Since you are a fan haha! I have a question so I see people read the first 3 books only. Do you think someone who is reading them for the first time should read all 6 books or do you think it’s fine to just read the first 3? 😁😆
Sorry to be so off topic but does anybody know a method to get back into an instagram account..? I was dumb forgot my account password. I would love any tips you can offer me
Hello there, Lauren. I wanted to point out that the things you marked on The Selection are indeed troublesome, just not the way you think. The sexism in The Selection is intentional, albeit poorly, poooorly executed. I will now spoil a lot of The Selection, but give some insight on its writin process and storytelling in general. Pardon any grammar mistakes, for spanish is my first language and I am writing this from my tiny cellphone. We all know that the series is described as a Distopian Fairytale (in México that is even the blurb), but we need to know that the "distopian" aspect is the least developed of all. And that is mainly because of who Kiera Cass is a person and as an author. You'd see, Cass has always afirmed that every male character that functions as the protagonist love interest has his personality based on atributes that she loves about her husband. That's why they all are more or less phisically simmilar, that's why they tend to be nurturing and sensitive. Or, you could say... _Providers._ And the reason everybody really, really trashes on Aspen is because Kiera finds him appealing enough that is hard for her to see his glaring flaws. In her original manuscript, _eeeeeveryyybody dies._ The King dies, Maxon dies, the Queen adopts America and then she marries Aspen. BAM, LOWER CASTS ARE NOW THE RULERS AND EVERYTHING IS AWESOME. But she realized that ending sucked, because the tone was too dramatic compared to the book, (she even acknowledges that she had to cut a lot of The Elite because it was mostly pointless melodrama, and even now has a hard time remembering that no, America does not get poisoned), and because in the end, America didn't get to make her choice, the one thing her character arc is meant to do: given how Maxon dies, and America becomes royalty anyway, she felt that the heroine of Illéa kind of turns towards Aspem and says "sure, why not". And that was partly because she likes him a lot. The Aspen is an idiot for focusing on his supposed role as a patriarch? That is intentional and Kiera knows it. The reason she wrote The Guard was to try and make people get into his mind and see the way he develops as a character and overcomes himself. Basicaly, an admision that she never wrote him like that in the main series. Because Aspen is a douche for no reason: breaks up with her for the Uber Male I Must Be mindset, realizes how idiotic he was after she leaves, follows her to the palace and tries to seduce her even if they both know it pains America to see him, undermines Maxon all the time and berates her for not giving him a chance as if he's entitled to one, knows full well that they could be killed because of his romantic boner for the girl he broke up with, gets happy after she is kicked out, (for a full minute, but still), and has to be told "no, it doesn't work that way" when he proposes they go live together. And stiiiiill he needs to see America and Maxon in bed for him to realize that America has moved on, stiiiiiill only communicates with her after the rebel attack and stiiiiill he is the one who delivers her at the altar. Mostly as a "oh, he is letting her go" moment, one that ignores that America's mom is still around, that he now has a girlfriend and that, well, you shouldn't wait for the wedding of your past love to let her go. So, Aspen's sexism is intentional but not developed enough to be seen as a flaw, nor acknowledged enough to be part of his character development. And that is mostly because Kiera Cass never got to see the character for what he was and needed to become, and therefore the way he behaves is never framed as a bad thing. The Guard, the novella meant to fix this up, was considered by most readers as doubling down on his doucheyness. So, yeah... Aspen is not a well rounded character. And the rest? Well, that is poor worldbuilding. Out of the three universes that K.C. has given us, most have this singular, interesting idea that is never developed enough to be fleshed out. In both Bethroted and Selection is the society, in The Siren is the Ocean herself. Kiera said that she chose to set The Selection in the future because she didn't find any society in the past that could fit the story, and we can very well say that's the main reason the distopian aspect came to be and why the world is poorly constructed: castes being underdeveloped, Illéa being "fixed" between The One and The Heir and then again between The Crown and its epilogue. The story being set centuries in the future yet technology remaons basically the same, the callbacks to the USA's Civil War (North good, South bad) becoming muddled after you realize that Illéa encompases all of North America and Central America, therefore placing the latino and black countries in the Bad South category that the ones fighting for slavery were in the conflict being paralleled. And well, sexism. Illéa's whole deal is "screw you, got mine. Have some reality show to ignore the issues". That's why I believe the inclusion of those rules and comments are necesary: not only to flesh out the distopian aspect of the novel, but because it also enhances the romance of it. Maxon and America come together for artificial reasons and are constricted by artificial rules, yet the relationship they develop is genuine and sincere, and _that_ is what brings forward the revolution we never get to see. That even in such circumstances, genuine love can flourish, and if human bonds are strong enough, it can topple the opression by just existing. But still, the themes are not developed enough and take a backseat to the romance. And that's why we need to point this out: The Selection is not a distopian romance, but rather a full on romance, a cheesy, corny, dramatic and fun romance, through and through, with some distopian elements throen every now and then. And that is awesome, I highly enjoy America's indeciciveness, Maxon's 180° in the worst. Possible. Moment, Celeste bitchiness with a reason and all that. It is a highly enjoyable series, a fun and fluttery romance. However, as a commentary on society, it is lackluster. It is not wrong to portray sexism, homophobia, abuse, rape and other morally reprehensible topics in fiction. We need to talk about them to understand them, after all. But it is wrong to not do enough to portray them as what they are, and that is for me The Selection's biggest flaw. Because the melodrama is not a weakness, it is actually the funniest aspect of the series if one knows about it beforehand. But if we do not point out that Kiera muddles the story with said underdeveloped elements, we run into a problem. For yes, there is Team Aspen girls out there, for some reason, and we should not go and mock them for it. But we should point out, "Hey, Kiera. This is not as good as we needed it to be", so we don't get some mixed perceptions on what is indeed wrong and what is not. It is not a crime, of course, but it is not a good thing to introduce such a topic and come out with its deepness being an equivalent for "corsets are opressive" for six books. So yeah! Fun romance, bad worldbuilding. Not the end of the world, but indeed worth thinking about, for pointing the flaws in a narrative is not useful if we don't sit down and think about why they are flawed in the first place.
I agree with you on some points, but most of them I just can’t. It kind of seems like you haven’t read it in a while and you forgot some aspects of it and the bad parts are exaggerated in your head. Of course it is all subjective how you see the book and your thoughts on all the melodrama and if you like the overall book. But coming from someone who just finished rereading the series again about a week ago, some points are just wrong. Again, you might not have read the series in a while and lots of the points you make are based on how each person looks at it of course, but I think you need a bit of a refresher on the series and your review and critiques would be better and more accurate. I personally do not at all see how when Aspen gives America away at her wedding is weird and just not good. They ended their relationship mutually, both finding love with someone else. I don’t think that Aspen should not have gone to the wedding because she was his ex, I love the idea of him walking her down the isle and stepping in as her family. It does not take until the wedding for them to say “hey, I don’t love you like that anymore”. In the books, Aspen repeatedly tried to tell America that he found someone else and they can’t be together anymore before she cut him off. So they didn’t officially realize they can’t be together at the wedding, no no no. And you say that in the last two books, it seems like they are still in love with each other. I personally think it’s more of a “we WERE more than friends”. You have to remember they spent two years together so obviously they have some sort of understanding and such (I really don’t know how to describe it, but it’s kind of like how your older friends know you well and how to read you). And in his novella, the whole thing is written in past tense, so it’s obviously going to use “loved”. (I just saw and checked) I don’t think he seems so high and mighty. Yes, he does have a bit of an ego but that definitely dies down as his character *develops* throughout the book. But, of course he is going to fight for her love, because he still loves her and he realizes he made a mistake. It’s also partially on her shoulders because she didn’t really try to stop him either. Of course how you perceive it is different from how I perceive it and neither opinion is wrong. They’re opinions. I’m just showing my perceptions and how I disagree with you. I understand how it can be seen like that though. In the end, all books have flaws big or small and you just have to enjoy the book, or not. No one get the wrong idea tho, I’m Team Maxon for obvious reasons :)
Omg! You said absolutely everything I was thinking, but unable to express. The Selection is my all time favorite series. I understand that some of the dystopian parts of it could have been a little stronger, but I kind of think that’s the point. The royals and nobles seem to ignore the bad in the country. Maxon has been guarded from it his entire life, and while America knows a lot more, she only knows the life of a 5. Why would they be able to describe this world and all these problems? They are just teenagers and no one has explained it to them! They only scratch the surface of these horrible issues because that’s not what the characters are focusing on. They are young and are focused on finding love. The issues that come along with it is secondary and not the main point. I do love that it’s not all perfect, and there are some problems that they don’t know how to fix, but I honestly think that the characters handled them well for their age. :)
ahh hi, new watcher here and i love you already! 😂 i actually just started rereading the series too (1 book down) so this was perfect lol. i love how you pointed out the problematic bits and were so aware of that, it’s definitely something important to cover!! i started strongly disliking Aspen the moment he said that “provider” thing 😬 although honestly I’m kind of glad (most of) the problematic bits were included, i think it’s a glimpse into the real world and how people can still think in such backwards ways even now. still, definitely frustrating!
Aw I’m glad you liked the video☺️ For me, I dislike Aspen as a person but I really enjoy his character. Like I feel him being in the story adds a lot of value and always got me more invested in it! As for the problematic parts, I think they were more of a early 2010s kinda thing rather than to show off the world, but I would be interested to know if she would take them out if she had the chance to🤔
When I read the selection the first time it took sooooo long to read it even tho it’s such a thin book and the others too ! It still takes so much time to read !
@@LaurenKissReads yep I’m actually not done with the books yet I’m on the elite but it’s so far pretty good, btw when I said that I I’m reading the book in 5th grade I did mean to offend anyone lolz
I enjoyed the first 3 books more than the last 2, I honestly felt that the romance in the last 2 books was poorly written. I also think that Eadlyn and America are both irritating protagonists. I don’t hate them but wow they were both really unlikeable at times.
Fudge I now realize I may be a bit of a faster reader than I thought I started the selection at 10 and was done by 1:20/ 1:30 ish that's like 3 1/2 hours
Your “problematic” issues are supposed to be problematic, that is the purpose of those parts in the books!!!! Thats what makes a book good, is that it’s realistic!!! It’s a different culture of course it can’t meet “America’s 2020 safety bubble standards.” The whole “I’m a man I need to provide, your body belongs to us, give yourself to the prince” crap is how that sort of culture works
ik im late but the selection series the trilogy is meant to be read all together. the selection book alone is only a part of the story and in order to finish it you would need to read all three books
The selection series is like my guilty pleasure
I feel that😂
Hah ma same😂
Since you are a fan haha! I have a question so I see people read the first 3 books only. Do you think someone who is reading them for the first time should read all 6 books or do you think it’s fine to just read the first 3? 😁😆
Sorry to be so off topic but does anybody know a method to get back into an instagram account..?
I was dumb forgot my account password. I would love any tips you can offer me
@Fox Harold instablaster :)
I just finished the books for the first time(took me 3 days total) and I’m in loveeeeee
I’m glad someone else re-read this... 😊
It was so good ah!
I'm due for my yearly rereading of the selection ❤
Aw I love that, I hope you enjoy them once again!
Hello there, Lauren. I wanted to point out that the things you marked on The Selection are indeed troublesome, just not the way you think. The sexism in The Selection is intentional, albeit poorly, poooorly executed.
I will now spoil a lot of The Selection, but give some insight on its writin process and storytelling in general. Pardon any grammar mistakes, for spanish is my first language and I am writing this from my tiny cellphone.
We all know that the series is described as a Distopian Fairytale (in México that is even the blurb), but we need to know that the "distopian" aspect is the least developed of all. And that is mainly because of who Kiera Cass is a person and as an author.
You'd see, Cass has always afirmed that every male character that functions as the protagonist love interest has his personality based on atributes that she loves about her husband. That's why they all are more or less phisically simmilar, that's why they tend to be nurturing and sensitive. Or, you could say... _Providers._
And the reason everybody really, really trashes on Aspen is because Kiera finds him appealing enough that is hard for her to see his glaring flaws. In her original manuscript, _eeeeeveryyybody dies._ The King dies, Maxon dies, the Queen adopts America and then she marries Aspen. BAM, LOWER CASTS ARE NOW THE RULERS AND EVERYTHING IS AWESOME.
But she realized that ending sucked, because the tone was too dramatic compared to the book, (she even acknowledges that she had to cut a lot of The Elite because it was mostly pointless melodrama, and even now has a hard time remembering that no, America does not get poisoned), and because in the end, America didn't get to make her choice, the one thing her character arc is meant to do: given how Maxon dies, and America becomes royalty anyway, she felt that the heroine of Illéa kind of turns towards Aspem and says "sure, why not". And that was partly because she likes him a lot.
The Aspen is an idiot for focusing on his supposed role as a patriarch? That is intentional and Kiera knows it. The reason she wrote The Guard was to try and make people get into his mind and see the way he develops as a character and overcomes himself. Basicaly, an admision that she never wrote him like that in the main series.
Because Aspen is a douche for no reason: breaks up with her for the Uber Male I Must Be mindset, realizes how idiotic he was after she leaves, follows her to the palace and tries to seduce her even if they both know it pains America to see him, undermines Maxon all the time and berates her for not giving him a chance as if he's entitled to one, knows full well that they could be killed because of his romantic boner for the girl he broke up with, gets happy after she is kicked out, (for a full minute, but still), and has to be told "no, it doesn't work that way" when he proposes they go live together. And stiiiiill he needs to see America and Maxon in bed for him to realize that America has moved on, stiiiiiill only communicates with her after the rebel attack and stiiiiill he is the one who delivers her at the altar. Mostly as a "oh, he is letting her go" moment, one that ignores that America's mom is still around, that he now has a girlfriend and that, well, you shouldn't wait for the wedding of your past love to let her go.
So, Aspen's sexism is intentional but not developed enough to be seen as a flaw, nor acknowledged enough to be part of his character development. And that is mostly because Kiera Cass never got to see the character for what he was and needed to become, and therefore the way he behaves is never framed as a bad thing. The Guard, the novella meant to fix this up, was considered by most readers as doubling down on his doucheyness. So, yeah... Aspen is not a well rounded character.
And the rest? Well, that is poor worldbuilding. Out of the three universes that K.C. has given us, most have this singular, interesting idea that is never developed enough to be fleshed out. In both Bethroted and Selection is the society, in The Siren is the Ocean herself.
Kiera said that she chose to set The Selection in the future because she didn't find any society in the past that could fit the story, and we can very well say that's the main reason the distopian aspect came to be and why the world is poorly constructed: castes being underdeveloped, Illéa being "fixed" between The One and The Heir and then again between The Crown and its epilogue. The story being set centuries in the future yet technology remaons basically the same, the callbacks to the USA's Civil War (North good, South bad) becoming muddled after you realize that Illéa encompases all of North America and Central America, therefore placing the latino and black countries in the Bad South category that the ones fighting for slavery were in the conflict being paralleled.
And well, sexism. Illéa's whole deal is "screw you, got mine. Have some reality show to ignore the issues". That's why I believe the inclusion of those rules and comments are necesary: not only to flesh out the distopian aspect of the novel, but because it also enhances the romance of it. Maxon and America come together for artificial reasons and are constricted by artificial rules, yet the relationship they develop is genuine and sincere, and _that_ is what brings forward the revolution we never get to see. That even in such circumstances, genuine love can flourish, and if human bonds are strong enough, it can topple the opression by just existing.
But still, the themes are not developed enough and take a backseat to the romance. And that's why we need to point this out: The Selection is not a distopian romance, but rather a full on romance, a cheesy, corny, dramatic and fun romance, through and through, with some distopian elements throen every now and then.
And that is awesome, I highly enjoy America's indeciciveness, Maxon's 180° in the worst. Possible. Moment, Celeste bitchiness with a reason and all that. It is a highly enjoyable series, a fun and fluttery romance. However, as a commentary on society, it is lackluster.
It is not wrong to portray sexism, homophobia, abuse, rape and other morally reprehensible topics in fiction. We need to talk about them to understand them, after all. But it is wrong to not do enough to portray them as what they are, and that is for me The Selection's biggest flaw. Because the melodrama is not a weakness, it is actually the funniest aspect of the series if one knows about it beforehand. But if we do not point out that Kiera muddles the story with said underdeveloped elements, we run into a problem. For yes, there is Team Aspen girls out there, for some reason, and we should not go and mock them for it. But we should point out, "Hey, Kiera. This is not as good as we needed it to be", so we don't get some mixed perceptions on what is indeed wrong and what is not.
It is not a crime, of course, but it is not a good thing to introduce such a topic and come out with its deepness being an equivalent for "corsets are opressive" for six books.
So yeah! Fun romance, bad worldbuilding. Not the end of the world, but indeed worth thinking about, for pointing the flaws in a narrative is not useful if we don't sit down and think about why they are flawed in the first place.
I agree with you on some points, but most of them I just can’t. It kind of seems like you haven’t read it in a while and you forgot some aspects of it and the bad parts are exaggerated in your head. Of course it is all subjective how you see the book and your thoughts on all the melodrama and if you like the overall book. But coming from someone who just finished rereading the series again about a week ago, some points are just wrong. Again, you might not have read the series in a while and lots of the points you make are based on how each person looks at it of course, but I think you need a bit of a refresher on the series and your review and critiques would be better and more accurate. I personally do not at all see how when Aspen gives America away at her wedding is weird and just not good. They ended their relationship mutually, both finding love with someone else. I don’t think that Aspen should not have gone to the wedding because she was his ex, I love the idea of him walking her down the isle and stepping in as her family. It does not take until the wedding for them to say “hey, I don’t love you like that anymore”. In the books, Aspen repeatedly tried to tell America that he found someone else and they can’t be together anymore before she cut him off. So they didn’t officially realize they can’t be together at the wedding, no no no. And you say that in the last two books, it seems like they are still in love with each other. I personally think it’s more of a “we WERE more than friends”. You have to remember they spent two years together so obviously they have some sort of understanding and such (I really don’t know how to describe it, but it’s kind of like how your older friends know you well and how to read you).
And in his novella, the whole thing is written in past tense, so it’s obviously going to use “loved”. (I just saw and checked)
I don’t think he seems so high and mighty. Yes, he does have a bit of an ego but that definitely dies down as his character *develops* throughout the book. But, of course he is going to fight for her love, because he still loves her and he realizes he made a mistake. It’s also partially on her shoulders because she didn’t really try to stop him either.
Of course how you perceive it is different from how I perceive it and neither opinion is wrong. They’re opinions. I’m just showing my perceptions and how I disagree with you. I understand how it can be seen like that though. In the end, all books have flaws big or small and you just have to enjoy the book, or not.
No one get the wrong idea tho, I’m Team Maxon for obvious reasons
:)
Omg! You said absolutely everything I was thinking, but unable to express. The Selection is my all time favorite series. I understand that some of the dystopian parts of it could have been a little stronger, but I kind of think that’s the point. The royals and nobles seem to ignore the bad in the country. Maxon has been guarded from it his entire life, and while America knows a lot more, she only knows the life of a 5. Why would they be able to describe this world and all these problems? They are just teenagers and no one has explained it to them! They only scratch the surface of these horrible issues because that’s not what the characters are focusing on. They are young and are focused on finding love. The issues that come along with it is secondary and not the main point. I do love that it’s not all perfect, and there are some problems that they don’t know how to fix, but I honestly think that the characters handled them well for their age. :)
ahh hi, new watcher here and i love you already! 😂 i actually just started rereading the series too (1 book down) so this was perfect lol. i love how you pointed out the problematic bits and were so aware of that, it’s definitely something important to cover!! i started strongly disliking Aspen the moment he said that “provider” thing 😬 although honestly I’m kind of glad (most of) the problematic bits were included, i think it’s a glimpse into the real world and how people can still think in such backwards ways even now. still, definitely frustrating!
Aw I’m glad you liked the video☺️ For me, I dislike Aspen as a person but I really enjoy his character. Like I feel him being in the story adds a lot of value and always got me more invested in it! As for the problematic parts, I think they were more of a early 2010s kinda thing rather than to show off the world, but I would be interested to know if she would take them out if she had the chance to🤔
When I read the selection the first time it took sooooo long to read it even tho it’s such a thin book and the others too ! It still takes so much time to read !
This genuinely convinced me to reread the series again too! Also this is unrelated but you’re really pretty
Ah I hope you enjoy your reread, and omg thank you so much!!
Also I LOVE YOUR READY PLAYER ONE TSHIRT
THANK YOU SO MUCH I LOVE IT TOO!
I love how most people read the selection at grade 8 and I’m ready it at grade 5 😌
Honestly I think it’s a great series! It’s a comfort series for me, so I hope you enjoyed it as well☺️
@@LaurenKissReads yep I’m actually not done with the books yet I’m on the elite but it’s so far pretty good, btw when I said that I I’m reading the book in 5th grade I did mean to offend anyone lolz
Unpopular opinion: I like Eadlyn more then America
I enjoyed the first 3 books more than the last 2, I honestly felt that the romance in the last 2 books was poorly written. I also think that Eadlyn and America are both irritating protagonists. I don’t hate them but wow they were both really unlikeable at times.
Fudge I now realize I may be a bit of a faster reader than I thought I started the selection at 10 and was done by 1:20/ 1:30 ish that's like
3 1/2 hours
Your “problematic” issues are supposed to be problematic, that is the purpose of those parts in the books!!!! Thats what makes a book good, is that it’s realistic!!! It’s a different culture of course it can’t meet “America’s 2020 safety bubble standards.” The whole “I’m a man I need to provide, your body belongs to us, give yourself to the prince” crap is how that sort of culture works
Can we read the selection as a stand-alone even if it is in a series? Or is it better to read the other books
ik im late but the selection series the trilogy is meant to be read all together. the selection book alone is only a part of the story and in order to finish it you would need to read all three books