3:52 what do you mean "weird"? we are talking military tactics here, how can this be weird? Let me help you out here by elaborating further on your very right point. You indeed have to touch spearmen in certain ways. You cannot approach them gently from the front but you have to maneuver yourself firmly behind their backs, point your sticks at their rear and push it in very hard. Remember to pull out quickly though before they can turn around and point their sticks in your way. You dont want to give them time to stick it back in you. There nothing "weird" about it...just good ol military wisdom.
God I hated that should have had them coming in from the sides and running back and forth sure in the end it wouldn't change the outcome but it would make them seem alot more badass of they had been in the background being slowly overwhelmed furring the fight
Sorry to be so off topic but does someone know a tool to log back into an Instagram account? I somehow lost my login password. I would love any tricks you can offer me!
Some correction on Savage Ork Boar Big Uns: They *also* do have the bonus vs. Large. It is not listed on the Unit card., but mouse over their weapon strenght to see it in the Tooltip. Playing a campaign as the Red Hand, this was a question that came up. So I verified it regulary. Indeed Normal and Savage Ork Boar Big Uns have the same weapon strenght including bonuses.
Aparently they only add the bonus to the unit card when it exceeds a certain threshold. Most archers have some AP dmg but they are not called AP because most of their damage is still affected by armor.
"I'm not saying cavalry can not touch spearmen, just that they have to touch them in certain ways. .....don't make that weird." And so, when Cavalry-Dandy plowed Spear-Prince from behind..... -except from an unnamed Space Dandy/Total War crossover Edit: WITH HIS MIGHTY LANCE!
This taught me a couple super important things in a very short time. I just started playing and I didn't realise "anti large" encompassed cavalry as well. I also didn't realise there was a differentiation between shock and standard cav. Thanks!
A quick note: charge bonus and anti-large bonus don't amplify only damage but also melee attack: a shock cav will almost always reach the hit% cap versus most target on the charge and spearmen unit gets to add at least 50% to it's hit%. They melt cav so hard because they get to hit A LOT more often while dealing a A LOT extra damage on each hit: a nice double buff that multyplies itself. As Zerkovich says do not throw your cav into spears willy nilly: an unit of mounted yeoman rear charging spears while they are engaged with peasants can do better than a group of knights of the realm charging them head on. Provided the peasant anchoring this strat don't get routed instantly.
Thank you for the videos. Im a fairly new player and I was getting very frustrated with the game until I started watching your content. Thanks to the many hours I spent learning from you, these videos shed a new light on my experience!
@@Zerkovich Sorry to repeat, got to ask you this Zerkovich. In the theme of something else to learn: Do you know if bonus vs large is applied solely to regular damage, or does any of that go onto armor piercing. For example if there was 66 regular, 33 armor piercing, and 10 bonus vs large, does that go to 66+10=76 regular, 33 armor piercing, or maintain the ratio, so 66+6 = 72 regular/ 33+3 = 36 armor piercing. I guess I am trying to say, does that extra damage vs large respect the armor piercing/ratio or just add to regular? Thanks mate if you take time to reply.
wow what an excellent series of videos,Subbed! amazing info here .very detailed for someone who tends to suck at this great game..but I still love it.and you don't drop Fbombs either.thank you for the little things like that ..:)
youre forgetting that the anti large bonus is also a bonus to the melee attack and thus the chande to hit the unit. it's why even skavenslaves can do decent damage in the right situation. decent damage for skavenslaves that is.
dude you rock seriously keep up the work. I was getting my arse hammered online until I saw your videos. my understanding of this great game of war chess is definitely thanks to you! p.s. if you can, could you do a video on leadership? I can't stop my empire running for the hills!
I found missile cav very useful against arty. Provided you can avoid the guarding units which hopefully aren´t missilers. Man, try reloading a bow while riding a horse, if you manage to do that in full gallop without lose control of your mount, slipping out of the saddle or smash into a random obstacle we´ll see further. Riding a horse is not THAT easy, there is a whole lot of forces at work. Such cavalry in real life tended to charge the enemy of a single hit and run, THEN reload and charge in again. Classic tactic of the huns and other famous riders.
I cringe everytime someone use Bretonnian knights without using lance formation.(yes yes i know this was before Bretonnia was playable) also, charge bonus decays over 30~60 seconds, so there's no need to pull out right away.
@@michaelmiller8600 that's not true, the tip of the formation is thin but the butt of the formation is wide. Plus what's the point of hitting more models if you can't do damage?
@@崔莱 the base is wide but it’s still a good bit less wide than it can be in normal formation. And in my experience with lance formation models in the back just get stacked up on the ones in front of them and don’t necessarily make the charge, especially if they’re hitting something with some mass. And the reason it matters is because your units only have charge bonus for ~15seconds as soon as it makes contact, so you want as many models fighting in that short amount of time as possible, especially since the bonus decays during that time too.
@@michaelmiller8600 but with lance formation you get so much MORE charge bonus out of that 15~30 seconds. Plus if you're fighting a large single-entity then it doesn't really matter how wide your formation is it matters that you do the most damage in the shortest time and then get the hell out before your models die.
Skirmisher cavalry, I saw when you were fighting massive boulders being lobbed by enemy artillery at your position. That is the real problem it is microing the cavalry, when there are more important things to micro, like shutting down those artillery. I just dont have the dexterity or skill to be able to micro more than 1 front. Any tips on improving that, advice? Seems if I have a choice I usually make a path around/away from enemy with the cavalry, forget about them and try and manage/micro the important things, but often I forget about the cavalry and they start getting slaughtered before I notice. I have always found it tough to split my focus to micro more than 1 thing in any rts games not just this. Something in my mental tool box is missing, some way of thinking about things. How do people sort that in their mind, to micro/manage several fronts?
4:10 Good video, but you missed another really important point here that a lot of people miss. Spears counter cav because of their cost most importantly. Spearmen are more often barely trained peasants, and they're killing elite nobles with the best equipment money can buy. In game terms this translates into gold, obvs. What this means is that spears can lose a combat, BADLY, and still 'win' in the cost and time departments.
In regards to charges, something I haven't been able to pin down is whether or not charges cancel each other out. Like if two infantry mobs are both ordered to charge each other, do they both get and take a charge bonus or does only one get the bonus and the other just takes more damage? What about cavalry? Or monsters and monstrous infantry? Does the unit mass factor in? This may be stupid and obvious, and I might just be stupid, but i haven't managed to tell on my own experiments.
A units mass can play a factor in how easy they can get out of combat when u pull them away but also how many units will be thrown aside when charging. Cavalry charging into infantry tend to throw them around all over the place (unless they stand stil and have charge def ofc). The mass of a unit have some effect on how u want to move the units while in combat. A giant is big with alot of mass he can generaly move right over enemy infantry. It may taka a short while but he can do it. A horse on the other hand can not, yes the mass is greather then infantry but not nearly enough to just push units aside from a stand still. It is always recomended to pull your units through your own units nearby if u wanna get them out of combat as it will not slow them down mutch. In terms of 2 units charging if both units got there full charge off they will both benefit frpm there own respective charge bonus. As long as they reach there top speed they get there bonus. If u have 2 units of cav and enemy have 1 it can be a good ide to have your weaker unit take the charge and when there cav is standing still u charge with your strong cav to prevent the enemys charge bonus on your more powerfull units.
16:39 - this is so ANNOYING. In any realistic scenario, that cavalry unit would automatically target the cavalry blocking their destination. I sorely wish there was an attack-move command or a toggle that permits the AI to attack nearest unit in sight.
AND, I would add ai to control the Reinforcement from oneself faction in the campain as for me is very difficult to controll more than one group of 20 units in a same battle.
Do calvalry need to worry about the goblin spears? They aren't specifically anti-large. Also, are the boar boy big'uns really "great" against other cavalry? Because I've sent them to do deal with cav units before, and they seem to loose a lot of units.
Nobody needs to worry about Goblin Spears. They're more like lovable bumbling children than a danger. I think so. All Greenskins Cavalry will take a fair amount of damage due to a lack of decent armour. For their price though, they can hang with some more expensive Cavs pretty well.
Anyone know if bonus vs large is applied solely to regular damage, or does any of that go onto armor piercing. For example if there was 66 regular, 33 armor piercing, and 10 bonus vs large, does that go to 66+10=76 regular, 33 armor piercing, or maintain the ratio, so 66+6 = 72 regular/ 33+3 = 36 armor piercing. I guess I am trying to say, does that extra damage vs large respect the armor piercing/ratio or just add to regular? Sorry, I am a bit of a stickler for shit like this, now I am going into the stats/mechanics in detail. Thanks to anyone who knows. Also please let me know HOW you know if you answer, did you do an experiment/reference to video/etc. Thanks anyone.
i think with the addition of the knight of the blasing sun the empire know gains the badge of best cavalry from the vamps and in a strait up 1 vs 1 test done by hair the demigriffs were actually able to beat blood knights more often than they would lose which is kinda off balance i think
back in attila u just don't bring shock calv because they'll get wrecked by melee calv no matter what. Especially those in diamond formation. the wedge formation for shock calvary do not help that much either.
I think when the Bretonnia full faction get released I expect to see Errant Knights and Questing Knights. The Errant Knights being the entry level heavy cavalry for the Bretonnians good for having low cost but effective shock cavalry, Questing Knights being armed with great weapons I think should have armour piecing and anti-large
Zerkovich Unfortunately the only canon Bretonnian infantry that has yet to be implement is the Battle Pilgrims. Games Workshop really screwed up with the Bretonnian army book
I know I'm 4 years late on this video but am I the only one who never noticed a difference from "charge defence against large foes"? Regardless of how long I have an unit with this trait stay in position when they are charged by shock cavalry it still takes a ridiculous amount of damage on the initial charge, which makes me wonder if it's working but just doesn't really do anything or if my units just aren't bracing for some reason.
a few questions that i was always curious about: what happens when spears counter charge, do they lose their defensive bonus? how effective are cavalry charges from the front when the enemy is engaged to a line of friendly forces(dense, or thin formation)-can this be viable? can cavalry formations affect the effectiveness or depth of charge-is best to keep my cavalry thinly spread or dense? can enemy unit formations affect the effectiveness or depth of my charge? is having melee cavalry engaged more effective than having them cycle charge?
Lets give it a try. 1. Yes they lose the bonus. 2. Yes this is viable and sometimes very effective. 3. Yes, but i'm not sure because it often gives different results. Generaly thin lines does more damage (Not if they are to thin) but you also lose more when you pull out. 4. Yes but funnily enough sometimes thin lines works better becuse the cav unit gets stuck on both sides of the unit and can't pull out effectively. 5. Depends alot of times on the situation but if they are fighting other cav they should not try and pull out. If fighting infantry they should cycle unless good chance of breaking moral of the enemy unit. Also depends on how stuck into the fight the unit is. Sometimes you just can't pull them out without taking more dmg than it is worth. Not an expert and just going from what I have seen.
You can use the unit card to determine their best use. Charge bonus over 45 usually means shock cavalry. If it’s under that but the melee defense is at least decent, it’s probably melee.
This Guide should be remade to cover all factions currently in the game, as their are tons of more cav now with special abilitys. This didn't even include noscia or wood elves. Also Air units should be in Cav section.
There really isent anything more to add to it apart from showing the new units stats and that any1 can look up. Everything boils down to what kind of cav is it? Melee cav leave them in combat, Shock cav do multiple charges, missile cav herass/run down missile infantry. And for good lord dont charge spearmen from the front.
once again another great vid >< keep it up mate!!.... *cough* dwarves *cough* my bearded friend xP nah doesn't really matter anything you put up is amazing so I'll watch it all ahahah
I certainly find the Dawi to be one of the strongest if not the strongest faction due to their high leadership, exceptional ranged and unwavering melee. What they lack in mobility they more than make up for in durability and strength. They do require they own playstyle as you tend to set up battles to be on the defensive instead of the attack because in a turtle you are nearly invincible even when outnumbered 5 to 1 but when attacking their weaknesses really show.
Dwarves don't need no stinking cavalry. You only need them if you can't win in a stand up fight and dwarves never lose ever. It is a well known fact that no dwarf has ever died in combat ever. BTW Havocgr I know your comment was 2 years ago but your name has been added to the book of grudges and dwarves will be visiting you soon.
In Medieval II Total War, I once was playing England, and forgot about one of my family members. So, naturally, another country took advantage of that. It was early game, and against AI. However, I somehow managed to take my 50 some odd cavalry against 1200 ish men.. Mostly spearmen. I know this is not a story to believe, but I promise it happened. I slaughtered all men while losing all men, but 3... including the Prince. My prince cavalry went from no XP to full XP that day, or something close to that.
Yeah Medieval II cavalry was pretty broken with horses being armoured and all in the era plus they were just balanced really poorly lol that was an awesome game though I really hope they redo it after Warhammer because it was one of my most favourites.
what do you think about my all around standard army for the empire (radious mod) ? 2 units of dismounted knights of the blazing sun ( armored, sword and shield) 3 units of dismounted knights of the blazing sun ( armored, halberds) 5 units of armored long rage musketeers. 2 units of knights of the blazing sun 2 units of griffons (halberds or swords) 4 units of rocket launchers 1 hero / wizard or sigmar priest 1 lord
I'm surprised that you haven't been talking about how terrain could also affect both speed and charges for cavalry units ; between flanking a line of unit from downhill to uphill or reversed, the result differs as much as light and day. I'm talking from experience : i once faced two chaos armies with two undead armies, both respectively lead by Archeon and Mannfred and another random lord, on a map in the Kislev provinces that had one hell of an Hill (at an almost 36°~38° angle) with chaos starting and reinforcing from downhill while mine from uphill. I won't exactly go in detail as how the battle went exactly (it was pretty chaotic - no pun intended) but at one point i saw two chaos knight units (footsoldiers), being part of the second army, on the verge of reinforcing the fight on my right flank that had been going well for me from the start and, at that point, only had a single unit of Black Knight Shock cavalry that hasn't been engaged in combat yet at my disposal to stop them. I ordered the charge from uphill to downhill... one question : can you picture someone doing hang-gliding without gliders ? Now do it with three dozen guys fulle clad in armor and you'll get the idea. (Spoilers : they don't land safely.)
I hate hate hate this. I'll send in some shock cav on a flank for a charge, wait about 30 seconds, then click in the opposite direction. I look back a couple minutes later to go in for another charge and half my cav is dead because they got stuck on the units i was trying to charge.
@@HiroProtaganist TL;DR Get out and chargin' every 5-10 sec for max dmg! Just a FYI, the charge bonus only lasts for 15 seconds and decreases linearly over time to 0 after the 15 seconds are up. So if the forums, wikis and my understanding are right, after 10 second you have lost 2/3 of your charge bonus. So a shock cavalry have lost a major part of their attack power by then. Because charge bonus boosts melee attack(chance to hit) and weapon strength(damage to health, duh!) by the same number as the charge bonus. For an example, let's take Black Knights with Lances & Barding (will just call them Black Knights from now on) at 16:40 ua-cam.com/video/4q_Q_4Suvpc/v-deo.html 24 Melee Attack(MA), 42 Weapon Strength(WS) and 58 Charge Bonus(CB) the other stats are not relevant. At the moment of impact of a successful charge the Black Knights have: 24 + 58 = 82MA and 42 + 58 = 100WS After 5 seconds the charge bonus have decreased by a 1/3 so there is 2/3 left: 2/3 * 58 ≈ 39 24 + 39 = 63MA and 42 + 39 = 81WP After 10 seconds the charge bonus have decreased by a 2/3 so there is 1/3 left: 1/3 * 58 ≈ 19 24 + 19 = 42MA and 42 + 19 = 61WP But yea getting stuck with 1 horse and having all the other 59 horses in the unit returning to get killed are really annoying.
@@patrik453 Sorry I missed this, was probably drunk. Thanks for doing all that math, I'll remember to only keep them in combat for half the time I usually do. Gotta work on that micro I guess.
I always hated how theres barely any physics for mounted units in total war still to this date, charging into infantry is fantastic people go flying and ragdoll all over depending on how hard the cavalry charge, calvary on cavalry on the otherhand they just awkwardly slow down and stop and take damage, i wish units would fly off horses and charges would be more devastating against other mounted units
Watched 20+ videos. Good job. You enunciation and style are far better in this video, roughly 3.30. No little slightly akward jokes. No hanging on words. The rythym is confident and steady. Remember talk about u know and it will flow. Veer off that track and the lack of confidence shows. Signing off on your channel should be 'off the cuff'. Again a lack of confidence will show. Skill is directly proportional to practice, so keep up the good work.
Its not that your calvelry cant ever touch spear men, its just that you have to touch them in different ways. Don't make that weird. As a future slaanesh player i'm going make it super weird.
Damn love your video they explain everything so well and so organized. Should link your video guide to steam guide you will get more exposure that way.
1:14 For example, If you run pistolers into orc archer boys without realizing that orc archer boys aren't terrible in melee and forget about them your gonna have a bad time.(F my life).
Bonus vs large should be Added with melee attack. What's the differente of damage between a blade with a stick on it or just a blade. However, the Spear would make it easier to stab a large guy.
Mr. OK Eh... I see you really don't know about weapons, or simply what's effective against cavalry. Speaking not in game terms but in realistic terms, is quite unlikely you'll be dealing with un-barded horses, and even if you are, you'll be trying to go at them while the rider is attacking you. I say this since that's almost all you'll be doing with your shorter range sword that won't allow you an easy time cutting that armored dude up there. Also won't help you in general to cut through the skin of a big horse, even though you could maybe shake it enough due to the pain. Now Spears? Spears have REACH. But that's not even the main thing, Spears weaponize the speed of cavalry in your favor. Cavalry is strong because these dudes are coming to bash you in with weapons going way faster than any normal human could move them due to their running horses, plus the entire weight of the horse outdoing the weight of even an armored knight. NOW, imagine what happens when all of that weight decides to hammer itself against a pointy long Spears aimed directly at them? Your own speed and weight suddenly helps the Spears penetrate your armor and the body of your horse, and a dead Knight is an useless knight. Not to mention Spears are obviously much easier to hold against the battering ram of a cavalry assault because you aren't grabbing to a small pommel, you are adjusting your position and weight with a long and easy to grasp shaft.
Try standing beneath a guy on a horse some day and whack him with a stick. If he put on his boots that morning you'll never get to him. Spears are a critical advantage against anything large, and were the dominant weapon of all human warfare until the advent of effective firearms.
Generally a horse willl not run into a wall of pointy things because it is not stupid. Of course, to make the game "look cool", such things need to be overlooked and the easiest way to represent polearms' effectiveness against cavalry is to give them a bonus.
If anyone don't mind me asking is there a reason why spears do better against cav? Like in real life do spears tend to do better against cav or did it start out as a game thing?
Well think about it. If a man on a horse was charging at you, would you rather have a sword or a spear? Haha. The range advantage of a spear is the key. Spears were the weapon of choice for a long time in ancient Greece though. Until they realised swords are a bit more versatile. So I guess it and isn't a game thing.
According to lore the Blood Knights pretty much are the strongest cavalry in the realm, essentially they are Grail Knights and Reiksguard who now have the power and strength of vampires on top of vampiric undead horses with magical weapons. "It is said that even the fabled Grail Knights of Bretonnia cannot match the Blood Knights lance for lance upon the field." warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Blood_Knights
3:52
what do you mean "weird"? we are talking military tactics here, how can this be weird?
Let me help you out here by elaborating further on your very right point.
You indeed have to touch spearmen in certain ways. You cannot approach them gently from the front but you have to maneuver yourself firmly behind their backs, point your sticks at their rear and push it in very hard. Remember to pull out quickly though before they can turn around and point their sticks in your way. You dont want to give them time to stick it back in you.
There nothing "weird" about it...just good ol military wisdom.
"no homo tho" - Sun Tzu
The writter of Game of Thrones should really check this video.
nah mate. pointless cavalry charge wouldn't be so dramatic and sad if you add military tactics to it
@Lord Admiral Spire There would be no balance that way.
God I hated that should have had them coming in from the sides and running back and forth sure in the end it wouldn't change the outcome but it would make them seem alot more badass of they had been in the background being slowly overwhelmed furring the fight
Yes... a witcher with a particular experince with peasants and their pitchforks would say the same thing
Sorry to be so off topic but does someone know a tool to log back into an Instagram account?
I somehow lost my login password. I would love any tricks you can offer me!
Some correction on Savage Ork Boar Big Uns: They *also* do have the bonus vs. Large. It is not listed on the Unit card., but mouse over their weapon strenght to see it in the Tooltip.
Playing a campaign as the Red Hand, this was a question that came up. So I verified it regulary. Indeed Normal and Savage Ork Boar Big Uns have the same weapon strenght including bonuses.
I think when this vid was published the SOBBB didn’t have anti-large; it was added later by CA.
Aparently they only add the bonus to the unit card when it exceeds a certain threshold. Most archers have some AP dmg but they are not called AP because most of their damage is still affected by armor.
"I'm not saying cavalry can not touch spearmen, just that they have to touch them in certain ways. .....don't make that weird."
And so, when Cavalry-Dandy plowed Spear-Prince from behind.....
-except from an unnamed Space Dandy/Total War crossover
Edit: WITH HIS MIGHTY LANCE!
He combs the battlefield like his pompadour on the hunt for infantry...
Prince sigvald is intrigued by this occurrence lol
This taught me a couple super important things in a very short time. I just started playing and I didn't realise "anti large" encompassed cavalry as well. I also didn't realise there was a differentiation between shock and standard cav. Thanks!
A quick note: charge bonus and anti-large bonus don't amplify only damage but also melee attack: a shock cav will almost always reach the hit% cap versus most target on the charge and spearmen unit gets to add at least 50% to it's hit%.
They melt cav so hard because they get to hit A LOT more often while dealing a A LOT extra damage on each hit: a nice double buff that multyplies itself.
As Zerkovich says do not throw your cav into spears willy nilly: an unit of mounted yeoman rear charging spears while they are engaged with peasants can do better than a group of knights of the realm charging them head on. Provided the peasant anchoring this strat don't get routed instantly.
Great to see you back at it. I think the only other major unit types that haven't really been gone over are monstrous infantry and chariots now.
Thank you for the videos. Im a fairly new player and I was getting very frustrated with the game until I started watching your content. Thanks to the many hours I spent learning from you, these videos shed a new light on my experience!
Thank you for your videos! They're so helpful.
Excellent guide! Thanks! I enjoyed the in-depth stats & bonuses assessment and how to match up certain types of cav vs. certain opponent types.
Glad you appreciate my works. Thank you.
A side note, they are still called melee cavalry even not been labeled so, because there are couple quest actually tell you to recruit “melee cavalry”
These Total War Guide-Vieos are really great! I am an fan from all the total war games but I can still learn some things from this! :)
Good stuff =]
every one of your videos gets me one step further away from sucking ass at this game. Thank you
Haha. Jolly good! You are welcome.
Holy crap, every guide video I type out you have a video on it, I wish UA-camrs in other games were as thorough as you.
160+ hours in the game already, at least 1 campaign victory for all factions, still learned a few things today. Great video!
There's always things to learn! :D
@@Zerkovich Sorry to repeat, got to ask you this Zerkovich. In the theme of something else to learn: Do you know if bonus vs large is applied solely to regular damage, or does any of that go onto armor piercing. For example if there was 66 regular, 33 armor piercing, and 10 bonus vs large, does that go to 66+10=76 regular, 33 armor piercing, or maintain the ratio, so 66+6 = 72 regular/ 33+3 = 36 armor piercing. I guess I am trying to say, does that extra damage vs large respect the armor piercing/ratio or just add to regular? Thanks mate if you take time to reply.
wow what an excellent series of videos,Subbed! amazing info here .very detailed for someone who tends to suck at this great game..but I still love it.and you don't drop Fbombs either.thank you for the little things like that ..:)
Somehow missed replying to this. Thanks for the support homie! :D Better late than never eh!
nice in depth video and cool camera angles to show battles, good video bro
youre forgetting that the anti large bonus is also a bonus to the melee attack and thus the chande to hit the unit. it's why even skavenslaves can do decent damage in the right situation. decent damage for skavenslaves that is.
Dude these videos have been amazing. Been watching them as I need them. Keep up the good work 👍
You should totally collaborate with @Lionheartx10 on his Warhammer campaigns! He could use a few lessons on using cavalry from you. :p
My cavalry just get stuck everywhere and with chariots is even worse. This guide is been pretty usefull, thank you
dude you're so cool! nice videos, keep em coming
**fist bump**
Beastmen cav never get tired btw!
edit: Grail knights also do some magic damage
dude you rock
seriously keep up the work. I was getting my arse hammered online until I saw your videos. my understanding of this great game of war chess is definitely thanks to you! p.s. if you can, could you do a video on leadership? I can't stop my empire running for the hills!
Thank you dude. Glad to be of assistance! War chess is a good description haha. I'll keep it in mind yo!
That grail knight vs marauders charge was beautiful.
well this was helpful, trying to understand the gameplay of totalwar and you explaining very well, thanks Man - keep doing it !!
Another awesome, easy to follow and understand, comprehensive guide, sir!
Dude! My gameplay has leveld up thx to your videos:D Sub well won!
Awesome! Welcome to the family Warchief!
Well made guide. Once again your really deserve more attention!
Phenomenal guide, made my dreams of a lizardmen cold one army a reality.
I found missile cav very useful against arty.
Provided you can avoid the guarding units which hopefully aren´t missilers.
Man, try reloading a bow while riding a horse, if you manage to do that in full gallop without lose control of your mount, slipping out of the saddle or smash into a random obstacle we´ll see further. Riding a horse is not THAT easy, there is a whole lot of forces at work. Such cavalry in real life tended to charge the enemy of a single hit and run, THEN reload and charge in again. Classic tactic of the huns and other famous riders.
@@QuestioningYam Aren´t Mongols huns too?
That is their classic tactic: ride in, release the bow, turn away to reload and repeat.
CHEERS LOVE THE CAVALRY'S HERE'
Never thought that i shoud click to have charge bonus, thanks. 200+ hours in total war games.
finally found a video where i learn something thank you !!!
I didn't realize it didn't have to be a big monster to be considered Large. Thanks.
I cringe everytime someone use Bretonnian knights without using lance formation.(yes yes i know this was before Bretonnia was playable)
also, charge bonus decays over 30~60 seconds, so there's no need to pull out right away.
I actually think lance formation isn't as good because you contact a lot less of the unit at a time
@@michaelmiller8600 that's not true, the tip of the formation is thin but the butt of the formation is wide. Plus what's the point of hitting more models if you can't do damage?
@@崔莱 the base is wide but it’s still a good bit less wide than it can be in normal formation. And in my experience with lance formation models in the back just get stacked up on the ones in front of them and don’t necessarily make the charge, especially if they’re hitting something with some mass. And the reason it matters is because your units only have charge bonus for ~15seconds as soon as it makes contact, so you want as many models fighting in that short amount of time as possible, especially since the bonus decays during that time too.
@@michaelmiller8600 but with lance formation you get so much MORE charge bonus out of that 15~30 seconds. Plus if you're fighting a large single-entity then it doesn't really matter how wide your formation is it matters that you do the most damage in the shortest time and then get the hell out before your models die.
You should make an updated cavalry video with the new faction cavalry and all the extra brettonia cav
THANK YOU SO MUCH THIS WAS AN AMAZING VIDEO, YOUR AN AMAZING PERSON ZERKOVICH!
Thank you my friend **high five** Glad you enjoyed it!
Hello Zerkovich can u pls tell me how to open table with stats of unit right in the battle?
press i
Skirmisher cavalry, I saw when you were fighting massive boulders being lobbed by enemy artillery at your position. That is the real problem it is microing the cavalry, when there are more important things to micro, like shutting down those artillery. I just dont have the dexterity or skill to be able to micro more than 1 front. Any tips on improving that, advice? Seems if I have a choice I usually make a path around/away from enemy with the cavalry, forget about them and try and manage/micro the important things, but often I forget about the cavalry and they start getting slaughtered before I notice. I have always found it tough to split my focus to micro more than 1 thing in any rts games not just this. Something in my mental tool box is missing, some way of thinking about things. How do people sort that in their mind, to micro/manage several fronts?
I love your videos. Keep up the great work.
Awesome vid; terrorgheist is a huge bat though :P a common mistake I also used to make
Is the information in here still accurate for WH3? I'm starting my first Bretonnia run, and I need to brush up on my gallop-gallop-poke-poke.
How long do i keep shock calvery in? Do I just withdraw instantly or is there a way to tell when the shock phase is over?
4:10 Good video, but you missed another really important point here that a lot of people miss.
Spears counter cav because of their cost most importantly. Spearmen are more often barely trained peasants, and they're killing elite nobles with the best equipment money can buy. In game terms this translates into gold, obvs. What this means is that spears can lose a combat, BADLY, and still 'win' in the cost and time departments.
Certainly true enough. Although not always true in Warhammer as you have mid and elite tier Spear units.
Shock Cavalry, in other words send in for charge, get out, send elsewhere but avoid front of spearman. Gotcha, cheers man 👍
Bit late on this one
8:48 you think we could get an updated version of this video for TWW3?
In regards to charges, something I haven't been able to pin down is whether or not charges cancel each other out. Like if two infantry mobs are both ordered to charge each other, do they both get and take a charge bonus or does only one get the bonus and the other just takes more damage? What about cavalry? Or monsters and monstrous infantry? Does the unit mass factor in? This may be stupid and obvious, and I might just be stupid, but i haven't managed to tell on my own experiments.
A units mass can play a factor in how easy they can get out of combat when u pull them away but also how many units will be thrown aside when charging. Cavalry charging into infantry tend to throw them around all over the place (unless they stand stil and have charge def ofc). The mass of a unit have some effect on how u want to move the units while in combat. A giant is big with alot of mass he can generaly move right over enemy infantry. It may taka a short while but he can do it. A horse on the other hand can not, yes the mass is greather then infantry but not nearly enough to just push units aside from a stand still. It is always recomended to pull your units through your own units nearby if u wanna get them out of combat as it will not slow them down mutch. In terms of 2 units charging if both units got there full charge off they will both benefit frpm there own respective charge bonus. As long as they reach there top speed they get there bonus. If u have 2 units of cav and enemy have 1 it can be a good ide to have your weaker unit take the charge and when there cav is standing still u charge with your strong cav to prevent the enemys charge bonus on your more powerfull units.
16:39 - this is so ANNOYING. In any realistic scenario, that cavalry unit would automatically target the cavalry blocking their destination. I sorely wish there was an attack-move command or a toggle that permits the AI to attack nearest unit in sight.
Dreadwins there is it's unit AI attack I believe
The technology isn't there yet.. since ROME 1.
AND, I would add ai to control the Reinforcement from oneself faction in the campain as for me is very difficult to controll more than one group of 20 units in a same battle.
@@davidacosta3977 medieval 2 with stainless steel have that feature... Using AI General Mod on Workshop will help
I think if you Alt + RMB you get an attack move, no? I do wish it was simpler tbh
Do calvalry need to worry about the goblin spears? They aren't specifically anti-large.
Also, are the boar boy big'uns really "great" against other cavalry? Because I've sent them to do deal with cav units before, and they seem to loose a lot of units.
Nobody needs to worry about Goblin Spears. They're more like lovable bumbling children than a danger.
I think so. All Greenskins Cavalry will take a fair amount of damage due to a lack of decent armour. For their price though, they can hang with some more expensive Cavs pretty well.
great video. Thanks! Love your channel dude
Thank you Sire.
Very helpful guides, thanks
Anyone know if bonus vs large is applied solely to regular damage, or does any of that go onto armor piercing. For example if there was 66 regular, 33 armor piercing, and 10 bonus vs large, does that go to 66+10=76 regular, 33 armor piercing, or maintain the ratio, so 66+6 = 72 regular/ 33+3 = 36 armor piercing. I guess I am trying to say, does that extra damage vs large respect the armor piercing/ratio or just add to regular? Sorry, I am a bit of a stickler for shit like this, now I am going into the stats/mechanics in detail. Thanks to anyone who knows. Also please let me know HOW you know if you answer, did you do an experiment/reference to video/etc. Thanks anyone.
i think with the addition of the knight of the blasing sun the empire know gains the badge of best cavalry from the vamps
and in a strait up 1 vs 1 test done by hair the demigriffs were actually able to beat blood knights more often than they would lose which is kinda off balance i think
back in attila u just don't bring shock calv because they'll get wrecked by melee calv no matter what. Especially those in diamond formation. the wedge formation for shock calvary do not help that much either.
Can you make a video about how to play Bretonnia effectively? Especially with the new cavalry diamond formation they have
Army Guide is in the works my man!
Zerkovich awesome, looking forward to it
There really is no sight as heartening as a mass charge of Cavalry.
I think when the Bretonnia full faction get released I expect to see Errant Knights and Questing Knights. The Errant Knights being the entry level heavy cavalry for the Bretonnians good for having low cost but effective shock cavalry, Questing Knights being armed with great weapons I think should have armour piecing and anti-large
And some damn infantry!
Zerkovich Unfortunately the only canon Bretonnian infantry that has yet to be implement is the Battle Pilgrims. Games Workshop really screwed up with the Bretonnian army book
:( One semi decent Sword unit is all they need. Here's hoping!
I know I'm 4 years late on this video but am I the only one who never noticed a difference from "charge defence against large foes"? Regardless of how long I have an unit with this trait stay in position when they are charged by shock cavalry it still takes a ridiculous amount of damage on the initial charge, which makes me wonder if it's working but just doesn't really do anything or if my units just aren't bracing for some reason.
a few questions that i was always curious about:
what happens when spears counter charge, do they lose their defensive bonus? how effective are cavalry charges from the front when the enemy is engaged to a line of friendly forces(dense, or thin formation)-can this be viable? can cavalry formations affect the effectiveness or depth of charge-is best to keep my cavalry thinly spread or dense? can enemy unit formations affect the effectiveness or depth of my charge? is having melee cavalry engaged more effective than having them cycle charge?
Lets give it a try.
1. Yes they lose the bonus.
2. Yes this is viable and sometimes very effective.
3. Yes, but i'm not sure because it often gives different results. Generaly thin lines does more damage (Not if they are to thin) but you also lose more when you pull out.
4. Yes but funnily enough sometimes thin lines works better becuse the cav unit gets stuck on both sides of the unit and can't pull out effectively.
5. Depends alot of times on the situation but if they are fighting other cav they should not try and pull out. If fighting infantry they should cycle unless good chance of breaking moral of the enemy unit. Also depends on how stuck into the fight the unit is. Sometimes you just can't pull them out without taking more dmg than it is worth.
Not an expert and just going from what I have seen.
There are 3 types of cavalry:
Ranged cav
Melee cav
Shock cav
Then what the heck is bestial and flying cavalry?
They will probably fall into one of those catagories.
Yeah I know, but it would be better if they were described as flying melee/shock cavalry and bestial melee/shock cavalry.
You can use the unit card to determine their best use. Charge bonus over 45 usually means shock cavalry. If it’s under that but the melee defense is at least decent, it’s probably melee.
After charge leave them in combat for around 10 sec. Better then mindless cycle charging because charge bonus lasts that long.
I laughed out loud at that "don't make that weird" comment
that's exactly what i searched thanks
So much has changed since this video. We need an update!
If I’m being honest the only Calvary I’m good at are missile cav and monsters along side flying units
This Guide should be remade to cover all factions currently in the game, as their are tons of more cav now with special abilitys. This didn't even include noscia or wood elves. Also Air units should be in Cav section.
There really isent anything more to add to it apart from showing the new units stats and that any1 can look up. Everything boils down to what kind of cav is it? Melee cav leave them in combat, Shock cav do multiple charges, missile cav herass/run down missile infantry. And for good lord dont charge spearmen from the front.
So charge shock cav into the front of polearms and leave them there?
once again another great vid >< keep it up mate!!.... *cough* dwarves *cough* my bearded friend xP nah doesn't really matter anything you put up is amazing so I'll watch it all ahahah
I'll get to the Dwarves at some point! I'm half expecting some kind of buff or new unit though so we'll see what happens.
Do feel the dwarfs suffer due to lack of mobility ? I certainly do. A buff is very much needed IMO
Zerkovich
all in good time gotta do them justice ya know :3 yeah that'd be sweet!!!
I certainly find the Dawi to be one of the strongest if not the strongest faction due to their high leadership, exceptional ranged and unwavering melee. What they lack in mobility they more than make up for in durability and strength.
They do require they own playstyle as you tend to set up battles to be on the defensive instead of the attack because in a turtle you are nearly invincible even when outnumbered 5 to 1 but when attacking their weaknesses really show.
Always have 4 cavarly in each army to flank.Thats why I dislike the dwarves ;p
We just flank with flamethrowers ;)
Dwarves don't need no stinking cavalry. You only need them if you can't win in a stand up fight and dwarves never lose ever. It is a well known fact that no dwarf has ever died in combat ever. BTW Havocgr I know your comment was 2 years ago but your name has been added to the book of grudges and dwarves will be visiting you soon.
@@ValosarX glorious dwarven hatred
would leaving shock cavalry in combat while the charge bonus is still affecting them be a good idea?
Ideally, yes, but only if you can avoid taking too much in the process.
Really nice vid helps a lot. I have a question tho: how do you make it so you can only select the main factions and not the secundary ones?
Erm I don't believe you can. Unless it's a mod.
I believe this was made before all the content had been fully released, hence the short list
I'm confused with TW Warhamer 2 what is the role of Spear Cavalry when playing as Dark-Elf's Anti-Cav or Shocking cav ?
Anti-Large. They'll do well against other Cav and cycle charging large foes.
In Medieval II Total War, I once was playing England, and forgot about one of my family members. So, naturally, another country took advantage of that. It was early game, and against AI. However, I somehow managed to take my 50 some odd cavalry against 1200 ish men.. Mostly spearmen. I know this is not a story to believe, but I promise it happened. I slaughtered all men while losing all men, but 3... including the Prince. My prince cavalry went from no XP to full XP that day, or something close to that.
Yeah Medieval II cavalry was pretty broken with horses being armoured and all in the era plus they were just balanced really poorly lol that was an awesome game though I really hope they redo it after Warhammer because it was one of my most favourites.
DO you play any other TW games. You should make videos like these for Attila and Rome 2.
Really enjoying your guides.
Any ranged guides ?
I have one for Rome 2 haha. Same principles apply really.
Or a 'Focus Fire' Tactic vid.
what do you think about my all around standard army for the empire (radious mod) ?
2 units of dismounted knights of the blazing sun ( armored, sword and shield)
3 units of dismounted knights of the blazing sun ( armored, halberds)
5 units of armored long rage musketeers.
2 units of knights of the blazing sun
2 units of griffons (halberds or swords)
4 units of rocket launchers
1 hero / wizard or sigmar priest
1 lord
I don't play any mods man so I'm the wrong man to ask!
You miss a lot of fun and variety of different units imo
One thing I'm surprised you didn't mention was which of the missile cavalry can move while firing.
I think that's obvious yo.
Is there a general rule of thumb which ones can vs can't?
Not 100% sure but units with 360 firing arc can shoot while moving and ones with fixed arc, like normal ranged units have, can't shoot on move.
Arkkimonni That's changed a bit now with the Wood Elves.
U.U dude I wanna toch that spearmen with my cavalry
Great guide. No mention of chariots though?
I'll be dropping a Tactic video for them soon. They didn't really fit into this as they're used quite differently. And thanks!
I'm surprised that you haven't been talking about how terrain could also affect both speed and charges for cavalry units ; between flanking a line of unit from downhill to uphill or reversed, the result differs as much as light and day.
I'm talking from experience : i once faced two chaos armies with two undead armies, both respectively lead by Archeon and Mannfred and another random lord, on a map in the Kislev provinces that had one hell of an Hill (at an almost 36°~38° angle) with chaos starting and reinforcing from downhill while mine from uphill. I won't exactly go in detail as how the battle went exactly (it was pretty chaotic - no pun intended) but at one point i saw two chaos knight units (footsoldiers), being part of the second army, on the verge of reinforcing the fight on my right flank that had been going well for me from the start and, at that point, only had a single unit of Black Knight Shock cavalry that hasn't been engaged in combat yet at my disposal to stop them. I ordered the charge from uphill to downhill... one question : can you picture someone doing hang-gliding without gliders ? Now do it with three dozen guys fulle clad in armor and you'll get the idea. (Spoilers : they don't land safely.)
Tenhys I love squig bowling dwarves that way too ;)
The problem I always have is my cavalry always seems to get stuck on people.
I hate hate hate this. I'll send in some shock cav on a flank for a charge, wait about 30 seconds, then click in the opposite direction. I look back a couple minutes later to go in for another charge and half my cav is dead because they got stuck on the units i was trying to charge.
@@HiroProtaganist TL;DR Get out and chargin' every 5-10 sec for max dmg!
Just a FYI, the charge bonus only lasts for 15 seconds and decreases linearly over time to 0 after the 15 seconds are up. So if the forums, wikis and my understanding are right, after 10 second you have lost 2/3 of your charge bonus.
So a shock cavalry have lost a major part of their attack power by then. Because charge bonus boosts melee attack(chance to hit) and weapon strength(damage to health, duh!) by the same number as the charge bonus.
For an example, let's take Black Knights with Lances & Barding (will just call them Black Knights from now on) at 16:40 ua-cam.com/video/4q_Q_4Suvpc/v-deo.html
24 Melee Attack(MA), 42 Weapon Strength(WS) and 58 Charge Bonus(CB) the other stats are not relevant.
At the moment of impact of a successful charge the Black Knights have:
24 + 58 = 82MA and 42 + 58 = 100WS
After 5 seconds the charge bonus have decreased by a 1/3 so there is 2/3 left: 2/3 * 58 ≈ 39
24 + 39 = 63MA and 42 + 39 = 81WP
After 10 seconds the charge bonus have decreased by a 2/3 so there is 1/3 left: 1/3 * 58 ≈ 19
24 + 19 = 42MA and 42 + 19 = 61WP
But yea getting stuck with 1 horse and having all the other 59 horses in the unit returning to get killed are really annoying.
@Andrew I"ll try that next time thank you!
@@patrik453 Sorry I missed this, was probably drunk. Thanks for doing all that math, I'll remember to only keep them in combat for half the time I usually do. Gotta work on that micro I guess.
I always hated how theres barely any physics for mounted units in total war still to this date, charging into infantry is fantastic people go flying and ragdoll all over depending on how hard the cavalry charge, calvary on cavalry on the otherhand they just awkwardly slow down and stop and take damage, i wish units would fly off horses and charges would be more devastating against other mounted units
When and why would you use the wedge?
You should do an update, since the Bretonnia update added a bunch of option...
how do you show the detail of each unit in battle ?
Charge bonus lasts 10 seconds before it goes
how do you prevent calvary from get stuck in a flank charge where they refuse to disengage without significant right click spam
You don't. Haha. You click spam, unfortunately. If one man gets stuck, it can pull the entire unit back in, it's a bit silly but hey ho!
Subscribed. Great video
Watched 20+ videos.
Good job.
You enunciation and style are far better in this video, roughly 3.30.
No little slightly akward jokes.
No hanging on words.
The rythym is confident and steady.
Remember talk about u know and it will flow. Veer off that track and the lack of confidence shows.
Signing off on your channel should be 'off the cuff'. Again a lack of confidence will show.
Skill is directly proportional to practice, so keep up the good work.
Its not that your calvelry cant ever touch spear men, its just that you have to touch them in different ways. Don't make that weird.
As a future slaanesh player i'm going make it super weird.
5:37 Empire knight are on the slope. That's why you can't win easily.
Damn love your video they explain everything so well and so organized. Should link your video guide to steam guide you will get more exposure that way.
That I have done yo. Thanks for your viewership my man.
I will make sure I try to touch the spearmen in the right way in future.
Just don't touch their... spears...
what a nice looking lance
That's what she said.
the cav always gets stuck and wont obey orders to move though :/
1:14 For example, If you run pistolers into orc archer boys without realizing that orc archer boys aren't terrible in melee and forget about them your gonna have a bad time.(F my life).
awesome time to re-install total war again
Haha, woooo!
Bonus vs large should be Added with melee attack. What's the differente of damage between a blade with a stick on it or just a blade. However, the Spear would make it easier to stab a large guy.
Mr. OK Eh... I see you really don't know about weapons, or simply what's effective against cavalry. Speaking not in game terms but in realistic terms, is quite unlikely you'll be dealing with un-barded horses, and even if you are, you'll be trying to go at them while the rider is attacking you. I say this since that's almost all you'll be doing with your shorter range sword that won't allow you an easy time cutting that armored dude up there. Also won't help you in general to cut through the skin of a big horse, even though you could maybe shake it enough due to the pain. Now Spears? Spears have REACH. But that's not even the main thing, Spears weaponize the speed of cavalry in your favor. Cavalry is strong because these dudes are coming to bash you in with weapons going way faster than any normal human could move them due to their running horses, plus the entire weight of the horse outdoing the weight of even an armored knight. NOW, imagine what happens when all of that weight decides to hammer itself against a pointy long Spears aimed directly at them? Your own speed and weight suddenly helps the Spears penetrate your armor and the body of your horse, and a dead Knight is an useless knight. Not to mention Spears are obviously much easier to hold against the battering ram of a cavalry assault because you aren't grabbing to a small pommel, you are adjusting your position and weight with a long and easy to grasp shaft.
Try standing beneath a guy on a horse some day and whack him with a stick. If he put on his boots that morning you'll never get to him.
Spears are a critical advantage against anything large, and were the dominant weapon of all human warfare until the advent of effective firearms.
Generally a horse willl not run into a wall of pointy things because it is not stupid. Of course, to make the game "look cool", such things need to be overlooked and the easiest way to represent polearms' effectiveness against cavalry is to give them a bonus.
If anyone don't mind me asking is there a reason why spears do better against cav? Like in real life do spears tend to do better against cav or did it start out as a game thing?
Well think about it. If a man on a horse was charging at you, would you rather have a sword or a spear? Haha. The range advantage of a spear is the key. Spears were the weapon of choice for a long time in ancient Greece though. Until they realised swords are a bit more versatile. So I guess it and isn't a game thing.
blaster23456 I suggest you go over to Scolagladiatoria and watch Matt Euston's videos on medieval weapons.
OK, now I figured out why my orc boar boyz never do anything... gotta start microing them to cycle charge, they melee defense is crap!
There ya go!
aren't the Grail Knights supposed to be the best cavalry lore wise?
According to lore the Blood Knights pretty much are the strongest cavalry in the realm, essentially they are Grail Knights and Reiksguard who now have the power and strength of vampires on top of vampiric undead horses with magical weapons. "It is said that even the fabled Grail Knights of Bretonnia cannot match the Blood Knights lance for lance upon the field." warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Blood_Knights