7 Misleading Lies in Yugioh
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- Опубліковано 26 чер 2024
- Welcome to the ultimate guide for debunking prevalent misconceptions in Yu-Gi-Oh! In this comprehensive video, we delve into correcting frequently misrepresented statistics and graphs that often lead to confusion and misinformation within the Dueling community.
Have you ever wondered about the accuracy of win rates, tier list rankings, or the performance of specific cards in Yu-Gi-Oh!? Join us as we dissect these topics with a critical eye, drawing upon reliable data and analytical methods to set the record straight.
Throughout this video, we'll explore the nuances of interpreting statistics in the context of the ever-evolving Yu-Gi-Oh! metagame. Learn how to distinguish between reliable data and misleading information, empowering you to make informed decisions in deck-building, card investments, and competitive play.
Discover the truth behind commonly cited graphs and charts, including those related to card usage, tournament results, and archetype popularity. Gain valuable insights into why certain statistics can be misinterpreted and how to apply a more accurate lens when analyzing the state of the game.
Whether you're a seasoned Duelist seeking to refine your strategic approach or a newcomer aiming to navigate the complexities of Yu-Gi-Oh! with confidence, this video is a must-watch. Our goal is to provide you with the tools and knowledge necessary to navigate the Yu-Gi-Oh! community armed with accurate information.
Join us on this enlightening journey as we uncover the myths, correct the statistics, and empower you to better understand the true landscape of Yu-Gi-Oh! Subscribe to our channel and hit the notification bell to stay updated on more content designed to enhance your Dueling prowess and analytical skills. Don't miss out on this eye-opening exploration into correcting Yu-Gi-Oh! statistics and graphs!
Hey my name is Jesse and this is Jesse's Strategy Gaming.
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Topic's I cover are - Strategy Video Games - Reviews & Walkthroughs.
I'll make some meme videos also every so often too. Currently making videos mainly for Yugioh but other reviews are in as well.
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Here's a stat. if you believe in the heart of the cards, you will 100% draw what you need. In truth you will always draw your dark magician which bricks and costs you the game.
I used to play games like Yugioh Duelests of the Roses that had a "Destiny Draw" system where if you were in a bad spot you would have a Heart of the Cards moment and draw a card like Dark Hole even if it wasn't in your deck.
@@JessePerezStrategyGaming Just like Yugi, cheating.
It's not a stat, but Dino have actually a very good top decking. Every single time I believed in the heart of the cards I drew an Ovi or an Fossil dig and ended up OTKing with Tyranno. Was never disappointed
@@JessePerezStrategyGaming lol I can only imagine the amount of glee and confusion if they did something like that like 1/10,000 times in MD. You just draw a Dark Ruler No More when you don't even have it in your deck 😂😂
@@CrawlumThats not heart of the cards. Thats just playing a good deck.
My favorite Statistic lie was when we all got fooled into thinking Firewall Dragon with its 2500 ATK and arrows would be Playmaker's ace monster...
Bro the choosing to go second video actually changed the game for me literally. I did blind second with 40 cards and it has been great results! I'm continually improving it and it keeps getting better. I played it recently at Costa Rica nationals and caught people so off guard when I won dice roll and went second lmao. Its such a fun mental game to play with people because you can side out and be prepared to go first. I really like it
Thats awsome! So happy to see your having success with it! and loving the mind games! :D It really does throw people off.
There's a lot to be said about blind second decks (that aren't Tenpai, those don't count). My build of Yubel runs no handtraps in the main (though I'm considering Ghost Ogre with how good it is), and just running board breakers, goes hard in locals! Also means I don't lose if I don't see the hand traps.
About topping charts, something Joshua Schmidt said in his Edison video a while back that stuck with me is that there's never enough time to fully explore a format before another one comes. Which is a plus for alternative formats but also explains why most of the time people playing competitively just stick to the 1~2 decks perceived as the best in the current meta. Any experimentation is mainly done in side deck, in staples or, when there's full deckbuiding, in trying to build a deck to counter said specific meta. That also explains why a lot of competitive players hate diverse formats with too many archetypes in the meta.
Anyway, so even though I agree with you that relying solely on basic top charts that don't show win rate by deck overall isn't technically right, if you're gonna play competitively then focusing your efforts on the most played decks of the format (or ones made to counter them) is always the safest bet to increase your win rate. Of course, that doesn't include player skill and compatibility with the deck, I myself have faced moments when I played a really strong deck poorly even after training because it simply didn't fit my playstyle, so people should look out for that as well (though this is more subjective).
I would go ahead and say that at least 80% of formats are not even remotely solved
Some of these points are great, but I disagree with the "searchability" argument.
The point of the original statement is not to say un-archetypal cards are entirely unsearchable, but that you are not able to search them as consistently and easily as you would an archetypal card or something with a searcher dedicated to its type (ROTA, Cynet Mining, Bonfire, Fossil Dig, etc)
Any card CAN be brute force searched by Symbol of Friendship, but the condition on that card is so incredibly convoluted, on top of not working on your 1st turn, that nobody ever runs it in a remotely competitive setting.
The best generic searcher you mentioned, Small World, is undeniably a great card, but it is not without its downsides. Going -1 by banishing a monster from your hand face-down and having to deckbuild around it to make sure you always have a "bridge" to your desired card are considerable negatives.
This gets a lot worse with Left Arm Offering, a card with such a ridiculous cost and restriction that not even Pot of Greed would be worth searching with it. Even a deck like Thunder Dragons, that wants their monsters banished, don't run this, as they have better ways to banish their monstes and don't want to get rid of random backrow in their hand (that they are not allowed to set)
Trap Trick is also undeniably strong, but does come with its downsides - requiring multiple copies of the normal trap you're setting and only letting you activate 1 trap after it resolves (likely the one you set)
Deep draw/excavators like Prosperity and Kuribandit also have their issues. Kuribandit of course only works during the end phase, a dealbreaker for most combo decks, and requires your normal summon, while Prosperity banishes 3/6 cards from your ED and prevents any deck that isn't named Tenpai from OTKing the turn it is used. Many decks cannot run Prosperity due to needing their entire ED (Synchrons or Plants for example) or wanting to OTK (Numeron, Ancient Gears, etc)
Beyond that, there is another issue. With all that, that's still only 1 card that can search any given card (monster, spell or trap). Running 3 copies of your target and 3 copies of your searcher, you have a ~57% chance of drawing either in a 5 card hand in a 40 card deck. That's a high chance, but if your deck relies completely on that card to function, a 57% chance isn't going to cut it. Not to mention how far down your odds go if your searcher gets hit with an Ash Blossom, or if you get hit by Droll earlier.
Compare that to something like Mathmech Circular, which can be searched by Cynet Mining, Small World or Alembertian (an ED monster, meaning you don't have to draw it at all); or Soul Resonator, which can be searched by Resonator Call, Earthbound Prisoner Stone Sweeper or Crimson Gaia (which itself is searchable by Vision Resonator, who can be milled by Bone Archfiend), and these decks have upwards of 90+% chances of reaching their crucial cards, often without even resorting to the big guns like Small World (or Mathmech Nabla, which summons Circular instead of searching).
Not only does having extra archetypal/typal search options help with consistency, it also helps to not have to deal with the downsides of "big gun" searchers and helps to play through handtraps, as often you'll draw 2+ searchers.
"Technically, it's blatantly false" is not a helpful conclusion and just ignores the point of the argument in the first place.
I understand your point, but you missed a lot of context as to why searchability is important, and the downsides of the generic searchers you presented.
Yeah, I was kinda thinking that myself. _Technically_ you can search anything with stuff like Small World, but how often is it worth it?
This is a problem ive had in my blind second purrely deck in that i needed another bonus cards that helps with getting both engine and non engine, now most purrely players will run prosperity but i cant since won't be able to otk, i also can't run desires since 3 happy memories are needed in the deck to otk, therefore I'm really struggling getting this one card that can solve this issue. The card that i settled for was 2 copies of metalfoes fusion since not only is it a good discard for the memories, it also draws you so it just pluses me more. And instead of 3 metalfoes fusion to reduce drawing multiple copies of it i added another board breaker which again helps the deck win
To add onto the Upstart Goblin bit, it plays into a similar concept with Pot of Prosperity. A Prospy for 6 when you have ~35 cards in deck is already strong, but playing Prospy during-after your combo with 25-30 cards in deck is much more devastating. Especially post-side when so many blowout going-first cards exist.
Hey now, ojama just needs 1 card to be meta. It just needs to do like 8 things.
So glad I discovered you, your Yugioh vids made deck building click for me and my enjoyment of the game has skyrocketed!
Go back a few vids and you find the link to their DC where we discuss everything in depth. Its quite enjoyable
I am so happy that you enjoyed the vids! These comments always make me smile :) Thank you for watching appreciate you.
@@aetherwolf9288 tnx m8, I guess I'll be joining y'all soon 👌
It's been a long time since I played Yu-Gi-Oh, so maybe things have changed since my day, but in the gamestore I frequented, there was something we referred to as the Yu-Gi-Oh triangle. Basically, how it worked was that there was one deck that was considered the best in the meta. So when there were tourneys, people would look at that and go: Oh, this is the top deck in the meta right now, so I'll build a counter deck to that, specifically designed to beat it. But then others would look at the counterdeck and think: this is only good when they're fighting the top meta deck and severely drops in power when it fights anything else, so I'll play something that's not top meta or counters it. But those would often lose to the top meta deck because... well, you don't get to become the top meta deck for no reason.
So you had a kind of pokemon starter triangle of water beats fire, fire beats grass, grass beats water thing going on. There was obviously more depth to it than that, but that was basically the tl;dr version. It was pretty hilarious. I remember a buddy of mine once said that there was no point to playing YGO, because you might as well just play rock paper scissors and take your chances.
Again, keep in mind that this was well over a decade ago, when the game still took more than 3 turns to complete and long combo chains were extremely rare. Maybe the system changes now, I have no idea.
To some extent this is still in YGO. And I think that's a good thing. Although every so often a tier 0 meta arises where scissors can still beat rock about 55+% of the time as well as paper 95% of the time.
Personally my main reason to run 40 over >40, provided the decks have the same consistency of starters/non engine, is increasing the chance to draw into side deck cards game 2 and 3, and for best of 1 increasing the chance you draw the all important maxx c and its outs(cause md is bo1). And the main reason to run >40 is the ability to increase the starter/non engine count while keeping the same number of bricks, effectively keeping the same consistency of live cards while reducing the chance to draw dead cards, and of course grass. For example I just climbed to m1 with punk horus, and I played a deck count of 48, which is the minimum amount of cards that maximizes the chance to draw a maxx c out(ash called by crossout gamma and droll) while retaining a 90% handtrap and starter consistency and allows me to fit all the bricks required, and of course the higher deck count reduces the chance to draw into all the bricks.
4:30 I thought about that, but the downside is you lower the chances of opening handtraps.
100% correct! You are trading your handtrap percentage for the chance to obfuscate and fluff up your garnets. Depending on the deck or playstyle this may be a worthwhile sacrifice or not depending on how many HTs and Garents are in the deck.
1 more reason to do 41+ upstrart is that 41 card deck + 14 starters has better ratios of drawing the starter as opposed to 40. You can even bump it to 42 and add an additional non engine and you will still have more consistency. While supressing the diminishing returns of running more engine.
There is ofc 1 negative it gives another step your opponent possibly can say no with ash droll or psy frame.
Upstart has been helping me for sure in this Highlander only run 1 event! :) 1 less card spot to think about lol.
@@JessePerezStrategyGaming yeah that too :D somehow even in highlanger i have problems fitting 60 cards not adding :D
Another bonus of Upstart Goblin is, depending on the opponent, you can use it to bait a card like Ash Blossom or something a tad more obscure like PSY-Framegear Delta to Continue plays with much more ease.
Perhaps a bit anecdotal, but it has helped me in quite a few games; same with Into The Void since it pretty much has the exact same effect. Also, I personally just find it incredibly funny when people try to scream at me until they’re blue in the face over my deck-building choices with total non-arguments such as insisting that Prosperity & Upstart clash even though even if you only run 1 Upstart, it’s a < 3% chance of them actually clashing.
the 40/60 card point is only true if all starters are equal. in for example snake eye ash and one for one are better starters than poplar or wanted (play into droll or use extenders...)
Wanted doesn't play into droll though.
I think in the 40/60 debate he is a little biased towards 60 card decks, yes you can still maintain consistency and can reduce chances of drawing garnets, but a deck has more than just starters, there are some extenders you want to draw to play through negation and then there are anti-hand traps like called by and crossout that become a lot more useless in a 60 card deck as they don't have replacements, in an ideal scenario where you have every starter and extender equally powerful then it's reasonable but reality is that most decks cannot afford cross 40-45 to run inferior extenders/starters
One of these days, I was building a custom deck (with cards that would be flip monsters support), but the important thing is that my game plan didn't just depend on opening with 1 monster in my hand (1 flip monster could be a starter, but any other flip monster would become a combo extender), therefore, I decided to use a hypergeometric distribution calculator to evaluate the best combinations to have the greatest chances of getting 2-3 cards of a certain type in my hand and while experimenting with different combinations, I saw that a combination of 18 cards in a 42 card deck gives a very good chance of exactly having 2-3 cards. Could you tell me if these numbers make any sense in practice? (I think it would be even more appropriate for this concept to be applied to a 2-card combo deck)
Your editing and videos are clean bro, hope you get 10k subs soon!
not every deck has a one card starter.
Most decks need two specific cards in hand to actually perform, and i think those decks are the ones that actually improve with 40 cards.
Also, what if a deck has starters, but not enough to warrant a 60 card deck?
Your correct! Some decks have 2 card combos. I have the math and the percentages of that here: ua-cam.com/video/dUB_C53DAt4/v-deo.html
With decks that have 2 card combos youll want about 20-23 starter/extender combo to have a good 85% consistency ratio.
If the deck can't have enough starters to run a 60 card deck then you'll have to run cards that draw and thin the deck or more GY focused strats to use the GY as a second hand.
Allure of darkneess, Pot Cards, etc. Its all about using ratios to your advantage.
Very true comment thank you for adding this because I forgot to mention this! Thanks for watching as well!
60 card cyber otk been doing it for years
Love your videos on stats, never seen that before in Yugioh😎👌👌👌
Something big though is decks with high representation will Also have lower win rates because when it's a mirror match one deck has to lose lowering the win rate to 50 percent
Oh good stuff. Properly understanding why/how certain statistics are calculated and what that data actually means is important.
Jesse clearly has a strong understanding of statistics and the math behind it. Does he have a background in game theory? The videos I have seen so far have used solid game theory when drawing conclusions from data, but not using the typical lingo I would expect.
VS isn’t bad going second. It plays a mountain of hand traps because they happen to synergize with their engine. It’s pretty common to play 12+ hand traps in the main and is one of the few decks that can main Shifter without too many problems. The deck also really likes to play Thrust because it can use that to fetch Stake Your Soul going second or Snow Devil going first. Thrust also opens other options that you can side in like Talents, D Barrier, or Eradicator that Boregore and the Diabellstar engine ensure is always online. The deck can also wield TCBOO is a pseudo-board breaker since Rock pass is generally enough to get your plays going on your opponent’s turn and TCBOO is beyond obnoxious. It also naturally mains Fenrir and Riseheart because the attributes line up well.
Vanquish Soul just isn’t a good deck because it lives and dies by Raizen access, and even then it’s not enough. You play garbage like Parallel Exceed because it plus a normal gets you into Raizen, but that makes your deck inherently bricky. You can play Small World, but then you’ll really want to play multiples of Mad Love and potentially Pantera so you don’t cut off access to some attributes. Durendal seems like a fantastic searcher, but is also beyond bricky and also requires you to have committed to something on board going first. The deck has very flexible non-engine that it can play, but sometimes you really want to leave it in hand to make one of your quick effects live, but then you can end up using the hand trap sub-optimally. I really enjoy the deck, but the reason it’s not successful isn’t because it’s bad going second, it’s because it needs Raizen to function and ends up playing things that make it inherently bricky as a result. It’s also incredibly easy to hand trap since you’d only ever hit Raizen/Jiaolong unless you have hand traps to spare, and it can’t easily play stuff like Hita to punish Ash Blossom because you’ll almost always have a Rock up, which can’t be used as link material.
I've always thought the most important tournament statistic is the conversion rate INTO Top Cut, where x amount of players with the highest score in Swiss Pools make it into the Single Elimination rounds(assuming a tournament isn't entirely Swiss rounds or Single/Double Elimination).
There's a vast difference in the matchup quality between Elimination Seeds and Swiss Format Rotations for the most part, as usually the stronger seeds are more likely to get byes(free rounds where they don't face anybody) or weaker seeds to give the lower scoring participants a chance to prove their ability by making them face harder opponents sooner into the bracket. Swiss Rotations generally try to make people face the strongest participants they haven't faced yet in order to get as a specific a scoring for placement as possible wia W-L-D ratios and then tie breaking by who won against the opponents with better records at a given point.
Also it is INCREDIBLY difficult to consistently get the kinds of win ratios needed to get into Top Cut in the first place, winning 5 out of 7 games(and sometimes even more), while all it takes to get knocked out of Single Elimination is to screw up or get dealt a bad hand a single time, leading to even HIGHER variance in the later part of an event. I've seen all too often where a Finals gets ruined by one player bricking in one of their games, sometimes even their last one, and considering all they did to get that far it just leaves the event ending on a sour note.
Searching for unintended targets is such a great silly thing in the game that I wish was allowed in more things. Like, f it - unintended cross between hundred eyes (now hundred-eyes) and red eyes
Lmao they probably have a list somewhere of names they can't use because of that. "Roid" for example is popular in in alot of words like "steroid", "asteroid", etc. and would make it part of the Roid archtype if used :D Thats so funny to me also .
@@JessePerezStrategyGamingalso EHero necroid shamen (a target that actually mattered in certain Roid strategies)
@@aetherwolf9288 yes! Necroid Shaman - That's one of the ones I was trying to remember who's name also was important that has extra value in TCG because of naming conventions. It was on the tip of my tounge lol! Thanks!
@JessePerezStrategyGaming And then there's Speedroids, which were designed as their own archetype separate from Roids... and Konami decided to fix the problem of Roids working with Speedroids by saying "You can't use Wind monsters here", which invalidated some of the Wind Roids. When they could've just said EXCEPT SPEEDROIDS SPECIFICALLY.
Not... the best decision on their part...
Do you take having multiple starters or extenders in hand when talking about consistency?
One handtrap is usually enough to stop your play if all you have is one starter.
just came here to talk about the fun about going second decks: (mikanko full going second) watch 5min combo see a board with 5+ negates, deploy lava golem > deploy kaiju > water arabesque kaiju bring hu-li > deploy kaiju AGAIN > win duel (shortened and details cutoff however happens more often than expected (loses to gimmick puppet just like almost every other deck)).
You'are doing such a great job with this video and others.
Thanks! I am happy you enjoy them! I have so much fun making them too! :)
great analysis...good ideas an tips.
Respect form Panama
"Your deck isn't competitve if it has more than 40 cards in it's list".
This guy told on himself. Like you know that someone just started when they say stuff like that.
We had multiple formats in which playing 60 wasn't only good, but outright optimal to play the deck. 2017 Grass piles and 2022 Adventure piles showed that.
Then there were also decks like dragon link which always played over 40.
Like this way of thinking comes from 10 years ago when people played 3 upstarts to make their decks less bricky.
Yeah 10y ago it was def true as you win of limited non-engine like heavy storm most of the games and playing over 40 was a crime 95% of the time for a good reason.
Now its way more intricated as it can be both true and false for the same archetype but with different builds. Like i would say in a normal labrynth deck playing over 40 is a crime because you wanna see Arianna as often as possible, same with VS its razen or buss. Pure snake eye also is probably a 40 must deck (w/o melodius) as normal summon se ash and wanted are by far too broken and you wanna see them at all cost even though you could make the argument that the deck has enouhh starters to go over 40 and try to see less bricks but i would disagree.Opposite example: R-ace has too many bricks to stay at 40, its a crime to stay at 40 lol but its not at branded level cause you dont have enought good cards to fill up to 60.
Here is a fun fact related to the last thing you say in the video: in Italian Redbeard of the plunder patroll is called " Barbarossa ---" and in the card there is a first line of text that say:"(this is not considered a Barbaros monster)" exactly to avoid a mix of 2 unrelated archetypes.
I feel like the biggest issue in the consistency debate is that "consistency" has some nuances in its defintion. Most people would probably agree that drawing a playable hand most of the time makes a consistent deck, however playable is of course very deck dependent and also a bit dependent on personal taste.
Let's say we have a 60 card deck with 20 cards each at 3 and it consitently gives us a playablebhand with our 1 card starter. We could cut this to 40 cards by just making every card a 2 of instead (ignoring card quality uere for now) and statistically this should give us basically the same consistency of starters, BUT we eliminate the option of drawing 3 of the same copy of any same card, which of course is not very likelynin a 60 Card deck, but when all those cards might be hard once per turns I take a 0% chance over a very small chance.
That being said, I am really glad for your videos as they made me optimize my R-ACE/SnakeEye deck last Season in MD pretty well, and at ~50 cards at that :D
Not saying you're wrong on the top cut = meta one, but worth discussing that even the representation/win rate schema isn't perfect since matchups can skew results either way. The consensus best decks numbers are going to get skewed more towards 50% since it's going to face more mirror matches than the field. Meanwhile, a weak deck that happens to have a good matchup against a top tier deck could get an unrepresentative high win rate because it's naturally gonna play a matchup it sees more often.
Consider a hypothetical dragon ruler format tournament that has about 70% dragon rulers, 20% spell books, and 10% evilswarms. The dragon rulers win rate will get skewed to 50% regardless of how it performa against spell books and evilswarms, just because your average match in that tournament is a mirror match. Meanwhile evilswarms could get a similar win rate despite getting folded like a lawn chair by spell books (and every other deck at the time) just because it's almost always gonna face its one good matchup in dragon rulers. Food for thought!
I think better than winrate and/or representation, conversion rate is a better indicator of a strength of a deck as I feel that its kinda bypasses a lot of variance that can happen in a tournament.
Hey I’m thinking of building a visualizer website so people can see the data for these different data points. I’d love to be able to get your input?
That sounds like a really good idea and is something that I don't think the YGO community has at this point. I am heavily interested in such a website as I think that it would be very successful if implemented correctly.
Keep me in the loop and feel free to DM me on discord if there might be a way I could help.
If I could, I would rock a very large deck. Almost endless search targets and big engines sound so nice.
Depending on the deck building, the chances for duplicates would be low.
But a five card exodia deck is kind of the strongest most consistent deck possible.
Alembertian can search:
Any lvl 4 monster with 3 materials
Any spell/trap with 4 materials (one card combo with circular)
To be fair about the 40 vs 60 card decks consitency. The problem with the concitency of the 60 card decks is not the amount of starters but the amount of viable non-engine. Most Handtraps and boardbreakers aren't playable in "format X or Y" leaving only a small portion of those cards viable in any given format. This creates a problem with concitency with defencive options for 60 card decks losing the diceroll. Only decks that excell in breaking boards with engine can reliably get away with runing 60 cards. examples being branded, tearlaments and some time ago dragonlink. For any other deck the rule 40 cards are more consitent then 60 cards holds true. But this is more because of bad game design then actual statistics. If Konami would print 20 or 30 more generic handtraps like ash blossom that are good against a very wide range of decks then 60 card decks will become more common.
I feel that, you would only need to get out winged dragon, then special summon slifer and tormentor to tribute for win. difficult, but maybe a fun and playable meta deck?
an intesting point is because of what u said in the unsearchable section, thrust can "GOING SECOND LETS GOO" search any card essentially, from ur trap trick, to ur left arm offering, to ur small word, even further having small world searching ur flip monster to get any trap from the deck - GO SECOND, PLAY THRUST lletss goooooo!!!!!
little suggestion, maybe go over how playing lower ratios of good cards so u can fit more good card in and how that impacts deckbuilding, also lowering ratios to prevent drawing multiples and then going to slightly weaker cards, and if you think its a benefit or a negative
While there's no real ruling on it, the general rule of thumb is that archetypes are based on the Japanese name, even if they were poorly translated. Some things just get by the translation team, like the Raviel issue, but it would ultimately come down to the judge, who would probably rule that you can't do it. Konami does make active attempts to keep archetypes consistent between version, after all, so it's clearly their vision that archetypes should be based on the Japanese text and Archetype conditions. Definitely not what I'd label as "Actually True."
People can generally get a rough idea of what decks to watch out for from a YCS topping chart. For that reason, I think they are mostly true to what they represent. At most, I would say topping charts can be misleading. A good player looking to get into the format can generally pick one of the top 2-3 decks in those charts and find themselves doing relatively well. A fair point is that the best deck might not be the deck with the most tops, but you're not going to tell players back in 2010 Edison to play around Amaryllis burn. No, you're going to tell them to play around Dandylion Quickdraw turbo.
One issue with 40 vs 60 is that some cards are limited so you literally can't add more of them. Otherwise yeah, just adjust ratios appropriately.
Triple Tactics Thrust is a good searcher
Whats the soundtrack playing in the background at 8:33?
Phoenix Wright Ace Attorney - Cornered
Thx :)
Lord of the Heavenly Prison is the best way to search for spells and traps IMO but has to be done during your opponent turn, and also protects your set cards until it is summoned. Also a level 10 with a big booty. One of the funniest ways Ive used this is to search Metal reflect slime to go into Xyzs Pain Gainer/7 Sins, punch over a big body over 3000 Atk/Def that is unaffected for whatever reason may be, then go into Zeus with 4 materials (or just set Fusion Destiny/Red Eyes Fusion for free DPE or Dragoon...)
Yeah Lord of heavenly prison is annoying to use well. For example, if you use hand reveal cards or draw it while under don thousand, you can use the effect on your own turn.
Useless tech, but maybe it'll help someone.
I think a statistic to look into is the viability of Ash Blossom at the moment. It's kind of mid against most decks that aren't Branded or Labrynth, and against Snake-Eyes, thanks to Hiita, it almost guarantees you get OTK'd on the crackback without back-up.
What are some more cards that have These accidental archetypal search synergies? In the Video he mentioned Ravioli Shimmering scraper, but there's also Elemental Hero necroid Something, which is treated a roid Card. There's also that while roid-speedroid Thing.
Nice theories!
Your video is excellent, but I have a question, did you go to stag, or Chavez? I think I bullied you in highschool
That scrap card reminds me of Arsenal Summoner, originally intended to search out the Guardian cards, the ones where you needed to control a specific equip card to summon them, very terrible archetype... anyways, I used it to search out guardian sphinx, and there are a lot of cards with guardian in the name.
Your explanation of why 40 cards and 60 cards are equally consistent is highly misleading. You aren’t just looking for starter consistency in these. You are also looking for your best hand traps or board breakers or whatever and the consistency of drawing the best one is lowered as your deck size increases. Hell even having x amount of starters is misleading as infrequently there is like the best starter and you want that so playing more cards diminishes your ability to get to him and so the consistency is dropped.
There is a reason the vast majority of decks in this game's history run at 40, 41, or 42 cards.
Then there was the era of Grass decks. And regular old 50~60 card Paleo decks.
I'd rather increase my chances of seeing Razen and 1 of each of the 3 attributes I need in my opening hand, instead of just maxing out on started.
Duuude, you're dropping some of the best Yugitube content!
Can you do Heros next? I'll give you my recent deck list for it
The number of people I've met that study the pie charts and then show up to event and dont play a single match against the deck they heard would have best representation is astounding!
That tier 0 decks are unbeatable.
There is tons of good decks out there, and even if t0 wins MOST games its not gonna win ALL of them.
Especially unchained is a deck thats being slept on rn
I’m a trash player, and I’ve been crushing master duel with going second ritual dogmaticka. The synergy the deck has with ultimate slayer is unfair, and the two rituals on the board by themselves equals 8500 damage
Snake Eyes triumphs over most decks because of how limited most archetypes are compared to it. Impose limits onto Snake Eyes and you'll find out real fast why stun decks win tournaments even with snake eyes around.
Stun has stopped winning tournaments.
@@strangevol5264 "Stun" will never stop winning tournaments as long as people are allowed to side in targeted floodgates to their decks.
It's not about how much you put in your deck but what it is you're putting in that matters.
i like the moving little man in the corner
I'm never trying to start something when I call something unsearchable. I usually mean it's not a valid target for anything but the generic searchers, which usually have big costs attached to them.
That said, at this point, I think of Normal Trap as an archetype unto itself now. You have to build a deck around using more of them than imperm, evenly, and archetypal traps, they have 3 (relatively) low cost searchers and even a foolish in Marella and a way to abuse that in Rollback
3:50 I think u should provide an example of a widely used deck that was topping g often but later found out to be bad
#3 is wrong on as well. While in a vaccum you are right, in practice you play into droll, collossus, deck lockdown very hard. The payoff is so minimal in comparison to 40 no droll that it's almost never worth it outside of maybe striker.
currently droll is played at >13% representation and assuming those that play droll run it at three copies that gives about a 4% chance that you will be drolled in a random game. That low amount is too low to be considered a threat at this point but that is good to keep in mind for future and past formats.
In formats where droll raises from 4% to 15% or more (like some heavy search superheavy sam formats etc.) then you can consider watching out for droll.
So for now I wouldn't worry about droll. Its like telling OCG or Master duel not to play Maxx C because of Floo its currently seen too little and counterable.
Also, you don't have to do the draw 1 first. in fact its better thin the deck then do the draw at the end because your likely to run into more Tech/handtraps/traps yourself to futher boost your followup turns.
Finally, if you did decide to use the draw first it still could be a better play to bait ash and have a total smaller decksize in cases where ash is used.
@@JessePerezStrategyGaming Almost nobody is ashing upstart lol. But even if you don't do the draw first, now you just have a dead card. It's always good practice to play around droll. Especially since the payoff of the 41st upstart is quite low
Where’s your cardian deck profile?! Love the channel
Hey j2c! Are you in the discord at all? I have the footage, i have clips, i have a deck profile im using, and the strats but still probably average at piloting it. But the biggest problem I have is the presentation. The deck is a real solitare deck so I am working out editing tricks to literally make the solitaire interesting and fun for others lol. i have some sample clips wanted to gadge your interest on them as i compile the video.
I am not! I will join tho so we can work on this deck together! I’m not a cardian genius but maybe my insight can help you too! I’ll figure out how to get in there and give you a heads up! Thanks man you rock!
I literally wrote multiple articles explaining this, idk how so many people refuse to understand this
That is so cool! Yes I know the pain! I would love if you could drop a link to your articles! It should be a great read for myself and some of the viewers/commenters for further insight.
Dragon link can often be more consistent at 60 than 40 because you have a lot of starters and 60 means you don't draw your bircks as often.
Depends on the format...
*Cries in the wyverbuster ban in MD.* 😭
Card high win rate either means it's win more card or its amazing
4:31 Just want to point out something about "drowning bricks" / "protecting garnets". Please consider the following, in general: Say, you have a relatively good deck. However, because you play one or more garnets in there, you just want to put in, say, one more card, so that you "see your garnets less often". Keep in mind, that this is typically about half a percent less likely. That means, you expect on avergage to see your garnets one game less likely out of 200 games compared to before. Do you really notice that in real life, though? I mean 200 duels is maybe like 70 till 100 matches. That would be for me like 20 locals. That's like 5 months. Do you really think, you will notice the difference that in 5 months of playing locals you saw a brick in one measily game less often compared to a hypothetical deck list with one less card, that you didn't play to actually see the difference? (Also after like 3 months you probably play a completely different deck anyways.)
Just think about this, you all, when the next time you want to put one more card in your deck, because you want to see a garnet 0.5% less often.
The diffrent search is WILD to me and they have to change the ruling
Yeah their are a couple of others too like Nec"ROID" shaman & Dark Jeroid are part of the roid archtype thanks to their naming conventions and "arsenal summoner" can add a card that has "GUARDIAN" in their name and now there are so many unintended targets because of that.
"misleading lies"
I prefer the good old fashion lie that leads straight to the truth.
The thing with upstart is that droll exists, so unless the deck has real synergy with upstart (like sky striker), it's just a bad move 99% of the time
exactly, which is why i put it at mostly true section but there are those teeny tiny exceptions
@@JessePerezStrategyGamingAnd also Upstart is at 3 now, so why would you play it in a 41 card deck? You can just have effectively a 37 card deck at the cost of dying harder to Droll.
The Calculator strikes again
Is that last point actually true? I know you can't fuse away certain spell/traps as archetype names as Magical Hats "monsters" with Super Poly because of how they're worded in Japanese, or at the very least, that's how autosims handle it.
Yes, it should be.
[Tournament Policy](img.yugioh-card.com/eu/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/KDE-E_TCG_Tournament_Policy_2_2.pdf), XI. Card Legality, sec. M.; emphasis mine:
> *Cards With Localization Errors or Incorrect Text*
>
> Occasionally, TCG cards may contain localization errors or incorrect text that alter the function of the card. In these cases, the cards **should be played according to the English-language text** found on the Card Database at www.db.yugioh-card.com/yugiohdb/ or using the “Card Search” or “Camera Search” function in NEURON.
If the English card name contains "Scrap". It is a "Scrap" card for purposes of the TCG.
😂😂 you funny, at the start of your video Sounds like Rex and weevil voice impression reading his response.. 😂😂😂
I love to have a good time making these videos gotta Crack a smile here and there :)
A 40 card deck with upstart goblin is better than a 41 card deck with upstart goblin
My big problem with this video is the 60 cards arent more consistent then 40 part, that parts true with searchers but if your looking for a specific hand trap/card to stop the meta in your opener and you have 60 cards thats a 3/60-3/59-3/58-3/57-3/56, Instead of 3/40-3/39-3/38-3/37-3/36. If I need ash blossom and its at 3 in my deck, need it in my opener and im on the draw, I am statistically less likely to see the card compared to a 40 card deck, the part about searchers is true, but you fail to mention opening hand consistancy
can you make Videos for Duelinks?
topping the charts = good decks should be put into mostly true because regardless of the numbers of people that played the decks most people value consistency, fewer cards to start a combo, ability to play through ash blossom and or niberu vs a deck they love and the better a deck is at doing all these things the more people will play them which will shape the meta even with the few playing rogue decks and anti-meta or just fun decks most will play the currently more consistent decks which are in the meta and which are the ones mostly topping in tournaments
yes i can see that point. from this point of view i would agree that the "topping charts" section could be in the mostly true category. great comment! Thank you for taking the time to illustrate this point of view i didn't really think of it this way. Thanks!
Glad I discovered you, the statistical analysis is super great. Pronounciation could use a bit of work. The Raviel retrain, is "Scraper" as in skyscraper, and not "Scrapper" as in someone that scraps things.
AHHH lmaooo thank you that makes way more sense now. I thought he was a "scrapper" cause he was looking for a fight lol
#2 is wrong on your end as well. If everyone plays 1 deck obviously it can only ever have a 50% win rate. We don't see the amount of mirror matches so while snake eye may have a mid winrate overall, while against non snake eye having a very high winrate. Whereas a less good deck such as race may have a 30-50% winrate against snake eye while being better than a lot of other decks skewing the data. Because those other decks never have mirrors often, we can't tell snakes true wr.
You could tell snakes true win rate the organizers have to do extra work by just not counting mirror match data in win ratio calculations. Or they could just provide all the the data, either way its more work on their end and they do the bare minimum.
Just providing a representation rate and how many get into top cut is all I'm asking for them to do. Also I agree with you we are saying the same thing.
The end point point was that we shouldn't fully trust the pie charts because there are misleading elements which it seems we both agree on.
I've won a fan community swiss tournament with going second dogmatikas undefeated. And yes I faced tearlaments, agents, snake eyes (also my last vs snake eye duel determined the champ) etc. all going 1st decks. I'm not saying going second dogmatika is surperior in any situation but it's not unarguably worse either.
I love it! Nadir Servant is one of the strongest cards too imo and using the ED cards that throw themselves to the GY gives so much card advantage!
Fellow pure Dogmatika enjoyer here, could you share your list mate?
@@DM-zi2up I believe I can't share link in comments so i will write down manually just a sec. Edit: Text was too long. I'm at discord server as hiera, if you are there i can share
Main:
1x Nealshaddoll Ariel
3x Ecclesia
1x Cartesia
1x Gamaciel (kaiju)
1x Fleurdelis
2x Maximus
1x White Relic (just for otking)
1x Alba Zoa
1x Feather Duster
1x Lightning Storm
2x Nadir Servant
2x TTTalent
1x TTThrust
1x Dogmatikalamity
1x Dogmatikamacabre
3x Dogmatikamatrix
3x Super Poly
2x Called by
3x Forbidden Droplet
3x Evenly
3x Imperm
1x Dogmatika Punishment
2x Red Reboot
Extra:
1x N'TTS
1x Mudragon
1x Shaddoll Apkallone
1x Fossil warrior
1x Garura
2x Herald
1x Malong
1x Wind Pegasus
1x Psy Omega
2x Luluwa
Side (for going first cards):
1x Mechaba
1x Secure Gardna
1x Almiraj
3x Iblee
1x Ash
3x Aliester the Invoker
2x Invokation
3x Magical Meltdown
wait, is there a source for the ruling of archetype membership being based on the cards english names? i could swear even in the TCG it's defined by their original japanese names. like celtic guardian not being a guardian card.
edopro confirms this but that simulator is a weird mix of OCG and TCG rulings so i cant be certain.
Yes! I have the source for you!
[Tournament Policy](img.yugioh-card.com/eu/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/KDE-E_TCG_Tournament_Policy_2_2.pdf), XI. Card Legality, sec. M.; emphasis mine:
> Cards With Localization Errors or Incorrect Text
> Occasionally, TCG cards may contain localization errors or incorrect text that alter the function of the card. In these cases, the cards *should be played according to the English-language text* found on the Card Database at www.db.yugioh-card.com/yugiohdb/ or using the “Card Search” or “Camera Search” function in NEURON.
If the English card name contains "Scrap". It is a "Scrap" card for purposes of the TCG.
for Upstart I also heard that playing them past 40 makes flex spots for side decking (ie if you have 42 with 2 Upstart, you're essentially playing a 40 card deck, but can side into a 42 card deck if needed)
You cannot search "El rascador Brillante" with "Raptor de Chatarra".
Also Buen video weón.
13:00 Lord of the Heavenly Prison for traps
The 40 card one is so weak. Look at MTG and their 100 card bullshit. Winning on the back of always searching out the correct cards. And you can't deck them out.
In Yugioh, it's the same thing. A smaller deck is just asking to get decked out.
Most of the time deck out doesn't matter unless you play against something like runick.
Searching is much easier in Magic though. So many cards let you search your deck for any card. Plus some cards even let you add a card from “outside of the game” which would be unimaginably broken in Yugioh 😂😂
@@bl00by_ Kashtira and Tearlament love to throw your deck out too. In master duel, they can't do that as consistently anymore because all of the cards that enabled that BS got banned.
going second is really good and ive gotten very far with it but you do need to side in or maindeck a bunch of handtraps to stop that one annoying gimmick puppet lock player and decks that can FTK
Trinity Format Mentioned
You can't attack going first, so it's objectively worse :^)
Having said that, I still go first, because I want to set Amazoness Onslaught.
Not sure if you know how to actually demonstrate this but…if a player drops maxx c on an opponent and the opponent goes full combo who wins, the player with the board or the player who drew a bunch of cards?
Or you could ask whether it’s better to play through it or end your turn early.
I get the impression most players think the advantage is on whoever played the maxx c rather than playing against it.
Even though it seems like it should be 50/50
But it’s fine if you don’t want to talk about maxx c. I feel like I could listen to every single opinion and demonstration of maxx c and still fail to understand that stupid card
There is a finite of starters can have tho...
I find it hard to build decks to be exactly 40 cards
Usually I end up around 43-48
I actually never had a deck that played 40 cards (as I play a lot of decks that just have certain bricks)
Saying you can search Raviel with Scrap Raptor is straight up wrong, the Japanese name is the only one that matters, even for the TCG.
While it is true that neither card has an exclusion clause, you cannot cherry pick ONE language that happens to have a bad translation and call it a day. No judge would rule in your favor.
They usually errata cards to have an exclusion clause (or inclusion), but until that happens you just have to know those exceptions.
Tcg is based on English. If they wanted to remove it from the archtype they would need to put a (this card is not a scrap monster) errata on the card which was never printed. [See frog the jam] or [Hardened Armed Dragon]. This is already ruled that this is a search target in TCG and because so if your playing TCG rules in another language this searches. Doesn't make sense but until there is an errata that's the rules.
Yes, it is.
[Tournament Policy](img.yugioh-card.com/eu/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/KDE-E_TCG_Tournament_Policy_2_2.pdf), XI. Card Legality, sec. M.; emphasis mine:
> **Cards With Localization Errors or Incorrect Text**
>
> Occasionally, TCG cards may contain localization errors or incorrect text that alter the function of the card. In these cases, the cards **_should be played according to the English-language text_** found on the Card Database at www.db.yugioh-card.com/yugiohdb/ or using the “Card Search” or “Camera Search” function in NEURON.
Whether it occurs in "most other TCG languages" is irrelevant. Its English card name contains "Scrap". It is a "Scrap" card for purposes of the TCG.
As a Mexican, that was horrible what you did there. Also, as a Mexican, that was hilarious what you did there.
As a Perez, I too am both ashamed and proud of that moment.
1 it's true but there is not a single deck with 20 good starters that's why we play only 13 at max. 2 Just look at 2 pie chart one of the number of deck at the beginning and one in top 16. 3 not too bad for upstart but you know time is something so you have to side it out when time comes so you are just playing at 41 + it's almost useless it changes the stat by less than 0.5 percent. And the rest hum not that bad but not gonna waste my time to explain everything
as a wise man once said
"small world, big brain"
40 cards is simply better, irregardless of ratios or type of deck. That chart at the beginning is flawed, but even if its not, your points fall on its face. Like skystriker with upstart, yea you do need spells to pop off, but why not just run 40 to not only see the upstart sooner, but when you draw, youll have even LESS cards in your deck to get through. There is never a reason to run more than 40
Cards that utilize grass is greener, and there have been GY heavy formats where 60 cards have topped and won YCS.
Also I do agree with the upstart which is why it was in the mostly true section. There is just very few scenarios where it could make sense
Saying just run more starters seems to paint the idea that you can just put it infinite starters and we are just chosing not to. Not to mention the whole card quality issue. Those extra 20 cards arent helpful turn 1 when you are watching the opponent full combo because you diluted your chances to draw high impact interaction like nib. It is overwhelmingly a better habbit to run as few cards as possible unless acted on by external factors like grass.
That is exactly why you run 60 cards soo you can see more often impactful cards
@@chicabubr7094 good luck getting someone to let you run 9 nibiru to fix the ratios though
@@kiraangle2823 good luck having at least 85% percentage of drawing 2 handtrap playing with a deck that use 35 card in the engine
@@chicabubr7094 that narrows things down to garbage like flower cardian and cool garbage like ddd and ojama. you still get a 50% shot of 2 with a playset of ash droll nib, or 76% with ash droll nib imerm. thats either 44/47 and you didnt have to find 13 other cards to fill space.
@@kiraangle2823 that indeed is the situation right now
It doesn't mean that was the situation in the future or in the past. Actually it wasn't at some points in the past
Like the beginning of 2022 with decks like cyberse eldlich
This is Duel Academy
I’m going to be honest I kind of don’t like your videos and I’ve been trying to figure out why, but I’ve finally got it, the big problem I have with you is that these rules are generally true and there are only very specific situations where you wanna do these things. Most decks don’t want to run a 60 card deck because at 20 starters a 40 card is more consistent than a 60 card with 20 starters. That’s not to say you never would, decks like dragunity that have a ton of tech pieces that all can be used to go into one another and build a board, however that’s not the majority, and the way you present it feels bad. It feels like you are presenting a lot of this stuff as though the larger yugioh community has it wrong and you have some secret information, it honestly feels kind of dishonest. This is not to say you should necessarily change, or that your a bad person for it or whatever idk man do whatever you want. :P I’m still watching them cause the information is good and it’s nice to have the stats already done when I’m working on decks and it has inspired me to try some fun (if not good ) decks
40 card deck ARE more consistant
TRUTH! Keep Cooking!