Folks forget, most of the series takes place within the Orion Spur, a small corner of the galaxy. The only times we go outside that sphere are via random jumps, or portals. Even the Covenant empire doesn’t span the entire galaxy. One of the things I like about Halo, it’s a sprawling universe but no one knows what all is out there, and after the Covenant, no one in the UNSC is really enthusiastic about finding out.
List of UNSC discoveries in space An amalgamation of various sentient races all hell bent on wiping us out An ancient civilisation that DID wipe us all out (twice!) An entity of pure rage and hate, driven to consume and convert everything not in its own image. A long lost species of god-like beings that interfere and experiment on humans (and anyone else they can get their hands on) for the giggles. And more recently, a race that makes those last two shit themselves in fear. I think that it's safe the say that the universe has been VERY hostile towards Humanity. It'd be more confusing if they wanted to keep on going out there.
It’s really funny cuz it’s nearly the complete opposite of Star Wars. Because the Star Wars Galaxy is largely Well known with the Core, Deep Core, expansion region, Mid rim and Outer rim with only Wild space and the Unknown Regions being the truly undiscovered areas. And even they have a lot of areas that we already know about but that’s why love the Unknown Regions because there was still so so much that remained a mystery and undiscovered even after the old EU was branded Legends.
So a battlegroup approaches and you leave a single ship. That seems like an ambassador, no? An attack on the ambassador's ship would illicit a response, and upon taking over the humans ship, given they know enough to broadcast civilian IFFs, they would probably be able to realise the humans response was due to already being at war. The logical thing to do, therefore, would be to disengage and keep watching the humans, waiting for another opportunity to send an ambassador at a less stressful time.
Not if the Cole protocol was done unless they left captured survivors but you would think that if they would be friendly they would return the prisoners after they found out what happened and if the 11 other ships were escort ships for the ambassador ship wouldn't they stay in position well the ambassador ship advance incase something happened instead of just leaving it and not doing it job the travel there would be though sub space so the travel to the destination would not be that dangerous and having a escort would not make any potential dangers of sub space travel less dangerous so if they were not going to stick around at all having a escort fleet would be useless unless they weren't planning on contacting just observing
@@kennyburkamp4054 This makes me think of Star Ocean with the entry Till the End of Time. There are database entries on scouting areas of the galaxy including things like combat scout fleets for the first reconnaissance missions. It could be a civilization that sends combat scouts to new areas that are truly unknown to them. As for the Cole Protocol, it could have been so fast they didn't have time to carry it out. If the attackers could rapidly take down the carrier while ignoring the others I don't see any reason the crew couldn't be left without enough time.
That is a terrifying story, I could only imagine the horror after the Human-Covenant War that when asked about the incident, and the Covenant responds that they never engadged humanity here on that day, both sides now realizing that something, even if only in small number, was out there...
Whenever they decide to conclude Chiefs story this needs to be explored. Imagine the series going outside the Milkyway to track these unknowns. Better then "Oh hey the Endless a new enemy tht is somehow better then everyone".
@@michaelhuie2661 ah yes so getting "new enemy that is somehow better than everybody" would be better than "new enemy that is somehow better than everybody"
@@Baldus-the_bald_guy100% agree, most of 343i design just don't hit the same And tbh the fact that the Autumn class is just upscale Pillar of Autumn just seems lazy to me
Helbard class Destroyers will always be my favorite design. That's interesting I've never heard of this event. A task force of ancient humans would be cool. Or a all new alien race would be cool too.
@@MeddlerPropagandist14 That is a logical assumption. I always assumed they died out some time between that terminal referencing them and the era the games take place in, but nothing confirms that or even puts it as a possibility other than sheer time passage.
@@ALLMINDmercenarysupportsystem I personally think their still out their watching the Milky Way, why did they release the flood on In 05? Who knows all I hope is that they aren’t the Endless and They Use Slip Space guns(idk random BS)
@RAWDOGGER420 I also hope they aren't Endless, but I think that's the way 343's going. As for Delta Halo, that's probably an accident. No evidence for any motive (or an accident, admittedly), but this is the simplest solution.
The extragalactic advanced flood checking if humans were far enough along the tech tree to be worth eating yet. The UNSC's poor showing bought earth another few hundred years., but they'll be back.
I’ve never heard of this before. Seems crazy. You need to make more videos like this. It gives many questions like who were these ships and that one ship managed to take out a ship with no problems at all. And why did the other ships leave but one out of the 12 unknown ship stay behind? I don’t think I’ve heard any of the halo UA-cam channels talk about this an event before. It’s like that one Unkown ship that crashed on installion 04 that spark didn’t know about at all. And also send out a distress message until spark blocked it. And another question is what were these 12 Unkown ships doing so close to earth and why were they there in the first place? So many questions🧐 were these ships searching for something before they left? Do these 12 unknown ships ever make another appearance or is this their last appearance? Have the covenant battled against these unknown ships as well? I don’t think these ships are apart of the banished either.
Another question is why did those 12 unknown ships even have old IFF codes anyway in the first place? And I can’t see these ships being related to the covenant since they wouldn’t run from the humans. That and covenant ships don’t just take a human ship down with one shot like that. And the banished wouldn’t just run either and then go into slip space just like the covenant as well. Plus the humans ships would have know that those 12 unknown ships would be covenant and wouldn’t just try to talk to them for identification. Plus the covenant by this point isn’t even at earth yet since regret is the first to go to earth in the timeline. And another thing is who else knew the location of our solar system and the location of earth besides the covenant years later in 2052 and humanity? And possibly the banished if they knew earth by the time halo 2 took place in oct of 2552. That I’m not sure of but we do know that the banished had to of formed around 2540 something so they would be around in 2552 obviously as halo wars 2 and the comics about the banished confirmed that. And it’s not that the 12 unknown ships had old IFF codes but I believe the video said they were civilian IFF codes which is also interesting. And I also doubt that this was ONI’s doing as well. And the endless by this point are locked up at like installation 07 so I don’t know if it’s them either.
My guess is these unidentified ships have some relation to the meddlers (who by now are very likely the endless) Ever since we read the halo ce terminals and learned of an unknown ship crash landing onto delta halo, we've speculated a lot as to what could have been inside of it, and the vessel itself was not forerunner (despite having similar design structure) My guess is these ships are likely the remaining remnants of the meddlers who've been secretly roaming through various systems (for unknown reasons of course, hell knows what they were doing near one of saturns moons) The only thing that holds this theory back is the outdated IFF transponder codes, I cannot come up with a reason as to why the meddlers would have something like that (you could say it might be insurrection but I very much doubt they have ships that can one shot a large vessel with minimal effort) As for the other 11 ships leaving the system, my guess is they left one behind to ensure there was no evidence to gather from what they were doing so they took out the strongest vessel in the battlegroup to ensure the rest of the battlegroup would retreat and preventing any attempts to interact with the unknown vessel, perhaps a "Leave no evidence that we were here." type of act. (although saying that sounds silly since they destroyed a vessel which was the evidence but from what you're saying it sounds to me like the vessel wasn't entirely destroyed, more like it was hijacked by the unknown vessel and was brought into the fleet) I have to say those I've never actually heard of this event before, it's certainly news to me. Thats just a theory on my part though, if I'm wrong then feel free to correct me.
not all forerunners died either so could be a remnant or renegade group or who knows what, but the endless also work, long as the follow up writing is good then it's not a major issue either way
@@yulfine1688 Wait I thought the didact was the last remaining forerunner to survive after the forerunner flood war? Y'know cuz he was corrupted by the logic plague and was locked inside a cryptum by his wife (the librarian) for his traitorous acts? Also it brings me to another point which also holds my theory back as I stated before, why do they have old IFF transponder codes?
What a timely video for me given I recently finished Halo 2 a few weeks ago and am now working on my own video discussing my thoughts on it. Halo 2 might be the best Halo game I’ve played with regards to lore expansion and world building. This seems to add a little more to it. I can’t wait to play Halo 3 for the first time soon!
@@RJ-91 Halo 5 is without a doubt my most played halo game from a multiplayer prospect. Almost level 151 and climbing. Warzone was very good for this game and I’m shocked Infinite did not bring it over.
humans were at war with aliens for a long time but this story seems like humans just found it's first contact with an alien race and it gives me goose bumps
Seems strange that the carrier would be the lead ship in the battle group. Would expect the frigates would be leading as scouts/picket ships followed by the cruisers and the carrier. This would give the carrier sufficient time to respond to any aggressive actions by an enemy/target since the carrier would be the ship with the greatest firepower.
@@thebaron3283 Starting at 9:22 it states that the unknown ship concentrated on the "lead ship of Battle Group Rino". Sounds like the carrier was "leading" the charge towards the target.
@@Thoridin58 Or more accurately, the rest of the BG was in a screening pattern around the ship, but the unknown decided to target the biggest ship as its CO likely assumed (and did so correctly) that it was the 'head' of the group. Carriers these days actually don't 'lead from the front' as they're they most important ship in the Battlegroup. Other ships take various positions around them, both to screen the ship, and to act as 'guard ships' should a pilot be forced to ditch.
Now I’m curious if these mystery ships have ever had an encounter with the Covenant. I hope it actually equates to something big similar to what happened in KOTOR where there was a small early hint of the Yuuzahn Vong by showing one of the early scout ships enter the galaxy. An Extra Galactic threat from outside the Milky Way invading the Galaxy would be so awesome.
The I.F.F is why on the level "343 Guilty Spark" on HALO COMBAT EVOLVED the flood was originally identified as yellow on our huds. Then our suits and own I.F.F transponders fixed it once they found out what happened.... But that's just my theory
I remember reading this on the wiki. But it doesn’t seem like the ship itself was lost if they were boarded. The ship was likely captured id say. But since there’s no info on whether or not the ship was captured or destroyed who knows? I will say that the flood are the only ones capable of boarding and taking over a ship extremely quickly. They did it in ghosts of Onyx, Mona Lisa, infinite succor and site 22 shows that there are still old Forerunner ships with flood on board. Who’s to say these aren’t ancient human ships? Surely plenty of FLEETS were lost without a trace.
Even for the flood these... tactics are odd. 11 ships leave and only 1 remains? (doesn't sit right for me) Why not destroy the entire battlegroup so it can be fused with the flood? And even then what would their goal have been in that moment?
@@Horrorpleb the flood uses bait and switch tactics. They baited Keyes and the marines and later chief in Halo CE. They did the same thing on those other ships too. With the exception of the covenant ships during ghosts of onyx. They would prefer to leave no witnesses rather than outright attack. So why not take over the biggest ship and leave it there? Also once someone’s infect they are basically in the hivemind so it’s likely if it is flood, they know what protocol is. They made the slip space jumps because they knew they have have to be engaged. If they engaged the whole fleet and that whole fleet was destroyed, it would have prompted the UNSC to send a bigger response to them which would make their presence known and defeat the purpose of their goal.
@@slicer940 I can see what you mean by bait and switch tactics, they've used such tactics before even on the mona lisa, keeping their presence hidden so anyone would board without suspecting a major threat (albeit ONI already knew of their presence but the marines carrying out the mission had no clue) Albeit it brings me to another question, how did they get ahold of ships such as these that could one shot a large vessel? I was also wondering why they never decided to show up when high charity went to the ark (but I could assume they wanted to keep the fleet hidden so they could be used in the near future for some sort of counter-offensive against humanity and all other races and they could perhaps link up with the flood infestation that happened at site 22 resulting in the first ever flood infected spartan) Perhaps this could be in link with humanities final test that was given to them by the precursors? And if this was a flood outbreak, when did it occur and how did it occur?
Dude I love the idea that the human covenant war got so big that it got the attention of other galaxies and far off civilizations that dwarf the forerunners. I know that ain’t really what the video is about but it’s a cool idea
My only thought was some ancient humans that got caught in some kind of time anomaly. Like from before the whole Forerunner war defeat and species reset. They would be much further advanced than anything
@ShimmyFrI know it would be unlikely to be compatible, but the expanded lore have pulled that stupid bullshit about how the Librarian genetically engineered humanity to guide them toward developing certain technology. Maybe humanity would have ended up building compatible comms 🤷♂️ it’s a weak theory lol
00, you often ask for suggestions for episodes, so in light of the closing of Rooster Teeth and the premiere of the finale of Red vs Blue. A most detailed breakdown of RvB as a tribute to the lore of its universe and the fact that it has had multiple Easter eggs and promotions for Halo.
I'd love to. But I won't. I made a video about the Halo Community a couple years back and featured a small clip from RvB to celebrate their contributions, and they copyright claimed the video. Initially I thought it was youtube messing around so I challenged it, but they rejected it anyway. So for risk of that happening again, I won't be covering any RvB content.
Could this be the first interaction with a Banished Raiding party? Their ships are quite powerful and in Infinite look distinct from other Covenant designs and likely would engage in boarding and rebroadcasting signals
@@ALLMINDmercenarysupportsystem they should have added a More powerful MAC to it, I mine a f**kng Paris MAC? Really? On a 2.5km ship? That’s some bullshit right there At least give it a Cruiser MAC! EDIT: Forgot to mention It’s MAC is rapid fire soooooo yeah
@@MeddlerPropagandist14 This is like saying every carrier IRL should have battleship guns. A carrier has no need for this type of weapon, and a better MAC would take up valuable space needed for hangars and munitions. I'd say that the carrier shouldn't have a MAC at all, really.
@@ALLMINDmercenarysupportsystem all hangers(that we know of) are towards the rear of the Epoch So logically having a Cruiser MAC wouldn’t be detrimental in anyway Maybe some Crew compartments aren’t there but I’d rather have A bigger gun than some people who run around being useless in battle
This is tge perfect story for a game another group of humans that used a different technology base that they discovered while exploring and built up another human government from it. So much material to pull from
This interesting as we know they aren't the Covenant, being able to almost instantly destroy a carrier. Two burning questions I have are: 1. Why did they fall back, when they saw Battle Group Rhino? 2. Why do they have human IFF tags (outdated sure, but still)?
I’m surprised I’ve never heard about this before, good stuff. If there are any more of these obscure mysteries in the halo universe, would you consider making videos on them too?
This information comes from the data drops included in the old Halo Legendary Crates; each one came with a few little data drops to flesh out more obscure pockets of the setting.
Given that the rest of the Halo Milky Way galaxy is STILL unexplored in full, who knows what actual factions and society’s could be out there that developed from Forerunner tech worlds. Or other races that were seeded after the Rings were fired. The Forerunners had to have known about TONS of other species then the ones we know in the galaxy, especially sapient ones that would make large civilizations. I can see a space faring race that grew up inside older forerunner and human ships/structures but with signs of cannibalization. (Aka signs of shoddy repairs and that ships had to be scrapped for parts.) Maybe go full Homeworld style with it! It would totally fit!
@@shcdemolisher Given what we know, the Human-Covenant War only spanned 100 light years across from an galactic empire that engulfed thousands of lights of years sphere of influence in a galaxy that is 100,000 lights across.
One slight correction to the whole thing with IFF: Not returning a 'Friend' response does not mean you're automatically a 'foe'. It means you're an "Unknown", and while you're correct that you'll be treated as "Potentially Hostile" until proven otherwise, NATO regs (which the UNSC pulls from) don't allow engagement until something is proven hostile, and their are strict criteria that must be met. Basically.... 1. They actually shoot at you 2. They take "aggressive actions" (lock their radar onto you, turn to an intercept heading, etc) 3. You have multi-factor authentication (their radar signature matches a known hostile, or they came from a direction of known hostiles when first detected) 4. You have visual identification that they are hostile. Obviously on the ground, for infantry, you'll be seeing more of a mix of 1 and 4, but for aircraft, ships, and space craft, you'll be seeing all four.
This is so cool! Not gonna lie I'm of the opinion that it might be ancient humans or something similar, and am totally going to use this as fodder for my halo fan fic towards that end lol
Could explain why they had civilian IFF they probably thought that they were linking up with their brethren only for unfamiliar ships to approach them.
Unknown contact guts enemy ship neutralising its threat but enacts simultaneous numerous boarding parties? They most likely wanted to sweep the ship and capture as much intel as possible. No doubt they’ve updated IFF Transponders now…
Pretty sure this is detailing the moment Covenant vessels first showed up in Sol prior to Halo 2. Note that the amount of unknown vessels were similar to the number of ships in Regret’s fleet. The use of _human_ civilian transponders indicates captured war material being put to use as a smokescreen against prying eyes. Had this been an unknown third party, there would be no reason for them to have access to such things, much less use them, only to immediately attack the battle group coming to intercept.
could be the forerunners that left before the halos were fired. we know the forerunners have transporter like capabilities with the didacts prometheans. would stand to reason they werent only on requiem, but that some went with the fleeing forerunner as guardians and soldiers
I mean there is nothing else, so that's sort of the only option if they do, bungie was very inconsistent with certain things and people forget 343 did pull from some of bungies old ideas etc and worked them into games, so unless the rest of all of those concepts etc were leaked we don't really know.
Hi, what if it wasn’t an alien ship, rather it was the Under construction, infinity, here’s what I think happened the infinity and fleet of ships that were building her we’re in orbit of the moon however, they sent out the wrong ID codes when confronted by a battle group, they tried to jump the infinity away with the rest of ship but jump Drive did not work fearing the secret of the Infiniti would get out the commander on the bridge of the infinity fired the main battery guns which destroyed the the over ship when Lord Hood heard of it, he realised it must’ve been infinity and all good, no pursuit as he and Office of naval intelligence wanted to protect the secret of the infinity. This is what I think happened thankyou paul
Maybe the covenant tried to use captured iif transponders from early in the war to scout the area regret would be going but dew ti spotting human ships they retreated to tell regret that there would be a small human presence but maybe they hadn’t spotted earth yet and their strongest ship decided to retaliate and destroy the totem lake before also leaving Idk I try’s to make this so that it could be the covenant but they still don’t know about earth
if it was covenant, would they not relay information back to their home fleet about the large presents of humanity on earth. Taking place just before halo 2 my thoughts are that it could be Ancient Humanity or a unidentified race possibly meddlers on installation 04. not much is known about their capability's or ships. Outdated IFFs is also weird i mean covenant can use them but they were so far into the war that they had no need too. Flood is also possible but they had no activity at that time in that location nor did they have captured ships to fly. my best guess is Old Humanity, Meddlers, or a unknown new alien species. Without information its anyone's guess.
Something shot your ship in the dark space and you don't know where the source of the fire is That might've been the most terrifying thing to experience when you can't see anything in space imo.
An intrguing, little known, piece of lore. Thanks for taking the time to create a video on it. The most likely candidate are the Banished potentially scoping out Earth as a threat and/or humanity as a potential ally. Explains some of the similarities to the Covenant (ship of overwhelming power) and differences (initial attempt at subterfuge, pulling ships out when under threat but leaving behind a rear guard). Meta reasoning - the Data Drop was released the same year as Halo Wars 2 so brand synergy. Other option - the person writing this Data Drop was unaware of the stated reason for the Covenant's finding of Earth and created their own justification in a classic 343 Left Hand doesn't know what the Right Hand is doing situation. Given 343's handling of narrative so far I also would not put it past them making the bare-bones of a story found in a Data Drop the lynchpin of a sea-shift in their universe however. Its the Athens not the Atlas ;-) Great video man! Would love to see more content about some of the more obscure lore.
I wish that this wasn't the banished but it probably was. I'm really hoping it was one of those unknown races that the Forerunners rendered extinct somehow surviving or the A.I.'s of the Ancient Humanity/Ancestors.
From the content of this vid, I would theorise ships of alien origin. Possible Fore-runner infiltration, but unknown intent. The destructive power of this single ship would be reasoned as an older, technologically advanced race. However, given how things were with the Covenant, 3rd Fleet should have gone to battle alert and made all haste to Battle Group Rhino!
Just a small addition to my last comment. Another contender for the indentity of those 12 ships, Guardians! Not something I have found much in the lore, but the tech level would suggest this faction. What interest the Guardians would have around Saturn is anyone's guess. But that is my best guess.
Is it possible they were the Remnants of the Ancient Human Empire? If so, that would be cool, we barely know anything about them, and I would love to read up more on them. Could explain how they have a civilian IFF albiet old.
I wish, or if they were another species that survived the Forerunner expansion, since Humanity is not the first sentient species that they nearly/fully estinguished. But most likely they were the Banished or some Sht.
whoever they were, they clearly didn't want the UNSC to know anything about them, which makes it unlikely that it's any faction we don't currently know of. What we now is: They attacked the biggest ship nearly instantly destroying it, then boarded it. They had old civilian IFF codes They left survivors They had all but one of their ships flee. given they didn't eradicate every ship, they clearly had a bigger problem with killing everyone, then with having been discovered. this is enough information to gleam it is probably a first contact scenario. with the most likely alternative explanation being espionage.
Here is the real question why didn't the UEG/UNSC not reversed engineer the Ancient Human Prime Cruiser that was found? The technology of that ship alone would've accelerated the technology curve of the UEG by a good portion especially the weapons and power drives, it's funny because here he talks about a mysterious fleet that left one lone ship that "destroyed " a 2.5km long carrier with ease,how,what weapons was used for that achievement, then coincidence that with them finding the AH vessel.
I wonder how different the war would have been had Humanity been using their war time economy instead of waiting to warn the colonies of invasion days before hand. Meaning every human worlds knew about the Covenant attacks and where activity working to counter the Covenant. Long before the Covenant showed up to each human world.
It would have been a more prolonged war, could Humanity win? Probably not I would like to imagine the UNSC infinity and Thanatos class battleships would play a HUGE role in the War
@RAWDOGGER420 the Covenant would definitely suffer more casualties has humanity had time to fortified their worlds. maybe had the chance to use more of the Nova Nukes on Covenant fleets
@@armycowboy4313 I think N.O.V.A bombs are the Keaton Victory over the Covenant, if there were more nova B’s than the UNSC would have Likely Won Step 1: Go to high charity with decent sized fleet Step 2: Launch the Nova with other missiles to have the covenant thinking it’s just harmless archer missiles Step 3: *BOOM* Step 4: Rose are Red Violets are Blue… Sangheilios is now a Astroid field… How about you Step 5: Rinse and Repeat
@RAWDOGGER420 I mean Oni did use stealth ship so the could easily deploy the Nova bomb. The other reason I think the war would go differently is war is the mother of inventions, having the entire human race working to defeat the Covenant they would be pumping out new and stronger weapons. Pretty much like things from the ( prototype from halo legends)
There's something else out there... and man, that is fucking terrifying. Edit: whats even more daunting is the fact that they were using outdated codes, meaning they either came across a lost unsc fleet, or they killed them and stole the codes. The "unknown" aspect is what makes my skin crawl, and thats why i rewlly wish 343 would have kept the forerunners out of the main campaigns (for as much as i love the Didact).
back to lore ship sizes? use your 2.65x larger numbers, they make sense, and your following is large enough, you may get them to catch on and force 343 to concede to your superior math.
Since I'm here on the early side for once I'm listing some faction facts about who could've and who could not have been our perpetrators here. This is obviously up for discussion so I'd like to hear what you all have to think too. ONI (Very unlikely, but possible. They probably would've heard Chief's news before the majority of the UNSC that Earth is soon to be found, so a reasonable assumption would be that even if it was ONI then they would've all jumped unless they had something to hide and needed the Rhino Battlegroup to fall back before finding something. I don't think it would've been ONI especially with how 343i doesn't seem to release a lot of ONI content, but I could be wrong. I also haven't read the books and my knowledge is based on UA-cam. Insurrectionists (Unlikely they would have that firepower, and also probably wouldn't linger to fight a whole battlegroup if it could be avoided) The Banished (Firepower possible, but highly unlikely they'd be within our solar system. Also, why would they have outdated human IFF transponders?) The Endless (I have no idea, just throwing it out there) The Didact? (We know he composed humans into prometheans and could have some outdated tech on board and/or in use, but I also don't think he would've been this close as he likely would've started a new conflict. I also don't know of any 'recent' human interaction or conflict with the Didact before the events of H4. The Flood from the games (practically impossible given that Installation 04 was destroyed along with the Gravemind aboard the Truth And Reconciliation, and also because the Indulgence Of Conviction that flew in during H3 would've been infected after the events of H2 on Installation 05.) Meddlers (There was a ship of unknown origin that crash landed on Alpha Halo way before HCE. I think it's been said that it predates all Human or Covenant space-travel. Spark had no idea who they were and built a'"sarcophagus" around their ship when it became evident that nobody survived the landing. Some theories dive into the idea of an extragalactic race running from the Flood and trying to find a way to stop it. Either way, we have no idea who or what they are. They're practically as mysterious and canonically present as Halo itself, and there is plenty of lore about the ancient Flood from the books fleeing the galaxy during the events of the Human/Forerunner war. They're still out there and we have no idea what's been happening beyond our galaxy. This will lead into the Flood from the books below.) (((Side note: I'm going to be honest, I never even knew this to be a real faction. I always assumed that 'meddler' was a name given to Covenant forces doing what they do with Forerunner artifacts.))) The Flood from the books etc (We know that some Flood had escaped the galaxy and weren't killed off by the Halo array back around the time of the Human/Forerunner/Flood war. They'd 100% have the firepower to take out practically any ship. There are HiddenXperia videos about the possibility of Precursor or Flood-controlled ships leaving the galaxy around the time that Humans fought the Flood. They did this to allow conflict to start between the other two factions without actually being present for part of it. The Forerunners had no idea that the Humans were running from something, they just assumed it was a territorial conflict. Who knows how much (many?) Flood there are beyond the Milky Way. By this point in time they'd probably be the most advanced faction in the known universe. I wouldn't put my money on this because of how fan-fictioney it sounds and because there probably would've been a coordinated Flood attack with the Gravemind that flew in during H3 which didn't happen. I feel that this would be somewhat probable, but there's some good points that could be argued against it. I don't think that these are the guys we're after here, but I would love it if they were.) If HiddenXperia somehow comes across this, I'd just like you to know that you're by far my main source of Flood lore. 👌 Thanks. That's all I got, thanks for reading & expanding.
Late reply to this but possibly Old Humanity, Ancient humanity they would have ships able to broadcast IFFs not sure if it would be proper IFFS used from today's humanity but it's possible they could have found derelict Civilian Vessels and used that. I like your idea of the meddlers that's very possible same reasons for IFFS above. the Flood is unlikely in my eyes due to the fact they would not retreat, and they were not present at the time in between early halo 2. They were still on high charity and had only captured ships of the Covenant. I truly think its ether Meddlers or Ancient Humanity. Endless is highly unlikely as well. Hope they shed light on this more in the future.
This seems like a panic-retcon to make us try to care more about the endless, considering how (i'm assuming) most of us were disinterested. We had a new threat each 343 game; it got tiring. I wanted to fight well-rounded, well-written forces that would span a trilogy. I never wouldve guessed that was going to be way too much to ask for. :/
The odds of a splinter covenant group is higher than the Endless suggested in the comments. Piracy was also prevalent and interest by the Covenant was likely leaked to 3rd parties that took the lead to look for artifacts and treasures of value to the Covenant or other parties.
I was actually thinkimg something like Jackal pirates with some modified CAS or something, even tho I don't think a CAS would be able to go toe to toe with a UNSC battle group consisting of an Epoch, 2 Marathons and a few Paris class frigates.
I would almost posit that the ships could have been Banished. The only hangup is that Rhino probably would have recognized them as modified Covie ships.
I got a question for you Installation 00, humans have anti gravity technology in the form of repulsor tech at this time. Boeing has a patent that NASA is now considering to use where it will produce a super heated plasma in front of a spacecraft to produce a sort of shield since the hotter plasma becomes the more solid and durable it becomes. But what gets me is that part of the Boeing patent is that this plasma shield would be controlled and directed with magnetic fields. So why didnt the UNSC NOT use this to their advantage and have their ships deflect the Covie Plasma with their repulsor tech? It would have improved a ship's survivability in battle no doubt with tech that is already installed on their ships.
UNSC Naval strategy is really lacking if the carrier was the one leading the entire battlegroup. Isn't the whole reason behind having an escort fleet to protect the flagship and your heavy hitters?
Now this may be very theoretical but would it be possible fotr the UNSC to make use of a gun type nuclear boom (little boy for refrence) in a rail gun as by may measure this would solve the terminal effects issue of slugs? especially in space where HE is practically inert compared to the power that the mass of the material holds especially in the case of rail guns projectile, pluss then you have the added benfit of the emp pulse which could play hacoc with the shields of enemies warships. you wouldnt even need a complicated implosion device just to parts that make up a critical mass of enriched uranium there may be the increased danger of spontaneous fishion if not handled well but with proper neutron shielding inside and outside the device this shouldn't be a problem, you could even still accommodate a solid material for the rest of the slug with just ferisous inserts forged into it that alow for magnetic manipulation and subsequent acceleration, having a lower density Mabey aluminium core which crumples during impact allowing the round to hit-crumple then form the critical mass at the surface of the target, you could even lace it with cobolt or depleted uranium casing it you wanted to make it spicy, or seeing as the unsc already understand fushion mabey using a lithium stabilised deuterium volume that collapses in into the shot trap Infront of the ball of enriched unraium making the boom even more powerful and even targeted if you where favouring penetration (shaped changes work with nukes to), the diameter of rail guns along with there throtable nature makes this a very usefull if a little expensive for the unsc but compared to the number of DDs and CL that they lost im sure it makes sense to use nukes more frequently, there fitting agents extinction so modern taboos dont really apply pluss yet again space is already irradiated. (very long post im sure but its kinda a pet theory of mine)
This would make for a Great Halo Game! Encountering a Truly New Threat that may even be more Powerful than the Covenant! None of this "the Endless" Shit that 343 is Pushing. Plus there's the Mystery of that 1 Unidentified Ship in the Halo Combat Evolved Terminal that was shown.
Has to be the Flood. I'm guessing they've taken over a colony and set sail with all the ships they could muster. Perhaps jumped out of system with most ships so as not to put all their eggs in one basket.
It would be cool if these are the meddlers and are not the endless but at the same time it would be a way to connect them. Perhaps at some point we’ll get a new alien.
Interesting... I know it's probably gonna be made about the endless, but what if it's ancient humans? I know ancient humans would probably not use IFF tags but for story theming and flow what if the out of date IFF's hint to ancient humanity and what if these ships have to do with the ship that crashed on installation 04 that guilty spark found?
I wonder if in the halo universe earth still has a water based fleet that they still use, thats the modern day equivalent of every single navy put together, and same with an air force
You know? My top two favorite titles ever are Halo and Alien. In this order. They are both similar and share a lot of things, concepts etcetera. BUT... There's a "but". Halo have a a gear more when it comes to space battles. There's nothing like that in Alien. No Covenant, no space battles. So those beautiful ships we see in the movies are just part of the scenary instead of being acting characters and this is something that really limits Alien franchise and gives Halo the primacy in my list. Other than having multiple alien races, Spartans, ODST, tanks, etc... and yes, I know Aliens lore actually have some space battles between the UAAC and UPP and tanks too... But they're still limited to the lore and not seen in any movies nor videogames. What a shame, what waste of potential... 😖
@Installation00 This question is irrelevant to the video but when mentioning the regrets fleet I thought back to lord hood’s comparison to the fleet at reach and wondered could the mantle’s approach have been able protect reach against the covenant? I’m curious what you think of the idea.
Folks forget, most of the series takes place within the Orion Spur, a small corner of the galaxy. The only times we go outside that sphere are via random jumps, or portals. Even the Covenant empire doesn’t span the entire galaxy.
One of the things I like about Halo, it’s a sprawling universe but no one knows what all is out there, and after the Covenant, no one in the UNSC is really enthusiastic about finding out.
List of UNSC discoveries in space
An amalgamation of various sentient races all hell bent on wiping us out
An ancient civilisation that DID wipe us all out (twice!)
An entity of pure rage and hate, driven to consume and convert everything not in its own image.
A long lost species of god-like beings that interfere and experiment on humans (and anyone else they can get their hands on) for the giggles.
And more recently, a race that makes those last two shit themselves in fear.
I think that it's safe the say that the universe has been VERY hostile towards Humanity.
It'd be more confusing if they wanted to keep on going out there.
So far we’ve only seen galaxy wide threats. Imagine universal threats.
It’s really funny cuz it’s nearly the complete opposite of Star Wars. Because the Star Wars Galaxy is largely Well known with the Core, Deep Core, expansion region, Mid rim and Outer rim with only Wild space and the Unknown Regions being the truly undiscovered areas.
And even they have a lot of areas that we already know about but that’s why love the Unknown Regions because there was still so so much that remained a mystery and undiscovered even after the old EU was branded Legends.
@@laroetea Yuuzahn Vong Style extra galactic threat would be cool
The covenant controls most of the galaxy it even says so on halo waypoint and multiple different sources that predate 343 point to this being the case
"We've got a new contact, unknown classification!"
“Kill it, or cry”
"slipspace rupture detected, slipspace rupture detected, slipspace rupture detected"
"it isn't one of ours, take it out"
Jjaro
@@Baldus-the_bald_guy that hits me in the feels harder than a plasma bolt. 😔
Sentient alien ships called the collectors? The council has dismissed this claim
Those weren’t in the Sol System until after the H-C war
@@MeddlerPropagandist14 the council has made their decision, commander
Nice reference
I’m commander Shepard and this is my favorite reference on the citadel
So a battlegroup approaches and you leave a single ship. That seems like an ambassador, no? An attack on the ambassador's ship would illicit a response, and upon taking over the humans ship, given they know enough to broadcast civilian IFFs, they would probably be able to realise the humans response was due to already being at war. The logical thing to do, therefore, would be to disengage and keep watching the humans, waiting for another opportunity to send an ambassador at a less stressful time.
Not if the Cole protocol was done unless they left captured survivors but you would think that if they would be friendly they would return the prisoners after they found out what happened and if the 11 other ships were escort ships for the ambassador ship wouldn't they stay in position well the ambassador ship advance incase something happened instead of just leaving it and not doing it job the travel there would be though sub space so the travel to the destination would not be that dangerous and having a escort would not make any potential dangers of sub space travel less dangerous so if they were not going to stick around at all having a escort fleet would be useless unless they weren't planning on contacting just observing
@@kennyburkamp4054 This makes me think of Star Ocean with the entry Till the End of Time. There are database entries on scouting areas of the galaxy including things like combat scout fleets for the first reconnaissance missions. It could be a civilization that sends combat scouts to new areas that are truly unknown to them. As for the Cole Protocol, it could have been so fast they didn't have time to carry it out. If the attackers could rapidly take down the carrier while ignoring the others I don't see any reason the crew couldn't be left without enough time.
That is a terrifying story, I could only imagine the horror after the Human-Covenant War that when asked about the incident, and the Covenant responds that they never engadged humanity here on that day, both sides now realizing that something, even if only in small number, was out there...
Whenever they decide to conclude Chiefs story this needs to be explored. Imagine the series going outside the Milkyway to track these unknowns. Better then "Oh hey the Endless a new enemy tht is somehow better then everyone".
@@michaelhuie2661 ah yes so getting
"new enemy that is somehow better than everybody" would be better than "new enemy that is somehow better than everybody"
@@airrider-jk9ikThe Endless are shit and their reveal was shit. Besides the Flood would probably still infiltrate this mystery ship.
@@hrthrhs nah, endless are great
@@airrider-jk9ikI’d prefer something new like an extra galactic threat similar to the Yuuzahn Vong from The Star Wars Expanded Universe.
Honestly, I'm just amazed that Totem Lake is going to become important enough to get a carrier named after it.
I know a lot of lore. But this is new and man this will bug me for years to come.
Same
Yeah I agree. I’d just come to peace with the visitors on installation 04 but now this!
I wonder if it’s the same species that crashed onto installations 04 and 05
Every ship design for the UNSC is perfect, change my mind
i wouldnt say every single one is perfect, ahem poseiden class light carrier ahem vindication class light battleship ahem, but a lot of them are good
Lol, the hero ship always gets destroyed 😂, so 🎤 ⬇️💥
I do actually really like a lot of the designs though, but i wouldn't go so far to say perfect. Perfection doesn't exist.
@@Baldus-the_bald_guy100% agree, most of 343i design just don't hit the same
And tbh the fact that the Autumn class is just upscale Pillar of Autumn just seems lazy to me
@@Bernoris Yeah... Mulsanne looks pretty good, though.
Battlegroup Rhino: "Here we come to f*ck you up!"
Also BR: "It's a prank bro!"
The last thing you want when you're already at war.
Ah, yes, 'the Endless'. The immortal race of sentient squids allegedly waiting in dark space. We have dismissed this claim.
* chooses renagade option *
So, are they like the Ceph, from the Crysis series?
Helbard class Destroyers will always be my favorite design.
That's interesting I've never heard of this event. A task force of ancient humans would be cool. Or a all new alien race would be cool too.
Or….
Meddlers💪💪👊👊👊🔥🔥🔥🔥
@@MeddlerPropagandist14 That is a logical assumption. I always assumed they died out some time between that terminal referencing them and the era the games take place in, but nothing confirms that or even puts it as a possibility other than sheer time passage.
@@ALLMINDmercenarysupportsystem I personally think their still out their watching the Milky Way, why did they release the flood on In 05? Who knows all I hope is that they aren’t the Endless and They Use Slip Space guns(idk random BS)
@RAWDOGGER420 I also hope they aren't Endless, but I think that's the way 343's going. As for Delta Halo, that's probably an accident. No evidence for any motive (or an accident, admittedly), but this is the simplest solution.
The extragalactic advanced flood checking if humans were far enough along the tech tree to be worth eating yet. The UNSC's poor showing bought earth another few hundred years., but they'll be back.
A little frustrating though, that they had basically no data to report other than "Carrier went boom so we GTFO"
The narration fear of unknown, mystery all were too good, one of the best video, literally giving mass effect 2 vibes the collector
I’ve never heard of this before. Seems crazy. You need to make more videos like this. It gives many questions like who were these ships and that one ship managed to take out a ship with no problems at all. And why did the other ships leave but one out of the 12 unknown ship stay behind? I don’t think I’ve heard any of the halo UA-cam channels talk about this an event before. It’s like that one Unkown ship that crashed on installion 04 that spark didn’t know about at all. And also send out a distress message until spark blocked it. And another question is what were these 12 Unkown ships doing so close to earth and why were they there in the first place? So many questions🧐 were these ships searching for something before they left? Do these 12 unknown ships ever make another appearance or is this their last appearance? Have the covenant battled against these unknown ships as well? I don’t think these ships are apart of the banished either.
Another question is why did those 12 unknown ships even have old IFF codes anyway in the first place? And I can’t see these ships being related to the covenant since they wouldn’t run from the humans. That and covenant ships don’t just take a human ship down with one shot like that. And the banished wouldn’t just run either and then go into slip space just like the covenant as well. Plus the humans ships would have know that those 12 unknown ships would be covenant and wouldn’t just try to talk to them for identification. Plus the covenant by this point isn’t even at earth yet since regret is the first to go to earth in the timeline. And another thing is who else knew the location of our solar system and the location of earth besides the covenant years later in 2052 and humanity? And possibly the banished if they knew earth by the time halo 2 took place in oct of 2552. That I’m not sure of but we do know that the banished had to of formed around 2540 something so they would be around in 2552 obviously as halo wars 2 and the comics about the banished confirmed that. And it’s not that the 12 unknown ships had old IFF codes but I believe the video said they were civilian IFF codes which is also interesting. And I also doubt that this was ONI’s doing as well. And the endless by this point are locked up at like installation 07 so I don’t know if it’s them either.
The reason why you haven't heard of this is that this is just from like a super small piece of information that was in a Halo Loot Crate only
Is it possible they are remnants of the Ancient Human Empire?
@@nightwing2032 If they werent hostile at first, maybe its all they had to communicate, and they were only retaliating?
@@nightwing2032maybe decendants from a generationship that developed their own tech and searched for their old home?
My guess is these unidentified ships have some relation to the meddlers (who by now are very likely the endless)
Ever since we read the halo ce terminals and learned of an unknown ship crash landing onto delta halo, we've speculated a lot as to what could have been inside of it, and the vessel itself was not forerunner (despite having similar design structure)
My guess is these ships are likely the remaining remnants of the meddlers who've been secretly roaming through various systems (for unknown reasons of course, hell knows what they were doing near one of saturns moons)
The only thing that holds this theory back is the outdated IFF transponder codes, I cannot come up with a reason as to why the meddlers would have something like that (you could say it might be insurrection but I very much doubt they have ships that can one shot a large vessel with minimal effort)
As for the other 11 ships leaving the system, my guess is they left one behind to ensure there was no evidence to gather from what they were doing so they took out the strongest vessel in the battlegroup to ensure the rest of the battlegroup would retreat and preventing any attempts to interact with the unknown vessel, perhaps a "Leave no evidence that we were here." type of act. (although saying that sounds silly since they destroyed a vessel which was the evidence but from what you're saying it sounds to me like the vessel wasn't entirely destroyed, more like it was hijacked by the unknown vessel and was brought into the fleet)
I have to say those I've never actually heard of this event before, it's certainly news to me.
Thats just a theory on my part though, if I'm wrong then feel free to correct me.
not all forerunners died either so could be a remnant or renegade group or who knows what, but the endless also work, long as the follow up writing is good then it's not a major issue either way
Nah, its the Greys..... they were never a myth. Heck the Chief could see their galaxy looking up at the sky from the "Ark"
@@yulfine1688 Wait I thought the didact was the last remaining forerunner to survive after the forerunner flood war?
Y'know cuz he was corrupted by the logic plague and was locked inside a cryptum by his wife (the librarian) for his traitorous acts?
Also it brings me to another point which also holds my theory back as I stated before, why do they have old IFF transponder codes?
@horrorpleb249 I'll have to double check the lores more convoluted these days
@@Horrorpleb Maybe they found Earth by finding humans in another system or in deep space and forcing the information from them or their ships.
Love that I was born in Totem lake Kirkland. Had no clue there was a UNSC carrier Totem Lake. Absolutely epic.
What a timely video for me given I recently finished Halo 2 a few weeks ago and am now working on my own video discussing my thoughts on it. Halo 2 might be the best Halo game I’ve played with regards to lore expansion and world building. This seems to add a little more to it. I can’t wait to play Halo 3 for the first time soon!
Your in for a treat, i personally enjoy every Halo game, I have for the last 20 years.
@@RJ-91 same here I don’t dislike any Halo game I’ve played even if some have some lesser qualities then the other
@@OrionInSpace even Halo 5, as it has the weakest story, I do appreciate it for what it is.
@@RJ-91 Halo 5 is without a doubt my most played halo game from a multiplayer prospect. Almost level 151 and climbing. Warzone was very good for this game and I’m shocked Infinite did not bring it over.
humans were at war with aliens for a long time but this story seems like humans just found it's first contact with an alien race and it gives me goose bumps
First. Let me use this as an opportunity to say thank you for all of these amazingly thorough videos sir! You make us sci-fi nerds proud!
Seems strange that the carrier would be the lead ship in the battle group. Would expect the frigates would be leading as scouts/picket ships followed by the cruisers and the carrier. This would give the carrier sufficient time to respond to any aggressive actions by an enemy/target since the carrier would be the ship with the greatest firepower.
Perhaps the unidentified ship's attack had enough range to target and destroy the Totem Lake before the captain had time to make those orders.
@@thebaron3283 Starting at 9:22 it states that the unknown ship concentrated on the "lead ship of Battle Group Rino". Sounds like the carrier was "leading" the charge towards the target.
@@Thoridin58 Or more accurately, the rest of the BG was in a screening pattern around the ship, but the unknown decided to target the biggest ship as its CO likely assumed (and did so correctly) that it was the 'head' of the group. Carriers these days actually don't 'lead from the front' as they're they most important ship in the Battlegroup. Other ships take various positions around them, both to screen the ship, and to act as 'guard ships' should a pilot be forced to ditch.
@@Thoridin58Lead ship could also mean the ship leading the Battlegroup ie; the command ship which would be the Epoch.
Consider the following: It was Oni, and that was the testing area for a UNSC infinity prototype of some kind.
Maybe this what caused the building of the Infinity to be moved to the Oort Cloud
Now I’m curious if these mystery ships have ever had an encounter with the Covenant. I hope it actually equates to something big similar to what happened in KOTOR where there was a small early hint of the Yuuzahn Vong by showing one of the early scout ships enter the galaxy.
An Extra Galactic threat from outside the Milky Way invading the Galaxy would be so awesome.
Sounds like ONI shenanigans
That was the first thing that came to my mind as well
Maybe a Point Blank Prowler
@@MeddlerPropagandist14 With that kind of firepower? And no signs of boarding pods?
@@WolfeSaberExperimentation with forerunner tech, possibly
@@that_one_helljumper With that level of control?
Okay this was fantastic and I don't think I've ever heard about this. What's the source material?
I was interested too.
Halopedia says it's from the Halo Legendary Crate. Data drop #2.
@@thestormwaroh so fanfic
@@The_noticer-u2b The Legendary Crate data drops were all fully-canon material, written by 343's franchise writing team.
@@BaconShelf oh written by 343? So fanfic?
@@The_noticer-u2b😂
The I.F.F is why on the level "343 Guilty Spark" on HALO COMBAT EVOLVED the flood was originally identified as yellow on our huds. Then our suits and own I.F.F transponders fixed it once they found out what happened.... But that's just my theory
I do hope they follow up with this it honestly sparks more interest in me then the current story
Probably just SG-1 and their inter-dimensional shenanigans.
I remember reading this on the wiki. But it doesn’t seem like the ship itself was lost if they were boarded. The ship was likely captured id say. But since there’s no info on whether or not the ship was captured or destroyed who knows?
I will say that the flood are the only ones capable of boarding and taking over a ship extremely quickly. They did it in ghosts of Onyx, Mona Lisa, infinite succor and site 22 shows that there are still old Forerunner ships with flood on board. Who’s to say these aren’t ancient human ships? Surely plenty of FLEETS were lost without a trace.
Even for the flood these... tactics are odd.
11 ships leave and only 1 remains? (doesn't sit right for me)
Why not destroy the entire battlegroup so it can be fused with the flood?
And even then what would their goal have been in that moment?
@@Horrorpleb the flood uses bait and switch tactics. They baited Keyes and the marines and later chief in Halo CE. They did the same thing on those other ships too. With the exception of the covenant ships during ghosts of onyx.
They would prefer to leave no witnesses rather than outright attack. So why not take over the biggest ship and leave it there? Also once someone’s infect they are basically in the hivemind so it’s likely if it is flood, they know what protocol is. They made the slip space jumps because they knew they have have to be engaged.
If they engaged the whole fleet and that whole fleet was destroyed, it would have prompted the UNSC to send a bigger response to them which would make their presence known and defeat the purpose of their goal.
But this would mean the Flood likely learned Earth Location. Wasn’t that something the Gravemind only learned during Halo 3?
@@slicer940 I can see what you mean by bait and switch tactics, they've used such tactics before even on the mona lisa, keeping their presence hidden so anyone would board without suspecting a major threat (albeit ONI already knew of their presence but the marines carrying out the mission had no clue)
Albeit it brings me to another question, how did they get ahold of ships such as these that could one shot a large vessel?
I was also wondering why they never decided to show up when high charity went to the ark (but I could assume they wanted to keep the fleet hidden so they could be used in the near future for some sort of counter-offensive against humanity and all other races and they could perhaps link up with the flood infestation that happened at site 22 resulting in the first ever flood infected spartan)
Perhaps this could be in link with humanities final test that was given to them by the precursors?
And if this was a flood outbreak, when did it occur and how did it occur?
I HEAVLY doubt the floods involvement here I mean think about it… THE FLOOD earth would have been a Biological Hell when John and blue team came back
Dude I love the idea that the human covenant war got so big that it got the attention of other galaxies and far off civilizations that dwarf the forerunners. I know that ain’t really what the video is about but it’s a cool idea
My only thought was some ancient humans that got caught in some kind of time anomaly. Like from before the whole Forerunner war defeat and species reset. They would be much further advanced than anything
@ShimmyFrI know it would be unlikely to be compatible, but the expanded lore have pulled that stupid bullshit about how the Librarian genetically engineered humanity to guide them toward developing certain technology. Maybe humanity would have ended up building compatible comms 🤷♂️ it’s a weak theory lol
00, you often ask for suggestions for episodes, so in light of the closing of Rooster Teeth and the premiere of the finale of Red vs Blue. A most detailed breakdown of RvB as a tribute to the lore of its universe and the fact that it has had multiple Easter eggs and promotions for Halo.
I'd love to. But I won't. I made a video about the Halo Community a couple years back and featured a small clip from RvB to celebrate their contributions, and they copyright claimed the video. Initially I thought it was youtube messing around so I challenged it, but they rejected it anyway. So for risk of that happening again, I won't be covering any RvB content.
Love mysteries like this in Halo
The Epoch class heavy carrier is on the thumb nail, LETS GOOOO!!!!
(yes, its my favorite)
A carrier is powerful enemy even to the covenant, to be unaffected by a assault like that is something only the covenants can take.
I can only imagine how scary this must have been… god damn…
Could this be the first interaction with a Banished Raiding party? Their ships are quite powerful and in Infinite look distinct from other Covenant designs and likely would engage in boarding and rebroadcasting signals
The Banished and Insurrectionists are the most likely candidates, the Flood and the Endless are a possibility too but they are less likely.
But why would they be using Is old civilian human iffs?
@@mariobadia4553 To get close to the UNSC forces without being shot on sight
DO NOT ATTACK THE EPOCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I mean it's macs where horrible. Mark 2 which is the same strength as the paris heavy frigate, charon and stelwart 😭😭
@benjaminbohrn5696 It is a carrier. If its MAC strength is important, then somebody screwed up.
@@ALLMINDmercenarysupportsystem they should have added a More powerful MAC to it, I mine a f**kng Paris MAC? Really? On a 2.5km ship? That’s some bullshit right there
At least give it a Cruiser MAC!
EDIT: Forgot to mention It’s MAC is rapid fire soooooo yeah
@@MeddlerPropagandist14 This is like saying every carrier IRL should have battleship guns. A carrier has no need for this type of weapon, and a better MAC would take up valuable space needed for hangars and munitions. I'd say that the carrier shouldn't have a MAC at all, really.
@@ALLMINDmercenarysupportsystem all hangers(that we know of) are towards the rear of the Epoch
So logically having a Cruiser MAC wouldn’t be detrimental in anyway
Maybe some Crew compartments aren’t there but I’d rather have A bigger gun than some people who run around being useless in battle
This is tge perfect story for a game another group of humans that used a different technology base that they discovered while exploring and built up another human government from it. So much material to pull from
You know, the more i see your video the more idea i have for my fanfic in this DAMN universe.
This interesting as we know they aren't the Covenant, being able to almost instantly destroy a carrier. Two burning questions I have are:
1. Why did they fall back, when they saw Battle Group Rhino?
2. Why do they have human IFF tags (outdated sure, but still)?
I’m surprised I’ve never heard about this before, good stuff. If there are any more of these obscure mysteries in the halo universe, would you consider making videos on them too?
Absolutely! If people like this kind of content, I'll make more of it.
@@Installation00Please do! It's very interesting and mysterious
Never heard of this before, how the hell has this stayed hidden?!
What’s this from, the conversations from the universe book? (Forget the name)
This information comes from the data drops included in the old Halo Legendary Crates; each one came with a few little data drops to flesh out more obscure pockets of the setting.
They went full warhammer on this with the unknown and unexplainable threats lurking in deep space lol
Given that the rest of the Halo Milky Way galaxy is STILL unexplored in full, who knows what actual factions and society’s could be out there that developed from Forerunner tech worlds. Or other races that were seeded after the Rings were fired. The Forerunners had to have known about TONS of other species then the ones we know in the galaxy, especially sapient ones that would make large civilizations.
I can see a space faring race that grew up inside older forerunner and human ships/structures but with signs of cannibalization. (Aka signs of shoddy repairs and that ships had to be scrapped for parts.) Maybe go full Homeworld style with it! It would totally fit!
@@shcdemolisher
Given what we know, the Human-Covenant War only spanned 100 light years across from an galactic empire that engulfed thousands of lights of years sphere of influence in a galaxy that is 100,000 lights across.
Under the Imperial Palace in fact.
More like 3 body problem
When you said, they looked human, I thought they were Insurrectionists. But a single ship with that much power doesn't seem human.
One slight correction to the whole thing with IFF: Not returning a 'Friend' response does not mean you're automatically a 'foe'. It means you're an "Unknown", and while you're correct that you'll be treated as "Potentially Hostile" until proven otherwise, NATO regs (which the UNSC pulls from) don't allow engagement until something is proven hostile, and their are strict criteria that must be met.
Basically....
1. They actually shoot at you
2. They take "aggressive actions" (lock their radar onto you, turn to an intercept heading, etc)
3. You have multi-factor authentication (their radar signature matches a known hostile, or they came from a direction of known hostiles when first detected)
4. You have visual identification that they are hostile.
Obviously on the ground, for infantry, you'll be seeing more of a mix of 1 and 4, but for aircraft, ships, and space craft, you'll be seeing all four.
This is so cool! Not gonna lie I'm of the opinion that it might be ancient humans or something similar, and am totally going to use this as fodder for my halo fan fic towards that end lol
Could explain why they had civilian IFF they probably thought that they were linking up with their brethren only for unfamiliar ships to approach them.
@@AngelsCreed-jo5fpPlus They did get fired upon So you could say this was self-defense.
Unknown contact guts enemy ship neutralising its threat but enacts simultaneous numerous boarding parties? They most likely wanted to sweep the ship and capture as much intel as possible. No doubt they’ve updated IFF Transponders now…
Pretty sure this is detailing the moment Covenant vessels first showed up in Sol prior to Halo 2. Note that the amount of unknown vessels were similar to the number of ships in Regret’s fleet. The use of _human_ civilian transponders indicates captured war material being put to use as a smokescreen against prying eyes. Had this been an unknown third party, there would be no reason for them to have access to such things, much less use them, only to immediately attack the battle group coming to intercept.
could be the forerunners that left before the halos were fired. we know the forerunners have transporter like capabilities with the didacts prometheans. would stand to reason they werent only on requiem, but that some went with the fleeing forerunner as guardians and soldiers
God, I hope they are Anicent Humans! That would be badass.
It’s The Collectors!
I bet 343 will pick this up and somehow relate it to the Endless lol
Meddlers> FRAUDless
Better than leaving it unresolved
It already seems likely that the Meddlers are those Endless who weren't picked up by the Forerunners, so probably.
I mean there is nothing else, so that's sort of the only option if they do, bungie was very inconsistent with certain things and people forget 343 did pull from some of bungies old ideas etc and worked them into games, so unless the rest of all of those concepts etc were leaked we don't really know.
I think it was 343 that created this plot thread in the first place.
That’s some heavy words before the intro. Looking forward to this one
Hi, what if it wasn’t an alien ship, rather it was the Under construction, infinity, here’s what I think happened the infinity and fleet of ships that were building her we’re in orbit of the moon however, they sent out the wrong ID codes when confronted by a battle group, they tried to jump the infinity away with the rest of ship but jump Drive did not work fearing the secret of the Infiniti would get out the commander on the bridge of the infinity fired the main battery guns which destroyed the the over ship when Lord Hood heard of it, he realised it must’ve been infinity and all good, no pursuit as he and Office of naval intelligence wanted to protect the secret of the infinity. This is what I think happened thankyou paul
Maybe the covenant tried to use captured iif transponders from early in the war to scout the area regret would be going but dew ti spotting human ships they retreated to tell regret that there would be a small human presence but maybe they hadn’t spotted earth yet and their strongest ship decided to retaliate and destroy the totem lake before also leaving
Idk I try’s to make this so that it could be the covenant but they still don’t know about earth
if it was covenant, would they not relay information back to their home fleet about the large presents of humanity on earth. Taking place just before halo 2 my thoughts are that it could be Ancient Humanity or a unidentified race possibly meddlers on installation 04. not much is known about their capability's or ships. Outdated IFFs is also weird i mean covenant can use them but they were so far into the war that they had no need too. Flood is also possible but they had no activity at that time in that location nor did they have captured ships to fly. my best guess is Old Humanity, Meddlers, or a unknown new alien species. Without information its anyone's guess.
Something shot your ship in the dark space and you don't know where the source of the fire is
That might've been the most terrifying thing to experience when you can't see anything in space imo.
Unknown contact slipping in
An intrguing, little known, piece of lore. Thanks for taking the time to create a video on it. The most likely candidate are the Banished potentially scoping out Earth as a threat and/or humanity as a potential ally. Explains some of the similarities to the Covenant (ship of overwhelming power) and differences (initial attempt at subterfuge, pulling ships out when under threat but leaving behind a rear guard). Meta reasoning - the Data Drop was released the same year as Halo Wars 2 so brand synergy.
Other option - the person writing this Data Drop was unaware of the stated reason for the Covenant's finding of Earth and created their own justification in a classic 343 Left Hand doesn't know what the Right Hand is doing situation.
Given 343's handling of narrative so far I also would not put it past them making the bare-bones of a story found in a Data Drop the lynchpin of a sea-shift in their universe however.
Its the Athens not the Atlas ;-)
Great video man! Would love to see more content about some of the more obscure lore.
They HAD to have gone back to investigate the Carrier's wreck, even if it's now a hushed ONI black site.
I think it's implied the wreck is completely missing. Likely captured
I wish that this wasn't the banished but it probably was.
I'm really hoping it was one of those unknown races that
the Forerunners rendered extinct somehow surviving or
the A.I.'s of the Ancient Humanity/Ancestors.
Can't recall where that animated unsc cruiser spinning and firing is from, if someone could answer that
From the content of this vid, I would theorise ships of alien origin. Possible Fore-runner infiltration, but unknown intent. The destructive power of this single ship would be reasoned as an older, technologically advanced race. However, given how things were with the Covenant, 3rd Fleet should have gone to battle alert and made all haste to Battle Group Rhino!
Just a small addition to my last comment. Another contender for the indentity of those 12 ships, Guardians! Not something I have found much in the lore, but the tech level would suggest this faction. What interest the Guardians would have around Saturn is anyone's guess. But that is my best guess.
Is it possible they were the Remnants of the Ancient Human Empire? If so, that would be cool, we barely know anything about them, and I would love to read up more on them. Could explain how they have a civilian IFF albiet old.
I wish, or if they were another species that survived the Forerunner expansion,
since Humanity is not the first sentient species that they nearly/fully estinguished.
But most likely they were the Banished or some Sht.
the carrier should have stayed back with the cruisers covering it. Send the frigates plus a few longsword flights to investigate the unknown vessels.
whoever they were, they clearly didn't want the UNSC to know anything about them, which makes it unlikely that it's any faction we don't currently know of.
What we now is:
They attacked the biggest ship nearly instantly destroying it, then boarded it.
They had old civilian IFF codes
They left survivors
They had all but one of their ships flee.
given they didn't eradicate every ship, they clearly had a bigger problem with killing everyone, then with having been discovered. this is enough information to gleam it is probably a first contact scenario. with the most likely alternative explanation being espionage.
Here is the real question why didn't the UEG/UNSC not reversed engineer the Ancient Human Prime Cruiser that was found? The technology of that ship alone would've accelerated the technology curve of the UEG by a good portion especially the weapons and power drives, it's funny because here he talks about a mysterious fleet that left one lone ship that "destroyed " a 2.5km long carrier with ease,how,what weapons was used for that achievement, then coincidence that with them finding the AH vessel.
a little later than i was planning for the watch of this video. But very good video 00!
My bet is on some Endless survivors.
Around this time wasn't Maria-062 testing the MK6 that was to be given to Chief?
Ancient Forthenconian humans ?
The meddlers of Halo CE terminal
Decepticons
I wonder how different the war would have been had Humanity been using their war time economy instead of waiting to warn the colonies of invasion days before hand.
Meaning every human worlds knew about the Covenant attacks and where activity working to counter the Covenant. Long before the Covenant showed up to each human world.
It would have been a more prolonged war, could Humanity win? Probably not
I would like to imagine the UNSC infinity and Thanatos class battleships would play a HUGE role in the War
@RAWDOGGER420 the Covenant would definitely suffer more casualties has humanity had time to fortified their worlds.
maybe had the chance to use more of the Nova Nukes on Covenant fleets
@@armycowboy4313 I think N.O.V.A bombs are the Keaton Victory over the Covenant, if there were more nova B’s than the UNSC would have Likely Won
Step 1: Go to high charity with decent sized fleet
Step 2: Launch the Nova with other missiles to have the covenant thinking it’s just harmless archer missiles
Step 3: *BOOM*
Step 4: Rose are Red Violets are Blue… Sangheilios is now a Astroid field… How about you
Step 5: Rinse and Repeat
@RAWDOGGER420 I mean Oni did use stealth ship so the could easily deploy the Nova bomb.
The other reason I think the war would go differently is war is the mother of inventions, having the entire human race working to defeat the Covenant they would be pumping out new and stronger weapons. Pretty much like things from the ( prototype from halo legends)
"They're in the walls, they're in the goddamn walls!"
There's something else out there... and man, that is fucking terrifying.
Edit: whats even more daunting is the fact that they were using outdated codes, meaning they either came across a lost unsc fleet, or they killed them and stole the codes. The "unknown" aspect is what makes my skin crawl, and thats why i rewlly wish 343 would have kept the forerunners out of the main campaigns (for as much as i love the Didact).
back to lore ship sizes? use your 2.65x larger numbers, they make sense, and your following is large enough, you may get them to catch on and force 343 to concede to your superior math.
Ancient Humanity?
Since I'm here on the early side for once I'm listing some faction facts about who could've and who could not have been our perpetrators here. This is obviously up for discussion so I'd like to hear what you all have to think too.
ONI (Very unlikely, but possible. They probably would've heard Chief's news before the majority of the UNSC that Earth is soon to be found, so a reasonable assumption would be that even if it was ONI then they would've all jumped unless they had something to hide and needed the Rhino Battlegroup to fall back before finding something. I don't think it would've been ONI especially with how 343i doesn't seem to release a lot of ONI content, but I could be wrong. I also haven't read the books and my knowledge is based on UA-cam.
Insurrectionists (Unlikely they would have that firepower, and also probably wouldn't linger to fight a whole battlegroup if it could be avoided)
The Banished (Firepower possible, but highly unlikely they'd be within our solar system. Also, why would they have outdated human IFF transponders?)
The Endless (I have no idea, just throwing it out there)
The Didact? (We know he composed humans into prometheans and could have some outdated tech on board and/or in use, but I also don't think he would've been this close as he likely would've started a new conflict. I also don't know of any 'recent' human interaction or conflict with the Didact before the events of H4.
The Flood from the games (practically impossible given that Installation 04 was destroyed along with the Gravemind aboard the Truth And Reconciliation, and also because the Indulgence Of Conviction that flew in during H3 would've been infected after the events of H2 on Installation 05.)
Meddlers (There was a ship of unknown origin that crash landed on Alpha Halo way before HCE. I think it's been said that it predates all Human or Covenant space-travel. Spark had no idea who they were and built a'"sarcophagus" around their ship when it became evident that nobody survived the landing. Some theories dive into the idea of an extragalactic race running from the Flood and trying to find a way to stop it. Either way, we have no idea who or what they are. They're practically as mysterious and canonically present as Halo itself, and there is plenty of lore about the ancient Flood from the books fleeing the galaxy during the events of the Human/Forerunner war. They're still out there and we have no idea what's been happening beyond our galaxy. This will lead into the Flood from the books below.)
(((Side note: I'm going to be honest, I never even knew this to be a real faction. I always assumed that 'meddler' was a name given to Covenant forces doing what they do with Forerunner artifacts.)))
The Flood from the books etc (We know that some Flood had escaped the galaxy and weren't killed off by the Halo array back around the time of the Human/Forerunner/Flood war. They'd 100% have the firepower to take out practically any ship. There are HiddenXperia videos about the possibility of Precursor or Flood-controlled ships leaving the galaxy around the time that Humans fought the Flood. They did this to allow conflict to start between the other two factions without actually being present for part of it. The Forerunners had no idea that the Humans were running from something, they just assumed it was a territorial conflict. Who knows how much (many?) Flood there are beyond the Milky Way. By this point in time they'd probably be the most advanced faction in the known universe. I wouldn't put my money on this because of how fan-fictioney it sounds and because there probably would've been a coordinated Flood attack with the Gravemind that flew in during H3 which didn't happen. I feel that this would be somewhat probable, but there's some good points that could be argued against it. I don't think that these are the guys we're after here, but I would love it if they were.) If HiddenXperia somehow comes across this, I'd just like you to know that you're by far my main source of Flood lore. 👌 Thanks.
That's all I got, thanks for reading & expanding.
Late reply to this but possibly Old Humanity, Ancient humanity they would have ships able to broadcast IFFs not sure if it would be proper IFFS used from today's humanity but it's possible they could have found derelict Civilian Vessels and used that. I like your idea of the meddlers that's very possible same reasons for IFFS above. the Flood is unlikely in my eyes due to the fact they would not retreat, and they were not present at the time in between early halo 2. They were still on high charity and had only captured ships of the Covenant. I truly think its ether Meddlers or Ancient Humanity. Endless is highly unlikely as well. Hope they shed light on this more in the future.
This seems like a panic-retcon to make us try to care more about the endless, considering how (i'm assuming) most of us were disinterested. We had a new threat each 343 game; it got tiring. I wanted to fight well-rounded, well-written forces that would span a trilogy. I never wouldve guessed that was going to be way too much to ask for. :/
The odds of a splinter covenant group is higher than the Endless suggested in the comments. Piracy was also prevalent and interest by the Covenant was likely leaked to 3rd parties that took the lead to look for artifacts and treasures of value to the Covenant or other parties.
I was actually thinkimg something like Jackal pirates with some modified CAS or something, even tho I don't think a CAS would be able to go toe to toe with a UNSC battle group consisting of an Epoch, 2 Marathons and a few Paris class frigates.
I would almost posit that the ships could have been Banished. The only hangup is that Rhino probably would have recognized them as modified Covie ships.
Mhm, but the Banished have absolutely no reason to be there.
I can see something like
The collectors in mass effect being halo
Must be the Borg or the Daleks has to be 😅
I got a question for you Installation 00, humans have anti gravity technology in the form of repulsor tech at this time. Boeing has a patent that NASA is now considering to use where it will produce a super heated plasma in front of a spacecraft to produce a sort of shield since the hotter plasma becomes the more solid and durable it becomes. But what gets me is that part of the Boeing patent is that this plasma shield would be controlled and directed with magnetic fields. So why didnt the UNSC NOT use this to their advantage and have their ships deflect the Covie Plasma with their repulsor tech? It would have improved a ship's survivability in battle no doubt with tech that is already installed on their ships.
W vid installation00 as always :).
UNSC Naval strategy is really lacking if the carrier was the one leading the entire battlegroup. Isn't the whole reason behind having an escort fleet to protect the flagship and your heavy hitters?
What’s your source for this? I’ve never heard of this engagement before
Now this may be very theoretical but would it be possible fotr the UNSC to make use of a gun type nuclear boom (little boy for refrence) in a rail gun as by may measure this would solve the terminal effects issue of slugs? especially in space where HE is practically inert compared to the power that the mass of the material holds especially in the case of rail guns projectile, pluss then you have the added benfit of the emp pulse which could play hacoc with the shields of enemies warships. you wouldnt even need a complicated implosion device just to parts that make up a critical mass of enriched uranium there may be the increased danger of spontaneous fishion if not handled well but with proper neutron shielding inside and outside the device this shouldn't be a problem, you could even still accommodate a solid material for the rest of the slug with just ferisous inserts forged into it that alow for magnetic manipulation and subsequent acceleration, having a lower density Mabey aluminium core which crumples during impact allowing the round to hit-crumple then form the critical mass at the surface of the target, you could even lace it with cobolt or depleted uranium casing it you wanted to make it spicy, or seeing as the unsc already understand fushion mabey using a lithium stabilised deuterium volume that collapses in into the shot trap Infront of the ball of enriched unraium making the boom even more powerful and even targeted if you where favouring penetration (shaped changes work with nukes to), the diameter of rail guns along with there throtable nature makes this a very usefull if a little expensive for the unsc but compared to the number of DDs and CL that they lost im sure it makes sense to use nukes more frequently, there fitting agents extinction so modern taboos dont really apply pluss yet again space is already irradiated. (very long post im sure but its kinda a pet theory of mine)
Can you qoute the source for this event. I just havent heard this before
Probally was The BAnished.
This would make for a Great Halo Game! Encountering a Truly New Threat that may even be more Powerful than the Covenant!
None of this "the Endless" Shit that 343 is Pushing.
Plus there's the Mystery of that 1 Unidentified Ship in the Halo Combat Evolved Terminal that was shown.
Has to be the Flood. I'm guessing they've taken over a colony and set sail with all the ships they could muster. Perhaps jumped out of system with most ships so as not to put all their eggs in one basket.
The Flood would've simply attacked Earth. They have no reason to be coy.
It would be cool if these are the meddlers and are not the endless but at the same time it would be a way to connect them. Perhaps at some point we’ll get a new alien.
Interesting... I know it's probably gonna be made about the endless, but what if it's ancient humans? I know ancient humans would probably not use IFF tags but for story theming and flow what if the out of date IFF's hint to ancient humanity and what if these ships have to do with the ship that crashed on installation 04 that guilty spark found?
Why does this feel more alien then anything 343 is putting out
I wonder if in the halo universe earth still has a water based fleet that they still use, thats the modern day equivalent of every single navy put together, and same with an air force
Something tells me that this battle might be important later in the story
You know? My top two favorite titles ever are Halo and Alien.
In this order.
They are both similar and share a lot of things, concepts etcetera.
BUT... There's a "but". Halo have a a gear more when it comes to space battles.
There's nothing like that in Alien. No Covenant, no space battles. So those beautiful ships we see in the movies are just part of the scenary instead of being acting characters and this is something that really limits Alien franchise and gives Halo the primacy in my list.
Other than having multiple alien races, Spartans, ODST, tanks, etc... and yes, I know Aliens lore actually have some space battles between the UAAC and UPP and tanks too... But they're still limited to the lore and not seen in any movies nor videogames.
What a shame, what waste of potential... 😖
Is this from one of the newer books? i haven’t heard of it before
@Installation00 This question is irrelevant to the video but when mentioning the regrets fleet I thought back to lord hood’s comparison to the fleet at reach and wondered could the mantle’s approach have been able protect reach against the covenant? I’m curious what you think of the idea.