Jade Carey Floor Inquiry Explained from World Championships 2022

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  • Опубліковано 12 вер 2024
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КОМЕНТАРІ • 111

  • @chelsear.5386
    @chelsear.5386 Рік тому +87

    I hope Jade uses the frustration of this experience as motivation to come back even stronger next time. What she has accomplished in the past few years is remarkable.

  • @Gazmeizster_Wongatron
    @Gazmeizster_Wongatron Рік тому +125

    That's the problem with submitting an inquiry sometimes. You're giving the judges an opportunity to review borderline skills under much closer scrutiny.
    I'm glad for Jade in this case that it didn't lose her a medal (and also gained a medal for Rebeca) but yeah submitting an appeal is always a risk.

    • @bekahwren
      @bekahwren Рік тому +3

      right! and she said the reason they did was they felt she had done the same routine as before so that's interesting. Can Chellsie Memmel weigh in on any inquiries? or is it just between the athlete and their coach?

  • @anovemberstar
    @anovemberstar Рік тому +42

    Thw judges wwre not "picking on her" - they only deducted this because they were REQUIRED to go through the VIDEO FOOTAGE of her whole floor routine, due to the Inquiry being lodged. They'd have done the same for any gymnast whose routine they had to go through and watch on video

    • @user-lt1vl4te1o
      @user-lt1vl4te1o Рік тому +3

      And her other dance moves also should have been downgraded but they didn't.

  • @duranca
    @duranca Рік тому +16

    WOW, this is a first. So far, everyone is disagreeing on here and offering their own point of view without hurling insults at one another or degrading the athletes at issue.

  • @AleaTeo
    @AleaTeo Рік тому +19

    Yeap, but in the other competitions judges judged with naked eye. When you submit an inquiry this things can happen.

  • @djames425
    @djames425 Рік тому +41

    Thank you for this, I've been waiting for an explanation. I watched her routine so many times on slo mo trying to figure out where they could have devalued a skill. It didn't occur to me that an L hop is supposed to be *above* horizontal. The inconsistency in judging is frustrating and it seems like the judges wanted to penalize her to discourage inquiries.

    • @cocoroni1031
      @cocoroni1031 Рік тому +5

      Judging in qualification should have been harsher, so that they don't just aim for "minimum" on those dance elements. ☠ Before that, Jade's L hop was devalued at Olympics either in QF / AA.

    • @TM-tmm
      @TM-tmm Рік тому +9

      Can you do a breakdown of Jessica because she seems overscored to me, just looking.

    • @agent606
      @agent606 Рік тому +10

      @@TM-tmm she was insanely overscored every time. I hope they do break down her scores. The domestic scoring in Britain for the worlds was worst than in the US for the American cup(s)

    • @viclit101
      @viclit101 Рік тому +2

      Bullshit. She wasn’t over scored at all, her E scores have been consistently low to mid 8’s for the past two years. Flipflytumble has done a video of her beam.
      NONE of the judges were British.

    • @agent606
      @agent606 Рік тому

      @@viclit101 lol sure. I know how judging works, thanks. There is always domestic advantage. and her FLOOR was egregiously over scored, especially compared to how the others were scored.
      Also, you can’t compare last quads scores to this quads scores. It’s a different COP. Comparing her 2001 scores to now is useless and she’s only competed outside of the UK once, at the Europeans. The other three scores were domestic scoring. It’s like comparing any other countries homes scoring, like the US championship to the US classic.

  • @chewiegym2765
    @chewiegym2765 Рік тому +59

    If they weren't going to credit this, then either the judges were too lenient the other times or stricter this time. 🤷‍♀️
    Perhaps the code needs to clarify further what "above horizontal" means in terms of °? But then again, Jade's leap doesn't look like the graphic so there's that.
    Thanks again for the detailed breakdowns, Emily.

    • @joaopedrosg1993
      @joaopedrosg1993 Рік тому +13

      The exact same thing happened with Andrade's double spin. The EF spin was not validated, but it was very similar to what she did in qualifying and in the AA, which was considered complete in both.

    • @chewiegym2765
      @chewiegym2765 Рік тому +15

      @@joaopedrosg1993 I don't think they should have credited at least three of Andrade's spins - her heel was down well before the completion of the skill, which is probably why she stumbled afterwards.
      If they're going to downgrade skills, the judges need to be consistent, regardless of the fact that the panels change with every competition.

    • @joaopedrosg1993
      @joaopedrosg1993 Рік тому +12

      @@chewiegym2765 That's exactly my point. I agree that most of her spins should not be credited, but this shows the inconsistency of the evaluation by the judges.

    • @--julian_
      @--julian_ Рік тому +8

      maybe they were trying to give Jess as much of a cushion as possible? jkjkjk

    • @chewiegym2765
      @chewiegym2765 Рік тому +4

      @@joaopedrosg1993 I agree with you! It shouldn't just be tighter scoring on floor because it's the floor final! 🤦‍♀️

  • @brodypenn
    @brodypenn Рік тому +82

    Props to Jade for being so cool, because she has the right to be pissed off. The judges were extremely strict to her all of the championships.

  • @debbieedwards9508
    @debbieedwards9508 Рік тому +47

    Jade Carey deserves so much better than the scores and attention she gets. Her performances are all but perfect, and I’ve seen a couple that indeed looked perfect. She is a class act and a genuinely very nice person. I hope she gets to attend every competition befitting her focus, skill, and ambitions. I also hope she is treated as she deserves in the future. Kudos for the way she demonstrates teamwork and caring.

  • @cocoroni1031
    @cocoroni1031 Рік тому +21

    Thank u for the helpful video! Double L turn has been judged strictly, and now L hop as well. Dance elements are really recipes for devaluation, depending on the strictness of judging.

  • @jorgebonilla2234
    @jorgebonilla2234 Рік тому +23

    I thought it was because she didn’t complete the 360 turn. That seems more plausible. Her leg position looks fine especially if you consider we’re watching from an overhead angle (so drawing lines like you did on the video is a bit misleading because the perspective is different)

  • @nicoles9077
    @nicoles9077 Рік тому +54

    It’s this type of thing is why I encouraged my kids to go into track and field. It’s you and the clock. Hard to argue Someone did or didn’t run 10. 05 secs for a 100 meter dash. Gymnastics and figure skating are too subjective with what constitutes artistry and judges are inconsistent in what they will or will not credit. Js

    • @juliapeltola4855
      @juliapeltola4855 Рік тому +11

      exactly the reason why i chose swimming when younger, however recently started gymnastics and learned the cop and becomed a judge just to know what actually is happening behind the scores and what I've noticed is that in reality its way better system than what i originally could imagine (although obviously not even close to as accurate as a clock)

  • @erinm9445
    @erinm9445 Рік тому +17

    All of the arguing about overscoring aside, the biggest problem with floor scoring this worlds was its inconsistency, which is well demonstrated in this video. And lowering by an additional tenth, when the same hope had been counted several times already in the same competition, feels an awful lot like retalation for the inquiry.
    The second-biggest problem is the new code itself, which I think is the source of all of the inconsistency. Artistic deductions should be at least vaguely comprehensible to an audience, and they shouldn't be of a large enough magnitude that Jessica's E score was two tenths higher than Jordan's, considering their differences in tumbling form and landings, and considering that Jordan's artistry is excellent from any normal standpoint.

    • @cocoroni1031
      @cocoroni1031 Рік тому +8

      The main issue of Jordan's floor is her leaps, particularly gogean and switch side half. There are more body shape and precision deductions on Jordan than Jessica.

    • @arlon9097
      @arlon9097 Рік тому +6

      The judges only had the opportunity to review this skills much closelly this time because of the inquiry. That is the problem with inquiries. Fun fact: In her interview, Rebeca said that you only should inquire if you are very sure about your routine; Rebeca had her inquiry approved on balance beam during all around at the olympics (:

    • @erinm9445
      @erinm9445 Рік тому +3

      @@cocoroni1031 That's fair and I do see that. But I think there's something wrong with the code when those things outweigh Jordan's advantage in tumbling form, which is impeccable, and landings, which are excellent.

    • @erinm9445
      @erinm9445 Рік тому +5

      @@arlon9097 This is a fair point. But the judges still downgraded the skill here by a tenth initially, where they did not in three previous performances this meet where it looks exactly the same. That's still a problem.

    • @arlon9097
      @arlon9097 Рік тому +2

      @@erinm9445 It can be a problem for humans (error prone) to have to evaluate in real time. Probably if the judges re-evaluated all routines using videos they would often find deductions they could not see naked eye, especially in terms of execution.

  • @DeepSeas..
    @DeepSeas.. Рік тому +11

    How generous of jade to give Rebecca and extra medal lmao Queen shit

  • @Urfavpiggies
    @Urfavpiggies Рік тому +29

    Time to start using that technology to define D score

    • @mariusa.5863
      @mariusa.5863 Рік тому +2

      Considering how arbitrary the scoring looks atm: yes, give it a try!

    • @hannibaljustincase9985
      @hannibaljustincase9985 Рік тому +4

      as great as it would be, it's rather impossible with how little money there is to gymnastics

    • @josephqualtier961
      @josephqualtier961 Рік тому +1

      @@hannibaljustincase9985 that’s not the issue at all, the issue is that it would make scoring take ages

    • @hannibaljustincase9985
      @hannibaljustincase9985 Рік тому

      @@josephqualtier961 depends on what are we talking about. I didn't think of humans analyzing anything but rather of a technology similar to hawk-eye

    • @FlipFlyTumble
      @FlipFlyTumble  Рік тому +1

      They’ve been trying since 2018/2019, but it’s not as easy as it seems. Would be cool if/when technology can get up to standard

  • @mindyschocolate
    @mindyschocolate Рік тому +10

    Ehhhh, it says above horizontal. She was just at. Also, I think she was bringing her leg down before she completed the full 360. As for why she got away with it previously, it depends on if they were different judges or not. Some are more strict to the code than others. Or they’re just blind.

    • @FlipFlyTumble
      @FlipFlyTumble  Рік тому +2

      they also haven't focused on requirements of this skill at judging courses as much as other leaps so a lot probably are unfamiliar with the expectations

  • @sbro9743
    @sbro9743 Рік тому +2

    Great explanation. Thank you.

  • @eliseperron1928
    @eliseperron1928 Рік тому +3

    Jade really shouldn’t be doing anything that allows judges a second look at her leaps or artistic elements. Not her strong suite at all.

  • @twlboy
    @twlboy Рік тому +5

    I don't see why this skill is so popular. If I were her choreographer, I would try to hide the potential deduction here with another skill - in this case maybe a hop wolf/cossack full jump. If it is the same value (I don't know) visually the bringing up of the support leg to the wolf position makes the extended leg seem horizontal at minimum and it also has the benefit of masking a minor bent leg.

    • @chewiegym2765
      @chewiegym2765 Рік тому +3

      It's a horrible skill in terms of aesthetic. There are so many dance skills in the code that gymnasts and coaches ignore nowadays, and I wish this was one of them!

    • @cheriolisterand9194
      @cheriolisterand9194 Рік тому

      This is the only C element that is easy to catch for these athletes(Jordan, Shi, Mykalya...). Wolf full jump is a B element, she doesn't have the skills to do rings(most of them being C or higher) on floor so that is huge limitation

  • @gym_analysis
    @gym_analysis Рік тому +41

    Meanwhile Gadirova's split 1.5 was not round (90 degrees short) but still got credited. This is some sketchy judging and they're not even trying to hide it.
    Edit: You can pause in slow motion to see that it's not round. And it's evident as it was NOT credited 2 out of 4 times (during Qualification and Team Final).

    • @FlipFlyTumble
      @FlipFlyTumble  Рік тому +29

      Her split 1.5 was round. It’s one of the best out there

    • @cocoroni1031
      @cocoroni1031 Рік тому +13

      Her split 1.5 was rounded for credited. If you refer to split 1.5 with 90-degree short, it's Jordan's attempt.

    • @chewiegym2765
      @chewiegym2765 Рік тому +17

      @@FlipFlyTumble I'm sure you've seen the comments all over the internet slating Jess for essentially breathing in this competition.
      Thanks for confirming AS A JUDGE that I, and others, are not seeing things.

    • @cassiusily
      @cassiusily Рік тому +14

      @@chewiegym2765 I know, can we all stop blaming Jess? If anyone has a problem it should be with the judges, not her.

    • @karyon1007
      @karyon1007 Рік тому +25

      @@cassiusily People are mostly "blaming" the judges... but a lot of them are trashing Jess while they're at it. She's barely 18 and they're practically cyber-bullying her.
      The way many "fans" talk about both Jessica and Jade on social media is completely unacceptable.

  • @glennelvendahl9492
    @glennelvendahl9492 Рік тому +1

    Ok but why did she submit an inquiry in the first place? What was it that they already weren’t crediting before they devalued the hop?

  • @cosmicorinne
    @cosmicorinne Рік тому +1

    A double tuck jump or double straight jump is a C and she wouldn’t have to worry about whether judges want to credit her leg being high enough that day. I don’t have a problem with them not crediting the L-hop 1/1 but it looks the exact same as all her others. All of them shouldn’t have been credited the n

    • @FlipFlyTumble
      @FlipFlyTumble  Рік тому +1

      those are harder than they seem and harder to get round! also she couldnt use it for her leap series. better off doing a simple switch leap tbh

    • @cosmicorinne
      @cosmicorinne Рік тому

      @@FlipFlyTumble they definitely aren’t easy hence it being a C skill but idk. I think both Jordan and Jade could utilize double tucks, straight jumps or cat leaps. I never made it past level 7 and could execute a double tuck jump. They could definitely do it if that sort of jump suits them. I was just trying to say the leg up and split jump variety of dance elements on floor have very strict requirements and it might be better to avoid those elements if they aren’t being credited anyways. (Much like ring switch & leaps being discredited.)

  • @mandoblair9117
    @mandoblair9117 Рік тому +3

    I 'm all for Jade and even more since watching college gymnastics but all I can see is people saying she was robbed and Jessica gifted the title but each to their own. However i feel for Jordan she was in 2nd place with a great routine and a lower difficulty than the others, if she had won Jade was still robbed. If Jade's difficulty was not downgraded she still would be not of beaten Jordan.
    I hope Jade makes it to the 2024 as she is constantly improving and more graceful than she was in the last cycle hopefully her difficulty will be back up to level of 2021 6.3
    Well done to all the medalist each have own uniqueness that they bring to the floor

  • @sinhueherrera8984
    @sinhueherrera8984 Рік тому +1

    Something I don’t understand is, for pirouettes they count when you drop
    Your heel, however with jumps, why they don’t count when your feet actually leaves the ground? If you look at this video slowly, she literally only does half turn in the air, the other half is pretty much done on the floor,do judges also devalue this? I doubt it

    • @joyfuljaj
      @joyfuljaj Рік тому +1

      I also wonder where they start counting the turn because from watching this I had assumed the devaluing was because it was nowhere close to 360.

    • @FlipFlyTumble
      @FlipFlyTumble  Рік тому +1

      the start of the leap is the direction of run approach, not where you are facing when your feet leave the ground. it’s not necessarily something i agree with but that’s the rule

  • @SociallyDistantnow
    @SociallyDistantnow Рік тому +24

    That’s objectively garbage. I truly hate that for Jade.
    Always appreciate your videos, Emily. Thank you.

    • @hannibaljustincase9985
      @hannibaljustincase9985 Рік тому +6

      Jade basically gifted Rebeca bronze and after all even if they'd credit her with 6.1 it wouldn't be enough for gold so maybe she isn't too pressed about it

    • @SociallyDistantnow
      @SociallyDistantnow Рік тому +7

      @@hannibaljustincase9985 weirdly, gifting people with medals they didn’t earn isn’t the goal of competition or inquiry. like any normal person, I’m certain that she cares that her routine was unfairly devalued.

    • @hannibaljustincase9985
      @hannibaljustincase9985 Рік тому +4

      @@SociallyDistantnow of course. my point was that at the end there was no negative outcome for Jade- she was in the same place medal wise as before inquiry. and I'm sure she got plenty of Brazilian fans that day.

    • @arlon9097
      @arlon9097 Рік тому +1

      @@hannibaljustincase9985 ​she returned the favor after winning gold on vault! hahaha

    • @SociallyDistantnow
      @SociallyDistantnow Рік тому +3

      @@hannibaljustincase9985 as an Andrade fan myself, I don’t hate the outcome for that reason 😊 it definitely could’ve ended worse. I just wish we had a better way of scoring competitions. Human error + biases + opaque scoring makes following this sport confusing and frustrating at times.

  • @matthewplampton955
    @matthewplampton955 Рік тому +8

    The americans need to drop that skill. It's hurting their overall artistry score, rightly or wrongly, it comes across as a bit of a cop out dance move and takes away from the performance as it feels out of place.

    • @chewiegym2765
      @chewiegym2765 Рік тому +4

      You'd have thought USAG would have taken note about leaps and deductions after the Kara Eaker beam debacle! Evidently they haven't, and they can no longer rely on just having amazing tumbling!

    • @FlipFlyTumble
      @FlipFlyTumble  Рік тому +1

      this is not considered artistry, but it would hurt their E score for sure

    • @matthewplampton955
      @matthewplampton955 Рік тому +1

      @@FlipFlyTumble judges are subjective. They definitely taken routine construction into account when considering overall impression and how that impacts their judging. These hops just seem so out of place. Same with wolf turns, they never get built into the routine.

  • @grainnej985
    @grainnej985 Рік тому

    Just to be clear: (Ignoring the leg for a second) they downgraded the turn from a 360 to a 180, then downgraded it again to a 360? 🤨

    • @FlipFlyTumble
      @FlipFlyTumble  Рік тому +2

      Yes, because the original judges felt her leg was up for only 180º. The inquiry judges (different panel watching from video) felt the leg wasn't up at all so it was credited as a normal 360 hop

    • @grainnej985
      @grainnej985 Рік тому

      @@FlipFlyTumble Ah. So the first downgrade was because of the leg, not the rotation on the hop.

    • @FlipFlyTumble
      @FlipFlyTumble  Рік тому +1

      @@grainnej985 yup!

  • @xtremefelix
    @xtremefelix Рік тому +6

    Komova was underscored in 2012 ... SUE ME !! HAHAHAHHAAHHA...
    I said in many other platforms and I say it again. Judging was weird, I don't care about the outcome of the medals, but the distance between 1st placer and 2nd-3rd was faarrr too great. It should've been a nail bitter going either way to 1st placer and 2nd placer at that particular final.

  • @pakopaez
    @pakopaez Рік тому

    Sin Martha Karoly y sus tranzas, por fin se está ejerciendo un justo jueceo???

  • @colesmith7509
    @colesmith7509 Рік тому +5

    So ridiculous. Cannot believe the judges credited that as a fucking A skill

    • @FlipFlyTumble
      @FlipFlyTumble  Рік тому +5

      tbh she’s lucky it even counted as an A. it barely looks like she made the 360 to me and she could’ve lost her leap requirement

  • @marciomarcallobo4662
    @marciomarcallobo4662 Рік тому +6

    TODAS as ginastas performam esse giro com a perna a 90º, incluindo a Jordan Chiles, Makayla Skinner, etc. e sempre é creditado.. não entendi o q aconteceu.

    • @sarah-vharnden1891
      @sarah-vharnden1891 Рік тому +9

      Exactly!!! They were being unfairly harsh toward her while wayyyy overscoring Gadirova 😒

    • @Stephan6510
      @Stephan6510 Рік тому +3

      Mas todas elas pelo menos completam, a Carey nem isso

    • @FlipFlyTumble
      @FlipFlyTumble  Рік тому

      Jordan’s is better, her leg is much higher

  • @PhenixJoe
    @PhenixJoe Рік тому +11

    Wow that is absurd! That is retaliation for submitting an inquiry, if I ever saw it. My faith in the integrity of WAG judging is diminished after this world championships. It was all around a dumpster fire.

    • @benbailey159bb
      @benbailey159bb Рік тому +1

      It isn't retaliation. Normally it's judged in real time, for an inquiry they use video slow-mo making stuff noticable that wasn't in realtime

  • @kameliehagen
    @kameliehagen Рік тому

    Il y a une totale absence de chorégraphie et elle n'est pas pénalisée ou si peu elle ne mérite pas un podium de wag mais de tumbleuse, ce n'est pas la même discipline FIG.
    Pareil en poutre, elle est surnotée, il n'y a ni sauts ni chorégraphie
    Elle devrait faire du tumbling ou du trampo

  • @alissonsilva-mr1kg
    @alissonsilva-mr1kg Рік тому

    😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

  • @user-lt1vl4te1o
    @user-lt1vl4te1o Рік тому

    So the judges cheated for her. That isn't new. She also cheated her other to dance moves too (pay close attention to where she started vs finished) I knew the judges cheated for her and this is just more proof.

  • @CourtneyK87
    @CourtneyK87 Рік тому +1

    That's so picky omg

  • @shanesilva52
    @shanesilva52 Рік тому +2

    This was complete BS!.. all the Americans were extremely strictly evaluated by the judges in Liverpool on men's and women's side. I didny agree with alot of the scoring and or execution scores!😡😡😡

  • @saucesebastien9453
    @saucesebastien9453 Рік тому +1

    Like Jordan she is been robbed.