Giving Edmonton a Transit Makeover
Вставка
- Опубліковано 5 лип 2024
- Watch this video ad-free on Nebula: nebula.tv/videos/rmtransit-gi...
Edmonton is growing fast, and the city has the bones for a true urban paradise - but what does its transit system need to do to stack up, not just with big Canadian cities, but with the best around the world? I talk about a plan for just that in my latest video!
Support the Channel and Get Exclusive Content: / rmtransit
My Blog: reecemartin.ca
Twitter: / rm_transit
Instagram: / rm_transit
Mastodon: masto.canadiancivil.com/@reece
Bluesky: bsky.app/profile/rmtransit.bs...
Threads: www.threads.net/@rm_transit
Community Discord Server: / discord
Music from Epidemic Sound: share.epidemicsound.com/nptgfg
Map Data © OpenStreetMap contributors
Nexa from Fontfabric.com
When Reece pulls out the transit crayons you know it’s gonna be a banger
This. Many have questionable crayons, but Reece usually has good ones
EDIT: I have a feeling it's a combination of two reasons.
One is how he has a global perspective, so he's seen what works elsewhere and what doesn't, at least more than many English speakers, and doesn't suffer from "not invented here syndrome" that many do.
Second is how he only really publicly crayons for cities he's lived in for many years and taken as a daily user, so he knows the conditions on the ground and what matters for said cities.
Many people have one but not the other, but Reece has the somewhat rare combination of both.
People who built an HO model railroad also use high-quality colored pens for this sort of track planning.
It always is. I used to love crayoning as a kid now I love watching these videos
I eat crayons
Thanks for that!
As an Edmontonion, I’m happy to see some more attention brought to our rail system. It’s far from perfect but we have a good base and I’m excited for the future.
There's lot of potential, especially as Edmonton grows!
The good base was everything underground on the original line. Everything since that has been a low key disaster, with poor routes that dont make geographical sense with the city, and were done out of "save time and money" which none of them have done. We are a radial city, the lines should have followed that as well. How do you not have a line running under 95% of jasper ave straight?
As a fellow Edmontonian I hate our transit. It can take over an hour to get place that take 10 in a car
@@mikestoast the expansion to the university in the mid/late 90s was good. the surface level expansion beyond i agree.
🧅
"Sometime between now and the heat death of the universe..." Brilliant, I'm going to be making good use of that at work.
It's good isn't it!
@@RMTransit did you just imply that it will happen before 2040?😧
@@MB-co6qj nah not the current heat crisis 😂
Edmonton excites me as its one of the few cities in canada (imo) thats actually trying to both implement more public transit and do something about the housing crisis, few cities seem to be willing to implement the drastic zoning reforms and invest in the necessary infrastructure for it
Of course building more housing and implementing additional transit ought to be done in tandem anyway.
A very good point, Edmonton makes me optimistic!
@botks894 I'd rather see better thought out development, than simply allowing higher density everywhere. Plus, the high demand can help to fund said development and the infrastructure supporting it.
Yeah except that our property tax is way above any other city in Canada. Paying for all of this are the home owners. Property tax went up by about 8% this year...
@@LukasTheBlue Edmonton isn't anywhere close to having the highest property tax, even after this year's increase. It doesn't even have the highest property tax in Alberta.
I really love that Bonny Doon -> West Edmonton Mall line. Whyte Ave is a hugely popular area, and that line could probably make the Zoo actually reasonable to get to for people without access to a vehicle. This, the airport connection, and the southern Metro line extension are easily my favourite additions to the network
I'd rather see it as an automated light metro line, that can be built into a loop line at some point. Alberta should work w/ CN and CP for a land shuffle, to free up space along Yellowhead and south of Whyte. I don't know why he didn't mention the regional service Alberta is working on? What we should do changes in that context.
Whyte Ave, between the U of A transit centre and Bonnie Doon, would probably be the one line in the city that would make sense as a street level tram. The kind that you can hop on and off, like in San Francisco. The historical trams that go across the High Level could even be used for special occasions. Unrealistic since this city couldn't plan their way out of a paper bag it seems, but that would be cool to see.
@@asomelord Laurier Park residents and the River Valley tree huggers would never allow it.
@@mcdangles971Yep, 100%. They had their heart set on using trams as regional/suburban rail instead.
@@Jay-jq6blI think that Reece covered this in another video.
Extension to the YEG airport would be very useful for Edmonton and LeDuc.
Reducing travel time and better transit options for airport (one of the largest employer) can significantly improve worker job quality, talent pool, and productivity.
Increasing service on the 747 bus route, as Reece mentioned, feels like such a simple first step. The 1 hour window in the early morning or evening, just crushes my desire to use it. Particularly when I arrive home in the evening, have had a couple of 55 minute waits
Boost the 30 minute runs to 15. The hour to 30. And better integrate with Leduc.
Or the first part of a proper regional/commuter rail line using the CP ROW... The whole corridor between Edmonton and Calgary really is one large linear city with smaller and smaller gaps between towns and cities every year.. Break it into 3 operating sections Edm, RD, Cgy and offer services to each area with local overlap to make connections between them at say Wetaskiwin and Olds...
@@stickynorth I'm hoping they create a new ROW, branching off from CP to go under the airport, then to the west side of Leduc, w/ a new station there, then sort of like slalom, flank the towns along the way with a much straighter ROW and brand new rail focused areas that tie into the existing towns.
There is also a fashion outlet mall right beside the airport that was just recently built, but the distance and lack of public transit (the 747 bus is near useless) makes it quite inaccessible for Edmontonians. A connection to the city by light rail, and a possible high speed rail line to Calgary (terminated at YYC airport, maybe?), would be a major boost to tourism and local businesses.
Picture this, if the LRT went over to the CP alignment before Nisku, you could have a connector with service to Beaumont, Devon, at a regional station, then having another regional station on the west side of Leduc, that crosses the LRT again, after it has served several station in between. Even if LRT is grade separated, it's still very slow because there's no express service.
Some of the corridors you mentioned for rapid bus routes are actually already used for crosstown bus routes, like the 51 (Castle Downs to Westmount segment), 52 (Westmount to Wem segment), 55 (Wem to Meadows along Whitemud via Southgate), and 56 (Meadows to Mill Woods segment). These are great routes for getting across the city in my experience, but the problem my encounter with them is that they often have half hour frequencies outside of peak hours, and also stop everywhere along the route. I think these should be supplemented by frequent limited stop express services that would greatly reduce travel time, something like what the 43 and now R4 are to the 41 in Vancouver.
I also think there’s room for another crosstown bus service along Ellerslie Road in the south, as there are a lot of communities from Windermere through Charlesworth along it, a travelling between them, requires taking buses across the Henday to transfer on 23 Ave NW, which just wastes a lot of time
I never actually thought about running a Valley Line branch along Whyte Avenue that way. The Strathcona area today is annoying in that getting there from the LRT system is a bit time-consuming. In many cases, the best option isn’t even an ETS bus but rather Sherwood Park’s 404 (when it runs), or riding a bike.
Overall, this is a great video and I could really see a lot of the changes positively impact how I get around the city. I’m going to share this with my councillor.
Suburban bus frequencies need to be improved across the board of course!
Edmonton has a lot of potential. It's unfortunate that the province has set all municipalities in the province on the road for budgetary shortfalls and failure. A healthy relationship between the two groups would be ideal, but the province is outright antagonistic and is practicing austerity when it isn't necessary. Edmonton, Calgary and every municipality needs funding which the province has almost completely withdrawn.
Smith is too busy partying with right wing grifters in the us. At the very very least they're using the surplus to pay off debt and go into the heritage fun rather than just burning it....
@@Ded5833 for real. I’m from Ontario but my girlfriend is Albertan so we often discuss moving to Edmonton after she finishes school. I think Edmonton has so much potential and will be a great city in a few years, but right now the UCP scare me too much. Here’s hoping Rishi can take her out when the time comes.
THe budgetary problems come from municipal spending and wastage NOT from the rest of the province. The rest of us subsidize the decisions of urbanite bug-people in the bloated city bureaucracies. If you cannot fund your city with a 1MM population base then the people and elites of your city are irresponsible and stupid.
@@cookiedawg6977scared? 🤣😂😂 what scares you so much about the UCP? Economic prosperity?
@@dabomb199715 Lots of things. I’m afraid about their extreme governmental overreach into municipal and social affairs, despite their “conservative”, small-government image. I’m afraid of their defunding of social programs, letting them crumble even though there is a surplus in the budget. Im afraid of their mismanagement of money with all the pointless and expensive fights they pick with the Feds. I’m afraid of their environmental irresponsibility. I’m afraid of them doubling down on refusing to diversify Alberta’s economy away from O&G. I’m afraid of their anti-intellectualism, corruption, and partisanship. Frankly, I just don’t like how they focus voter’s attention on trivial issues and try to blame Ottawa for all of Alberta’s problems. What economic prosperity are you talking about exactly?
Excellent Reece. I had a year working on the Edmonton system a decade ago and I really like the city.
That's very cool to hear!
Edmonton really needs that Whyte Ave to WEM line built yesterday. So much east-west traffic with not-very-good bus routes that could be massively improved by a system with priority over vehicular traffic...
100% Thank former Mayor Mandel for both deflecting the proposed 87 Ave LRT bridge away from HIS area and voter base (rich, crusty monied West End Conservatives) to the existing 156 St route far away from the potential mansions affected by this project... What a shame because it's the busiest route that I can think of... At least now since the 8 changed...
That was a terrible planned route. Our LRT plan is a mess with no real logic just "hey let's go down this street for the heck of it" but cancelling that route was the correct choice. There is nothing along fox drive and most of whitemud. It would have skipped population for "expediency" It should have run under jasper out under stony plain road.
@@stickynorth The plan was not go go down 87th ave. It was to go down belgravia and down fox drive up along whitemud to WEM. A line that would avoid population. We knew someone who got one of the construction contracts for the south leg from the U of A station, and they talked how this was supposed to how the line got out west. Thankfully it never happened.
Absolutely agree. I put together a transit map like this when the Valley Line was about to open and came up with something similar, only far more aggressive. Where this plan expands on what's there, my plan focused on connecting what is there and expanding from that. Getting better cross-city connections would mean the LRT is connecting more communities than any outward expansion alone can do.
Wow thanks for liking Edmonton. I am surprised someone actually like this place.
I love Edmonton. I moved here from Tokyo in 2008.
There are a lot of similarities between Edmonton and the Tyne and Wear Metro in the UK. Both started in the 1970s using existing rail lines connected to a new central tunnel, with German-based rolling stock. Both later faced financial problems being able to extend the tunnel to useful destinations (west Newcastle - still not connected, and south Edmonton). And both later had planners who wanted to turn it into urban LRT, rather than see it as the subway it is (the 2002 Project Orpheus would have made much of the TW Metro street running, but was never implemented - while Edmonton got all the problematic street running when it finally extended south and especially on the NAIT extension).
Having grown up in both Newcastle and Edmonton, I can say these are both amazing systems that did a lot for their communities - and yet still faced trouble getting approval/funding for badly needed extensions and improvements.
A great comparison and very apt - thank you for this!
That being said, TW Metro really ought to inspire Edmonton with those *beautiful* new Stadler trains!
Please do more crayoning with Reece maybe with calgary or Montreal or Halifax
I don't think I will do Calgary. Halifax could be interesting!
@@RMTransit I'm happy you might do Halifax:)
@@RMTransit damn i was hoping you’d do Calgary, it’s only fair 🤷
@@RMTransit You kinda have to now, lol.. If not you'll never hear the end of the Calgary "but...but.. you did Edmonton crowd"... That's literally the dynamics of everything in Alberta sadly enough... From hospitals (Calgary got a new one, Edmonton's was cancelled and Red Deer is getting one as a a voter bribe essentially) to transit funding... Although "To Be Fair" Calgary doesn't needly nearly a much transit planning suggestive help as others since they tended to have created a giant unitary transit plan and stuck to it over time with little change... Unlike Edmonton which can't even decided which projects to advance at any given time... I.e. Gorman was supposed to be built by 2007 or 2008 and here we are... Or the added $210M price tag to the SLRT extension even with value engineering... Agreed on Halifax though... They have a loop around the peninsula that is grade separated and would made a great reuse transit corridor along with a revival of the streetcar network...
Thanks for making this video Reece, nice to see Edmonton getting some love
Thank you for covering Edmonton! I really appreciate it.
You making a dedicated video on Edmonton public transit has always been a dream of mine , thank you dude ❤️
Great video with a lot of great points but I wanted to point out a few things.
1. There’s already confirmed a south extension to the airport, I’d just like to not have to wait like 25 years until they get around to building it? Haha.
2. Your dream Edmonton rail network is HELLA expensive, don’t think it’ll be that feasible to build, even though it’d be lit. Otherwise we’d need to triple our population to get the tax revenue to build it.
3. The elevated track being terminated at Ellerslie should be a NATIONAL CRIME. How DARE they. I’m still mad that they think they have to do this to save some money. Some things are worth spending an extra 50-100 million on. There’s still time technically to adjust this back but I doubt they’d do anything so yeah, they’ll regret doing this. It’s going to be a Uof A /belgravia situation all over again. Unbelievably terrible traffic because the rail is crossing at grade across an extremely busy intersection. Here’s to hoping the provincial govt offers a bit of extra cash to get it elevated? Or better yet….have it dip underground and come out the other side of the street .
Nobody in twin brooks wanted a station there and it’s too close to the century park one. Therefore they should scrap the twin brooks station, have it just go straight from century park to ellerslie, that’d save some money and make the train decently faster too.
Great video, Reece, with some smart advice for Edmonton. I hate it when city transit planners push slow tram services for mass transit, undermining modal shifts because of the poor travel times.
Its all about the aesthetics, which are rightly something we should think about, but its cart before horse if it undermines the publics support for PT
LRT is basically poor man's metro, you can get 70% of goodies metro has while spending one-third.
And slower than the bus routes they replaced
@@Rick-C-117for the Valley line? Maybe, but not the Capital and Metro lines. I've been a semi-regular user of Edmonton's transit for around a year now, and only the Valley line has been rivalled by buses in terms of travel time.
Baltimore Red Line, but tbh, at this point, I just want the damn thing built so we can stop talking about it
Unfortunately it just can't scale like metro, in 20 years they'll very much regret not doing a system like the SkyTrain.
@@AmokCanuck Valley Line? Yes.. It's a niche P3 project that is doomed to fail by its design... The existing German-style high-floor PRE-METRO? Nope, that's solid... They just need to get the speeds back up on certain sections and add in a few new infill stations along the existing ROW... McCauley @ 95, Future Station under the Brownlee/former Remand centre would make a great downtown Central Station with pedway access to Churchill and beyond.. It's also where Stelmach proposed to build an HSR station back in 2006-2009... Attached to the back to the RAM over the Living Bridge on 97th...
What's the North American obsession with hooking up many independent cars into a train? It means paying for 4-6 additional drivers cabs (with all the equipment and electronics) that will never be used. As well as reducing passenger capacity
I mean open gangways were a pretty recent invention and the Frankfurt cars were started a decade ago. The recent High Floor cars were built only a few years before that was started. Better off getting new trains with the centre cars.
Low floor vehicles are a whole different story. Skoda seems to build almost upto 60m long Low floor vehicles, and that’s just for actual tram lines not even LRT. Systems like Seattle and San Diego should get elongated S700s
If one car breaks down or there's a passenger emergency, the other cars can be returned to service immediately. I think that's the idea behind it, at least.
It's to provide flexibility. When you only have 20 riders late Sunday evenings, (which is common in North America (see Denver especially), 5 cars is ridiculous inefficiency.)
The VIA rail station out in the middle of nowhere would greatly benefit from a connection to mass transit.
Same with Ottawa! No clue why the VIA station moved from a strategic downtown location to middle of no where in between the airport and downtown
What is with VIA stations and being in the middle of nowhere. The one near me is far from the main parts of town, and now I hear edmonton and ottawa have the same issue? I wonder why
Why Edmonton’s VIA stations is so out of the way is based on the movement of the rail lines. When Edmonton was initially being expanded trains ran across the High Level Bridge into a rail yard currently where MacEwan university is (that’s why the university is so long). This yard was moved north of the Yellowhead so the station moved with it.
@@stefannakonechny2004 Bingo. It is what is is being located on what's left of the CN rail loop that used to connect NW to NE via downtown... To some degree this should be revived for commuter rail service if you ask me...
Let’s spend lots of money to favour the 200 people who take VIA every year. Keep wasting billions.
the babying down light rail is TOO common, extremely annoying too.
Calagry's C-trains are very fast and typically keep up with traffic. Which is why when I travelled to Edmonton I was very dissapointed with how slow their LRT's moved.
Transit has to be fast if we want people to get out of their cars.
@@drewpatterson8261Calgary actually considered “Urban LRT” down Centre Street but it was vehemently rejected by residents so they continued with the High Floor Suburban model.
@@drewpatterson8261 I know. ETS used to run much faster... But to save energy and wear and tear they slowed down service from 70 km/h to 50 km/h on most of the line.. Almost Portland slow... I hate it! And of course the Valley Line is GLACIAL to watch in motion/drive along side... The rolling stock is nice looking though...
Just got back home from Norway and the public transit was sooo efficient, clean, safe, and dummy proof. The tram (light rail) takes you right from the Bergen airport all the way to city centre, or any stop in between. Makes landing at the airport and getting to the hotel bloody easy. The cars were coupled like he describes in this video too, which was nice. Accidentally walk into a full car? just stroll down into the next one that has space. It ran very frequently too, every 7 minutes. I hope our transit can begin to look more like theirs.
Edmonton resident: The problem is not the infrastructure but personal safety. The issue is the Socio-economic drug culture/homeless using drugs on the trains, assaults, harassment etc. Ask any female person how they feel about using the "LRT" especially if they are alone. and worse yet at night.
EPS - Edmonton Police Service is currently piloting 6 two person teams dedicated to the transit system, this is not enough. For the LRT to be utilized more is changing the perception of personal safety on the LRT.
This is the responsibility of the Alberta (UCP) government.
Read the Constitution of Canada Division of Powers.
I just moved to Edmonton two days ago !
It's an interesting time to be here! I grew up in Edmonton but "escaped" for a 4-yr span to Vancouver, ending roughly with the 2010 Olympics. Both cities continue to grow and provided you've been able to secure affordable housing, Edmonton is *finally* beginning to exhibit some of the big-city feel that allowed me to fall in love instantly with Vancouver and several other places I've visited since. A more comprehensive rail network I consider to be central to that feel.
Welcome!
Make sure you have a nice winter coat (don't cheap out, it will be your best friend!). I moved here 5 years ago; I'm pretty happy with it. There's a big rollout of bike infrastructure underway rn. Hit up Farrow's if you want some relatively cheap-but-good sandwiches!
Your timing is good. Edmonton was awful until about 18 years ago, and has been steadily improving ever since.
Do Winnipeg. And you better suggest rail!! 😉
Great video. Long overdue. The project missed that would probably do some of the greatest good is closing the downtown subway loop by adding proper stations at MacEwan University and Railtown thereby creating a proper albeit small central circulator.
As for the Fort Saskatchewan rural line? It was a commuter rail stop on a line that used to run all the way to Vegreville. It was 73 miles from CN Station and took 90 minutes to complete with stops at Fort Sask, Chipman and Vegreville approximately every 30 minutes/30 miles apart except Fort Sask which is 16 miles from downtown. Trains ran every 30 minutes and it was a popular service for the region until CN dropped all passenger service and VIA failed to run with it. These types of commuter lines should run South as far as Wetaskiwin or Ponoka (75 and 100 km respectively from downtown) and as West as Evansburg/Entwistle at least in the long run. Getting commuters from Parkland, Sturgeon, Leduc and Strathcona County to the U of A or downtown seems like a real challenge now with its mixture of transit offerings that aren't reliable outside a few small windows of time...
imo, the Edmonton LRT should turn more into a suburban rail than a metro. ofc, the central core *should* have metro-style service, but i think that treating the suburban sections like suburban rail rather than metro might be a good idea. i think you were kinda already suggesting it, but i would add a few things to make it more like suburban rail:
-*express trains.*
while the LRT *should* be upgraded to speeds of up to 100-110kmh, i think even then, with tons of stations, it might not even be enough. this is where express trains come in! for this style of EMU-metro type service, i would recommend "splitting" each line into sections: areas where inner locals run, and expresses run express, and areas where long distance express run, and locals turn back. at the local turnback stations, you should have timed, cross-platform transfers (we love those!) between local and express trains, similar to a 4-track Keio line station in Tokyo! There should also be at least 1 or 2 extra timed cross-platform stations along the "inner local" sections of the network, allowing fast and convenient trips between all areas of the network! And the truth is, adding the collective of a few dozen km *AT MOST* of track for these 4-track, Japanese style overtake stations, should not be expensive at all. These express trains should ofc have standing room, but I think on longer journeys, having 65%+ seated is a good idea. I was testing out this seating arrangement: transverse seats in rows of 3, plus bench seating on the other side. this basically gives you close to the amount of seats found with 3 by 2 seating, found on mainline trains (and ironically, a few metros), in the space of a narrow coach that can "only" fit 2-2 transverse seating. you also have space for one row between the seats, areas by the doors and space in between the seats, for standees! In theory, this is a good way to balance seating, but i am not quite sure the comfort levels of 3-row seating on these types of trains. anyways, suburban rail style express service would be a big W for the Edmonton LRT! even with express service, i think that all services, local *and* express, should run *no less* than every 12 mins, but ideally every 10 mins. frequency is always key on all services!
-*more mainline rail type ROW:*
i also think you were suggesting this, but while grade separation on the areas with more than 24tph (12 local and 12 express) should *defiantly* be done, i think that grade crossings are perfectly okay! as long as the gates are down for half the time they are up, its basically like having another road intersection. that said, these grade crossings *need* to be mainline rail style: no crossings in the medians of roads or any of that. *all* of those tram-style crossings should be replaced with full grade separation in those areas, on elevated viaducts. *but*, the crossings on the northern part of the capitol line are the perfect design for the other crossings: full train priority and no intersections directly after the crossing to cause congestion. also, you mentioned that tram-style operation in the boonies might be okay, but i would go further and treat it like a mainline train and do a Portland WES-style median running mainline tracks, with somewhat high speeds (around 65kmh). basically, i think Edmonton should think: "if this was a mainline suburban train, how would we design it?" and use those designs to work around the current LRT they have.
-*incentive for standard mainline suburban and regional rail*
i think that Edmonton should have a few regional rail lines, that extend the LRT-turned-suburban-rail into the deep suburbs even more! building mainline-style infra for the LRT system could be translated to a standard suburban/regional railway for Edmonton! I dont think that ETS even needs to run the service: VIA rail should run it! I think we should normalize intercity railroads operating SBahns and regional trains, which is, guess what.....WHAT THEY DO IN EUROPE! Amtrak already does this around Chicago and a few of their state corridor routes, so the idea isn't unheard of here in NA. I don't think it would hurt VIA rail to get into the regional/suburban/commuter markets in the big cities, similar to DB in Germany!
(im going to geek out on rolling stock for a little bit, but for these type of operations, i would recommend CEM bilevels + modern electric locomotives for regional express services, and, specifically, the 3.2 meter wide nordic model of the stadler FLIRT, for the all-stop regional sprinters. i would also design a few loco+coach sets that can run on EMU schedules, that have 100% EMU performance, just to test out tech that makes loco+coaches as high performance as EMUs! ofc, these loco+coach sets would never replace EMUs, ideally they would run side-by-side! )
sorry for geeking out a bit there, lol. but in conclusion, i think treating the ETS light rail like proper suburban rail, and less like metro, is the right approach, and I think you were already kinda saying that!
This is honestly fantastic, I was working on Express/Inter-City designs myself connecting from all the cities as best as I could. I love the passion!
I don't disagree that it should be suburban rail esque - most suburban metros are!
yup, BART, WMATA, and MARTA have done a great job with their suburban metros, a good model to copy
Calgary next! Everyone wants it
I hope Edmonton puts transit to good use.
Give Calgary a makeover too!
Love these kinds of videos Reece!
I would love to see a "Connecting Canada: from Toronto to Vancouver" rail line video. It would help everyone. Or even just connecting the prairies to each other via rail, for example winnipeg-yorkton-saskatoon-lloydminister-edmonton.
Is Calgary next for "Crayoning with Reece" or Montreal?
I don’t know that I’ll do Calgary
@@RMTransitwhy not? :(
@@RMTransit And then you'll do Ottawa?
I think the main message to Quebec is just "stop building tramways for 5+ billion and start listening to CDPQ"
@@RMTransit So, will you do Calgary next or Ottawa?
I've been WAITING for this video to see what ideas you had for the system, and I'm glad to see that we are on the same page about a bunch of things. I do have a few ideas/concerns about some plans though.
Overall, one of the current issues of the low floor (tram) system is that it does NOT have priority of the signal system when it runs concurrent with the road. IMO one of the first things that needs to change with the system is that it gets remedied first. Currently, in a high traffic scenario (rush hour) , the Metro Line in only a few minutes faster than being in a car. If the City wants to get more people on board, it really needs to give a time incentive to allow this to occur. Given the current issue re: crime and general safety, only being slightly faster than a "safe" car does not warrant many people taking this train currently.
@9:26 That extension works great, but it should run on 153 Ave than take the route you chose. It's more linear, and it could help with costs since it could just be a straight connection between the two lines.
@13:52 You mention going into Buena Vista Park. That idea is a brilliant one, but FYI a LOT of rich people live within that area (think almost all of the Oilers and even the owner of the team himself). The issue you could run into is simply NIMBYs with a ridiculous amount of pull of the local government, but it is a neat idea. A loop between Jasper Ave (Downtown) and Whyte Ave (think gentrified Kensington Market) is absolutely necessary, and the conversations I've had with City councillors have already hinted that both that would be built, alongside a high speed track (I'll get to that in a second).
@11:33 YES! This is so desperately needed. With the current provincial government's decleration of a "Metrolinx" train operator with high speeds (I'll call it Albertalinx for now), I have an interesting idea: Turn Churchill into a MASSIVE hub for the municipal, provincial, and federal rail network. Currently the Churchill station has the Valley Line on the roadways, and underneath it the tunnels for the Capital and Metro Lines. If you could create another level underneath, with longer platforms for the Albertalinx tracks as well rerouting the VIA rail tracks (currently set up near the Yellowhead and CN rail lines, roughly near Blatchford), the amount of traffic and business that could bring the area would be SUBSTANTIAL. You can essentially create an European-style hub and have a truly enjoyable transfer w/o having to venture too far off if need be.
Another proposal I bring is the moment you brought up at @13:30, where it comes into contact with the Windemere neighborhood. That area has been primed for some development, and even has great use of mixed development. If you were to create a single line using Ellerslie Road SW and going east to west from this, across the QEII, and connecting at the southern point of the Valley Line West, you can allow individuals to move from the SW to the SE w/o trekking all the way to Downtown.
BTW your point about Fort Saskatchewan and St. Albert? Those were in the works but one of the cities didn't want the expansion (my memory says St. Albert, but I could be wrong) and there was a Edmonton Metropolitan Transit Services Commission that wanted to connect all of the cities at one point, but due to financing (an everpresent issue), Edmonton pulled out of the group and the entire commission was disbanded in 2023.
Lots of words, but I am truly passionate about seeing my city become one of the best in the world! Love to see what you think!
"Meanwhile, at some point between now and the heat death of the universe the capital line should be extended" This is honestly the funniest and best part of the video.
As someone who uses Edmonton transit almost every day, there are certainly days where i want to rip my hair out but we definitely have a good base to build off of. I hope one day this city can live up to its potential with transit, it would be amazing
Wow, I remember growing up in Edmonton (1975-2000) and St. Albert was basically a whole different city... now it's barely a suburb, and soon will be nothing more than a neighborhood inside Edmonton.
75,000 people and growing faster by the day....
Most ppl in St. Albert work out of Edmonton anyway. New small businesses tend to struggle in St Albert
@@stickynorth My comment wasn't about its size, but of its location related to EDM over the decades.
@@hoodedmirror1051 - Sounds like Airdrie to Calgary. A lifestyle community for people who don't want to live in Calgary, without giving up the conveniences of the city.
@@FHL-Devils Thats exactly it. Its a small outside city with slightly better schools, parks, etc. And then a lot of people take a 30 minute commute to Edmonton every weekday
The problem people in Edmonton are having right now with is trusting that future LRT projects will be done on time and on budget. Metro Line had so many signaling issues, Valley Line was 3 years late in delivery, and most recently there is a cost overrun of $240 million in expanding the Capital Line southward. The city, Edmonton Transit, and the project managers need to keep these projects on track (pun not intended), otherwise the current generation of taxpayers will no longer support LRT and general transit expansion, and transit improvements will be stalled for decades.
Big problem is trusting it to private contractors. the city has been large enough for decades that they should have their own city owned construction company, not unlike any of the other city owned business like Epcor.
So there is going to have to be some clarification of some important issues:
1) Refinery Row has to be separate from the City Of Edmonton and the City cannot dip its fingers into Refinery Row. This has been the biggest barrier to creating a regional governance system like a regional transit network. I strongly suspect that it is the province that steps in and provides a rail system between Edmonton's suburban cities and Edmonton itself. And if the province is going to do that, it will probably utilise the TUC that is Anthony Henday to facilitate that.
2) The station redesign at Stadium might make it look more dangerous when it comes to interaction between different forms of transportation, but to me the largest thing it seemed to be designed around was getting rid of the pedestrian underpass where a good number of assaults and murders were happening. Should the underpass have been replaced by an overpass? Maybe. But I think the criminal element was the biggest deciding factor.
3) The Urban LRT thing was Stephen Mandel's child. Basically a way of justifying the expansion of the LRT while avoiding the disturbance of residents in Parkview, Laurier Heights and Crestwood. It's why the Low Floor LRT was selected. I agree it is high time to move away from the concept or at least, maintain those elements for the Low Floor LRT and keep the original design considerations for the High Floor LRT.
4) Speaking of the Low Floor LRT, I think it is hopeless to rely on it for connecting high traffic areas. It's slow, but more navigable on Edmonton's surface streets. It should be the system to provide inner city circulation. I like the idea of building the Downtown circulator, and if it is built in conjunction with the Alberta rail network, can hop on the replacement of the High Level Bridge. My other weird idea is to have the High Floor LRT ring around the inner ring road (Whitemud, 170th Street, Yellowhead (or 137h Avenue), 50th street) so as to give WEM a High Floor LRT station, and provide more intense service. I have noticed the ridership on the Route 55 has been skyrocketing, ever since it simplified the old 33 route with its milk run in Brander Gardens removed. They've been constantly adding buses on Route 55, so it is something to consider in future plans.
I'd like to see the hill under Saskatchewan Drive redeveloped. I saw one idea to turn the top deck of the High Level bridge into a park akin to the Highline, which I think could be really awesome, especially if it ties into a pedestrian terrace on the south end and connects parks on the north.
@@Jay-jq6bl The Top Deck would be cool as a park however it would be better as an active train deck with HSR and 2 LRT/tram lines on top which is one of the current proposals the city is still studying for the upcoming redux of the bridge.. Other options including Twinning the HLB (also planned since the 1950's) or a tear down and new bridge on its site with traffic being rerouted to Walterdale in the meantime since the far West walkway is actually designed as a 4th traffic lane should the need arise... In this case to make it temporary a two-way bridge with 2 lanes in each direction which would be enough capacity in the meantime for the OG HLB to be dealt with one way or another...
There is not going to be a replacement of the high level. It is going to be refurbished. There is no place else to put a bridge in that section of the city. No more high floor or at grade lines. Get it underground or dont even bother doing it. High grade just means less stations and more eyesores. WEM should have 3 stations at it, and where they are running the line it should be underground with the east station that also services the hospital being a node that is part of the western section of the third inside the Henry ring LRT.
@@stickynorth The area and infrastructure leading to it is no way feasible for HSR. The current tram line is a perfect use for the top deck. It could continue to run in conjunction with a park, however they already have issue with people jumping and a top deck park would have to put up high barriers. Living in the area and seeing the proposals, nothing is great. the only good thing would be to see the street car line be extended north up to grant mac, lifting that strange dip in jasper up to grade and running the street car under a small bridge. Stop trying to tear everything down and remove the few unique and character things this city has.
@@mikestoast As the bridge is more than 100 years old, the ability to refurbish the bridge is going to be limited as critical components of the bridge get weaker with age.
Thanks for the great video - really appreciate your insights and rationale for next steps in our transit system in Edmonton. It's a video I've shared and hope the city takes into consideration in future plans and that we truly be bold.
Great ideas. TY!
As an Edmontonian and a student from NAIT, please keep our transit system underrated, don't want no 500 people in one coach like Ontario.
Sometime in the near future they’ll probably have to extend the Valley line west a bit further, as more neighborhoods expand west of Edmonton. There’s also gonna be a huge rec centre being built in Lewis Estate/ just past Lewis and into Secord.
I hope they have lots of busses going from Lewis farms to Secord. Going to be lots of kids trying to get to the rec centre
I’ve just noticed, Vancouver’s New Flyer Xcelsior buses look so much better than any other North American city’s bus of the same model because of how Translink has styled the window frames. They no longer have the visible rounded edge window frames. Instead they are European style seamless windows making the same Xcelsior buses look that much more futuristic. Just take a comparison between the New Flyer XDE60 buses Seattle ordered in 2019 and the ones Vancouver ordered in 2019, shown in this video as the RapidBus. Besides the paint scheme being different, Vancouver’s just looks so much sleeker due to the seamless windows while Seattle’s just looks like a remodel of the D60LF New Flyer diesel from the early 2000s.
As someone who lives in Sherwood Park, I am glad you thought of us. We need more connectivity than busses.
Speaking of Edmonton, I still wonder are there still plans for a dedicated high-speed line between Edmonton and Calgary? They could use 200 km/h Stadler KISS train sets for a one way trip of just under 90 minutes.
I think that’s in Alberta’s rail network plan that was unveiled recently.
Two different projects are kind of promoted so far Ellis Don's P3 concept Prairie Link which would operate in a new dedicated HSR corridor at 400 km/h. Current price tag if $9.8B, the other is a regional/commuter rail line using the existing CP ROW and probably infrastructure to some degree... No speed or price tag on that however 200 km/h service is possible on MOST of the line if they upgraded the crossings and put up fencing as per the 2004 Van Horne train study. It called for 200-240 km/h service along the line with closing and upgrading of crossings along the way...
@@stickynorth I'll take the latter solution with the modified CPKC right of way. Using an almost stock Stadler KISS train set, 200-220 km/h max between Edmonton and Calgary is definitely possible.
"plans" is better for it, They have been around for 40 years, and comes up every so often but nothing is ever going to happen with it, unless we get a radical shift in gov. Even where the NDP are now centre/centre-right, they will not touch it. The politics of this province are too reactionary and there has not been any long term planning for near 50 years.
Damn, MetroLink catching strays lol
You would not believe how congested Century Park stairs and escalators get whenever a train comes to the station, I definitely would vouch for a general increase in capacity for stations to be able to handle more people faster
I haven't ridden it since attending NAIT in 2013. But I still remember the stairs, pedway, trains and buses being packed before and after school hours
The design for this station is insane, two staircases + one elevator up from the train platform and then a single staircase back down to the bus station is a completely baffling bottlenecking decision. Century Park is begging for a redesign, especially with the southern expansion.
@shoeboogler They should elevate the whole track when they first built. But nope, too expensive, go with the cheap option and lay it on the street. Piss off every driver cause they have to wait 10-15 minutes to cross the track.
Don't forget all the signalling and lighting issues that happen sometimes.
@@TrickiVicBB71 For sure, 111th is kind of a nightmare corridor because of the grade crossings during rush hour. Definitely wish it was elevated. But I think a better station layout is about all we will get at this point.
@@TrickiVicBB71I assumed that they would do this. Was pretty shocked when they decided not to.
The Bonnie Doon to University route along/near Whyte Ave is sorely needed and is the only route that would actually make a lot of sense as a low-floor tram.
Another issue is that even with all of the planned extensions, the system is completely radial. A loop line or even just some connections between lines without having to go downtown would make the system much more practical for all sorts of trips other than just commuting.
The only way for it to work as a low floor tram would be to fully remove the traffic from Whyte Ave in that section. The street is simply not big enough to accommodate, traffic and a tram. Even with all the parking removed, which it should be in favour or bike lanes.
This obsession with at grade or above grade needs to stop. Get everything underground or dont even bother.
@@mikestoast it could run along one of the other avenues adjacent to Whyte
@@lance-biggums other avenues are even narrower, with many one way streets as it is, not to mention other barriers (massive property buys) underground or dont bother, everything else is not a serious idea and just half measure to "do something"
83 ave would work
Great video. I do feel like Windermere and Terwillegar were ignored for the most part though. Those are probably the largest growing areas in the city and Ellerslie Road's poor planning is absolutely facing the consequences of that mass expansion right now.
for the connection to sherwood park i feel like it would be nice if it went down 118 ave instead of along the yellowhead. 118 ave is prioritized for cars currently, but it runs parallel to the newly upgraded yellowhead, so there's really no need for that. 118 has a lot of destinations, as well as a lot of housing; so giving the area good transit access would be great. whereas the yellowhead is pretty out of the way.
Thanks!
I love these style of videos. Could you maybe look into making one of these about Eindhoven, the Netherlands? It is a rapidly growing technology hub but only has 2 train stations for commuter rail, and a very overcrowded bus system.
Best update for the 747- have the first run of the day arrive BEFORE the first morning shift for staff instead of ten minutes after.
Edmonton needs to build it's downtown up way more before we focus on getting all of this connectivity to bring people in.
Hi just FYI, the Valley Line extension does not go down 66st, it will continue along 28th ave and then turn onto 50st to stop at Charlesworth
Do a video like this but for Winnipeg. Winnipeg is seriously a backwards city, transit-wise, and I would love to see how you would plan and design a effective and functional transit system for them!
As an edmontonian with a passion for this, thank you for the video. However there are some mistakes and some assumptions made that are just not happening here. The Hospital on the south side is not being built. The Airport is not setting aside land for a train or a terminal.
One of the worst things the city ever did was stop building the underground LRT during the first phase for the Commonwealth games.
All of Edmontons above ground lines need to be removed and fully moved underground, except in the river valley and ravine areas. The at grade lines have been a disaster. I dont think any have of yet reached their intended speed targets, they create a mess of traffic, all in the name of "cheaper and faster" yet Edmonton built the NAIT extension ~1.5 miles for around the same cost that Indianapolis IIRC built 27 miles of underground LRT grade tunnel. It also does not help that the city and builders have the idea that stations should be ~20 blocks apart, and some stations inaccessible to people who live 1-3 blocks away. The Mutant station is purposefully build away from the residential area. Lines have different trains with poor transfer points.
Edmonton is a radial city and the LRT should follow suit.
A proper LRT system in Edmonton would be a circle and spoke system, and as such is pretty easy to map out with only slight adjustments that can be better articulated on a map (especially with the half spokes), and consist of the following (of note this should again all be underground except in the river valley and ravine areas due to elevation)
Stations a min of 4 blocks and a max of 8 block apart, where a block is defined as a downtown east/west block
N/S line running from: the south side of Leduc up 50st, through Nisku up 43 st, up Nisku Spine rd, up parsons road, and to the west side of CT-S up 106st, over walterdale bridge, up 105th street at the hospital up 106th to nait then up 97 to the north end of the city. The City centre airport should have been moved to CFB Edmonton, and the LRT line run up to it. With CFB Edmonton shutting down and operations moving out to CFB Cold Lake or Wainwright
E/W Line Running from; Intersection of Sherwood drive and Broadmoor In sherwood park (more on this later) west to 90ave and 50st, up 90th ave, up connors roads, across the low level bridge, up jasper ave, up 102 ave to 142st. This would then branch with "A" branch going SW to Meadowlark Rd, up 87th ave, three stations at the mall, up sunder greens drive and west up 86th ave. "B" branch going from 102 ave and 124 st to 107ave and 170 st intersection, then up 107 ave to the Anthony heady with further plans to extend further west.
NW/SE Line Running from: Gervais Rd and St Albert Trial, down St Albert trial, down 140 st, down Dunvegan Rd, down St Alberta trail/ Groat Rd, From the 118 ave and St Alberta Trail intersection to the intersection of 124st and Stony plain road, from that intersection to Jasper and 110 st, up Jasper, over the low level bridge, up connors rd, up 83 st, up 86th st, up 76 st. Intersection of 76 and Millbourne cut strict SE to 14 ave and 25 st intersection.
NE/SW Line: Plans to run out the Fort Sask It is too far away a this point in time. Follow the existing line (but underground) all the way to 114st and 71 ave intersection, then to 122 and 51ave intersection, west along side whitemud dr, up terwillegar, up 170 st to 41 ave.
In between each of these main spokes would be half spokes starting at the first ring LRT and radiating out. Ex a Beaumont half spoke.
The First Ring: Start at Tawatina Bridge, up 95st, up 103a ave up 104 ave to 124 st, down 124 st, cross groat road bridge up Groat Rd to Sask Dr and Windsor Rd, up 120 st to University Ave, to to 82 ave to 93 st, up 91 st up 92 st, up connors rd, up 96A St to the bridge.
The Second Ring: Wayne Gretzky Drive and 112 ave intersection, up 112ave, up 111ave to 142 st. Up 142 St, cross Quesnell Bridge. Up Riverbend Rd to the intersection of 147a st and 45 ave. up Whitemud Dr to 75 St up 75 st to Capilano Bridge
Third Ring: 87 Ave and 170st Intersection, down 170 st, aqueduct style bridge to cross the river to Riverbend Rd and Rabbit Hill Rd. Down Riverbend Rd. down 23 Ave to 34 st. up 34 st to Baseline Rd, up beside Goldstick park, cross ainsworth dyer bridge, from 34 st and 104 ave intersection straight to 50st and yellowhead. up 50 st to 137 ave. west on 137 ave to 127 st. from 127 st and 137 ave intersection straight to mayfield and 163 st intersection, up mayfield rd. up 170st
Fourth Ring (half): Ellerslie rd and 34 st intersection, up Elleslie rd to Rabbit Hill Rd. From that intersection straight NW to Windermere Blvd, up windermere Blvd. Cross the river, to 199st and Maskekosihk trail. NW to Esaiw Place straight north in the middle between 199st and 215 st to whitemud dr. up winterburn rd to the yellowhead with future plans to cross and go north up to Trumpeter way.
Fifth Ring (Half): 20st and 144 ave intersection, up 144 ave, at 144 ave and Victoria trail intersection straight to 50 st and 153 ave intersection, up 50 st, west on 167 ave to 127 st. From 127 st and 167 ave intersection straight to 142 st and 153 ave intersection, then over to the NW/SE line.
Airport: From the Airport up Airport Road to 43 St and the N/S line. For volume purposes, and luggage hauling around. i would make this 4 lines instead of the standard 2.
Sherwood Park: Sherwood Dr and Broasmoor Intersection, straight east to Clover Bar Rd. Up Clover Bar Road to Davenport Dr and Lakeland Drive intersection. Up Lakeland Drive to Broadmoor Blvd. Then South on Broadmoor Blvd. A half spoke in the Edmonton line could run up baseline Rd from 75 st to high cliff rd.
St Albert: Elevation changes are tricky here. Ideally the line would run under St albert trail. Then with a rind starting at Gervais Rd and St albert trail, up herbert rd to Boudruay intersection, north up sir winston churchill ave to sturgeon rd interaction. Cross straight to st alberta trial and erin ridge rd intersection. up villeneuve rd to hogan rn, down hogan rd, down leveque way, up the train tracks to Levasseur rd. up lavasseur rd to gervais rd.
I would also have very small branches for sports. Trains that run straight from the airport to locations, carrying sports teams, local or flying in for games. A small branch at the U of A to the Butterdome. A small branch at 105 ave and 105 st, going west to Grant Mac and East to Rogers (Side note, since arena ice spans are ~30-35 years, the entire area between 104 and 106 ave, and 104 st and 101 st, should be set aside specifically as "arena land" so the city and sports team owners are nto fighting over location, an the next arena does not have to end up in leduc or spruce grove because they can find land in the city) Grant Mac should also be extended fully up to 107 ave. A branch going to the Commonwealth community recreation centre. Civilian trains would not access these stations, sports teams could be dropped off, personnel and equipment right at the venues, without needing to bus in or get on the public access trains.
All of this before talking about how it would tie into the decades old spinning wheel of high speed rail talk in the province and how it would pass through the city.
This plan would have the added benefit of touching the main drivers of a good pubic transit system, that being touching as many Cultural, Educational, Recreational , Residential, Industrial locations on the route, with an emphasis on the former 4.
The province should have bough Edmonton 8 tunnel boring machines when the first line was being build and never stopped. The same with Calgary though Calgary is more linear and thus a different organization to their trial system . Buy them and dont stop digging until and extremely comprehensive network is built. As it is we are stuck with horrible above ground and at grade lines that are basically useless (one that directly interferes significantly with hospital traffic) and make it a pain to get to stations as the city is intent on having people drive to the stations to use them.
A couple comments: 1. The long term future for the valley line south is likely going to be turning south after the mill woods stop down 50st towards Beaumount (you've got it on 66st on your map). There's already zoning in place for a transit center on the south east corner of 50st and ellerslie road. No funding or design work done on that yet though. 2. The hospital in the south west is not currently under construction, it's been mothballed by our massively incompetent provincial government. Great video!
Unfortunately, there would be major pushback from Sherwood Park with respect to pushing an LRT out to it. I am aware of Sherwood Park residents that refer to the LRT as "mobile homeless shelter".
Thanks for covering my city!!
Superb info and opinions Reese! I am about to visit family in Edmonton and St. Albert - St. Albert - a residential bedroom community next to Edmonton - only has buses. I wonder if the affluence means many people drive. My family is in St. Albert and when I visit no one is ever on the buses! My niece said with weather and average household income most young people have a car as well. AB is conservative and I find fewer people interested in green/alternative transit. Insightful video! Thank you!! 🙂
Edmonton is very good about bike lanes- current council is fairly urbanist in that and a few other regards! When I moved here in 2019 the situation was way worse than it is now.
Edmonton is also more mixed politically than you might expect. As far as partisanship, Edmonton-Strathcona has the only NDP MP in AB, but pretty much every MLA in the city is NDP (our national and provincial interests are not super aligned).
@@TheDEM1995 Hey I appreciate this a lot! I am pretty familiar with the city as a lot of family live there and in Calgary, Drumheller and Smoky Lake! Happy to hear of the bike lanes! I have been on the LRT and enjoyed it - took it from visiting a family member at the Royal Alex to her home Downtown to get her some stuff. I'd like to ride it a lot more! Love the federal NDP MP! It looks like Naheed Nenshi (who I like a lot!! - met him in YYC!!) will detach the provincial NDP from the federal party. Very interesting! Thanks so much!! 🙂
Thanks for this amazing look into the future. We just need a provincial partner that is willing to come to the table!
I’m surprised you didn’t mention any sort of heavy rail network. The Edmonton metro region has many significant exurban communities such as Spruce Grove, St. Albert, Fort Saskatchewan, Sherwood Park, and Leduc. These should have fast and reliable regional rail connections into the centre of Edmonton where people can then transfer to other modes of transit. Love your video!
The issue is I can’t imagine those lines getting into central Edmonton for low prices, so without a fix I’m not sure how that’s going to work
@@RMTransitWith a new bridge (albeit a big bridge) and using existing low-use rail corridors, trains could originate in the western part of St. Albert, cross the Sturgeon River and pass City Hall, continue to the CN rail yard (which would have to be jumped, the expensive part of the project), cross one of the existing rail bridges over the Yellowhead (used by weekly passenger trains), and follow the wide abandoned rail corridor (keeping the bike trail and green space intact ) to 121st Street and 104th Avenue, the western edge of the downtown core and the site of the new Brewery District Station on the Valley Line. Use equipment similar to that on the original Ottawa O-Line, and you have a direct connection between the centre of the two cities with a journey time of 15 minutes.
@@RMTransit All the suburbs he mentioned could be served with not too much extra construction along the CN alignment that runs parallel to Yellowhead Trail. Leduc would only be one station past the airport, and downtown to YEG has already been prioritized. If the downtown line runs through to Yellowhead trail, it could tie in all the suburbs together. Even Gibbons, Devon, and Beaumont could be reached easily enough. I really wish they could just cap Yellowhead where the bridge will cross. That could make a nice regional station, if CN could be convinced to move.
@@christopherspencer8110 Alberta is working to create a regional rail service and they're going to have to figure a way to get regional service up to Grande Prairie at some point. I'm guessing they'll just try to straighten the existing alignment west of St Albert, so that would suggest they'll have regional service running between St Albert and the lake. From there following the existing alignment past the cement plant to the alignment that runs along Yellowhead trail. I'm expecting a tunnel through downtown will run along 97st or so for regional service.
Their original plan for the exurbs was BRT lines. As far as I know, commuter rail was never considered.
Commuter rail is a much better idea though imo.
Honestly you should run Sound Transit’s ST3 Project, and maybe ST4…? I like Vancouver’s rapid transit and transit in general, and it would be very nice to see high frequency light metro trains running in Seattle! Maybe you should make a video called the Seattle Edition of Crayoning With Reece!
Love these. I'd love to see you do something similar with "Fake London" seeing as we're one of the fastest growing cities in Canada. It'd be nice to have an experts overview to show some city councilors who seem to hum and haw whether transit is actually beneficial or not.
Great video Reece! Thanks for shining a light on our city! It would be amazing if we ended up with something anywhere close to this. 😅
Edmonton needs better TOD. I'd say the same for most C-Train stations. They don't necessarily all have to be a Metrotown-sized second downtowns with 50+ story condos and giant malls. A city should only invest in new urban centers if it really needs it, like when the metro area reaches three million residents. Meanwhile, Edmonton doesn't half half the geographic restrictions of a city like Vancouver or Montreal. With how sprawling Edmonton is, most stations can be dense, low to medium rise mixed use urban villages that taper off into town homes and eventually single family housing, all connected with decent bus service and bike paths. Currently, the bus service is there, but there isn't enough bike infrastructure, and far too many stations connect to parking lots and strip malls. Every station should be a reason to build some kind of vibrant urban area in the suburbs, which cut down on sprawl while making the suburbs nicer. I really like Edmonton City Council's push for 15 minute cities, but the best way to do that is to focus it around transit and TOD.
For the last going onto 3 months there are Peace Officers frequenting the LRT trains now. Love the app by ets it helps to check how long I will have to wait for the Bus or LRT. No stress,eave the driving to the drivers.
Edmonton gang
I would argue that we need to extend the valley line west all the way to Spruce Grove as well.
Ofc all these exterior connections would require ETS to accept that non residents need access...
Agreed we desperately need a rail connection to Ft. Saskatchewan. Put a Park N Ride on the Edmonton side of the river that Ft Saskatchewan Transot can run a service too...
A YEG Connection is long overdue as well.
Honestly I don't know how much transit planning can be separated from density planning. While the city's new zoning laws are loose, I actually don't think they're optimal.
I speak from experience on the south side of Edmonton, so I will ignore the other areas, but I think that South Common (outdoor mall) really ought to be re-zoned/re-designed for mixed use high density. It has a lot of space, the roads actually act as relatively good bones there, it has good nearby access to both century park and mill woods.
With Century Park having a higher population in its 15 minute walking radius than downtown Edmonton does, something similar could be done at Mill Woods station/mall and South Common, which is even bigger than the Century Park development.
The city is quite spread out but has a decent level of density all over. Having these 3 nodes basically on an east-west line really provides the opportunity for good trolley bus service connecting these areas, and if you projected out the Century Park and adjacent population to these other areas as well, you'd be talking about a whopping 200k people along this corridor.
Furthermore, combined with Alberta's potential for high speed rail, the right of way that goes right next to south common provides ready-made grade separation while also having space to have a station at south common. It's natural to at least have a station by whyte ave as well. The right of way and the space already exists! This would provide a third node of connectivity in the center as well, making south common a really valuable spot in terms of ability to grow the population.
Such a corridor can act as a more southerly whyte ave/downtown area as well. While I know the city really likes to support the downtown, the actual population center of Edmonton is somewhere south and to the west of the university of alberta. If it weren't for historical reasons the natural downtown would likely be on Whyte Avenue.
The University of Alberta should also be selling off its farm in the middle of the city
Edmonton merged city planning (neighbourhood planning) and transportation departments in 2012. Excellent move, other cities should follow.
Great video! Just want to add that they have thought of eventually connecting the valley line east to Sherwood Park.
I think it’s called the Festival or Energy line.
So close to 300k ❤❤
Not going underground at the hospital on 111 ave was idiotic planning & approval.
Ideas has never been Edmonton's problem. Enacting on plans is the part we suck at. Especially in a timely manner...
Every world class city has a rail connection to the airport to and from downtown.
As a Calgarian, I’m obliged to ask for a Crayoning with Reece video on Calgary next (my Calgarian pride refuses to let us get beaten by Edmonton), we’ve got the second highest ridership of any LRT system in the Americas (with three times the ridership of Edmonton), and I want to see what you’d go with for expansions (beyond current plans, I’d personally go for a line going roughly between Canada Olympic Park and Chestermere, a circle line roughly following Crowchild/Glenmore/The Trans-Can around the central suburbs, extending the proposed Airport line to cover the transit desert north of Nose Hill, and generally improving bus service)
I have faith you will get your wish. My dream is for Edmonton and Calgary to be connected by high speed rail.
One small note on the rural LRT in St. Louis: a huge part of that is because a lot of the growth in the region has favored the Missouri side, largely for tax reasons, and the main urbanized area on the Illinois side (East St. Louis) got urban renewaled hard so there hasn't been as much suburban growth on that side. Growth on the Illinois side is just so much slower, and tends to favor growth outward from Edwardsville/Collinsville over East St. Louis
Hi Reece, does this mean a similar video for Calgary is coming up next? 🤞
Pretty please could you do a video about Calgary and the CTrain?
I feel like it’s a really good dynamic because there are 2 LRT with a 3rd low-to-the-ground LRT line under construction with 2 phases yet to be built
BUT ALSO
There are BRT lines as well which might or might not be able to be routed better.
Additionally, there is no line to one of the largest Airports in the country.
Thanks a bunch and you’re vids are great
Happy with the valley line but the city is forcing people to use by cancelling the bus between Davies station and downtown, which was faster
As an Edmontonian with a lot of experience and opinions on our transit, I completely agree with almost every word of this video!
Great video! They should also connect the airport. $55 Uber to my airbnb! 😰
There was a Express bus route for the valley line before it was built. The 73A and 73B. Before those routes there was the 510X
Do Halifax. Traffic on the peninsula is becoming impossible for those that live elsewhere, and EVERYTHING (hospitals, universities, government services) is on the Peninsula. Meanwhile our population is exploding as people flee the rural areas.
Man I can't wait for the WEM line to be finished so I don't need to drive downtown for work.
If you want to improve a transit system, take a look at Halifax, Nova Scotia
Having spent a lot of time on the Metro line recently, they really need to improve frequency for trains and buses in the morning. Having a bus every 20 minutes and train every 12 minutes is not good enough for people that actually need to take the bus to work.
Cool concept. I will be in canada 🇨🇦 summer 2025 for the first time. Too said that I can not embrace these plans there 😢
Just starting the vid, the valley line was brutal. I have high hopes, but little confidence for the future.... now that I learned how to drive, it's crazy. 15min drive or 1h45 by bus. 20min drive or 2h by bus with 5 transfers.... it's crazy
What about a connection out to the Via Station? I know it's in the middle of nowhere, so better transit out there would be helpful, and maybe help Via sell more tickets for the Canadian.
the valley line construction has been more than disrupting to everyone living in the area. I know someone who's gonna have a train pass by his front window, with only a sidewalk separating his lawn and the rails
Connecting acheson/spruce grove/parkland county would be huge. Highway 16A and 16 are already insanely congested at rush hour and spruce being a bedroom community would increase demand dramatixally
If you Google the neighbourhood development plan for Marquis, there’s actually development plans that show a possibly planned expansion of the LRT past Gorman, to the Northeast toward Ft. Sask
Imagine going to collesium station ☠️☠️☠️
"what is a rural LRT?"
Tell me you've never been to Switzerland without telling me.
Okay but then again we don't call them LRT, we just call them Bahn. :D
Switzerland is, and has always been, the bankers (collaborators) of the worst regimes in history. Im glad that those practices have paid off enough to build fancy trains. You must be proud.
I have been, but St. Louis doesn't get enough attention. Karlsruhe would also be a good example/.
Do one for Winnipeg please!
@rmtransit I believe the St. Albert-Sherwood Park (technically Strathcona County, SP Is literally just a nickname) line(s) were planned under the "Energy Line, Festival Line" names. Both were killed off when the respective cities/hamlets didn't want to pay their portion.