PROPHET12 DSI: Thoughts after some time.
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- Опубліковано 17 вер 2024
- Prophet 12: DSI Instruments. I have owned this fantastic Synthesizer for almost a year now, and have some quick thoughts. Any other Pro12 owners out there, please let me know how you all think of your synth!
Thing seems amazing to me
Nice review. Even the features you aren't keen you still managed to make sound good. Deep synth.
Thank you. They can serve a purpose for sure, but 90% of the time I only use drive (which is really great sounding) to get character out of the character section.
the Prophet 12 is an awesome Bass, and Lead Synth. Definitely the strong suite of a Prophet. Thanks for a great "Realistic" review :)
I am still on the fence, but this is a good video to show some of the important points. I totally agree on your assesement of the character, but wondered, with the wide choice for oscillator waves, some might benefit. For me, there's a few reasons I am thinking of the P12. For one, those delay lines seem amazing, and not something you get on most synths. Another factor is the oscillators are quite flexible, though hard to say if I gain anything over my Blofeld and Virus. If I bought the keyboard, the controls on the board seem very nice. One of the big draws is the knobbiness. So good to have immediate access to those parameters. Overall, this seems to have stuff my Blofeld and Virus don't have.
indeed the virus and prophet seem similar on paper, but they sound nothing alike. the prophet updated to linear and exponential FM which is great! the virus is great for bread and butter sounds as well as just crazy experimental stuff but it truly has that VA sound to it. the p12 is a more flexible synth in my opinion but because of its physical layout, i end up with totally different sounds. I would not consider the virus and p12 to overlap functionally or sonically! For what its worth.
THANK YOU for the basic patch trick ! I can't believe I had to go through the global menu every time. I would enjoy very much if you did some more. Maybe some patch programming tricks. Just saying.
Thanks for showing the "init patch" feature! The same feature is available on the Prophet 08. 6:17 I'd try altering the pitch, or the volume of the modulator (OSC2) with the envelope 4 or 5. Also, try various odd harmonics (if C is fundamental, E, F or G even A or A#) with differing carrier waves (eg. 1/3, 1/5, 1/7, 2/3, 2/5, etc.) Try snappy attack times, or long decays, with short releases. FM synthesis is the hardest to get right. There is a pdf called "FM theory and applications" available through google. I don't understand it because I don't yet have an FM synth. I notice this was posted 2 years ago, but I hope that helps
Perfect!! Can't wait for the video!
Just ordered mine can't wait!
Thinking about acquiring one of these imminently! That's a really important point you add at the end, which I hadn't really taken in until I saw this... when people are comparing polyphony, it's drop-out of sustained notes that they are usually worried about. So comparing a 12 note polyphonic synth like this to, say, the 128 note polyphony of something like a Motif XF is not necessarily relevant. Analog vs Digital = Apples vs Oranges. Thanks for taking the time to do this vid :-)
great video Arie! walk through on a very complex instrument. Got me a step closer to loving my p12
To bad they quit making this model. Not many out there for sale. They ought to make an updated model like this one.
Hi, I can see you also own a Virus TI2. soundwise, wich one you like more? O own a P6 and just bought a Virus TI2 polar, and I am happy with it but still wonder if I should have bought a P12 instead maybe.... Would be cool to hear your opinions on both and which one you think would be a better complement for a P6? Thanks
Good hearing your thoughts as an owner. I would like to hear several classic sounds on both such as standard horns, strings, EP and see the difference in a Virus and the P12.
Hack and Decimate are best kept beneath 8, except when you really want to create something that is messed up. To emulate early digital I found that Decimate and Hack being set at 6-8 is best.
Ohh I agree,you are lucky to have both.that's why iwas asking I'm thinking they perfectly mated for each other.I,be been playing synths off and since the late 70,s and I have to agree with you,All this digital vs analogue is drivel.When I hear those arguments it appears to me that these people really don,t know what they are talking about.You are a very knowledgeable young man.looking forward to more of your stuff
Thanks Reggie. I love all synths, digital and analog. Digital can produce some unbelievably rich, pure, deep sounds that analog just cannot. Same goes for analog. People get all caught up in "catch phrases" but forget all the mixing and processing that goes into the final product. That's why we have EQs and compressors and harmonic excites, etc.... Usually it's a snap judgement based on someone's first impression prior to learning how to really program the instrument. Then they go "would you look at that?..wow this is actually very deep and rich...I retract my initial judgment!"
YEPand thanks
Thanks for the demo
Very very helpful thanks!!
Can you set up a modulation of Fm amount with an envelope to just add an inharmonic attack transient. or maybe leave the amount up and just frequency-mod osc.2 with an env, Also if you sync 1+ 2 you can still change the harmonics w Fm but it won't be out of tune .
Hey thanks for the sync FM idea. I'll give it a try. Yes the FM amount can be modulated by the assignable envelopes to produce great fast transient attacks.
@Arie Cole I use that trick w/ my KorgR3. If you like to have it tuned look at Albrecht Durer’s Melancholia 1(Magic Square)
cool latch hold works on pro 2 as well. Didnt know that. I always went to the global menu.
It would be great if you did one of these for the prophet rev 2!
Hey just thought you'd like to know if you dont already, The latest beta update has linear fm!
+Tom Edwards Apparently, DSI is announcing it, so perhaps OS update is not far off. Some people guessed they might be trying to get it done before NAMM
Great video! I just had a quick question regarding bass. Can it do bass frequencies well? Kinda like prophet 5 type of stuff?
here's how i see the 6,rev2,12 comparison :
6 : for lead and more mids frequency sound.
12 : for deep low end with open high end. offer the biggest image.
rev2 : is an in beetween of them both
thought ?..
Hi StudioTime, did you keep it or did ya sell it?
What do you think of the Pro-2? It doesn't have the 12 note polyphony, but it is 4 note paraphonic, with extras in the sequencer and you can route audio through it.
I think it is really cool! I must admit I was a bit jealous at first. Its awesome, I love the sequencer for sure! As for trading the P12 for the Pro 2, I don't think there is enough reason to. Visa verse, if you where to go from a Pro 2 to a P12, I don't see the reason sound wise, unless you want polyphony. I do wish the P12 had the multimode filter. Oh and a 12db LPF that actually boosted some resonance!!
Oh man you're totally helping me keep my 12 I was gonna trade it for a 6. Can you please do a video of the chorus effect you were referring to with the delays :)
Sorry for the slow reply... I'll work on a quick chorus video for sure. I would absolutely keep the 12 over a 6. The 12 is just such a simple, deep, complex, sound design toolbox. The 6 is neat, but once the newness wears off, it's not very practical, comparatively. IMHO!
Jdxa all the way... killer fm bass also
the lights on front tell you which are voices are being activated, not which are currently being used. goes back to the early prophet-5 n 10s when ppl were worried about voice priority using one voice chip more than the rest and burning em out faster. also helps identify an issue on a single voice because you used to have to tune them individually after while. mostly decoration now. can't speak on the voicing of the virus w any expertice cause i don't have one but as I recall, the number of possible active voices has more to do w how much dsp power a single voice takes up, than a static number of voices available like one w an analog signal path has. could be wrong. soft dsp vs analog hardware.
Thanks for the history insight of the voicing lights! They can be of some use when your diagnosing voicing issues, other than that they just look pretty cool when you get playing fast! As for the Virus, sound wise the oscillators are a bit darker, not quite as buzzy as the P12. I love them both, but they have their different advantages. The Virus with 2 oscillators and regular filter mode has immense polyphony, but when you begin to route modulations and use the analog modeling filter, it can drop drastically. I have yet to get multi mode working. 16 part multi timbral....um how about 2-3 useful timbral mode haha.
***** Hah, own a Virus TI, never attempted multi, and haven't seen anyone else do it either. I used my Motif for standard sounds as it's excellent at multi, and had my Virus as a single voice synth on track 16. Really seemed to let the Virus do what's it's good at - amazing sounds something like the Motif can't seem to do. I am no expert, and maybe with the total integration in a rig with a DAW, it could be used on a few tracks. I recorded directly to a mixer/digital recorder using my Motif as a sequencer, far simpler for me
do you still have this synth? wondering if you still have, and if you could share your patch or sell, I'd interested in buying it :p specially looking for more warm sound patches !
Great instrument. I have a prophet 10 which is quite old but it has a gutsy and more primal sound. The modulated sounds here are somewhat different. Should get a Prophet 6. I just ordered a Roland JD-XA and look foreward to exploring that.
+fnersch How are you finding the JD-XA?
+Vlad Malik Awesome. The permutations of Digital & analog are endless. Will take years to exploit. A real bargain at $2200.
fnersch 4 years In what was your end verdict on the jdxa?
@@seeyouintheeighties A good instrument. Just wish it had more analog voices. More can be midied in however.
fnersch I was contemplating a prologue 16 as it has a digital oscillator but people aren’t keen on talking about it which rings alarm bells in my head and its now leaning me towards the jdxa
5:50 was that before they added the linear FM option?
Dude!! I'm just at the beginning of you video and already I need to ask: do you know if there is a similar quirk on the Tempest because there is no complete reset (as far as I'm aware) so every time I want to create a sound, I have to go through and check every single parameter has been set to 'zero' to ensure I'm dealing with a pure time before I start
Messing with it?
Thanks by-the-way :)
Hey Andrew,
Im not aware of any quick trick to reset the Tempest....(I have been wanting a Tempest for a while now) I did learn that this trick worked on the Pro2 though. I wonder if it will work on the new Sequential Prophet 6?
Hey Arie
Thanks for the reply. I have found a way after watching one of Carson's videos on the Tempest (I think the one on making a beat). The reason I ask is that the P12, Tempest and Pro2 seem to share the same architecture so if you know how to use one, the others will be easy to figure out. Another kind soul has also added project files on the Tempest forum which will load a complete clean slate...
Good luck getting a Tempest. An amazing machine - that is virtually limitless as a drum machine. I have just sold my kidneys for an octatrack to compliment it (a marriage made in heaven) and then time for my nuts to go later in the year for the Pro 2!! :)
Arie where did you get your keyboard stand for your Prophet and Virus. I really like it from what I can see in the video?
looks like a standard "A-frame" stand. they're pretty easy to find
Yup it's a On Stage KS7903 GC has them.
Would this or the new rev2 pair better with my Moog Sub 37?
curious as well
It really depends on what you want. It is easier to make warm, harmonic sounds with the Rev2, so it will pair better with your Moog in a traditional, harmonic sense. However, if you prefer to have less overlap between your instruments and more sound design flexibility, the Prophet 12 is a better option. Keep in mind that it is easy to design displeasing sounds with the Prophet 12 if you are not good at sound design.
i think different here, bring me a better synth which is comparable with the P12. there is no such thing. its perfect, with all fails and errors.
When he talks about the non musicality and quality of the sounds, it applies to all Dave Smith synths. To me, this is the best of all his synths and I find the midi does not work properly most of the time. DS doesn't seem to care much because how could they have a problem with their "perfect" creations.
Yep I have one it's nice,hey how does it mesh with your virus
I would say that Prophet and Virus are pretty different from each other. On paper they seem similar as far as architecture, however I go about sound design differently on the virus vs prophet. Some things are more accessible on the prophet via direct knobs where menu diving is more common on the virus. The virus has some great FX with just the turn of a knob, so I find I can get to a more "polished" sound quicker. The prophet is a little more crisp sounding generally, where the virus is a bit darker oddly enough being 100% digital. They are both top notch instruments without a doubt.
Something about the tone rubs me the wrong way
Why are these more expensive than the 16 voice rev2?
Danielle Scribbins The Prophet 12 is still the flagship product. It offers WAY more complex modulation routings and has a much more broad spectrum of sound possibilities than the Rev 2. The Rev 2 is essentially two prophet 8s in one rig. They did tweak some features but all in all is a prophet 8. It's a wonderful synth. All analog and 16 voices is huge! Hope this helps.
I don't have time for twisting knobs when creating music that makes money for me.
VSTis for you then?
The fm is an emulation of analog fm. This is why it sounds weird. I have an an analog keys from elektron that does fm, it's analog not emulation and this is what it sounds like.
Before i buy a synth, i want to know what is an oscillator? 😂
The filter sweeping/enveloping is so sterile.
Can you judge listening on computer speakers, laptop speakers, etc?
Michael Bauers Well in this case I was listening on Genelec studio monitors.
Ah well, you got me there :)
danron It's actually not. Tons of character and life. Just have to dial it in. That's the best thing about the P12. It can sound cold and sterile, or warm and organic, it just depends on what you need and how you use it.
I regret no demonstrating the "analog" character this synth can produce. I hear and read a lot of people thinking because it has digital oscillators it's cold. It's really not. I can produce the classic Prophet 5 chorused pads perfectly, PWM it's amazing on it and the Curtis style analog filter is beautiful. I wish the 12db mode had more resonance but oh well. Calling this or any digital synth cold is like calling all VSTi's cold. Moog's oscillators are duller because they are analog, I can't inject buzzyness into them but I can cut it out of the DSI's oscillators with filtering. They all have a purpose. It's not a one vs the other.
Hi, I can see you also own a Virus TI2. soundwise, wich one you like more? O own a P6 and just bought a Virus TI2 polar, and I am happy with it but still wonder if I should have bought a P12 instead maybe.... Would be cool to hear your opinions on both and which one you think would be a better complement for a P6? Thanks