If you’re into multiverses, power plays, or high-stakes revenge served ice cold, you might just love my sci-fi novels. In Delphine Descends, journey with Kathreen as she rises from war-victim to galaxy-class powerhouse with a serious grudge. And in Black Milk, join Prometheus as he shatters the laws of time, space, and sanity for love (and maybe destroys the universe along the way). Links to both below 📖 Delphine Descends (Amazon link) shortlink.uk/P59l Black Milk (Amazon link) shortlink.uk/MHpv
You should add "The Mote in God's Eye" by Jerry Pournelle and Larry Niven. It was nominated but didn't win and it is, in my opinion, one of the top ten SciFi books of all time.
What else was nominated that year. That could have a lot to do with it. And or personal politics. The book has been optioned a few times but l think the Moties made it unfilmable at the time.
The Hugo Awards should never have been changed to include fantasy. Fantasy should have its own awards and deserves to also. The Nebula Awards are even worse than the Hugos now, unlike back in 20th century.
Agreed, but unfortunately that was only part of the problem. Fantasy have had the WFA since the 1970s, but to be honest, they're in just a bad a state nowadays as the Hugo and Nebula! If you ask me there has been a common factor in all of their demise.
Get the five ppl in this thread to agree on a delineation and I'll agree with you lol. Examples to fight over: book of the new sun, inversions, viriconium, star wars, lord of light
Neal Stephenson's "SNOW CRASH" was a magnificent romp that ought to have not only won a ton of awards, but it's a sin that it hasn't been adapted into a big-budget major motion picture by now. Any novel that has a hero/protagonist named 'Hiro Protagonist' just SCREAMS to be read and enjoyed by as many people as possible.
I think the problem with making Snow Crash into a movie is that it was just too awesome. Until very recently, it has been unaffordable to realise locations like the Raft, either live-action or animated - and I suspect even today it would be done poorly. And now it is too late, it's silly to have cyberpunk set in the past.
I'll give it another try. I never made it past the first bits. Forgive me if I don't remember it exactly, because it's been a looooong time but... Having pizza delivery somehow be high-stakes but obviously still low-$$ made me feel the author wasn't even trying to think things through, and then the skateboard wheels that segmentally changed radius to keep you from feeling bumps was another. A cute idea written by a 14-year old, but definitely NOT a genius 14 year old. Anybody who has seen an ice skater spin faster as they pull in the arms should have understood the problem with that idea. We'll imagine a world where someone made that wheel and put it in a skateboard. The angular momentum of the wheel would be constantly changing, meaning the ride would be LESS smooth and steady, not MORE. I enjoy science fiction and fantasy, but I expect the author to think deeply about the worlds they create so that they hold together. You're allowed to change physics or the world, but the rest of it has to work the way we know it to work, and you have to stitch your changes into the rest of the fabric of reality.
@@ronaldbell7429 Changing the radius of a wheel can make the ride smoother, that's how pneumatic types work. I wouldn't worry about the angular momentum, it's very small compared to the other forces involved.
10. Children of Dune 9. Ilium 8. Old Man's War 7. Blindsight 6. Anathem 5. Leviathan Wakes 4. Seveneves 3. Death's End 2. The Collapsing Empire 1. Project Hail Mary
Thanks for the listing. Just watched someone else's list of his 'top ten' scifi books and man that always makes me angry. I think I can watch the rest of this one. :)
Yes, I hugely enjoyed the reworking of the history of western philosophy with aliens and supertech - just what you would expect from Stephenson, in fact. I especially loved the moment with the Saunt Bucker's Basket. Perhaps it failed to snag the Hugo because of length, or perhaps it was considered too derivate of A Canticle for Leibowitz, which had won the award many years before.
Twelve years ago someone made a recording illustrating what the Thousander's chant would sound like. It gives me goosebumps. Imagine dozens in the Millennial Math doing it. m.ua-cam.com/video/-VnmO9q8dn4/v-deo.html&pp=ygUQdGhvdXNhbmRlciBjaGFudA%3D%3D
I’ve been reading SF since my first book “Space Cat” circa 1953. I think you have an excellent take on what should be winning. I find I have read all your choices and have passed on all the winners. This tells me I am no longer using the Hugo as a guide for what my next book should be.
It's the politics of the awards now. Its so convoluted and marred by certain people's personal politics an author can have their book discounted just through not agreeing with someone when they badmouth other authors.
The majority of voters, especially at that time, were Americans. Also at that time, many British works didn't make their way to America until a year or more after they are published. That contributed to several British books not making the ballot.
If I remember it correctly, PKD has received only two nominations throughout his entire career. They probably mistakenly thought that he wrote cookbooks or travel logs, it seems. 😕
Ian M. Banks was one the rare authors were i like all his releases. As avid reader, i catch on when authors rely to much on tropes or repeating themes or dragging out things and as result i get bored. Yes "The Use of Weapons" is one of the best books of "The culture" Universe. I also liked "Wasp Factory" and "The Bridge" from his second pen name "Ian Banks" (missing M.), under which he released non Sci-Fi Books.
Another great video, with the bonus of mentioning a few books I haven't read and feel I should. I don't think John Scalzi's Old man's War books deserve a Hugo; too light weight and Heinleinesque. However the The Collapsing Empire trilogy is stupendous. His writing has matured and the world building and plot superb. And now the elephant in the room. Iain M Banks never won a Hugo. I think Player of Games, Matter and the Hydrogen sonata all deserve them. And as for Use of Weapons, it's just blasphemous that this magnum opus didn't get the Hugo.
@@AnonymousAnonposter Curious: Special compared to what? Aged terribly how? And they were never meant to be dense. You seem to be equating dense with good.
It makes me so happy to see you recognizing John Scalzi. I was born in 1950 and Scalzi is my nominee for best 21st Century writer in the footsteps of the Golden Age authors I grew up with.
The Hugo Awards seem to have discredited themselves in recent years to the extent that they have become anti-recommendations. I've been surprised that the Dungeon Crawler Carl series, although unconventional, has been completely off the radar for some sort of nomination for some award. It's impressive universe building.
Because it is considered LitRPG which is not taken seriously by the major awards. Similar to the way SciFi/Fantasy is not taken seriously by those that vote on the Oscars.
@@leonardhatcher3272 I'm thinking of when Babylon 5 (season 4?) won a Nebula. It was unconventional. First book of Dungeon Crawler Carl was a guilty pleasure. But by book 6 it had far transcended its genre.
Its way way worse than that. Leftest politics have infiltrated it for quite some time now. DEI is the New God.(though new was a decade ago and still going strong)
Well done. Can’t argue with any of your alternative choices. I’ve read every one you mention, and share a lot of the excitement you express at their myriad virtues.
I don't know, Revelation Space wasn't even nominated in the year it was eligible, looking at the other nominees that year I think it should have won (Harry potter won that year)
I love Project Hail Mary, and to think I was put off by the title! It's my favourite 'comfort book' when I need a relaxing read to put me in a good place. Rocky, my favourite alien.
Project Hail Mary was ruined from the start for me because of the ridiculous amnesia nonsense. It's a common trope in movieland, but it absolutely doesn't happen in reality. If you see someone walking around, talking and behaving normally (and actually exhibiting problem solving cleverness for God's sake), but they insist they have no idea who they are, they're either lying or they're a psych patient. To have it drag on and on like it did in the book that's supposed to be hard science fiction was pretty galling. Also to have a bunch of science fiction fans who shrug off stuff that wouldn't have passed muster outside of Days of Our Lives is honestly pretty galling too. Weir did a great job with his first book, partly because he wrote it publicly and got a lot of feedback, fact-checking him. But now he more or less has to write things on his own, and... not to want to be too mean about it, he's kind of a mediocre writer of great (or anyway grand) ideas.
I@ronaldbell7429 You are being mean. I am sorry you didn't enjoy it however it is disingenuous of you to criticize those that did. Science Fiction is all about suspending disbelief. You might as well critique all SF for it's improbability. As someone once observed 'science fiction is written as much for scientists as ghost stories are written for ghosts'.
@@garethhanby It's been awhile since I read it. I'd forgotten that but... having met these people (practicing neurologist) I have to say: the eternal question is whether the person claiming amnesia for that reason can really have it, in that form, in complete isolation. The main drivers of that kind of amnesia don't actually apply in that setting, and to the extent they did, he they would have prevented him from discovering the things he discovered, because in that setting they were part of what he was trying not to recall. If a lack of self preservation had allowed him to enter that state in that setting, it would have prevented him from the journey of discovery that we all had to come along and watch. It was a bonecracking storytelling contortion, and the story would have been better served by just telling the story, IMHO.
Old mans ware was a breath of near-retro'esque fresh air when it came out. Love the series and offshoots. There is one John Scalzi book that for some reason I keep returning to. Honestly, it doesn't 'feel' like a Scalzi book and it is quite short, but 'The God Engines' to me is fantastic. Maybe not long or deep enough for Hugo awarding, but certainly would make a great movie for the adventurous financier and director..
Thanks for compiling this list. I haven't read most of the books you've mentioned, but I'll make note of them for future (😉) reading. I have read _Project Hail Mary_ though. I enjoyed it but couldn't shake the feeling that it was a re-hashed _The Martian_ (which I also enjoyed).
loved a few of these, Blindsight is a personal favorite, though I understand why not everyone likes it (it is relentlessly pessimistic, and I get that's just not everyone's flavor). its is even less approachable, though I like it even more at this point. I'm really hoping we get a third. I honestly think that Old Man's War and Leviathan Wakes are both roughly appropriately regarded as is? I liked the basic concept of OMW, but found that while the book(s) introduced some pretty interesting and heavy concepts, the execution was a bit too much of a light military space adventure to really dive into them to the degree I'd have liked. and LW does some stuff pretty well. I like the portrayal of divergent cultures across the solar system, and the cloak and dagger chase across the solar system for an alien superweapon was great. I felt like a lot of the attempts at political drama fell a bit flat though, especially the insistence that basically everything can just be talked out and anyone getting too militant (whatever the context or their reasons) must be a baddie. this might not be fair to LW itself, but this got especially bad in the later books, where Holden and the gang are just the most annoying centrists in every conflict. I'll acknowledge that I haven't read PHM, but The Martian really didn't leave me wanting more. maybe that's unfair to PHM, idk how different it might be. I didn't _dislike_ The Martian. it was a fun enough read, and I liked the degree of detail the author went into with just about every topic that came up. it was just a very... unemotional read for me. the whole thing is more or less "competence p0rn", without any especially interesting characters or emotional stakes. that's not _inherently_ bad or wrong for a book. but it's not what I look for at this point, so it's unlikely to be what I'd consider award-worthy. and honestly, not a huge fan of any of the Three Body Problem books. they aren't bad, I don't regret reading them or anything. but I thought they suffered for being way too focused on having big (and admittedly very cool) ideas, to the detriment of interesting characters, or a particularly well put together plot. in Death's End in particular, it feels like the plot repeatedly hinges on Cheng making the dumbest possible decisions in any particular moment. why anyone continues to trust her beyond "because the author wants stuff to keep going wrong" is beyond me.
I'm ancient now, but I read "Where Late the Sweet Birds Sang" over 30+ yrs ago & I still remember the emotional punch of that novel; its elegiac sensibility has stayed with me ever since. IMO Hugos normally go to more populist work, so it's surprising to me CofD didn't get the gong. I know everybody has their own favourites, but it's still a pleasing outcome for me that Wilhelm won.
In the 70's and 80's it was very rare for a sequel to even get a nomination. It was far less a popularity contest back then, and considered a serious literary award, and you don't give serious literary awards to sequels, which were still looked down upon back then.
I'm not sure why I didn't know Simmons' Ilium and Olympos were sci-fi, but I'm now going to read them as soon as I finish Banks' Inversions. The Hyperion Cantos is still one of my favorites and I probably read that over twenty years ago.
To me and many. It's Dune and the Hyperion Cantos at the very top. Dune gets special credit for being advanced in a age where Sci Fi was still written for kids. including the new wave stuff(which still mostly used the twist twilight zone twist ending). It was like Alan Moore's Watchman Comic. All of a sudden Science Fiction and Comics was also putting out Grand and Great Adult worthy reads that changed everything on the highest level.(I know there was some mature work before, but few and far between and not anywhere close to the greatness of those)
Like a lot of other things around the same time, it became extremely overly politicized, and rushed decades of long-built prestige, recognition and profit right over the proverbial cliff.
I think it's been over 20 years since I've read them, but I think Ilium and Olympos are even better than the Hyperion cantos, mainly because it was a lot tighter both story and prose wise and I also have a weak spot for the Greek myths. Although thinking back now I do seem to remember a lot more cool stuff from Hyperion than from Ilium 😄
I liked them a lot more, but that probably had more to do with my love of all the ancient Greek literature, plays and mythology I could get my hands on since childhood, than it did any objective analysis of the two series.
Terrific video! I had exactly 30 minutes in a bookstore for the first time in four years. Ah, buy some science fiction. Asked the staff who won some Hugos? Otherwise relied on blurbs, since they didn't have new books by favourite authors. Ended up with the Fifth Season, which I enjoyed, but it wasn't prize winning. By mail order I bought the Three Body Problem, which I felt even more negative about (the games). So I will take your advice, as I will soon be visiting an English speaking city for the first time in two years. As for Dune, I really enjoyed it back in the day, but just assumed Herbert was cashing in with sequels, so ignored them for the Silverberg and Aldiss books then.
Thank you so much for this. And I agree with your choices and commentary. I’ve been in love with SF since the early 1950s. A big regret in my long life is that I didn’t save all those wonderful pulp magazines that were truly better than those being published today.
@@hariszark7396 I agree that it may be slow at times, and definitely isn`t the Hyperion Cantos with it`s amazing premise. But I just love the Moravecs.
@@Clonetropper005 Sci-Fi Odyssey thought Old Man’s War should have won over Spin, but I love Spin and think it deserved its Hugo Award. But otherwise I agreed with all of his picks.
I just read Spin a few weeks ago. Intriguing concept the author barely begins to explore due to getting bogged down with the three protagonists' interpersonal relationships.
Agree - Illium. Without a doubt. I've read the Hyperion Cantos and Illium/Olympus both a couple of times, and I like Illium more. Agree - Seveneves. Easily the best book I read last year (not the Hugo year, but the year I read it). Qualified Disagree - Blindsight. I know it's a darling on BookTube and intellectually I can see it. But I found it impenetrable and unenjoyable. Disagree - Project Hail Mary. I DNF'd it. I found our hero insufferably cheeky. Basically the character from The Martian in a different setting. Which is fine, I enjoyed him in The Martian. But tired of him quickly in PHM. Did any of the Expanse novels ever win? Since the Hugo is awarded by industry folk AND readers, and since it was such a great series for all the reasons you list, I don't understand it not being awarded.
Omg thank you. I just finished listening to PHM and also found the MC and writing insufferable. Seems like sci-fi written for people who don't read sci-fi, so I'm baffled how people who have read good sci-fi still liked it...
Not sure what book won that year, but I thought Kim Stanley Robinson's Red Mars should have won, though they seem to have tried to make up for it by awarding Hugos to Green Mars and Blue Mars.
I have read the start of one of your two novels, which I sent myself as a sample of Black Milk, on Amazon. I have to agree with one of the comments in the Amazon store, for the Kindle version: 'The editor has done a very poor job as there are a huge amount of words which were either wrong or in the wrong context.' Just a heads up, since that is the reason I will not be bying it for now. If I were the author, I would correct those errors and then make a video informing my followers that the new version is available for the Kindle version of this book.
Yeah, that's one of my hot buttons, as well. Far too many books are just a jumbled mess of bad spelling, wrong word choice, wrong tense that they're unreadable.
I just went out and bought a copy of "Blindsight" by Peter Watts based on your comments. Had never heard of either the book or the author before. Looking forward to reading it!
Great list. I've read all but three, Illium , Project Hail Mary and Anathem. These three will now enter my to read list. Agree with you assessment of all the others. Seveneves really flew under the radar, great book, super long but I couldn't put it down. I think a lot of the 'left field winners' came down to politics. I'll say no more..
Totally agree about Blindsight and Death's End. I DNF'd Jemisin's The Fifth Season with extreme disappointment. As with any award, personal judgement need not agree with the determining body's vote. We do well to remember that the Academy Awards are a systematic marketing ploy for the film industry in general. Likewise the Hugos for sf.
I really liked The Fifth Season, and think it definitely deserved to at least contend for the award (I have not read Seveneves yet, so can't say how it compares. I should probably fix that). while I liked the latter two books in the series a fair bit, they were not, in my opinion, on the same level. also very good for me, but not really "most prestigious award" worthy.
The Hugo has turned itself into a mark of shame. Which is, itself a real shame. I've read most of the alternatives in you list, and loved most of them. I'll be checking out the others soon!
The reason that neither Anathem or Seveneves by Neal Stephenson won the Hugo is that the voters all have a stick up their butt when it comes to books over 800 pages. I'll die on this hill with that argument! I also *personally believe* that Neal Stephenson is looked *down upon* as the "James Rollins of hard SF" - pumping out lengthy book after lengthy book that will sell "to mindless masses".
It would appear that those running and voting on the Hugo contenders have mostly turned their back on hard science fiction, in favour of fiction produced by a more defined democratic, over the last 20-years at least.
Turned their backs on SF in favor of Identity politics. Go look at the major winners the last decade. and then go look at the winners of all the other genre awards and you will see the same DEI system in place. If you doubt it, It's easy to do. There are about 6 of them(including the Locus Awards) and you will wonder if white males(cis ones anyway) are actually allowed in the club they basically created.
I read a series of books in the 80's that dealt with engineered humans that had a 6th finger but worked like a small thumb. Really great books but can't remember either a title or the author.
The 6 finger detail reminds me of the Chieri, the natives of planet Darkover, which is the setting for many novels and short stories by Marion Zimmer Bradley (and several guest writers).
You got me interested in several of these titles, some of which I already own but have relegated. Great video. Will pass on Ilium, though, and I just cannot stand anything "dune," so that one is a pass, too. But the others I will read. Old Man's War I read in my twenties, so that was a while ago.
Neal Stephenson is one of my favorite authors, regardless of genre. Seveneves is one of the most terrifying books I've ever read. Absolutely loved it. Best opening in all fiction.
I take no notice of award winners for the reasons you expressed in your video. The majority of my favorite SF reads have come from books that have not won any major awards - & it does seem strange to include fantasy in the Hugo awards..... It is also strange that there is an apparent reluctance to consider high-concept, visionary (or awe-inspiring) SF for these awards - isn't that the reason we all started to read SF in the first place? & yet the too easy allegorical stories - that have a very low SF feel to them - seem to dominate. I'm a fan of Simmons, but I haven't read Illium, or Olympos, as yet. I haven't read Neal Stephenson, Joe Scalzi, or the Blindsight book as yet either - looks like I've got some ground to make up. & after reading a sample of M.K. Jemisin's The Fifth Season, I won't be proceeding with her The Broken Earth trilogy - despite the fact that every volume in the series won a Hugo - it doesn't give me what I'm looking for in SF.
Overall I think the video makes a good case for most of the books it discusses. I have minor quibbles (I like Blindsight, but I think Rainbows End was a better choice, for example). My biggest diaagreement is with Children of Dune. The first part of it is fine, but it then begins to fall apart. Dune is a very good novel; Dune Messiah is good, though not up to the original; Children of Dune is a step down. And God Emperor ... well, Herbert should have stopped sooner.
Thanks for the list! I look forward to reading a few that I've missed. Though I'm a fan of Neal Stephenson, I find him uneven. I love Anathem, which as you said appeals at many levels. But I think Seveneves is one of his weaker works. I find the conflicts contrived and unsatisfying. One of my favorites is Termination Shock, which didn't even garner a Hugo nomination. While not as ambitious as Anathem, it's a great story with complex interlocking arcs, peopled with vividly, lovingly drawn characters.
I agree with your take on Neal Stephenson. I think Anathem is one of the best books I have ever read in any genre, while thought Seveneves was simply tedious and boring.
I read both Spin and OMW and have no problem with either books winning. Both were more than worthy but Spin stayed with me more than OMW did these many years later. I'm 69, if that makes any difference.
I loved Illium and this is on spot. Spin vs Old mans war both are great imo and it's difficult to choose one. Anathem over Gaiman definitely. I agree with you in nearly all.i haven't read seveness but fifth season was kinf of disappointment.
While it's correct that the Hugo Awards focus on Sci Fi, they have always had Fantasy entries, e.g. some parts of the Dragonriders of Pern series. And on that Fantasy note, in 2001 Storm of Swords should have won instead of Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire. And while I absolutely adore the Graveyard Book, I agree that it was a bit of an odd choice over Anathem. Might have been the circumstances; the financial crisis from 2008 might have made people want something cozier and more lighthearted.
I've only read some of the books mentioned here, so I don't have firm opinions on many of the perceived slights... except one. I think Spin absolutely deserved to win over Old Man's War. I don't have as high an opinion of Scalzi as the streamer does (I think he's a little too flippant and a little too jingoistic), and to add to that, Spin is one of my all-time favorites.
Ilium and Olympos for sure! Old Man’s War👍Blindsight was deeply disturbing but I read it while recuperating from major back surgery.Anathem is awesome! Seveneves Yes! Three body problem was problematic. Collapsing Empire and sequels are great! Love the characters!
What a great idea for a show. Sometimes we need to kill the sacred cows. I just had a look at my library and apart from Ilium by Dan Simmons which has been on my TBR pile for far too long, I agree with all but one of your choices. I don't think Old Man's War is better than Spin. I really like John Scalzi's work and 100% agree with your rating of The Collapsing Empire. A great series and contained one of the funniest, foul mouthed characters I have ever read. Apart from that one book and Ilium (I'm so ashamed I haven't got around to it as I loved the Hyperion Cantos so much) you were spot on with the 8 other books. However, not one Iain M. Banks book winning a Hugo is a damning indictment of the entire Award in my opinion! You have got me thinking of some of the other books on the Hugo list that I thought were a waste of time and there must be better books they could have picked: Dreamsnake by Vonda McIntyre in 1979 immediately came to mind. To say nothing of the Dog by Commie Willis in 1999 was not great and not a patch on the 1993 Doomsday Book or Blackout in 2011. Don't get me started on the 2001 Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire which should have gone to Revelation Space by Alastair Reynolds 2023 Nettle and Bone - what the hell! You have really got me thinking. Great channel and keep up the good work.
Jemisin's trilogy was science-fantasy, not epic fantasy or another fantasy offshoot. As the series develops we realize that. The third book definitely made all this clear, so it, and the series it concludes, is worthy of the Hugo, IMO.
Many science fiction franchises include the paranormal (Star Trek, Star Wars, nearly all of Anne McCaffrey, …): to deny that is to limit the genre to Clarke and Popular Mechanics. The Broken Earth series earned its recognition and belonged on those ballots.
This is one of my favourites, Darrell. Neal Stephenson's an old favourite of mine. Was listening to Blindsight on YT but the reader was awful. Thanks for this episode.
Great video, thank you. It reminds us why art is entirely subjective. I LOVE Old Man's War. And, having read them all, Old Man's War is Scalzi's only great book and I would argue several of them are throwaways. Collapsing Empire is just ok. PHM is very good. I've re-read it and enjoyed it upon re-reading. It holds up. But I've read the Martian many times over the years. Absolutely brilliant once in a lifetime home run by Mr. Weir.
@franciscomap75 actually to me the various characters and their development is the most impressive, it's been over a decade since I read the books but I still remember Hashi Lebwohl, Warden Dios, Holt Fasner etc.. And yeah, Morn
Weird -- this starts up right about the time when I stopped reading science fiction. I was expecting very different arguments when I clicked on this. Yes, I am old now. 💀
Just general lack of interest in what people were writing. My favorites start about the late '30s and end about the mid '70s. Plus I preferred short stories and disliked epics and trilogies. And I binge-read a lot of detective fiction. And I tried to catch up on some mainstream books I'd passed over. A lot of reasons, really. I voted in the 1978 Hugos, but don't ask me what I voted for.
I have read many of the books you mentioned. Both the winners and the would be winners. I think the winners were by and large deserving. However Blindsight is a book that I find absolutely fascinating.
Old Mans War was good fun and has a creative twist on the usual military sci fi but its just not in the category of the other books you mention and is not Hugo worthy for me
Many thanks for this excellent piece. I am a regular on your channel. Could you comment on why Iain M. Banks didn't win a Hugo Award for a book of his culture series? The Alebraist was nominated but I would have thought one of his Culture books would have made it. Thanks again.
If you’re into multiverses, power plays, or high-stakes revenge served ice cold, you might just love my sci-fi novels. In Delphine Descends, journey with Kathreen as she rises from war-victim to galaxy-class powerhouse with a serious grudge. And in Black Milk, join Prometheus as he shatters the laws of time, space, and sanity for love (and maybe destroys the universe along the way). Links to both below 📖
Delphine Descends (Amazon link) shortlink.uk/P59l
Black Milk (Amazon link) shortlink.uk/MHpv
You should add "The Mote in God's Eye" by Jerry Pournelle and Larry Niven. It was nominated but didn't win and it is, in my opinion, one of the top ten SciFi books of all time.
@arnehermann3417 well said Sir 👏.
I wish more people knew about that book
I agree, a great story
Agreed - and the sequel, "The Gripping Hand," mos def merits a read also.
What else was nominated that year. That could have a lot to do with it. And or personal politics. The book has been optioned a few times but l think the Moties made it unfilmable at the time.
The Hugo Awards should never have been changed to include fantasy. Fantasy should have its own awards and deserves to also. The Nebula Awards are even worse than the Hugos now, unlike back in 20th century.
Well, there should be clearer limits, i.e. Science fantasy, yes, pure fantasy no.
Totally agree!
Agreed. They are two quite different things when it comes to my personal tastes.
Agreed, but unfortunately that was only part of the problem. Fantasy have had the WFA since the 1970s, but to be honest, they're in just a bad a state nowadays as the Hugo and Nebula! If you ask me there has been a common factor in all of their demise.
Get the five ppl in this thread to agree on a delineation and I'll agree with you lol. Examples to fight over: book of the new sun, inversions, viriconium, star wars, lord of light
Neal Stephenson's "SNOW CRASH" was a magnificent romp that ought to have not only won a ton of awards, but it's a sin that it hasn't been adapted into a big-budget major motion picture by now. Any novel that has a hero/protagonist named 'Hiro Protagonist' just SCREAMS to be read and enjoyed by as many people as possible.
I agree. Snow Crash and The Diamond Age were some of his best books.
I think the problem with making Snow Crash into a movie is that it was just too awesome. Until very recently, it has been unaffordable to realise locations like the Raft, either live-action or animated - and I suspect even today it would be done poorly. And now it is too late, it's silly to have cyberpunk set in the past.
I'll give it another try. I never made it past the first bits. Forgive me if I don't remember it exactly, because it's been a looooong time but... Having pizza delivery somehow be high-stakes but obviously still low-$$ made me feel the author wasn't even trying to think things through, and then the skateboard wheels that segmentally changed radius to keep you from feeling bumps was another. A cute idea written by a 14-year old, but definitely NOT a genius 14 year old. Anybody who has seen an ice skater spin faster as they pull in the arms should have understood the problem with that idea. We'll imagine a world where someone made that wheel and put it in a skateboard. The angular momentum of the wheel would be constantly changing, meaning the ride would be LESS smooth and steady, not MORE. I enjoy science fiction and fantasy, but I expect the author to think deeply about the worlds they create so that they hold together. You're allowed to change physics or the world, but the rest of it has to work the way we know it to work, and you have to stitch your changes into the rest of the fabric of reality.
@@ronaldbell7429 Changing the radius of a wheel can make the ride smoother, that's how pneumatic types work. I wouldn't worry about the angular momentum, it's very small compared to the other forces involved.
Yes, just imagine that opening scene!
10. Children of Dune
9. Ilium
8. Old Man's War
7. Blindsight
6. Anathem
5. Leviathan Wakes
4. Seveneves
3. Death's End
2. The Collapsing Empire
1. Project Hail Mary
Ilium was an absolutely fantastic and fun romp. Simmons wuz robbed.
Thanks for the listing. Just watched someone else's list of his 'top ten' scifi books and man that always makes me angry. I think I can watch the rest of this one. :)
Ilium is a special and unforgettable book
Read Anathem, heavy but fascinating
Seveneves was great, and 1 paragraph in it made clear an orbital physics question i has always pondered
'Anathem' is one of my all time favorites. The world he created is utterly fascinating.
Yes, I hugely enjoyed the reworking of the history of western philosophy with aliens and supertech - just what you would expect from Stephenson, in fact. I especially loved the moment with the Saunt Bucker's Basket. Perhaps it failed to snag the Hugo because of length, or perhaps it was considered too derivate of A Canticle for Leibowitz, which had won the award many years before.
Twelve years ago someone made a recording illustrating what the Thousander's chant would sound like. It gives me goosebumps. Imagine dozens in the Millennial Math doing it.
m.ua-cam.com/video/-VnmO9q8dn4/v-deo.html&pp=ygUQdGhvdXNhbmRlciBjaGFudA%3D%3D
I’ve been reading SF since my first book “Space Cat” circa 1953. I think you have an excellent take on what should be winning. I find I have read all your choices and have passed on all the winners. This tells me I am no longer using the Hugo as a guide for what my next book should be.
I'm still baffled how The Use of Weapons wasn't even nominated. To me it's both a genre and a literary masterpiece.
Yeah, it's a shame Banks didn't get more recognition. Use of Weapons was excellent.
It's the politics of the awards now.
Its so convoluted and marred by certain people's personal politics an author can have their book discounted just through not agreeing with someone when they badmouth other authors.
The majority of voters, especially at that time, were Americans. Also at that time, many British works didn't make their way to America until a year or more after they are published. That contributed to several British books not making the ballot.
If I remember it correctly, PKD has received only two nominations throughout his entire career.
They probably mistakenly thought that he wrote cookbooks or travel logs, it seems. 😕
Ian M. Banks was one the rare authors were i like all his releases.
As avid reader, i catch on when authors rely to much on tropes or repeating themes or dragging out things and as result i get bored.
Yes "The Use of Weapons" is one of the best books of "The culture" Universe.
I also liked "Wasp Factory" and "The Bridge" from his second pen name "Ian Banks" (missing M.), under which he released non Sci-Fi Books.
PKD was also being largely overlooked by the Hugo's during his career, isn't that right?
Brilliant list, you are absolutely right on both accounts regarding Neal Stephenson!!!
First SFOdyssey video I've come across. Did a very good job! I'll be exploring more of his content. Bravo, SFO.
Colorado Avalanche :)
Old Man's War is one of my favorite books, scfi or otherwise. I really wish this would be made in a video series.
Likewise! But I wouldn't want the current Hollywoke anywhere near it lol!
Broken Earth and Dark Forest both were great trilogies. I’d say they were very different but equal in quality.
Another great video, with the bonus of mentioning a few books I haven't read and feel I should. I don't think John Scalzi's Old man's War books deserve a Hugo; too light weight and Heinleinesque. However the The Collapsing Empire trilogy is stupendous. His writing has matured and the world building and plot superb. And now the elephant in the room. Iain M Banks never won a Hugo. I think Player of Games, Matter and the Hydrogen sonata all deserve them. And as for Use of Weapons, it's just blasphemous that this magnum opus didn't get the Hugo.
There seems to be a bias towards American books. This is especially notable with modern Nebula Awards.
I recently read The Culture series and for me it's nothing special, it's aged terribly in many ways and the books are far from dense.
And wtf is wrong with "Heinleinesque"? 😊
Lol
@@AnonymousAnonposter Curious: Special compared to what? Aged terribly how? And they were never meant to be dense. You seem to be equating dense with good.
Thanks!
Thank you!🙏
It makes me so happy to see you recognizing John Scalzi. I was born in 1950 and Scalzi is my nominee for best 21st Century writer in the footsteps of the Golden Age authors I grew up with.
I've missed out on all of these!
Thanks for the opportunity to fix that.
Good presentation, by the way!
The Hugo Awards seem to have discredited themselves in recent years to the extent that they have become anti-recommendations.
I've been surprised that the Dungeon Crawler Carl series, although unconventional, has been completely off the radar for some sort of nomination for some award. It's impressive universe building.
Because it is considered LitRPG which is not taken seriously by the major awards. Similar to the way SciFi/Fantasy is not taken seriously by those that vote on the Oscars.
@@leonardhatcher3272 I'm thinking of when Babylon 5 (season 4?) won a Nebula. It was unconventional. First book of Dungeon Crawler Carl was a guilty pleasure. But by book 6 it had far transcended its genre.
Its way way worse than that. Leftest politics have infiltrated it for quite some time now. DEI is the New God.(though new was a decade ago and still going strong)
@@leonardhatcher3272 Plus, it's juvenile, and I say this as a LitRPG enjoyer xD.
You could have mentioned that there's a Project Hail Mary movie in the works with a 2026 release date, starring Ryan Gosling.
I felt that Weir wrote both The Martian and Project Hail Mary intending them to be movies/series. Very cinematic
Hail Mary stinks
Well done. Can’t argue with any of your alternative choices. I’ve read every one you mention, and share a lot of the excitement you express at their myriad virtues.
Why not anything by Alastair Reynolds yet?
I don't know, Revelation Space wasn't even nominated in the year it was eligible, looking at the other nominees that year I think it should have won (Harry potter won that year)
@@RichardBarclay _ouch_
I love Project Hail Mary, and to think I was put off by the title! It's my favourite 'comfort book' when I need a relaxing read to put me in a good place. Rocky, my favourite alien.
I just hope they don't mess up the film.
Project Hail Mary was ruined from the start for me because of the ridiculous amnesia nonsense. It's a common trope in movieland, but it absolutely doesn't happen in reality. If you see someone walking around, talking and behaving normally (and actually exhibiting problem solving cleverness for God's sake), but they insist they have no idea who they are, they're either lying or they're a psych patient. To have it drag on and on like it did in the book that's supposed to be hard science fiction was pretty galling. Also to have a bunch of science fiction fans who shrug off stuff that wouldn't have passed muster outside of Days of Our Lives is honestly pretty galling too. Weir did a great job with his first book, partly because he wrote it publicly and got a lot of feedback, fact-checking him. But now he more or less has to write things on his own, and... not to want to be too mean about it, he's kind of a mediocre writer of great (or anyway grand) ideas.
I@ronaldbell7429 You are being mean. I am sorry you didn't enjoy it however it is disingenuous of you to criticize those that did. Science Fiction is all about suspending disbelief. You might as well critique all SF for it's improbability. As someone once observed 'science fiction is written as much for scientists as ghost stories are written for ghosts'.
@@ronaldbell7429 As I remember, it the amnesia was done intentionally because he was reluctant to go on the mission.
@@garethhanby It's been awhile since I read it. I'd forgotten that but... having met these people (practicing neurologist) I have to say: the eternal question is whether the person claiming amnesia for that reason can really have it, in that form, in complete isolation. The main drivers of that kind of amnesia don't actually apply in that setting, and to the extent they did, he they would have prevented him from discovering the things he discovered, because in that setting they were part of what he was trying not to recall. If a lack of self preservation had allowed him to enter that state in that setting, it would have prevented him from the journey of discovery that we all had to come along and watch. It was a bonecracking storytelling contortion, and the story would have been better served by just telling the story, IMHO.
Old mans ware was a breath of near-retro'esque fresh air when it came out. Love the series and offshoots.
There is one John Scalzi book that for some reason I keep returning to. Honestly, it doesn't 'feel' like a Scalzi book and it is quite short, but 'The God Engines' to me is fantastic. Maybe not long or deep enough for Hugo awarding, but certainly would make a great movie for the adventurous financier and director..
Hail Mary is one of my all time favorite Sci-Fi reads
Thanks for compiling this list. I haven't read most of the books you've mentioned, but I'll make note of them for future (😉) reading. I have read _Project Hail Mary_ though. I enjoyed it but couldn't shake the feeling that it was a re-hashed _The Martian_ (which I also enjoyed).
Old Man’s War was amazing. I still think about it often…
loved a few of these, Blindsight is a personal favorite, though I understand why not everyone likes it (it is relentlessly pessimistic, and I get that's just not everyone's flavor). its is even less approachable, though I like it even more at this point. I'm really hoping we get a third.
I honestly think that Old Man's War and Leviathan Wakes are both roughly appropriately regarded as is? I liked the basic concept of OMW, but found that while the book(s) introduced some pretty interesting and heavy concepts, the execution was a bit too much of a light military space adventure to really dive into them to the degree I'd have liked. and LW does some stuff pretty well. I like the portrayal of divergent cultures across the solar system, and the cloak and dagger chase across the solar system for an alien superweapon was great. I felt like a lot of the attempts at political drama fell a bit flat though, especially the insistence that basically everything can just be talked out and anyone getting too militant (whatever the context or their reasons) must be a baddie. this might not be fair to LW itself, but this got especially bad in the later books, where Holden and the gang are just the most annoying centrists in every conflict.
I'll acknowledge that I haven't read PHM, but The Martian really didn't leave me wanting more. maybe that's unfair to PHM, idk how different it might be. I didn't _dislike_ The Martian. it was a fun enough read, and I liked the degree of detail the author went into with just about every topic that came up. it was just a very... unemotional read for me. the whole thing is more or less "competence p0rn", without any especially interesting characters or emotional stakes. that's not _inherently_ bad or wrong for a book. but it's not what I look for at this point, so it's unlikely to be what I'd consider award-worthy.
and honestly, not a huge fan of any of the Three Body Problem books. they aren't bad, I don't regret reading them or anything. but I thought they suffered for being way too focused on having big (and admittedly very cool) ideas, to the detriment of interesting characters, or a particularly well put together plot. in Death's End in particular, it feels like the plot repeatedly hinges on Cheng making the dumbest possible decisions in any particular moment. why anyone continues to trust her beyond "because the author wants stuff to keep going wrong" is beyond me.
Only got a copy of Anathem from my local library discards recently. Was a totally unexpected surprise and kept me up at night reading it.
I needed two shots at it, and finally did the audiobook which was a fanttastic listen!
@@wandabissell Was pretty confusing sometimes, but in the end a good read.
I'm ancient now, but I read "Where Late the Sweet Birds Sang" over 30+ yrs ago & I still remember the emotional punch of that novel; its elegiac sensibility has stayed with me ever since. IMO Hugos normally go to more populist work, so it's surprising to me CofD didn't get the gong. I know everybody has their own favourites, but it's still a pleasing outcome for me that Wilhelm won.
In the 70's and 80's it was very rare for a sequel to even get a nomination. It was far less a popularity contest back then, and considered a serious literary award, and you don't give serious literary awards to sequels, which were still looked down upon back then.
I'm not sure why I didn't know Simmons' Ilium and Olympos were sci-fi, but I'm now going to read them as soon as I finish Banks' Inversions. The Hyperion Cantos is still one of my favorites and I probably read that over twenty years ago.
To me and many. It's Dune and the Hyperion Cantos at the very top. Dune gets special credit for being advanced in a age where Sci Fi was still written for kids. including the new wave stuff(which still mostly used the twist twilight zone twist ending). It was like Alan Moore's Watchman Comic. All of a sudden Science Fiction and Comics was also putting out Grand and Great Adult worthy reads that changed everything on the highest level.(I know there was some mature work before, but few and far between and not anywhere close to the greatness of those)
Could not agree more! Great list!
Sometimes I'm totally puzzled as to why some books got an award in the first place.
Like a lot of other things around the same time, it became extremely overly politicized, and rushed decades of long-built prestige, recognition and profit right over the proverbial cliff.
The Hugo's, that is.
Just discovered your channel, and holy crap, as a sci fi noir author myself. I love your channel! You are awesome!
Thanks 🙏
Illium definitely deserved that spot in the Hugo Awards. As did Olympos.
I think it's been over 20 years since I've read them, but I think Ilium and Olympos are even better than the Hyperion cantos, mainly because it was a lot tighter both story and prose wise and I also have a weak spot for the Greek myths. Although thinking back now I do seem to remember a lot more cool stuff from Hyperion than from Ilium 😄
I liked them a lot more, but that probably had more to do with my love of all the ancient Greek literature, plays and mythology I could get my hands on since childhood, than it did any objective analysis of the two series.
Gaiman was beloved by the system. He won the Locus best short award like 5 years in a row.
He won't be winning anymore though.
Why not anymore?
Terrific video! I had exactly 30 minutes in a bookstore for the first time in four years. Ah, buy some science fiction. Asked the staff who won some Hugos? Otherwise relied on blurbs, since they didn't have new books by favourite authors. Ended up with the Fifth Season, which I enjoyed, but it wasn't prize winning. By mail order I bought the Three Body Problem, which I felt even more negative about (the games). So I will take your advice, as I will soon be visiting an English speaking city for the first time in two years. As for Dune, I really enjoyed it back in the day, but just assumed Herbert was cashing in with sequels, so ignored them for the Silverberg and Aldiss books then.
His son is cashing in on sequels but Herbert was not.
Thank you so much for this. And I agree with your choices and commentary. I’ve been in love with SF since the early 1950s.
A big regret in my long life is that I didn’t save all those wonderful pulp magazines that were truly better than those being published today.
Illium and Olympus (the sequel) by Dan Simmons; are brilliant.
Didn't really liked Ilium so I never moved on to the next one.
Honestly I prefer to read Homer's Iliad again.
@@hariszark7396 I agree that it may be slow at times, and definitely isn`t the Hyperion Cantos with it`s amazing premise. But I just love the Moravecs.
@@marcomattano3705 Fair enough. 👍
Great video. I'm looking forward to trying some of the alternatives you suggested
Awesome - they are so going on my to read list
I agreed with 6 of your picks, haven’t read 3 of them, and disagreed with just 1. I liked Old Man’s War but Spin was awesome!
disagreed with?
@@Clonetropper005 Sci-Fi Odyssey thought Old Man’s War should have won over Spin, but I love Spin and think it deserved its Hugo Award. But otherwise I agreed with all of his picks.
Spin was very worthy. I think it won the Nebula.
I just read Spin a few weeks ago. Intriguing concept the author barely begins to explore due to getting bogged down with the three protagonists' interpersonal relationships.
@@WordsinTime Yeah both were great. Sequel not so much.
Agree - Illium. Without a doubt. I've read the Hyperion Cantos and Illium/Olympus both a couple of times, and I like Illium more.
Agree - Seveneves. Easily the best book I read last year (not the Hugo year, but the year I read it).
Qualified Disagree - Blindsight. I know it's a darling on BookTube and intellectually I can see it. But I found it impenetrable and unenjoyable.
Disagree - Project Hail Mary. I DNF'd it. I found our hero insufferably cheeky. Basically the character from The Martian in a different setting. Which is fine, I enjoyed him in The Martian. But tired of him quickly in PHM.
Did any of the Expanse novels ever win? Since the Hugo is awarded by industry folk AND readers, and since it was such a great series for all the reasons you list, I don't understand it not being awarded.
The first expanse novel was nominated. The whole series won the Hugo in 2020.
Omg thank you. I just finished listening to PHM and also found the MC and writing insufferable. Seems like sci-fi written for people who don't read sci-fi, so I'm baffled how people who have read good sci-fi still liked it...
Of the books you mentioned, I have read Children of Dune and Old Man's War. Enjoyed them both.
Not sure what book won that year, but I thought Kim Stanley Robinson's Red Mars should have won, though they seem to have tried to make up for it by awarding Hugos to Green Mars and Blue Mars.
Thanks for the reading list, a well done video and glad you mentioned the actual winner to contrast with your choices.
Good list. All of the books on your list that I have read were fantastic.
I have read the start of one of your two novels, which I sent myself as a sample of Black Milk, on Amazon. I have to agree with one of the comments in the Amazon store, for the Kindle version: 'The editor has done a very poor job as there are a huge amount of words which were either wrong or in the wrong context.' Just a heads up, since that is the reason I will not be bying it for now. If I were the author, I would correct those errors and then make a video informing my followers that the new version is available for the Kindle version of this book.
Yeah, that's one of my hot buttons, as well. Far too many books are just a jumbled mess of bad spelling, wrong word choice, wrong tense that they're unreadable.
Hmm... Illium? Why have I not read this yet. Putting this on my must read soon list.
I just went out and bought a copy of "Blindsight" by Peter Watts based on your comments. Had never heard of either the book or the author before. Looking forward to reading it!
💓
Did you start reading it yet?
What's your verdict!!??
Thanks you and I am updating my reading list!
I have to agree with you about Project Hail Mary. Best book I read the year it came out
Thanks Darrel! I usually try to pick my next read based on winners of the Hugo Awards, but I respect your opinion too.
You've zeroed in on several of my personal favorites so I'm going to take you up on the stuff I haven't read. Great vid.
Great list. I've read all but three, Illium , Project Hail Mary and Anathem. These three will now enter my to read list. Agree with you assessment of all the others. Seveneves really flew under the radar, great book, super long but I couldn't put it down. I think a lot of the 'left field winners' came down to politics. I'll say no more..
Very interesting. Have to get hold of some of these.
Blindsight... OMG. Absolute killer scifi
I love your vibe, keep it going!
Totally agree about Blindsight and Death's End. I DNF'd Jemisin's The Fifth Season with extreme disappointment. As with any award, personal judgement need not agree with the determining body's vote. We do well to remember that the Academy Awards are a systematic marketing ploy for the film industry in general. Likewise the Hugos for sf.
I really liked The Fifth Season, and think it definitely deserved to at least contend for the award (I have not read Seveneves yet, so can't say how it compares. I should probably fix that). while I liked the latter two books in the series a fair bit, they were not, in my opinion, on the same level. also very good for me, but not really "most prestigious award" worthy.
old mans war is awesome book. I've read it several times and the Audio book is really good also!
A lot of brits have been overlooked. Pandora's Star & Night's Dawn trilogy should have won. Scalzi gets plenty of Hugo attention.
The Hugo has turned itself into a mark of shame. Which is, itself a real shame.
I've read most of the alternatives in you list, and loved most of them. I'll be checking out the others soon!
The correct answer is Gene Wolfe’s “Book of the New Sun” followed by every other novel he wrote.
The reason that neither Anathem or Seveneves by Neal Stephenson won the Hugo is that the voters all have a stick up their butt when it comes to books over 800 pages. I'll die on this hill with that argument! I also *personally believe* that Neal Stephenson is looked *down upon* as the "James Rollins of hard SF" - pumping out lengthy book after lengthy book that will sell "to mindless masses".
It would appear that those running and voting on the Hugo contenders have mostly turned their back on hard science fiction, in favour of fiction produced by a more defined democratic, over the last 20-years at least.
Turned their backs on SF in favor of Identity politics. Go look at the major winners the last decade. and then go look at the winners of all the other genre awards and you will see the same DEI system in place. If you doubt it, It's easy to do. There are about 6 of them(including the Locus Awards) and you will wonder if white males(cis ones anyway) are actually allowed in the club they basically created.
I read a series of books in the 80's that dealt with engineered humans that had a 6th finger but worked like a small thumb. Really great books but can't remember either a title or the author.
The 6 finger detail reminds me of the Chieri, the natives of planet Darkover, which is the setting for many novels and short stories by Marion Zimmer Bradley (and several guest writers).
Agreed on Ilium. Absolute masterpiece.
+1 for Anathem, what a fantastic book.
Thanks! I have read many of the "shoulda's", and will check out the rest. So far, I agree.
What a great list and I agree wholeheartedly! Especially Hail Mary - such a great change from the bleak SF has gotten stuck on.
Hail Mary stinks. It try’s way way to hard to be funny.
Thanks for that! I agree with your choices, and I feel fortunate to have read almost all the books you suggested should have won.
You got me interested in several of these titles, some of which I already own but have relegated. Great video. Will pass on Ilium, though, and I just cannot stand anything "dune," so that one is a pass, too. But the others I will read. Old Man's War I read in my twenties, so that was a while ago.
Neal Stephenson is one of my favorite authors, regardless of genre. Seveneves is one of the most terrifying books I've ever read. Absolutely loved it. Best opening in all fiction.
Loved collapsing Empire. Can’t believe it didn’t win.
Weather I agree with your picks or not these seem like great books to put on my Library list to read. Thanks
I take no notice of award winners for the reasons you expressed in your video. The majority of my favorite SF reads have come from books that have not won any major awards - & it does seem strange to include fantasy in the Hugo awards.....
It is also strange that there is an apparent reluctance to consider high-concept, visionary (or awe-inspiring) SF for these awards - isn't that the reason we all started to read SF in the first place? & yet the too easy allegorical stories - that have a very low SF feel to them - seem to dominate.
I'm a fan of Simmons, but I haven't read Illium, or Olympos, as yet. I haven't read Neal Stephenson, Joe Scalzi, or the Blindsight book as yet either - looks like I've got some ground to make up.
& after reading a sample of M.K. Jemisin's The Fifth Season, I won't be proceeding with her The Broken Earth trilogy - despite the fact that every volume in the series won a Hugo - it doesn't give me what I'm looking for in SF.
Overall I think the video makes a good case for most of the books it discusses. I have minor quibbles (I like Blindsight, but I think Rainbows End was a better choice, for example). My biggest diaagreement is with Children of Dune. The first part of it is fine, but it then begins to fall apart. Dune is a very good novel; Dune Messiah is good, though not up to the original; Children of Dune is a step down. And God Emperor ... well, Herbert should have stopped sooner.
Thanks for the list! I look forward to reading a few that I've missed. Though I'm a fan of Neal Stephenson, I find him uneven. I love Anathem, which as you said appeals at many levels. But I think Seveneves is one of his weaker works. I find the conflicts contrived and unsatisfying. One of my favorites is Termination Shock, which didn't even garner a Hugo nomination. While not as ambitious as Anathem, it's a great story with complex interlocking arcs, peopled with vividly, lovingly drawn characters.
I agree with your take on Neal Stephenson. I think Anathem is one of the best books I have ever read in any genre, while thought Seveneves was simply tedious and boring.
Seveneves was bloated. I understand that Jemisin falls more into fantasy but it was better that year by a mile
Termination Shock is half a story. I returned the audiobook and won't buy Stephenson anymore.
I read both Spin and OMW and have no problem with either books winning. Both were more than worthy but Spin stayed with me more than OMW did these many years later. I'm 69, if that makes any difference.
Thank you for your suggestions.
I loved Illium and this is on spot. Spin vs Old mans war both are great imo and it's difficult to choose one. Anathem over Gaiman definitely. I agree with you in nearly all.i haven't read seveness but fifth season was kinf of disappointment.
While it's correct that the Hugo Awards focus on Sci Fi, they have always had Fantasy entries, e.g. some parts of the Dragonriders of Pern series. And on that Fantasy note, in 2001 Storm of Swords should have won instead of Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire. And while I absolutely adore the Graveyard Book, I agree that it was a bit of an odd choice over Anathem. Might have been the circumstances; the financial crisis from 2008 might have made people want something cozier and more lighthearted.
I've only read some of the books mentioned here, so I don't have firm opinions on many of the perceived slights... except one. I think Spin absolutely deserved to win over Old Man's War. I don't have as high an opinion of Scalzi as the streamer does (I think he's a little too flippant and a little too jingoistic), and to add to that, Spin is one of my all-time favorites.
Ilium and Olympos for sure! Old Man’s War👍Blindsight was deeply disturbing but I read it while recuperating from major back surgery.Anathem is awesome! Seveneves Yes! Three body problem was problematic. Collapsing Empire and sequels are great! Love the characters!
What a great idea for a show. Sometimes we need to kill the sacred cows.
I just had a look at my library and apart from Ilium by Dan Simmons which has been on my TBR pile for far too long, I agree with all but one of your choices. I don't think Old Man's War is better than Spin. I really like John Scalzi's work and 100% agree with your rating of The Collapsing Empire. A great series and contained one of the funniest, foul mouthed characters I have ever read. Apart from that one book and Ilium (I'm so ashamed I haven't got around to it as I loved the Hyperion Cantos so much) you were spot on with the 8 other books.
However, not one Iain M. Banks book winning a Hugo is a damning indictment of the entire Award in my opinion!
You have got me thinking of some of the other books on the Hugo list that I thought were a waste of time and there must be better books they could have picked:
Dreamsnake by Vonda McIntyre in 1979 immediately came to mind.
To say nothing of the Dog by Commie Willis in 1999 was not great and not a patch on the 1993 Doomsday Book or Blackout in 2011.
Don't get me started on the 2001 Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire which should have gone to Revelation Space by Alastair Reynolds
2023 Nettle and Bone - what the hell!
You have really got me thinking. Great channel and keep up the good work.
Jemisin's trilogy was science-fantasy, not epic fantasy or another fantasy offshoot. As the series develops we realize that. The third book definitely made all this clear, so it, and the series it concludes, is worthy of the Hugo, IMO.
You sure?
It has satellites and drones. But definitely closer to fantasy
Many science fiction franchises include the paranormal (Star Trek, Star Wars, nearly all of Anne McCaffrey, …): to deny that is to limit the genre to Clarke and Popular Mechanics. The Broken Earth series earned its recognition and belonged on those ballots.
People cant control earthquakes, that is magc.
@@deoradh Star Wars is space fantasy. Star trek too ends becomin fantasy with all its gods and inconsistencies.
I agree with you on Illium and Project Hail Mary.
This is one of my favourites, Darrell. Neal Stephenson's an old favourite of mine. Was listening to Blindsight on YT but the reader was awful. Thanks for this episode.
first time viewer here. what an awesome channel you have, i predict this channel will soon take off seriously, do you hear me algorithm-god
great topic and video. thank you.
Blindsight and the sort-of sequel Echopraxia blew my mind.
Great video, thank you. It reminds us why art is entirely subjective. I LOVE Old Man's War. And, having read them all, Old Man's War is Scalzi's only great book and I would argue several of them are throwaways. Collapsing Empire is just ok.
PHM is very good. I've re-read it and enjoyed it upon re-reading. It holds up. But I've read the Martian many times over the years. Absolutely brilliant once in a lifetime home run by Mr. Weir.
Oh yes! Old Man's War was excellent! Fully agree on that one!
The Gap series by Stephen Donaldson, one of my all time favorites. Alistair Reynolds Revelation Space series.
Morn Highland is my favorite character of all time
@franciscomap75 actually to me the various characters and their development is the most impressive, it's been over a decade since I read the books but I still remember Hashi Lebwohl, Warden Dios, Holt Fasner etc.. And yeah, Morn
@@franciscomap75 Morn from Star Trek: Deep Space Nine? :D
You’re remarkable! Keep glowing.
Weird -- this starts up right about the time when I stopped reading science fiction. I was expecting very different arguments when I clicked on this. Yes, I am old now. 💀
Why'd you stop?
Just general lack of interest in what people were writing. My favorites start about the late '30s and end about the mid '70s. Plus I preferred short stories and disliked epics and trilogies. And I binge-read a lot of detective fiction. And I tried to catch up on some mainstream books I'd passed over. A lot of reasons, really. I voted in the 1978 Hugos, but don't ask me what I voted for.
I have read many of the books you mentioned. Both the winners and the would be winners. I think the winners were by and large deserving. However Blindsight is a book that I find absolutely fascinating.
Who is "subraxas" and what does it do?
🙂
You want actual mind-blowing as opposed to an idea that can be explained in one sentence? Permutation City by Greg Egan.
I think that Darrel did review this novel a few years back.
Old Mans War was good fun and has a creative twist on the usual military sci fi but its just not in the category of the other books you mention and is not Hugo worthy for me
Many thanks for this excellent piece. I am a regular on your channel. Could you comment on why Iain M. Banks didn't win a Hugo Award for a book of his culture series? The Alebraist was nominated but I would have thought one of his Culture books would have made it. Thanks again.