It’s also the odd scar choice. It should tell us something but feels meaningless while meanwhile the face belt is just awesome and he doesn’t get that. That’s probably what feels off imo. - you even notice it in this entire bts shoot, they go on and on about the goblin king. What he he, who he is, part of a whole race. And then Azog gets a bunch of interesting designs and they go with the berserker, it’s so basic. Not bad, just not really interesting either.
They guy playing Azog seems like a really fun and cool person. He adapted really quickly to this weird way of acting and shooting a role, all things considered.
I like the design they ended up using for Azog, but man, it really should been an actual actor. I understand they were pressed for time, but making Azog just CGI was a huge mistake
@finnofzaun9209 It would hardly be impossible considering the prosthetics doing far more advanced stuff in LOTR. Fairly certain the reason is they changed their minds too late to reshoot the scenes with a practical version of the new design and cgi'd over what they had already made and used Azog's old design for the henchman he fed to his wolves
@finnofzaun9209 Gollum would not work with prosthetics because there's not a living person that thin. You'd need to find someone mega anorexic with the tiniest bone structure of all time to fit the prosthetics on. Meanwhile Azog is 90% a regular human with a missing arm and pointy ears. If they could make Lurtz and Gothmog practical, I don't know why Azog would be impossible. You can literally see scenes in there with the orc with pointy shoulder pads in scenes that ended up having Azog in it in the final product, such as the Moria scene and the cliff scene at the end of the movie. Honestly wouldn't surprise me if the Weather top scene was the only scene in the first movie Manu mo-capped for
@finnofzaun9209 You're not even reading what I'm typing... You're actually comparing an ape to a guy with pale skin and pointy ears. Azog and Ceasar are worlds apart in why you can't use prosthetics
Azog would’ve worked as a Cgi villain the team just didn’t have enough time to fully flesh out the animation. They are capable just look at Gollum. The problem was all of the orcs ended up being CGI when Azog should’ve been the only one.
CGI was the way to go. Azog and Bolg looked so different and much more powerful than the other orcs we'd seen up to that point, it felt refreshing from a design perspective. Practical effects are great and all, but sometimes I feel that the need to showcase them has become somewhat snobbish (-remembers that embarrassing JJ Abrams Force Awakens preview-). You gotta use the best tool for the job, not the shiniest.
Finally. I was scrolling through these comments and seeing the likes and it's insane to think either of the first two would have been a good Azog. They absolutely went the right direction.
@@InvertedFreeSolo The red bearded Azog is great. Not as Azog but as a character. The problem is that they overdid it. Azog competes with so many other orcs that are all clearly meant to be THE orc at some point that he doesn’t stand out, the pale orc is not bad but he almost feels under designed compared to the other ones that all show up in the film, no helmet or even decent armor until the final one… It’s not the CGI, it’s hoenstly the effect of (re)designing this guy on the fly.
What I do not understand is this: There is an orc in the Hobbit book that could have been easily used for the role that Azog has in the movies: Bolg. Instead they brought Azog back from the dead while they could have just used Bolg instead, and made Bolg a minor character that did not do anything really but fight Legolas....I really don't get that but I still love these movies anyway (I saw them as a kid).
@@melkuen5223 All of this I echo as well. Even the original maquette for Azog was better than the final design! They had a perfect orc villain in Bolg; huge, indimidating, gnarly, (like the early version with Conan Stevens), locked in a blood vendetta with Thorin because of their slain forebears. Treating Azog's absence as a "problem" from the source material to "solve" when the obvious answer was staring them in the face was a huge miscalculation. Despite this, I still go back and watch these films alongside LotR, but the mistakes and sense of missed opportunity still loom large. Also, I do like Manu Bennett as an actor, he was a darn good sport in the mo-cap process throughout. Even if he would have been a phenomenal prosthetic orc.
when you have to make a massive movie and well story. putting a book into a movie is alot harder than it seems, alot falls in the cracks and things that seem right in the moment of making arnt, @@oscarstainton
When I watched the movie for the first time I didn't really know what bothered me. Now I know. Azog is just kind of a huge baby. He looks a little out of place and uncanny. Nonetheless it does not damage the movie as much when you remember what pressure they all were under.
Azog is fine but compare him to Gothmog. Not because Gothmog isn’t CGI but he felt too basic almost. A big berserker. One handed. Who hates dwarves. He is not far off from being pretty good but in the end he turns out to just be all right. No fault of anyone really - just needed more time and some better writing particularly in the final movie where takes the role of a general but doesn’t fit it, he is a berserker, not some kind of tactician, they communicate as much via his design for two whole movies and THAT harms the character. He is AWESOME fighting. Let him fight. Let him intimidate, scream, rage. Instead he stands on the damn mountain and gives signals. Doesn’t fit.
A little bit....all three movies were twerked around compared to the Hobbit book! The Hobbit was A child's book and the studios came along and turned it into LOTR style.(ridiculous)
I wouldn't say wrong decisions, just proof that fast pre-production isn't Jackson's thing. Had he had the time to really search for a design for Azog, maybe they wouldn't have had needed to make him CGI, but rather use prosthetics for him. Eventually what sealed the deal on CGI Azog was the fact that they had already shot the movie with another Azog, and had to place the new Azog over the footage. Now I do believe tho, that all the concept arts and designs are better than what Azog ended up being. Hell, Borg is better than Azog in my book. But I do love Manu Bennett's voice to the character.
also remember PJ wanted to make it 1 film 2 max, but WB forced him to make 3 movies back to back like LOTR. people overhate the Hobbit, its a decent film and adaptation but sadly rushed @@MARYWTHER
It's insane how they had all of these beautifully sculpted and manufactured prosthetics and they decided to go with the PS3 character!
It’s also the odd scar choice. It should tell us something but feels meaningless while meanwhile the face belt is just awesome and he doesn’t get that. That’s probably what feels off imo. - you even notice it in this entire bts shoot, they go on and on about the goblin king. What he he, who he is, part of a whole race. And then Azog gets a bunch of interesting designs and they go with the berserker, it’s so basic. Not bad, just not really interesting either.
The first design was quite good and it made it into the battle of five armies.
They guy playing Azog seems like a really fun and cool person. He adapted really quickly to this weird way of acting and shooting a role, all things considered.
Azog was a bit naked. More armor would be nice.
I like the design they ended up using for Azog, but man, it really should been an actual actor. I understand they were pressed for time, but making Azog just CGI was a huge mistake
@finnofzaun9209 It would hardly be impossible considering the prosthetics doing far more advanced stuff in LOTR. Fairly certain the reason is they changed their minds too late to reshoot the scenes with a practical version of the new design and cgi'd over what they had already made and used Azog's old design for the henchman he fed to his wolves
@finnofzaun9209 Gollum would not work with prosthetics because there's not a living person that thin. You'd need to find someone mega anorexic with the tiniest bone structure of all time to fit the prosthetics on.
Meanwhile Azog is 90% a regular human with a missing arm and pointy ears. If they could make Lurtz and Gothmog practical, I don't know why Azog would be impossible.
You can literally see scenes in there with the orc with pointy shoulder pads in scenes that ended up having Azog in it in the final product, such as the Moria scene and the cliff scene at the end of the movie. Honestly wouldn't surprise me if the Weather top scene was the only scene in the first movie Manu mo-capped for
Just rewatched it and Peter literally says they replaced the original actor for Azog with the cgi copy
@finnofzaun9209 You're not even reading what I'm typing...
You're actually comparing an ape to a guy with pale skin and pointy ears. Azog and Ceasar are worlds apart in why you can't use prosthetics
@finnofzaun9209 The arm is like the only thing that demanded to be cgi, the rest of Azogs design doesn't.
Azog should've kept the bear claw pauldrons.
Azog would’ve worked as a Cgi villain the team just didn’t have enough time to fully flesh out the animation. They are capable just look at Gollum. The problem was all of the orcs ended up being CGI when Azog should’ve been the only one.
its wild they used the worse azog look in the final film lol lol
CGI was the way to go. Azog and Bolg looked so different and much more powerful than the other orcs we'd seen up to that point, it felt refreshing from a design perspective. Practical effects are great and all, but sometimes I feel that the need to showcase them has become somewhat snobbish (-remembers that embarrassing JJ Abrams Force Awakens preview-). You gotta use the best tool for the job, not the shiniest.
Finally. I was scrolling through these comments and seeing the likes and it's insane to think either of the first two would have been a good Azog. They absolutely went the right direction.
@finnofzaun9209 what?
@@InvertedFreeSolo The red bearded Azog is great. Not as Azog but as a character. The problem is that they overdid it. Azog competes with so many other orcs that are all clearly meant to be THE orc at some point that he doesn’t stand out, the pale orc is not bad but he almost feels under designed compared to the other ones that all show up in the film, no helmet or even decent armor until the final one… It’s not the CGI, it’s hoenstly the effect of (re)designing this guy on the fly.
Shame really. Those two earlier prosthetic designs looked really good.
why is it a problem that azog was killed? XD
What I do not understand is this: There is an orc in the Hobbit book that could have been easily used for the role that Azog has in the movies: Bolg. Instead they brought Azog back from the dead while they could have just used Bolg instead, and made Bolg a minor character that did not do anything really but fight Legolas....I really don't get that but I still love these movies anyway (I saw them as a kid).
@@melkuen5223 All of this I echo as well. Even the original maquette for Azog was better than the final design! They had a perfect orc villain in Bolg; huge, indimidating, gnarly, (like the early version with Conan Stevens), locked in a blood vendetta with Thorin because of their slain forebears. Treating Azog's absence as a "problem" from the source material to "solve" when the obvious answer was staring them in the face was a huge miscalculation.
Despite this, I still go back and watch these films alongside LotR, but the mistakes and sense of missed opportunity still loom large. Also, I do like Manu Bennett as an actor, he was a darn good sport in the mo-cap process throughout. Even if he would have been a phenomenal prosthetic orc.
when you have to make a massive movie and well story. putting a book into a movie is alot harder than it seems, alot falls in the cracks and things that seem right in the moment of making arnt, @@oscarstainton
When I watched the movie for the first time I didn't really know what bothered me. Now I know. Azog is just kind of a huge baby. He looks a little out of place and uncanny. Nonetheless it does not damage the movie as much when you remember what pressure they all were under.
Azog is fine but compare him to Gothmog. Not because Gothmog isn’t CGI but he felt too basic almost.
A big berserker. One handed. Who hates dwarves.
He is not far off from being pretty good but in the end he turns out to just be all right.
No fault of anyone really - just needed more time and some better writing particularly in the final movie where takes the role of a general but doesn’t fit it, he is a berserker, not some kind of tactician, they communicate as much via his design for two whole movies and THAT harms the character. He is AWESOME fighting. Let him fight. Let him intimidate, scream, rage.
Instead he stands on the damn mountain and gives signals. Doesn’t fit.
azog looked really menacing, a violent force but his purpose along the next two films started to feel thin, kind of weak.
azog..the hottest orc ever to live in middle earth.
Azog wasnt the problem...but they use to much CGi when the orcs attacks and most of them they look shity
A little bit....all three movies were twerked around compared to the Hobbit book! The Hobbit was
A child's book and the studios came along and turned it into LOTR style.(ridiculous)
5:50. 3:33
always impressed by what they can do, but it's a shame it was in service of such a cliche and artificially inserted character
All the wrong decisions of Peter Jackson in one video.
Which decisions were wrong?
I wouldn't say wrong decisions, just proof that fast pre-production isn't Jackson's thing. Had he had the time to really search for a design for Azog, maybe they wouldn't have had needed to make him CGI, but rather use prosthetics for him. Eventually what sealed the deal on CGI Azog was the fact that they had already shot the movie with another Azog, and had to place the new Azog over the footage. Now I do believe tho, that all the concept arts and designs are better than what Azog ended up being. Hell, Borg is better than Azog in my book. But I do love Manu Bennett's voice to the character.
also remember PJ wanted to make it 1 film 2 max, but WB forced him to make 3 movies back to back like LOTR. people overhate the Hobbit, its a decent film and adaptation but sadly rushed @@MARYWTHER