters etc.
For my use case I don't care about having to reboot, I installed a handful of RPMs when I installed the OS, rebooted, and never had to think about it again as I power my PC on every morning.
I do everything in virtualbox, which is a snap package. Inside virtual box I run docker, which is a flatpak package. Inside docker I run qemu, which is an appimage package. Inside qemu I run another docker flatpak which has my actual programs that I use.
@coffee Wow, I didn't know I was that powerful.
Same for me here, steam, go development, several containers for „stuff“. Works like a charm since f30
@coffee there's a Linux distro for everybody, isn't that the point of Linux?
@coffee oh wow, so you're the Messiah of Linux? Illustrate your so called "Doom"
After using Fedora Silverblue for about 2 years I can finally say it's the FUTURE of Desktop OS
@Yann BOYER dnf install gcc?
Never had any issues installing a compiler in a toolbox. Have been oompiling plenty of stuff from source within a container.
I think it is indeed the future of linux in many ways. I really like the concept of having apps running separately from the rest of the system and I really like the idea of an "untouchable" core system that cannot be corrupted in any way. There are of course still challenges to be addressed (how to manage additional drivers that may not be included in the kernel... like nvidia drivers?) but I really like the idea and I think it will really disrupt our Linux desktops.
After watching the Linux Tech Tips Linux X deletion debacle, I was looking around for OS that could fix that problem. This is absolutely how Linux should look in the future. Users shouldn't be fucking with the system unless they know what they're doing.
Granted, this ends up with the same problem that you hit in Windows/MacOS where you trust the maintainer. But if the maintainer is also opensource, they can't just hide shit (forever).
And immutable system that's only updated by the maintainers is the way forward.
Installing Apps shouldn't break your fucking entire system.
@@SinistralEpoch the upcoming Steam OS 3 will also using similar technology. The base OS will be immutable. Steam will be separate from the base OS. Flatpak is the recommended way to install app. Although you can use appimage and other method also.
@@JahidulIslam That's fucking brilliant if the upcoming SteamOS base is immutable.
for development workspaces i use docker dev containers anyway
and i only use flatpak stuff, and restrict their permissions if they by default have access too many things
i like how new flatpak lets you open files with a flatpak app that normally dont have access to any files in the system
its like if the app says, "i wanna access this", flatpak says "no" to the app, but if the user says, "open this file/folder with this flatpak app", then flatpak gives permissions to that file only,
it also uses file/folder selection dialog boxes to give permissions too, which is really cool, so app cant access anything, read or write without user input,
its almost seamless, you dont even realize the app normally dont have access to that file
The idea is likeable definitely, but I also don't see myself using it (not even close) in its current state. It is nice to see innovation, let's see where it goes from here.
Absolutely agree
You can install Davinci Resolve in Sliverblue. babywouge has a video about it./opt is writable in Silverblue. So anything that gets installed in /opt should work with Silverblue. Fedora also offer google chrome repo right from the gnome software repository option. You just need to enable it like you do for steam and nvidia driver.
this was very informative, thank you... I feel that this is a really interesting technology approach... when more apps are distributed as flatpak you will restart the system only once in the while.
Yes it is the future. You can see good implementation of immutable system already in macOS catalina, people don't even know that main installation is read only :) Also dmg images are similar to flatpaks with runtime permissions.
You can install any package using "toolbox", which are containers in which you install a small fedora image that has dnf and can install and run gui apps too; but as you said it's true that the performance might be a bit worse
It's updates mechanism reminds me of how custom android rom's update being shipped.
Yeah it's kind of the same
FYI: You can still enable third-party repositories like rpmfusion, chrome, vscode or copr's by copying their .repo file to /etc/yum.repos.d. Chrome and VSCode work as expected as a layer package. This is basically the only/best way to use the proprietary NVIDIA driver on SB - which works like a charm on Silverblue 32.
For an example see rpmfusion.org/Configuration#Command_Line_Setup_using_rpm & rpmfusion.org/Howto/NVIDIA#Silverblue
Nice, I didn't know !
@@TheLinuxEXP I would really enjoy a follow up video. I think Silverblue is so new, that misconceptions are very common.
Imagine running chrome and vscode, sad
Thank you, Nick. I've been following their mailing list. It's interesting.
You're welcome :) I need to take a look at that to see where they're taking this next
This is a very interesting concept! 🙂
I wonder if you could mount and chroot into the next image?
This could be the iOS/Android equivalent to PC I've been waiting for. It's far from ready but it could be what PCs in every home in the world runs whenever the technology is ready. I am happy with my Android devices but there's no true Android equivalent for PC yet. Trust me when I say, Fedora Silverblue is on to something good. The only thing we need to do is get the switch from "MS-DOS" to "NT" in the Linux world and I could finally actually recommend a dream OS to all my friends and relatives. Even Windows is off the table for me.
This is the first time I am hearing about silverblue, and it is definitely not something I would want on my personal desktop. One of the reasons I have is regarding backups. As a single user, I would like all packages as part of system and all configurations as part of the user and it becomes really convenient to have a system backup using timeshift. For this reason, I personally prefer the manjaro/arch format of using repos or compiling and still installing via the package manager to the system.
That being said, I would love this to be rolled out in my institute. I loved the point you made about company wide updates. It would solve all the dependency hell issues which arise out of not having sudo access in work computers and clusters (especially things which don't update for ages out of fear of incompatibility), and I would prefer something like this where all the packages are not part of the system or it's updates. I wish flatpak or this format of distros become more popular for that, as it saves a lot of time.
Quick note: as far as I know and tried on this disto, you don't need to use sudo for "rpm-ostree install"
That's good to know !
love your channel. this video is amazing, thank you very much :D
Thanks for taking a look at it and explaining it to us! I have no idea if this is the future but you have to admit, having the freedom to explore such new concepts is pretty cool and in the ethos of Linux and open source.
Great review! I've used Silverblue and indeed reboots are a throwback in the past. I've been thinking about this and maybe we're not using it correctly? In my case most apps that has been installed through ostree-rpm was CLI tools. For those, maybe Docker could solve this? No need to reboot with this!
One thing I really like about Silverblue is that we don't need root to update the apps anymore :D. I have switched my grandmother on Linux (Elementary OS) and she never updated, because it was a manual process with a password prompt.
Flathub has some CLI apps. Vim, ffmpeg are available in flathub repo.
This sounds like an absolute nightmare. I really hope this doesn't catch on.
finally someone who can see the problem
If you install flatpak apps as user apps in a separate home partition, you potentially have a portable collection of apps. As long as your home partition and user are same, you can use the same set of flatpak applications across different distro.
If I am not mistaken, Silverblue allows users to create containers of many (current and previous) versions of Fedora Workstation within the booted system image... at runtime. Although intended primarily for development of software, users could use containers for compatibility with legacy software, in addition to developing for legacy systems. The containers (potentially) provide a way to isolate activities, without creating “new” ostree images.
I never tested that hypothesis while testing Silverblue 30, summer of 2019. I abandoned the idea of using it at as daily driver within a day of installing it. The issues Nick mentions in the video represent just some of those I encountered. I agree completely with his assessment of Silverblue’s target: enterprise organizations. Most desktop Linux users would struggle to find either the software they want to install, or use-cases for its primary features. And, low popularity of a distro tends toward low community support.
It’s a shame. The concept is exciting. In practice, however, I was left feeling, “Now what?”
Answer: Try another distro. :-)
That's always the answer when boredom settles in :)
I am wondering if future Linux version will consist of a base system running a KVM (Virtual Machines). All one has to do is prepare the new virtual machine (Fedora xx.n), and with a few commands, terminate the current version and start the previous version (Fedora xx.n-1).
Using a virtual machine with very very minimal functionality (load/unload/ of VMs), one could do a better job than Silverblue. In my mind, with VMs, there is much less confusion, much less disruption, and recovery will be much quicker and easier. In particular, I am looking at interconnections of distributions and loosely coupled architecture.
For on-line use, I could not appreciate a half hour time to restore a system.
Yes, for example, in high availability, banking systems are duplicated. Switch to the alternate system was done on Sunday's at 2 am. I seek VMs as much more practical and superior.
Thats my two cents worth. SilverBlue is great for Linux maintainers, but not necessarily so for end-user implementations. I did test Silverblue for a week, and compared it to Clear Linux; neither appealed to me. Each has it's advantages and drawbacks.
Best review on Fedora distro. All I saw before is people showing wallpapers.
Hahaha well that sets the bar pretty low then 😅
I'm not sure but i think that something similar to Silverblue is EasyOS and its SFS packages, debian repository and possibility to make containers.
To upgrade system you just need to replace three files and run one of them.
It is the system that is created by Barry Kauler (creator of puppy linux).
thought about the same Daniel, and believe it goes way back to Slackware where packages could be added as an overlay module to a running system and squashed quite a bit size wise. Still around in Puppy, SLAX, Slitaz and similar distros.
I use Silverblue and it is great on the desktop. Problem still is the install of printers and scanners. Still have to find out how to do that.
Could this setup be useful for cloud or installing on company servers an offering to tons of users with streaming? Desktop As A Service, I think it's called.
btw, didn't Nitrux use znx, that was about deploying and managing the OS a single file? There still is content on this around but I can't find any newer info on it and the page on github seems to have been deleted
Yes, team behind Nistrux is going towards quite similar idea, but I think their approach is little mor flexible - znx for frugal install of OS, using APT to manage .deb packages (on top of OS), and lastly AppImages as containerised user apps.
When you think about it, the rebooting isn’t like Windows at all. Because if anything doesn’t work out, you can just reboot and your immediately back to where you started.
That and error mitigation isn't a total black box like it is with Mac or Windows.
I don't think you'd want to use it yet, but I like the direction. I think we should deprecate traditional system packages for basic user applications and use 3rd party packaging for these instead. My issues with flatpaks *for now* are that they don't have proper terminal commands, making them really suitable for GUI apps only, and can they be installed offline? I'm worried about our dependency on online connectivity.
I've never really stopped to watch an ad before, but the KernelCare idea is actually quite interesting. [No, I'm nothing to do with KernelCare or TLE!]
The Toolbox will definitely come in handy for dev purposes for my schoolwork. I wish I've known it sooner because we were developing an OS from scratch for one of my classes and I could've installed them on my own machine using toolbox rather than relying on AWS. But at the time I was using Ubuntu :P
Sounds like a server-oriented OS as you said. The idea itself is great, and probably will solve those problems about tinkering soon.
Thanks much for clarifying many confusing concepts :)
You’re welcome :)
immutable model os may be idealistic. but it won't be the future of linux. especially for servers.
I think it makes sense for schools though.
For container based stuff, redhat is already shipping immutable os. Formerly known as core os, now redhat coreos.
@@daniels1924 Indeed. My company was using CoreOS until it got killed by whatever RedHat product and we moved back to CentOS but the immutable part of the OS was never an issue for us, in fact the point of it being preconfigured was one less headache and allowed us to spin up several servers in a matter of seconds.
Ugly distro, Linux is superior to Windows because open files can be overwritten on disk. That is the reason it can update itself without rebooting.
@F99 Crafter I would say there are many advantages of making changes to the system files on the fly. It just is not as simple as no changes == best stability. That may be correct for systems like Windows. But what about things like kernel livepatching? Or maybe updating system preferences (which sure, some has user configuration feature).
It's just a tedious thing you think you need. But it's really just suitable to a number of users.
I want to try this on the Steam Deck, installing it as a second system sharing the home.
* hope advice me, just come from windows OS:
1- English not my first language.
2- use linux mint as daily os. It's good and i do not feeling any different (find alternative open source software and let's say i learn how use them).
3- only problem i face is the operation system crashed, almost after every kernel update or after some app crashed. I reinstall the linux mint 5 time during last month.
4- i use (inkscape + node js + freecad + libroffice + browser + vlc)
5- now i search for another distro and think in fedora design distro or bluesilver.
6- in your opinion fedora bluesilver will keep my OS safe and away from crashes?
7- did you advice me by the correct distro (fedora or other)?
8- there's any book or UA-cam video playlist can learn from it administration of fedora daily use system( maintenance the distro)
9- thanks in advance
Great vid; on point, it is indeed a enterprise distro.
Yeah it struck me in the middle of the video recording: this is a dream for quick deployment on a huge fleet of computers
this is also how ubuntu touch is meant to be used, except for reboot for packages, it has click packages for that
True !
How is it different from multi-booting on a single hard disk. Traditionally one could use multiple partitions, but with recent versions of Windows, one could boot from a virtual disk image ( docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/manufacture/desktop/boot-to-vhd--native-boot--add-a-virtual-hard-disk-to-the-boot-menu )
Not having dnf, the slowest package manager ever built is a plus! Immutable base system images for servers or containers sure but desktops / workstations I'm not so sure. I am sure I wouldn't use an immutable desktop built by Fedora. or Suse, both are far too much hassle to get basic licence encumbered necessities like codecs or firmware.
The question I have regarding ostree, which I couldn't find the answer for in Fedora docs:
If I add a package using ostree, then update the image - for example due to a secure fix - will my ostree installed package need to be reinstalled again every upgrade?
It awfully sounds like this the case and that would become really old really fast...
It won't be reinstalled, but added to the image
@@TheLinuxEXP automatically?
Yep!
Apple is doing something similar in a more strict manner with Big Sur. The OS is split into System and Data volumes on APFS. The System volume is mounted read only and has SIP - System Integrity Protection turned on but now in Big Sur macOS 11 a snapshot of the System to APFS is made, signed and that is what is booted. On T2 or M1 Mac's the firmware won't boot an OS that's not legit (can be overridden). Unfortunately, this means macOS updates become enormous as they include the entire System plus all the firmware for every model, etc. Linux images are much smaller so less of a problem. Linux does offer you more flexibility than Apple. Developers can change System on macOS but it's not easy. This new design makes it far more complex to create a bootable external clone of your system. You can clone the Data volumes but need to install macOS Big Sur onto the external drive to make it bootable. Just saying the ideas are similar but implementation varies considerably.
Sounds like it uses stupid amounts of disk space. Aren't flatpaks pulling all libraries they need too and thus are huge compared to packages with shared libraries? Also, I've heard Silverblue explained twice now and both times it sounded like much more hassle than a well-configured desktop distro with current tools and methods.
Initial download will be big. But flatpak package share runtime. If you use multiple apps that relies on gnome 3.36 runtime, the runtime is installed once with the first app. Following apps will use that runtime, so next download will be smaller. You can also remove unused runtime.
It's like docker images.
Fedora has its own version of Flathub? Tried to locate my favored apps on Flathub. Not there yet: Flashpeak Slimjet, Gkrellm.
Other possible shortcomings of Silverblue: newest hardware, devices, standards, etc. Bug & bug fixes, better optimizations are so rapid that turnover rates are making "stability" almost non existent.
In the meantime, Apple chose the BSD form of Unix, instead of Linux. Perhaps BSD-based systems might follow Apple's direction, especially with the new ARM CPU, including the newest Apple.
Fedora is all i use anyhow not silverblue but the workstation edition excited for 35 release tomorrow!
If you have a concern about app installs, try using appimages. They are complete applications in its own "container", similar to an iso image. Just download it, make it executable, and start using it. To uninstall, delete the file.
Great video.
Isn't the update system and installation system like our good old windows 10 which we all love to hate ?? 🤔
no
Neither Fedora Silverblue nor Fedora Workstation forces updates on you, so, no.
Hmmm... To run a system on flatpak packages or leave this magic and use btrfs with snapshots... I stay with the second option.
Fedora's lead dev did an AMA on reddit and confirmed that Silverblue will eventually replace Workstation.
I don't know how I feel about this. It's such a radical change from how GNU/Linux has been working for the past 20+ years.
@Bolivian-Lament systemd is here to stay. I know how you feel. Red Hat/IBM is trying to be the Microsoft of Linux. It's a good thing for the growth of Linux for the PC but maybe not so good for FOSS.
It would be really cool if the software developers statically compile all the dependencies including libc into one single binary or at least compile to load the so files from a relative path by default like the way it is with Windows. I'm pretty sure it is possible with the ELF format.
You have appimage for that. Just make the file executable and run it.
Well, if you like to tinker, you would do that in a VM or a container anyways. Why would you contaminate your stable running OS with "testing" stuff?
Because testing applications shouldn't require a container :)
Is it more secure if the system image is not writable?
A lot more, yeah
reverting to older image may come with a problem of updated user apps files that might not be backwards compatible. unless that involves a reboot to older fs snapshot.
That's why they use flatpak: the config files don't depend on the system underneath !
@@TheLinuxEXP i see, so the user apps stay unchanged, only the base os is switched?
Exactly :)
@@yoshi314One good thing of flatpak is that if you have a separate /home partition and install flatpak packages in user mode, you can potentially use those apps regardless of distro you are using without installing them again (At least that's my theory). You just need flatpak (preferably flathub repo for updating) and using same username. I am talking about normal Linux distro here. If you are using Gnome with this type of setup, I would have disable extensions before changing the distro.
Another plus of side of Silverblue is that you can use different types of desktop environment without messing up your initial desktop environment. It will be a separate image. It's very good way to test alpha or beta of version of desktop environment or totally different DE like KDE, xfce etc. When you remove that image it will be gone from your system completely. You will not have left over configs file to deal with.
Obviously, Silverblue is not ready yet. It will be more suited in corporation where you need to manage a lot computers. This will make admin's life a little easier.
right, I do not even consider using it, just for some enterprise use, not for a desktop user who all the time does things around the system
There would have to also be a forced reboot sometimes, or something, because many people love to not shutdown their PC's sometimes
I like the sound of “Fedora Atomic” better
You should do a video about OpenSUSE MicroOS as well when it gets desktop support
What about GNOME extensions? I want to use it with dash to panned
You can install them like you do on normal Linux distro. Install Dash to panel from the Gnome extensions website. Use Gnome-tweaks or gnome-extensions app to enable it.
I used Silverblue for a few weeks, and by the end of it, it sure didn't feel like the future even though I was super excited starting out.
"I cannot see myself using it"... C'est baby wogue qui ne va pas être content ! Heureusement, il est en vacances en ce moment 😄
En tout cas, chouette vidéo 👍
Hahah en même temps c'est un vrai fanboy de cette distrib, il aurait trouvé quelque chose a redire dans tous les cas 😅
Merci !
Looks like concepts of Docker, AppImage, NixOS all combined into one
thank you great video!!
Thanks :)
You could achieve some of the benefits with snapshots and for development I don't see how that is better than docker.
Great video. Love Fedora 32, it's very stable with the latest kernels. It is helpful to know how to change a Deb file to an RPM install. Otherwise, next to Arch, Fedora and Debian vanilla are my favorite distributions.
Fedora SB holds a lot of promise. I'm a 10 yr Linux user (Ubuntu -based mostly) and used SB 32 for about a month. I gave up and switched to standard Fedora WS. My gripes:
1. Slow installation -- 1 hr to do app installs w/ a script. My other distro setup scripts take 20 min. max.
2. Slow startup. There's always a 1 min. delay during startup. Fedora WS has no such delay. Why???
3. Slow shutdown. Again, another 1 min. delay during shutdown.
4. Teamviewer app rpm -- needed it badly but can't install. Fedora SB w/ Xorg installs/works app just fine.
Wayland is still a no go for remote desktop. Install the rpm with Gnome software and login in into Xorg session. It should work there.
Why is there no translations on your videos (even automatic translations)
It's too early. UA-cam didn't analyze the words in the video yet
Probably that, yes!
Part of linux experience is developing/installing custom software. Arch linux is actually better at enabling this than fedora workstation.
Silver blue has a lot of potential to be user friendly for new Linux users and even people that just want things to work.
Sayangnya Fedora punya umur aktifnya pendek dan tidak mengadopsi model rolling release, jadi untuk saat ini aku lebih memilih manjaro untuk distro sehari - hariku.
I could see it making sense for businesses that use linux for a desktop environment, but Ive never seen a business that does that. The people I see using linux are usually developers and as a developer myself, I hate the whole concept of silverblue. But there is clearly a user base out there, and to each their own.
in St.louis Mo. Imo"s pizza uses Cent Os on their pos stations and their main pc used for payroll and inventory control.
Thanks
funny I was just thinking of something like this
Why not just donate to timeshift and automate imaging the system?
OHHH!!! Fedora atomic workstation sounds so much cooler than silverblue
I see a bunch of use cases that might benefit from it but not the future for general users.
There is a "silverlight" joke in here somewhere
this would work for normal users but for more advanced people, like me for example, i would go crazy
it can work for normal users who don't want to touch the terminal more than once or twice for installing software, I definitely see myself putting an immutable distribution on a computer belonging to someone who is too far before our generation to know or care all that much about failure recovery.
Ohhh, Beautiful...
Amazing video
Thanks !
is this still holds up?
This is called Dockerization at its extream level
I don't see Google Chrome available on flathub, and for sure Fedora won't include it, how do you install it without rpm? I can see a lot of problems, that's why I'm sticking to wordstation, and fedora server
Also, I NEVER update anything from gnome software, I don't wanna reboot to update php or nginx, dnf update is fine... Only kernel and drivers update deserves reboot
You can download the rpm package from official site and open it in Gnome software and install. Reboot the system and you are good to go.
@@JahidulIslam so update Chrome needs a reboot? That's worse than windows
@@idtyu Well it wouldn't if there was a Chrome flatpak. There are problems with the current/legacy ways of packaging desktop applications, i.e. rpm/deb dependencies and lack of sandboxing, and the fact lots of applications still provide only those packages is not a reason to try to make a better system. I know what you mean about superfluous reboots for sure, but for most people that is a non-issue (for *system* updates - obvs nobody wants to have to reboot to update Chrome, but thats why Chrome should be available in flatpak - so that it isn't tied to the OS packages)
@@krnlg actually a good solution surfaced, ms edge can be installed via flatpak. It also supports hardware acceleration which chrome made clear that it won't support
Sounds like a good thing, but with these kind of restrictions just doesn't make it look all that great. For a cheap laptop thats $100 of less it might seem more practical if you're just using it for writing documents and web browsing, but anything else beyond that isn't possible.
So if you are interested in that kind of system but without snaps or flatpack but real packaging : NixOS is another OS based on the Nix package manager (nixos.org)
Thanks, I'll take a look
Or Guix ;)
@@CristianMolina Yes, also its FOSS sibling Guix... Though I had the feeling that they were not at the same level of refinement : Guix does not seem to have as much traction as the NixOS technosystem.
Really need flatpak for databases...why PPAs are unavoidable.
period tell 'em nick, yall did he lie?? no he told straight facts and said it on point.
Very scary future. We might as well install non-root android on all our pcs the way all this is going. Have linux devs even heard of the unix way or if it aint broke don't fix it?
Every solution has a use case, so saying that a "con" is that "it is not good for a " is really not valid. I would never use on personal computers it but doesn't sound too different to what I did almost 30 years ago with windows 3.1. I had a master image that the PCs booted from. When I updated that image, it would go to all the PCs in the company the next time they booted. Of course this is a more modern and secure solution, but I can totally see the use case. Companies creating flatpaks for the applications their users will use. Applications properly vetted at the corporate and school levels where admins go crazy trying to contain systems.
So fedora introducing windows habbit of need to rebooting pc after every changes and installation of packages done.
That's what I don't like about it
Unless you install all your apps with Flatpak, which should be the recommended approach for desktop apps.
Yeah, an utterly moronic setup.
But this distribution is targeting a specific kind of linux users.
Nick ; move fast and break things