Uncovering Hidden Gatekeeping in Music: Racism and Sexism
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- Опубліковано 2 лис 2024
- Hello comrades -
I usually come to you all with a 10+ page essay, written with thoughts planned well in advance, but I wanted to speak more freely so I could upload a new video in between the time that I am scriptwriting.
I wanted to take this time to be timely and talk about Cowboy Carter, and how this album took me down a memory lane of experiencing gatekeeping and racial and gender bias in hardcore/punk/metal.
This is a relaxed convo, and the first video about subculture on here! I hope you enjoy and learn about some new music.
Hi y’all! Got copyrighted at 27ish minute mark - hope y’all enjoy this one ❤
As Latino male growing up not speaking Spanish I always felt not fully connected to my culture so when I got into Punk I was also made to feel like I’m not part of the culture because I wasn’t white
I don't know where you're located, but the West Coast US punk scene was literally built off of Hispanic punks, going all the way back into the 70s. The Northeast US hardcore scene was built off Hispanic musicians. Some of the most legendary punk and hardcore bands and musicians of all time were Latino.
I understand how these things grew to be looked at as white music, but you (general you, not you specifically) can only keep that impression if you're totally uninterested in all the bands or people your favorite musicians considered their favorite musicians. Every time I go back out West, I hang with more Hispanic skinheads than I've *ever* seen white skinheads. Punk and hardcore have a huge Latino presence, and have for literal decades already. They've never once stopped holding it down.
I'm not going to hit you with everything all at once, but if this sounds totally alien to you then I could post the names of some legendary bands and musicians from a Hispanic background. I could probably spend a couple hours just naming them, and still not even catch all of them. Just the ones that were most important to the West Coast and Northeast scenes alone.
zthank you for sharing but the thing for me was I grew up in a predominantly white neighborhood and the only other Latin people around me weren’t vibing with the same thing I was. It never deterred me from following my interest and eventually finding community
@@RevShifty I think people get tunnel vision about their specific scenes. Like yeah the west coast is mostly latinx but maybe they’re from Kansas City? Yeah there were more people of color in your area during your era - but during theirs there was none. I think it’s important to keep that in mind
Love this conversation. It's complicated at best. Otherwise bands like "End It" wouldn't feel like they are breaking down walls today in the hard-core seen.
Sometimes in the metal seen whoever won the fights in the pit dominated the seen. Like the Samoans taking down the Nazis at Pantera shows. Personally I learned a lot from Sepultura.
I learned about my country from an outside perspective and I learned a lot about the options I had for belief and expression. I learned that my feelings were universal and had no borders. It kept me away from the hate that wanted to dominate these spaces. A hate that was so easy for a white male in poverty like myself to fall pray to. That perspective gave me the freedom to like what I wanted to and adopt politics( or the lack there of) that aligned with myself. It saved me.
Madball. Now we're talking.
You could mention how rockabilly is best performed and celebrated by bands like El Haragan y Compania!
Felt, I’m, a I guess Latina trans woman and I also feel super not connected but it’s nice knowing we’re not alone
The way you expressed your struggles in music/hardcore...that's how i feel with the current state of "pride" and the queer community. As a black man who's just...a guy...and is working class poor, and not as conventionally attractive as I'm expected to be, and whose tastes don't align with whom I'm supposed to be attracted to (because I'm a bear), it's been a hell of a struggle for the past 12 years since i came out. In fact, it's been hell for me.
I feel like a ghost everywhere i go, in the most supposed progressive, "inclusive" places. And with the current culture of ghosting and apps, I'm all fucked up. Makes me very socially awkward, sensitive and untrusting because i never know.
Imma cut it off right there because just like kendrick, i got like 10 more paragraphs in the chamber. Thanks for sharing your perspective and experience.
Yooo i could relate to this so much, i grew up as a hardcore/metalcore kid too. This wasn't in North America, but my family moved from Kerala, India to Dubai and the hardcore scene was very white dominated (mostly Aussie, UK and South African). It was the same scene Asking Alexandria came out of, and ours was one of the only non white bands in the scene, with me being the only Indian. We killed it and had fun but i remember the white supremacy lol. This one time i was going to play a show at a garage in a place called Al Qouz, and a girl at the front booth of the venue asked me for a sharpie in an american accent. We call Sharpies 'markers', so i asked her what she meant, she laughed and said 'dont you have sharpies in your country?' Lol the funny thing was she wasnt even american, she was lebanese but white passing. Ive had white Aussies make fun of my accent as well but im pretty sure they were just insecure about how good we were 😂
Thanks for sharing Rohan! It’s crazy that this happens globally.
Idk why, but imaging South African racists listening to hardcore really gave me a jumpscare lmao. You’re a real one for surviving that.
Are things starting to change in Dubai as far as having more Indian bands?
@@lucretia_macevil Haha! Yeah the experiences with race and racism in the UAE is bizarre, because everything is out in the open, there isnt really a concept of social justice, its more about "Tolerance". Its a double edged sword because on one hand a news outlet like Breitbart, could never exist because its illegal to discriminate against any group of people online or in the papers, however that's driven by the need for the government to keep bringing in migrant workers to drive the machine and keep up the facade, not because they're particularly against descrimination by their intention. Artists are stifled quite a bit because of the need of the UAE gov to monetize everything. Gov officials began to ask hotels that used to host our gigs to provide a permit, and underground bands were basically stalked to pay money or have the gigs shut down. So alot of the shows moved to house gigs and villa gigs of Emirati kids, because the cops couldn't really touch the local community (the only citizens in the country). Radio stations played the same 8 hit songs all the time and the spot for our kind of music was just a few hours at night on one station. Kids were constantly being fed the most mainstream content and music, which added to the shrinking of the scene. But this, mixed with the fact that expats in the UAE will not be able to stay there if theyre out of a job or homeless, created an unstable environment. The scene now is mostly nurtured by our fillipino and Arab community, there are Indians too, but the overall size of the scene is much much smaller than when i was in it. If you're Emirati and local though, none of these rules really apply to you, and they can get away with calling people the n word as well. A good friend of mine and colleague at my old job was from Kenya and he faced alot of overt descrimination even from within the company, despite his experience, skills and age. He'd keep smiling though, It was frankly traumatising so I bounced out of the country a little more than a year ago. There is still a tiny scene there but it's been largely killed by corporates and the need for the gov to make a buck off everything. Brands like Adidas and Puma have co-opted spaces that kids grew up in, in old Dubai, and commercialized the crap out of it. Bringing you the aesthetic of being from the streets of Dubai but none of us can talk about the inhumane conditions of many of our brothers and sisters. It can be goofy. If I wanted to do my youtube in the UAE and make money off of it I'd have to pay the gov 30 grand dirhams (8000 dollars) to even start monetizing. So content creation and art were more accessible to rich kids if you wanted to start young.
I literally thought "name 5 song" neck beards were the exception and not the rule until very recently. We used to bully skinheads that popped up at local punk/hardcore/metal shows. They were all such losers and cry if your elbow "accidently" finds their nose in the pit. I'm really annoyed for you knowing you have to deal with these chodes.
But on a more fun note, I found The Down Troddence after Babymetal released Shanti Shanti cuz I thought Indian influences would sound cool af in metal. I really like them. I would love to hear Indian punk if it's out there.
If you have any recommendations I'd love to hear them.
I could tell you were a hardcore kid! As someone else who grew up (and very much remains) a punk and hardcore kid, you can always tell when someone grew up a fan. Because they're not taking any shit anywhere, and it shows in most everything they do. Because they usually have a sharp degree of insight, usually colored by cynicism.
And they're always my favorite people.
I feel like I’m not a cynic, I’m just observant lmao but thank you, it’s true we always see each other in the wild
@@lucretia_macevil One person's observation is another person's cynicism. I don't find you cynical at all, but that's how that degree of insight is often described. That's how people who don't take the bullshit others try to feed them are often described. There's just this keen degree of no bullshit insight that I've only ever found among people who grew up in the hardcore scene that makes it stick out like a sore thumb to me.
Hey man I take a fair amount of shit especially from my wife
Ive experienced so much bs in the music industry as well as informal jam sessions just cuz im a trans/femme but im also white and can appear conventionally attractive. I get so angry hearing about experiences like yours, as a black, autistic, femme. And to know how common these stories are, especially in relation to how often they are ignored (or treated as something to normalize) is just ick.
As a white person who only came out as trans in my early 20s and was read as "male" all thru out my musical formation, I had to overcome a lot of bs that my cis male counterparts never had to think about for one second. Accounts like yours really lay bare just how much worse folks are treated when the targeted person also has a dark complexion. I mean, being chastised and ridiculed in public for engaging in artforms that your ancestors literally invented is a whole other level of colonial minded cruelty and dehumanizing on the craziest level.
Thank you so much for taking the time to speak on this topic, share your experiences, and put it out there. You really deserve to blow up on here. ❤
This year I decided to just make and post music here completely by myself. And without the gross streaming services. I want to exist as I am without the input or acceptance of people who don't know what they're doing anyway.
Love this video ❤
Proud of you! If you ever wanna share it, let me know I’d love to listen
@@lucretia_macevil There's three songs posted recently on this account. I do nothing to promote though. My spoonie self feels like it's self care to only do the part I like (making the thing) lol.
I would be so down if the next album in the Renaissance trilogy is a punk/metal album
Thank you fore the vid. I just found your channel. Love that u talk about the shit u want to talk about. The fact that its just u and a camera. U dont have to hide your true opinion on a subject. Cant wait to see wher this channel goes
Yooo im sure youve posted or said this elsewhere but you got a link to your jams???
As a midwestern metal head who played in a pop punk band in hs, i love hearing how other people relate to their chosen genres and how they got into them. This was fantastic, thank you for sharing so much of yourself!
Thank you! My SoundCloud is on my about page
@@lucretia_macevil dj mama cake got chops! Found my newest hyperfixation, thank you again
Really dug the inspirational message in this vid to creators out there wanting but not sure how/when to go about sharing their art. Great video!✌🏽
Thanks for giving it a chance!
This was awesome, super uplifting.Thanks 🎉🎉
Your taste in music is hella cool. I would have killed to find more people that listened to Senses Fail and Blink 182 in high school. I've never understood the gatekeeping mentality in music and comics. I mean, in your case the issue is 100% racism and misogyny in those crowds, but I always got really excited if someone was interested in stuff I was. I would have thought you were cool AF if we met back then and would have aggressively and embarrassingly tried to be your friend lol.
(Also you need to check out Kennyhoopla if you haven't heard him yet. It's really good stuff and Travis Barker features on a lot of his stuff.)
I appreciate the comment a lot! We can totally be music buddies now, although I do wish I had more allies back then. I’ve built a community over the years, but this is the reality of my experience.
I think gatekeeping regardless of race is still racism and sexism, and bigotry in general because of the things I mentioned in the video - there’s an attitude that only certain people are welcome, only certain people are valid as fans. Bigotry harms us all, you know? Even subtly with things like this.
Never heard of them though, feel free to drop a song you think I should check out!
@@lucretia_macevil you're 100% correct. The vast majority of the triggers for straight white male rage are the same things that oppress many minority groups all while having less factors against them. It's easier to scapegoat POC, women or us alphabet soup folks than it is to recognize that the system in a way that aligns with their false sense of superiority. Racist punk/hardcore kids are literally doing the establishments work for them with zero self awareness.
I came out as bi 5 years ago at 30 (landed on pan a bit later) and I'm very white despite my grandparents being Mexican immigrants. And I moved from CA to TX 12 years ago so I came out after being established and getting a few promotions in TX. Lemme tell you, the difference in living 30 years with all the privilege, to living in TX and just being too fruity if you look too close confirmed so many of my theories on how bigotry operates. It was a bit of a shock and I'm still unpacking it. I sorta regret coming out at work though cuz the shit straight white people say to others they think are straight white people is INSANE and I don't have the ammo for HR complaints as much anymore.
I'll come back with some Kennyhoopla recs a bit later today. I respect you and like Kennyhoopla too much to fumble on a knee jerk track 🤣
I laughed at your joke. Excellent timing.
😂you made my day
You are definitely hardcore! Love the message, stay strong.
Thank you for your perspective and for letting us in on your vast knowledge of music and artists! So grateful to be able to listen ❤ I can definitely understand your feelings, it’s definitely hard being poc in arts spaces.
Very inspiring 😊 thank you, and keep on keeping on
thanks for sharin.
🖤
This was really interesting. Enjoyed your perspective. Thanks!
My intro to punk was the compilation cd Short Music for Short people in 1998 😎😄
Only partway through but I can't wait to say your story is interesting. Thanks for this video.
I'm so sorry you experienced that kind of gatekeeping in the hardcore scene in central Jersey. I can tell you there were trans women and Black musicians making brutal punk music before the Ramones ever stepped on their first stage. I can tell you Black and brown people and women have *always* been involved in the scene. I grew up always seeing Black and brown fans at shows, I even knew a large number of Black and brown skinheads in the same region. And I grew up in the Northeast myself, but I'm a few years older than you, and I guess things changed in that area in that time. And I was closer to NYC (and Boston, depending on the time, which had an extremely brutal hardcore scene for a while) than you were at that time.
That sucks. I'm sorry. If I ever saw you at a show, I would've happily been your pit buddy.
Appreciate the comment 🖤- I lived all over, and experienced the same sort of things - not everyone shared the same experiences because of the “club” mentality of it. There were times where I was included, and times when I was not - is my main point I guess and it’s because of peoples own misogynoir. I am aware I wasn’t the only black femme ever - just at the time, in my area. I’ve met and made community with plenty of people of color, this is just my story, and how it happened.
P.S. FSU was also in NJ lol. I started going to hardcore shows in 2003-4, and that was when all of that was happening, so no it wasn’t always pleasant
@@lucretia_macevil Ha! I grew up around the very people that founded FSU. Knowing you knew exactly who I was talking about makes me so happy for some reason. Which is kind of a weird way to feel about such a notoriously brutal clique lol.
I want to be clear that I don't doubt your experiences at all. I was just saying that that kind of closed club mentality wasn't nearly as prevalent when I was going to the most shows, probably from the mid 90s to early aughts. I would never deny anyone's experience, I'm just sad you didn't get to experience the same openness I saw just a few years earlier. There wouldn't have been anything about you that stood out, that stopped you from being welcomed by more people. I'm just sorry it played out like that.
@@RevShifty nah I didn’t think you were saying that! I’m just jaded and am like don’t cry for me, Argentina or whatever the song is 😂
You’re right, the 90s was always an era people longed for at my age as a younger millennial but no, it was full chauvinism, racism and misogyny. There were dudes I know by name still who intentionally hit women at shows because “we weren’t supposed to be there”.
That stuff didn’t stop me from going, it was the people who knew certain things were wrong who cared more about their reputation than what’s right. That was ironically a decade apart too, but I just got to my breaking point eventually lol.
We are like, veterans of the FSU years 😂a real camaraderie.
@@lucretia_macevil I came up in the Boston scene first, and I can't describe how legitimately brutal it really was for a few years. But if you went to enough shows and could hold your own on the floor, there was actual community hiding in there. They just wanted to see what you were made of first, to see how you handled things.
I remember going to an after show party at someone in early FSU's home, and seeing a "wall of shame" behind the bar. It was where everything they ripped off people they had beaten was hung up, so there were swastikas, Confederate flags, and even racist club pins, jackets, and t-shirts hanging up upside down all over the place. It was wild. They literally chased entire clubs out of the city, because they were just that damned brutal.
DMS started in a similar way, all those years ago. They (the originals) were all so poor that most of them were living in squats by the time they were 12-15. And most of them were brown, so there was an extra layer of anger. But they built up a community, where they'd eventually even teach each other trades or make sure they found each other work to pay for band equipment. There were entire businesses where everyone working there was part of the Black and Blue.
I know FSU eventually helped spread that club mentality as it grew and time went on, but that wasn't how it started. I'm glad I got to see it all start, even if it caused me a few scars and some pretty righteous tinnitus. There was definitely a unique comradery to be found, it's just that you couldn't see it unless you could survive the brutality.
I don't usually do nostalgia, but I'm definitely feeling it today. Thanks for bringing up all the old memories.
A lot of my music exposure came from video games. Tony Hawk got me interested not only in punk, but more esoteric hip-hop artists like Deltron. The PS1 game Ape Escape planted the seeds for me to go down the jungle bass rabbit hole in high school, Marvel vs Capcom 2 got me into jazz (besides what my father played for me), Kingdom Hearts and Zelda got me into orchestral, my brother got me into grunge with Incubus and Pearl Jam (and everything that Dave Matthews is 😅), and Radiohead opened the flood gates when I first heard Paranoid Android from the credits of the anime Ergo Proxy (only picking it up because the main character on the DVD looked like Amy Lee lol).
I never really had the experience of being made to feel uncomfortable around white crowds since I grew up primarily around other black kids, so most of my critiques came from people who looked like me. My 5th grade teacher was the main one to set the record straight about where this "white people music" really came from, but it only really served to make me feel less like an anomaly for being interested in things other than what we watched on BET or listened to on 95.5 and 96.3 in the DMV.
Now I'm more of a progressive metal and djent person when it comes to alternative leaning music, but it's fun to play synth music, and I want to learn how to build my own modular rack. My fiancé is even encouraging me to take advantage of my education benefits to go to school for composition while I still have them. I'll be 30 this year, but why not lol.
Side note: I've also agreed that Beyonce is good at what she does, but her stans can make it it really weird really quickly lol.
I experienced that as well, from my black peers - but was speaking solely on gatekeeping as it pertains to people assuming they can let certain groups in and out of a genre. I appreciate you sharing your experience, I can relate!
Another great video!!! Also I’m a musician, but haven’t done much the past 10 years…it’s a goal to get back to it. When I started in the 80s there were very few female-identified people in bands; if there were, they were vocalist/showpieces. Thankfully things are starting to change, and technology has made it possible to do so much more yourself.
I’m also not a huge Beyoncé fan; Cowboy Carter is very good though. There were a few tracks that seemed out of place, but they were still enjoyable.
Great work Lucretia!💙
I appreciate your comment! I hope you have fun experimenting with music and getting back to your creative roots in that way.
Just want to say also: that Beyoncé didn’t call it a country album, but a beyonce album, meaning it was more experimental than country. I don’t think a song can be out of place on a conceptual album, in the case - also if you count the interludes as apart of the project, as I think it was intended, then every phase of the album has its own section.
That’s why there’s opera, rap, bluegrass and Brazilian funk all on the same album. There are NO limitations to art, is the main takeaway. I hope you also realize that there aren’t any limitations for you either, when you create - so you can make the music that’s in your heart 🖤
Waiting for Lucretia to drop their 20-album discography of all their early 2000s emo songs
😂idk if anyone needs to hear that
gonna buy a Sex Machineguns shirt (japanese metal band, named because they're "harder than the sex pistols") and find that guy so I can be like "nah i can't read japanese, I just like the music"
It really breaks my heart that the scene that raised me failed you so spectacularly. Part of me really struggled to wrap my head around it, although yeah, I'm your typical Midwest WASP, so my opinion is largely invalid here. Where I came up, the scene accepted everyone with open arms. Granted sometimes POCs were treated like unicorns, there was never any hate, aside from one time a few NPs started shit with a black girl and her white boyfriend, but we kicked their teeth in and sent them on their way. I wish you could have experienced the scene as I had.
The only other thing that needs mentioning, a lot of people seem to forget the direct impact POCs had on the Punk/HxC scene. Pioneering bands like Fishbone, Bad Brains, Pure Hell, and Living Colour walked so Hatebreed and Madball could run.
If you aren't familiar with any of them, definitely check them out. From one 'Tizzed out punk to another, stay up girl. You're doing great things.
I appreciate the comment but want to remind everyone responding as mentioned before, since hardcore is a boys club - not everyone will experience the same scene. POC in your area may have been accepted, but not everyone is. You said it yourself, they are treated like unicorns. Is that acceptance? No lol it isnt. Plenty of the hardcore bands with black men and men of color that are popular now are people I grew up with. Which is why I brought up the point of white supremacist capitalist patriarchy. Intersectionality matters and it matters a lot. That determines people’s experiences in the world.
Also the absence of a mentioning doesn’t mean the absence of knowledge. I know you mean well, but assuming I don’t know bad brains and similar bands (although I used bad brains clips In the video) is a form of gatekeeping. You are positioning yourself as someone who has to tell me something, or put me on.
Food for thought! I had great experiences and memories in hardcore, but I can’t deny what happened to me. I think for people who never experienced the gatekeeping at this extent should sit in the discomfort and work to make a better scene, instead of telling how much more accepting there’s is.
It’s like a blinders situation 😂. Hope that makes sense!
I grew up as a white, lower middle class autistic kid in the european metal scene and I loved it... generally.
The gatekeeping always pissed me off though. Don't exclusively listen to Norwegian Black Metal, Death Metal and maybe Thrash?
You're going to made fun off.
Also it always made me sad to see so little diversity around and of course misoginy is also rampant.
I don't go to shows anymore.
Anyway, great video!
Gatekeeping effects everyone but is bullying for marginalized people, essentially - because white supremacy has unrealistic standards for everyone, including you
Good video, I like it. I am now subscribed. Have a nice day!
Thanks for joining!
Good vid!
My dad was a huge movie buff. I got exposed to Anime (Astro-Boy), Japanese tv (Johnny Sokko), French films (As Bicicletas de Belleville), and a lot of David Cronenberg (before A History of Violence).
I appreciate your defense of Hard Core. What are your thoughts on movements like Straight Edge as you were younger?
Nice! I saw some anime early too - my first two were street fighter and ninja scroll.
I was an arrogant straight edge kid for most of my teenage years, and it was because I was immature and trying to cope with trauma around addiction in my family. I still struggle with resentment and work on my empathy as an active muscle. I learned a lot the older I became. I think if people are edge for them that’s amazing, but don’t be like me at the time, who was imitating a common arrogance of straight edge people back then (which I touched on, the elitism). During the 2000s, it was the “kill your local drug dealer” and “if you’re not now you never were” era. Hilariously embarrassing to think of now.
@@lucretia_macevilNinja Scroll was amazing!
Agree with the Straight Edge reflections. Dad died of alcoholism and I can’t count the times I helped my meth addicted mother (took a lot of therapy and understanding to learn to love her based on the life she had) had an effect on my thought processes.
Straight Edge existed in a similar way to me which is why I asked. Thanks for sharing.
@@fakename4683 same to you ❤️🩹
❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Little girl what's your game?
Hard luck and trouble
Bound to be your claim to fame
Tail-shakin heart-breakin trucking through town
Each and every country-mothers son hanging round
Drive a young man insane
Evil that's your name
Dahda dahda dahda dahda dah dah
😂😂😂
Can I ask for a collab with Lil Bill on a totally non serious ranking video of best hardcore, punk, bands? Why: because of the generational divide 😅 I think itll be really fun to watch
lmao - imma ask him
1:35 🥺
She loves to talk to the people
gotta sub
Thank you 🙏🏾
i am SO late to the party (this video has been on my to-watch for ages now due to my pussy-foot-ness) but let me just say. a minute in and 6 degrees of capitalist white supremacist patriarchy is GENIUS and your friends better start laughing because that is DELIGHTFUL and i will be stealing it (except i am a bad thief so i will mention i got inspired by either your channel or this video. disregard that that is literally not what theft is)
tho then again, maybe i'm just a weirdo who breathes politics. either way i think that's based and an absolutely beautiful lil jest, a jape, a beautiful cause for a guffaw. can't wait to actually watch the video!!!
Did anyone assume you weren't a hardcore kid/grew up as one???
Cuz like, as one as well, it was obvious ❤
I said the exact same thing. I grew up (and very much remain) a punk and hardcore kid, and we can always tell one of our own. Something about the sharp degree of insight, flavored with almost as much cynicism just tells everyone who has been there exactly what's going on.
😂you know what, you’re right
@@lucretia_macevil you've heard of Cinnamon Babe, right?
@@sapphicmoonwitch I have not
@@lucretia_macevil ua-cam.com/video/oeE8XB_bur0/v-deo.html
Hey~
Hi
@@lucretia_macevil Have you read N.K. Jemisen's Great Cities duology? Just curious
@@writethepath8354I have not
Although I do think there should be some sort of gatekeeping by somebody at least when it comes to the "Tom McDonalds" and "MAGA rappers" of these times...
Just curious -- why were you criticizing the Beatles?
John Lennon was a domestic abuser and intentionally stole from black musicians. I would argue that there’s a large enough population of black people in America are neutral to annoyed with the Beatles for the same reasons I have.
I appreciate them as talented artists and would never take that away from them, but don’t care for them. I’m just arguing people should do the same for beyonce. You can acknowledge talent without playing them everyday.
I prefer solo Paul McCartney.
Here’s an article about black culture and beatlemania:
medium.com/illumination/why-black-people-dont-give-a-damn-about-the-beatles-94456cc60e30
@@lucretia_macevil
Thanks for the link. I can't read it. I don't want to keep track of a lot of memberships. I did a search and got a lot of hits. It looks like he stole from Frank Zappa, too. Even Rolling Stone has an article -- "Beatles' 5 Boldest Rip-Offs".
I vaguely recall a mention of John Lennon and domestic abuse, but only one. I definitely hadn't heard that he stole from black artists. I'm not denying it; I just hadn't heard. I've heard Elvis did it too.
I have a hard time judging musical talent. Just because I don't like something doesn't mean it took no talent to make it (and just because I like something doesn't mean it took talent). Or maybe I just don't understand the style. Or maybe the notes are deliberately and precicely wrong. (Ever hear Tom Waits' "The Piano Has Been Drinking"?) Or maybe I'm way out on the Dunning-Kruger end of it. I could be. I don't play any instruments or write songs, etc.
Lol Whuts dms
its a hardcore crew / gang
Whats more punk and hardcore than advocating for ppl to give more money to the billionaire beyonce for a country album because ots "objectively good". What a terrible turn in the end
I think beyonce is a Rorschach test for people’s misogynoir.
Do you still use Amazon? Still eat meat and dairy? What type of phone do you have?
Or does purity about supporting billionaires only matters when she is black and a woman? Food for thought. You’re proving my points with every comment you’re writing bro lmao.
I'm so confused. I really don't mean to gate keep, but I grew up poor, and we considered pop punk to be pop punk, not hard-core or punk music. Good Charlotte vs NOFX vs Hatebreed or ministry. A blink 182 is pop punk, not hardcore.
Your second point stands about not feeling like you belonged. My gf at the time was black and she got so many looks for wearing my Tool shirt. Got a lot of "but you like rap, right?!".
Your third point, suburbs making hard-core racist? Idk about that. I think a lot of poor people are also racist (weather due to their parents or due to social engineering) to different degrees. Sometimes that comes out the more it when their confidence grows. I think poor people tend to push against it but take someone you're not sure about and show them a few rich people of color and watch their face change.
This comment mostly just for the algorithm. Love the video and hearing about your experience
how can you be gatekeeping me? I don’t know you 😂
I know pop punk is pop punk, and hardcore, hatebreed, good Charlotte and ministry are all different genres - it’s why I said the term alternative a few times, as a catch call term - my main point is, is that people assume I don’t have the knowledge, or belong there because of who I am. And to be honest, you’re kinda doing that right now…assuming I don’t know the difference between blink 182 and hardcore.
I was speaking about my experience as a kid that exposed me to more music. Blink 182 lead me to hardcore. No one said blink 182 is hardcore.
My point about suburban kids bring elitism is because of classism. I thought that was implied - but to be completely clear, because of classist standards, the shape of what those underground scenes are have changed significantly- that is just my opinion anyway.
Appreciate your comment and hope this clears up whatever you confusion you had.
Yeah bro, suburban kids wearing their moms jeans is not the same as literal kids slumming it. People being mad in their suburban home with suburban comforts, unable to realize or speak for liberation, is certainly much different from kids that grow up, in and out of homelessness, in and out of one ate up apartment complex to the next, constantly needing community to literally materially alter their lives, searching for liberation, are two entirely different scenes, two entirely different community's.
People in their suburbs envious of the city scene but scared of its people. They are mad at the "validity" of their poverty. The suburbanites are asthetics, the actual poor are living in the conditions that predicate the material need for the scene, not just the emotional connection that the suburban scene finds.
How is it actually possible that your every comment keeps getting dumber and more try hard? It's almost kind of impressive, just in a few really pathetic ways.
How is it that your every post somehow manages to get both dumber and more try hard? That's almost kind of an accomplishment, only in really pathetic ways.
How is it your posts only get dumber and more try hard with every post? That's almost kind of an accomplishment, only for pathetic reasons.
Objective on subjective is a bad look. Jolene cover is so weakkk. A billionaire threatening a woman for trying to steal the "man she raised"... he already cheated on her?! Lol idk I honestly don't care she made a country album, country isn't my cup of tea , but to say music is objectively good is just wrong and it's most definitely it's own sort of gatekeeping lmfao
You can think whatever you want. Objectively it is sonically a good album, just like objectively Beethoven is a great composer. Whether you listen to cowboy carter over and over or have Beethoven is in your playlist after that is up to you, but certain things are kind of undeniable in my opinion. As I mentioned on here, If you feel strongly enough you can make your own content saying your opinions freely - because that’s what I’m doing here lol
When you are experiencing art, be it music or whatever, and like it, hate it, are moved by it or whatever - that is subjective. But talking about skill and talent of an artist is objective. It takes practice, dedication, and at least dash of natural talent. I should know - I practiced classical guitar as a kid and I suuuucked because I did not put in the work. Beyoncé obviously has - talk all you want about your experience of her art, but I can’t see how any can say she is isn’t very good at what she does.
@@millejohn people have a hard time admitting this when it comes to her.
Also - here to say that it wasn’t a Jolene cover, Dolly Parton WROTE it for her. As in wrote the lyrics for beyonce to sing. wonder if you still think it’s weak now knowing the original creator did it with her.